Izwe Lethu Soso Mashiloane
--- On Mon, 12/14/09, Thembeka Majali <[email protected]> wrote: From: Thembeka Majali <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Ideology To: [email protected] Date: Monday, December 14, 2009, 2:27 PM Dear comrades, Could I get a sense of cde Popo's confusion and the contradictions raised by many of those he had spoken to. Nevertheless my simple take on the issue is that PAC has been about improving the material conditions of the african masses such as the land to house the people, feed the people, clothe, treat illnesses and educate the people, how we relate with each other socially and otherwise and put african peoples interest at core. African people are experiencing exploitation by the employer from the factory floor and earn low wages and vent their anger and frustration to an immediate family member when knock off from work. The state has the responsibility to provide all of the above, protect its resources ie its people, cultures and its god given natural resources. The state plays a significant role in legislating what is produced,consumed, how things are produced and how they are controlled and distributed favouring the africans. What has happened is that africans have never benefitted from the countries wealth it has been in the hands of the few and still remains in the hands of the minority even todate the state has no control over its economy there is no equitable re-distribution of the countries wealth. We know that most african countries have no control over their economies, they have developed economies that are not favouring thier people but rather economies inherited from their colonial regimes. Now understanding Marx or Lenin is just an analytical tool to deepen your understanding of issues as Pan Africanists guided by organisational objectives. We need to understand Marx from an african context and he should talk to our needs as an africans. Otherwise for me the organisation is sitting with the problem of people wanting to be elected into positions of power or imposing themselves into positions of power with no clear vision or have weak capacity at all levels of social, economic and political analysis. Hence even your defunct leadership called for co-operation with the ruling party with no scientific evidence to qualify the need for such statement and later suggest that the Party may close shop, they are just immitating Sobukhwes leadership style that has worked for him at that particular time. Thembeka, On Fri, Dec 11, 2009 at 3:02 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: Greetings, I think the debate as raised by cde Popo is very important and key in finding ourselves in this political maze we find ourselves. But I propose that all of us should give ourselves time to study extensively the literature of our party, speeches of our founding fathers in conjunction with the writings of the following Pan Africanist Pioneers: Osagyefo Kwame Nkrumah: #Class Struggle in Africa #Essential features of Nkrumaism by PANAF Editors #Africa Must Unite #The struggle Continues George Padmore: #Pan Africanism andd Communism Dr Babu # Socialist Africa or African Socialism Lets read these books and receive wisdom from great african revolutions and then embark on an informed and robust debate. I would be arguing from the point of view that PAC is a socialist party that pursue scientific socialism and shall refer you to founded positions by both founding fathers of the PAC and Pan Africanist leaders in Africa and in the diaspora. Yours for a classless society Kwame Ndebele PAYCO President > Thanks comrade for raising this thorny issue in our political mist. > > I think comrade during the years we have recruited people from different > political thoughts. We rallied this people on the principle of aquiring > more support for the election purpose. We did not rally this people on the > principle of African Nationalism and Pan Africanism Ideas which makes the > core of our ideology. That is the first mistake we have made and we should > live with it. Time dictates to us this development. > Secondly Mo-Afrika I think if people can go back and refere to our > founding fathers speeches they will find answers to the issues you are > raising. People need to know that Marxism addresses itself to the class > struggle where the sociaty is divided in different classes. It does not > address the Nationalist struggle or it does so on small scale. As Africans > we are fighting a nationalist struggle. First we are oppresed as a Nation > and not as a class(ofcouse there are classess within the same oppressed > nation with the rise of a black elite class ochestrated by BEE). > As to whether we are Marxist or Socialist one need to refere to what > African leaders have said: that we remain neutral in all but non that > affect the destiny of Afrika. To us Marxism, Lenninsm are tools of > analisis to where we derive a solution to African problems. We are neither > Marxist nor Socialists. WE ARE PAN AFRICANISTS and we are guided by > African Nationalism ideals. WE MUST SEE US AS PAN AFRICANIST BEFORE ANY > OTHER THING. AND WE MUST UNDERSTAND PAN AFRICANISM BEFORE WE CLAIM TO BE. > > WE MAINTAIN THAT PAN AFRICANISM IS SOCIALISTIC IN FORM. TO US PAN > AFRICANISM AND SOCIALISM ARE THE SAME. > > From Cape to Cairo Morroco to Malagasia not even a settle can claim one > inch of Afrika, IZWE LETHU!!! > > > > > > ________________________________ > From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Fri, December 11, 2009 11:23:29 AM > Subject: [PAYCO] Ideology > > Greetings Sons and Daughters > > Ma-Afrika there's a serious need to look at the IDEOLOGY with a clear > cautions and careful. I've try to highlight this to many sometime ago and > it is really a serious problem. Many are saying the are "Marxist", > "Socialist" we you ask clarity the contradict each other. Some they say > aren't Marxist but are Socialist and it become very difficult to continue > work with people who are sing different song in one church. The massage we > are sending outside is conflicting but all of us we are claiming to be > "Pan Africanist". Lte me ask what type of socialism are we are talking > about? It has different types. > > Secondly, the Nationalist are also here, because nationalism is ideology > on its own. There having a right to do so cause of African Nationalism. As > well as Socialist because of African Socialist Democracy. Let me warn > before hand does who say it's one. Nkrumah African Socialism and Nyerere > African Socialism is not the same, so when we engage each other we must > put it in back of our minds. > > Thirdly, some of the Socialist differ as some are Stalinist, Trosky, Aunt > Rosa, and so forth. I'm raising this after this engagement with M'Afrika > Mawande Jack on this forum many comrades they try to engage me outside it > and it became clear to me that we need to seat down and this iron out the > defferences. So that when we go out to the public we spaek the same > language, if not sing the same song in the same page and same hym book. > > Please Ma-Afrika let discuss this openly and honest and stop say socialism > is one cause it not.If you say that you will be like Mavarara asking them > about "what is NDR ? their respond is you don't know National Democratic > Revolution chief/ mchana. instead of answering you the dodge the question > as they can't answer it. > > > Let's engage each other all of us who are in this forum. Irrespective of > where you came from nad which angle young or old, green or yellow, male or > female no one will kill or beat you. > > Your servant in an Africanist cause' > Lubabalo Popo > PAYCO Political Commissar > 078 604 6098 > [email protected]/ [email protected] > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > South Africa's premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm > > -- > Sending your posting to [email protected] > > Unsubscribe by sending an email to [email protected] > > You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco > > Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com > > > > > > -- > Sending your posting to [email protected] > > Unsubscribe by sending an email to [email protected] > > You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco > > Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ South Africa's premier free email service - www.webmail.co.za ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ For super low premiums, click here http://home.webmail.co.za/dd.pwm -- Sending your posting to [email protected] Unsubscribe by sending an email to [email protected] You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to [email protected] Unsubscribe by sending an email to [email protected] You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to [email protected] Unsubscribe by sending an email to [email protected] You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
