Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs and the principle of individuation

2017-04-10 Thread John F Sowa
On 4/10/2017 11:46 AM, Jerry LR Chandler wrote: The unique role of the chemical elements in the composition of chemical sentences serve as an excellent model for the logical structures of other sentences in other symbol systems. I agree that the system of chemical elements is more tractable tha

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread Clark Goble
> On Apr 10, 2017, at 12:44 PM, Jon Alan Schmidt > wrote: > > How exactly would you pose "the Kantian question about 'Das Ding an sich'? > What makes you think that I am "trying to get a short way out of" it? I take it primarily as the problem of reference. While Peirce does have the index,

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread Jon Alan Schmidt
Kirsti, List: I am indeed exploring the hypothesis that all Signs can be classified, but not necessarily assuming that this is always easy to do. On the contrary, I recognize the difficulty in many cases, including this one in particular--which is why I sought input from the List. "Our existing

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Sign as Triad vs. Correlate of Triadic Relation (Was semantic problem with the term)

2017-04-10 Thread Clark Goble
> On Apr 8, 2017, at 10:46 AM, Jon Alan Schmidt > wrote: > > Indeed, Peirce defined "potential" as "indeterminate yet capable of > determination in any special case" (CP 6.185; 1898), but wrote that "Ideas, > or Possibles"--i.e., the constituents of the Universe of 1ns, "whatever has > its B

Aw: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs and the principle of individuation

2017-04-10 Thread Helmut Raulien
Jerry, List, did I get it right, that "individuation" is just a thought-experiment about what and how a thing (or law...) would be, if it was totally rid of any representation? just, what a "thing in itself" would be: Something incomprehensible for the scholastic doctors, as Gary wrote? Not only

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread Clark Goble
> On Apr 9, 2017, at 7:41 PM, John F Sowa wrote: > > The surface is a vague boundary. All plants and animals have > exterior cells that are dead or dying (hair, skin, scales, bark) > and they have secretions (sweat, tears, oils, sap, resins). > > The outer layers are always mixed with liquids

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Sign as Triad vs. Correlate of Triadic Relation (Was semantic problem with the term)

2017-04-10 Thread Clark Goble
> On Apr 7, 2017, at 7:40 PM, Gary Richmond wrote: > > What you just wrote ("that the "womb of indeterminacy" is "the original > continuity which is inherent in potentiality," and habit as "a generalizing > tendency" emerges from that primordial continuity") reminded me that > Aristotle's not

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs and the principle of individuation

2017-04-10 Thread Jerry LR Chandler
List: The following quote deserves rigorous study. It is deeply relevant to three critical aspects of CSP’s philosophy of science: 1. issues that relate realism to idealism 2. issues that relate the physical sciences to the chemical sciences and 3. issues that relate the sciences to the relatio

Re: Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread Edwina Taborsky
BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; } John, a very nice post - but I do have some quibbles. I don't think that you can reduce the differentiation and subsequent networking of these differences that is the basis of complexity- to vagueness. That is, compl

[PEIRCE-L] Re: Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread Jon Awbrey
Kirsti, Thanks for the notice. Of course that setup is barely a beginning. It is only the grounds out of which understanding must grow, IF our understanding is to proceed on these two conditions: MAT. We take the methods and tools that C.S. Peirce gave us seriously. COR. We take the context of

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread kirstima
What an excellent post! Just an addition to what John said on bacteria: It seems hard to (in prevalent culture) to understand the fact that we are not directly nourished by our intake of nutritients (food), but via the bacteria in our digestive system. We feed the (kinds of) bacteria, which f

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Re: Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread kirstima
Jon A. Seems valid to me. But it does not answer the quest for understanding. - If you see my point. Kirsti Jon Awbrey kirjoitti 7.4.2017 02:02: Jon, List ... I've mentioned the following possibility several times before, but maybe not too recently. A sign relation L is a subset of a carte

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread kirstima
John, I found it very interesting that you took up metaphor in connection with "laws of nature". I once got across with a study on metaphors in science with a side note by the researchers that natural scientist often got angry on any hint that they may have been using such. - It was just some

Re: [PEIRCE-L] Laws of Nature as Signs

2017-04-10 Thread kirstima
Jon, The presupposition in your question(s)you do not take up is the presupposition that all signs can and may be (easily) classified. - If you look up some detailed versions of Peirces classifications of signs, and you'll see what kinds of problems I mean. "Our existing universe" does not g

[PEIRCE-L] Jaakko Hintikka - Memorial Issue - Logica Universalis

2017-04-10 Thread jean-yves beziau
Jaakko Hintikka Memorial Special Issue of Logica Universalis Edited by Ahti-Veikko Pietarinen Call for Papers Any paper related to the work of Hintikka is welcome, in particular those dealing with the following topics: - Knowledge and Belief - Independence-friendly logic - Lingua Universalis vs Ca

RE: [PEIRCE-L] Pragmatism and Sign as holon as mind-body as tool

2017-04-10 Thread Stephen Jarosek
>”I don't really need a response to any of these questions, because they were >only posed to reveal the sloppy thinking, logical gaps and inconsistencies in >your posting. At the very least, individual statements (definitions, axioms, >predictions) should be able to stand up to scrutiny, before

RE: [PEIRCE-L] Pragmatism and Sign as holon as mind-body as tool

2017-04-10 Thread Stephen Jarosek
Thanks Ben, glad to see that you get it. While the concepts are not all that difficult, one needs to step outside of their existing assumptions and make an effort to review the totality of what is being said. That’s why I write such articles as the one referenced. By contrast, someone nitpickin