on 02/17/2010 02:46 PM Daniel Brown said the following:
>     My problem is with Manuel's practices of advertising the site.
>     In all of the years I've been involved with PHP, both officially
> and as a part of the community, all I've seen you (Manuel) contribute
> to the community is a health dose of "go to my website."  You've never
> (or, perhaps so rarely it seems as though you've never) offered
> advice, assistance, or free code without the guise of, "go to

I completely disagree with that. Regardless how many times I refer to
pages in the PHPClasses site, I always explain how to solve the problems
of the users that I bother to reply here. Anybody can check the archives
and verify that.

> phpclasses.org."  To me, it's completely out of the spirit of open
> source, and puts a thin veil over - however unintentional it may be -
> extremely disgusting practices of advertising.  I've avoided saying

I don't know what you think it is the "Open Source spirit". For me is
sharing the source of code that solves user problems. That is what I
share in the PHPClasses site: I share my PHP source code.

It seems you are complaining that I do not post the source code here. I
do not think that would be viable, as most solutions that I refer have
thousands of lines of code. Sharing large pieces of code is what
repositories like PHPClasses are for.

What about you? How many times have you shared your Open Source code?

> anything negative about it on the list through the years, but
> seriously, enough is enough, and something has to be said.  And you
> can trust me that I'm *not* the only one who thinks that.  I know of a
> lot of people who filter messages from you into the trash or SPAM
> folder because the response is always the same, and usually useless,
> overall.

That is your opinion because you seem to be biased and you just do not
seem to want that I post any sort of help at all, otherwise you would
not ignored the countless times that I bothered to come here and post
replies that do not lead people to the PHPClasses site.

It would be much less hypocrit if you would just tell me directly that
you do not want me to help people here in any form.

>     Again, it's nothing against your site.  The site can actually be

I doubt that. You seem to be contradicting yourself. First you complain
that I lead people to the PHPClasses site, then you claim you have
nothing against the site. Does not sound very consistent.

How else do you want me to help people when I have a solution to their
problems that I submitted to the PHPClasses site? Do you want me to tell
that I have a solution, do not tell them where it is available, and let
them guess that it is in the PHPClasses? Sounds ridiculous.

> pretty useful.... but how about just adding it as a signature to your
> email and actually posting FREE, USEFUL material relevant to the

What are you talking about? I only post free material here. I do not
sell code. All the code I distribute is open source. If you do not find
it useful just because I make the code available in the PHPClasses site,
that is your opinion. Assuming that everybody finds it useless it is
just a biased complaint.

If you search the archives of the list you will find plenty of other
users recommending code that is in the PHPClasses site, either mine or
from others. Are you going to claim those people are also evil?

> topic?  Stop using mailing lists and forums as a free treasure trove
> of opportunity for advertising your services and pay it back in a way:
> by actually contributing something to the community, completely
> selfless, with no ulterior motive.  You think the site is seeing some
> success now?  Wait until you try that and see how good quality traffic
> increases in a few months.  You'll be well-rewarded, I would almost
> guarantee it.

I may be wrong but the impression that you are passing is that you have
a deep envy of the attention that the site gets. You seem to want to
fight that, as if letting the others know about the site is bad thing,
and I am being evil when I tell about the site resources here.

Furthermore you seem to assume that the site only gets traffic from this
list. You could not be farther from truth. This site gets more than
20.000 unique visitors every day. About 12.000 come from Google and
other search engines. The rest is users that visit the site directly or
were lead after reading any of the site newsletters.

The mentions of the site in this list hardly affect the site traffic
these days. It may have affected in the early days when the site was

If you really want to know why the site gets so much traffic these days,
is because it has over 5000 packages for all sorts of purposes
contributed by over 2600 of authors. The 30 packages that I have
contributed hardly make a difference these days in the overall site traffic.

So, if you wonder why I still bother to come here when I have time and
tell you about my packages, is because the original reason that made me
create the site prevails.

I created the site in 1999 to share my work, so others can test it and
provide eventual bug reports and improvement suggestions. That feedback
from the users is my gaibn. That will benefit the quality of my work and
consequently the projects on which I use those packages.

The site originally had to commercial purposes. The commercial purposes
only started in 2001 when I needed to professionalize it to keep it open.

Still before then and even before the PHPClasses site was created I came
here and helped others letting them know about components I wrote that
can solve the problems they presented. The difference is that I pointed
users to other sites where I shared my work before PHPClasses. Check the
list archives to verify that is a fact.

So, instead of complaining, why don't you try to be more positive and
help other users sharing your PHP components in the PHPClasses site like
many thousands of users did?

If you do not like the way the site works, try submitting it elsewhere,
or better create your own repository, as others already suggested.

I am sure it would be more helpful than trying to act as if you are the
owner and the censor of this list and your task is to boycott my


Manuel Lemos

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