On Monday 27 February 2006 12:11, Justin Larmon wrote: > On 2/27/06, Joseph M. Gaffney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > * Knowing it isn't going anywhere - Now don't get me wrong, I really > > doubt suseforums.net and suselinuxsupport.de are going anywhere, but one > > of the very big things I like about an official forum is that its here to > > stay. Its > > not going to be sold off, be replaced by advertising, or forgotten about > > by > > the owner. I have recently (and not so recently) experienced this on too > > many forums to list here; several of which being major forums for major > > F/LOSS software and several being completely unrelated, but the result > > was the same. The site was sold, and because of the popularity, became a > > place > > for advertisers to easily get links and prominent google results, or the > > new > > owner really didn't care and was only interested in advertising revenue, > > and > > the site went downhill, etc, etc. Knowing that an official forum exists > > means knowing this will never happen to the official forum. > > So basically, you had bad experiences elsewhere and think it might happen > to the existing forums. I know suseforums.net is not going anywhere, and I > highly doubt suselinuxsupport.de is either. I also don't think either > forumswill be sold of, replaced by advertising or even start advertising.
I specifically said " I really doubt suseforums.net and suselinuxsupport.de are going anywhere". I said that because I don't believe this is going to happen. However, theres always the possibility that it might, and that is also evident to new users as well. One of the things many of us fail to realize is that not all Linux users are gurus, or even quite technically adept. There are a number of users out there who are technically literate (I don't mean can read, I mean have a working knowledge of basic technologies), and many of these people believe that if the application is something real, it should have its own X. X being forum, mailing list, web site, etc, etc. Not having such a thing causes the appearance of a bad setup to such users, and they don't have the same faith that they otherwise could have in the projects longevity. > > * openSUSE is the community, and an openSUSE forum shows a more linked > > community. - There are people who go on mailing lists, people who go on > > newsgroups, people who go on forums, so on, and so on. Sometimes they go > > on > > several of these. The fact is, many new users are very familiar with > > forums, > > and know that if these forums exist, they are there to support them in > > some > > way. Not having an official forum, imho, does not show us to be a > > contiguous > > community, but more of what we seem today - scattered, uncommunicative, > > and > > disinterested in cooperation. > > So why start a new forum and make it more disorganized and look like the > community can't communicate. Why not just start communicating better, see > if that works and if not come back later to this decision. I don't see how it makes the existing community look disorganized - I see it as centralizing communication - not to one medium, but to one portal. How would it cause the appearance of disorganization? I'm open to the discussion, I just don't see it. > > Against a Forum: > > > > * Angering existing forum maintainers - This is the only reason I'd have > > against a forum, and I don't believe its a good reason either. I don't > > believe they should be angry honestly, because I don't think an attempt > > at unifying our community into a cohesive whole could possibly be > > something to > > be against. > > It's not that it is angering. It is the way this is going about. It is > asking for the opinions of the maintainers but no one "in charge" going to > ask. It is asking Viras to start a discussion on suselinuxsupport.de but > before he gets the chance, announce there will be a "technical" forum. It > is everyone saying it will help unify the community and not trying to unfiy > what we have already. Except thats not what happened, and not what was said here on the list. Again, I believe (and correct me if I'm wrong), but the decision was regarding technical *capability*, not a "technical forum". And I don't see that its possible to unify what we have already by any other means - no single existing forum can be donned "official", and yet it seems (atleast, imho) there is a desire and a need for an official forum. > How an official forum would work within the existing community: > > * Act as a central place of discussion - Bugs, packaging problems, > > wishlist > > items, etc, etc all pop up all over the existing forums. If the > > maintainers > > of those forums post on the official forum about the topic, there is only > > one > > place developers, maintainers, wiki guys, etc need to look. Theres no > > reason > > to have to monitor (yes, I know its basically 2 - but there are smaller > > ones > > elsewhere) multiple forums if theres one place for these topics to be > > reviewed. > > If I remember correctly there were a lot of people, developers and > maintainers, who said even if there was an official forum they would not > use it (it was in the forum discussion last month I think). If that was the > case then an official forum would not matter. And others have said that they will. No single communication medium will ever be preferred by all, but as long as a few participate in each, and there is a degree of cross-communication, I believe it to be a step in the right direction. > * Single sign-on - The current openSUSE wiki (and thus, Novell site) logins > > > should be the same as the forums. By doing so, new registrants to an > > official openSUSE forum could be told of how they can contribute to the > > wiki > > as well. Many posters will do lengthy tutorials, complicated packaging > > information, etc, and all this information is extremely valuable and > > welcomed > > as documentation on the wiki. > > If there is an "official" forum, then this is a great idea. > > It is not that I am personally against the idea of a new official forum, I > just wonder why everyone is so quick to want a new official forum instead > of trying to fix the communication between the existing forums and mailing > lists first. You never know, that might be all that is needed. Imho, we need more. Again, this is only my opinion, and I'm more than open to discussion on this, as is (I believe) everyone on this list. Joseph M. Gaffney aka CuCullin --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
