I agree with the fact that words shape our way of thinking, but how
does master in this context relates to slavery?

I would agree that a master/slave disk setup would directly relate to
that, but as I see there are no "slave" branches nor repositories. So
I really don't understand it.

As for Pharo being political, I have my doubts, but calling people
names does not foster dialogue, and certainly doesn't help building a
stronger community.

Best regards,

Esteban A. Maringolo

On Wed, Jul 21, 2021 at 7:18 AM Steven Costiou <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Bullshit bullshit bullshit.
>
> It is not about feeling oppressed and stuff, it is about systemic racism that 
> impregnated our vocabulary and that we are trying to get rid off.
> We should say in the FAQ that we support the idea of the transition but that 
> for now, technically, using "master" is easier with Pharo until anyone from 
> the community takes her time to solve the project.
>
> Woke + Virtue-Signalling => nazi words used by nazis to tell other nazis that 
> they should nazify the discussion and kill every effort about any kind of 
> social movement discussion.
> + typical nazi arguments everywhere in your messages... We're not stupid.
>
> Vocabulary and things will change. Pharo is political (in every way), so it 
> has a political dimension and it will be discussed.
> You can do nothing about it.
> Just quit.
>
>
>
> Le 2021-07-21 11:51, [email protected] a écrit :
>
> Ugh. Slight history lesson / disambiguation.
>
>
>
> The phrasing „woke" actually came from „the left", first it was being „woke" 
> about feminism, then this, then that.
>
> Then, those who felt oppressed by the sexist arguments of extreme, „woke" 
> fraction of feminism, or racist arguments of those posing as anti-racists 
> (and I could go on), started to use it as a pejorative, for those pushing 
> insane propaganda, and for the propaganda itself.
>
> Then, those who called themselves / their positions „woke" in the past, 
> started screeching that it is „extreme right vocabulary".
>
>
>
> As multiple people pointed out, master repository doesn't have anything to do 
> with slavery; as I pointed out there is need to feel butthurt about some 
> words even if your ancestors were affected by the concepts they were also 
> used for. So you points are completely invalid, virtue-signalling garbage.
>
>
>
> But it usually takes „having the lived experience" of the woke garbage 
> turning aginst you, to get one of the indoctrinated to leave their religion. 
> And trying to do so doesn't belong on this forum, I just said what I felt 
> needed to be said.
>
>
>
> And with this, I'm back to lurking, I just wanted to clearly demonstrate why 
> such debates have no merit (clearly the opposite) on prog. lang. 
> forums/mailing list.
>
>
>
> Everyone, keep on making Pharo great.
>
>
>
> From: Steven Costiou <[email protected]>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2021 9:47 PM
> To: Rauš Miloslav <[email protected]>
> Cc: [email protected]
> Subject: [Pharo-dev] Re: Metacello / Iceberg / GitHub master to main renaming
>
>
>
> So far, no windmill complained about "woke incursions".
> "Woke" is extremely clear vocabulary, only used by - let us get straight to 
> the point and not waste our time - modern nazis.
>
> So, perhaps you misused the word and should document yourself extensively on 
> the subject.
> But your reply seems to point otherwise.
> And *you* are the one feeling hurt because we want to recognize that 
> vocabulary has an impact on how we perceive and conceive things.
> What was that again about cowardise and virtue? :)
>
> It is something to cope as we can with an annoying technical situation, it is 
> another thing to ask to not consider political views because they are "woke" 
> (which only purpose is to deny their legitimity without arguing).
> Does the Pharo community support "anti-woke" argumentation?
> This needs to be clear so that I can decide to leave the community or not.
>
> Or perhaps, that is a misunderstanding.
>
> Steven.
>
> Le 2021-07-20 20:12, [email protected] a écrit :
>
> Hi,
>
>
>
> it's „highly probably" somewhere in the territorry of poor understanding, but 
> I wouldn't blame language (don't pretend to be obtuse when you want to be 
> sneakily subversive).
>
>
>
> I explicitly stated that fighting against _actual_ slavery is better done by 
> other means / elsewhere. Fighting against percieved shadows („extreme right 
> vocabulary"; or nomenclature that never hurt no-one) is just divisive, and 
> counter-productive on a programming language mailing-list.
>
>
>
> You can't erase history, and that some words that had negative connotations 
> in the past are used for new, entirely unrelated purposes today is no wonder.
>
>
>
> As, of course, you can't be bothered to know, I'm member of one of those 
> nations called „Slavic" (.cz in my mail address). You know, you pretender, 
> nations who were enslaved so frequently that the word „slave" came from our 
> enslavement. Do I have a tendency to blame „heirs" of those who enslaved us 
> in the past ? Do I cringe every time the word slave is uttered ? Do you know 
> that some brainwashed individuals in our nation, in sync with todays 
> brainwashing, tried to push the narrative that we (our nation), were 
> colonizers as well ?
>
>
>
> NO.
>
>
>
> No-one is gonna make me feel like a victim (or an abuser) because of what 
> happened in the past, before my father was born, etc.
>
>
>
> Go fight you windmills, Don Q., I just hope the rest of the community won't 
> let themselves be pulled into it.
>
>
>
> M.R.
>
>
>
> From: Steven Costiou <[email protected]>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2021 4:08 PM
> To: Pharo Development List <[email protected]>
> Cc: Rauš Miloslav <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] Re: Metacello / Iceberg / GitHub master to main 
> renaming
>
>
>
> Le 2021-07-19 16:54, [email protected] a écrit :
>
> Maybe it's worth putting something in an faq - that we support the intent of 
> the master to main naming convention
>
> That's pretty counter-productive. It would be just empty virtue-signalling 
> response to an empty virtue-signalling gesture (that of MS/Github pushing 
> master->main transition).
>
> The change would bring absolutely nothing to no-one (except a lot of needless 
> work/friction; and an inroad for future woke incursions). Whomever is having 
> problem with slavery can fight modern-day slavery in ie. Africa / China / etc 
> or sex trafficking in their own country.
>
>
>
> I'm a bit sorry if I misinterpret what you say because of my poor 
> understanding of english.
> But I would answer that whomever having a problem with fighting slavery in 
> general should leave the community.
> Anyone also using and supporting extreme right vocabulary (e.g. "woke") 
> should leave the community.
> If that's trolling, all the same.
>
>
>
> If I misinterpreted (non-native english speaker), I am sorry, and probably 
> you will agree with me and there is no need for dicussion.
>
>
>
> Steven.
>
>
>
>
>
> I'd prefer either nothing in the FAQ, or finite statement to the tune of "no 
> wokeness, we are about merit and not about empty gestures".
>
>
> Of course I expect cowardice & virtue-signalling to win in the end, but at 
> least I tried.
>
>
> M.R.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tim Mackinnon <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, July 19, 2021 1:14 PM
> To: Pharo Development List <[email protected]>
> Subject: [Pharo-dev] Re: Metacello / Iceberg / GitHub master to main renaming
>
> Maybe it's worth putting something in an faq - that we support the intent of 
> the master to main naming convention, but that as we are a small community 
> trying to improve many aspects of 50 years of development, this one had to 
> unfortunately take a back seat for the moment while we simplify other things 
> to make this an easier change?
>
>
> Tim
>
>
>
> On 19 Jul 2021, at 12:26, stephane ducasse <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Sven
>
> From that perspective this master to main change will cost us a lot of 
> problem.
> I decided to continue to configure all my repositories to use master
> and I will do it for any repository that is related to pharo and that people 
> may use. Just to remove such kind of friction.
> I would encourage people to do the same like that we do not have to think.
>
> S
>
>
>
> On 12 Jul 2021, at 14:32, Sven Van Caekenberghe <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> For new GitHub projects the default branch is now main instead of master.
>
> There is however code in Metacello / Iceberg / ... that tries a number of 
> options if no branch is specified, but it is not yet aware of this change.
>
> Specifically:
>
> This does not work
>
> ./pharo reddit.image metacello install github://svenvc/Reddit
> BaselineOfReddit
>
> instead you have to say
>
> ./pharo reddit.image metacello install github://svenvc/Reddit:main/
> BaselineOfReddit
>
> It took me half an hour to figure this out ;-)
>
> Sven
>
>
>
>
>
>

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