>Bob Marchant writes
>>
>>Well , here's the big question . Are you talking about a real contract
>>proof ? The kind where you , as a company , guarantee it's accuracy for
>>repro , with the subsequent liability for any claims should the proof
>>be innaccurate ?
>
Richard Kenward wrote :-
>
>Is this really a fair question? A contract proof is only such if both
>parties, the one asking for a print run to match it and the party
>expected to do this if they both accept that it is the standard to
>match...that's what a contract proof is, be it on loo paper on a John
>Bull printing outfit or a Fuji Final Proofing system.
Hi Richard ,
A contract proof does what it says on the box.It forms the basis of a
contract , even if that contract is based on your system outlined above.A
contract implies legal obligations.
>
>No supplier could be expected to give the assurances you are asking
>Philip's outfit to provide surely?
Two answers to two questions here.Firstly , yes there are suppliers that
give these assurances .They are the pre press companies that work with
press houses ,or press house with in house repro.The client signs off the
proof , the press has an obligation to match within defined tolerances
the proof that the pre press company supplies. It's a legal contract ,
and many companies have found out just how expensive it can get when
things go wrong.
If I purchase a proof from a company such as Philips , and use it as the
basis for a contract , I want to know that the proof is accurate for my
purposes.
Secondly , I'm not expecting anything from Philips company . Philip is
quite rightly asking relevant questions on this list as to the sort of
service he should provide. In order to establish a reasoned response ,
I'm asking about his methodology.
>Inaccurate in what way? Ask a dozen pre-press companies to proof a job
>on the same proofing systems or different ones and I bet you will get a
>dozen different results to look at..
Well ,actually if you ask a dozen pre-press companies to a job on the
same proofing system using the same parameters then in the case of the
Digital Cromalin for instance , you will not get a different result.
The mistake that most people make here is that they believe the Digital
Cromalin machine and other industry standard proofing devices only have
one flavour of CMYK.
They don't.
They can be set up to proof to a variety of press settings.To get a
proper contract proof , you should of course define the press target.
It's this lack of understanding of the pre press process that leads to
innaccuracies.
As we all know , even if you use a modest inkjet such as a profiled 1160
and use it within defined parameters , you will get print output from
different machines that match within very fine tolerances. And the same
can be achieved from model to model as we have found out on our Pro-File
testing.
This of course is the result of the fine work caried out by the likes of
Thomas Holm , Neil Barstow and others.
>>...so which is the right one now?
The right one is the one that has been produced by a knowledgable company
using the correct protocol.
I wrote:-
>>If this is the case , I would go to a company who were extremely well
>>versed in colour proofing and understood the implications of supplying
>>proper contract proofs. Oh , and of course the ability to settle any
>>dispute with a third party either technically or financially.
Richard wrote:-
>Pie in the sky I would say to the last sentence<G>
>
>Happy hunting!
Well Richard , we've already done our hunting . The more sophisticated
pre press and press houses are already running fully colour managed
workflows.
F'rinstance, the company we used to print the last two years IDEA awards
books used Iris prints as the contract proofs. They supplied us with a
profile that described their press and was used in conjunction with their
Iris printer.
Our company used this profile to preview and separate the image files.
We signed off the proofs, they matched the proofs.
Job done.
The answer is in understanding that there is no universal CMYK space that
suits all presses and paper/inks and therefore no universal CMYK proofing
space.
If somebody is supplying contract proofs , then those proofs must be
targetted at the relevant press, or at a target that is mutually agreed
by all parties , and I believe that this should be made clear to
everybody on this list.
Hence my questions to Philip. I 'm sure that he will soon get back to us
with the relevant answers.
Regards,
Bob Marchant.
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