On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 10:25 AM, Ian Lynch <[email protected]> wrote: > On 3 August 2011 15:10, Rob Weir <[email protected]> wrote: > >> On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 9:54 AM, Andre Schnabel <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> > Hi Rob, >> > >> >> Von: Rob Weir <[email protected]> >> > >> >> > >> >> > I think there is a difference between informed hypothesis and >> >> speculation >> >> > :-) >> >> >> >> And neither is the same as facts. I'm concerned when I hear >> >> paternalistic statements of "our contributors will never post patches" >> >> or "They would never ever sign the iCLA", or "If we don't let them >> >> contribute anonymously with 1-character passwords and fake names under >> >> an eclectic license of their choice then they will kill themselves". >> > >> > Well maybe - just maybe - you may consider that the people who try to >> give >> > you some advice have been dealing with exactly those type of contributors >> > for the last couple of years, while IBM (according to your own words >> > was not the best citizen in the Ooo community ecosystem). >> > >> >> I do consider that. I'm sure their views are honestly held. I'm not >> ignoring them. But there is a huge difference between an opinion on >> what you personally would prefer or do versus an opinion on what you >> think thousands of others would prefer or do. I can accept the former >> while giving much less weight to the latter. I see no reason to accept >> as the gospel truth the views of 3 people claiming to speak for >> thousands when we have the easy ability to reach out to the thousands >> directly. >> >> > Btw. I have mot seen anybody stating such statements as you quote. The >> only >> > thing i saw was people pointing to risks. You may ignore a certain amount >> > of risks, but finally these sum up. >> > >> >> There are risk either way. For example, the risk of having a wiki >> containing product documentation that no one can copy or modify >> because it is not under a proper license. >> >> > You need not care about me (I'm not an apache committer) but it's sad >> that >> > you even try to ignore those people who are strongly committed to OOo at >> > apache. >> > >> >> Generally, it is in bad form to start every conversation with a >> statement along the lines of, "You probably will ignore me" or "You >> may not care what I say" or "You'll probably will think this is a bad >> idea", etc. Have enough respect for your own ideas that you think >> they are worthy of serious consideration. And have enough respect for >> others on the list that you assume that they will consider your >> thoughts serious. It poisons the conversation from the start when you >> start in a defensive tone. >> > > To be fair, an overly aggressive tone can do just as much poisoning as a > defensive one. I think it is also worth bearing in mind that a lot of people > here are not native English speakers and so it is easy to read things into > posts that were either not intended or were a subset of the entire situation > simply because it just takes too long to type reams in a foreign language > explaining every aspect of everything. Apart from the language issue, what > is considered bad form varies with culture so we should be wary of brute > logic from our own perspective as a tool for progress. We have to work > together and respect other people's position especially when most are doing > this for love rather than for money. It's not like in a company where you > can sack and replace people. We have lost good people in the past because > that wasn't understood and it's easier to keep people and their knowledge > resource than replace and retrain them. >
Some good points. Maybe we want to start (or steal) an FAQ on similar "netiquette" points? It might fit in the "Community FAQ's" section. > Regards, >> >> -Rob >> >> > >> > regards, >> > >> > André >> > >> > PS: again a scnr: >> > http://geekandpoke.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341d3df553ef01538f1979c0970b-pi >> > >> > >> > -- > Ian > > Ofqual Accredited IT Qualifications (The Schools ITQ) > > www.theINGOTs.org +44 (0)1827 305940 > > The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, > Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and > Wales. >
