On 10/08/2017 06:44 AM, One7two99 wrote:

Hello Taiidan,

There isn't any reason to buy purism's faux
libre laptops instead of say
a Lenovo G505S ...
I don't understand why this topic is often discussed to emotionally.
As far as I know the G505s is a big laptop (15inch?) which seems also located at the 
entry class (compared to the "Thinkpad class").
The performance is about the same as an ivy bridge class laptop (X230), the downsides being the build quality is not as good and there is no dock or second battery option.
Don't get me wrong I think most "older" are perfectly fine, that why I am 
suggesting looking at a x230 or similar.
A good thing with Purism Laptop line is, that it shows that there is a market for laptops 
that seem to look like they are more "free" than others - if the company fools 
people here, you are right this is bad - but this is also a chance for others to make it 
More competition is always good :-)
If it was a bigger market I would agree with you, however in such a small market they simply suck resources from better projects.
And maybe some users just want to buy a new "shiny" machine and not a 4y old 
Then they should buy a dell
Maybe even for the "strange" reason that it just looks more sexy or that they 
need certain interfaces, a specific display resolution ... Whatever.
Looking at my company it would not be possible to buy a used machine without 
hardware replacement as all laptop are covered with on-site service.
That's why I'm using the X230 as BYOD device.

which is actually owner controlled (open
source hw init coreboot), supports qubes
4.0 and doesn't have a black box supervisor
processor (ME/PSP)
If I understand you correctly you're saying that the blob which contains Intel 
AMT/ME is not modified in Purisms laptop line?
It is modified by me_cleaner but as I said before one can do this on pretty much any laptop without boot guard (or cross vendor cpu swap to disable BG) and save the additional thousand dollars you would have spent on a purism laptop over a dell (I like dell because of the "ProSupport" US tech support option on their business lines) - additionally if Intel had a backdoor in ME they would include it in FSP as well making purism's "coreboot" quite pointless

me cleaner only would effect generic ME exploits not the hypothetical intel backdoor which could easily be included in the initial modules, hardware mask ROM or hidden EEPROM.
As far as I know it is possible (at least for the laptop I am using an also 
others) to use ME_cleaner which will cripple the AMT Blob so that the risk that 
anything bad is running there is reduced.
Yeah I did it on my X230 and it works great, but me is simply nerfed not disabled - a laptop without it is much better.
Take a look at this post:

"(...) Of those 23 modules, 21 modules are completely removed from the ME partition, 
and we leave only 2 modules: ROMP and BUP. The ROMP module is a “ROM bypass” module which 
is used to bypass the ROM initialization code and it’s less than 1KB of code, used to 
load the BUP module and execute it. The BUP module is a 116KB module which is used to 
initialize the ME hardware. (...)"

So this would still be a (bit more) reasonable secure laptop.
Of course, but at that point you might as well just skip the middleman and go buy a laptop from a chinese whitebox seller like they did - then run ME cleaner yourself (and donate the money you saved to the people who made me_cleaner)

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