Josh Berkus wrote:
> Bruce,
> > The fact is, the existing system worked as it should, though it is often
> > invisible.  We didn't get all the features we wanted, but that isn't
> > because the system isn't working.
> But it's exactly the invisibility of the process which people are 
> complaining about.   If the postgresql novice, it's darned near 
> impossible to figure our who is working on feature X and what it's 
> status or specification is.  Your TODO just doesn't reflect current 
> enough information.

Right.  I think we want people to announce to the lists before they
start on a patch.  Often we can give advice and if someone else is
working on it, they can mention that.  I don't think our TODO list will
ever allow people to start working effectively without asking the

> We've had this discussion, or one similar to it, each release for the 
> past 3 releases.  Obviously other people feel that there's an issue, 
> even if *you* don't.

OK, they are free to use other methods.  I am not stopping them.  The
TODO list marks items as done, but doesn't really track who is working
on what.

> Also, the current nature of the system has a "bus-factor of 1"; that is, 
> if you get hit by a bus NOBODY else has the information you have in your 
> head (I seem to recall you harassing Marc about similar 
> single-point-of-failure issues).   We need a Bruce brain-dump to the 
> web, even if someone else has to do the typing.

I know about the same as the community members who pay attention to
postings.  What I do is to act on that information by contacting
developers and asking them to complete their work for feature freeze.
Many of my conversations are not appropriate for the public, which is
why it is done privately.

In fact, the feedback I have gotten from some community members that
have heard a little of the discussions I have had with developers is
that I am too forceful.  I know that doesn't match my often non-critical
or even lax handling of things, but I take my community responsibility
seriously, and if someone has stated they are working on an item, I
expect them to take that pledge seriously as well.

As far as people always asking for better tracking, they used to always
ask for a roadmap, and when we stated we couldn't because we have no
control over developers, they pointed to Mozilla, which had a roadmap at
the time (but we know what happened to them.)

In the case of recursive queries, I did more than might have even been
polite to try to get the developer to complete it.  I don't see how
changing our system is going to improve it.  If you want to change the
system, find a system that would have actually done better than what we
have in place.

Or try a new system, and I will keep doing what I do, and we can see
which system works best.

  Bruce Momjian   [EMAIL PROTECTED]

  + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. +

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