Thank again for the extensive infos Toni

In fact, that sounds great about the concurrent user amount, specialy for
scenes without avatars, as I think there are many cases where avatars are
not really needed.

As for the use with avatars, its a good start with about 30-50 in one place
as a for a lot of uses a seperation into different rooms is no problem,
maybe even better for load balancing. Thats why I had the idea that maybe
Shibboleth and Grouper could be used for federated single sign on to xmpp,
web content and tundra and using grouper for group management. Though I
still have to read through those docus to see if I didnt misunderstood the
concept. So far there are a few things out using this approach (without
tundra of course) in some universities. What I liked most in this approach
is the way federations between different authentication providers work. But
as mentioned - I will have to play around with it first to get a bit
familiar with it.

About the Tundra version: I was using 1.03 where I experienced the
previously mentioned issues. Strangely when I hit the update button it asks
about installing to Version 1.0.3 again, which I did once but its still the
same. Everytime when I start the viewer, I'm asked if I want to update. Just
after I did choose the repair option in the installer it replaced viewer.exe
and after that the update message after viewer start didnt show again - but
when I try manual update, it still shows that it found an update. (why did I
click it ? Just because it was there) I will try a de-/reinstall maybe it
gets better.

The good news - the tree textures are there now - but not the bark textures
and also the fish and osprey demo still behave the same - maybe there is
something somewhere cached and a full deinstallation will solve it.

Cheers
Pedro


On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 3:53 PM, Toni Alatalo <[email protected]> wrote:

> On Sat, 2011-03-05 at 15:19 +0100, Peter Steinlechner wrote:
> > thanks for the update, as I was just about to post about the missing
> > textures. I have a simlar issue with a group of trees in the chesapeak
> > bay demo where the textures dont show.
>
> Yes there is a known issue, certain ones don't (always) show over http
> in viewer. Strangely enough they show on the server when you run that
> with the renderer, and on Linux showed for me last night in viewer too
> (at last built linux naali with nvidia cg so the shaders work). There is
> very little difference in how scene loading happens in server/viewer
> mode (when rendering enabled, not headless) so is weird, we'll debug
> that next week.
>
> > The osprey demo i couldn't get to work at all. I wonder if thats maybe
> > in connection with the preview version I had installed or did I
>
> Please use at least 1.0.2 and why not 1.0.3 -- earlier versions had
> issues with http assets dependencies from scripts vs. headless server
> etc, I'm surprised the December preview works that much.
>
> > Maybe a too early question: how many concurrent users you estimated
> > could connect to a tundra server ?
>
> Depending on the application, the current bottleneck is easily the
> bandwidth of the realtime communication. Again how much bandwidth is
> taken depends on the application -- if all just look at a static scene
> and fly around with cameras, that doesn't take any bandwidth (cameras
> are local only) you can basically have an infinite amount (is basically
> like many users having loaded the same web page, which they can scroll,
> but nothing is synched among participants).
>
> If you want avatars for all, the current av app takes quite a lot 'cause
> there are no separate movement messages but it all goes with the generic
> EC sync. I don't remember the exact figures, Jukka wrote it in some
> post, but IIRC he said the bandwidth is already less than with LLUDP ..
> and that now you could have 30-40 and with optimizations 60-80 or so.
> Doing those optimizations by writing dedicated movement packages is
> planned.
>
> To go above that we've been talking about the usual MMO solutions of
> separating the scene to different 'rooms' etc. and other normal
> techniques to not communicate everything to everyone all the time. Enne
> at least needs this I think, but how and who would develop it is not
> known yet (we keep planning it in coming weeks).
>
> We will certainly also check out the Opensim scalability work being done
> at Intel and continue talks with those guys .. they use server side
> proxies (client managers) to kind of facade the sim connection by using
> several servers, that are all connected to a master server, and Dan Lake
> told on IRC early this week that they've had 1,500 avatars in one scene
> now with this technique. For those who want this technique, host a
> server farm with numerous sim servers all serving the same scene to a
> different group of clients (but all clients still see each other, this
> is not sharding), it is yet an open question whether is better to use
> opensim and Intel's work as is, or whether the same proxy stuff could be
> easily adopted to Tundra too (Dan at least was gonna check Tundra demos
> out :). The protocol they use to talk between the client managers and
> the master server is a custom thing anyway, not LLUDP (just some ad hoc
> messaging with tcp). I don't know yet if/when someone actually needs
> this with reX.
>
> > Pedro
>
> ~Toni
>
> > On Sat, Mar 5, 2011 at 2:58 PM, Toni Alatalo <[email protected]>
> > wrote:
> >         On Sat, 2011-03-05 at 15:48 +0200, Toni Alatalo wrote:
> >         > On Sat, 2011-03-05 at 15:25 +0200, Toni Alatalo wrote:
> >         > > server.exe --file
> >         > >
> >
> http://www.realxtend.org/world/BeneathTheWaves/BeneathTheWaves.txml
> >
> >         > are some strange white objects (the texture png they ref to
> >         seemed white
> >         > in my browser at least)
> >
> >
> >         Ah sorry for another message, forgot to mention the most
> >         visible known
> >         issue: some of the textures are assigned with the direct
> >         use-this-image-as-texture technique which is supported in old
> >         rexviewer
> >         and in Naali against Taiga, but not with Tundra. This is by
> >         design as we
> >         figured that it's ok to require using material definitions
> >         like normally
> >         with Ogre. So many textures there don't show 'cause the
> >         material ref in
> >         the mesh is directly to an image.
> >
> >         There's two ways to solve this:
> >         a) create new plain use-a-texture materials in the converter
> >         b) add some feature to Tundra to support using images as
> >         textures
> >         directly. possibly a script that you can attach, or somehow to
> >         the
> >         internals.
> >
> >         Feedback on which approach would seem more useful is welcome,
> >         if is
> >         worthwhile I can do either at some point.
> >
> >         > ~Toni
> >
> >         same, but off now.
> >
> >
> >
> >         --
> >         http://groups.google.com/group/realxtend
> >         http://www.realxtend.org
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > http://groups.google.com/group/realxtend
> > http://www.realxtend.org
>
>
> --
> http://groups.google.com/group/realxtend
> http://www.realxtend.org
>

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