date:20200219

Ferric Chloride kills the coronavirus.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:57 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

My bare pcb provider got the go ahead to restart production Monday.

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 19, 2020, at 7:54 PM, TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> 
> wrote:

Shit, the other thing is when will China be a viable supplier again? Anyone 
seeing shipments from China? We use 3 chinese suppliers and they are MIA, 
wondering when things will become normal again?

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:57 PM Peter Kranz mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> > wrote:

Correct.. 
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Lifepo4-Batterie-Lithium-48V-Lifepo4-Lipo_62343352866.html?spm=a2700.details.deiletai6.9.61a95ffebuB5z3

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

From: TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> > 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 5:36 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Cc: Peter Kranz mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

Peter, so just over 1k$ for 100ah@48vdc?

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:08 PM Peter Kranz via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

Second calc is wrong:

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $1100 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.22/Wh

So its actually half the price of my Deka solution per Wh.

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Peter Kranz via AF
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 2:28 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Cc: Peter Kranz mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I am 
comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go below 50% 
DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that I’m not 
cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the huge cycle life 
penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is still valid.

But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in the 
bottom of my racks:

4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)

@50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or $.48/Wh

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh

So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom 
rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be breaking 
even with LiFEPO4 based systems.

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of ch...@wbmfg.com  
Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

I repost the list.

You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But yeah, 20 
cents is more like it.  

If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.  

From: TJ Trout 

Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+ kh/w 
unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I just posted 
two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$ per kw/h ??

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert mailto:i...@avantwireless.com> > wrote:

I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by 1/2 
or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and such)...   
with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x difference in 
requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep cycle.  They really 
need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...

On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is 
$/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even 
matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from 
lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell phone or 
an electric car, but it's pretty much

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread Chuck McCown

My bare pcb provider got the go ahead to restart production Monday.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 19, 2020, at 7:54 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
> 
> 
> Shit, the other thing is when will China be a viable supplier again? Anyone 
> seeing shipments from China? We use 3 chinese suppliers and they are MIA, 
> wondering when things will become normal again?
> 
>> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:57 PM Peter Kranz  wrote:
>> Correct.. 
>> https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Lifepo4-Batterie-Lithium-48V-Lifepo4-Lipo_62343352866.html?spm=a2700.details.deiletai6.9.61a95ffebuB5z3
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Peter Kranz
>> www.UnwiredLtd.com
>> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
>> Mobile: 510-207-
>> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: TJ Trout  
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 5:36 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Cc: Peter Kranz 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Peter, so just over 1k$ for 100ah@48vdc?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:08 PM Peter Kranz via AF  wrote:
>> 
>> Second calc is wrong:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $1100 (138 lbs)
>> 
>> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.22/Wh
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> So its actually half the price of my Deka solution per Wh.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Peter Kranz
>> www.UnwiredLtd.com
>> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
>> Mobile: 510-207-
>> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 2:28 PM
>> To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
>> Cc: Peter Kranz 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I am 
>> comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go below 
>> 50% DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that I’m 
>> not cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the huge 
>> cycle life penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is still 
>> valid.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in the 
>> bottom of my racks:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)
>> 
>> @50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or $.48/Wh
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs)
>> 
>> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom 
>> rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be breaking 
>> even with LiFEPO4 based systems.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Peter Kranz
>> www.UnwiredLtd.com
>> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
>> Mobile: 510-207-
>> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
>> Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I repost the list.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But yeah, 
>> 20 cents is more like it. 
>> 
>> If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range. 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> From: TJ Trout
>> 
>> Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM
>> 
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+ 
>> kh/w unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I 
>> just posted two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$ 
>> per kw/h ??
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert  wrote:
>> 
>> I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by 
>> 1/2 or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and 
>> such)...   with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x 
>> difference in requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep 
>> cycle.  They really need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...
>> 
>> On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
>> 
>> As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is 
>> $/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even 
>> matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from 
>> lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell phone 
>> or an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're talking 
>> about doing.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>> 
>> I only care about $/kWH
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread TJ Trout

Shit, the other thing is when will China be a viable supplier again? Anyone
seeing shipments from China? We use 3 chinese suppliers and they are MIA,
wondering when things will become normal again?

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:57 PM Peter Kranz  wrote:

> Correct..
> https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Lifepo4-Batterie-Lithium-48V-Lifepo4-Lipo_62343352866.html?spm=a2700.details.deiletai6.9.61a95ffebuB5z3
>
>
>
>
> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* TJ Trout 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 5:36 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Cc:* Peter Kranz 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> Peter, so just over 1k$ for 100ah@48vdc?
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:08 PM Peter Kranz via AF 
> wrote:
>
> Second calc is wrong:
>
>
>
> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>
>
>
> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $1100 (138 lbs)
>
> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.22/Wh
>
>
>
> So its actually half the price of my Deka solution per Wh.
>
>
>
>
> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 2:28 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Peter Kranz 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I
> am comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go
> below 50% DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that
> I’m not cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the
> huge cycle life penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is
> still valid.
>
>
>
> But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in
> the bottom of my racks:
>
>
>
> 4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)
>
> @50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or
> $.48/Wh
>
>
>
> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>
>
>
> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs)
>
> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh
>
>
>
> So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom
> rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be
> breaking even with LiFEPO4 based systems.
>
>
>
>
> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> I repost the list.
>
>
>
> You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But
> yeah, 20 cents is more like it.
>
> If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.
>
>
>
> *From:* TJ Trout
>
> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+
> kh/w unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I
> just posted two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$
> per kw/h ??
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert  wrote:
>
> I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by
> 1/2 or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and
> such)...   with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x
> difference in requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep
> cycle.  They really need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...
>
> On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
>
> As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is
> $/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even
> matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from
> lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell
> phone or an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're
> talking about doing.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
> I only care about $/kWH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the Leaf
> packs are really awesome, the modules are basically made to be modularly
> packed, you can use all-thread. Several off the shelf PCB's available to
> make them into 8s, 16s packs with all of the cell voltages already pinned
> out, basically a diy kit is available to make them into packs and they are
> sub $100/kwh
>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread Peter Kranz via AF

Correct.. 
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Lifepo4-Batterie-Lithium-48V-Lifepo4-Lipo_62343352866.html?spm=a2700.details.deiletai6.9.61a95ffebuB5z3

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: TJ Trout  
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 5:36 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Cc: Peter Kranz 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

Peter, so just over 1k$ for 100ah@48vdc?

 

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:08 PM Peter Kranz via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

Second calc is wrong:

 

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

 

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $1100 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.22/Wh

 

So its actually half the price of my Deka solution per Wh.

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Peter Kranz via AF
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 2:28 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Cc: Peter Kranz mailto:pkr...@unwiredltd.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I am 
comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go below 50% 
DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that I’m not 
cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the huge cycle life 
penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is still valid.

 

But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in the 
bottom of my racks:

 

4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)

@50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or $.48/Wh

 

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

 

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh

 

So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom 
rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be breaking 
even with LiFEPO4 based systems.

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of ch...@wbmfg.com  
Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

I repost the list.

 

You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But yeah, 20 
cents is more like it.  

If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.  

 

From: TJ Trout 

Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+ kh/w 
unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I just posted 
two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$ per kw/h ??

 

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert mailto:i...@avantwireless.com> > wrote:

I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by 1/2 
or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and such)...   
with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x difference in 
requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep cycle.  They really 
need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...

On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is 
$/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even 
matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from 
lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell phone or 
an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're talking about 
doing.

 

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

I only care about $/kWH

Sent from my iPhone

 

On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> 
> wrote:

 

Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the Leaf packs 
are really awesome, the modules are basically made to be modularly packed, you 
can use all-thread. Several off the shelf PCB's available to make them into 8s, 
16s packs with all of the cell voltages already pinned out, basically a diy kit 
is available to make them into packs and they are sub $100/kwh

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:05 PM TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> > wrote:

all of the batteries batteryhookup.com

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread TJ Trout

Peter, so just over 1k$ for 100ah@48vdc?

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 5:08 PM Peter Kranz via AF  wrote:

> Second calc is wrong:
>
>
>
> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>
>
>
> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $1100 (138 lbs)
>
> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.22/Wh
>
>
>
> So its actually half the price of my Deka solution per Wh.
>
>
>
>
> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Peter Kranz via AF
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 2:28 PM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
> *Cc:* Peter Kranz 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I
> am comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go
> below 50% DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that
> I’m not cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the
> huge cycle life penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is
> still valid.
>
>
>
> But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in
> the bottom of my racks:
>
>
>
> 4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)
>
> @50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or
> $.48/Wh
>
>
>
> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>
>
>
> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs)
>
> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh
>
>
>
> So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom
> rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be
> breaking even with LiFEPO4 based systems.
>
>
>
>
> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> I repost the list.
>
>
>
> You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But
> yeah, 20 cents is more like it.
>
> If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.
>
>
>
> *From:* TJ Trout
>
> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+
> kh/w unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I
> just posted two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$
> per kw/h ??
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert  wrote:
>
> I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by
> 1/2 or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and
> such)...   with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x
> difference in requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep
> cycle.  They really need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...
>
> On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
>
> As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is
> $/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even
> matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from
> lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell
> phone or an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're
> talking about doing.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
> I only care about $/kWH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the Leaf
> packs are really awesome, the modules are basically made to be modularly
> packed, you can use all-thread. Several off the shelf PCB's available to
> make them into 8s, 16s packs with all of the cell voltages already pinned
> out, basically a diy kit is available to make them into packs and they are
> sub $100/kwh
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:05 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> all of the batteries batteryhookup.com and bigbattery.com are _used_ or
> new old stock, nothing new.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:02 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> you get what you pay for, all of these guys guarantee the models to
> discharge to the specs they provide or money back
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 11:17 AM Robert  wrote:
>
> You should be aware, that bigbattery.com is selling _used_ batteries.
> For example the 24v "powerwall"  3KWh unit for $699 is a used unit per Will
> Prowse.   His testing showed 67% degradation from new.  What the cycle life
> of a 67% depleted battery array is unknown..
>
> On 2/13/20 10:54 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Hoboy does she have some nice batteries...
>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread Peter Kranz via AF

Second calc is wrong:

 

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

 

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $1100 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.22/Wh

 

So its actually half the price of my Deka solution per Wh.

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Peter Kranz via AF
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 2:28 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Cc: Peter Kranz 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I am 
comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go below 50% 
DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that I’m not 
cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the huge cycle life 
penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is still valid.

 

But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in the 
bottom of my racks:

 

4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)

@50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or $.48/Wh

 

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

 

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh

 

So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom 
rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be breaking 
even with LiFEPO4 based systems.

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of ch...@wbmfg.com  
Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

I repost the list.

 

You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But yeah, 20 
cents is more like it.  

If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.  

 

From: TJ Trout 

Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+ kh/w 
unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I just posted 
two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$ per kw/h ??

 

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert mailto:i...@avantwireless.com> > wrote:

I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by 1/2 
or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and such)...   
with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x difference in 
requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep cycle.  They really 
need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...

On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is 
$/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even 
matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from 
lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell phone or 
an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're talking about 
doing.

 

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

I only care about $/kWH

Sent from my iPhone

 

On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> 
> wrote:

 

Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the Leaf packs 
are really awesome, the modules are basically made to be modularly packed, you 
can use all-thread. Several off the shelf PCB's available to make them into 8s, 
16s packs with all of the cell voltages already pinned out, basically a diy kit 
is available to make them into packs and they are sub $100/kwh

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:05 PM TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> > wrote:

all of the batteries batteryhookup.com   and 
bigbattery.com   are _used_ or new old stock, nothing 
new.

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:02 PM TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> > wrote:

you get what you pay for, all of these guys guarantee the models to discharge 
to the specs they provide or money back

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 11:17 AM Robert mailto:i...@avantwireless.com> > wrote:

You should be aware, that bigbattery.com   is selling 
_used_ batteries.  For example the 24v "powerwall"  3KWh unit for $699 is a 
used unit per Will Prowse.   His testing showed 67% degradation from new.  What 
the cycle life of a 67% depleted battery array is unknown..

On 2/13/20 10:54 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread Peter Kranz via AF

In the old days I would have certainly home brewed stuff like this, and there 
is nothing wrong with it if you do it cleanly.

 

But now that I am in volume deployment mode, I want devices that are ethernet 
connected and snmp capable, all buttoned up in a nice form factor with fusing, 
etc. all in place.

 

I also did my calc incorrectly below.. its $.22/Wh for the Meritsun unit.. 
$1100/4800, not too far off your solution.

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: TJ Trout  
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 3:21 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Cc: Peter Kranz 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

you should be able to diy a solution for .12c/Wh, that's what I'm doing, would 
be cool to see if anyone else is doing anything similar? Just need some 
lifepo4/li-ion modules, a 60v bms and a rack shelf..

 

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 2:28 PM Peter Kranz via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I am 
comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go below 50% 
DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that I’m not 
cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the huge cycle life 
penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is still valid.

 

But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in the 
bottom of my racks:

 

4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)

@50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or $.48/Wh

 

The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:

 

1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs) 

@100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh

 

So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom 
rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be breaking 
even with LiFEPO4 based systems.

 

Peter Kranz
  www.UnwiredLtd.com
Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
Mobile: 510-207-
  pkr...@unwiredltd.com

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of ch...@wbmfg.com  
Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

I repost the list.

 

You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But yeah, 20 
cents is more like it.  

If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.  

 

From: TJ Trout 

Sent: Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

 

I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+ kh/w 
unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I just posted 
two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$ per kw/h ??

 

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert mailto:i...@avantwireless.com> > wrote:

I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by 1/2 
or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and such)...   
with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x difference in 
requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep cycle.  They really 
need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...

On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is 
$/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even 
matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from 
lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell phone or 
an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're talking about 
doing.

 

On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

I only care about $/kWH

Sent from my iPhone

 

On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> 
> wrote:

 

Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the Leaf packs 
are really awesome, the modules are basically made to be modularly packed, you 
can use all-thread. Several off the shelf PCB's available to make them into 8s, 
16s packs with all of the cell voltages already pinned out, basically a diy kit 
is available to make them into packs and they are sub $100/kwh

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:05 PM TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> > wrote:

all of the batteries batteryhookup.com   and 
bigbattery.com   are _used_ or new old stock, nothing 
new.

 

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:02 PM TJ Trout mailto:t...@voltbb.com> > wrote:

you get what you pay for, all of these guys guarantee the models to discharge 
to the specs

Re: [AFMUG] Rack Injector power question

2020-02-19 Thread Tyson Burris

We blew two radio ports today on the old style gear.  Hopefully the documents 
clarify things better moving forward.
Love the product but honestly the lack of current and accurate documents is the 
main shortcoming that cost us a tower climb.



Tyson Burris, President
Internet Communications Inc.
739 Commerce Dr.
Franklin, IN 46131

Office # 317-738-0320
Cell/Direct # 317-412-1540
Online: www.surfici.net

[ICI]
What can ICI do for you?

Broadband Wireless - PtP/PtMP Solutions - Mesh Wifi/Hotzones - IP Cameras - 
Fiber - Towers - Infrastructure.

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail is intended for the
addressee shown. It contains information that is
confidential and protected from disclosure. Any review,
dissemination or use of this transmission or its contents by
unauthorized organizations or individuals is strictly
prohibited.

From: AF  On Behalf Of Forrest Christian (List Account)
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 4:59 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Rack Injector power question

The manual is out of date.The current revision (B0) boards don't care.   
I've got a lot of documentation work to catch up on starting right after the 
Base3 starts shipping.   The documentation changes are pretty much all things 
like this which just make things easier for people instead of things which they 
*have* to do differently.

The only thing which needs positive power is the old-style canopy sync board, 
since canopy sync pretty much requires positive power to operate.

The return connection on each input is tied together and should be the grounded 
conductor, if you are grounding a site at all.   If you're doing the DC to DC 
output thing, your -48VDC input should be hooked to the rackinjector such that 
the -48VDC is on the Vin pin and the return (or + in this case) is on the 
return.   On the DC - DC converters, you tie the - output of each converter to 
this same point (the +/return on the -48VDC), and then you end up with +24VDC 
or +48VDC.So the +output goes to Vin and the - output goes to return, and 
the 'ground' side of everything else.





On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:04 AM Adam Moffett 
mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>> wrote:
 From the manual:

"Important: At least one of the power sources must be of positive
polarity – the current revision of the RackInjector control board needs
at least one positive voltage in order to operate. If multiple positive
power sources are available, it will pull power from the input with the
highest voltage."

Should I take that to mean a negative terminal needs to connect to
ground for some reason?

I intend to connect a rectifier (-48V) and Meanwell RSD converters to
other voltages.  The RSD's don't have a ground reference on the output
side if I recall correctly.  I can add a connection from neg to ground
on the 24V converter, but is that really what they mean by positive
polarity?



--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


--
- Forrest
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?

2020-02-19 Thread TJ Trout

you should be able to diy a solution for .12c/Wh, that's what I'm doing,
would be cool to see if anyone else is doing anything similar? Just need
some lifepo4/li-ion modules, a 60v bms and a rack shelf..

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 2:28 PM Peter Kranz via AF  wrote:

> Chuck, something you may want to consider in your calculations is that I
> am comfortable taking LiFePO4 batteries to 100% DOD, whereas I never go
> below 50% DOD for my AGM backup systems. I guess one could make a case that
> I’m not cycling my AGM systems very much, so I shouldn’t care about the
> huge cycle life penalties of 100% DOD in which case your spreadsheet is
> still valid.
>
>
>
> But assuming we go with the 50% DOD argument, I can fit 4x170Ah AGMs in
> the bottom of my racks:
>
>
>
> 4x Deka 170Ah 12AVR1700-ET @ $495 = $1980 (120 lbs x 4 = 480 lbs)
>
> @50% DOD = 4080Wh of storage in a package 22” deep and 12.6” high or
> $.48/Wh
>
>
>
> The equivalent LiFePO4 new unit:
>
>
>
> 1x MeritSun LFP100-48 Units = $2200 (138 lbs)
>
> @100% DOD = 4800Wh of storage in a package 16”deep and 8.7” high or $.45/Wh
>
>
>
> So, my conclusion so far is if you are buying relatively expensive telecom
> rated AGM batteries and only going to 50% DOD with them, you may be
> breaking even with LiFEPO4 based systems.
>
>
>
>
> *Peter Kranz*www.UnwiredLtd.com 
> Desk: 510-868-1614 x100
> Mobile: 510-207-
> pkr...@unwiredltd.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2020 10:33 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> I repost the list.
>
>
>
> You can get a front post telecom batt for 16 cents per watt hour.  But
> yeah, 20 cents is more like it.
>
> If solar flooded cells are OK, those can be had in the 7 cent range.
>
>
>
> *From:* TJ Trout
>
> *Sent:* Friday, February 14, 2020 11:20 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> I don't know what you guys are smoking :) but SLA/VRLA batteries are $200+
> kh/w unless we are talking walmart boat batteries which are ~$100kw/h, I
> just posted two sites with li-ion batteries with many options for 70-100$
> per kw/h ??
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 8:46 AM Robert  wrote:
>
> I think you nailed it.   And until commercial Li batteries reduce price by
> 1/2 or more they aren't competitive except in special use cases. (RV and
> such)...   with 1/2 price drop and 2x the performance it's effectively a 4x
> difference in requirements and then they equal the utility of wet deep
> cycle.  They really need to be less than 1/2 the price to be a no-brainer...
>
> On 2/14/20 8:03 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
>
> As I see it, for backup or solar applications, all that really matters is
> $/kWH, lifespan, and temperature tolerance (and that generally doesn't even
> matter if they're not outside). Are there any realistic advantages from
> lithiums other than size/weight? That's obviously important for a cell
> phone or an electric car, but it's pretty much irrelevant for what we're
> talking about doing.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 14, 2020 at 9:18 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
> I only care about $/kWH
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Feb 13, 2020, at 5:05 PM, TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Chuck, if you are after high kw/h and don't mind low density, the Leaf
> packs are really awesome, the modules are basically made to be modularly
> packed, you can use all-thread. Several off the shelf PCB's available to
> make them into 8s, 16s packs with all of the cell voltages already pinned
> out, basically a diy kit is available to make them into packs and they are
> sub $100/kwh
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:05 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> all of the batteries batteryhookup.com and bigbattery.com are _used_ or
> new old stock, nothing new.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 1:02 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> you get what you pay for, all of these guys guarantee the models to
> discharge to the specs they provide or money back
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 13, 2020 at 11:17 AM Robert  wrote:
>
> You should be aware, that bigbattery.com is selling _used_ batteries.
> For example the 24v "powerwall"  3KWh unit for $699 is a used unit per Will
> Prowse.   His testing showed 67% degradation from new.  What the cycle life
> of a 67% depleted battery array is unknown..
>
> On 2/13/20 10:54 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Hoboy does she have some nice batteries...
>
>
>
> *From:* Brian Webster
>
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 13, 2020 11:49 AM
>
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V 200Ah battery packs?
>
>
>
> Same here……
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Brian Webster
>
> www.wirelessmapping.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] *On
> Behalf Of *Mathew Howard
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 13, 2020 12:41 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Alibaba LiFePO4 48V

[AFMUG] Frontier Quotes

2020-02-19 Thread Nate Burke

I was helping one of my customers who has an office in another state.  
They just got Frontier DSL Installed, they should have a /30 available 
to them.  It looks like it wasn't provisioned correctly, as traceroute 
shows it's looping in the Frontier Network.   They got the frontier Tech 
back on site and had his laptop plugged in, we were on the phone with him.


Frontier: 'I connected to the WIFI and it's working fine, that's usually 
how I know it's working'
Us: 'Try setting your laptop to the static IP Address we are supposed to 
have'

'Ok'
'Can your laptop get out to the internet'?
'No'
'I think that it's not provisioned correctly for the /30'
'I'm not even sure who to call for that.  The Group that used to do 
Static IP Addressing is gone, the Internet help desk is gone, There's no 
One left.  I'll have to call my supervisor and see if we can find 
someone to call'


--
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Rack Injector power question

2020-02-19 Thread Forrest Christian (List Account)

The manual is out of date.The current revision (B0) boards don't care.
 I've got a lot of documentation work to catch up on starting right after
the Base3 starts shipping.   The documentation changes are pretty much all
things like this which just make things easier for people instead of things
which they *have* to do differently.

The only thing which needs positive power is the old-style canopy sync
board, since canopy sync pretty much requires positive power to operate.

The return connection on each input is tied together and should be the
grounded conductor, if you are grounding a site at all.   If you're doing
the DC to DC output thing, your -48VDC input should be hooked to the
rackinjector such that the -48VDC is on the Vin pin and the return (or + in
this case) is on the return.   On the DC - DC converters, you tie the -
output of each converter to this same point (the +/return on the -48VDC),
and then you end up with +24VDC or +48VDC.So the +output goes to Vin
and the - output goes to return, and the 'ground' side of everything else.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:04 AM Adam Moffett  wrote:

>  From the manual:
>
> "Important: At least one of the power sources must be of positive
> polarity – the current revision of the RackInjector control board needs
> at least one positive voltage in order to operate. If multiple positive
> power sources are available, it will pull power from the input with the
> highest voltage."
>
> Should I take that to mean a negative terminal needs to connect to
> ground for some reason?
>
> I intend to connect a rectifier (-48V) and Meanwell RSD converters to
> other voltages.  The RSD's don't have a ground reference on the output
> side if I recall correctly.  I can add a connection from neg to ground
> on the 24V converter, but is that really what they mean by positive
> polarity?
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>

-- 
- Forrest
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread SmarterBroadband

We have one.   

Very happy we purchased it.   

Going to be great with CBRS eNodeB alignments and registration.   

We use on dish alignments and it works really well.

 

Adam

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 8:50 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

 

I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking at this 
for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not looking to 
use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points.

We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably 
rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not installing 
sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust tilt, etc.

 

This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new access 
points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but then the tool 
will sit

 

Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If it 
were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k on the 
kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the convenience 
outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a licensed link.

 Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value. saving 
maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets some cost.

You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your experience?

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Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com

2020-02-19 Thread Cameron Crum

I find it is usually cheaper, but even at the same price, the convenience
is worth it.


On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 3:06 PM  wrote:

> How does the price compare with normal rentals?
>
> *From:* Layne Sisk
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 12:50 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com
>
>
> I use it all the time, and in fact I rent a car that I own out on it.  It
> works great!
>
>
>
> Layne Sisk
>
> ServerPlus
>
> 801.426.8283, ext 102
>
> [image: New logo xl] 
>
> 
>
> 
>
> [image: Utah 100]   [image: fast50-01][image: Inc 5000]
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Cameron Crum
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 11, 2020 9:23 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com
>
>
>
> I've used Turo with great success a number of times. To me it is much more
> convenient, as where I have used them they show up at the airport curbside,
> you take some pics, get the keys and off you go. I always buy the
> supplemental insurance just to be safe but it is pretty cheap. I've had
> great cars, a Porche Cayenne, BMW X5, and a Ram 1500, all with no problems
> whatsoever, and at cheaper prices than a mid-sized rental car. Beats
> standing in line at the rental counter or having to ride some bus to a
> rental car lot and then standing in line. Same goes for drop off. MEet them
> at the airport drop off lane, take a few more pics and you are on your way.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:11 AM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> Bad
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 8:07 AM Mark - Myakka Technologies 
> wrote:
>
> I  know  some  of  you  guys do a bunch of traveling.  Has anyone used
> turo.com?   Good/Bad?   I have a trip coming up late spring and so far
> the car rental places are out of control price wise.  Was looking into
> alternatives.
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
> Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com
>
> Myakka Technologies, Inc.
> www.Myakka.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

Is the BTTB tunneling also turned on?

(blast through the building)

From: Gino A. Villarini 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 1:00 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Yeah, we are using eoip tunneling.  Network is IPV6 

From: AF  on behalf of Dan Spitler 
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Date: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 at 2:14 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

The radios are Facebook's https://fccid.io/2AK7S-FBC1601 

No idea where the building-blasting marketing came from; that's definitely not 
the case.

Gino: How are you offering IPv4? We (and Magyar Telekom) had to tunnel over v6 
which... bleh.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 9:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

  Certainly all their videos with the bright microwave links going from radio 
to radio, went down streets, and across streets, but never "through" buildings. 
To buildings I can accept, but not so much through.

bp On 2/19/2020 9:19 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

I think it's probably just a case of the person writing the article not 
knowing what they're talking about. I'm pretty sure the idea is to "blast 
internet" around the buildings, not through them.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:10 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

  Tech arrives at front desk.  “Hi, I’m from Facebook and I’m here to blast 
through your building.”

  Maybe they mean throughout buildings.  The hype seems to involve massive 
antenna arrays, sounds like the old assumption that with multipath you can 
bounce off the furniture and find a path.  But outside building to inside seems 
a challenge unless like Mike says it’s an open air building like a stadium?

  This is going to an interesting and challenging future.  People now 
expect their Internet to be gigabit speed, never have even 1 second of 
downtime, and work everywhere they go.  These things are at odds with each 
other.

  From: AF  On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:48 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto 
Rico | Engadget

  Maybe they're open-air buildings?  ;-)

  -
  Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions

  Midwest Internet Exchange

  The Brothers WISP

--

  From: ch...@wbmfg.com
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM
  Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico 
| Engadget

  “the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through 
buildings “

  I just want to hear it from Gino.

  From: ch...@wbmfg.com 

  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM

  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico 
| Engadget

  Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...

  From: Ken Hohhof 

  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM

  To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico 
| Engadget

  Is that a rhetorical question?

  From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico 
| Engadget

  So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?

  Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  
wrote:

 

Gino Villarini 
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
m: 

www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968

From: AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza 

Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 

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Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com

How does the price compare with normal rentals?

From: Layne Sisk 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 12:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com

I use it all the time, and in fact I rent a car that I own out on it.  It works 
great!  

Layne Sisk

ServerPlus

801.426.8283, ext 102

From: AF  On Behalf Of Cameron Crum
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2020 9:23 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com

I've used Turo with great success a number of times. To me it is much more 
convenient, as where I have used them they show up at the airport curbside, you 
take some pics, get the keys and off you go. I always buy the supplemental 
insurance just to be safe but it is pretty cheap. I've had great cars, a Porche 
Cayenne, BMW X5, and a Ram 1500, all with no problems whatsoever, and at 
cheaper prices than a mid-sized rental car. Beats standing in line at the 
rental counter or having to ride some bus to a rental car lot and then standing 
in line. Same goes for drop off. MEet them at the airport drop off lane, take a 
few more pics and you are on your way. 

On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:11 AM TJ Trout  wrote:

  Bad

  On Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 8:07 AM Mark - Myakka Technologies  
wrote:

I  know  some  of  you  guys do a bunch of traveling.  Has anyone used
turo.com?   Good/Bad?   I have a trip coming up late spring and so far
the car rental places are out of control price wise.  Was looking into
alternatives.

--

Thanks,
Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.Myakka.com

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Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

Yeah, we are using eoip tunneling.  Network is IPV6

From: AF  on behalf of Dan Spitler 
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Date: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 at 2:14 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

The radios are Facebook's 
https://fccid.io/2AK7S-FBC1601
No idea where the building-blasting marketing came from; that's definitely not 
the case.
Gino: How are you offering IPv4? We (and Magyar Telekom) had to tunnel over v6 
which... bleh.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 9:23 AM Bill Prince 
mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Certainly all their videos with the bright microwave links going from radio to 
radio, went down streets, and across streets, but never "through" buildings. To 
buildings I can accept, but not so much through.

bp

On 2/19/2020 9:19 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
I think it's probably just a case of the person writing the article not knowing 
what they're talking about. I'm pretty sure the idea is to "blast internet" 
around the buildings, not through them.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:10 AM Ken Hohhof 
mailto:af...@kwisp.com>> wrote:
Tech arrives at front desk.  “Hi, I’m from Facebook and I’m here to blast 
through your building.”

Maybe they mean throughout buildings.  The hype seems to involve massive 
antenna arrays, sounds like the old assumption that with multipath you can 
bounce off the furniture and find a path.  But outside building to inside seems 
a challenge unless like Mike says it’s an open air building like a stadium?

This is going to an interesting and challenging future.  People now expect 
their Internet to be gigabit speed, never have even 1 second of downtime, and 
work everywhere they go.  These things are at odds with each other.

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:48 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Maybe they're open-air buildings?  ;-)

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[Image removed by sender.][Image removed by 
sender.][Image 
removed by 
sender.][Image
 removed by sender.]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[Image removed by sender.][Image removed by 
sender.][Image 
removed by sender.]
The Brothers WISP
[Image removed by sender.][Image 
removed by sender.]

From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@af.afmug.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM
Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

“the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through buildings 
“

I just want to hear it from Gino.

From: ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...

From: Ken Hohhof
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Is that a rhetorical question?

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?
Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini 
mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>> wrote:
 

Gino Villarini
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
m:
[Image removed by sender. aeronet-logo]
[Image removed by sender. inc500]
[Image removed by sender. fb-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
insta-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
in-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
tw-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
yt-logo]

Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

WE are using Facebook trial hardware

From: AF  on behalf of Mathew Howard 

Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Date: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 at 11:51 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Yeah, but what brand?

There are several different companies working on Terragraph equipment 
(including Cambium)

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 8:42 AM Bill Prince 
mailto:part15...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Terragraph.

https://terragraph.com/

bp

On 2/19/2020 6:39 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:

What brand is that equipment anyway?
On 2/19/2020 9:35 AM, Colin Stanners wrote:
Gino, this looks great for you, just note that in that picture there is a 
flat-faced part of a mount on both sides of a round pole. I don't recommend 
doing so as the flat face can "swivel" around the pole with vibration or one 
end can "slide" down further than the other, which may be issue with 
directional 60Ghz. I usually recommend around a round pole to have at least one 
side be a pretty-tight-to-the-pole U-bolt, or on the flat-plate side to have 
one of those V-shaped "teeth" cut-outs between the pole and flat plate.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:15 AM Gino A. Villarini 
mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>> wrote:
 

Gino Villarini
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
m:
[Image removed by sender. aeronet-logo]
[Image removed by sender. inc500]
[Image removed by sender. fb-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
insta-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
in-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
tw-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
yt-logo]
www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 
Guaynabo, PR 00968
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> on behalf of 
Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

Hey Colin, thanks for the kudos.  The picture is not from our actual 
deployment.  No idea where Engadget got it…

From: AF  on behalf of Colin Stanners 

Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Date: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 at 10:37 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Gino, this looks great for you, just note that in that picture there is a 
flat-faced part of a mount on both sides of a round pole. I don't recommend 
doing so as the flat face can "swivel" around the pole with vibration or one 
end can "slide" down further than the other, which may be issue with 
directional 60Ghz. I usually recommend around a round pole to have at least one 
side be a pretty-tight-to-the-pole U-bolt, or on the flat-plate side to have 
one of those V-shaped "teeth" cut-outs between the pole and flat plate.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:15 AM Gino A. Villarini 
mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>> wrote:
 

Gino Villarini
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
m:
[Image removed by sender. aeronet-logo]
[Image removed by sender. inc500]
[Image removed by sender. fb-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
insta-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
in-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
tw-logo]
[Image removed by sender. 
yt-logo]
www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 
Guaynabo, PR 00968
From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> on behalf of 
Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com>>
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
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Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com

2020-02-19 Thread Layne Sisk

I use it all the time, and in fact I rent a car that I own out on it.  It works 
great!

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102
[New logo xl]
[http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
[Utah 100]   [fast50-01] [Inc 5000]

From: AF  On Behalf Of Cameron Crum
Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2020 9:23 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT - turo.com

I've used Turo with great success a number of times. To me it is much more 
convenient, as where I have used them they show up at the airport curbside, you 
take some pics, get the keys and off you go. I always buy the supplemental 
insurance just to be safe but it is pretty cheap. I've had great cars, a Porche 
Cayenne, BMW X5, and a Ram 1500, all with no problems whatsoever, and at 
cheaper prices than a mid-sized rental car. Beats standing in line at the 
rental counter or having to ride some bus to a rental car lot and then standing 
in line. Same goes for drop off. MEet them at the airport drop off lane, take a 
few more pics and you are on your way.


On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:11 AM TJ Trout 
mailto:t...@voltbb.com>> wrote:
Bad

On Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 8:07 AM Mark - Myakka Technologies 
mailto:m...@mailmt.com>> wrote:
I  know  some  of  you  guys do a bunch of traveling.  Has anyone used
turo.com?   Good/Bad?   I have a trip coming up late spring 
and so far
the car rental places are out of control price wise.  Was looking into
alternatives.


--

Thanks,
 Mark  mailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.Myakka.com


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Re: [AFMUG] UV Resistant Label Machine

2020-02-19 Thread Lincs_Chel

Hi;

Both the Heat Shrink and the IND Flexible Nylon labels are UV rated
(according to the Dymo specs).

Industrial-strength tear-proof adhesive resists moisture, extreme
temperatures, UV light and more so labels won't curl or fall off
- UL recognized as a component to UL 969

https://www.dymo.com/en-US/view-all-labels/rhino-ind-labels/ind-flexible-nylon-labels-1-in

However, I have used both the 18mm & 24mm, Black on White versions, and
they did fade to almost 'invisible'. Not sure if the colours matter for
better longevity results.

On 18/02/2020 2:33 AM, Jason Wilson wrote:

I use the heat shrink stock for the rhinos. They are UV listed.

http://www.dymo.com/en-US/ind-heat-shrink-tube-1-4-in

On Mon, Feb 17, 2020 at 9:11 PM Lincs_Chel > wrote:

Hi;

I have found the same issue. The Dymo Rhino labels (vinyl series),
don't stay as long as the Brother TZ-Ez (flexible) series. What I
tend
to do now is to place the labels at multiple points on the cables
that
is exposed to the sun. I use labels from both manufacturers on
the same
cable.

Masking tape and a Sharpie holds up well. So we label with this
during
installation and use the electronic labels (Brother and Dymo
Rhino) for
pretty.

Really disappointed with the Rhino series however. They really
fade and
sometimes they tend to peel (doesn't stay wrapped securely around the
cable). The writings almost entirely not legible. For indoor use
they
do a better job.

Note, I have only used the Black on White labels. Not sure how the
other colours will stay legible for the extended periods of time
exposed
to the outdoor elements.

Looks like we now have to plan to do a regular maintenance
exercise to
re-label the cables every couple years (or 18-months or so).

If anyone finds or has suggestion for a good UV rated label system
(either with Brother / Dymo) would really be great.

On 17/02/2020 12:19 PM, Matt wrote:
> We use cheap DYMO label machines to label cat-5 tower runs etc.
> Within 6 months you cannot read the labels used outdoors but you
> usually do not need too. Does anyone know of outdoor UV resistant
> cartridges for them or for any label machine?
>

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Jason Wilson
Remotely Located
Providing High Speed Internet to out of the way places.
530-651-1736
530-748-9608 Cell
www.remotelylocated.com

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Re: [AFMUG] UV Resistant Label Machine

2020-02-19 Thread Lincs_Chel


Hi Matt;

I use either the 19mm (3/4in) and the 24mm (1in) sizes for the Dymo 
flexible series.  Depends how you want to wrap the cable. But both sizes 
work well for CAT5 cable (outdoor, STP and UTP).


The amount of info you wish to be printed will dictate the size. I found 
the smaller fonts don't print well on the Dymo RHINO series.  For the 
Brother TZ tapes, the 24mm and 18mm are the equivalent sizes that work 
well with the CAT5 cables.


If you wrap in portrait mode. Either size will work.  If you wrap in 
landscape mode, (need more characters to display), the 24mm will work 
better.  As it will fold around the cable (and possibly overlap) fully.


In either case, the flexible series is better for the CAT5 cables.

LH


On 18/02/2020 10:30 AM, Matt wrote:


I use the heat shrink stock for the rhinos. They are UV listed.

http://www.dymo.com/en-US/ind-heat-shrink-tube-1-4-in



>>>Choose from 1/4", 3/8", 1/2", 3/4" and 1" label widths

What size do you need for outdoor shielded cat-5?






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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

2020-02-19 Thread Jaime Solorza

thanks for tips!!!
Jaime Solorza
Wireless Systems Architect
915-861-1390


On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 9:43 AM  wrote:

> Well if it is exactly so many seconds it will surely help.
> Start with low gain and work your way up with antennas.
> Or just try to sample the area with an omni and signal strength alone.
> Enough samples and you will have a decent direction.
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:05 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch
>
>
> Good luck.  I hate trying to locate interference sources.  If it only
> occurs for 1-2 seconds once every 4 minutes, that will be even more
> difficult.
>
>
>
> Maybe at least you can determine what frequency and channel width it is
> using, and the signal level.  To figure out if it is on the exact same
> frequency, or maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is overloading the
> receiver front end.  I know there are some high powered paging systems
> around 930 MHz, not sure what would be up at 950.
>
>
>
> Is the STL analog or digital?  And is it like a backhaul link with tons of
> fade margin, or could a relatively modest signal interfere with it?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Jaime Solorza
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch
>
>
>
> Will see what I can find today and tomorrow...
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman 
> wrote:
>
> Electric Utilities are pretty constant in my experience. If it is
> licensed, you can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for finding
> interfering signals.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
> Just got a late evening call to help find a possible interference issue on
> a licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets "interrupted" every four
> minutes for a second or so since last Thursdayradio technician replaced
> STL and same issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit sites tomorrow..
>
> The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter checks out as well as antenna
> and waveguide.
>
> I do know 895-900MHz is getting hosed from across border as well as
> Verizon's PCS bands from new provider across border.  Going to take SA up
> the mountain and see what it shows ..
>
> The four minute interval intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the
> utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas from my fine feathered
> friends welcomed...
>
> Goodnight, Jaime Solorza
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Lewis Bergman
>
> 325-439-0533 Cell
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Dan Spitler

The radios are Facebook's https://fccid.io/2AK7S-FBC1601
No idea where the building-blasting marketing came from; that's definitely
not the case.
Gino: How are you offering IPv4? We (and Magyar Telekom) had to tunnel over
v6 which... bleh.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 9:23 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Certainly all their videos with the bright microwave links going from
> radio to radio, went down streets, and across streets, but never "through"
> buildings. To buildings I can accept, but not so much through.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 2/19/2020 9:19 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
>
> I think it's probably just a case of the person writing the article not
> knowing what they're talking about. I'm pretty sure the idea is to "blast
> internet" around the buildings, not through them.
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:10 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> Tech arrives at front desk.  “Hi, I’m from Facebook and I’m here to blast
>> through your building.”
>>
>>
>>
>> Maybe they mean throughout buildings.  The hype seems to involve massive
>> antenna arrays, sounds like the old assumption that with multipath you can
>> bounce off the furniture and find a path.  But outside building to inside
>> seems a challenge unless like Mike says it’s an open air building like a
>> stadium?
>>
>>
>>
>> This is going to an interesting and challenging future.  People now
>> expect their Internet to be gigabit speed, never have even 1 second of
>> downtime, and work everywhere they go.  These things are at odds with each
>> other.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:48 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in
>> Puerto Rico | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>> Maybe they're open-air buildings?  ;-)
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>> --
>>
>> *From: *ch...@wbmfg.com
>> *To: *af@af.afmug.com
>> *Sent: *Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM
>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
>> Rico | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> “the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through
>> buildings “
>>
>>
>>
>> I just want to hear it from Gino.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* ch...@wbmfg.com
>>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM
>>
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
>> Rico | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>> Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Ken Hohhof
>>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM
>>
>> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
>> Rico | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>> Is that a rhetorical question?
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
>> Rico | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>> So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>
>>
>> On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>>  
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Gino* *Villarini *
>> Founder/President
>> @gvillarini
>> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
>> m:
>>
>> [image: aeronet-logo] 
>>
>> [image: inc500] 
>>
>> [image: fb-logo] 
>>
>> [image: insta-logo] 
>>
>> [image: in-logo]
>> 
>>
>> [image: tw-logo]
>> 
>>
>>
>> [image: yt-logo]
>> 
>>
>> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>>
>> *From: *AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza <
>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
>> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
>> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico
>> | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>>

[AFMUG] Rack Injector power question

2020-02-19 Thread Adam Moffett


From the manual:

"Important: At least one of the power sources must be of positive 
polarity – the current revision of the RackInjector control board needs 
at least one positive voltage in order to operate. If multiple positive 
power sources are available, it will pull power from the input with the 
highest voltage."


Should I take that to mean a negative terminal needs to connect to 
ground for some reason?


I intend to connect a rectifier (-48V) and Meanwell RSD converters to 
other voltages.  The RSD's don't have a ground reference on the output 
side if I recall correctly.  I can add a connection from neg to ground 
on the 24V converter, but is that really what they mean by positive 
polarity?




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Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread David Coudron

We looked at a bunch of different options and decided to build a simple device 
using a metal framing square and a rifle scope.  It works really well.  
Basically we pick a landmark 1-2 miles out in Google Earth before climbing the 
tower.   Then when we are on the tower, we clamp the square/scope to the 
backhaul dish and use the scope to aim the dish.   With a couple of 
repetitions, the guys have gotten good enough to aim the first side, leave that 
tower site, and build the second site and aim.  Signal quality is good enough 
that we rarely have to revisit the first tower, only on links of 15 miles or 
more or if we can’t see the remote tower from the tower we are on even with the 
rifle scope (some of them are tough to pick out due to what is behind them).

This works well enough, I can’t imagine spending more on something else.   For 
backhaul dishes, the scope does the elevation and azimuth that we need.   For 
sector antennas, we use a simple plastic square to aim at a landmark.   Way 
easier than carrying a tool up the tower and very accurate.   For tilt, we use 
the iHandy level built into the phone.  It is surprisingly accurate.

Regards,

David Coudron

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 11:27 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

Specifications:

Azimuth accuracy: 0.5º
Tilt and roll accuracy: 0.1º
Position accuracy: 60 cm with SBAS

The real time roll is something that would be nice, with the structures we 
mount to and the mounts we use, getting the mast completely plumb isnt always 
an option, if i can have real time tilt and roll I can tweak the mast nuts and 
the tilt nuts to get it true. I tried with digital levels, but theyre finicky

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:21 AM Adam Moffett 
mailto:dmmoff...@gmail.com>> wrote:

So yeah like he said you can measure the elevation angle pretty well with a 
cheap tool.  You align the first dish's azimuth to a landmark and dead 
reckoning.   You peak the second dish, then go back to peak the first one.

If the tool lets you nail the azimuth on the first dish without re-climbing the 
tower then it's worth every penny.  Does it?  Just wondering.

If you use backhauls with the BNC voltage output and get the BNC to banana plug 
adapter then you get realtime feedback to peak the signal with.  I always 
thought the scope thing was a good idea, but never did get to use one.




On 2/19/2020 12:08 PM, Darin Steffl wrote:
We have one and it's very nice. We only use it to aim sectors and horns. For 
backhaul dishes, there no need to use it in my opinion since we use landmarks 
to get the aiming started. With sectors, there's no way to aim it like a dish 
so this tool is very helpful.

It should be under $4600 as that's what we paid for it new.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 10:58 AM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:
I had a project, still have a project to build one.
Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very short.
Maybe I will finish it someday.

If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...


Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from any 
hardware store to nail the elevation.
Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.

I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.
If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth you will 
be dead on for a lot less money.

From: Steve Jones
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking at this 
for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not looking to 
use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points.
We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably 
rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not installing 
sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust tilt, etc.

This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new access 
points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but then the tool 
will sit

Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If it 
were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k on the 
kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the convenience 
outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a licensed link.
Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value. saving 
maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets some cost.
You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your experience?

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Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread Steve Jones

Specifications:

Azimuth accuracy: 0.5º
Tilt and roll accuracy: 0.1º
Position accuracy: 60 cm with SBAS

The real time roll is something that would be nice, with the structures we
mount to and the mounts we use, getting the mast completely plumb isnt
always an option, if i can have real time tilt and roll I can tweak the
mast nuts and the tilt nuts to get it true. I tried with digital levels,
but theyre finicky

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:21 AM Adam Moffett  wrote:

> So yeah like he said you can measure the elevation angle pretty well with
> a cheap tool.  You align the first dish's azimuth to a landmark and dead
> reckoning.   You peak the second dish, then go back to peak the first one.
>
> If the tool lets you nail the azimuth on the first dish without
> re-climbing the tower then it's worth every penny.  Does it?  Just
> wondering.
>
> If you use backhauls with the BNC voltage output and get the BNC to banana
> plug adapter then you get realtime feedback to peak the signal with.  I
> always thought the scope thing was a good idea, but never did get to use
> one.
>
>
>
> On 2/19/2020 12:08 PM, Darin Steffl wrote:
>
> We have one and it's very nice. We only use it to aim sectors and horns.
> For backhaul dishes, there no need to use it in my opinion since we use
> landmarks to get the aiming started. With sectors, there's no way to aim it
> like a dish so this tool is very helpful.
>
> It should be under $4600 as that's what we paid for it new.
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 10:58 AM  wrote:
>
>> I had a project, still have a project to build one.
>> Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very
>> short.
>> Maybe I will finish it someday.
>>
>> If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...
>>
>>
>> Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from any
>> hardware store to nail the elevation.
>> Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.
>>
>> I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.
>> If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth you
>> will be dead on for a lot less money.
>>
>> *From:* Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Advice on spending
>>
>> I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking
>> at this for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not
>> looking to use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points.
>> We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably
>> rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not
>> installing sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust
>> tilt, etc.
>>
>> This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new
>> access points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but
>> then the tool will sit
>>
>> Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If
>> it were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k
>> on the kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the
>> convenience outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a
>> licensed link.
>> Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value.
>> saving maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets
>> some cost.
>> You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your
>> experience?
>>
>> --
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> --
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>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread Adam Moffett

For sectors we like to assemble the standoffs on the ground and 
pre-mount the antennas.  On the ground we can take the time to measure 
precisely and make sure the antennas are at the correct angles relative 
to each other.  Then tell the tower guy "mount this plumb and turn the 
assembly until this sector is facing 0 degrees North." If he's off a 
smidgen that's ok because the sectors are all off by the same amount and 
we still get full coverage.



On 2/19/2020 12:18 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


I could see it for APs, especially if you are going to these narrow 
beam horns.


For backhaul links, especially licensed links, I would just use a 
multimeter on the BNC connector if the radio has one, or the alignment 
tool in the GUI otherwise.  Maybe it would make sense to prealign the 
dishes before final tweaking for best signal, but Chuck’s rifle scope 
method is probably better for that.  That’s the only one I would trust 
enough not to tweak the alignment once the radios are linked up.


But back to sectors, I will admit I probably have some that are 
supposed to be spaced every 60 or 90 degrees but in actuality are off 
by 2-5 degrees.  Not really a huge deal, but probably suboptimum.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:58 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

I had a project, still have a project to build one.

Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very 
short.


Maybe I will finish it someday.

If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...

Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from 
any hardware store to nail the elevation.


Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.

I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.

If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth 
you will be dead on for a lot less money.


*From:*Steve Jones

*Sent:*Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM

*To:*AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group

*Subject:*[AFMUG] Advice on spending

I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been 
looking at this for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy 
in CBRS. Not looking to use it at customer sites, just backhauls and 
access points.


We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, 
probably rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with 
contractors not installing sites to spec, and having to go back up to 
turn radios/adjust tilt, etc.


This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new 
access points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. 
but then the tool will sit


Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". 
If it were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at 
almost 7k on the kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder 
if the convenience outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the 
cost of a licensed link.


Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of 
value. saving maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and 
there offsets some cost.


You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your 
experience?




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Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread Steve Jones

We are getting some accessories. I have an old TruPulse that I really like,
but its my personal one and Im not sure its calibration is good. I like
that it will do the maths for me to get accurate AGL even if I have to put
it at an angle because of structures in the way, so that drives the cost up
too. have you had any battery issues with the smartaligner?

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 11:09 AM Darin Steffl 
wrote:

> We have one and it's very nice. We only use it to aim sectors and horns.
> For backhaul dishes, there no need to use it in my opinion since we use
> landmarks to get the aiming started. With sectors, there's no way to aim it
> like a dish so this tool is very helpful.
>
> It should be under $4600 as that's what we paid for it new.
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 10:58 AM  wrote:
>
>> I had a project, still have a project to build one.
>> Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very
>> short.
>> Maybe I will finish it someday.
>>
>> If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...
>>
>>
>> Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from any
>> hardware store to nail the elevation.
>> Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.
>>
>> I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.
>> If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth you
>> will be dead on for a lot less money.
>>
>> *From:* Steve Jones
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Advice on spending
>>
>> I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking
>> at this for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not
>> looking to use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points.
>> We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably
>> rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not
>> installing sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust
>> tilt, etc.
>>
>> This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new
>> access points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but
>> then the tool will sit
>>
>> Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If
>> it were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k
>> on the kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the
>> convenience outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a
>> licensed link.
>> Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value.
>> saving maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets
>> some cost.
>> You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your
>> experience?
>>
>> --
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
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>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

I could see it for APs, especially if you are going to these narrow beam horns.

 

For backhaul links, especially licensed links, I would just use a multimeter on 
the BNC connector if the radio has one, or the alignment tool in the GUI 
otherwise.  Maybe it would make sense to prealign the dishes before final 
tweaking for best signal, but Chuck’s rifle scope method is probably better for 
that.  That’s the only one I would trust enough not to tweak the alignment once 
the radios are linked up.

 

But back to sectors, I will admit I probably have some that are supposed to be 
spaced every 60 or 90 degrees but in actuality are off by 2-5 degrees.  Not 
really a huge deal, but probably suboptimum.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:58 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

 

I had a project, still have a project to build one.  

Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very short.  

Maybe I will finish it someday.  

 

If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...

 

 

Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from any 
hardware store to nail the elevation.  

Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.

 

I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.  

If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth you will 
be dead on for a lot less money.  

 

From: Steve Jones 

Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

 

I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking at this 
for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not looking to 
use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points. 

We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably 
rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not installing 
sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust tilt, etc.

 

This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new access 
points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but then the tool 
will sit

 

Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If it 
were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k on the 
kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the convenience 
outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a licensed link.

Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value. saving 
maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets some cost.

You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your experience?

  _  

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

-- 
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AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget


  
  
Never let reality mess up your fantasy.


bp



On 2/19/2020 9:10 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


  
  
  
  
  
Tech arrives at front desk.  “Hi, I’m from
  Facebook and I’m here to blast through your building.”
 
Maybe they mean throughout buildings.  The
  hype seems to involve massive antenna arrays, sounds like the
  old assumption that with multipath you can bounce off the
  furniture and find a path.  But outside building to inside
  seems a challenge unless like Mike says it’s an open air
  building like a stadium?
 
This is going to an interesting and
  challenging future.  People now expect their Internet to be
  gigabit speed, never have even 1 second of downtime, and work
  everywhere they go.  These things are at odds with each other.
 
 

  
From: AF
   On Behalf Of Mike
  Hammett
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:48 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
  
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit
  wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget
  

 

  Maybe
  they're open-air buildings?  ;-)
  


-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
  
  Midwest Internet Exchange
  
  The Brothers WISP
  


  
  
  
  
  
From:
ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@af.afmug.com
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM
Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless
rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

  

   


  

   

  


  

  
“the
60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that
blasts internet through buildings “
  
  
 
  
  
I just
want to hear it from Gino.
  
  

  
 
  
  

  From:
  ch...@wbmfg.com
  


  Sent:
  Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM


  To:
  AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 


  Subject:
  Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit
  wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico |
  Engadget

  


   

  
  

  

  Well
  the press release talked about it
  going “through buildings”.  ...


   


  

   


  
From:
Ken Hohhof 
  
  
Sent:
Wednesday, February 19, 2020
9:06 AM
  
  
To:
'AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group'

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

Tech arrives at front desk.  “Hi, I’m from Facebook and I’m here to blast 
through your building.”

 

Maybe they mean throughout buildings.  The hype seems to involve massive 
antenna arrays, sounds like the old assumption that with multipath you can 
bounce off the furniture and find a path.  But outside building to inside seems 
a challenge unless like Mike says it’s an open air building like a stadium?

 

This is going to an interesting and challenging future.  People now expect 
their Internet to be gigabit speed, never have even 1 second of downtime, and 
work everywhere they go.  These things are at odds with each other.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:48 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

Maybe they're open-air buildings?  ;-)



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  
 
  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  
 
  The Brothers WISP
   
 




  _  

From: ch...@wbmfg.com  
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM
Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

 

“the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through buildings 
“

 

I just want to hear it from Gino.

 

From: ch...@wbmfg.com   

Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM

To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...

 

 

From: Ken Hohhof 

Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM

To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

Is that a rhetorical question?

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?

Sent from my iPhone

 

On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com> > wrote:

 

 

 

 

Gino Villarini 
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
m: 


  

  

   

   

   

 

  

   



  www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 
Guaynabo, PR 00968

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > on behalf 
of Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> >
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

 

https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  _  

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

 

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Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread Darin Steffl

We have one and it's very nice. We only use it to aim sectors and horns.
For backhaul dishes, there no need to use it in my opinion since we use
landmarks to get the aiming started. With sectors, there's no way to aim it
like a dish so this tool is very helpful.

It should be under $4600 as that's what we paid for it new.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 10:58 AM  wrote:

> I had a project, still have a project to build one.
> Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very
> short.
> Maybe I will finish it someday.
>
> If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...
>
>
> Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from any
> hardware store to nail the elevation.
> Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.
>
> I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.
> If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth you
> will be dead on for a lot less money.
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Advice on spending
>
> I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking at
> this for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not
> looking to use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points.
> We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably
> rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not
> installing sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust
> tilt, etc.
>
> This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new
> access points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but
> then the tool will sit
>
> Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If
> it were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k
> on the kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the
> convenience outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a
> licensed link.
> Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value.
> saving maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets
> some cost.
> You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your experience?
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

I had a project, still have a project to build one.  
Not trivial because the baseline between the two GPS receivers is very short.  
Maybe I will finish it someday.  

If you buy one, let me “borrow it for a few days”...


Elevation is very simple.  You can buy a cheap electronic level from any 
hardware store to nail the elevation.  
Then all you gotta do is sweep and peak.

I have not talked to anyone that has used one of these things.  
If you can find a landmark along the path and use a scope for azimuth you will 
be dead on for a lot less money.  

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:50 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] Advice on spending

I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking at this 
for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not looking to 
use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points. 
We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably 
rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not installing 
sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust tilt, etc.

This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new access 
points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but then the tool 
will sit

Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If it 
were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k on the 
kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the convenience 
outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a licensed link.
Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value. saving 
maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets some cost.

You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your experience?



-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Mathew Howard

I recall seeing quite a few buildings in Puerto Rico that 60ghz would go
through just fine...

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 10:48 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Maybe they're open-air buildings?  ;-)
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *To: *af@af.afmug.com
> *Sent: *Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
>
>
> “the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through
> buildings “
>
> I just want to hear it from Gino.
>
> *From:* ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
> Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...
>
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
>
> Is that a rhetorical question?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
>
>
> So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
> *Gino** Villarini *
> Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> m:
>
> [image: aeronet-logo] 
>
> [image: inc500] 
>
> [image: fb-logo] 
>
> [image: insta-logo] 
>
> [image: in-logo] 
>
>
> [image: tw-logo]
> 
>
>
> [image: yt-logo]
> 
>
> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>
> *From: *AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza <
> losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico |
> Engadget
>
>
>
>
> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

[AFMUG] Advice on spending

2020-02-19 Thread Steve Jones

I got approval from the boss to order a smart aligner. Ive been looking at
this for a while, particularly with the need for accuracy in CBRS. Not
looking to use it at customer sites, just backhauls and access points.
We have historically never been verifiably accurate on azimuths, probably
rolled out pretty bad too. We have had issues with contractors not
installing sites to spec, and having to go back up to turn radios/adjust
tilt, etc.

This will be handy for this year, we are dropping in at least 40 new access
points and 3 or 5 new licensed links in the next few months. but then the
tool will sit

Boss said the worst thing to me, "get it if you think its necessary". If it
were a $1k tool it wouldnt be a question bet we are looking at almost 7k on
the kit. It meets my accuracy needs, but I almost wonder if the convenience
outweighs the necessary. ant his is over half the cost of a licensed link.
 Knowing my numbers are right in propagation tools holds a lot of value.
saving maybe an hour getting a tight link aligned here and there offsets
some cost.
You old timers, is this a justifiable expenditure based on your experience?
-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Colin Stanners

60Ghz will go through buildings as long as their walls / doors are shoji
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sh%C5%8Dji

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 10:44 AM  wrote:

> Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...
>
>
> *From:* Ken Hohhof
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM
> *To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
>
> Is that a rhetorical question?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
>
>
> So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
> *Gino** Villarini *
> Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> m:
>
> [image: aeronet-logo] 
>
> [image: inc500] 
>
> [image: fb-logo] 
>
> [image: insta-logo] 
>
> [image: in-logo] 
>
>
> [image: tw-logo]
> 
>
>
> [image: yt-logo]
> 
>
> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>
> *From: *AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza <
> losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico |
> Engadget
>
>
>
>
> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget


  
  
That is a case of marketing getting ahead of reality. Also note
  that they say the maximum distance is 250 meters. That is not a
  building penetrating signal. Probably not even a window
  penetrating signal.

bp



On 2/19/2020 8:46 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com
  wrote:


  
  
  
  
  

   
  

   

  
  

  
“the 60GHz
millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts
internet through buildings “
 
I just want
  to hear it from Gino.

  
 

  From: ch...@wbmfg.com
  
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020
9:43 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave
  Users Group 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's
gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico |
Engadget

  
   


  

  Well the press release talked about it going
“through buildings”.  ...
   
  

   
  
From:
  Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19,
  2020 9:06 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm
Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's
  gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico
  | Engadget
  

 
  
  

  Is that a rhetorical
question?
   
  

  From: AF
 On
  Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19,
2020 10:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users
Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's
gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
Rico | Engadget

  
   
  So how well does 60ghz blast through
buildings?
  
Sent from my iPhone
  
  

  
  

  On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino
A. Villarini 
wrote:

  
  

   
   
   
   
  Gino Villarini 
  Founder/President
  @gvillarini
  t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
  m:

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Mike Hammett

Maybe they're open-air buildings? ;-) 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:46:32 AM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget 











“the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through buildings 
“ 

I just want to hear it from Gino. 




From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget 




Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”. ... 





From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM 
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget 



Is that a rhetorical question? 



From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget 

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings? 

Sent from my iPhone 






On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini < g...@aeronetpr.com > wrote: 






  


Gino Villarini 
Founder/President 
@gvillarini 
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
m: 

aeronet-logo
inc500  
fb-logo 
insta-logo  
in-logo 
tw-logo 
yt-logo 
www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968 

From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > on behalf of Jaime Solorza < 
losguyswirel...@gmail.com > 
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget 



https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 
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[AFMUG] Fw: Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget



“the 60GHz millimeter-wave wireless tech that blasts internet through buildings 
“

I just want to hear it from Gino.

From: ch...@wbmfg.com 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:43 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...


From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Is that a rhetorical question?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?

Sent from my iPhone





  On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:

   

   

   

   

  Gino Villarini 
  Founder/President
  @gvillarini
  t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
  m: 


   







  www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968

  From: AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza 

  Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

   

  https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 

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  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch


  
  
or someone has a nearby transmitter that is turned up well beyond
  what might be needed. I'm inclined to agree with Jaime's theory.

bp



On 2/19/2020 8:40 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


  
  
  
  
I was trying to convince myself it could be
  some weather or military radar that does a 360 degree sweep
  every 4 minutes, and that PIM was creating a difference
  frequency of 950 MHz.  But your explanation makes more sense. 
  In which case somebody has an OOBE problem or is not on their
  assigned frequency, or maybe the STL needs a narrow bandpass
  filter on their receiver.  Like WISPs used to put on their 900
  MHz equipment when located near a paging tower.
 
 
From: AF
   On Behalf Of Jaime
  Solorza
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:33 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
  
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch
 

  Suspect it's a utility because of
intervals associated with polling. The water utilities has
over 800 well and lift stations working at 928.xxx and
952.xxxMHz ...you can actually hear them polling on a
scanner!  

 

  
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 9:18 AM Bill
  Prince 
  wrote:
  
  

  and 900 MHz is not all that directional; a signal
strong enough to overload will be difficult to find a
direction on.
  bp
  
   
  
On 2/19/2020 8:05 AM, Ken Hohhof
  wrote:
  
  

  Good
luck.  I hate trying to locate interference
sources.  If it only occurs for 1-2 seconds once
every 4 minutes, that will be even more difficult.
   
  Maybe
at least you can determine what frequency and
channel width it is using, and the signal level.  To
figure out if it is on the exact same frequency, or
maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is
overloading the receiver front end.  I know there
are some high powered paging systems around 930 MHz,
not sure what would be up at 950.
   
  Is
the STL analog or digital?  And is it like a
backhaul link with tons of fade margin, or could a
relatively modest signal interfere with it?
   
  From:
AF 
On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one,
Mister Grinch
   
  
Will
  see what I can find today and tomorrow...
  
   
  

  On
Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman 
wrote:


  
Electric
  Utilities are pretty constant in my
  experience. If it is licensed, you can call
  the FCC. They have the best equipment for
  finding interfering signals. 
  
   
  

  On
Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza

wrote:


  
Just
  got a late evening call to help find a
  possible interference issue on a licensed
  STL working at  950MHz that gets
  "interrupted" every four minutes for a
  second or so since last Thursdayradio
  technician replaced STL and same
  issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit
  sites tomorrow..

  The
FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter
checks out as

Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

Well the press release talked about it going “through buildings”.  ...


From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:06 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

Is that a rhetorical question?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?

Sent from my iPhone





  On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:

   

   

   

   

  Gino Villarini 
  Founder/President
  @gvillarini
  t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
  m: 


   







  www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968

  From: AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza 

  Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

   

  https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 

  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

Well if it is exactly so many seconds it will surely help.
Start with low gain and work your way up with antennas.
Or just try to sample the area with an omni and signal strength alone.  
Enough samples and you will have a decent direction.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:05 AM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

Good luck.  I hate trying to locate interference sources.  If it only occurs 
for 1-2 seconds once every 4 minutes, that will be even more difficult.

Maybe at least you can determine what frequency and channel width it is using, 
and the signal level.  To figure out if it is on the exact same frequency, or 
maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is overloading the receiver front 
end.  I know there are some high powered paging systems around 930 MHz, not 
sure what would be up at 950.

Is the STL analog or digital?  And is it like a backhaul link with tons of fade 
margin, or could a relatively modest signal interfere with it?

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

Will see what I can find today and tomorrow...

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman  wrote:

  Electric Utilities are pretty constant in my experience. If it is licensed, 
you can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for finding interfering 
signals. 

  On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza  
wrote:

Just got a late evening call to help find a possible interference issue on 
a licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets "interrupted" every four minutes 
for a second or so since last Thursdayradio technician replaced STL and 
same issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit sites tomorrow..

The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter checks out as well as antenna 
and waveguide.

I do know 895-900MHz is getting hosed from across border as well as 
Verizon's PCS bands from new provider across border.  Going to take SA up the 
mountain and see what it shows ..

The four minute interval intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the 
utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas from my fine feathered friends 
welcomed...

Goodnight, Jaime Solorza

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

  -- 

  Lewis Bergman

  325-439-0533 Cell

  -- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

I was trying to convince myself it could be some weather or military radar that 
does a 360 degree sweep every 4 minutes, and that PIM was creating a difference 
frequency of 950 MHz.  But your explanation makes more sense.  In which case 
somebody has an OOBE problem or is not on their assigned frequency, or maybe 
the STL needs a narrow bandpass filter on their receiver.  Like WISPs used to 
put on their 900 MHz equipment when located near a paging tower.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:33 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

 

Suspect it's a utility because of intervals associated with polling. The water 
utilities has over 800 well and lift stations working at 928.xxx and 952.xxxMHz 
...you can actually hear them polling on a scanner!  

 

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 9:18 AM Bill Prince mailto:part15...@gmail.com> > wrote:

and 900 MHz is not all that directional; a signal strong enough to overload 
will be difficult to find a direction on.

bp

 

On 2/19/2020 8:05 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Good luck.  I hate trying to locate interference sources.  If it only occurs 
for 1-2 seconds once every 4 minutes, that will be even more difficult.

 

Maybe at least you can determine what frequency and channel width it is using, 
and the signal level.  To figure out if it is on the exact same frequency, or 
maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is overloading the receiver front 
end.  I know there are some high powered paging systems around 930 MHz, not 
sure what would be up at 950.

 

Is the STL analog or digital?  And is it like a backhaul link with tons of fade 
margin, or could a relatively modest signal interfere with it?

 

From: AF    On Behalf 
Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group   
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

 

Will see what I can find today and tomorrow...

 

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman mailto:lewis.berg...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Electric Utilities are pretty constant in my experience. If it is licensed, you 
can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for finding interfering signals. 

 

On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Just got a late evening call to help find a possible interference issue on a 
licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets "interrupted" every four minutes for 
a second or so since last Thursdayradio technician replaced STL and same 
issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit sites tomorrow..

The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter checks out as well as antenna and 
waveguide.

I do know 895-900MHz is getting hosed from across border as well as Verizon's 
PCS bands from new provider across border.  Going to take SA up the mountain 
and see what it shows ..

The four minute interval intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the 
utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas from my fine feathered friends 
welcomed...

Goodnight, Jaime Solorza

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




 

-- 

Lewis Bergman

325-439-0533 Cell

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

 

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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

2020-02-19 Thread Jaime Solorza

Suspect it's a utility because of intervals associated with polling. The
water utilities has over 800 well and lift stations working at 928.xxx and
952.xxxMHz ...you can actually hear them polling on a scanner!

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 9:18 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> and 900 MHz is not all that directional; a signal strong enough to
> overload will be difficult to find a direction on.
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 2/19/2020 8:05 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>
> Good luck.  I hate trying to locate interference sources.  If it only
> occurs for 1-2 seconds once every 4 minutes, that will be even more
> difficult.
>
>
>
> Maybe at least you can determine what frequency and channel width it is
> using, and the signal level.  To figure out if it is on the exact same
> frequency, or maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is overloading the
> receiver front end.  I know there are some high powered paging systems
> around 930 MHz, not sure what would be up at 950.
>
>
>
> Is the STL analog or digital?  And is it like a backhaul link with tons of
> fade margin, or could a relatively modest signal interfere with it?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF   *On Behalf
> Of *Jaime Solorza
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch
>
>
>
> Will see what I can find today and tomorrow...
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman 
> wrote:
>
> Electric Utilities are pretty constant in my experience. If it is
> licensed, you can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for
> finding interfering signals.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
> Just got a late evening call to help find a possible interference issue on
> a licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets "interrupted" every four
> minutes for a second or so since last Thursdayradio technician replaced
> STL and same issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit sites tomorrow..
>
> The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter checks out as well as antenna
> and waveguide.
>
> I do know 895-900MHz is getting hosed from across border as well as
> Verizon's PCS bands from new provider across border.  Going to take SA up
> the mountain and see what it shows ..
>
> The four minute interval intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the
> utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas from my fine feathered
> friends welcomed...
>
> Goodnight, Jaime Solorza
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Lewis Bergman
>
> 325-439-0533 Cell
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
>
> --
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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AF@af.afmug.com
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[AFMUG] OT: Voip Innovations Support

2020-02-19 Thread Nate Burke

Has anyone noticed a change with VI Support since Sangoma took over?  
Without any data to back it up, it fees like I'm sitting on hold longer 
before someone picks up.  They can still always solve my problem when I 
get through to someone, But they all sound like they're sitting in the 
middle of a coffee shop, or in a train station, there is so much 
background noise, people yelling, music playing, etc.  I'm on right now 
and it sounds like she's on an airplane, like there is rushing wind 
behind her.


I still have no complaints about the quality of the service, it just 
seems like something with Live support has changed.


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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch


  
  
and 900 MHz is not all that directional; a signal strong enough
  to overload will be difficult to find a direction on.

bp



On 2/19/2020 8:05 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


  
  
  
  
Good luck.  I hate trying to locate
  interference sources.  If it only occurs for 1-2 seconds once
  every 4 minutes, that will be even more difficult.
 
Maybe at least you can determine what
  frequency and channel width it is using, and the signal
  level.  To figure out if it is on the exact same frequency, or
  maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is overloading the
  receiver front end.  I know there are some high powered paging
  systems around 930 MHz, not sure what would be up at 950.
 
Is the STL analog or digital?  And is it
  like a backhaul link with tons of fade margin, or could a
  relatively modest signal interfere with it?
 
From: AF
   On Behalf Of Jaime
  Solorza
  Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
  
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch
 

  Will see what I can find today and
tomorrow...

 

  
On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis
  Bergman 
  wrote:
  
  

  Electric Utilities are
pretty constant in my experience. If it is licensed, you
can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for
finding interfering signals. 

 

  
On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM
  Jaime Solorza 
  wrote:
  
  

  Just got a late evening call to
help find a possible interference issue on a
licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets
"interrupted" every four minutes for a second or so
since last Thursdayradio technician replaced STL
and same issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit
sites tomorrow..
  
The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz
  and transmitter checks out as well as antenna and
  waveguide.
  
  
I do know 895-900MHz is getting
  hosed from across border as well as Verizon's PCS
  bands from new provider across border.  Going to
  take SA up the mountain and see what it shows ..
  
  
The four minute interval
  intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the
  utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas
  from my fine feathered friends welcomed...
  
  
Goodnight, Jaime Solorza
  

-- 
  AF mailing list
  AF@af.afmug.com
  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
  


  

   

-- 

  
Lewis Bergman

  325-439-0533 Cell

  

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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Mathew Howard

Well, I think everybody here probably knows the answer...

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 10:07 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Is that a rhetorical question?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
> Rico | Engadget
>
>
>
> So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
>
> 
>
>  
>
>
>
>
>
> *Gino** Villarini *
> Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> m:
>
> [image: aeronet-logo] 
>
> [image: inc500] 
>
> [image: fb-logo] 
>
> [image: insta-logo] 
>
> [image: in-logo] 
>
>
> [image: tw-logo]
> 
>
>
> [image: yt-logo]
> 
>
> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>
> *From: *AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza <
> losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico |
> Engadget
>
>
>
>
> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

Is that a rhetorical question?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 10:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
Engadget

 

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?

Sent from my iPhone





On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com> > wrote:

 

 

 

 

Gino Villarini 
Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
m: 


  

  

   

   

   

 

  

   



  www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 
Guaynabo, PR 00968

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > on behalf 
of Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> >
Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

 

https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 

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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

Good luck.  I hate trying to locate interference sources.  If it only occurs 
for 1-2 seconds once every 4 minutes, that will be even more difficult.

 

Maybe at least you can determine what frequency and channel width it is using, 
and the signal level.  To figure out if it is on the exact same frequency, or 
maybe an adjacent channel but so strong it is overloading the receiver front 
end.  I know there are some high powered paging systems around 930 MHz, not 
sure what would be up at 950.

 

Is the STL analog or digital?  And is it like a backhaul link with tons of fade 
margin, or could a relatively modest signal interfere with it?

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2020 9:46 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

 

Will see what I can find today and tomorrow...

 

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman mailto:lewis.berg...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Electric Utilities are pretty constant in my experience. If it is licensed, you 
can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for finding interfering signals. 

 

On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Just got a late evening call to help find a possible interference issue on a 
licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets "interrupted" every four minutes for 
a second or so since last Thursdayradio technician replaced STL and same 
issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit sites tomorrow..

The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter checks out as well as antenna and 
waveguide.

I do know 895-900MHz is getting hosed from across border as well as Verizon's 
PCS bands from new provider across border.  Going to take SA up the mountain 
and see what it shows ..

The four minute interval intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the 
utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas from my fine feathered friends 
welcomed...

Goodnight, Jaime Solorza

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com  
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




 

-- 

Lewis Bergman

325-439-0533 Cell

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AF@af.afmug.com  
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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Chuck McCown

So how well does 60ghz blast through buildings?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 19, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
> 
> 
>  
>  
>  
> Gino Villarini 
> Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
> m: 
>   
> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
> 
> From: AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza 
> 
> Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | 
> Engadget
>  
> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 
> -- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Mathew Howard

Yeah, but what brand?

There are several different companies working on Terragraph equipment
(including Cambium)

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 8:42 AM Bill Prince  wrote:

> Terragraph.
>
> https://terragraph.com/
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 2/19/2020 6:39 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>
> What brand is that equipment anyway?
> On 2/19/2020 9:35 AM, Colin Stanners wrote:
>
> Gino, this looks great for you, just note that in that picture there is a
> flat-faced part of a mount on both sides of a round pole. I don't recommend
> doing so as the flat face can "swivel" around the pole with vibration or
> one end can "slide" down further than the other, which may be issue with
> directional 60Ghz. I usually recommend around a round pole to have at least
> one side be a pretty-tight-to-the-pole U-bolt, or on the flat-plate side to
> have one of those V-shaped "teeth" cut-outs between the pole and flat
> plate.
>
> On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:15 AM Gino A. Villarini 
> wrote:
>
>>  
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Gino*
>> *Villarini *Founder/President
>> @gvillarini
>> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
>> m:
>> [image: aeronet-logo]  [image: inc500]
>>  [image: fb-logo]
>>   [image: insta-logo]
>>   [image: in-logo]
>>   [image:
>> tw-logo]
>> 
>>   [image: yt-logo]
>> 
>> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>>
>> *From: *AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza <
>> losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
>> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
>> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico
>> | Engadget
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Your a strange one, Mister Grinch

2020-02-19 Thread Jaime Solorza

Will see what I can find today and tomorrow...

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 AM Lewis Bergman  wrote:

> Electric Utilities are pretty constant in my experience. If it is
> licensed, you can call the FCC. They have the best equipment for
> finding interfering signals.
>
> On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 10:08 PM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> Just got a late evening call to help find a possible interference issue
>> on a licensed STL working at  950MHz that gets "interrupted" every four
>> minutes for a second or so since last Thursdayradio technician replaced
>> STL and same issue...no BERs detected.  Going to visit sites tomorrow..
>> The FM frequency is 97.5 MHz and transmitter checks out as well as
>> antenna and waveguide.
>> I do know 895-900MHz is getting hosed from across border as well as
>> Verizon's PCS bands from new provider across border.  Going to take SA up
>> the mountain and see what it shows ..
>> The four minute interval intrigues me...as in SCADA system polling...the
>> utilities do use nearby frequencies...any ideas from my fine feathered
>> friends welcomed...
>> Goodnight, Jaime Solorza
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
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>>
>
>
> --
> Lewis Bergman
> 325-439-0533 Cell
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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget


  
  
Terragraph.
https://terragraph.com/


bp



On 2/19/2020 6:39 AM, Adam Moffett
  wrote:


  
  What brand is that equipment anyway?
  
  On 2/19/2020 9:35 AM, Colin Stanners
wrote:
  
  

Gino, this looks great for you, just note that in
  that picture there is a flat-faced part of a mount on both
  sides of a round pole. I don't recommend doing so as the flat
  face can "swivel" around the pole with vibration or one end
  can "slide" down further than the other, which may be issue
  with directional 60Ghz. I usually recommend around a round
  pole to have at least one side be a pretty-tight-to-the-pole
  U-bolt, or on the flat-plate side to have one of those
  V-shaped "teeth" cut-outs between the pole and flat plate. 



  On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:15
AM Gino A. Villarini  wrote:
  
  

  

   
 
 
Gino Villarini

  Founder/President
  @gvillarini
  t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204 
  m: 
 

  

  
  
   
   
   
   
   
  
  

  

www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304
  Guaynabo, PR 00968

  From: AF 
  on behalf of Jaime Solorza 
  Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
  
  Date: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37
  PM
  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
  Subject: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit
  wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget


   


  https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/ 

  

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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Adam Moffett


What brand is that equipment anyway?

On 2/19/2020 9:35 AM, Colin Stanners wrote:
Gino, this looks great for you, just note that in that picture there 
is a flat-faced part of a mount on both sides of a round pole. I don't 
recommend doing so as the flat face can "swivel" around the pole with 
vibration or one end can "slide" down further than the other, which 
may be issue with directional 60Ghz. I usually recommend around a 
round pole to have at least one side be a pretty-tight-to-the-pole 
U-bolt, or on the flat-plate side to have one of those V-shaped 
"teeth" cut-outs between the pole and flat plate.


On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:15 AM Gino A. Villarini > wrote:


 

*GinoVillarini
*Founder/President
@gvillarini
t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
m:

aeronet-logo   inc500
 fb-logo
 insta-logo
  in-logo
 tw-logo


yt-logo   
  

www.aeronetpr.com  | Metro Office Park
#18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968

*From: *AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> on behalf of Jaime Solorza
mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com>>
*Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
*To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto
Rico | Engadget


https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/


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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget

2020-02-19 Thread Colin Stanners

Gino, this looks great for you, just note that in that picture there is a
flat-faced part of a mount on both sides of a round pole. I don't recommend
doing so as the flat face can "swivel" around the pole with vibration or
one end can "slide" down further than the other, which may be issue with
directional 60Ghz. I usually recommend around a round pole to have at least
one side be a pretty-tight-to-the-pole U-bolt, or on the flat-plate side to
have one of those V-shaped "teeth" cut-outs between the pole and flat
plate.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 7:15 AM Gino A. Villarini  wrote:

>  
>
>
>
>
>
> *Gino*
> *Villarini *Founder/President
> @gvillarini
> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
> m:
> [image: aeronet-logo]  [image: inc500]
>  [image: fb-logo]
>   [image: insta-logo]
>   [image: in-logo]
>   [image:
> tw-logo]
> 
>   [image: yt-logo]
> 
> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>
> *From: *AF  on behalf of Jaime Solorza <
> losguyswirel...@gmail.com>
> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Date: *Tuesday, February 18, 2020 at 11:37 PM
> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico |
> Engadget
>
>
>
>
> https://www.engadget.com/2020/02/18/facebook-terragraph-san-juan-puerto-rico/
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Facebook's gigabit wireless rolls out in Puerto Rico | Engadget