Clark, Jon S, List,

Clark wrote:


It would seem that Peirce would be concerned about too strong a central
government in that he wants to maximize inquiry and thus possible solutions
to a problem rather than a single line of inquiry. This would mean a trust
in federalism of a sort. A federalism where each state and ideally each
county/city within that state would be free to try solutions to problems.
Only after seeing success in other locals would solutions be adopted more
widely and then via each state/county.

The problem otherwise, from a Peircean perspective, would be the danger of
too quickly abandoning common sense (the tried experiential solutions of a
community) as well as imposing a single hypothesis on society with no way
to really test it well. That is there would be a large danger of abduction
not being sufficiently tested in terms of it being the best of possible
solutions.

I’m not sure if anyone else would agree here.


My first impression is that you may be on to something here, Clark, that
Peirce's understanding would tend toward a kind of federalism as needed to
ensure that no single hypothesis be adopted too quickly for the country as
a whole. While it is probably not the best example, I immediately thought
of the fairly recent remarks by Governor Hickenlooper of Colorado
concerning his state's two year experiment in legalizing cannabis and what
the data (etc.) surrounding the results of that experiment might mean for
other states considering legalization. He said, in effect, that he thought
it important to move slowly in such matters, suggesting that other states
wait at least a "couple of years" more allow his (and several other) states
to further amass data. Indeed, one NYU researcher studying the Colorado
data as it comes in suggested that maybe a decade wouldn't be too long.

“There are no conclusions available about how it’s going,” said Mark A.R.
Kleiman <http://marroninstitute.nyu.edu/people/mark-a.-r.-kleiman>, a New
York University professor who is one of the nation’s foremost experts on
marijuana legalization and its consequences. “None of the bad things that
are likely to happen if this thing goes badly would have happened yet.”
(from an article in the Denver Post, Oct., 2016).

​Clark continued:


There are of course strong arguments against federalism in preference to a
stronger central government. That is the problem of getting solutions
implemented when there are countering movements in individual states where
particular powers are able to unduly control government. (This was of
course the argument of the classic progressives of the Teddy Roosevelt era)



There are indeed "strong arguments against federalism in preference to a
stronger central government." When, as in the USA, the federal government
is unable, for example, over a long period of time to enact laws which
clearly address what is rapidly coming to be seen by many of all political
persuasions as a critical need for investment in the upgrading of the
country's antiquated infrastructure (e.g. bridges, electrical grids, water
supply systems, public transportation systems, etc.), many of which are
interstate issues and so simply *can't* be addressed by states alone), this
presents a threat to the welfare of the citizenry generally. That some
conservatives--as in the USA and England, for example--can make of the
several important, nay, *essential* tasks of central government something
of a 'dirty word' is not, as I see it, in the country's interest. We *all*,
for example, need potable water.

Jon S. wrote:

That strikes me as a sensible application of Peirce's self-proclaimed
"sentimental conservatism" (CP 1.661).  If "philosophical science" should
be allowed to "influence religion and morality ... only with secular
slowness and the most conservative caution" (CP 1.620), then it seems like
the same is true of proposed political solutions to perceived societal
problems.


Yes, "secular slowness." But Peirce wrote this in the 19th century, while
in the 21st we have "wicked problems" in this country and in the world
which (like, say, the displacement of workers by internet technolgies and
robotics, etc.--but there are several) need *urgent* attention. The
solution to these will not, as I see it, be a kind of universal Toryism.
Jon continued:

Perhaps with a similar thought in mind, the Founders quite intentionally
designed an arrangement in which it is very difficult to enact sweeping
changes at the national level in the absence of broad consensus.  When
public opinion is polarized like it is right now, gridlock in Washington is
a *feature *of the system, not a *bug*--despite the complaints that it
routinely engenders from both sides of the aisle.


I cannot necessarily agree with Jon that the gridlock we see in
Washington--which has gone on for much too long in my opinion, for example,
in consideration of the above mentioned national infrastructure (but there
are several other essential matters affected by this political
gridlock)--again, I do not see that this is *necessarily* "a *feature *of
the system and not a *bug*." On the other hand, it is surely possible for
the federal government to move too quickly, as Jon (off-list) has suggested
that we may have as regards abortion and gay rights (I do not necessarily
agree in these two matters, but my opinion here is not in the least
relevant to the current, theoretical discussion).

Clark concluded:

That is there will intrinsically be a tension between discovering solutions
for a problem and whether the majority or at least powerful want to solve
that problem.


I agree that there is this intrinsic tension which involves perhaps even
more factors: first of all acknowledging particular (especially 'wicked')
problems, then conceiving of solutions, experimenting locally (e.g. in
individual states), amassing data, informing the population of the results,
and finally perhaps applying the lessons learned in working to solve more
general, that is, national problems.

On the other hand, I would imagine that Clark and Jon are quite correct in
suggesting that Peirce's position suggests the sort of federalism which
Clark outlined.

Best,

Gary R



[image: Gary Richmond]

*Gary Richmond*
*Philosophy and Critical Thinking*
*Communication Studies*
*LaGuardia College of the City University of New York*
*C 745*
*718 482-5690*

On Mon, Nov 28, 2016 at 2:23 PM, Jon Alan Schmidt <[email protected]>
wrote:

> Clark, List:
>
> That strikes me as a sensible application of Peirce's self-proclaimed
> "sentimental conservatism" (CP 1.661).  If "philosophical science" should
> be allowed to "influence religion and morality ... only with secular
> slowness and the most conservative caution" (CP 1.620), then it seems like
> the same is true of proposed political solutions to perceived societal
> problems.  Perhaps with a similar thought in mind, the Founders quite
> intentionally designed an arrangement in which it is very difficult to
> enact sweeping changes at the national level in the absence of broad
> consensus.  When public opinion is polarized like it is right now, gridlock
> in Washington is a *feature *of the system, not a *bug*--despite the
> complaints that it routinely engenders from both sides of the aisle.
>
> Regards,
>
> Jon Alan Schmidt - Olathe, Kansas, USA
> Professional Engineer, Amateur Philosopher, Lutheran Layman
> www.LinkedIn.com/in/JonAlanSchmidt - twitter.com/JonAlanSchmidt
>
> On Mon, Nov 28, 2016 at 12:40 PM, Clark Goble <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> On Nov 26, 2016, at 2:39 PM, Gary Richmond <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Meanwhile, my own sense is that one possible strength of Peirce's theory
>> lies in his philosophical* summum bonum*, namely, the notion of our
>> seeking the 'reasonable in itself'. It follows that--and here one perhaps
>> necessarily goes beyond a consideration of democracy--when this *summum
>> bonum* is offered in consideration, now not of mere science, but of what
>> have been called the 'wicked problems' confronting humanity and the world,
>> that one might hope for approaches (if not exactly solutions) which appear
>> reasonable for those communities of interest hoping to address them.
>>
>> As I’ve thought more about the comments over the weekend I think I have
>> come to an implication of Peirce’s thought. This isn’t necessarily
>> something Peirce himself considered too much.
>>
>> It would seem that Peirce would be concerned about too strong a central
>> government in that he wants to maximize inquiry and thus possible solutions
>> to a problem rather than a single line of inquiry. This would mean a trust
>> in federalism of a sort. A federalism where each state and ideally each
>> county/city within that state would be free to try solutions to problems.
>> Only after seeing success in other locals would solutions be adopted more
>> widely and then via each state/county.
>>
>> The problem otherwise, from a Peircean perspective, would be the danger
>> of too quickly abandoning common sense (the tried experiential solutions of
>> a community) as well as imposing a single hypothesis on society with no way
>> to really test it well. That is there would be a large danger of abduction
>> not being sufficiently tested in terms of it being the best of possible
>> solutions.
>>
>> I’m not sure if anyone else would agree here.
>>
>> There are of course strong arguments against federalism in preference to
>> a stronger central government. That is the problem of getting solutions
>> implemented when there are countering movements in individual states where
>> particular powers are able to unduly control government. (This was of
>> course the argument of the classic progressives of the Teddy Roosevelt era)
>>  That is there will intrinsically be a tension between discovering
>> solutions for a problem and whether the majority or at least powerful want
>> to solve that problem. For an example of this think of the relative
>> difference in state policies in a state like Mississippi versus what we
>> might call a more successful state.
>>
>
>
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