Correct. They also have FUNDING. The apache foundation has lot of paid permanent staff, as well as money for bounties and hired programmers.
Of course they can have the luxury of a roadmap. Same goes for other projects that do that level of organization. - Melanie On 11/11/2015 01:53, Glenn Martin wrote: > To me, this has always been the major weakness of open source software. > I've seen this on many other projects. There is a "core" in charge but, > ultimately, they focus only on things that they need for their work. When > somebody suggests a feature, the response is usually of the form "that > would be a great addition! If you could code that up, please submit it". > I completely understand the feeling there, but it's hard to build up a > major user base that way (the projects continue to stay in "toy" phase). > > The truly successful open source projects DO have a roadmap and they DO > code towards it. They are real projects that just happen to be open source. > > Glenn > > > NOTICE: The opinions and thoughts in this email are my own and do not > reflect those of any other person or organization. > > > On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 7:31 PM, Melanie <[email protected]> wrote: > > > You keep on about organizational things like a defined roadmap and > > documentation. These are things generally produced by organized and > > PAID bodies. > > > > Core is a team of developers who just as soon let the code do the > > talking. Few of us have any talent for doing big writeups and these > > few are doing other things that take up their time, mostly in academia. > > > > Core is consensus-based and there is no "boss" to set out a roadmap > > everyone else has to follow. We all volunteer our time and > > creativity for this project and to most of us, this is a > > recreational activity, not work. > > > > Admittedly, the project could profit from some guidance, but that > > same guidance would likely lead to a loss of active developers, as > > people who volunteer their time want to do what they like to do, not > > what some roadmap tells them to. This discussion has been had before. > > > > If it were at all possible, I would certainly take up that mantle, > > but that would dis-mantle the team as it stands now. The current > > team isn't interested in fulfilling expectations other than those of > > their own and the users they are working with. > > > > For most of the team, that is users of social virtual worlds who > > could care less about accurate stats, but do care about three green > > lights on the lag meter. They actually don't even care if the stats > > show 11 or 55, as long as the lag meter is green. > > > > I have had people (in other grids) tell me "This place is so > > laggy!". I then would move my avatar around to test responsiveness > > and find that there is no lag, so I would ask them "Why do you > > consider this laggy? I can't see any lag?" and get "The lag meter > > shows the sim is lagging" as a reply. These people, several people > > in multiple grids, then announced to be going back to SL where there > > is no lag. > > > > Go figure. > > > > We are there to make things work for the majority of our users. > > Sorry to say, MOSES and scientists are not a majority. The thousands > > of social grid users spread across all the virtual worlds are. > > > > - Melanie > > > > On 11/11/2015 00:44, dz wrote: > > > I am astounded at how much of the dialogue about this issue you both > > > choose to ignore. > > > > > > Please publish the location of the ROADMAP of REAL CORE problems.... I > > > will be happy to attend the MOSES meetings and attempt to get those > > > issues on their agenda. Don't blame people for working on the things > > > that are important to them when that is the example set by core over a > > long > > > period. You expect people to help and then denegrate them for not > > > attacking the problems you REFUSE to document and share in public. > > > > > > When did MOSES get access to commit the patch??? The patch was > > > accepted after a significant amount of conversation... Everyone BUT > > > you and Melanie voted it +1... you can't rewrite the history and > > assert > > > that the problem is because MOSES committed a patch... CORE committed > > the > > > patch at the request of this community. > > > > > > I have repeatedly asked for the identification of these mysterious users > > > who are the source of this avalanche of complaints... I apologize for > > > assuming they resided on Melanies grid... > > > Now that I hear that her users aren't the source of the complaints > > > I'm left to wonder if there is ANY justification for reverting the > > > stats.. PLEASE share with the group what the source of these complaints > > is > > > so we can begin a dialogue. I participate in a LOT of OpenSim related > > > forums just for that purpose... I haven't seen any of the noise > > > that is supposedly deafening. > > > > > > Assuming "they" truly are upset, I haven't herd a peep about why it > > is > > > appropriate for some backroom decision to override the consensus built > > in > > > this forum over a period of months. > > > I'm sorry, I've tried repeatedly to figure out WHY it is important to > > > revert, and all I keep hearing is "Melanie didnt know it would > > affect a > > > lag meter".. This argument was extended to include " We have to > > > accommodate users of viewers that are NO LONGER being maintained"... > > > HOW in the world can that be a viable position for you to defend Neb, > > > when your rant was directed at the importance of moving forward with > > > viewer developers or we are dead...?? > > > > > > I really am trying to figure this out, but all I see as responses > > is > > > "You are wrong, I changed my mind, it is import to someone who > > > still hasn't spoken on this list" The whole point of this list is to > > > share the issues that are important.... Given the volume of traffic on > > the > > > subject, it obviously is. Please share some REAL information about > > > the actual impact so we can re-evaluate the needs of the WHOLE > > community. > > > We don't know WHO is complaining,, We HAVE heard that you can > > > turn the blinking lights into numeric representations ( even in the OLD > > > meters), We HAVE heard that there is a JIRA for the viewer team to > > > remove/update the functioning of the lag meter.. Everyone agrees > > that > > > the lag meter cant possibly be correct so I find it impossible to > > > believe that it is INTEGRAL to the success of Opensim. All of use > > who > > > wanted accurate stats could be wrong, but I'd sure like to know > > WHY, > > > not just have someone pronounce we are and implement yet another > > > obscure INI variable.. > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 2:56 PM, Michael Emory Cerquoni < > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> Doug I participated in MOSES grid as well and my experience there was > > >> terrible, far worse performance than i experienced in any other grid, I > > >> took part in the FCVW build and planning and experienced a multitude of > > >> problems on MOSES platform that just do not exist in the core > > opensimulator > > >> software. And this is what I mean by chasing ghosts, MOSES is fixing > > bugs > > >> in MOSES for MOSES that just do not exist in the core software. You can > > >> feel however you want and if you feel embarrassed then go work on MOSES > > >> software, no one is stopping you. I do agree though that this whole > > thing > > >> is quite a huge embarrassment for the project. It still does not change > > >> the fact that to date no improvements have come from this change and all > > >> its done is cause arguments, the reason their code was not accepted is > > >> because it was not suitable for core, end of story. They wanted us to > > >> accept patches unconditionally and sorry, that is not going to happen. > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Michael Emory Cerquoni > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> Opensim-dev mailing list > > >> [email protected] > > >> http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Opensim-dev mailing list > > > [email protected] > > > http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev > > _______________________________________________ > > Opensim-dev mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Opensim-dev mailing list > [email protected] > http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev _______________________________________________ Opensim-dev mailing list [email protected] http://opensimulator.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/opensim-dev
