Re: [Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 04:19:23PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: >On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 02:13:48PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: > >On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 01:36:00PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: > > >I've relocated to Florida (Palm Bay), and am trying to set > > >up shop here as a KJ. > > Well, no shit. Welcome to sunny (where, by sunny, right now I > mean > > 'rainy') Florida. > > > >Indeed. It's quite a bit nicer than Colorado's weather though. > I'll bet. > >Heh. Yeah. You joke until you realize that last year it SNOWED >IN JUNE there. That sucked, and filled me with much annoyance. >Colorado natives can NOT drive correctly in snow. They all just buy >four-wheel drives to compensate. Hee. >At least the wrecks are entertaining as long as you're not involved in them >:P I'll bet. > So I found out further down, and forgot to go back and edit this. Nice > to have a portable skill, though, isn't it? > >It is, yes. I love freelance software development. Because I'm >single (dammit) and have no local "ties" really I can just up >and "take a vacation" to some other exotic spot (though for now, >Florida is plenty "exotic" compared to my previous port of call) >and keep on working; clients rarely (if ever) need to actually meet >face-to-face. Indeed. My chops are mostly system and network admin, and help desk, which are slightly less portable. I used to be a coder, but I much prefer to design (which is just as well, since so few *coders* are decent designers...) > >Same here. I've got a Python module built that can automatically > >handle song rotations ( i.e. you hand it names, songs, etc., and > >it timestamps each submission (and new singer), counts total > >performances by each singer per night, and performs weighted, > >balanced rotation management to keep the "average wait time per > >singer" down. > > How does that play in Peoria? Most of the KJs in my market use strict > rotation, and most of the circuit singers don't well tolerate anyone > who doesn't. Including me. :-) > >I've been to many karaoke shows here in Palm Bay/Melbourne now, and >I am consistently annoyed with how rotations run, because nobody >runs them like I do. :) >Nobody seems to run a rotation the same way either, and the net >result is people end up waiting too long. The guy who runs most of >the shows I attend now does something really funky -- instead of >smoothly blending new and old singers together into rotations, he >does it in batches. One old singer, three new ones, one old one, >four new ones, etc. That has the effect of putting people off and >making people wait longer than necessary. I suppose it's time to start figuring out what can be optimzed for, and what that optimization pessimizes. Do we have a wiki yet? :-) >The management system I wrote was initially just strict rotation >(FIFO), but that doesn't fly. Flies just fine here... why doesn't it fly other places? Oh, wait: you're about to explain. :-) > The new one was designed with these >principles and goals in mind: >1) A singer who arrives early (or at least on time) at show start >and stays until the show closes should get to sing more songs (and >with as "even" a wait between songs as possible) than someone who >turns up later. Straight rotation handles this: the size of the full singer list follows a bell curve; the early rotations may be 4 to 6 singers, even though the largest one is 24 singers. The tighter a show you play, the more benefit the early arrivers get. >2) A singer who shows up an hour before the show closes should have >at least a *chance* to sing one song if at all possible. This is *usually* not a problem at my most common show; attrition is pretty hard after the Big Rotation. >3) Apart from respecting 1 & 2, singers should sing on a >first-come-first-served basis, mixing new singers with old once the >first rotation is finished. Hmmm... >The end result of all this juggling is that a person who shows up >right at 9:00pm at show start will still get to sing three songs >if I have forty singers in a night, while someone who shows up at >midnight (show closing at 1:00am) will sneak in and get one song. >Everybody else waits a uniformly average amount of time ( i.e. >everybody waits about the same amount of time, give or take a few >minutes, between their songs). That wait increases as people get >added, but it's uniform; there's no "special treatment". "Special treatment" is like "special interest". It depends on you
Re: [Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 02:13:48PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote:>On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[1]jra@baylink.com> wrote:>> On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 01:36:00PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: > >I've relocated to Florida (Palm Bay), and am trying to set> >up shop here as a KJ.> Well, no shit. Welcome to sunny (where, by sunny, right now I mean> 'rainy') Florida. >>Indeed. It's quite a bit nicer than Colorado's weather though.I'll bet.Heh. Yeah. You joke until you realize that last year it SNOWED IN JUNE there. That sucked, and filled me with much annoyance. Colorado natives can NOT drive correctly in snow. They all just buy four-wheel drives to compensate. At least the wrecks are entertaining as long as you're not involved in them :P > >but software projects are paying the bills right now. I've got> Was that what brought you here?>>No, not really. A woman did. You'd think I'd have learned from the first >time I moved from one state to another to live with somebody -- maybe I'll>learn from this one.So I found out further down, and forgot to go back and edit this. Niceto have a portable skill, though, isn't it? It is, yes. I love freelance software development. Because I'm single (dammit) and have no local "ties" really I can just up and "take a vacation" to some other exotic spot (though for now, Florida is plenty "exotic" compared to my previous port of call) and keep on working; clients rarely (if ever) need to actually meet face-to-face. >Same here. I've got a Python module built that can automatically>handle song rotations ( i.e. you hand it names, songs, etc., and>it timestamps each submission (and new singer), counts total>performances by each singer per night, and performs weighted,>balanced rotation management to keep the "average wait time per >singer" down.How does that play in Peoria? Most of the KJs in my market use strictrotation, and most of the circuit singers don't well tolerate anyonewho doesn't. Including me. :-) I've been to many karaoke shows here in Palm Bay/Melbourne now, and I am consistently annoyed with how rotations run, because nobody runs them like I do. :)Nobody seems to run a rotation the same way either, and the net result is people end up waiting too long. The guy who runs most of the shows I attend now does something really funky -- instead of smoothly blending new and old singers together into rotations, he does it in batches. One old singer, three new ones, one old one, four new ones, etc. That has the effect of putting people off and making people wait longer than necessary. The management system I wrote was initially just strict rotation (FIFO), but that doesn't fly. The new one was designed with these principles and goals in mind:1) A singer who arrives early (or at least on time) at show start and stays until the show closes should get to sing more songs (and with as "even" a wait between songs as possible) than someone who turns up later. 2) A singer who shows up an hour before the show closes should have at least a *chance* to sing one song if at all possible.3) Apart from respecting 1 & 2, singers should sing on a first-come-first-served basis, mixing new singers with old once the first rotation is finished. The end result of all this juggling is that a person who shows up right at 9:00pm at show start will still get to sing three songs if I have forty singers in a night, while someone who shows up at midnight (show closing at 1:00am) will sneak in and get one song. Everybody else waits a uniformly average amount of time ( i.e. everybody waits about the same amount of time, give or take a few minutes, between their songs). That wait increases as people get added, but it's uniform; there's no "special treatment".It always went over very well in Colorado, mostly because the computer *displays* the whole process (you see your name appear in a different color if you're a new singer, and you see the colors staggered) between every song and people can see where they are on the rotation. When someone sees the list grow and change, they understand they're not the only singers and don't bitch about wait time. When they see that when they're new, they bump somebody, they don't get upset when a new singer bumps them later. When I ran this rotation method without showing it on screen anywhere, people constantly asked when their turn was, how long the wait was, etc. Since I started showing the whole thing in a grid, those questions all but stopped. It may actually just be showing people how it's working that makes it effective, not the method itself, but it does help keep things flowing fast. Keep in mind that because the machine helps run some of this (some of my _javascript_ stuff implements some of this), the shows I run go very *fast*. As I'm calling for applause for the singer who's just finished a song, the computer/player is al
Re: [Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 02:13:48PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: >On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 01:36:00PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: > >I've relocated to Florida (Palm Bay), and am trying to set > >up shop here as a KJ. > Well, no shit. Welcome to sunny (where, by sunny, right now I mean > 'rainy') Florida. > >Indeed. It's quite a bit nicer than Colorado's weather though. I'll bet. > >but software projects are paying the bills right now. I've got > Was that what brought you here? > >No, not really. A woman did. You'd think I'd have learned from the first >time I moved from one state to another to live with somebody -- maybe I'll >learn from this one. So I found out further down, and forgot to go back and edit this. Nice to have a portable skill, though, isn't it? > >There's a lot left to automate, as for now I run things by > >hand as far as firing off new CDG songs, videos, etc. > Yep. > And it's that "by hand" stuff I want to package up and automate. > >Same here. I've got a Python module built that can automatically >handle song rotations (i.e. you hand it names, songs, etc., and >it timestamps each submission (and new singer), counts total >performances by each singer per night, and performs weighted, >balanced rotation management to keep the "average wait time per >singer" down. How does that play in Peoria? Most of the KJs in my market use strict rotation, and most of the circuit singers don't well tolerate anyone who doesn't. Including me. :-) >Ironically I'm not using that right now at all since >I put the new display software together. I'm curious about the new >hardware you're talking about (with touch-screens not requiring a >pen, etc.); we'd previously talked about older/cheaper hardware but >I'd like to see these new targets. Cool. I'll try to find you the best page on them to look at. > > And where's your blog again? > > [2]http://willfe.com/ I > haven't written much in it lately, mostly > because the biggest > reason I moved here in the first place turned > out to be one > hell of a lie (it involved a woman, go figure) and > there just > hasn't been much motivation to actually write. > > Wow. That blew up? > Damn; sorry, guy. > >Well, the experience has taught me (the hard way) that she'd not >have been a good mate anyway. I could probably have handled just >about any of her "quirks" and the many poor choices she's made, >regarding me, herself, and others in her life, but the continuing >lying (yes, present tense) that she insists on pulling has proven >itself to just be part of her nature, and that is something I can't >deal with. Ruh roh. Yeah; good call. > She acts apologetic and offers an olive branch (classic >"let's just be friends") when she sees what this has done to me, >but to this day she maintains an "image" of the world that she'd >like me to see, and I know much of it to be false. For all her >intellect, she honestly doesn't seem to understand that she lives >in a world where other people she's mucked with aren't afraid to >talk to me about things she's done or said. Good. Glad you jumped early enough, though, perhaps, not as early as you'd have liked. Cheers, -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth[EMAIL PROTECTED] Designer Baylink RFC 2100 Ashworth & AssociatesThe Things I Think'87 e24 St Petersburg FL USA http://baylink.pitas.com +1 727 647 1274 A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet and in e-mail? Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 ___ Pykaraoke-discuss mailing list Pykaraoke-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pykaraoke-discuss
Re: [Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 01:36:00PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote:>I've relocated to Florida (Palm Bay), and am trying to set>up shop here as a KJ.Well, no shit. Welcome to sunny (where, by sunny, right now I mean 'rainy') Florida.Indeed. It's quite a bit nicer than Colorado's weather though. >but software projects are paying the bills right now. I've gotWas that what brought you here?No, not really. A woman did. You'd think I'd have learned from the first time I moved from one state to another to live with somebody -- maybe I'll learn from this one. > There's a lot left to automate, as for now I run things by>hand as far as firing off new CDG songs, videos, etc. Yep.And it's that "by hand" stuff I want to package up and automate.Same here. I've got a Python module built that can automatically handle song rotations (i.e. you hand it names, songs, etc., and it timestamps each submission (and new singer), counts total performances by each singer per night, and performs weighted, balanced rotation management to keep the "average wait time per singer" down. Ironically I'm not using that right now at all since I put the new display software together. I'm curious about the new hardware you're talking about (with touch-screens not requiring a pen, etc.); we'd previously talked about older/cheaper hardware but I'd like to see these new targets. > And where's your blog again?>>[2]http://willfe.com/ I haven't written much in it lately, mostly>because the biggest reason I moved here in the first place turned>out to be one hell of a lie (it involved a woman, go figure) and >there just hasn't been much motivation to actually write.Wow. That blew up? Damn; sorry, guy.Well, the experience has taught me (the hard way) that she'd not have been a good mate anyway. I could probably have handled just about any of her "quirks" and the many poor choices she's made, regarding me, herself, and others in her life, but the continuing lying (yes, present tense) that she insists on pulling has proven itself to just be part of her nature, and that is something I can't deal with. She acts apologetic and offers an olive branch (classic "let's just be friends") when she sees what this has done to me, but to this day she maintains an "image" of the world that she'd like me to see, and I know much of it to be false. For all her intellect, she honestly doesn't seem to understand that she lives in a world where other people she's mucked with aren't afraid to talk to me about things she's done or said. -- Looking for something to read? Visit http://willfe.com/ ... it's easy, safe, and fun for the whole family! Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642___ Pykaraoke-discuss mailing list Pykaraoke-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pykaraoke-discuss
Re: [Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
On Sun, Jun 25, 2006 at 01:36:00PM -0400, William Ferrell wrote: >On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Ok, I'll admit; that's *almost* all I've got so far. :-) > Not quite: I have a paper sketch of a screen layout. > I need to figure out Glade, which I gather is the prototyping > environment of choice for complicated user interfaces. > As I've discussed before, though, primarily with Will, who's done much > of this already, though not all in one place, my goal is to create a > one-screen, full-screen interface that handles multiple playlists > (karaoke, background, sound-effects, etc), possibly driving multiple > outputs (my Terratec Phase 26USB will generate 3 stereo pairs to feed > my mixer), and potentially interface with wireless songbook tablets (my > current target is the Fujitsu Point 510 or 1600; the touchscreens of > which are 800x600, color, and don't require a pen). > How *have* things been going with your lashup these days? > >I've relocated to Florida (Palm Bay), and am trying to set >up shop here as a KJ. Well, no shit. Welcome to sunny (where, by sunny, right now I mean 'rainy') Florida. > I'm making some progress in that area >(feels like more "sideways" than "forward" movement though), I can understand that. >but software projects are paying the bills right now. I've got Was that what brought you here? >a lot of things as far as a hosting platform working on a "by >hand" basis; I use JACK for low-latency audio production, mplayer >for video/multimedia playback, xmms for filler music playlist >management and visualizations (projectM), and Firefox to display >rotation information on the screen. PyKaraoke is used for actual >CDG playback; I don't use 100% of the screen for it, but instead >leave a bar at the top and bottom now (top shows name of singer and >song title, bottom shows a smooth line-by-line scroller that shows >the next few singers and promotional texts). The HTML in use now >auto-generates the bulk of the screen via Javascript; I just fill >in names, song titles, and group assignments, and mark who's up, >and it auto-generates the rest, including the grid, "who's next," >etc. There's a lot left to automate, as for now I run things by >hand as far as firing off new CDG songs, videos, etc. Yep. And it's that "by hand" stuff I want to package up and automate. > And where's your blog again? > >[2]http://willfe.com/ I haven't written much in it lately, mostly >because the biggest reason I moved here in the first place turned >out to be one hell of a lie (it involved a woman, go figure) and >there just hasn't been much motivation to actually write. Wow. That blew up? Damn; sorry, guy. Cheers, -- jr 'well, not really; it's just what I say' a -- Jay R. Ashworth[EMAIL PROTECTED] Designer Baylink RFC 2100 Ashworth & AssociatesThe Things I Think'87 e24 St Petersburg FL USA http://baylink.pitas.com +1 727 647 1274 A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet and in e-mail? Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 ___ Pykaraoke-discuss mailing list Pykaraoke-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pykaraoke-discuss
Re: [Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
On 6/25/06, Jay R. Ashworth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Ok, I'll admit; that's *almost* all I've got so far. :-)Not quite: I have a paper sketch of a screen layout.I need to figure out Glade, which I gather is the prototypingenvironment of choice for complicated user interfaces. As I've discussed before, though, primarily with Will, who's done muchof this already, though not all in one place, my goal is to create aone-screen, full-screen interface that handles multiple playlists (karaoke, background, sound-effects, etc), possibly driving multipleoutputs (my Terratec Phase 26USB will generate 3 stereo pairs to feedmy mixer), and potentially interface with wireless songbook tablets (mycurrent target is the Fujitsu Point 510 or 1600; the touchscreens of which are 800x600, color, and don't require a pen).How *have* things been going with your lashup these days?I've relocated to Florida (Palm Bay), and am trying to set up shop here as a KJ. I'm making some progress in that area (feels like more "sideways" than "forward" movement though), but software projects are paying the bills right now. I've got a lot of things as far as a hosting platform working on a "by hand" basis; I use JACK for low-latency audio production, mplayer for video/multimedia playback, xmms for filler music playlist management and visualizations (projectM), and Firefox to display rotation information on the screen. PyKaraoke is used for actual CDG playback; I don't use 100% of the screen for it, but instead leave a bar at the top and bottom now (top shows name of singer and song title, bottom shows a smooth line-by-line scroller that shows the next few singers and promotional texts). The HTML in use now auto-generates the bulk of the screen via _javascript_; I just fill in names, song titles, and group assignments, and mark who's up, and it auto-generates the rest, including the grid, "who's next," etc. There's a lot left to automate, as for now I run things by hand as far as firing off new CDG songs, videos, etc. And where's your blog again?http://willfe.com/I haven't written much in it lately, mostly because the biggest reason I moved here in the first place turned out to be one hell of a lie (it involved a woman, go figure) and there just hasn't been much motivation to actually write. -- Looking for something to read? Visit http://willfe.com/ ... it's easy, safe, and fun for the whole family! Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642___ Pykaraoke-discuss mailing list Pykaraoke-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pykaraoke-discuss
[Pykaraoke-discuss] The Other End: ProShow; a playback controller for commercial hosting
Ok, I'll admit; that's *almost* all I've got so far. :-) Not quite: I have a paper sketch of a screen layout. I need to figure out Glade, which I gather is the prototyping environment of choice for complicated user interfaces. As I've discussed before, though, primarily with Will, who's done much of this already, though not all in one place, my goal is to create a one-screen, full-screen interface that handles multiple playlists (karaoke, background, sound-effects, etc), possibly driving multiple outputs (my Terratec Phase 26USB will generate 3 stereo pairs to feed my mixer), and potentially interface with wireless songbook tablets (my current target is the Fujitsu Point 510 or 1600; the touchscreens of which are 800x600, color, and don't require a pen). How *have* things been going with your lashup these days? And where's your blog again? Cheers -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth[EMAIL PROTECTED] Designer Baylink RFC 2100 Ashworth & AssociatesThe Things I Think'87 e24 St Petersburg FL USA http://baylink.pitas.com +1 727 647 1274 A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet and in e-mail? Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services, security? Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your job easier Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache Geronimo http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel?cmd=lnk&kid=120709&bid=263057&dat=121642 ___ Pykaraoke-discuss mailing list Pykaraoke-discuss@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/pykaraoke-discuss
