Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
You guys does not take the End-user into account at all. On 7/16/13, Skip Tavakkolian skip.tavakkol...@gmail.com wrote: when discussing good and evil, thought experiment proofs are the only thing anyone can offer. I should have prefaced what i said with: if you insist on assigning goodness or wickedness to things, then it follows that any large, all encompassing On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Kurt H Maier kh...@intma.in wrote: On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 04:07:38PM -0700, Skip Tavakkolian wrote: the nature of any large, all encompassing thing is to be good and evil all at the same time. proof: imagine a company (Google, Microsoft, Oracle, GE, etc.) that spans the universe. your perception of whether that thing is mostly good or mostly evil is a reflection of your belief about the nature of the universe. this is what passes for proof these days?
[9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
The comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup is a moderated Newsgroup. Articles require approval before being posted. It has been moderated from here, the University of Bath, since the 1990's. I, the current moderator, will be leaving the University at the end of this month and our Usenet server will be turned off in late August of this year. So a new moderator for comp.os.plan9 is required. Newsgroup articles are also sent to the 9fans mailing list. Messages sent to the 9fans mailing list are auto-injected into the comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup. This bi-directional gateway will disappear when our Usenet server is turned off. So a volunteer to take over this service is also required. Further details of the above are given below. Moderating the Newsgroup isn't labour-intensive. For example I've approved and posted some 18 articles in the last three months. The vast majority of these articles have arrived via Google Groups. The moderator will need access to a Usenet system and have the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. I.e. articles from the moderator which include an Approved: header are accepted. Volunteer moderators are requested. I suspect the reason that moderating the Newsgroup isn't arduous is that the majority of the articles in the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup are gatewayed in from the 9fans mailing list at: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/ and most serious plan9 adherents are members of this mailing list. Currently our Usenet server acts as a bi-directional gateway. The articles from the 9fans mailing list are injected into the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup and articles approved for the Newsgroup are sent on to the mailing list. Gatewaying the 9fans mailing list into the Newsgroup will obviously keep running until our Usenet server is switched off, but a replacement elsewhere is ideally required. The minimum requirement for gatewaying mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is to be subscribed to the 9fans mailing list and have access to a Usenet system with the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. Manually injecting 9fans mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is labour-intensive. It needs to be automated. There are probably several ways of doing this, but we've set this up directly on our Usenet server. Our setup is similar to the following. We use the mail domain mail2news.bath.ac.uk for mailing lists we wish to inject into Newsgroups. Mail for this domain is handled by the Usenet server, which is running exim as its MTA and INN as its Usenet software. All incoming email is checked for viruses using ClamAV. An address in the mail2news.bath.ac.uk domain is subscribed to the 9fans mailing list. Email arriving for this address is checked to see it has the correct envelope sender (9fans-boun...@9fans.net). If so, the INN program mailpost is used to inject the message into the Newsgroup. The mailpost program keeps a record of the Message-ID's it has seen. So there's no problem with looping, ie the attempted injection of the same message a repeated number of times. Newsgroup articles could be injected into the mailing list by using INN news2mail channel script. However, betraying my original Cnews roots, this is done by a shell script driven by the fragment: # Inject articles posted to the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup back into # the mailing list, 9fans@9fans.net, using a locally written script. # The script should include safeguards against looping, ie not # re-injecting articles that originally came from the mailing list. plan9mail!\ :comp.os.plan9\ :Tp:/opt/news/bin/plan9mail %s in INN's newsfeeds file. The above script uses the news2mail program from the antique but usable newsgate.tar.Z package to send email. The anti-looping checks include ensuring the Newsgroup article doesn't include a header of the form: X-BeenThere: 9fans@9fans.net which indicates this was a 9fans mailing list article injected into Newsgroup. The above may sound complex, but it's fairly maintenance free once set up. We clearly won't be able to continue with this service once our Usenet server is decommissioned. A volunteer to set up and run a similar service is required. -- Dennis Davis, BUCS, University of Bath, Bath, BA2 7AY, UK d.h.da...@bath.ac.uk Phone: +44 1225 386101
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
Will your replacement set up a facebook or google-plus relay then? I thought about this already for quite some time after I've seen the successful migration of both tech-savy and novice users to web 2.0 services. There is just no way to argue against finally making it possible to fully exploit our modern touch-interfaces that also make it so trivial to include scrolling media rich content, images, videos without the typical mimecode problems. On 7/15/13, 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk wrote: The comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup is a moderated Newsgroup. Articles require approval before being posted. It has been moderated from here, the University of Bath, since the 1990's. I, the current moderator, will be leaving the University at the end of this month and our Usenet server will be turned off in late August of this year. So a new moderator for comp.os.plan9 is required. Newsgroup articles are also sent to the 9fans mailing list. Messages sent to the 9fans mailing list are auto-injected into the comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup. This bi-directional gateway will disappear when our Usenet server is turned off. So a volunteer to take over this service is also required. Further details of the above are given below. Moderating the Newsgroup isn't labour-intensive. For example I've approved and posted some 18 articles in the last three months. The vast majority of these articles have arrived via Google Groups. The moderator will need access to a Usenet system and have the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. I.e. articles from the moderator which include an Approved: header are accepted. Volunteer moderators are requested. I suspect the reason that moderating the Newsgroup isn't arduous is that the majority of the articles in the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup are gatewayed in from the 9fans mailing list at: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/ and most serious plan9 adherents are members of this mailing list. Currently our Usenet server acts as a bi-directional gateway. The articles from the 9fans mailing list are injected into the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup and articles approved for the Newsgroup are sent on to the mailing list. Gatewaying the 9fans mailing list into the Newsgroup will obviously keep running until our Usenet server is switched off, but a replacement elsewhere is ideally required. The minimum requirement for gatewaying mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is to be subscribed to the 9fans mailing list and have access to a Usenet system with the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. Manually injecting 9fans mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is labour-intensive. It needs to be automated. There are probably several ways of doing this, but we've set this up directly on our Usenet server. Our setup is similar to the following. We use the mail domain mail2news.bath.ac.uk for mailing lists we wish to inject into Newsgroups. Mail for this domain is handled by the Usenet server, which is running exim as its MTA and INN as its Usenet software. All incoming email is checked for viruses using ClamAV. An address in the mail2news.bath.ac.uk domain is subscribed to the 9fans mailing list. Email arriving for this address is checked to see it has the correct envelope sender (9fans-boun...@9fans.net). If so, the INN program mailpost is used to inject the message into the Newsgroup. The mailpost program keeps a record of the Message-ID's it has seen. So there's no problem with looping, ie the attempted injection of the same message a repeated number of times. Newsgroup articles could be injected into the mailing list by using INN news2mail channel script. However, betraying my original Cnews roots, this is done by a shell script driven by the fragment: # Inject articles posted to the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup back into # the mailing list, 9fans@9fans.net, using a locally written script. # The script should include safeguards against looping, ie not # re-injecting articles that originally came from the mailing list. plan9mail!\ :comp.os.plan9\ :Tp:/opt/news/bin/plan9mail %s in INN's newsfeeds file. The above script uses the news2mail program from the antique but usable newsgate.tar.Z package to send email. The anti-looping checks include ensuring the Newsgroup article doesn't include a header of the form: X-BeenThere: 9fans@9fans.net which indicates this was a 9fans mailing list article injected into Newsgroup. The above may sound complex, but it's fairly maintenance free once set up. We clearly won't be able to continue with this service once our Usenet server is decommissioned. A volunteer to set up and run a similar service is required. -- Dennis Davis, BUCS, University of Bath, Bath, BA2 7AY, UK d.h.da...@bath.ac.uk Phone: +44 1225 386101
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 12:04 PM, hiro 23h...@gmail.com wrote: Will your replacement set up a facebook or google-plus relay then? I thought about this already for quite some time after I've seen the successful migration of both tech-savy and novice users to web 2.0 services. There is just no way to argue against finally making it possible to fully exploit our modern touch-interfaces that also make it so trivial to include scrolling media rich content, images, videos without the typical mimecode problems. Gmane has some handy web-based tools like RSS feeds, threaded reader and a blog-style interface. Not direct integration with social, but close enough for my needs. http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.os.plan9.general Best, -- Scott Elcomb @psema4 on Twitter / Identi.ca / Github more Atomic OS: Self Contained Microsystems http://code.google.com/p/atomos/ Member of the Pirate Party of Canada http://www.pirateparty.ca/
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 6:24 AM, 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk wrote: The comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup is a moderated Newsgroup. Articles require approval before being posted. It has been moderated from here, the University of Bath, since the 1990's. I, the current moderator, will be leaving the University at the end of this month and our Usenet server will be turned off in late August of this year. Speaking for the mailing list side, thanks for all your service, for so long and so well!
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
Isn't google the now well-known devil itself ? On 07/15/2013 11:04 PM, hiro wrote: Will your replacement set up a facebook or google-plus relay then? I thought about this already for quite some time after I've seen the successful migration of both tech-savy and novice users to web 2.0 services. There is just no way to argue against finally making it possible to fully exploit our modern touch-interfaces that also make it so trivial to include scrolling media rich content, images, videos without the typical mimecode problems. On 7/15/13, 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk wrote: The comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup is a moderated Newsgroup. Articles require approval before being posted. It has been moderated from here, the University of Bath, since the 1990's. I, the current moderator, will be leaving the University at the end of this month and our Usenet server will be turned off in late August of this year. So a new moderator for comp.os.plan9 is required. Newsgroup articles are also sent to the 9fans mailing list. Messages sent to the 9fans mailing list are auto-injected into the comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup. This bi-directional gateway will disappear when our Usenet server is turned off. So a volunteer to take over this service is also required. Further details of the above are given below. Moderating the Newsgroup isn't labour-intensive. For example I've approved and posted some 18 articles in the last three months. The vast majority of these articles have arrived via Google Groups. The moderator will need access to a Usenet system and have the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. I.e. articles from the moderator which include an Approved: header are accepted. Volunteer moderators are requested. I suspect the reason that moderating the Newsgroup isn't arduous is that the majority of the articles in the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup are gatewayed in from the 9fans mailing list at: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/ and most serious plan9 adherents are members of this mailing list. Currently our Usenet server acts as a bi-directional gateway. The articles from the 9fans mailing list are injected into the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup and articles approved for the Newsgroup are sent on to the mailing list. Gatewaying the 9fans mailing list into the Newsgroup will obviously keep running until our Usenet server is switched off, but a replacement elsewhere is ideally required. The minimum requirement for gatewaying mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is to be subscribed to the 9fans mailing list and have access to a Usenet system with the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. Manually injecting 9fans mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is labour-intensive. It needs to be automated. There are probably several ways of doing this, but we've set this up directly on our Usenet server. Our setup is similar to the following. We use the mail domain mail2news.bath.ac.uk for mailing lists we wish to inject into Newsgroups. Mail for this domain is handled by the Usenet server, which is running exim as its MTA and INN as its Usenet software. All incoming email is checked for viruses using ClamAV. An address in the mail2news.bath.ac.uk domain is subscribed to the 9fans mailing list. Email arriving for this address is checked to see it has the correct envelope sender (9fans-boun...@9fans.net). If so, the INN program mailpost is used to inject the message into the Newsgroup. The mailpost program keeps a record of the Message-ID's it has seen. So there's no problem with looping, ie the attempted injection of the same message a repeated number of times. Newsgroup articles could be injected into the mailing list by using INN news2mail channel script. However, betraying my original Cnews roots, this is done by a shell script driven by the fragment: # Inject articles posted to the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup back into # the mailing list, 9fans@9fans.net, using a locally written script. # The script should include safeguards against looping, ie not # re-injecting articles that originally came from the mailing list. plan9mail!\ :comp.os.plan9\ :Tp:/opt/news/bin/plan9mail %s in INN's newsfeeds file. The above script uses the news2mail program from the antique but usable newsgate.tar.Z package to send email. The anti-looping checks include ensuring the Newsgroup article doesn't include a header of the form: X-BeenThere: 9fans@9fans.net which indicates this was a 9fans mailing list article injected into Newsgroup. The above may sound complex, but it's fairly maintenance free once set up. We clearly won't be able to continue with this service once our Usenet server is decommissioned. A volunteer to set up and run a similar service is required. -- Dennis Davis, BUCS, University of Bath, Bath, BA2 7AY, UK d.h.da...@bath.ac.uk Phone: +44 1225 386101 -- john francis lee 246/3 Moo 22 Thanon Kaew Wai Mueang Chiangrai
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
the nature of any large, all encompassing thing is to be good and evil all at the same time. proof: imagine a company (Google, Microsoft, Oracle, GE, etc.) that spans the universe. your perception of whether that thing is mostly good or mostly evil is a reflection of your belief about the nature of the universe. On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 3:03 PM, john francis lee j...@robinlea.com wrote: Isn't google the now well-known devil itself ? On 07/15/2013 11:04 PM, hiro wrote: Will your replacement set up a facebook or google-plus relay then? I thought about this already for quite some time after I've seen the successful migration of both tech-savy and novice users to web 2.0 services. There is just no way to argue against finally making it possible to fully exploit our modern touch-interfaces that also make it so trivial to include scrolling media rich content, images, videos without the typical mimecode problems. On 7/15/13, 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk wrote: The comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup is a moderated Newsgroup. Articles require approval before being posted. It has been moderated from here, the University of Bath, since the 1990's. I, the current moderator, will be leaving the University at the end of this month and our Usenet server will be turned off in late August of this year. So a new moderator for comp.os.plan9 is required. Newsgroup articles are also sent to the 9fans mailing list. Messages sent to the 9fans mailing list are auto-injected into the comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup. This bi-directional gateway will disappear when our Usenet server is turned off. So a volunteer to take over this service is also required. Further details of the above are given below. Moderating the Newsgroup isn't labour-intensive. For example I've approved and posted some 18 articles in the last three months. The vast majority of these articles have arrived via Google Groups. The moderator will need access to a Usenet system and have the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. I.e. articles from the moderator which include an Approved: header are accepted. Volunteer moderators are requested. I suspect the reason that moderating the Newsgroup isn't arduous is that the majority of the articles in the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup are gatewayed in from the 9fans mailing list at: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/**wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/ and most serious plan9 adherents are members of this mailing list. Currently our Usenet server acts as a bi-directional gateway. The articles from the 9fans mailing list are injected into the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup and articles approved for the Newsgroup are sent on to the mailing list. Gatewaying the 9fans mailing list into the Newsgroup will obviously keep running until our Usenet server is switched off, but a replacement elsewhere is ideally required. The minimum requirement for gatewaying mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is to be subscribed to the 9fans mailing list and have access to a Usenet system with the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. Manually injecting 9fans mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is labour-intensive. It needs to be automated. There are probably several ways of doing this, but we've set this up directly on our Usenet server. Our setup is similar to the following. We use the mail domain mail2news.bath.ac.uk for mailing lists we wish to inject into Newsgroups. Mail for this domain is handled by the Usenet server, which is running exim as its MTA and INN as its Usenet software. All incoming email is checked for viruses using ClamAV. An address in the mail2news.bath.ac.uk domain is subscribed to the 9fans mailing list. Email arriving for this address is checked to see it has the correct envelope sender (9fans-boun...@9fans.net). If so, the INN program mailpost is used to inject the message into the Newsgroup. The mailpost program keeps a record of the Message-ID's it has seen. So there's no problem with looping, ie the attempted injection of the same message a repeated number of times. Newsgroup articles could be injected into the mailing list by using INN news2mail channel script. However, betraying my original Cnews roots, this is done by a shell script driven by the fragment: # Inject articles posted to the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup back into # the mailing list, 9fans@9fans.net, using a locally written script. # The script should include safeguards against looping, ie not # re-injecting articles that originally came from the mailing list. plan9mail!\ :comp.os.plan9\ :Tp:/opt/news/bin/plan9mail %s in INN's newsfeeds file. The above script uses the news2mail program from the antique but usable newsgate.tar.Z package to send email. The anti-looping checks include ensuring the Newsgroup article doesn't include a header of the form:
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
Oracle was a terrible example. That company is about one man, his ego, and what he wants to inflict upon humanity. On Jul 15, 2013, at 19:07, Skip Tavakkolian skip.tavakkol...@gmail.com wrote: the nature of any large, all encompassing thing is to be good and evil all at the same time. proof: imagine a company (Google, Microsoft, Oracle, GE, etc.) that spans the universe. your perception of whether that thing is mostly good or mostly evil is a reflection of your belief about the nature of the universe. On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 3:03 PM, john francis lee j...@robinlea.com wrote: Isn't google the now well-known devil itself ? On 07/15/2013 11:04 PM, hiro wrote: Will your replacement set up a facebook or google-plus relay then? I thought about this already for quite some time after I've seen the successful migration of both tech-savy and novice users to web 2.0 services. There is just no way to argue against finally making it possible to fully exploit our modern touch-interfaces that also make it so trivial to include scrolling media rich content, images, videos without the typical mimecode problems. On 7/15/13, 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk 9f...@mail2news.bath.ac.uk wrote: The comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup is a moderated Newsgroup. Articles require approval before being posted. It has been moderated from here, the University of Bath, since the 1990's. I, the current moderator, will be leaving the University at the end of this month and our Usenet server will be turned off in late August of this year. So a new moderator for comp.os.plan9 is required. Newsgroup articles are also sent to the 9fans mailing list. Messages sent to the 9fans mailing list are auto-injected into the comp.os.plan9 Usenet Newsgroup. This bi-directional gateway will disappear when our Usenet server is turned off. So a volunteer to take over this service is also required. Further details of the above are given below. Moderating the Newsgroup isn't labour-intensive. For example I've approved and posted some 18 articles in the last three months. The vast majority of these articles have arrived via Google Groups. The moderator will need access to a Usenet system and have the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. I.e. articles from the moderator which include an Approved: header are accepted. Volunteer moderators are requested. I suspect the reason that moderating the Newsgroup isn't arduous is that the majority of the articles in the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup are gatewayed in from the 9fans mailing list at: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/mailing_lists/ and most serious plan9 adherents are members of this mailing list. Currently our Usenet server acts as a bi-directional gateway. The articles from the 9fans mailing list are injected into the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup and articles approved for the Newsgroup are sent on to the mailing list. Gatewaying the 9fans mailing list into the Newsgroup will obviously keep running until our Usenet server is switched off, but a replacement elsewhere is ideally required. The minimum requirement for gatewaying mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is to be subscribed to the 9fans mailing list and have access to a Usenet system with the right to post articles to a moderated Newsgroup. Manually injecting 9fans mailing list articles into the Newsgroup is labour-intensive. It needs to be automated. There are probably several ways of doing this, but we've set this up directly on our Usenet server. Our setup is similar to the following. We use the mail domain mail2news.bath.ac.uk for mailing lists we wish to inject into Newsgroups. Mail for this domain is handled by the Usenet server, which is running exim as its MTA and INN as its Usenet software. All incoming email is checked for viruses using ClamAV. An address in the mail2news.bath.ac.uk domain is subscribed to the 9fans mailing list. Email arriving for this address is checked to see it has the correct envelope sender (9fans-boun...@9fans.net). If so, the INN program mailpost is used to inject the message into the Newsgroup. The mailpost program keeps a record of the Message-ID's it has seen. So there's no problem with looping, ie the attempted injection of the same message a repeated number of times. Newsgroup articles could be injected into the mailing list by using INN news2mail channel script. However, betraying my original Cnews roots, this is done by a shell script driven by the fragment: # Inject articles posted to the comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup back into # the mailing list, 9fans@9fans.net, using a locally written script. # The script should include safeguards against looping, ie not # re-injecting articles that originally came from the mailing list. plan9mail!\ :comp.os.plan9\ :Tp:/opt/news/bin/plan9mail %s in INN's newsfeeds file. The above script uses the news2mail program from the
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 04:07:38PM -0700, Skip Tavakkolian wrote: the nature of any large, all encompassing thing is to be good and evil all at the same time. proof: imagine a company (Google, Microsoft, Oracle, GE, etc.) that spans the universe. your perception of whether that thing is mostly good or mostly evil is a reflection of your belief about the nature of the universe. this is what passes for proof these days?
Re: [9fans] Moderator's Note: comp.os.plan9 Newsgroup.
when discussing good and evil, thought experiment proofs are the only thing anyone can offer. I should have prefaced what i said with: if you insist on assigning goodness or wickedness to things, then it follows that any large, all encompassing On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 8:12 PM, Kurt H Maier kh...@intma.in wrote: On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 04:07:38PM -0700, Skip Tavakkolian wrote: the nature of any large, all encompassing thing is to be good and evil all at the same time. proof: imagine a company (Google, Microsoft, Oracle, GE, etc.) that spans the universe. your perception of whether that thing is mostly good or mostly evil is a reflection of your belief about the nature of the universe. this is what passes for proof these days?
