2018-02-13 23:53 GMT+01:00 Ben Nemec <openst...@nemebean.com>:
> On 02/13/2018 01:57 PM, Tom Barron wrote:
>> Since python 2.7 will not be maintained past 2020  it is a reasonable
>> conjecture that downstream distributions
>> will drop support for python 2 between now and then, perhaps as early as
>> next year.
> I'm not sure I agree. I suspect python 2 support will not go quietly into
> that good night. Personally I anticipate a lot of kicking and screaming
> right up to the end, especially from change averse enterprise users.
> But that's neither here nor there. I think we're all in agreement that
> python 3 support is needed. :-)
>> In Pike, OpenStack projects, including TripleO, added python 3 unit tests.
>> That effort was a good start, but likely we can agree that it is *only* a
>> start to gaining confidence that real life TripleO deployments will "just
>> work" running python 3. As agreed in the TripleO community meeting, this
>> email is intended to kick off a discussion in advance of PTG on what else
>> needs to be done.
>> In this regard it is worth observing that TripleO currently only supports
>> CentOS deployments and CentOS won't have python 3 support until RHEL does,
>> which may be too late to test deploying with python3 before support for
>> python2 is dropped. Fedora does have support for python 3 and for this
>> reason RDO has decided  to begin work to run with *stabilized* Fedora
>> repositories in the Rocky cycle, aiming to be ready on time to migrate to
>> Python 3 and support its use in downstream and upstream CI pipelines.
> So that means we'll never have Python 3 on CentOS 7 and we need to start
> supporting Fedora again in order to do functional testing on py3? That's
> potentially messy. My recollection of running TripleO CI on Fedora is that
> it was, to put it nicely, a maintenance headache. Even with the
> "stabilized" repos from RDO, TripleO has a knack for hitting edge case bugs
> in a fast-moving distro like Fedora. I guess it's not entirely clear to me
> what the exact plan is since there's some discussion of frozen snapshots and
> such, which might address the fast-moving part.
> It also means more CI jobs, unless we're okay with dropping CentOS support
> for some scenarios and switching them to Fedora. Given the amount of
> changes between CentOS 7 and current Fedora that's a pretty big gap in our
> I guess if RDO has chosen this path then we don't have much choice. As far
> as next steps, the first thing that would need to be done is to get TripleO
> running on Fedora again. I suggest starting with
RDO has *yet* to choose a plan, and people were invited to work on the
"stabilized" repository draft . If anyone has a better plan that fits all the
constraints, please share it asap.
Whatever the plan, we're launching it with the Rocky cycle.
Among the constraints (but not limited to):
* EL8 is not available
* No Python3 on EL7 *and* no allocated resources to maintain it (that includes
rebuilding/maintaining *all* python modules + libraries)
* Bridge the gap between EL7 and EL8, Fedora 27/28 are the closest thing we
have to EL8 
* SCL have a cost (and I cannot yet expose why but not jumping onto the SCL
bandwagon has proven to be the right bet)
* Have something stable enough so that upstream gate can use it.
That's why plan stress that updates will be gated (definition of how
is still open)
* Manage to align planets so that we can ship version X of OpenStack  on EL8
without additional delay
Well, I cannot say that I can't relate to what you're saying, though. 
 Do not assume anything on EL8 (name included) it's more
complicated than that.
 Take a breath, but we might have to ship RDO as modules, not just RPMs or
Containers. I already have headaches about it.
 Do not ask which one, I do not know :)
 Good thing that next PTG will be in Dublin, I'll need a lot of
irish whiskey :)
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