> From: Jay Armstrong [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>
> Seriously, smartass, I'd like a 'yes' or 'no' answer from you: do you
> really think the CIA doesn't monitor the web?
I'm not a smartass. I'm just out to get you :-)
>From Catch-22:
"They're trying to kill me," Yossarian told him calmly.
"No one's trying to kill you," Clevinger cried.
"Then why are they shooting at me?" Yossarian asked.
"They're shooting at *everyone*," Clevinger answered. "They're
trying to kill everyone."
"And what difference does that make?"
The difference between cynicism and paranoia is the difference between:
The CIA is monitoring email on the internet.
The CIA is monitoring *my* email on the internet.
I can, with almost complete confidence, assure you that nobody at
Ironflare is censoring your email. From longtime observation of this
list, I have discovered that the mailing list software Sucks Bigtime.
I'm sorry to say this, because someone at Ironflare probably put a
significant amount of time into it in a noble but misguided attempt to
show off the Orion server. Unfortunately natural brilliance and a
thorough understanding of J2EE do not automatically translate into
detailed knowledge of ESMTP and the specific manner in which the
hundreds of mail agents out there butcher it. The consequence is that
with *frequent* occurance mail is lost, mail is delivered out of order,
the list blacks out for weekends at a time, vacation messages get sent
to everyone, mail senders get back dozens of bounce messages, etc. I
started that thread you mentioned ("Orion Team Needs New List
Software"), and it's still very much true. I suspect that vanity
prevents Ironflare from converting to Mailman or some other mature
package.
As to why Karl never responded to your message about licensing
violation, hey, maybe he's too busy working on the broken list software.
Or more likely, Orion. Think about it. What's a two-person company in
Sweden going to do about somebody 10,000 miles away abusing a $1500
license? The practical limitations of enforcement pretty much mean that
anyone that wants to can steal the software. For a small company and a
relatively inexpensive product you just have to hope that there are
enough honest customers out there to pay your bills. Fortunately it
looks like there are.
I don't understand why you think the Oracle deal is anything but a
fanstastic coup for both us (the Orion community) and Ironflare. It
validates the product, puts a significant amount of $$$ in the pockets
of Karl & Magnus, makes it a lot easier for us to "sell" Orion to
clients, and *radically* increases our market value as experts with The
Oracle J2EE Solution as well as the obscure Swedish app server we know
and love. Larry and Karl make a deal, and suddenly my resume gets a
steroid injection! I couldn't be happier!
Will Oracle draw from this community? Send them a resume and find out!
What kind of validation are you looking for? Sure we (the users) spend
a lot of time debugging the app server - but hey, nobody is forcing us
to run the autoupdater. And a lot of people, myself included, consider
this just the least we can offer to Ironflare for providing us with a
free server. "Free for noncommercial use" has "bought" them a lot more
than $1500 worth of my time, and I'm quite content about it.
Jeff Schnitzer
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
