I agree with the fact that words shape our way of thinking, but how does master in this context relates to slavery?
I would agree that a master/slave disk setup would directly relate to that, but as I see there are no "slave" branches nor repositories. So I really don't understand it. As for Pharo being political, I have my doubts, but calling people names does not foster dialogue, and certainly doesn't help building a stronger community. Best regards, Esteban A. Maringolo On Wed, Jul 21, 2021 at 7:18 AM Steven Costiou <[email protected]> wrote: > > Bullshit bullshit bullshit. > > It is not about feeling oppressed and stuff, it is about systemic racism that > impregnated our vocabulary and that we are trying to get rid off. > We should say in the FAQ that we support the idea of the transition but that > for now, technically, using "master" is easier with Pharo until anyone from > the community takes her time to solve the project. > > Woke + Virtue-Signalling => nazi words used by nazis to tell other nazis that > they should nazify the discussion and kill every effort about any kind of > social movement discussion. > + typical nazi arguments everywhere in your messages... We're not stupid. > > Vocabulary and things will change. Pharo is political (in every way), so it > has a political dimension and it will be discussed. > You can do nothing about it. > Just quit. > > > > Le 2021-07-21 11:51, [email protected] a écrit : > > Ugh. Slight history lesson / disambiguation. > > > > The phrasing „woke" actually came from „the left", first it was being „woke" > about feminism, then this, then that. > > Then, those who felt oppressed by the sexist arguments of extreme, „woke" > fraction of feminism, or racist arguments of those posing as anti-racists > (and I could go on), started to use it as a pejorative, for those pushing > insane propaganda, and for the propaganda itself. > > Then, those who called themselves / their positions „woke" in the past, > started screeching that it is „extreme right vocabulary". > > > > As multiple people pointed out, master repository doesn't have anything to do > with slavery; as I pointed out there is need to feel butthurt about some > words even if your ancestors were affected by the concepts they were also > used for. So you points are completely invalid, virtue-signalling garbage. > > > > But it usually takes „having the lived experience" of the woke garbage > turning aginst you, to get one of the indoctrinated to leave their religion. > And trying to do so doesn't belong on this forum, I just said what I felt > needed to be said. > > > > And with this, I'm back to lurking, I just wanted to clearly demonstrate why > such debates have no merit (clearly the opposite) on prog. lang. > forums/mailing list. > > > > Everyone, keep on making Pharo great. > > > > From: Steven Costiou <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2021 9:47 PM > To: Rauš Miloslav <[email protected]> > Cc: [email protected] > Subject: [Pharo-dev] Re: Metacello / Iceberg / GitHub master to main renaming > > > > So far, no windmill complained about "woke incursions". > "Woke" is extremely clear vocabulary, only used by - let us get straight to > the point and not waste our time - modern nazis. > > So, perhaps you misused the word and should document yourself extensively on > the subject. > But your reply seems to point otherwise. > And *you* are the one feeling hurt because we want to recognize that > vocabulary has an impact on how we perceive and conceive things. > What was that again about cowardise and virtue? :) > > It is something to cope as we can with an annoying technical situation, it is > another thing to ask to not consider political views because they are "woke" > (which only purpose is to deny their legitimity without arguing). > Does the Pharo community support "anti-woke" argumentation? > This needs to be clear so that I can decide to leave the community or not. > > Or perhaps, that is a misunderstanding. > > Steven. > > Le 2021-07-20 20:12, [email protected] a écrit : > > Hi, > > > > it's „highly probably" somewhere in the territorry of poor understanding, but > I wouldn't blame language (don't pretend to be obtuse when you want to be > sneakily subversive). > > > > I explicitly stated that fighting against _actual_ slavery is better done by > other means / elsewhere. Fighting against percieved shadows („extreme right > vocabulary"; or nomenclature that never hurt no-one) is just divisive, and > counter-productive on a programming language mailing-list. > > > > You can't erase history, and that some words that had negative connotations > in the past are used for new, entirely unrelated purposes today is no wonder. > > > > As, of course, you can't be bothered to know, I'm member of one of those > nations called „Slavic" (.cz in my mail address). You know, you pretender, > nations who were enslaved so frequently that the word „slave" came from our > enslavement. Do I have a tendency to blame „heirs" of those who enslaved us > in the past ? Do I cringe every time the word slave is uttered ? Do you know > that some brainwashed individuals in our nation, in sync with todays > brainwashing, tried to push the narrative that we (our nation), were > colonizers as well ? > > > > NO. > > > > No-one is gonna make me feel like a victim (or an abuser) because of what > happened in the past, before my father was born, etc. > > > > Go fight you windmills, Don Q., I just hope the rest of the community won't > let themselves be pulled into it. > > > > M.R. > > > > From: Steven Costiou <[email protected]> > Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2021 4:08 PM > To: Pharo Development List <[email protected]> > Cc: Rauš Miloslav <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] Re: Metacello / Iceberg / GitHub master to main > renaming > > > > Le 2021-07-19 16:54, [email protected] a écrit : > > Maybe it's worth putting something in an faq - that we support the intent of > the master to main naming convention > > That's pretty counter-productive. It would be just empty virtue-signalling > response to an empty virtue-signalling gesture (that of MS/Github pushing > master->main transition). > > The change would bring absolutely nothing to no-one (except a lot of needless > work/friction; and an inroad for future woke incursions). Whomever is having > problem with slavery can fight modern-day slavery in ie. Africa / China / etc > or sex trafficking in their own country. > > > > I'm a bit sorry if I misinterpret what you say because of my poor > understanding of english. > But I would answer that whomever having a problem with fighting slavery in > general should leave the community. > Anyone also using and supporting extreme right vocabulary (e.g. "woke") > should leave the community. > If that's trolling, all the same. > > > > If I misinterpreted (non-native english speaker), I am sorry, and probably > you will agree with me and there is no need for dicussion. > > > > Steven. > > > > > > I'd prefer either nothing in the FAQ, or finite statement to the tune of "no > wokeness, we are about merit and not about empty gestures". > > > Of course I expect cowardice & virtue-signalling to win in the end, but at > least I tried. > > > M.R. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tim Mackinnon <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 1:14 PM > To: Pharo Development List <[email protected]> > Subject: [Pharo-dev] Re: Metacello / Iceberg / GitHub master to main renaming > > Maybe it's worth putting something in an faq - that we support the intent of > the master to main naming convention, but that as we are a small community > trying to improve many aspects of 50 years of development, this one had to > unfortunately take a back seat for the moment while we simplify other things > to make this an easier change? > > > Tim > > > > On 19 Jul 2021, at 12:26, stephane ducasse <[email protected]> wrote: > > Sven > > From that perspective this master to main change will cost us a lot of > problem. > I decided to continue to configure all my repositories to use master > and I will do it for any repository that is related to pharo and that people > may use. Just to remove such kind of friction. > I would encourage people to do the same like that we do not have to think. > > S > > > > On 12 Jul 2021, at 14:32, Sven Van Caekenberghe <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi, > > For new GitHub projects the default branch is now main instead of master. > > There is however code in Metacello / Iceberg / ... that tries a number of > options if no branch is specified, but it is not yet aware of this change. > > Specifically: > > This does not work > > ./pharo reddit.image metacello install github://svenvc/Reddit > BaselineOfReddit > > instead you have to say > > ./pharo reddit.image metacello install github://svenvc/Reddit:main/ > BaselineOfReddit > > It took me half an hour to figure this out ;-) > > Sven > > > > > >
