BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px;
}John, JAS, list
I have two points about the comment by JAS, But I've outlined them
before and merely restate my view of the Peircean outline.
1] JAS: Why not simply admit disagreement with Peirce's explicitly
stated belief that God as" traditionally defined is the real,
personal, and transcendent creator of the universe? "
I don't think that Peirce said that section that I have underlined.
I don't know what 'traditionally defined' means. And, in addition,
this definition has to be contrasted with his many references to the
self-organizing nature of the universe, AND, the analogy of the term
of 'god' with 'mind'.
2] I have a problem with the analytic framework of JAS, where he can
take a hypothesis about belief [ie from Phyllis] about 'psychological
barriers to belief' - and conclude that people DO believe in the
'traditional definition of god ..etc' even though they say they do
not. It's just that they have a 'psychological barrier' to admitting
or being conscious of their belief!
I find such an assertion - illogical and unscientific.
3] And I do think that there is a huge difference between religion -
which is a psychological and societal system - and a personal belief
in god. I think you can belong to and participate in a religion, in
all its customs and beliefs, for the emotional and communal bonds
that a religion provides - and - be, personally, an atheist!
Edwina
On Tue 14/09/21 6:13 PM , "sowa @bestweb.net" s...@bestweb.net
sent:
Edwina, Jon AS, List, I don't remember all the details of Peirce's
many references to God or religion, but I do remember that he said
that his views were "unconventional", even though he did take
communion at an Episcopal church and he did have a strong spiritual
experience at St. Thomas Church on 5th Ave in New York.
BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }
ET: As for " the real, personal, and transcendent creator of the
universe" - that description, to me, is an anthropomorphic outline
and provides no analysis and moves, I feel, into the psychological.
I have not seen any passage by Peirce that implies the quoted
statement, and I would also avoid making Edwina's inference. JAS:
Why not simply admit disagreement with Peirce's explicitly stated
belief that God as traditionally defined is the real, personal, and
transcendent creator of the universe? That sentence merely states
a "traditional definition", but it does not claim that Peirce
believed that definition was true. I have not seen any such
definition in Peirce's writings. Please show (1) Peirce's exact
definition and (2) his statement that he believes it. JAS: Why keep
insisting that he somehow meant something different from what his own
words plainly state? Scholars of different traditions argue
endlessly over details of punctuation and little words or endings,
such as the suffix -que in "filioque". They would never use the
phrase "plainly state" about any religious text. Please show the
ipsissima verba that exactly state or seem to imply what Peirce
actually believed And by the way, Peirce made a sharp distinction
between formally defined statements in mathematics and mathematical
logic and informally defined statements in English or other natural
languages. Inferences from mathematical statements that follow
formal rules are acceptable. But informal inferences from statements
in ordinary language are much less reliable. Statements in ordinary
language about invisible beings are especially problematical. Just
ask any theologians in any tradition about their opinions of scholars
in other traditions. And by the way, I consider atheists to be
religious adherents of unconventional traditions. Einstein, for
example, sometimes said that he was an atheist. But when he was
asked "Do you believe in God?" He said "I believe in the God of
Spinoza." John
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
► PEIRCE-L subscribers: Click on "Reply List" or "Reply All" to REPLY ON
PEIRCE-L to this message. PEIRCE-L posts should go to peirce-L@list.iupui.edu .
► To UNSUBSCRIBE, send a message NOT to PEIRCE-L but to l...@list.iupui.edu
with UNSUBSCRIBE PEIRCE-L in the SUBJECT LINE of the message and nothing in the
body. More at https://list.iupui.edu/sympa/help/user-signoff.html .
► PEIRCE-L is owned by THE PEIRCE GROUP; moderated by Gary Richmond; and
co-managed by him and Ben Udell.
