On 05/19/2014 02:54 PM, TeMPO Consulting wrote: > Hello Fabien > > after attending two webminars and reading all the mail related to > pricing I still have two major questions > > 1. are the prices listed at https://www.odoo.com/page/pricing related > to the SaaS offer or to Odoo Enterprise, or both ?
Both. We want to keep the same price/contract in order to not create pricing competition between both. It also allows people to switch from saas to on-premise without having to change their contracts. > 2. if they also apply to Odoo Enterprise what is the SLA provided by > the "Community Support" ? What do you mean by community support? > > many thanks for your reply. > > Maurice MORETTI > >>> Basic math for a client with 20 users and 5 apps for 24 months: >>> * 20 users x 5 apps x 24 months x $15 = $36,000 >>> * Partner commission for 24 months (~50%)= $18,000 >> No, this is a common usecase: >> >> Here is a typical use case (with old pricing), 40 users: >> - Public Price: $18720 >> - Partner Price: $9360 (a ready partner) >> - Price sold to customer: $13.000 >> - Implementation Cost: $90.000 >> >> Maintenance part of the TCO: 12.6% >> Commission part of the TCO: 3.5% >> >> >> >>> On Sun, May 18, 2014 at 11:47 AM, Fabien Pinckaers <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> I just wrote a blog to explain the new pricing: >>> https://www.odoo.com/blog/1/post/158 >>> >>> Please read it before going further in this email. >>> >>> >>> I'll try to answer most questions here: >>> >>> 1/ How to compute the price? >>> >>> The price is: # total of users X # of apps bundle X 12€ >>> >>> 2/ Why don't we charge according to real usage? (e.g.: 5 users on CRM, 3 >>> on accounting, 7 on projects?) >>> >>> Because it's impossible to predict for yearly contracts! Quoting would >>> become a nightmare and a lot of people would abuse from this unclear >>> situation. (a customer would start with a low price but three month >>> after we would have to upsell him because of the number of users on some >>> apps) >>> >>> Lets take the following use case: a company of 10 users that uses CRM, >>> accounting, projects. They have 3 sales person, 4 consultants, 1 >>> director, 1 secretary and 1 accountant. >>> >>> When you do a quote for this customer, how many users do they have per >>> application? >>> - is the director using accounting and CRM? >>> - can the sales have read access to project for follow-ups to their >>> customers? >>> - can the accounting check sales orders coming from the sales? >>> - is it the secreatary that give access rights to others users? >>> >>> I checked in our production database. We have 7 persons working in the >>> marketing department. If one do a quote of 7 users for the marketing >>> application bundle, it's totally under-estimated. >>> >>> In reality, we have 45 users on marketing application, not 7: >>> - the Professional Service team that built the certification sample >>> exam on the website (survey) >>> - users that train others users on features >>> - managers that need statistics about events, mass mailing, ... >>> - most sales need an access to check prospects on events, >>> - system administrator need an access to allocate access rights and >>> test for others users >>> >>> 3/ Is it expensive? >>> >>> Absolutly not. It's 2x to 3x cheaper than the market average. Check this >>> comparison of software vendors: >>> https://www.odoo.com/website/image/ir.attachment/537400/datas >>> >>> Moreover, partners get 50% to 60% discount on the public price. It means >>> gold partners pay only 4.8€ / $6 per user and per application. Whatever >>> the market, it's super cheap and super competitive. >>> >>> >>> 4/ Is it an increase of the price? >>> >>> For some customers: no. (1-3 apps) >>> For some customers: yes. >>> >>> The biggest increase would be around 2x more for one particular customer >>> that uses a lot of applications. (6) I never saw a company running 10 >>> apps and if they do, it's normal that they pay 120€ per user because the >>> value they get from Odoo is huge. No other product can offer this. >>> >>> >>> 5/ localization & customization >>> >>> Odoo has a lot of huge advantages compared to traditional ERPs: >>> - higher scope: website, ecommerce, cubes analysis, CRM, ... >>> - better usability, faster implementation >>> - better flexibility: allows custom development and high level config >>> >>> Odoo also has a few disadvantages compared to traditional ERPs, the main >>> one is the localization in some countries. (something we will fix for v9 >>> as we will massively invest in accounting l18n) >>> >>> Odoo has a lot of PROS and a few CONs. But the few CONs are largely >>> compensated by the PROs. As the product is better, economics tell us >>> that the product must be more expensive. >>> >>> Not only we are not more expensive, but we are at least 2x to 3x >>> cheaper. And, if you take the partner price 4.8€ per user and per app, >>> we are 6x cheaper than the competition! >>> >>> I do not know a lot of industry where a product can be 2X cheaper for a >>> better quality. >>> >>> One should not be frustrated about the price. >>> >>> @marcelo >>> > I recently read the posts by the Compiere founder explaining what >>> > went wrong after he got VC money. Read it and it will look like it is >>> > all happening again. >>> Every time we do a change in the community people cry: take care of >>> forks, read Jorge's blog, VCs are evil, OpenERP does not understand its >>> users... >>> >>> Odoo is not comparable to Compiere/Tryton/Openbravo or others. The >>> sustainability of a product is not related at all with fork threats, >>> failure of others open source software or what ever. >>> >>> The sustainability of every product is directly linked to it's ability >>> to create a sustainable model where partners and publishers get enough >>> revenues to grow their activities on the product. >>> >>> This requires a lot of things like: having a great product allowing good >>> service margins, a good price for the publisher, happy customers, etc. >>> >>> > What kind of business puts potential clients in front of active >>> > paying clients? The model is wrong wrong wrong. >>> >>> What's wrong is to have a pricing so cheap that it does not allow to >>> sustain the development of the product, or too few customers because the >>> product is not competitive. That's what killed some products. >>> >>> > If Odoo was a ready-to-use software then the model would make a >>> > lot of sense. But they are ignoring the importance of localization & >>> > customization. If I wanted off the shelf software I wouldn't bother >>> > going open source. >>> >>> Our customers don't choose Odoo beause it's open source. They choose >>> Odoo because it's better (products and/or servives of partners) >>> >>> We should stop being frustrated of being open source. It's not because >>> we are open source that we should be cheaper. The only thing that >>> matters for a customer is to have a great product at an affordable >>> price. >>> >>> Open Source is not a customer value, it's a way to develop better >>> products. >>> >>> >>> > Also, this thing that partners will not get any commission >>> > on contracts with more than two years is REALLY nonsense. It >>> > essentially means that the contract will become 50% more >>> > expensive on the 3rd year because the partner will need that >>> > revenue back and of course it will be important for the client >>> > to keep bonds with the partner. It is really sad when >>> companies >>> > pull this sort of crap on their "partners". >>> >>> My understanding is that partners don't sell Odoo Enterprise because of >>> their commissions. They sell it because they need it for their customers >>> and because this allows them to sell more services. (and this is how it >>> should be) >>> >>> The part of the commission on Odoo Enterprise is usually lower than 4% >>> of the revenue a partner take on a project. So, their motivation is not >>> on the commission. >>> >>> I may be wrong. I am open to discuss this during the community days. >>> >>> >>> >>> Hope it helps better understanding this strategic move, >>> Thanks for the feedback, >>> >>> -- >>> Fabien Pinckaers >>> Odoo Founder >>> >>> Phone: +32.81.81.37.00 <tel:%2B32.81.81.37.00> >>> Web: https://www.odoo.com >>> Twitter: @fpopenerp >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community >>> Post to : [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community >>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >> > > > -- > Très cordialement > > Maurice MORETTI > > _________________________________________________________________________ > TeMPO CONSULTING 20, avenue de la Paix 67000 Strasbourg FRANCE > > Web : http://www.tempo-consulting.fr > email : [email protected] > > Tel : 33 (0)3 88 56 82 10 > Fax : 33 (0)3 88 56 46 64 > Mobile : 33 (0)6 08 61 85 02 > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community > Post to : [email protected] > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > -- Fabien Pinckaers Odoo Founder Phone: +32.81.81.37.00 Web: https://www.odoo.com Twitter: @fpodoo _______________________________________________ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community Post to : [email protected] Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
