subject:"Web Programming Cert"


 i dont' know what we are talking about funding

No one is talking about financial contributions. We're talking about
contributing time and effort to open source projects.
-- 
Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN
Railo Technologies, Inc. -- http://getrailo.com/
An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/

If you're not annoying somebody, you're not really alive.
-- Margaret Atwood

well it was said If you have the venture capital, I have the Chutzpah.  :)  
and i was referring to that.  i am down to contribute my time and my limited 
abilities for the sheer learning experience it would be for me. and i think it 
would be very rewarding. and i'm just saying i would have no problem helping 
pay for any of the small expensies related to the project, i know the majority 
of it is time and effort  :) 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-06 Thread Sean Corfield


On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 11:02 PM, Carey  Duryea ca...@keepingitgreen.net wrote:
 and i was referring to that.  i am down to contribute my time and my limited 
 abilities for the sheer learning experience it would be for me. and i think 
 it would be very rewarding. and i'm just saying i would have no problem 
 helping pay for any of the small expensies related to the project, i know the 
 majority of it is time and effort  :)

Ah, OK. Cool. Yes, hosting for open source projects often costs money
and supporting that alone is a worthwhile enterprise. Thank you!
-- 
Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN
Railo Technologies, Inc. -- http://getrailo.com/
An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/

If you're not annoying somebody, you're not really alive.
-- Margaret Atwo

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Re: Web Programming Cert


 i dont' know what we are talking about funding

No one is talking about financial contributions. We're talking about
contributing time and effort to open source projects.
-- 
Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN
Railo Technologies, Inc. -- http://getrailo.com/
An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/

If you're not annoying somebody, you're not really alive.
-- Margaret Atwood


So does anyone have any experience starting these types of things?  what to 
start with? i would like to contribute.  i don't want this to go down on the 
list of many good ideas people have had together! haha :)   any ideas of first 
steps , lay them out! 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

LOL. I'm not kosher, so to speak. I just love language. Or
something like that. :)

There's been some effort in this area of bringing things together.
There's that framework that can leverage like, a bunch of other
frameworks, and those same heads ported Galleon and maybe some other
stuff? Things branch, but like you say, everyone has their own pet
forks or whatever. :)

I'm the same as everybody else tho. Too tempting to roll your own.
Freaking CFML! :)

Speaking of (ha!), I'm putting something similar to what your saying
together (like probably ten other heads), and so I've thought about it
a good bit. Began a model-glue deal with actionpacks for the various
bits-- but I'm aiming to make the actionpacks framework agnostic at
their core, so they can be plugged in elsewheres...

I was being sorta generally gung ho, but if you seriously want to get
serious, we can team up. Get a VPS or whatever, and we're in like
Flynn :)

:Den

--
The sovereign cure for worry is prayer.
William James

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 11:00 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:

If you have the venture capital, I have the Chutzpah. :)

Or, to quote a totally wicked and way underrated 80's flick:

If you bring the dip, I'll bring the chips.

Seriously tho, I hear you. Let's get competitive, just for kicks.

:Den

Den,
how come everyone in the coldfusion community is Jewish? haha my best
friend and business partner is part of the tribe. ya i've thought alot about
this actually, thought about what framework, how to integrate alot of other
already present projects to arrouse a few others in the community, aka
blog.cfc , ray, chris, mike etc etc i just know that alot of times one of
the determining factors is coldfusion like .net developers by nature have
their own box of goodies , where as php throw everything into a community
box. Where CFers claim to get paid for there work, and php work ends up all
in india, so i've heard the claim. but my point is i have plenty of indian
friends that are CFers. I do have to say that drupals sort of extensible
content types, and base core functionality are definitly something to target.
lets face it, there are some unique functionalities out there, but there are
some very core functionalities forums,blogs,social profiles, that all
should all fit directly into a cf community. that way the extensiblity of
these core functionalities instead of from stratch starts, or goodie box
starts. i'm all about universal intelligence, not about proprietory
knowledge. i know poliferating a community with intellegence will inter
make my life fruitful. i'm so down!

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-06 Thread Brian Thornton

I could cover the cost of a VPS.

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 2:59 AM, denstar valliants...@gmail.com wrote:

LOL. I'm not kosher, so to speak. I just love language. Or
something like that. :)

I'm the same as everybody else tho. Too tempting to roll your own.
Freaking CFML! :)

I was being sorta generally gung ho, but if you seriously want to get
serious, we can team up. Get a VPS or whatever, and we're in like
Flynn :)

:Den

--
The sovereign cure for worry is prayer.
William James

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 11:00 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:

If you have the venture capital, I have the Chutzpah. :)

Or, to quote a totally wicked and way underrated 80's flick:

If you bring the dip, I'll bring the chips.

Seriously tho, I hear you. Let's get competitive, just for kicks.

:Den

Den,
how come everyone in the coldfusion community is Jewish? haha my best
friend and business partner is part of the tribe. ya i've thought alot
about this actually, thought about what framework, how to integrate alot of
other already present projects to arrouse a few others in the community, aka
blog.cfc , ray, chris, mike etc etc i just know that alot of times one of
the determining factors is coldfusion like .net developers by nature have
their own box of goodies , where as php throw everything into a community
box. Where CFers claim to get paid for there work, and php work ends up all
in india, so i've heard the claim. but my point is i have plenty of indian
friends that are CFers. I do have to say that drupals sort of extensible
content types, and base core functionality are definitly something to
target. lets face it, there are some unique functionalities out there, but
there are some very core functionalities forums,blogs,social profiles,
that all should all fit directly into a cf community. that way the
extensiblity of these core functionalities instead of from stratch starts,
or goodie box starts. i'm all about universal intelligence, not about
proprietory knowledge. i know poliferating a community with intellegence
will inter make my life fruitful. i'm so down!

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology-Michael-Dinowitz/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
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Re: Web Programming Cert


I could cover the cost of a VPS.

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 2:59 AM, denstar valliants...@gmail.com wrote:


no i hear ya i had never heard that word before!  but i'm down to cover  
version control hosting,  using this thread forever might get redundent to haha 
but let me know what to do next i have the trigger in my hand 

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 11:26 PM, Sean Corfield wrote:

Yup, I'll second that. If you contribute to an open source project,
you have a traceable footprint on the 'net and your capabilities can
be examined. When I'm an employer interviewing people, I Google them
to see what they've done publicly...

Rut-roh.

Look man, I can explain! I had been drinking, you see, and the
re-factor seemed like a really good idea, you know?

Heh. These new deals, where you get cred for answering questions
and whatnot are interesting too.

Feels sorta like whoring tho. I'm enough of a whore at my day job.

I don't do what I do to score points. Not /those/ kinds of points.
I'm at a whole 'nuther level. :)

LOL. Ah yeah.

Besides being a great place to say, look what was done, open source
projects are a great place to say so that's how it was done. The
cleaner and clearer and more organized you can be, the better.

Not just because it looks good, but because things actually function
better that way. It's easier for people to contribute, etc.. Open
source teaches a lot, it's like the cyber street. You can lean stuff
you'd never learn elsewhere, but you can also die out there.

Some dude had this funny view of open source: that it was survival of
the fittest, and a battle of sorts. If people doing the same stuff
don't want to team up, crush them.
And I can see that side of open source too, but it seems a sad perspective.

Although crush them just sounds freaking fun, doesn't it?

Anyways, I guess I think that it's pretty cool that people can be
judged by their work so easy these days. That's something that always
pissed me off growing up- how hard that was to do, when it seemed so
logical. Probably always be a good bit of who you know tho, as
that's sorta fundamental.

Eh. Anywhoo, I'll wind up this winding missive by saying how stoked I
am that there are open source CFML engines that are freaking sweet.
It at least provides the potential of millions of contributors, which
closed source simply cannot. Yes, I said potential.
I don't care that currently there may be only two... potential is power.

Maybe.

LOL

:D3N

--
The sway of alcohol over mankind is unquestionably due to its power to
stimulate the mystical faculties of human nature, usually crushed to
earth by the cold facts and dry criticisms of the sober hour.
William James

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Re: Web Programming Cert

Rut-roh.

Look man, I can explain! I had been drinking, you see, and the
re-factor seemed like a really good idea, you know?

Heh. These new deals, where you get cred for answering questions
and whatnot are interesting too.

Feels sorta like whoring tho. I'm enough of a whore at my day job.

I don't do what I do to score points. Not /those/ kinds of points.
I'm at a whole 'nuther level. :)

LOL. Ah yeah.

Besides being a great place to say, look what was done, open source
projects are a great place to say so that's how it was done. The
cleaner and clearer and more organized you can be, the better.

Although crush them just sounds freaking fun, doesn't it?

Maybe.

LOL

:D3N

Den,
i totally hear you, so lets talk about starting i wanna do it , with the
full functionalites that cf has to offer. agree upon a framework to start?
Make a site to propose the idea to the rest of the community? make that site
the beginnings of the entire project, and the communication portal? creating a
discussion board would be were i likely would think a good place to start, and
then generating a proposal form there

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

Sounds swell. Guess we'd need a name, neh? :)

My view of open source results in wanting buy-in-ness more than
crush them-ness... Framework be a fighting word. :) Not sure
how to tackle that other than supporting them all (at least
potentially).

Which is why we'd need a solid way to test all the different stuff.
Which is why I taped together cfdistro (a deal that tests and builds
and stuff).

Sorta why I did it, at least. :)

Yes, fer sure a name. Maybe some scope.

I was calling mine shendub, because it is going to be like github
but awesomer (and not just because it's in CFML :]), but I like the
idea of a pro-learning deal like you were talking about.

Heh. Might as well make it a moodle killer too. :]

There I go again, getting all violent. =)

:Den

--
There is an organic affinity between joyousness and tenderness, and
their companionship in the saintly life need in no way occasion
surprise.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 1:57 AM, Carey Duryea wrote:
Den,
i totally hear you, so lets talk about starting i wanna do it , with the
full functionalites that cf has to offer. agree upon a framework to start?
Make a site to propose the idea to the rest of the community? make that site
the beginnings of the entire project, and the communication portal? creating
a discussion board would be were i likely would think a good place to start,
and then generating a proposal for

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-06 Thread Casey Dougall

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 7:23 PM, Carey Duryea ca...@keepingitgreen.netwrote:

I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

i'm thinking you should go to the library first before you spend hundreds
of dollars and check out any number of php books, PHP 6 Fast and Easy Web
Development is one . this book you can buy used on amazon for 20 bucks,
i've had it check out at the local library for sixteen consecutive weeks.
no one puts a hold on the book, i keep it for a while. yours your public
library first! and you know if the library doesn't have the book you can
suggest them to get it, they will buy it and you cah check it out.

My 2 cents...

I had a Ex Girlfriend do one of those University of Phoenix web development
programs. While the professor comes up with a course outline with
assignments and grades, you still do all of your learning directly from the
book.

I'm in firm believe that level 1 classes in any field could be learned on
your own, read the book and follow the examples. When you have a solid
understanding of basics, look to see where you can gain additional knowledge
on that topic to reach the next level.

I love safari books online, pick and choose the subjects you are interested
in, read and follow examples along the way. Just make sure you actually
write out each script yourself, don't copy and paste as you won't learn how
to write code that way.

http://safaribooksonline.com/Corporate/Index/

It's not a degree, or cert. but it does exactly the same thing for learning
aspect for anything you would learn in 101 courses, you always have people
around on message lists and forums that can assist when you run into
problems.

I've found In the end, work experience makes the biggest impact on your
career. unless you are going to go for a Bachelor's Degree or something in
higher education, you are better off getting into the work force as quickly
as possible in the field you enjoy.

If you have a solid understanding with the basics, you can always offer your
services as an intern in a web development firm, and these firms will help
you gain additional experience that will go way beyond what this Web
Programming Certificate provides.

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-06 Thread Roger Austin

Sean Corfield seancorfi...@gmail.com wrote:
A certificate doesn't say zip about whether you can get work done. The
courses might be useful for the O.P. but they don't tell an employer
anything so the certificate itself is worthless, IMO.

As in most things, it depends. A certificate might not be worth the
paper and ink in reality, but it can be the difference between getting
in the door. Many hiring decisions are not made on reality, but on
perception.

Many corporate job search criteria are not set up by knowledgeable
people in the field. HR people do a lot of it and certifications are
one way they break ties. They can put your resume in play where it would
be in the reject pile otherwise. I would not discount them completely.
I have seen many job announcements with certifications as necessary
though most of them were in Microsoft based systems. (MS has made a lot
of money on certifications.)

It is also true that corporate organizations look for ways to show
differences between employees. Getting certified is measurable. (All
the MBAs love to measure stuff.) Getting a certification can get you
a raise or promotion in many places. Of course, many independent
developers probably have no use for certifications since they are
irrelevant in the real world.

I would encourage anyone to continue to take classes and even teach
them in your field. We have all benefited from the hard work people
put into teaching, books, blogs, user groups, etc.
--
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/roger-austin/8/a4/60
http://twitter.com/RogerTheGeek
http://www.misshunt.com/ Home of the Clean/Dirty Magnet
http://www.ncdevcon.com/ TACFUG 2010 Conference in North Carolina

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-06 Thread Gerald Guido

you don't have to be spoon feed this stuff for enormous amounts of money

There is a lot to be said for curriculum design, guided instruction and
formal training. I am not interested in debating the merits of autodidactism
and self guided learning as I am proponents of both BUT, a well designed
curriculum (not having looked that the curriculum of the ORLY courses) will
purposely guide you though the developmental steps you need to master a
course of study and/or develop a skill set. There are people who do *nothing
but* (i.e. built careers) figure out and research what the best ways for
education to be delivered. Though, like all fields, this best way is hotly
contested. I have formal training in Higher Ed. education and work with
people in the field so I have been exposed to this quite a bit. (Hey look! I
am using my education).

A good example of guided instruction are the Lynda.com tutes. They guide you
though the subject matter step by step with each step building on the
knowledge and skill developed in the previous step to guide you in
developing a solid understanding of the material.

The one thing that you get from mentorship (education being
institutionalized mentorship) that you can't get from self directed learning
is not the the how to do something, but the why you should do things a
certain way. Basically you can learn from the mistakes that other people
have made. A lot of times the people who teach have already made the common
mistakes and can guide you thought the pitfalls commonly made in ones
developmental path. Though there is a lot to be said for screwing up on ones
own.

You learn by doing so there is something to be said for doing homework. So
in that respect this would be good way to go for some people..

My $0.02 and worth every penny.

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 7:25 PM, Carey Duryea ca...@keepingitgreen.netwrote:

I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

you don't have to be spoon feed this stuff for enormous amounts of money

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-06 Thread Gerald Guido

On a practical note. I cannot say enough good things about the free courses
offered by the Stanford Engineering Everywhere program

http://see.stanford.edu/see/courses.aspx

The Programming methodology course is a fantastic place to start learning
programming.
http://see.stanford.edu/see/courseinfo.aspx?coll=824a47e1-135f-4508-a5aa-866adcae

You get all the course materials (sans the hard copy books) , home work
assingments etc. and all the lectures are all on video. Plus you get to
learn Java from an engineer from Google.

Good stuff.

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 9:49 AM, Gerald Guido gerald.gu...@gmail.com wrote:

you don't have to be spoon feed this stuff for enormous amounts of money

A good example of guided instruction are the Lynda.com tutes. They guide
you though the subject matter step by step with each step building on the
knowledge and skill developed in the previous step to guide you in
developing a solid understanding of the material.

You learn by doing so there is something to be said for doing homework. So
in that respect this would be good way to go for some people..

My $0.02 and worth every penny.

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 7:25 PM, Carey Duryea ca...@keepingitgreen.netwrote:

I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

you don't have to be spoon feed this stuff for enormous amounts of money

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert


I could cover the cost of a VPS.

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 2:59 AM, denstar valliants...@gmail.com wrote:


no i hear ya i had never heard that word before!  but i'm down to cover  
version control hosting,  using this thread forever might get redundent to haha 
but let me know what to do next i have the trigger in my hand 

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

Sounds swell. Guess we'd need a name, neh? :)

My view of open source results in wanting buy-in-ness more than
crush them-ness... Framework be a fighting word. :) Not sure
how to tackle that other than supporting them all (at least
potentially).

Which is why we'd need a solid way to test all the different stuff.
Which is why I taped together cfdistro (a deal that tests and builds
and stuff).

Sorta why I did it, at least. :)

Yes, fer sure a name. Maybe some scope.

I was calling mine shendub, because it is going to be like github
but awesomer (and not just because it's in CFML :]), but I like the
idea of a pro-learning deal like you were talking about.

Heh. Might as well make it a moodle killer too. :]

There I go again, getting all violent. =)

:Den

--
There is an organic affinity between joyousness and tenderness, and
their companionship in the saintly life need in no way occasion
surprise.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 1:57 AM, Carey Duryea wrote:
Den,
i totally hear you, so lets talk about starting i wanna do it ,
with the full functionalites that cf has to offer. agree upon a
framework to start? Make a site to propose the idea to the rest of
the community? make that site the beginnings of the entire project,
and the communication portal? creating a discussion board would be
were i likely would think a good place to start, and then generating
a proposal
for

i hear ya about frameworks being a fighting word, everyone sort of has there
preference and basically there own set of goodies that relate to certain frame
works. i woudl think going with one of the more popular ones would be good.
what do you think would be the most widely attractive framework?

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

Keeping in mind that the most widely attractive framework might not be
the best fit, probably FW/1 or maybe ColdBox or CFWheels. People seem
hyped for 'em.

And they're swell! They do their jobs well.

Personally, I like the whole XML deal MG has. I don't leverage it
right, at all, but it is a powerful concept (and one that I think is
especially suited to framework use).

I've already promised some actionpacks for MG, so that's going to
happen regardless, but back when I first started with MG
actionpacks, I realized that it would be really easy to not tie
anyone into MG itself. There's just a MG specific XML file for when
you plug into MG. I use ColdSpring for configuring most things, and
they can all leverage that, so that part's cool (unless someone wants
to use LightWire- oh noes, it never ends! ;]).

Personally I think it would be nothing but good to support as many
frameworks as we possibly can. Replete with examples and docs and
whatnot. That would be worth more than the sum of the parts, if that
makes sense.

A problem I have, is that I see everything relating. And thus I see
ways of working smarter, vs. harder, *everywhere*. I almost have a
compulsion to take the waste from one process and turn it into the
food for another. The problem is, everywhere is a large area to
cover.

Well, /one/ of the problems with seeing /anything/ *everywhere*, obviously. :)

I think most of what I see is evolution, so I'm not too worried- if I
don't do it, someone will. :)

Eventually.

:Den

--
There must be something solemn, serious, and tender about any attitude
which we denominate religious. If glad, it must not grin or snicker;
if sad, it must not scream or curse.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 2:29 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:

i hear ya about frameworks being a fighting word, everyone sort of has there
preference and basically there own set of goodies that relate to certain
frame works. i woudl think going with one of the more popular ones would be
good.
what do you think would be the most widely attractive framework

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Re: Web Programming Cert

Keeping in mind that the most widely attractive framework might not
be
the best fit, probably FW/1 or maybe ColdBox or CFWheels. People
seem
hyped for 'em.

And they're swell! They do their jobs well.

Personally, I like the whole XML deal MG has. I don't leverage it
right, at all, but it is a powerful concept (and one that I think is
especially suited to framework use).

Well, /one/ of the problems with seeing /anything/ *everywhere*,
obviously. :)

I think most of what I see is evolution, so I'm not too worried- if I
don't do it, someone will. :)

Eventually.

:Den

--
There must be something solemn, serious, and tender about any
attitude
which we denominate religious. If glad, it must not grin or snicker;
if sad, it must not scream or curse.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 2:29 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:

i hear ya about frameworks being a fighting word, everyone sort of
has there preference and basically there own set of goodies that
relate to certain frame works. i woudl think going with one of the
more popular ones would be good.
what do you think would be the most widely attractive
framework

Den,
sometimes when you talk , i'm like whata reyou crazy hahha but
seriously i'm obviously not as familar with teh variety of frameworks as you
are, but i'm thinking , how in the world can you accomidate all of them. i
thought picking one would create some kind of uniformity in the community we
create

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Re: Web Programming Cert

Hehe. Sanity is *such* a fun concept. And I have a love/hate
relationship with labels, even if they're good ones, like sane.
So... Yeehaw! =)

If we were doing a framework, I'd say it would be important to be
uniform, and stick to the framework, but what we're talking about
(sorta- communication is another fun concept) is stuff that brings
people together, so picking something that splits people up isn't as
good as providing the means to unite them (by showing how the shared X
translates to the personal Y they're used to, sorta).

This is core functionality that people need in many arenas, so
requirements are something that should be considered carefully.

Like, I realized that if I did these custom tags I've been doing for
Railo in a certain manner, they're usable for Railo, OpenBD, and Adobe
CF. The same exact code!

It's harder than just writing for X and saying if you want this, you
need X, but I really dig the flexibility that extra work provides.
And the *adaptability*, even.

It should be really easy for people to adapt these things, as so many
questions are answered with it depends, ya know? And by taking
these adaptability needs in hand from the get-go -- by actually
adapting these things for various uses and environments -- we add more
usefulness without an equal increase in cost. Relatively. (Relativity
is an interesting concept too =]p.)

Another example is the CFML formatting stuff I began working on for
CFEclipse. I could have written it so it only worked inside Eclipse,
but I thought this is useful outside of Eclipse too. It was more
work to make it so, but I'm aiming to be useful, above all else, I
reckon. So it was worth it, to me.

Eh. Until we have brain linkage (or realize it's there already,
perhaps), these forms of communication will have to do.

Sorry so sloppy, so to speak. =)

:DeN

--
To be a real philosopher all that is necessary is to hate some one
else's type of thinking.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 6:41 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:
Den,
sometimes when you talk , i'm like whata reyou crazy hahha but
seriously i'm obviously not as familar with teh variety of frameworks as you
are, but i'm thinking , how in the world can you accomidate all of them. i
thought picking one would create some kind of uniformity in the community we
create

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Re: Web Programming Cert

Den,
thats cool i used to use cfeclipse untill coldfusion builder came out and i
heard cfeclipse wasn't suppported or wasnt going to be supported anymore. But
you sound like you have alot more experience then i do. i freaking built one
site in coldfusion. blankdealer.com and i'm dying for more programming
expereience and i think this whole project would be a good focus for me. i
have read briefly about alot of the frameworks but more about coldfusion on
wheels, and fusebox just out of sheer curiousity really. i'm reading about
coldspring right now cause you mentioned it and i have never takin the time to
read about it. ya and your right this is a good place to communicate till we
get a site up of sorts taht would enable chat/communication of sorts. i wanna
integrate the ability to do many things but allow the simplicity to do the very
simplist as well. but i'm with you i always like the idea of being platform
inspecific, and things that had a applicatable to a broader audience of
everything! haha specificity is my word. to most levels of specificity the
usefulness of this community plumbing would be useful!

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Re: Web Programming Cert

A site for selling decks? Sweet! I was out skating yesterday for the
first time in like years. :) It looks good too. Nice work!

CFEclipse is still alive, and kick'n it, fer realz. :)

I've got plenty of experience, but sometimes that gets in the way, so
it shouldn't be valued /too/ much. Heh.

I'm as full of poop as the next person, so to speak. =)

Well... what do you want to start with? A kick-ass tracking system, perhaps?

:Den

--
To study the abnormal is the best way of understanding the normal.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 7:41 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:
...
Den,
thats cool i used to use cfeclipse untill coldfusion builder came out and i
heard cfeclipse wasn't suppported or wasnt going to be supported anymore.
But you sound like you have alot more experience then i do. i freaking built
one site in coldfusion. blankdealer.com and i'm dying for more programming
expereience and i think this whole project would be a good focus for me. i
have read briefly about alot of the frameworks but more about coldfusion on
wheels, and fusebox just out of sheer curiousity really. i'm reading about
coldspring right now cause you mentioned it and i have never takin the time
to read about it. ya and your right this is a good place to communicate till
we get a site up of sorts taht would enable chat/communication of sorts. i
wanna integrate the ability to do many things but allow the simplicity to do
the very simplist as well. but i'm with you i always like the idea of being
platform inspecific, and things that had a applicatable to a broader audience
of everything! haha specificity is my word. to most levels of specificity
the usefulness of this community plumbing would be useful!

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Re: Web Programming Cert


Den,
 What do you mean by tracking system?  Tracking what? hhahah i was thinking 
of creating a site to construct the community on at some point.  first develop 
some core functionalities, and then basically set up a voting api that people 
can vote sugguestins to be developed and have sort of a democratic state! like 
a true freaking community should be, POWER TO THE POEPLE! 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

you don't have to be spoon feed this stuff for enormous amounts of money

You learn by doing so there is something to be said for doing homework. So
in that respect this would be good way to go for some people..

My $0.02 and worth every penny.

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 7:25 PM, Carey Duryea ca...@keepingitgreen.netwrote:

i thought this was an interesting reply! for sure, i just found going to
community colleges i was being taught by someone who had no practical street
knowledge about being creative with techologies or anything related to the
teachings. sort of a administer of the textbook is all they were. Eitehr way i
appreciate the education i got. i just sort of pick up so much more from
someone who has been on the grind with the material in real use!

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Re: Web Programming Cert


YEAH!  PEEP POWERS!  =)

A tracker to track the tracker, maybe? :)

I'm down for whatever.

What would you call such a site?  What would the URL be?

:Den

-- 
Truth lives, in fact, for the most part on a credit system. Our
thoughts and beliefs pass, so long as nothing challenges them, just as
bank-notes pass so long as nobody refuses them.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Carey  Duryea wrote:

 Den,
     What do you mean by tracking system?  Tracking what? hhahah i was 
 thinking of creating a site to construct the community on at some point.  
 first develop some core functionalities, and then basically set up a voting 
 api that people can vote sugguestins to be developed and have sort of a 
 democratic state! like a true freaking community should be, POWER TO THE 
 POEPLE!

 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

YEAH! PEEP POWERS! =)

A tracker to track the tracker, maybe? :)

I'm down for whatever.

What would you call such a site? What would the URL be?

:Den

--
Truth lives, in fact, for the most part on a credit system. Our
thoughts and beliefs pass, so long as nothing challenges them, just
as
bank-notes pass so long as nobody refuses them.
William James

On Thu, May 6, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:

Den,
What do you mean by tracking system? Tracking what? hhahah i
was thinking of creating a site to construct the community on at some
point. first develop some core functionalities, and then basically
set up a voting api that people can vote sugguestins to be developed
and have sort of a democratic state! like a true freaking community
should be, POWER TO THE POEPLE!

i need a tracker to track the track of the tracker of what the heck you are
talking about sometimes! hahaha , keyword rich. or brand building name. i
like mathmatical names for sure. Automaton, thats why i like the named
coldfusion in the first place , i read evertyhing there was about the failed
conclusion of coldfusion in relation to power production and stuff. i love
math names and automation

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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-05 Thread Kris Sisk


I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

It mostly looks good, but there's a Perl class in there. Don't get me wrong, I 
know Perl, I like Perl, and I write a whole lot of scripts for my own personal 
use in Perl. I even cut my web development teeth on a chat room written in 
Perl, but who uses it for web programming anymore? 

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Re: Web Programming Cert


I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

i'm thinking you should go to the library first before you spend hundreds of 
dollars and check out any number of php books,  PHP 6 Fast and Easy Web 
Development  is one . this book you can buy used on amazon for 20 bucks, i've 
had it check out at the local library for sixteen consecutive weeks.  no one 
puts a hold on the book, i keep it for a while.  yours your public library 
first! and you know if the library doesn't have the book  you can sugguest them 
to get it, they will buy it and you cah check it out.  

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Re: Web Programming Cert


I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

you don't have to be spoon feed this stuff for enormous amounts of money 

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Re: Web Programming Cert


I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php

i'm thinking you should go to the library first before you spend hundreds of 
dollars and check out any number of php books,  PHP 6 Fast and Easy Web 
Development  is one . this book you can buy used on amazon for 20 bucks, i've 
had it check out at the local library for sixteen consecutive weeks.  no one 
puts a hold on the book, i keep it for a while.  yours your public library 
first! and you know if the library doesn't have the book  you can sugguest them 
to get it, they will buy it and you cah check it out.  

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RE: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-05 Thread Justin Scott


 i'm thinking you should go to the library first
 before you spend hundreds of dollars and check

I checked out some books at the library isn't nearly as attractive as
Earned Web Programming Certificate from The University of Illinois on your
resume.  Hitting the library may show some initiative, but employers need to
know you can get work done too.


-Justin



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Re: Web Programming Cert


I'm thinking that this might be a good deal

http://www.oreillyschool.com/certificates/web-programming.php


Good point!!!  i guess i was looking at it from my perspective i only 
develop for my own entrepreneurial endeavors.  i have never been a guy of 
creditials though cause of always been a busniness owner, i was looking into 
getting a coldfusion cert. through a adobe certified company.  i forget what 
the name of it was though.  i was looking for classes in php and coldfusion, 
and i pretty much called around and was trying to find the most interactive 
classes online i could find and to be honest with tyou the fact that this place 
has a sandbox to actively work with the concepts you learn is a really big 
selling point. i looked at the site pretty thoughly. do you know anything about 
coldfusion certs?

links that relate 
https://store1.adobe.com/cfusion/store/html/index.cfm?event=displayProductcategoryOID=1579608store=OLS-US#

http://adobe.knowledge.elementk.com/catalog/Syllabus.jsp?productId=85139typeId=1
http://adobe.knowledge.elementk.com/catalog/Syllabus.jsp?productId=4800typeId=1
 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-05 Thread Sean Corfield


On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 5:04 PM, Justin Scott
jscott-li...@gravityfree.com wrote:
 I checked out some books at the library isn't nearly as attractive as
 Earned Web Programming Certificate from The University of Illinois on your
 resume.  Hitting the library may show some initiative, but employers need to
 know you can get work done too.

A certificate doesn't say zip about whether you can get work done. The
courses might be useful for the O.P. but they don't tell an employer
anything so the certificate itself is worthless, IMO.

I looked over the syllabus and it's very basic stuff. However, I'd
certainly love every CFer to take the Unix / Apache portions of these
O'Reilly courses!
-- 
Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN
Railo Technologies, Inc. -- http://getrailo.com/
An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/

If you're not annoying somebody, you're not really alive.
-- Margaret Atwoo

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Re: Web Programming Cert


i'm reading about apache right now , trying to figure out all this load 
balancing stuff.  i really do wish though that there were more interactive 
lessons out there, seems like teaching in general has not caught up with the 
capability that these new technologies actually can produce!  interactive, 
sandbox, self paced, many different learning style options, real time examples. 
  i don't know how many times i read about a new concept and i never hear how 
the concept is used in real life, practicality!  practical experience give me! 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-05 Thread denstar


On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 10:11 PM, Sean Corfield wrote:
...
 I looked over the syllabus and it's very basic stuff. However, I'd
 certainly love every CFer to take the Unix / Apache portions of these
 O'Reilly courses!

Hey, I'll teach that for $50 bucks less!

I could probably print up a nice certificate, and perhaps come up with
a respectable sounding place of issue, too.

:)p

I am *so* kidding.  I think the underselling I do quite often, is
hurtful to the profession.  It's hard to value stuff that's easy to
do tho.

-- 
The hell to be endured hereafter, of which theology tells, is no worse
than the hell we make for ourselves in this world by habitually
fashioned our characters in the wrong way.
William James

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Re: Web Programming Cert


i was going to say, One really good way to show a potiential employer your 
skill and your ability to get things done, is contribute to open source 
projects.  if you contribute things to open source that show your skills 
everyone appreciates you!  and it will show an employer that you are sort of 
active no matter if your on the clock or off it, shows ambition and drive for 
sure.  i hire developers and that would be a big hint for me.  CONTRIBUTE! you 
know how bad we need it in the coldfusion community.  Where is our Drupal, 
Where is our Joomla, Our Oscommerce, Our Wordpress!!!  i don't wanna be the one 
that sits around and argues what language is better, i would like to 
contribute.  i would love to start a project that would compete with these 
Giant php communites! 

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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-05 Thread denstar

If you have the venture capital, I have the Chutzpah. :)

Or, to quote a totally wicked and way underrated 80's flick:

If you bring the dip, I'll bring the chips.

Seriously tho, I hear you. Let's get competitive, just for kicks.

:Den

--
Turkish waiter: One Istanbul Express.
Woody Wilkins: Yes. A double.
Turkish waiter: [suprised] A double? Nobody orders the double, sir!
Woody Wilkins: Okay. Make it a triple.

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 10:25 PM, Carey Duryea wrote:

i was going to say, One really good way to show a potiential employer your
skill and your ability to get things done, is contribute to open source
projects. if you contribute things to open source that show your skills
everyone appreciates you! and it will show an employer that you are sort of
active no matter if your on the clock or off it, shows ambition and drive for
sure. i hire developers and that would be a big hint for me. CONTRIBUTE!
you know how bad we need it in the coldfusion community. Where is our
Drupal, Where is our Joomla, Our Oscommerce, Our Wordpress!!! i don't wanna
be the one that sits around and argues what language is better, i would like
to contribute. i would love to start a project that would compete with these
Giant php communites!

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Re: Web Programming Cert

If you have the venture capital, I have the Chutzpah. :)

Or, to quote a totally wicked and way underrated 80's flick:

If you bring the dip, I'll bring the chips.

Seriously tho, I hear you. Let's get competitive, just for kicks.

:Den

Den,
how come everyone in the coldfusion community is Jewish? haha my best friend
and business partner is part of the tribe. ya i've thought alot about this
actually, thought about what framework, how to integrate alot of other already
present projects to arrouse a few others in the community, aka blog.cfc , ray,
chris, mike etc etc i just know that alot of times one of the determining
factors is coldfusion like .net developers by nature have their own box of
goodies , where as php throw everything into a community box. Where CFers claim
to get paid for there work, and php work ends up all in india, so i've heard
the claim. but my point is i have plenty of indian friends that are CFers. I
do have to say that drupals sort of extensible content types, and base core
functionality are definitly something to target. lets face it, there are some
unique functionalities out there, but there are some very core functionalities
forums,blogs,social profiles, that all should all fit directly into a cf
community. that way the extensiblity of these core functionalities instead of
from stratch starts, or goodie box starts. i'm all about universal
intelligence, not about proprietory knowledge. i know poliferating a community
with intellegence will inter make my life fruitful. i'm so down!

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert

2010-05-05 Thread Sean Corfield


Yup, I'll second that. If you contribute to an open source project,
you have a traceable footprint on the 'net and your capabilities can
be examined. When I'm an employer interviewing people, I Google them
to see what they've done publicly...

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 9:25 PM, Carey  Duryea ca...@keepingitgreen.net wrote:
 i was going to say, One really good way to show a potiential employer your 
 skill and your ability to get things done, is contribute to open source 
 projects.

~|
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Re: Web Programming Cert