On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 3:03 AM, eric b <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Rob, > > Le 4 janv. 12 à 02:24, Rob Weir a écrit : > >> >> Note that this does not become your product's name. It is a logo, like >> "Intel Inside", that can be used by 3rd party products that include or are >> based on an Apache product. > > > > This point is ESSENTIAL, and imho, only official Apache OpenOffice.org > websites should use the logo. > > Though, if 3rd party product want to mention they are based on Apache > product, then they can write it, and why not, add the apache logo. But not > the OpenOffice.org one. >
I'm not sure we're authorized (as a project) to permit use of the Apache logo. I suspect not. But we are able to create a "powered by logo" that is distinct from the "product" logo, for 3rd party products to use. The idea is to avoid diluting the value of the core product logo, but still allow 3rd party apps to express their use of the code, and for them to help us raise awareness of the brand. Think of it this way: Did the "Intel Inside" program help or hurt Intel and the value of their brand? I don't think it hurt them. > > > >> So it allows you to grow your own brand while accurately expressing your >> use of the Apache code. We'd need to think how this could work with products >> based on legacy OOo releases, pre Apache. > > > This is a bad track. Indeed, people are already completly confused. > We should certainly try to avoid confusion. > At one recent event, I discussed with some around 20 average french people > (randomly, average users, not following OpenOffice.org story), and the > result is : > > - Oracle is the current OpenOffice.org owner > - OpenOffice.org is no longer free and Oracle killed it > > - LibreOffie is the new name of OpenOffice.org > - Apache OpenOffice is yet another fork, nobody knows and nobody cares. > > It took me a long time to explain them what happened in meantime. > > > I invite everybody to repeat the test, and share what they obtain. > The above may be true. But I don't think it is caused by logo confusion. And think of it this way. What helps the brand more: A) White Label Office making no mention of OpenOffice or B) White Label Office having a "Powered by OpenOffice.org" logo? > > >> But I think something similar could be discussed. >> > >> If we wanted, we could also include a link on the main download page, >> pointing too White Label Office, but we'd need to be fair and offer the same >> kind of link to anyone else who was based on OOo, and who was respecting the >> trademarks, e.g., LibreOffice, Symphony, etc. > > > > IMHO, the right decision is to NOT add external links at all : easy to > manage, and always fair for all. > > To justify this point of view, I got one famous example in mind : one > NeoOffice link was added (Simon Phipps around already ...) on the main > OpenOffice.org porting project web page. It was a disaster for > OpenOffice.org because people were confused, and thought NeoOffice was the > "official" Mac OS X port. This way, NeoOffice derivated a long time the > porting project forces, including donations who were derivated too. > > The case is exactly the same with LibreOffice today, and I strongly suggest > to retain the lesson of the past, and to not redo the same mistake. > Avoiding past mistakes is important. But is there something that could be done that promotes the larger ecosystem as well as avoids confusion with users? For example, look at the Apache Subversion download site: http://subversion.apache.org/packages.html It has links to many 3rd party derivatives of the Apache product. But I think they help avoid confusion by having a prominent disclaimer on the webpage: "The Apache Subversion project does not officially endorse or maintain any binary packages of the Subversion software. However, volunteers have created binary packages for different distributions and platforms, and as a convenience, we maintain a list of links to them here." > Defend the name, and control the logo usage, is ESSENTIAL. Just wondering > how long it will take to the Apache people, to understand that it was the > worse decision ever to rename** OpenOffice.org into Apache OpenOffice > (instead of Apache OpenOffice.org, far better). > I agree that we need to protect and control the brand. But part of that control can be promoting specific logos for specific purposes, in ways that support the overall brand. 1) A logo that is only used on the website and in official Apache releases 2) A related, but distinct "powered by" or similar logo, that denotes a product that is based on AOO 3) A related, but distinct "get AOO" or similar logo, that a supporter can put on their website or blog to link to our download site Our power is our ability to control use of the brand. Preventing use is one form of control. But channeling use to beneficial patterns of use can be even more powerful. -Rob > > Regards, > Eric Bachard > > > > **I bet there are a lot of LibreOffice / TDF supporters in the list of the > people who voted for the change. > > -- > qɔᴉɹə > Projet OOo4Kids : http://wiki.ooo4kids.org/index.php/Main_Page > L'association EducOOo : http://www.educoo.org > Blog : http://eric.bachard.org/news > > > > >
