Re: Reason for GPS problems found!
Did openmoko said that they will not gonna solve this?, I have only eared that they are studying the BEST way to solve this, so please don't FUD about totally false no go. Even the sd+glamo is not bloking to have some more better graphics than mobile media (not awesome but decent at last) Please be more gently with people that are doing their best to let you know this kind of bugs, the process to resolve it and finally the resolution they will decide more transparently than any hardware factory has never done. Regards PD.-OM hardware team, When our neos arrive at Bacelona count with us to any test you need to be done --- El mié, 16/7/08, Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Reason for GPS problems found! Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: miércoles, 16 julio, 2008 8:50 Its really pretty important that the communication on this issue *not* diverge into hate and vitriol towards customers, because to those who are observing the OpenMoko project - not participating - the SD+GPS testing issue is a *huge* screw up. No, the SD+GPS issue is a bug. Context:SD+Glamo == No go. SD+GPS == No go. How many GTA02's have been shipped before this problem was discovered? How much time wasted trying to get GPS functioning so that development can continue? Admittedly a somewhat nasty bug, but nothing extraordinary. If I can't use SD+GPS, its a no-brainer: Freerunner is no longer qualified for my project. Having spent a year on OpenMoko, thats nasty. I was willing to give the SD+Glamo issue a slide, but .. ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: In the press
+ 1 to the clasification, but a visual discrimination about uptodate/outdated/work in progress in this pages will be very useful too. --- El mié, 16/7/08, BrendaWang [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: BrendaWang [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: In the press Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: miércoles, 16 julio, 2008 10:25 How about to use the Openmoko Index page. This page collect every topic of Wiki. And depend on the page's content, pages of wiki will classify into right category. But now , Software part (http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko_Wiki_Official_Index_Page#Software) and Technical part , might be not clear enough( http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko_Wiki_Official_Index_Page#Technical) , but in the future, I will make them become more easy to find. For example, just like this Part I Choose your software develop tool Development Environment For developer Part II Coding and compile (OE, Toolchain.) Part III Running your program (Emulation .) Part IV Program sharing Part V Install Part VI Tools used in Openmoko Scott Derrick ??: In my opinion , the Wiki sucks Very difficult to find any useful information. Scott Vinc Duran wrote: I think it's accurate. On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 10:41 PM, Matt Joyce [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I found this yesterday, thought it was quite an ok article. http://arstechnica.com/reviews/os/open-moko-software.ars This stood out for me *The tangled pile of mostly outdated and incomplete documentation at the OpenMoko wiki*... Is this an accurate evaluation of the wiki ? If so, what can we do to fix it up, how do we identify old content and schedule it for updating? Matt ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org mailto:community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ¿No te gusta tu dirección de correo? Consigue una que te guste de verdad - millones de direcciones de correo disponibles en Yahoo! http://es.docs.yahoo.com/mail/nueva_direccion.html ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Reason for GPS problems found!
What not to try the soldering or try to shield the sd? both? --- El mar, 15/7/08, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Reason for GPS problems found! Para: community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Crane, Matthew [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: martes, 15 julio, 2008 4:05 wrong! won't help, don't try! /j___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPS
not hate just pure and unhealthy insane envy --- El lun, 14/7/08, arne anka [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: arne anka [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: GPS Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: lunes, 14 julio, 2008 7:22 Today I powered up my gps the first time and got a fix after 80 seconds. I was on a hill in a small village outside in a garden under a apple tree and the Freerunner was standing upright. Then I rebooted it and got an other fix in 80 seconds again. I've been using agps-gui. Much better than I expected. The Freerunner did see 5 satellites the first time, 3 the second time. i am afraid, most people on this list will hate you now :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Pulster DHL and Correos Spain
--- El vie, 11/7/08, Christoph Pulster [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Anyone who placed a order with us and likes to now the status of it, please feel free to contact me. You have the right to get on my nerves with a lot of emails. or even before to place that order :),I know because I'm one those doubts mail bombers, holy patience , I got him in my contact list as Cristoph Zen Pulster. Chris www.pulster.de OpenmokoShop.de ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: robotics anyone?
When I recive the phone I will try to run on it a RTAI kernel and some program compiled with www.beremiz.org, its automation not strickly robotics but we can share kwnolege and experience --- El vie, 11/7/08, andres [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: andres [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: robotics anyone? Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: viernes, 11 julio, 2008 9:09 Hi, Sorry to be a little OT but It looks like a dream FreeRunner board as a robotic platform for $100 Anybody doing anything related?___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: robotics anyone?
I have misunderstood andres, I though Freerruner board is a Naked phone main board. as B sais, The debug board is an extension of the phone without a processor. No processor, no running program, no robotics. --- El vie, 11/7/08, B [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: B [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: robotics anyone? Para: community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: viernes, 11 julio, 2008 10:33 The 99$ debug board is not the same as the phone internals. It is an interface board for doing low level hardware debugging on the phone. AFAIK the phone is not available as a board only, so you're still looking at 399 (or 369 in a 10-pack) for your robotics platform. andres wrote: Hi, Sorry to be a little OT but It looks like a dream FreeRunner board as a robotic platform for $100 Anybody doing anything related? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 850 sold out, 900 delayed, connection?
--- El sáb, 12/7/08, Alexander Frøyseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Alexander Frøyseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: 850 sold out, 900 delayed, connection? Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: sábado, 12 julio, 2008 12:22 Timo Jyrinki skrev: 2008/7/11 Alexander Frøyseth [EMAIL PROTECTED]: If that so Why dont they sell from their own site first? Well, to this one I had a guess that since there were European resellers in the first place but openmoko.com itself does not have any places in Europe, it was fastest and cheapest for the first customers to deliver 900 phones to the European market as soon as possible via the resellers. On the other hand at first there were no US resellers so it was best to sell 850 phones via the direct openmoko.com shop as they can quite cheaply post them to US. Just guesses, but I don't think there is any conspiracy anywhere :) -Timo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community You are a part of it, I knew it :) Sure, I have seen him taking breakfast with Steve Works, Bill Doors and a very suspicious pink flying monkey. All is a maneuver to make us look in other way mean while iphone 3G is launched. By the way, anyone can confirm that the iphone doesn't have way to forward a sms message XD __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Iberia Group list wiki page
Hi all We are coordinating a Spain-Portugal order of Freerunners via pulster.com here is the wiki page http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/IberiaGroupSale with sales/shippment conditions. It may be interesting for all of you that doesn't have enough people to create a 10 pack group, we are not multiple of 10 dependant ;) so any one in Spain interested please visit the page and then contact one of the coordinators. I will update the wiki often so don't forget to visit it before ask , maybe the answers is almost there :) Regards David __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Problem with QEMU and MokoMakefile
what make instruction did you use? It begins like the ASU image file but as you notice I have no seen this initial screen before. --- El jue, 10/7/08, Shawn Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Shawn Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Problem with QEMU and MokoMakefile Para: OM-Community community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: jueves, 10 julio, 2008 3:32 I've been wanting to test out the UI that is shown on the wiki and software reviews around the net. Upon building (make qemu) and letting it complete I got a very different UI that what I expected. Here's a couple of screenshots: http://projektenterprises.com/mokoshots/ Any ideas as to why I am getting this UI instead of the one I've seen across the web, I'm sure I had to have messed up along the way somewhere. -Shawn T.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Group Sale in Spain
Hi methril, after some mail Jose Luis Perez Diez and I concluded that will be cheaper to buy the neo through pulster than importing directly from the USA. So that's why we didn't make any mailing advice, or going forward with the 10 pack approach. Feel free to e-mail us to discuss about it or about any other issue. I will be glad (and sure Jose Luis too) to hear from you Regards --- El jue, 3/7/08, Rafael Campos [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Rafael Campos [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Group Sale in Spain Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: jueves, 3 julio, 2008 12:07 Hello to all the Spanish guys in the mailing list. I received some mails from other guys interested in the FreeRunner asking questions about it. The most popular is: it's going to be translated to Spanish? or the other one (in all the places): How much is the battery life? :D I'm asking that question, because in the GroupSales in the wiki, we are some of us that want a FreeRunner and we didn't send e-mail to each other to asking the method, address, meeting for the receivement, the organization, and maybe with more people interested in the Freerunner, bought somo of thems and keep in Spain to cheaper taxes and delivery costs. I Hope to see any response (from spanish guys) Waiting your comments, -- ___ Rafael Campos o0 Methril 0o___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OEM market,any thoughts about that??
I'm curious about If when released, if a volunteer makes a detailed photoguide of where/what/for what/how about the hardware. Can count with openmoko help? It's recommended to no distribute those kinds of docs? or better do it under openmoko supervision? Only to talk about it, meanwhile the freerunner arrives, ... waiter, another beer, please. --- El mar, 17/6/08, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: OEM market,any thoughts about that?? Para: community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: martes, 17 junio, 2008 11:51 Am Mo 16. Juni 2008 schrieb Al Johnson: On Sunday 15 June 2008, Joerg Reisenweber wrote: Am Sa 14. Juni 2008 schrieb steve: A big percentage of requests I get are for this, however, they always want some hardware twist. They don't exactly know our hw, I guess (e.g it's not commonly known we have a low-voltage-RS232, I2C, and separate power feed on internal debug-con / testpoints). Also some mods on hw are quite easy to accomplish, either for us or for them. I suggest, you forward their requests to me, and I'll have a look at it and see what's feasible EE-side with reasonable effort/cost. Would be a pity to send them away, just because we didn't check what we can do for them, no? cheers jOERG Is there any documentation available for these interfaces? They may be a good alternative to USB for adding extra buttons, sensors or whatever in alternative cases. The debugcon should be kinda documented in the wiki IIRC. Most of the testpoints are documented right on the board by a printing. But no, I don't think there is a complete comprehensive doc yet. Maybe if I really don't know how to kill my time eventually... ;-) Anyway you're wellcome to ask. I'm not allowed to publish schematics, but I shall answer _every_ reasonable question regarding hardware. cheers jOERG___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use forum? - Use OESF.org forum
I then I got another source of knowlege/comunication to add to the repository. Bookmarked! --- El mar, 17/6/08, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Why not use forum? - Use OESF.org forum Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: martes, 17 junio, 2008 11:42 Hi! I was wondering - why are we not using forum for community? It's much better to view, you can subscribe and unsubscribe to the topics you want and etc. I have been notet that a new (Sub-)Forum has been created: http://www.oesf.org/forum/index.php?showforum=161 OESF is one of the largest fora systems and was initially a Zaurus User Group. But now it covers everything around embedded/mobile/ handheld Linux devices including embedded Debian, Android, OpenBSD, OpenZaurus... So, Openmoko also fits into this environment with some 8000 subscribers. Nikolaus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Storage Idea?
well maybe gta4 will hava a sata interface but This data is copy/pasted from vendor page Power Consumption: Spin-up 2.5 Seeking 1.4 Reading 1.4 Writing 1.4 Active Idle 0.55 Low Power Idle 0.45 Standby 0.15 Sleep 0.10 if this data is watts then at 3,3 volts 0,10/3,3 then 30,30 mA even when its in sleep mode so 1200mA/h the phone with almost anythig off, (gsm, wifi,screen,processor... all) will least at sleep mode no more than 40 h you may think not bad but this is very very far away from the Battery life (Approximation/Ideal Target) Standby time 150-200 Hrs in the wiki gta02 description. this is only in sleep mode. in working mode 1.4+2.5= 3.9W then 3.9/3,3=1182 mA so barely an hour working on battery at full charge and all off only hd working (forget about continuous use as swap, portable media player or any other intensive hd app ;), with the actual battery of course more powerful battery more time ) Another free estimation; if usb 2.0 seems to be 30MB/s at the most optimistic rate so 160 GBytes are about 160 * 1024/30=5461 seconds to be transfered out of the phone this about 1 hour and a half (1/2 hours more than battery duration without taking care about cpu/usb system power needs to do that operation. Here you can argue against justifing that is it's usb wired it can be also powered, but I will still think that is to much power consuption for a portable device,and 160 gigs is a lt of disk space aprox 420 chapters of mythbusters(more than twelve days continuous sesion) I think there will be more efficient power solutions to give future versions of OM phones a a lot of space , only thinking loud and with no experience at all only basic phisics maths applied I really thing is too much power comsuption for a movile solution but only guessing I'm not a hardware guy , --- El lun, 16/6/08, Samuel Melrose [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Samuel Melrose [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Storage Idea? Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: lunes, 16 junio, 2008 11:57 Hey, Was just looking through some pages, examining my iPod hardware, and I can across something interesting, the thing that powers the storage for the big, all powerful high storage devices. Well, atleast its ability to store 160GB... Not sure if anyone here already knows about this, but just thought it might be an interesting addition to one of the OpenMoko phones, although when it forks into several edditions as it looks quite expensive. But anyway, getting to it... The Toshiba 1.8 hard drive. Very small, MicroSATA interface up to ~600Mbps... And up to 160GB storage. Not sure if anyone would want that much storage for their phone, but I'm sure it might come in handy atleast for developers? Although I know MicroSD is up to about 32GB now and a lot cheaper... Will leave the link anyway, hope it comes in useful... http://www.toshibastorage.com/main.aspx?Path=StorageSolutions/1.8-inchHardDiskDrives Thank you, Samuel Melrose [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Why not use votation system?
good one, code committed to main stream distro? or bash code ? python script included in that offer? --- El dom, 15/6/08, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: RE: Why not use votation system? Para: 'List for Openmoko community discussion' community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: domingo, 15 junio, 2008 9:18 Could we weight votes by code committed. No code. No vote. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michele Renda Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2008 1:25 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Why not use votation system? Hi Steve I think I was a bit mis-understood. I didn't told that all the decisions must to be took with a votation system! If we would do so I think we will not have a phone, but a microwave. My idea was only: when Openmoko has to take a decision between two equivalent solution and WANT to know the opinions of the comunity to use a votation system. But only for opinion asked by OM, like it was for the audio jacket. And in every case must to be clear that also if the votation say choose A the final decision must to be tooken by OM, because you must to invest on it. I hope I clarified something :) steve wrote: The complexity of the decision is deeper than that. It involves cost, engineering budget, schedule, price, return on investment, parts availability. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brad Midgley Sent: Thursday, June 12, 2008 12:12 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Why not use votation system? Michele Do you want feature X or feature Y? you might need a table representing the cost and business feasibility of each feature. We've seen a lot more transparency on the 3g decision recently which reveals it to be more complicated than people thought. -- Brad ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Acceleration in our pockets
Hi Raster, Your are not wrong at all about resolutions maths and bus bottlenecks, I have learned a lot from your posts , and I'm very thankful for you effort to communicate this to us. Nevertheless I think you were wrong about the pessimistic approach, no decent video from sd . You have never said this explicit but some post destilate such idea(at the end of this message I have extract some of them) balrog have said it has pass over the 21 fps in 320x240 barrier (not clear if he had tried from sd yet) so maybe wrong is a strong word (I don't thing so, but you may find it offensive) but don't confuse it with lie that is really a strong word and I have never pretend to insinuate this. And again I was thinking loud, and I was think I have erase this sentence that have irritating you, again and again and again please accept my apologizes [...] with the glamo you need to be careful what you do and how you do it. if you can keep something entirely within the glamo - it should be ok. so things like uploaded pixmaps and then blitting them around is ok. video decode is another matter entirely. the glamo has an mpeg4 decoder on it - but we don't have any api to access that directly/sanely and just feed it an mpeg4 stream. any other codec has to be done on the cpu anyway and uploaded across the bus as yuv data.[...] [...]that is quite possible. 320x240 video would be sane possibly if the source is internal flash instead of SD or maybe 802.11.[...] [...]but the problem here is that xv does not provide a way to do this sanely (stream just mpeg4 data to x so it decodes in hardware). the graphics chip (glamo) can decode mpeg4 itself, but we dont have the time or resources to do this properly ourselves. you are free to do it yourself as we provide all the code, but you would need to reverse-engineer the graphics chip or hope that graphics documentation can be made public. right now you need an NDA to see the docs.[...] [...]what freerunner *IS* good at is nice high resolution still images. it is NOT good at motion (animation). that's possibly the simplest way i know to describe its graphics :) great for ebook and text reading. great for your high-res photos. don't expect a media-center out of it with swooshy bits and fanciness and video at wonderful quality and resolutions and framerates.[...] [...]see my other mail. [EMAIL PROTECTED] is not possible. off sd card about 19fps is the limit @ 320x240. 21fps if from internal flash. i did actual tests. mpeg4 video.[...] --- El vie, 13/6/08, Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Acceleration in our pockets Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED], List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: viernes, 13 junio, 2008 2:47 On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:22:30 + (GMT) David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: Hehehe definitively you have something to say :) oops I thought that I have erased this final this so unfortunate sentence so please accept my apologizes lets joy the fact that the glamo will not be a wasted chip it never was wasted, but it's not the ultimate solution to everything either. i'm still wondering where i was so wrong? --- El jue, 12/6/08, Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Acceleration in our pockets Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED], List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: jueves, 12 junio, 2008 6:58 On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:52:07 + (GMT) David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: nb - i codec only - and i also used mplayer at the time. mpeg1, mpeg2, not to mention a myriad of other codecs won't work there, and it still only producing qvga video. if you do follow prior threads on this, you will notice that i never covered the mp3 decode of the glamo. that's always possible, but as such to do well would need a generic codec-level api supporting it - like openmax. I copy paste an very interesting comment from balrog ,seems that I have become his(totally voluntary) mail list assistant ;) Rasterman. 352x288 25 fps. something to say? --Begin of comment--- # balrog Says: June 11, 2008 at 4:20 am Mikko: I hope we’ll eventually see more than just MPEG support on the Glamo (3D stuff etc). Regarding QVGA at this moment it’s a conjecture… and at this moment it’s confirmed. I’ve just tried QVGA and while the colours became a bit undersaturated and gamma seems to be too high, I got full 25fps playback both straight and with rotation, hw-scalled from 352×288 to 240×320 or 320×240. Unfortunately tslib seems to not have
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
+1 to Joerg, but don't worry a lot of this speculation garbage about Freerunner or succesors capabilities and what have to do and what not will die onces the freerunner is aviable and used by a miriad of volunters. Maybe will be another kind of speculation garbage but not this one :). The idea of a 7 segment liquid cristal screen as an usb lcd can be take in count for very critical battery applications that only need the hardware capabilites and some light feedback. --- El vie, 13/6/08, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!) Para: community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Chris Wright [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: viernes, 13 junio, 2008 9:52 Am Fr 13. Juni 2008 schrieb Chris Wright: Since the alternative to using QVGA is using VGA with a faster GPU and processor, One last time: ...OR USING VGA IN QVGA MODE WITH SAME PROCESSOR, AND SWITCH TO VGA WHENEVER YOU NEED THIS RESOLUTION. It's all about nothing else than just saving some 5 bucks on the screen (which probably will not apply whenever this comes to reality, because you have to buy QVGA-screens from antiquities collectors then), and the allegedly *better* (huh?) quality of QVGA when compared to a VGA in QVGA-mode. All of this are moot arguments!!! and this is a phone that runs on batteries, I'm inclined to encourage the use of QVGA on future Openmoko phones. And WTF is the rationale behind this??? You're suggesting we should use slower cpu for saving battery or what? Yeah our GTA04 will probably have 8bit cpu and a 7-segment display, but no screen at all, and 4000h of standby time. (btw: standby isn't related to cpu-power-consumption at all) I have a phone from 2002 with a battery that used to last a week; it annoys me to deal with much less than that. Don't ask what I'm annoyed of! Aaahrg, really sorry, but [ignore thread] now (last one of hw-dev leaving pointless discussion). /j___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
OEM market,any thoughts about that??
Only babbling wating to the Neo to come out ;) I work on a PLC manufacturer (well the corp. do a lot of other products but PLC are my little puppet) so I was thinking about the openness of this architecture, the need for processing power and flexibility of engineers making production machines an the need they have of communication , and I for my thoughts I have to confirm it with engineers of that the department about specs. but some PLC we propose the hardware is less powerful and less powerful I was thinking about adding an I/O interfaces (digital or analogical) I have seen it at my work distributed I/O interfaces with ethernet output and with rs232 serial output, both with and open standard protocol of PLC communication modbus, I thing there is some implementation on Linux in lgpl http://copyleft.free.fr/wordpress/index.php/libmodbus/; Think's I don't know, Neo is able to have an rj45 ethernet connection as see it as an standard ethernet network interface in kernel?. I have eared about an usb to rj45 adaptor, has been tested by any one?, serial connection is included in the debug board.and surelly the usb port included in the phone will do the trick with an rs232 usb convertor. but any one has treat it as a serial port?, can be both with a usb hub? neo has a lot of cool thing inside with a not bad price, I imagine than make a deal to openmoko inc to buy some mount naked neos , example buying in 100 packs or so to mount directly in a box after the rom is flashed with the desired configuration (an OM with graphics rippoff and the application compiled ) I have to madurate the part of the Who and how will program this solution: -the oem or - as full solution application included If first approach is taken, then to even think to enter in that market we must emulate in the neo some kind of PLC programing interface as they are used to work with, but even letting the door open to access it directly and they do on C directly but not OEM has this kind of knowledge well a has to been asked and redefined in my mind schema of things but all of this things will be unuseful if the nacked neo hardware part was unable to be posible or more expensive than buy a mounted neo. or any other technical constraint that this marketing guy has ignored. __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Acceleration in our pockets
I copy paste an very interesting comment from balrog ,seems that I have become his(totally voluntary) mail list assistant ;) Rasterman. 352x288 25 fps. something to say? --Begin of comment--- # balrog Says: June 11, 2008 at 4:20 am Mikko: I hope we’ll eventually see more than just MPEG support on the Glamo (3D stuff etc). Regarding QVGA at this moment it’s a conjecture… and at this moment it’s confirmed. I’ve just tried QVGA and while the colours became a bit undersaturated and gamma seems to be too high, I got full 25fps playback both straight and with rotation, hw-scalled from 352×288 to 240×320 or 320×240. Unfortunately tslib seems to not have noticed the change and still reports touch coords in 0…640 range. i_m_bison: Darude_-_Feel_the_beat.mp4 (the video is ok, the music not so much:)) tuXXX: I was wondering about that too, but rather MPEG decoding on the CPU and scaling/rotation on Glamo - this would allow us to do more stuff concurrently. The other way, as Mikko notes you transfer the video to the VRAM, then back to the RAM and then back to the VRAM and the bus becomes a bottleneck. In the current setup and normal usage I don’t agree with Raster that 7M/s is a bottleneck, it’s rather hard to saturate with normal X usage even coupled with SD card traffic etc. --End of comment-- Raster, I'm really happy that you where so wrong at this topic --- El jue, 12/6/08, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Acceleration in our pockets Para: community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Peter Nijs [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: jueves, 12 junio, 2008 2:37 Am Do 12. Juni 2008 schrieb Peter Nijs: Isn't the shared bus an advantage because now it can use DMA? Maybe that's why it is possible to hook up an sd-card to the glamo anyway. I see no other explanation why one would put an sd cardreader in a graphics ship. Please tell me if and why I'm wrong. Peter Good point. Would make perfect sense... /j___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Acceleration in our pockets
Hehehe definitively you have something to say :) oops I thought that I have erased this final this so unfortunate sentence so please accept my apologizes lets joy the fact that the glamo will not be a wasted chip --- El jue, 12/6/08, Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Acceleration in our pockets Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED], List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: jueves, 12 junio, 2008 6:58 On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:52:07 + (GMT) David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: nb - i codec only - and i also used mplayer at the time. mpeg1, mpeg2, not to mention a myriad of other codecs won't work there, and it still only producing qvga video. if you do follow prior threads on this, you will notice that i never covered the mp3 decode of the glamo. that's always possible, but as such to do well would need a generic codec-level api supporting it - like openmax. I copy paste an very interesting comment from balrog ,seems that I have become his(totally voluntary) mail list assistant ;) Rasterman. 352x288 25 fps. something to say? --Begin of comment--- # balrog Says: June 11, 2008 at 4:20 am Mikko: I hope we’ll eventually see more than just MPEG support on the Glamo (3D stuff etc). Regarding QVGA at this moment it’s a conjecture… and at this moment it’s confirmed. I’ve just tried QVGA and while the colours became a bit undersaturated and gamma seems to be too high, I got full 25fps playback both straight and with rotation, hw-scalled from 352×288 to 240×320 or 320×240. Unfortunately tslib seems to not have noticed the change and still reports touch coords in 0…640 range. i_m_bison: Darude_-_Feel_the_beat.mp4 (the video is ok, the music not so much:)) tuXXX: I was wondering about that too, but rather MPEG decoding on the CPU and scaling/rotation on Glamo - this would allow us to do more stuff concurrently. The other way, as Mikko notes you transfer the video to the VRAM, then back to the RAM and then back to the VRAM and the bus becomes a bottleneck. In the current setup and normal usage I don’t agree with Raster that 7M/s is a bottleneck, it’s rather hard to saturate with normal X usage even coupled with SD card traffic etc. --End of comment-- Raster, I'm really happy that you where so wrong at this topic --- El jue, 12/6/08, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Acceleration in our pockets Para: community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Peter Nijs [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: jueves, 12 junio, 2008 2:37 Am Do 12. Juni 2008 schrieb Peter Nijs: Isn't the shared bus an advantage because now it can use DMA? Maybe that's why it is possible to hook up an sd-card to the glamo anyway. I see no other explanation why one would put an sd cardreader in a graphics ship. Please tell me if and why I'm wrong. Peter Good point. Would make perfect sense... /j___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why not use votation system?
I don't like the fact that a cold statistics guide decisions/development of OM (and any open-source/free software) being developed based on it, mailing list,forums and even blogs allows you to argue about, and understand more the why of some decisions not the decision itself only. I like more the idea of a positive/negative arguments vote system something like comments of digg.com. A lot more complex implement I suppoe but you can evaluate more accurate how the community how even feels about something. By the way, the idea of having such a thing like this as planet system? not to filter what is it the first page, no such news volume to even think about this almost right now ;), but to have a ponderate opinion value(how the whole comunity thinks about your and others opinions good/bad/irrelevant.? --- El jue, 12/6/08, Michele Renda [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Michele Renda [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Why not use votation system? Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: jueves, 12 junio, 2008 8:14 Hello I was thinking more to a votation system about the decisions that are shared with community. Do you want feature X or feature Y? I think this can help a lot OM to take some decisions, and can remain for storical reasons. I know there are a lot of online services that give its for free. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Font type and size was (QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03)
Thanks Dale, as David says it's this simply test makes the things very clear, whit bold there's is no way but as I said before this font on the freerunner can be used to previews, icons and a way to have various text files opens at time and intuit of what's about and then to work use the second one. --- El mié, 11/6/08, David Pottage [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: David Pottage [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Font type and size was (QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03) Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: miércoles, 11 junio, 2008 10:18 On Wed, June 11, 2008 2:59 am, Dale Schumacher wrote: If your current display is around 150dpi, you can see what QVGA would be like with something like this: xterm -fn '*-clean-*--6-*-c-40*' This will give you a terminal window with a 4x6 font cell (3x5 for characters + 1px spacing). Note that the automatic smear bold make this font unreadable, but the non-bold works. However, I would much prefer to use a larger font on a VGA-size display with 285dpi, like this: xterm -fn '*-clean-med*--16-*-c-80-*' -fb '*-clean-bold*--16-*-c-80-*' Thank you for that. You have added some useful light to the discussion on graphics resolution compared with all the heat. It is a simple test that anyone running Linux, or most other X servers (even cygwin) can run. Having tried the test myself I would say the difference is like night and day. At QVGA you can just about log into your box to reboot your web server if you need to, but the whole experence is quite painfull. At full VGA you can examine log files and the like and actualy figure out the root cause of any problems and fix them. This is the difference between windows sysadmins (reboot at the first sign of trouble), and unix sysadmins who actually find and fix the root cause. For myself I already have a QVGA Nokia phone with PuTTy, so I can log in remotely in an emergency, but VGA is so nice that with a Freerunner I probably would log in in other situations as well. -- David Pottage Error compiling committee.c To many arguments to function. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!)
Hi Carsten I suppose you passion to be in favor of qvga has to have an strong reason. You have asked to us why be prefer vga vs qvga and I thing this long long thread can be resumed as because is better (isolating it to resolution question only) I propose you to the answer the reverse question and please be as truefull as you can. You considerer than downgrade the resolution will improve so much the perfomance of the hole system to justify it? if so, as long as this decision is only concern to GTA03 (the camera version of GTA02 to simplify) I will change my mind and advocate for a qvga version, and in the marketing view it well still make sense, one version to professional use with no camera and more res to console/spectrometer/and other remote control funny stuff and other more phone like with camera able to do all the above but not so clean so more for hobbyist than profesionals, of for other needs, mean while booth can coexist and costumer is able to choose it will be more than pretty. But if this decision concern GTA04 and beyond ,or gta03 will replace gta02, I will not agree(LOL, I said it like I have some influence in openmoko decisions) because we must go forward and increase specs (and performance), --- El mar, 10/6/08, Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!) Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Dave O'Connor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: martes, 10 junio, 2008 7:43 On Mon, 09 Jun 2008 20:43:22 -0700 Dave O'Connor [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: I said this in the channel but you weren't there. We should be going forward with specs, not backward. By the time the next revisions come there'll be a whole new generation of hardware so the freerunner will then be lagging even more. Someone mentioned getting a faster cpu and my 2c are that I think that that's a much better option. But it sounds like you've already made the decision. i'd love a better cpu - better memory bus and much more. right now the only thing we have is gta03 - same cpu as freerunner etc etc. just different gsm subsystem (2g/edge) and no glamo (dumb 2442 fb), new case, added camera. don't get me wrong - i've been running high res as long as i have been able to. i went to 1600x1200 as soon as mu hardware could. i have insisted on laptops with 1600x1200 or higher - 1920x1200 ones too. i use tiny fonts and high dpi screens. i personally love high resolution, but i have noticed a tendency to be the only one in the room who can read it. i'd love an 800x480 300dpi screen - they exist. i was playing with a phone last week with one on it. but practical factors may just not allow it. if you wish to find a reliable supplier for us of such hardware at a good price, then go for it, but practical product concerns may mean it just can't happen. same with cpu speeds and graphics. we are in a world where to get gfx support to run such high resolutions means we need to have closed drivers. and that is not somewhere where we are going. we make compromises. you won't get the best of components in every possible way due to the nature of what is being done here. we try where we can, but somewhere compromises will need to be made. what people have been saying here is that they have excellent eyesight and can see a tin 2.8 vga screen well enough to make use of it. like really see the difference and be able to do things with that res that would be not possible, impractical or painful otherwise. i've fairly amazed at the number of people saying their eyesight is so good as it is in stark contrast to my experience over the years, but ok - i'll take it for what it is. i didn't know how many people really could see the difference AND make use of it. i'm surprised. On Tue, 2008-06-10 at 08:52 +0800, Carsten Haitzler wrote: On Mon, 09 Jun 2008 18:43:51 +0200 Peter Kraker [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: not going to happen - that's 2 product runs. expensive to maintain. gta03 is vga right now - unless there is a very big push to qvga. it is possible to go, and not hard at all. it would save costs on hardware, but it won't change at this stage. but beyond gta03 it's an open book and who knows - we may likely pull out a lower res screen. it is in fact very likely something will be a lower res in later products as there is just so much more choice there below vga. How painfull would it be, to sell GTA03 with QVGA and GTA03V version with VGA screen, if those two are indeed very similar ? I'm certain there are enough of us geeks ready to give up some glitter for pixels. Regards Peter Kraker Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) pravi: On Mon, 9 Jun 2008 08:56:22 +0800 Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Font type and size was (QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03)
But I have no knowlege about this font, hehehe I like it. ~70 chars/line in the example of 291 pixels so in a 640 will be about ~160 chars in one line (penden to confirm the minimum distance to be readable maybe 3 cm hehehe well now seriouly I was able to read the example in a 1280x768 10.6 inch screen so about 140 dpi in 40 cm distance with no movement (in a desk). I totally agree that this font is not for work but it can be used to make a text thumbnail in a icon of a text file or to and advanced text editor had a mosaic quickview of all open text files Only dumb maths 160 columns x 60 lines = 4600 chars per screen (well maybe a lot of strange dots on a screen) --- El mar, 10/6/08, Dave O'Connor [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Dave O'Connor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 (was something about yummy CPU-GPU combos!) Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Dotan Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED], Flemming Richter Mikkelsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: martes, 10 junio, 2008 8:04 I'm with Robert on this one. Took me a while to parse many of the characters on that image. On Tue, 10 Jun 2008, robert lazarski wrote: On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 12:12 PM, The Rasterman Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 15:57:36 +0300 Dotan Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: 2008/6/10 The Rasterman Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED]: nb - your chars just become tall (3x7). eg: I understand. I would still like to see a screenshot of fstab or xorg.conf open in vim with such a font on qvga screen. I don't mind getting used to some displeasures, however others I avoid if possible. http://hea-www.harvard.edu/~fine/images/fonts/atari-small-samp.gif That's painful for this reader. I couldn't write or read code - or anything really - in that font for more than a few seconds. IMHO, It'd be kind of ironic that a totally hackable phone wouldn't have the ability to read or write text. FYI, I did lasik corrective surgery so my eyesight is relatively good . Robert ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 - product management, features assumptions
me too --- El mar, 10/6/08, Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: QVGA V/s VGA for GTA03 - product management, features assumptions Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: martes, 10 junio, 2008 9:49 Ortwin Regel wrote: Reading these posts of the last few days it has just occurred to me that it's not Carsten we should be beating up on here. Who the heck asked for translucency and flashy animations? Management seem to be asking for this alpha bleeding rubbish, and it seems to me that we users need to be telling management that we don't care a heck for it. Sure, I know the iPhone does this now, but that doesn't mean Openmoko has to do it. Do we really want Openmoko to be just another iPhone clone? I know we see a fair number of posts on here about the iPhone, but surely that's just a result of the current buzz - is UI animation really a *necessity* in the long-term (or medium-term) future of the mobile phone market? DISCLAIMER: I haven't used an iPhone, and I'm not terribly interested in it. I do use a Mac as my main desktop, but that's not for the animation, it's because I want something that just works when I sit down at my computer. All us Mac fans found Expose to be a *massive* UI improvement when it was released, but that's because virtual desktops have always been rubbish on a Mac - with so many windows on a single desktop *some* way of finding the bottom-most one was required. The other day I was talking to a Linux developer who turned off compiz on his desktop because it slowed down his productivity - you simply don't need Expose if you have virtual desktops (which admittedly are not suitable for my granny). It seems to me that, whilst the iPhone's animation may wow people, what really distinguishes the iPhone is the same attention to UI simplicity that Apple have always brought to their products. It does a FEW things amazingly well, and that's where it separates itself from the majority of phones on the market, none of which *quite* suit the mass-market of users. Most users don't want to understand the filesystem on their mobile phone, so Apple do away with it; Apple have made it spectacularly easy (so much so that one must include in the discussion the word intuitive) to email a photo taken on the camera or grabbed from a webpage, but they make it impossible to email attachments under many other circumstances. The majority of users don't want to copy paste text on their mobile phones, so Apple just got rid of it - other manufacturers muddy up the phones they aim at girls and little old ladies (excuse me) by including the ability to copy paste; Apple have realised that only a minority of business-phone users want or need that. The Neo Freerunner have both been smartphones, and that's surely the interest that draws Linux users to this list. We want to be able to shell into our unix servers, read PDFs and so on. The idea of an open phone fires our imagination because we can integrate our contacts from our LDAP servers and our diary with an iCal server, we can do whatever the heck we want with Openmoko - we want to ADD features, not remove them. In the context of that, does animation and transparency matter? Heck no! We want a phone that displays text icons on the screen, and as long as the phone does that quick enough, we don't want you wasting resources on trying to make the experience more flashy. There has been mention in these threads about the screen requirements of smaller phones. I can only conclude from this that FIC are planning to leverage their experience in building smartphone hardware in order to break into to the larger market of small girlie and soccer mom phones. Fine, but please don't do this at the expense of your smartphone market. Honestly, I don't see how you can do this well, without castrating your power-phone offerings. Parts of this conversation have focussed on making a use case for VGA screens, but please, FIC management, make a use case for transparency and flashy animations before having Carsten work on it. Whilst I was writing an Apple spam arrived here, promoting today's new iPhone announcement - I clicked on the link to iSteve's presentation. The enterprise take-up from Fortune 500 companies was surely impressive, but this leverage is because of Exchange- compatibility and all the features that OS X gives to the iPhone for free, not the flashy animations. This is where Openmoko can compete. I could write a lot, LOT more here, Stroller. I second this. Rob ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: SMT is running!
push the ROCK let itROLL!! --- El mar, 10/6/08, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: SMT is running! Para: 'List for Openmoko community discussion' community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: martes, 10 junio, 2008 3:39 So I got word from the factory that we have our date. And we got the line. And parts are being planted on boards this week. I know it's been a long wait for everybody, but the stone is almost to the top of the hill. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Yummy new CPU/GPU combo
Carsten, There is any posibility to change the screen resolution without reboot? If we can do so we can dinamically change it to got the best of two worlds, a high resolution for almost statical screens to webbrowsing, doc editing, picture viewing, an a low resolution to mame, video playback(?), and anything else doesn't fit on high res. It can be done? Regards --- El vie, 6/6/08, Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Yummy new CPU/GPU combo Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Tom Cooksey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: viernes, 6 junio, 2008 4:36 On Thu, 5 Jun 2008 12:56:00 +0200 Tom Cooksey [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: Well... yeah, that's kindof the reason for the initial post! I must have misunderstood previous posts as I was convinced the glamo was itself attached to the CPU's SDIO interface. You can understand where I was coming from now! :) Right. Shame the cpu doesn't have more cache so it has a better change of getting on with something else while the DMA occurs. Thanks for clearing things up. It's good to hear that the problem isn't because of any particularly bad decision on OpenMoko's part. Renews my faith a little. :-) glamo is a fairly old graphics cpu and design. frankly it was designed for qvga - at best. it CAN do vga, but that is beyond its intended use. we have pushed it much farther than smedia intended it to be - even smedia is amazed at the bus speeds we get to the glamo - they have never seen it so fast. glamo turned up primarily for 2 reasons. 1. we added wifi - and we just didn't have any other (good) interfaces (we can sit and discuss spi all u like right now - but lets hold that thought). so we needed to use up our sdio port for... wifi - but where will we stick the actual sd card? glamo came with its own sd interface - bonus, so we get that back again. 2. refresh. we run a vga screen. 640x480x70x2 - 41mb/sec ... JUST to refresh the screen. we lost 41mb/sec of memory bandwidth just to keep the screen displaying on the gta01. vga was by far pushing what the soc can do. literally that is a huge amount of the bandwidth we had left (as its reads only and we clock @ 100mhz for the bus clock on the gta02, it's be about 20% of memory bandwidth gone). the glamo removes that drain and gives u back bandwidth... but at another cost - the glamo's own bus and the extra work to write acceleration to keep as much on the glamo as possible. we definitely don't do everything we can on the glamo - but there is only so much time and development effort to go around. as such we only really knew what the glamo was like once we had it going reasonably, and by then - it's too late. glamo is in. it's not going away as there just is no alternative. so solutions could be: ditch vga, go to qvga, thus dropping mem bandwidth loss to 10mb/sec (1/4 of what it was), and now have to drive only 1/2 the pixels in software. end result would be much lower dpi, but much smoother and nicer performance. but then go all the cries of i must have vga!!! (though i wonder just how many people have good enough eyesight to really tell the difference). if we want to live in the realms of such high resolution, imho, we need to look very carefully at a high-end soc with good on-board graphics acceleration, but that would have put the freerunner on hold as a product for a looong time. so you would all still be waiting and waiting. no one would be talking of production runs right now! :) -- Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: resolution preferences??
Carsten, What app/situation you have in mind when you affirm than nobody can detect a the difference at half resolution? I have in mind a web browser a half resolution means double the scroll bars, I have in mind a pdf doc viewer, half resolution means I have to zoom in more the document to be readable, also a let you more useful surface to develop any app(more buttons, menu items) I'm wrong with all that thoughts? --- El vie, 6/6/08, Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: resolution preferences?? Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Steven Milburn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: viernes, 6 junio, 2008 7:39 On Fri, 6 Jun 2008 00:02:14 -0400 Steven Milburn [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: This question is probably just because I misunderstood something you said before, but I'll ask anyway :) If it is acceptable to use QVGA, couldn't that basically be done without any hardware changes? I believe I remember you saying the glamo does scaling, so couldn't you let SW treat the display as qvga, and just have the glamo scale it up? Or, is the question more about having qvga instead of the glamo (which leaves you back with the SDIO interface shortage)? we can just drive the vga screen at qvga. no need for scaling - just change the output at the lcd controller level. but it is a waste to pay for a vga screen when we won't use it. also it does look blocky. it isn't about glamo or not - it's separate to glamo entirely. simply - how important is a vga screen... really? how many people out there can really see the difference? be really honest. stop thinking my specs are bigger than your specs. scan u REALLY see all the pixels on a vga screen of that size. i bet to most people its all a blur - a qvga screen looks identical to them. only to a minority who have very good eyesight does it really make a difference, but this is just my bet. i'm asking the question - and hoping for real honest answers. --Steve On Thu, Jun 5, 2008 at 10:42 PM, The Rasterman Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, 05 Jun 2008 11:50:43 +0200 Marc Bantle [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: quick question - would you prefer a qvga lcd (save a bit of cost) since we'e going to need to software-drive all graphics - the fewer pixels you have to fill, the better for speed. i'm really tossing up if the speed of qvga is worth the loss of resolution. i'm just not sure. Would that be 320x240 (QVGA [1]) or 480x320? qvga is 320x240. wqvga... that's a whole world of resolutions (400x240, 432x240, 480x272, 480x320). :) I think the latter would be acceptable in terms of usability. OTOH it would also but it's not a drop-in replacement as its widescreen. we c ould go for 2.8 vga or 2.8 qvga. drop-in replacement. anything else mans new case/design etc. etc. also remember just getting supply of a screen is hard. you also need it at a decent physical size. i'm asking the question if going down to a (relatively) low resolution screen would be an ok compromise. - create extra maintenance cost for system and app themes one way or another we will need to be able to do multiple resolutions in the long-run. - narrow on-screen information for people with good eye-sight (granny won't be affected ;-) Sofar I haven't suffered from lacking graphic speed on my GTA01. It seemed that waiting for UI feedback was mainly cause by other background processes (e.g. SD-read or such) My interest are standard smartphone and geo apps and for those I'd rather go for resolution. again - it depends what you want to do. :) gta01 actually performance better in many ways graphically :) -- Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Yummy new CPU/GPU combo
But we are able to do to hardware scaling, isn't it? afaik in the long video play resolution thread this were mentioned (maybe there are differents scale concepts) --- El vie, 6/6/08, Stefano Cavallari [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Stefano Cavallari [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: Yummy new CPU/GPU combo Para: community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: viernes, 6 junio, 2008 10:53 X certainly can do that, but AFAIK without specs you can't do hardware scaling, so using anything different than the screen resolution would be slow and/or use too much cpu thus drain the battery. On Friday 06 June 2008 09:08:41 David Samblas Martinez wrote: Carsten, There is any posibility to change the screen resolution without reboot? If we can do so we can dinamically change it to got the best of two worlds, a high resolution for almost statical screens to webbrowsing, doc editing, picture viewing, an a low resolution to mame, video playback(?), and anything else doesn't fit on high res. It can be done? Regards --___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Cleared to start Mass production
Thanks, thanks to you all coreteam, fanboys, critical ones, wanabees and geeks in general, and any other kind of entity thanks you all to make it posible. --- El jue, 5/6/08, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Cleared to start Mass production Para: 'List for Openmoko community discussion' community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: jueves, 5 junio, 2008 5:12 The latest update I have from the factory indicates that mass Production ( that means running the SMT line without stopping to check stuff every two seconds) has been CLEARED TO START. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dennis Wollersheim Sent: Monday, June 02, 2008 9:16 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: OpenMOKO availbility -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 It will be available soon (within one month would be my guess). Does anyone else have a better guess? You cannot book an order at present. I reckon they will be able to ship to Pakistan. Cheers Dennis Masoom Alam wrote: Hi every one, I wanted to ask, that when the latest version of the openmoko will be available (seems a stupid question, as we can see a lot of posts on the mailing list :)). Actually, I dont want to wait for one year this time, therefore asking this question. Plus, is there is any possiblity at the moment to book an order for me in advance now? Plus, I want to ship the latest version to Pakistan, any recommendation in this regard? Regards, MM Alam -- -- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - -- - --- Dennis Wollersheim Lecturer, Health Information Management La Trobe University Bundoora Victoria 3086 Room HS1:110 (03) 9479 1763 (bh) 0414 529 454 (mobile) http://homepage.cs.latrobe.edu.au/dewoller - --- -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with MultiZilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIRMWF41ROt9TlFkoRAhFTAJ9DvMdVl2bbtGUHJFG2nR8Dde9mOgCg/KlF E4wU+XXesXAVFoo0dvnJLck= =GOB0 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: using the openmoko neo101 in mass storage mode
Anyway to me it's not of this high priority to have WixXXx-compatible mass storage. As long as things will PnP with all kinda *nix-systems. Included virtualized ones :) --- El mié, 4/6/08, Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: using the openmoko neo101 in mass storage mode Para: community@lists.openmoko.org CC: Andy Green [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: miércoles, 4 junio, 2008 4:19 Am Mi 4. Juni 2008 schrieb Andy Green: Somebody in the thread at some point said: Yes init 1 sounds like the kind of medicine that matches the problem, but actually doing telinit 1 when you want to share storage is pretty harsh. I know it's a bit unfair but imagine if that was how things were on a Linux laptop. Actually that's the way things are on laptops (admittedly Mac). You hold a button on boot, and the whole device is nothing but a very expensive external USB(/firewire)-storage device. Even they didn't consider to have any UI up during this mode. AFAIK (No Mac here) Anyway to me it's not of this high priority to have WixXXx-compatible mass storage. As long as things will PnP with all kinda *nix-systems. so just my 2 €cent jOERG___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: new iphone - not interested at all
Absolutly and totally agree with you Robert --- El lun, 2/6/08, Robert Schuster [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: De: Robert Schuster [EMAIL PROTECTED] Asunto: Re: new iphone - not interested at all Para: List for Openmoko community discussion community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: lunes, 2 junio, 2008 10:13 Hi, I for one am completely blind when it comes to proprietary technology nowadays. I am not interested in any device that offers substantially less freedom than what is provided by OpenMoko. 'Proprietariness' is kind of zero factor for me: Multiplied with any cool feature factor it will cause *zero* exciteness. Additionally I am also not interested anymore in devices that need to be hacked, reverse engineered or lack important drivers (e.g. power management). When it comes to proprietary devices I am also *much* more concerned about environmental pollution: After all a device that implements its maker's vision and cannot be freed from it anytime becomes useless when the next generation appears. If you are a manufacturer of such a device do mother nature a favor and leave the silicon, oil, copper and whatever resources you need for it under earth's surface! Call me free software zealot, GNU hippy or RMS biggest admirer but this is my opinion and everyone is completely free to disagree. I have a life to live (and enjoy) and will not accept random people misusing software to decide what I can do and what not. Regards Robert Christian Benke schrieb: Good evening! So who of you is thinking about buying the new iphone instead of an openmoko in case the technical specs really improve(3G, better resolution)? I'd love to have a open smartphone, but there are so many compromises with the openmoko project(hardware lacks, formfactor, unfinished software) and the timing for the release is bad unfortunately (on the other side the people interested in openmoko are not necessarily interested in the iphone - However, i guess there will be some people who drop the idea of buying a moko after next weeks apple conference...) I feel bad about this decision, i'm not willing to use proprietary software anywhere in my environment, neither work nor private, but the hardware side of the iphone is presumably better(3G, bigger screen) and the software is just _ready_. I'm kind of in a dilemma right now, on the one hand i know i'll hate the closeness of OSX at some point (Just like it happened with Windows 7 years ago) and would love to be able to do what i want with my smartphone, on the other hand i'm not a developer (i do some scripting but i'm far from any serious software hacking) and i don't have the skills to fix annoying bugs and will have to wait another few months till the software is in a useable state and a freerunner could get a expensive toy for me if development is not accelerating as fast as i expect it to after the release :-( I guess the freerunner will not get available in the next week so i can still decide, probably i'm lucky and all the speculations about the iphone are untrue(only 3G is not a (OM-)dealbreaker for me) ;-) My favourite would still be a Nokia E70 with a useable linux-OS, i just loved the gullwing formfactor - if just Symbian wasn't such a crutch, and a bit more RAM would also not hurt on the E70... my 2 cents Christian ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm
I vote for B) I prefer to use Blueetooth to the phone headset, and if you want sound quality use a wired headphones without any adaptor --- El vie, 30/5/08, Joerg Reisenweber lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: Joerg Reisenweber lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: 2.5mm or 3.5mm Para: community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: viernes, 30 mayo, 2008 8:18 Hi community! A short poll: on a future GTA0x (gt;2), would you prefer to have A) standard 2.5mm headset (mic+phones) connector, where you have to buy a cheap adapter if you want to use your old headphones, (the way like it's for GTA01/02) or B) classic 3.5mm headphones Walkman(R) connector, where you have to DIY an adapter for any standard cellphone headset? (or does anybody know of 3.5mm headSET standards or adapters?) please hurry to vote, we have to make a decision. Thanks cheers jOERG Openmoko-HW-development___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
normal headphones vs movile headphones?? Was Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm
Whats the difference between normal headphones vs movile headphones?, did you mean mobile headset(2 earspeakers+mic)? --- El vie, 30/5/08, Thomas Zimmermann lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: Thomas Zimmermann lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm Para: List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; Fecha: viernes, 30 mayo, 2008 11:50 2.5mm. If you want to buy some earphones for a mobile, than you will get only some with 2.5mm connectors. Thomas Am Freitag 30 Mai 2008 09:35:36 schrieb Rahul Joshi: gt; Exactly. 3.5mm for the same reason. gt; Are there any tangible benefits to using 2.5mm though? gt; gt; Rahul J gt; gt; On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Richard Reichenbacher lt; gt; gt; [EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; wrote: gt; gt; 3.5mm. I'd rather be able to take any headphones I have laying around gt; gt; and use them for music. If I wanted a headset I would buy a Bluetooth gt; gt; headset. gt; gt; gt; gt; -Original Message- gt; gt; From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] gt; gt; [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joerg gt; gt; Reisenweber gt; gt; Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2008 11:18 PM gt; gt; To: community@lists.openmoko.org gt; gt; Subject: 2.5mm or 3.5mm gt; gt; gt; gt; Hi community! gt; gt; A short poll: on a future GTA0x (gt;2), would you prefer to have gt; gt; A) standard 2.5mm headset (mic+phones) connector, where you have to buy gt; gt; a cheap adapter if you want to use your old headphones, (the way like gt; gt; it's for GTA01/02) or gt; gt; B) classic 3.5mm headphones Walkman(R) connector, where you have to DIY gt; gt; an gt; gt; adapter for any standard cellphone headset? (or does anybody know of gt; gt; 3.5mm headSET standards or adapters?) gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; please hurry to vote, we have to make a decision. Thanks gt; gt; gt; gt; cheers gt; gt; jOERG gt; gt; Openmoko-HW-development gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; gt; ___ gt; gt; Openmoko community mailing list gt; gt; community@lists.openmoko.org gt; gt; http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Virtualization to give windows servicies to Neo
Was Re: using the openmoko neo101 in mass storage mode (sorry topic too long to be useful and maybe the post too) Seeking about give an like usb masstorage service to Windows users I have found this inspiring page using-sshfs-to-access-remote-directories-in-windows[1] What about seek some basic easy virtualizable distro to ripoff whatever unneeded in th kernel and soft that provide us a local simulated linux based usb to network adapter and mount an samba server or whatever?(long question), nbsp;I don't know how in Windows host -gt;Linux simulated scenario will work , but I have tried some usb mass storages and the windows simulated on my Linux machines reacts as an hardware plugged mass storage device. If I was decently working with a virtualized XP innbsp; Kubuntu (both very heavynbsp; OS in anbsp; Athlon 3200+ and 515Mb of ram I supose an mini distro without X and a per example a light web server to config it (an default config can be set or guided by an assistant in the installation process ) I know it will be more resources eater this solution than the usb to Ethernet windows drivernbsp; and ssh directly on the phone but in the real with putty and even a winscp I use it very often, but both them requires the use of the keyboardnbsp; doesn't appear in the my pc list of icons openmoko can be loaded with those services and servers itself, they only have to be ported but for sure, it will load more the neo than has only one ssh server (very busy but only one server) and and virtual net services bridge machine in the pc that can use the virtual usb port driver thenbsp; virtualnbsp; machine provide and mount an internal network in itself or use the network created in the windows machine whit this[2] and liberate the neo from this translating ssh to whatever windows understand task I can do some testing on virtualize an OS in and relative older low processor machine, the Atheros one (an celeron 1.1 Hz laptop can be used too for a windows instalation (sigh) but only after exams in july , but any one with more experience or has another virtualization architecture help will be appreciated as all commentaries against or agree are welcome [1]http://ubuntu.wordpress.com/2007/03/05/using-sshfs-to-access-remote-directories-in-windows/ [2]http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_and_Windows#USB_Ethernet_emulation --- El vie, 30/5/08, David Pottage lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: David Pottage lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: Re: using the openmoko neo101 in mass storage mode Para: List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; Fecha: viernes, 30 mayo, 2008 12:49 On Fri, May 30, 2008 10:09 am, Andy Green wrote: gt; ~ But not mass storage: this operates in block mode and requires complete gt; ownership of the storage by the host then (since if we have it mounted gt; too, we will write conflicting things to directory structures, etc). Could we emulate a block device, so that Windows thinks it has sole ownership of a USB block device with a FAT32 FS on it, but for every block access call it makes we intercept the call, figure out what file windows is trying to read or write to, make the corresponding change to our local files (on and ext3 volume), and return emulated results back to windows. I dare say windows would get confused if I file it had cached got changed by Linux, but the user could probably put up with that. -- David Pottage Error compiling committee.c To many arguments to function. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: normal headphones vs movile headphones?? Was Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm
ok so you where talking about headsets not headphones alone thanks :) --- El vie, 30/5/08, [EMAIL PROTECTED] lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: [EMAIL PROTECTED] lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: Re: normal headphones vs movile headphones?? Was Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED], List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; Fecha: viernes, 30 mayo, 2008 5:46 The main differences would be size and price. I can buy a decent 2.5mm mobile headset (one earpiece + one mic) for about $10US and al of those will fit in my pocket. The cheapest headsets for a computer (2 earpieces+one mic) start around $30US and are huge, since they aren't really meant to be portable. You can find smaller 3.5mm headsets (usually one earpiece+one mic) designed for use in businesses, but because they're used for business they are *very* expensive, although on the flip side they tend to be very comfortable and have excellent sound quality. But I have no wish to spend $100 on a headset that I'm going to carry with me everywhere I go. - Michael On Fri, 30 May 2008, David Samblas Martinez wrote: gt; Whats the difference between normal headphones vs movile headphones?, did you mean mobile headset(2 earspeakers+mic)? gt; gt; --- El vie, 30/5/08, Thomas Zimmermann amp;lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]amp;gt; escribi贸: gt; De: Thomas Zimmermann amp;lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]amp;gt; gt; Asunto: Re: 2.5mm or 3.5mm gt; Para: List for Openmoko community discussion amp;lt;community@lists.openmoko.orgamp;gt; gt; Fecha: viernes, 30 mayo, 2008 11:50 gt; gt; 2.5mm. gt; If you want to buy some earphones for a mobile, than you will get only some gt; with 2.5mm connectors. gt; gt; Thomas gt; gt; Am Freitag 30 Mai 2008 09:35:36 schrieb Rahul Joshi: gt; amp;gt; Exactly. 3.5mm for the same reason. gt; amp;gt; Are there any tangible benefits to using 2.5mm though? gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; Rahul J gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 12:05 PM, Richard Reichenbacher amp;lt; gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; [EMAIL PROTECTED]amp;gt; wrote: gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; 3.5mm. I'd rather be able to take any headphones I have laying gt; around gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; and use them for music. If I wanted a headset I would buy a gt; Bluetooth gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; headset. gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; -Original Message- gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joerg gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; Reisenweber gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2008 11:18 PM gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; To: community@lists.openmoko.org gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; Subject: 2.5mm or 3.5mm gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; Hi community! gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; A short poll: on a future GTA0x (amp;gt;2), would you prefer to have gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; A) standard 2.5mm headset (mic+phones) connector, where gt; you have to buy gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; a cheap adapter if you want to use your old headphones, gt; (the way like gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; it's for GTA01/02) or gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; B) classic 3.5mm headphones Walkman(R) connector, where gt; you have to DIY gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; an gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; adapter for any standard cellphone headset? (or does anybody know of gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; 3.5mm headSET standards or adapters?) gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; please hurry to vote, we have to make a decision. Thanks gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; cheers gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; jOERG gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; Openmoko-HW-development gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; ___ gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; Openmoko community mailing list gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; community@lists.openmoko.org gt; amp;gt; amp;gt; http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community gt; gt; gt; gt; ___ gt; Openmoko community mailing list gt; community@lists.openmoko.org gt; http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community gt; gt; gt; __ gt; Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada m谩s inteligente. __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Neo as cellular modem?
If anyone is really interested in make this phone an AP to whatever usenbsp; andnbsp; if anbsp; external power isnbsp; an option, why not use a USB 1.1 wireless adapter able tonbsp; do that even it only do itnbsp; in b instead of g if the usb 1.1 doen't allownbsp; the 54 Mb/s.it can be very probable that can even use monitor mode with that dongle ;) even without external power it can be doable for a shorts periods of time (well battery will decide the timeframe) --- El jue, 29/5/08, Michael Shiloh lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: Michael Shiloh lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: Re: Neo as cellular modem? Para: List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; Fecha: jueves, 29 mayo, 2008 6:00 Alexey Feldgendler wrote: gt; On Thu, 29 May 2008 08:59:10 +0200, Andy Green lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; wrote: gt; gt;gt; We're helpless unless Atheros decided to implement Master mode in their gt;gt; closed firmware. Unfortunately the power advantages of having the bulk gt;gt; of the ieee80211 actions managed in the firmware are pretty compelling gt;gt; so I don't know how we get out of that bind. gt; gt; The very knowledge that we can't do something that the hardware would gt; technically be capable of is annoying, Strongly agree. In some cases this was a result of the agreement we were able to reach with the chip manufacturer in order to open source the driver. We don't view this as a perfect solution, but rather a good start. Hopefully in the future the success of Openmoko will encourage chip manufacturers to become more open. gt; but I don't really see why we would need to implement a true AP in the phone. Strongly disagree. Innovation is stifled whenever choices are limited simply because we can't think of why someone would want to make that choice. We should always strive to make such choices available. For any reasonable use gt; case I can think of, ad-hoc mode should be enough. The only usability gt; advantage of being an AP would be that it can send beacon packets that gt; allow other devices to detect an available network, but sending beacon gt; would be a battery drain anyway. Assuming the use case made sense, the Freerunner could be powered externally. Michael ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: My second battery life test with the freerunner in standby
No need to be Shakespeare here :) I understand you and I like a lot what you are saying. I appreciate a lot your effort to translate your thoughts and experience to English, Dutch is a little out of my languages knowledges. Any report from real world add fresh air on this list likenbsp; an open windows (what an oxymoron) When the CPU will be able to down and up his Hz depends of system demands it will be a lot of power saving extra. I will like to know how the diferents components(wifi, gps...) affects on the battery drainage and a music with headset testnbsp; and ...and ...and..I want my freeruner to do it myself ;)!!! --- El mié, 28/5/08, einstein lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: einstein lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: My second battery life test with the freerunner in standby Para: List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; Fecha: miércoles, 28 mayo, 2008 11:18 Hi, the day is over an the freerunner turns off after 16hours. I charged it over night, 7 hours long. So i only turn on the gsm. I don't use the Freerunner often. A short gps session of 15min an some sms, one short call, one missed call! And in the afternoon i wake up the freerunner every 30min to check the state of the device. I am supriesed of this. yesterday i think 14 hours are possible. Well, i think all the developers do a great job, and there are many opertunitys for more standby time. So now i go to bed, in 7 hours my night is over. Greets Einstein PS: sorry for the my bad english... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: My second battery life test with the freerunner in standby
yes, I'm sorry maybe he understand better Deutsch than dutch ;) --- El jue, 29/5/08, Bastian Muck lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: Bastian Muck lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: Re: My second battery life test with the freerunner in standby Para: List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; Fecha: jueves, 29 mayo, 2008 4:03 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 I think he would not have understood dutch either since he comes from germany ;-) David Samblas Martinez schrieb: | No need to be Shakespeare here :) | I understand you and I like a lot what you are saying. | I appreciate a lot your effort to translate your thoughts and experience to English, Dutch is a little out of my languages knowledges. | Any report from real world add fresh air on this list like an open windows (what an oxymoron) | When the CPU will be able to down and up his Hz depends of system demands it will be a lot of power saving extra. | I will like to know how the diferents components(wifi, gps...) affects on the battery drainage | and a music with headset test and ...and ...and..I want my freeruner to do it myself ;)!!! | | | --- El *mié, 28/5/08, einstein /lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt;/* escribió: | | De: einstein lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; | Asunto: My second battery life test with the freerunner in standby | Para: List for Openmoko community discussion lt;community@lists.openmoko.orggt; | Fecha: miércoles, 28 mayo, 2008 11:18 | | Hi, | | the day is over an the freerunner turns off after 16hours. I charged it | over night, 7 hours long. So i only turn on the gsm. I don't use the | Freerunner often. A short gps session of 15min an some sms, one short | call, one missed call! And in the afternoon i wake up the freerunner | every 30min to check the state of the device. | | I am supriesed of this. yesterday i think 14 hours are possible. | | Well, i think all the developers do a great job, and there are many | opertunitys for more standby time. | | So now i go to bed, in 7 hours my night is | over. | | Greets | | Einstein | | PS: sorry for the my bad english... | | | ___ | Openmoko community mailing list | community@lists.openmoko.org | http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community | | | - | | Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! lt;http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mailuk/taglines/isp/control/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=52431/*http://es.docs.yahoo.com/mail/overview/index.htmlgt; | La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. | | - | | ___ | Openmoko community mailing list | community@lists.openmoko.org | http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIPg7mlYiDScJJ+7QRAoywAKCuNPX0T40dzPrRQsMackB1k1sPDQCg0q4e 2d/rshJRPzM0WMMLZAP9WAI= =gjWN -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: My blog, Freerunner FIrst Impressions and some pics
I was able to connect this morning (Kevin, your pics arrise me a mixture of joyful and envy) but thenbsp; server where the page resides seems a very overloaded, low downoad rates and a lot of retries in the picture part until a succesfull conection let me see your (you lucky bas*%$rd...ups! sorry }:) ) early freerunner. --- El vie, 23/5/08, Marco Trevisan (Treviño) lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; escribió: De: Marco Trevisan (Treviño) lt;[EMAIL PROTECTED]gt; Asunto: Re: My blog, Freerunner FIrst Impressions and some pics Para: community@lists.openmoko.org Fecha: viernes, 23 mayo, 2008 2:14 Kevin Dean wrote: gt; Anyway, the writeup can be read at: It's about a day (since it has been posted on planet) that I can't connect to your site! :( -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente.___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Mapless GPS
I'ts a great idea, is like a compass but with a selectable north :)--- El jue, 22/5/08, Alexey Feldgendler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:De: Alexey Feldgendler [EMAIL PROTECTED]Asunto: Mapless GPSPara: "List for OpenMoko community discussion" community@lists.openmoko.orgFecha: jueves, 22 mayo, 2008 12:27Randall Munroe, the author of XKCD, suggests an excellent idea:http://blag.xkcd.com/2008/05/20/gps-cyborg-implant/Simply put, it's a GPS navigator that only repeatedly gives you the direction towards the target (in “three o'clock” style) and thedistance to it, without using any maps at all. It probably won't help you in a maze of twisty passages all alike, but should be good enough when navigating in a city or suburb where roads are made to enable you to reach places.This has a lot of advantages:* Dead simple to implement.* Doesn't require display. This allows to save power (usually GPS navigators have to keep the screen backlight on all the way) and use a headset to speak directions -- especially useful for cyclists.* Doesn't require maps that are often expensive (especially routable ones), are in proprietary formats, get outdated, use a lot of memory or require a persistent internet connection. Only a one-time access to Google Maps or alike is necessary to obtain the target coordinates; or they can be saved from the current location of the device, sent to each other in SMS etc.* Equally suitable for drivers, cyclists and pedestrians.* Doesn't insist on taking you blocked roads it doesn't know about.* Makes following the directions more interesting because you actually make decisions and don't feel following directions like a robot.* You get a chance to learn different roads and the way they connect instead of just taking the same path every time (important for the “navigation idiots” like myself who doesn't ever leave home withouttheir GPS navigator).* The idea can be easily extended to more complex cases, like having several targets and having the user, not the machine, make decisions as to in which order to visit them; having two OM users find each other by getting directions towards each other's location; taking note of the routes the user follows, comparing them by distance travelled and duration and giving hints like “last time you turned right here”; etc.-- Alexey Feldgendler [EMAIL PROTECTED][ICQ: 115226275] http://feldgendler.livejournal.com___Openmoko community mailing listcommunity@lists.openmoko.orghttp://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community LLama Gratis a cualquier PC del Mundo.Llamadas a fijos y móviles desde 1 céntimo por minuto.http://es.voice.yahoo.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: My Openmoko blog is aimed at helping Freerunner users get started
Seems that there is an updated version of the Qtopia Desktop called Qtopia Sync Agent http://doc.trolltech.com/qtopia4.3/qtopiadesktop/--- El mar, 20/5/08, Ian Darwin [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:De: Ian Darwin [EMAIL PROTECTED]Asunto: Re: My Openmoko blog is aimed at helping Freerunner users get startedPara: "List for Openmoko community discussion" community@lists.openmoko.orgCC: "Ian Darwin" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Fecha: martes, 20 mayo, 2008 9:52On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 04:45:14AM +1000, Lorn Potter wrote: If anybody knows the location of the files that QT contacts uses, orhas actually tried the QTopia Desktop with the new ASU image, please pipe in! (Please don't guess, because you might cause somebody towaste a lot of time, or lose data :-)) Qtopia contacts are stored in the sqlite database. They can also be copiedto the sim card. Qtopia Desktop is too old and will not work with Qtopia version 4.Urgh. Thanks for pointing this out! ___Openmoko community mailing listcommunity@lists.openmoko.orghttp://lists..openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Enviado desde Correo Yahoo!La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Will GTK be used in Openmoko? (was: Re: Software Status Update)
Hi raster,Seems that some lag has delay your mail in my inbox, so righ now the answer is clear Use whatever you like and feel confortable :) I already know I can develop even in a teoricaly costumized ncurse if I want it meanwhile It has been specified as dependency and installed before the app itself. My doubts were more about if gtk is no used (in spite of it's already installed and ready to go in the core) , and I have a silly idea I want to develop and transform it to a silly app, but as long as I don't have experience in anything I have to document myself about whatever I will use, so for me is the same effort to read about gtk bindings or elf ones, but one criteria can be to not load more graph libraries on memory if there is one already loaded so to make my silly app with a some text fields and a pair or three of buttons I will prefer using the already used one. The real meaning of "official" (for me) in open context is about information not restriction at all of course, I simply don't know that the hole core apps in the last update has been ported to elf PD.- Great work cutting down the doubts about this issue :) thanks On Thu, 15 May 2008 17:05:23 +0200 (CEST) David Samblas Martinez[EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: Sorry me if this has been said in other post, but if gtk is not the "default" graphical library what library gonna be ETK the "official" one? Just to document me for future apps(ideas) in mind please read my prior email. why does everyone think that there has to be anofficial widget set and thus everyone has to move to it? use what solves yourproblems best for you! --- Mo Abrahams [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I was wondering about that too. Personally I would rather have stuck with GTK, but in the grand scheme of things I will be doing less coding than other people I imagine.On Thu, 2008-05-15 at 07:31 -0700, Michael Shiloh wrote: Have we made the decision then to officially move away from GTK? Thiswas asked on the community list awhile ago, and IIRC there has been no"official" answer. Michael Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote: as we are not shipping any gtk apps... not much of an issue at the moment. thecommunity is free to package up anything they like. :) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.orghttp://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community-- Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Enviado desde Correo Yahoo!La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Another little question about Group sales to steve
So the group can allways make a signed agreement to divide the price of the phone that if the final only one phone option is 399$ if the extra phone is selled to 369,1$ anyone got a final discount of 39'9$ on every phone. Christ van Willegen [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 6:20 PM, ian douglas wrote: Correct, you'd get the discount on the group of 10, and have to pay full price on the extra 9. Might be worth looking for people in neighboring countries, etc., to group up? or buy 20 and sell the last one via eBay... 9 phones at full price is almost the same as 10 at the discounted price! Christ van Willegen -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Quickstart web page my first manual readed before product release
Hi Alex, if I understand you question (my english has margin to be improved ;) ) the manual is at http://quickstart.openmoko.org not completed yet but interesting reading Regards --- Wilkinson, Alex [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: 0n Wed, May 14, 2008 at 11:53:13PM +0200, David Samblas Martinez wrote: Since I was a young wannabe I like to read manuals, I allways remember my first full specification readding at 13 years reading the full Epson ms-dos manuals (full command list especification included) 1 night before I can even start my first computer (an 8086) because (damn it!) my family decided to go to soup that evening with my uncles... Now I am a old an experienced wannabe and I cannot remember any other tech doc than make me feel so near again this first geek experience (near to drop a tear here) Here again reading about manage something desired but not even (but so near ) in you hands. And where may you be reading this from ? -aW IMPORTANT: This email remains the property of the Australian Defence Organisation and is subject to the jurisdiction of section 70 of the CRIMES ACT 1914. If you have received this email in error, you are requested to contact the sender and delete the email. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Will GTK be used in Openmoko? (was: Re: Software Status Update)
Sorry me if this has been said in other post, but if gtk is not the default graphical library what library gonna be ETK the official one? Just to document me for future apps(ideas) in mind --- Mo Abrahams [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I was wondering about that too. Personally I would rather have stuck with GTK, but in the grand scheme of things I will be doing less coding than other people I imagine. On Thu, 2008-05-15 at 07:31 -0700, Michael Shiloh wrote: Have we made the decision then to officially move away from GTK? This was asked on the community list awhile ago, and IIRC there has been no official answer. Michael Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) wrote: as we are not shipping any gtk apps... not much of an issue at the moment. the community is free to package up anything they like. :) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: clarification re easy OpenMoko updating for average consumer
Seems that there is already a Moko-Manager project http://projects.openmoko.org/projects/openmokomanager/ I was unable to run it yet but it got screen shoots ian douglas [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Ron K. Jeffries wrote: As an Ubuntu *user* every now and then I get an alert that upgrades are available. Likewise with other major distros like Fedora -- you get an alert that upgrades are available when you login, or come back from an idle state overnight (nightly cron job I imagine). In the case of the Freerunner though, if updates are available, we should give the user the option of upgrading everything automagically, without ever prompting them, or letting them manually update. Not saying this is necessarily the way to go because some other mobile OS does this, but my Blackjack 2 running Windows Mobile 6 gives me the option of manually looking for updates and manually applying them, or just letting the phone do things on its own. Of course, *because* it's Windows I don't let it do anything automatically... But from an end user perspective, if we want to reach non-techies (or as Ron put it, people with IQ's less than 175), should we even prompt for a password when the root user doesn't even *have* a password? Unless we prompt the user upon first boot-up of the phone to enter a security passphrase for things like updates, locking the phone from any use, locking the phone for international calls, etc. Just my $0.02. -id ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Funny Dialer
There is a link to that article?? --- steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Lovely, I have just submitted an article to Innovation magazine highlighting the first case mod that was done. If you complete your mod, I'll see what I can do to showcase it on our website. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Heikki Sørum Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 11:12 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: Funny Dialer Actually, I'm dreaming of doing a serious Steam-punk mod of the freerunner case. Eg. create a circular watchlike case from the CAD files with typewriter keys and all the fancy steam-ish stuff. ;) Heikki Soerum. Den Mon, 12 May 2008 12:55:56 -0700 steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] skrev: I love retro stuff. Michael and I were talking about sample apps for beginners and I thought it would be cool to to do a hello world dialer. get it? I know kinda dorky. Doing a remix of the old rotary dialer as a hello world app on the neo would be a neat hack. Neo would approve. _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Breakable Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 5:06 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Funny Dialer I am positive you should have to turn the dialer manually for most user friendliness :D While hilarious this could become a killer feature to make a phone for the technologically challenged. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Alarmclock puzzle
And then you will arrive late because you are trying to beat up the 14th snozee Level :) Really a lot of ideas have arrise to wake up people bu I have saw myself, in my sleep mode, looking at something black that beeps, brights an buzz and with strange messages , colors and buttons on the screen... I will tell my wife to record a message that textually says every five seconds:It cost 400$ DON'T destroy it PD.-This I hope this message will be effective to my wife too, is not very wake up friendly. --- Hans L [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: An interesting alarm would be a Simon( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_(game) ) clone. Instead of a monotone beep or music of a normal alarm, the sound you wake up to could be the game beeping the notes at you. It could beep the sequence and wait a couple seconds for you to try to repeat it, and if no input, then it would play the sequence again. The more you hit snooze, the longer the pattern becomes. Start with maybe a sequence of 5 or so, and add a couple to the sequence each time. Actually, would be a fun game to have on there regardless of alarm clocks :-P Hans Loeblich ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ LLama Gratis a cualquier PC del Mundo. Llamadas a fijos y móviles desde 1 céntimo por minuto. http://es.voice.yahoo.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Quickstart web page my first manual readed before product release
Since I was a young wannabe I like to read manuals, I allways remember my first full specification readding at 13 years reading the full Epson ms-dos manuals (full command list especification included) 1 night before I can even start my first computer (an 8086) because (damn it!) my family decided to go to soup that evening with my uncles... Now I am a old an experienced wannabe and I cannot remember any other tech doc than make me feel so near again this first geek experience (near to drop a tear here) Here again reading about manage something desired but not even (but so near ) in you hands. Michael in the chapter 7 is written [...] Note that updating the root file system will erase any data you have added, such as contacts or calendar information.[...] some tar -cvzf backupneopimdata.tar.gz watever/the/pims/apps/save/the/information will be apreciated here to be able to restore this info after an update. Some more sophisticated backup solutions can be added lately as long as their are implemented and will be ok to add a link to http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Backup directly when this part has been developed. - LLama Gratis a cualquier PC del Mundo. Llamadas a fijos y móviles desde 1 céntimo por minuto. http://es.voice.yahoo.com___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Software Status Update
I like it It is really pretty design and concept Marco Trevisan (Treviño) [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: steve wrote: It should not be a secret to anybody that there is a substantial work being done on the software side. Frankly, I am not able to answer any detailed questions on it because I'm just focused on getting the hardware out with a bare bones ( dialer/contact/sms) level of software functionality. Do you mean something like this [1] (flash player required)? Since it's so cool! :P Bye! [1] http://tinyurl.com/65zn6e -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: yet another question about group sales (re: group goodies)
As I understand only 10 phones pack has goodies, now if you buy 11 phones will be one ten pack with ten goodies + 1 phone with no goodies... --- Alexander Frøyseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: After what I know, you get 11 goodies when you buy 11 phones. Vinc Duran skrev: I don't know your answers but I thought it was 10 pack (like order=10 rather than order=10). On Mon, May 12, 2008 at 10:41 PM, nickd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I apologise if this has been asked before, but my Google-fu fails me and I can't search the lists properly, *so*... I know that if you order 10 Freerunners that you only get the discount on the groups of 10. In the same way, do you only get the same amount of goodies as phones? I.e. count(phones) = count(pouches,headsets)? OR count(phones) - (count(phones) mod 10) = count(pouches,headsets)? So will 11 phones give you 11 pouches or 10? I need more coffee. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Alarmclock puzzle
My wife tells me that I have an sleep mode where I'm able to do obey simply order like close the window(or I'm cold), bring me water(or I'm thirsty) and I obey/react to her request(even out a familiar place like a hotel room or a camping) without remember it when I really weak up. So I'm sure even a puzzle will be matter of time to be solved in sleep mode and then go deep sleep mode again. So for me a recorded voice of my wife telling me do breakfast will be effective enough :) --- Georg Michelitsch [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Alexander Frøyseth wrote on 05/13/2008 02:49 PM: Hello again I just have an idea for an nice addon or software (call it what you want) to the alarmclock Okey, let me tell a little story from real life. Every day when I go to school, I have to wake up, and now I have 2 alarmclocks, but still I manage to oversleep. Soo what I was thinking about was that I have to solve a puzzle to turn the alarmclock off, and not just push a button. One possibility is a 4 bits jigsaw puzzle like this: http://www.bimbambanana.com/index.php?p=Puzzle-alarm-clock-cool-gadgetsside=visProdprod_id=21 another, and perhaps an more easy to make is that the screen shows fours digits that you have to click in right order to turn it off. Perhaps like an antibot test on websites. I am more as an web programmer, so I isent so good to program software. NOTE: You have to have the choice to turn this on and off when you sets the clock Hope that someone think this is a good idea, and tries to program one. Alexander Frøyseth ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Possibly the turn-off puzzles shouldnt be too hard to solve, otherwise this'll result in alot of people (including me) removing their battery, smashing their neo while you're totally woozy in the morning, not really thinking about what they're doing simply to gain a few more minutes in bed :D cu, Georg ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Gaming on Openmoko?
There are some good java games for movile phone out there than can be executed with jlimo. I was able to run some games in the dosbox in jlime so I supuse that a lot of oldies pc games can be runned in neo too. About the key thing, despite we loose part of the screen, I supose it can be relatively easy to implement an alternative keyboard as the included one but only with 8 directional keypad (this keypad willbe an 8 swiched one but can evolve to analogic) and two buttons A B as fire ,jump etc... Mo Abrahams [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: We don't have drivers for the 3D hardware, so I am afraid games like that are a little out of the question... although I think that would need something more powerful than what we have anyway wouldn't it? Would be very happy to see somebody get 3D working though =) It could be fun to see how app developers would exploit it, let alone having 3D games... I was about to say someone should port some gameboy emulator or something, since we do have 2D, but then the button thing hit me =P On Sat, 2008-05-10 at 00:04 +0200, ramsesoriginal wrote: I just watched http://gizmodo.com/388688/raging-thunder-iphone-racing-game-shows-tons-of-potential, and asked myself what sorts of games are tested/planned/running on the freerunner: For example, is planet Penguin Racer Working? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: How many framebuffers does openmoko has?
--- Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: no. This is a clear answer X-D __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: How many framebuffers does openmoko has?
Answered out the list --- Bin Chen [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 5:05 PM, David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Carsten Haitzler [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: no. This is a clear answer X-D What does X-D mean? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: questions for steve regarding group purchases
And according me Openmoko is doing in hardware what Linux made in software! And it is great. Same feeling here!!! - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Software
And why not implement a execute command option in
the PIM Task Manager(Schedule)?
If the neo will be able to wake up to play a sound
and/or buzz, I suppose it can execute a shell command
and sleep again when finished.
(maybe this was already implemented/planned, isn't
it?)
--- Ryan Prior [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
Perhaps phone-cron needs to be written, to take
anacron to the level of
task flexibility required for modern cell phones.
Cron and anacron are
crusty old beasts - we need something fresh and
sharp.
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 6:42 PM, Bastian Muck
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Anachron can unfortunately run tasks once a day,
which you can read at the
Drawback. I guess that tasks, with a
remember-funktions canot really be
realized with anachron.
I don't know if there is a timer, which can send
an wakeup-interupt, but
when it exists the next upcoming task could be
searched an the time could be
passed to the timer. Does anybody knows of such
timer?
If not i think it should be integrated in gta03.
Greetings Bastian
Torfinn Ingolfsen schrieb:
| Hi,
|
| On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Mike Baroukh
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| About this, I was wondering if there was
possibility to have cron like
| tasks even if the phone is suspended ?
|
| You could always run something like anacron{1]
on the phone. As long
| as yoy don't keep you phone suspended for a day
or more that would
| work. :-)
|
| References:
| 1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anacron
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Re: Software
(WARNING! NON DEVELOPER OPINION BELOW)
As I read from other device RTC acts just like another
wakeup event (as an screen touch or a button) when the
stored time equals the always running clock.
Here I have doubts, the app associated to that alarm
event is stored anywhere in some kind of sorted by
time cue, this app is notified and it's entry in the
cue is eliminated, then the next app alarm request
upload to RTC his time and so one, there will be
anywhere a centraliced RTC petitions manager (I think
is in the kernel directly) but I have no idea how
exactly the app is notified(dbus?)
(NON DEVELOPER OPINION END)
--- thomasg [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
I think there should be a daemon handling this
tasks.
As the RTC-alarm can only be once (every day), the
daemon would have to
handle this to allow multiple alarms/wakeups.
The daemon would have to act like this: first set
the RTC-alarm - after
waking up check for the scheduled event and decide
if it's the correct day
and run the tasks. After
that decide what's the next event and set the
RTC-alarm-time to the
new time (or leave it as it is in case it was the
wrong day).
The daemon would/should have its own event database
that can be filled via a
dbus-interface.
As the RTC-alarm might be different from device to
device it might be the
clean way to let the odeviced handle the
alarm-setting (communication
between the two daemons via dbus) and just have a
dbus-interface for that in
the new daemon.
That is at least what I imagine.
On 5/7/08, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Am Mi 7. Mai 2008 schrieb David Samblas Martinez:
And why not implement a execute command option
in
the PIM Task Manager(Schedule)?
If the neo will be able to wake up to play a
sound
and/or buzz, I suppose it can execute a shell
command
and sleep again when finished.
The interesting bit of this is to distinguish
between dates that just had
wake
up the device, so we may go to sleep again
immediately after execution,
and
dates that happen to be executed while user
intentionally switched on
the
device already so we mustn't go to sleep
afterwards.
/j
(maybe this was already implemented/planned,
isn't
it?)
--- Ryan Prior [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió:
Perhaps phone-cron needs to be written, to
take
anacron to the level of
task flexibility required for modern cell
phones.
Cron and anacron are
crusty old beasts - we need something fresh
and
sharp.
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 6:42 PM, Bastian Muck
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1
Anachron can unfortunately run tasks once a
day,
which you can read at the
Drawback. I guess that tasks, with a
remember-funktions canot really be
realized with anachron.
I don't know if there is a timer, which can
send
an wakeup-interupt, but
when it exists the next upcoming task could
be
searched an the time could be
passed to the timer. Does anybody knows of
such
timer?
If not i think it should be integrated in
gta03.
Greetings Bastian
Torfinn Ingolfsen schrieb:
| Hi,
|
| On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 9:26 AM, Mike
Baroukh
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
| About this, I was wondering if there was
possibility to have cron like
| tasks even if the phone is suspended ?
|
| You could always run something like
anacron{1]
on the phone. As long
| as yoy don't keep you phone suspended for
a day
or more that would
| work. :-)
|
| References:
| 1) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anacron
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k9r7LB1DceHTxuqMFYgeAtI=
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RE: interesting development in the world of WiMax
meanwhile it this future OM suports usb 2.0... http://www.airspan.com/products_wimax_custprem_16eUSB.aspx I have sent a mail to them to know if possible to work on USB 1.1 but I'm pretty sure the answer will be no ian douglas [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I had a colleague send me this URL today and asked whether any future Openmoko devices will support WiMax. http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/hiner/?p=690 Sprint has finalized a groundbreaking deal to spin off its nascent U.S. WiMAX network into a joint venture partnership with Clearwire that will be funded by Intel, Google, Comcast, Time Warner Cable, and Bright House Networks. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Group Sales Page
The http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php/GroupSales seems to be up again --- Dirk Deimeke [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Hi, I've tried to access it with the link in my bookmark but it seems to not to be there anymore. searching for group in the wiki shows http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php/Group_Order Dirk ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Yahoo! Solidario. Intercambia los objetos que ya no necesitas y ayuda a mantener un entorno más ecológico. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Stylus Recommendation
XD I have not think about it Grabriel , you are right if it is a starndard mini usb metal conector. But if instead of we use a some rubbish,flexible fake conector(I have this kind of material protecting some connectors of my camera and my phone) the yank danger can be avoided. --- Gabriel Ambuehl [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Monday 05 May 2008 15:37:17 David Samblas Martinez wrote: Hey I like it too!! It can act as dirty protection for the usb connector. Or it could yank it right out of the case if you're not careful... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: youtube freerunner vid is up
I think this is the link, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9QLdK6pFCIfeature=related Great video , steven a huge to your sons even with all the envy of the world Jens Fursund [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: and for the screen, in the related videos there is a video from trolltech where they show of a freerunner and you see the screen. Where did you find it, could you post a link? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Yahoo! Solidario. Intercambia los objetos que ya no necesitas y ayuda a mantener un entorno más ecológico. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: I'm sorry , that's my fault (was:GTA03 wish list (was: What US plans are people using?))
--- steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Either this is NOT a real goal of Openmoko or the developers suck at it. There are SEVERAL applications on Openmoko that require a stylus (many of the games, for instance). As far as I know, the criteria Openmoko apps must be usable with fingers has never been set. http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-April/016014.html Pardon me if I'm mistaken, but the person who said that isn't a developer, let alone someone with the authority to ensure the developers comply with that directive on Openmoko released applications. I'm sorry , not I'm not a developer and don't even wanted ro restart a flame, I will think twice before I reply and I will tag my opinions clearly as they are Only Happy Enthusiastic Freerunner User Wannabe Opinions (OHEFUWO) In this case I have arrived when the fingers fans were more active in the list and I only have a partially view of this issue, but now I realize that I was wrong and OM is a (evolutioning) mixture of finger/stylus distribution. So even this post http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-April/016224.html Have some flame material caused by my own missinformation, so please ignore them or not take them too seriously. Thanks you all of your patience with these bigmouth --- steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: We had a many debates about this: finger fans on one side, stylus guys on the other side. In the end the spirit of openness prevailed. Since its open source we cannot require or determine or impose any kind of thou shalt not use thy finger or thou shalt use the stylus Generally speaking I think a good portion of us in OM, would like to see a finger thing, falling back to stylus when the finger simply cannot do the job. So internally a flexible pragmatic philosophy, externally, folks can do whatever floats their boat. as it should be. So, the Box contains a stylus. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Dean Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 10:00 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Re: GTA03 wish list (was: What US plans are people using?) On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Stroller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of the objectives of openmoko is to no need to use the stylus at all ... When devels talk about mokofy (port to openmoko) some aplication one of the chalenges is to use it with out stylus. Either this is NOT a real goal of Openmoko or the developers suck at it. There are SEVERAL applications on Openmoko that require a stylus (many of the games, for instance). As far as I know, the criteria Openmoko apps must be usable with fingers has never been set. http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-April/016014.html Pardon me if I'm mistaken, but the person who said that isn't a developer, let alone someone with the authority to ensure the developers comply with that directive on Openmoko released applications. I was VERY pleased the other day to read this, as I find it fiddly to mess around with a stylus. I hate the stylus with a PASSION too. In my opinion, this is NOT a GTA03 issue but a GTA02 issue. There's debate ove the box contents of the Freerunner. If the box does NOT include a stylus, I think the software applications MUST be written in a way that is functional without it. I'm of the opinion that everything needed to use the device must be included in the box. You don't NEED an SD card to use the Freerunner but you DO need a battery. If the software that will be Openmoko REQUIRES a stylus, I think it's really a crappy thing to do for Openmoko NOT to ship one with the box. Making this decision is, in my opinion, important NOW. Despite previous phones I've owned having stylus holders, I have always lost them. I guess a stylus holder simply doesn't actually _hold_ so well. The idea of a device that does everything is to eliminate the need to carry around an address book, an ipod, a GPS navigation device, a calculator and so on. Without a way to tuck the stylus away it's adding to the number of items a person has to carry around (and track). I personally carry my Neo, my wallet and my car keys (which actually CAN work as a stylus, as long as I'm not driving). I don't carry a pen and I don't carry a stylus. A dependancy on the stylus on the applications would INCREASE the number of things I have to carry around (which to me, decreases the value of a Neo). Apart from this, it always seems to me much more natural to use my fingers, but of course on previous phones the on-screen buttons are too small. I would love a link, if anyone has one, to official developer documentation stating the no-stylus requirement. As far as I know, there isn't one. In fact, I think the guildelines for application development are either non-existant,
Re: 10 PACK UPDATE!!!
We maybe must stop this or freerunner will be the first mobile phone with a PARENTAL ADVISORY tag in its case. :) In oderside it can be a very agresive marketing campaing Open your.phone Flemming Richter Mikkelsen [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On 4/25/08, steve wrote: Somebody needs to work on the software to make it vibrate better. Maybe I'll have a look at it (need to get the phone first). I got one idea, but I need to test it:) -- Please don't send me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Join the FSF as an Associate Member at: Free your mind - Open(moko) your phone ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Video Playback virtually impossible on Neo Freerunner? (Re: Video of Qt 4.4 on Neo1973: brings iPhone like graphics)
I'm gonna still buy the freerunner when as soon as it become avialble and I will work as hard as my non-linux-freak life let me do it. But I have to admit than this video limitation in the neo's video has dissapoint me very deeply. The good news is that I have been disapointed BEFORE I have bought the neo and even Before the freerunner is released so OM gives me the oportunity to decide and evaluate if this is a stopper to buy this phone or not. Can any of the core team confirm this video limitations? --- Christoph Witzany [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: As I understood Video playback will be virtually impossible on the freerunner, at least from the sd card (which is the only sensible location to store videos on the neo ftm). Please correct me if I misunderstood. Well that could have the potential to kill the Freerunner as consumer product. Just because virtually every other 100$ phone does it which is shaping the consumers' expectations. And while I do not expect to use this feature more than a couple times a month it would make me reconsider using it as my main phone (I'll be using it as development platform, so it doesn't matter for now). I think that this design should be reconsidered as soon as possible if Openmoko really wants to go into the consumer market. PS: What about streaming media from the net? Any musings and/or actual experiences with that? If I interpreted Carsten right 640x480 video will display at 5-10 fps at best, right? Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) schrieb: On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 09:24:26 +0200 polz [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: On Thursday 24 April 2008 05:52:52 Carsten Haitzler wrote: On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 18:28:40 +0200 thomasg [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: yup. those 7m/sec (that's write to video ram) is also shared with SD card IO. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that this means it should be impossible to playback videos in full-screen from an SD card on a gta02. 640*480*25 = 768 and that's with 8bpp. Has anyone tested video playback on a GTA02 yet ? correct. yuv will be w * h * 1.5 bytes for 1 frame (standard video yuv). so 3240x240*1.5*30 (320x240 @ 30fps) = 3.4m/sec - BUT... when u are copying you have ZERO cpu cycles to decode the next video frame. so that means 50% of cpu cycles will be spent ONLY copying video data to video ram. the other 50% u have left to decode the mpeg1/2/4 or whatever video in system ram to a yuv buffer. i would say this is the realistic highest resolution you will get. [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the MOST you will get (6.9m/sec), but u have ZERO (or almost) cpu cycles to actually decode the video into yuv. remember here i am assuming use of xvideo and the yuv to rgb conversion and scaling on the glamo - which xglamo does support. if you do software yuv-rgb + scale then its even less fun. with software. the best u will get is 11fps at 640x480 - and this is NO cpu cycles to actually decode the video, convert it to 16bit rgb and scale. in reality i expect you to see 2-5fps in this scenario, maybe eve 1fps. this is ONLY playback if the video data is already in ram - ie the mpeg data is cached. if it is read off internal flash you will pay an IO cost - but it's not shared with the glamo bus. if it is on SD card - you will basically have to now share the IO between SD and graphics. i believe the graphics IO takes precedence over SD card IO, so as long as u keep the glamo gfx bus busy, sd will be on hold until u stop. then some sd io can get through. with the glamo you need to be careful what you do and how you do it. if you can keep something entirely within the glamo - it should be ok. so things like uploaded pixmaps and then blitting them around is ok. video decode is another matter entirely. the glamo has an mpeg4 decoder on it - but we don't have any api to access that directly/sanely and just feed it an mpeg4 stream. any other codec has to be done on the cpu anyway and uploaded across the bus as yuv data. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Video Playback virtually impossible on Neo Freerunner? (Re: Video of Qt 4.4 on Neo1973: brings iPhone like graphics)
I know and I'm sorry if I was missunderstood I'm not complaining about I will be unable to play video, I complaining about Have a 640x480 resolution screen and not able to play at 640x480 resolution. Well more than complaining about this is that I believe that with that cpu and graphical power I will be able to do that, maybe not now but developing the glamo drivers it would be posible, but today I realize that is a bus issue so no matter how much Hz and features drivers had read the sd and play 640x480x25fps at time doesn't fit in the pipe, and we cannot change the tube. But again is all about my own expectations and the ignorace about the shared sd/graphics bus issue. Cuestions:, It will be able to play full screen at 480*320*25=5.6 m/s ? 1.4 M/s is enought to read the video on the sd at same time?? I if I not wrong mp4 ratio is 16:1 so 1.4*16=22.4 max raw video data in the 1.4 pipe so seems to be enough even for a less cpu eater video compresion. I will be able to live with a little pixelation ;)(a lot of irony in this phrase in the era of youtube fullscreen videos on 1280x1024 screen) --- Peter Kraker [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: As written by raster, you can play video at lower resolution. Also implementing support for mpeg4 should help a great deal. David Samblas Martinez pravi: I'm gonna still buy the freerunner when as soon as it become avialble and I will work as hard as my non-linux-freak life let me do it. But I have to admit than this video limitation in the neo's video has dissapoint me very deeply. The good news is that I have been disapointed BEFORE I have bought the neo and even Before the freerunner is released so OM gives me the oportunity to decide and evaluate if this is a stopper to buy this phone or not. Can any of the core team confirm this video limitations? --- Christoph Witzany [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: As I understood Video playback will be virtually impossible on the freerunner, at least from the sd card (which is the only sensible location to store videos on the neo ftm). Please correct me if I misunderstood. Well that could have the potential to kill the Freerunner as consumer product. Just because virtually every other 100$ phone does it which is shaping the consumers' expectations. And while I do not expect to use this feature more than a couple times a month it would make me reconsider using it as my main phone (I'll be using it as development platform, so it doesn't matter for now). I think that this design should be reconsidered as soon as possible if Openmoko really wants to go into the consumer market. PS: What about streaming media from the net? Any musings and/or actual experiences with that? If I interpreted Carsten right 640x480 video will display at 5-10 fps at best, right? Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) schrieb: On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 09:24:26 +0200 polz [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: On Thursday 24 April 2008 05:52:52 Carsten Haitzler wrote: On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 18:28:40 +0200 thomasg [EMAIL PROTECTED] babbled: yup. those 7m/sec (that's write to video ram) is also shared with SD card IO. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that this means it should be impossible to playback videos in full-screen from an SD card on a gta02. 640*480*25 = 768 and that's with 8bpp. Has anyone tested video playback on a GTA02 yet ? correct. yuv will be w * h * 1.5 bytes for 1 frame (standard video yuv). so 3240x240*1.5*30 (320x240 @ 30fps) = 3.4m/sec - BUT... when u are copying you have ZERO cpu cycles to decode the next video frame. so that means 50% of cpu cycles will be spent ONLY copying video data to video ram. the other 50% u have left to decode the mpeg1/2/4 or whatever video in system ram to a yuv buffer. i would say this is the realistic highest resolution you will get. [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the MOST you will get (6.9m/sec), but u have ZERO (or almost) cpu cycles to actually decode the video into yuv. remember here i am assuming use of xvideo and the yuv to rgb conversion and scaling on the glamo - which xglamo does support. if you do software yuv-rgb + scale then its even less fun. with software. the best u will get is 11fps at 640x480 - and this is NO cpu cycles to actually decode the video, convert it to 16bit rgb and scale. in reality i expect you to see 2-5fps in this scenario, maybe eve 1fps. this is ONLY playback if the video data is already
RE: Newbee wants to kick start - second try
No realease date yet, but we are closer than ever... I was waiting for it so long that when I got one in my hands I will miss this waiting for feeeling. --- Adilson Oliveira [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hello. Sorry for being pushy but I've seem even blank emails being answered, I wonder why mine wasn't the first time so I decided to try again :) I've been fascinated for this project for some time and now, with the proximity of the Freerunner release, I want to start to be a bit more active. I also have been following this list for a few days and I would like to have some clarifications. - - Looks like there's some movement towards pre-sales of the freerunner. Is there something set for Latin America (I'm in Brazil)? I didn't see any in the wiki page so I suppose there's none yet, right? Can I start one or is there any pre-requisites? - - Next month I'll in in Europe and I could use this time to grab mine. Is the release time of the freerunner already set? - - I've being reading about a project to implement cryptography on Openmoko so the calls and text messages can be secured, unfortunately I forgot the name of the project but I've heard that voice calls can't be secured like that due limitations on the way GSM work. Is this correct? Thanks and []s Adilson. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIEIF/2cB5Bt7H7YARAud+AKCU9lMbjg857XttODOc+1V7GozvbgCfVxz5 5J0ahZkXOLyob7Gzs0ySGS4= =85Tz -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: 10 PACK UPDATE!!!
a pouch, a headset ... and a the Y cable(or the cable+connectors+schema to do it yourself) . Well, I have to try it ;) steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I decided to do something EXTRA for the groups of people who are uniting to execute a group sales. Every 10 pack, will come with a box of stuff. 10 pouches and 10 head sets. So if you join a group sales organization and buy with other people, then the 10 pack will include these extras. Sean and I are so happy with the way the community is coming together around this idea of group sales that it just made sense. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GTA03 wish list (was: What US plans are people using?)
Challenge is not a obligation nor a contract nor even a requirement , but if neo's has been designed without any stylus holder is because the intention is not to need it in day by day (common) use, but there is a lot of good stylus friendly applications out there ready to be used so every is free include it in his neo and OM with his package manager for sure will be happy to include in his repository to an easy and happy install.them But for sure a lot of this applications can become(or new ones directly created to be) finger friendly and if anybody (OM team included) consider that this worth the effort it will do. As long I was able to see naturally those applications that make sense to be managed on the run(phone calls/messaging, players, gps even a doc viewer) will be more likely to be used by fingers only; but those that need more attention to manage and a lot of features/options/paremetric/precision needing will be more difficult and meaningless to be managed without stylus. A better description about soft included or to be included finger/stylus ready here And now will come the free source magic, that a lot of newcomers, and even lazy veterans are afraid of... If you don't like it , you are free to change it or try to convince any one to do it for you, to do so try good arguments and reasons and if it doesn't work try to use the money , it's incredible how many developers agree to work for money ;) An remember if you don't want to carry the stylus everywhere you can always enter a bar and take a toothstick :) (for sure I will have to do it more than one time) Kevin Dean [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 1:28 PM, Steven ** wrote: I don't think the games were ported. I thought they were just a simply cross-compile to show that they would work on Openmoko. I think the intention is that you should be able to do most things without a stylus. It says essentially that on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Applications#Overview That said, this is opensource! You can't force every developer to design their program for finger operation. A point of clarification... I'm not referring to every app, I'm referring specifically to the applications that Openmoko will be releasing. Perhaps this is an incorrect assumption, but I am under the impression that Openmoko Inc. will be writing and releasing software to do the things their hardware devices are advertised as being able to do. They say GPS Navigation and I assume Openmoko Inc. will provide customers with a GPS navigation application. Same for dialer (since the device is advertised as being able to make phone calls) and so on. the device isn't advertised as a home automation remote control, but it MIGHT be if the user decided to go beyond what the consumer device is being sold to do. Someone can write an application in Qt 4.4 and SAY it's a Gnome application, but it's not. Likewise, if it doesn't conform to the guidelines specified for Openmoko it's not really an Openmoko app, if that makes sense. Some app just might not be usable without a stylus and that's up to the developer. If you don't like it, modify the source and change the GUI. Keep in mind that Freerunner is designed to be a mass market product. That's very true that this can be done but making that action a REQUIREMENT for consistant applications is directly opposite the ideas of a mass market device. The one thing I've written[1] was specifically designed to be finger-friendly as I don't intend to carry a stylus around with me either. -Steven [1] http://projects.openmoko.org/projects/moko-sudoku/ On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 12:00 PM, Kevin Dean wrote: On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Stroller wrote: One of the objectives of openmoko is to no need to use the stylus at all ... When devels talk about mokofy (port to openmoko) some aplication one of the chalenges is to use it with out stylus. Either this is NOT a real goal of Openmoko or the developers suck at it. There are SEVERAL applications on Openmoko that require a stylus (many of the games, for instance). As far as I know, the criteria Openmoko apps must be usable with fingers has never been set. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! La bandeja de entrada más inteligente. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update
Hey there is nothing more dearly than a happy developer dancing after a successfull test. :) Regarding colors, maybe in the massmarket phase being able to customice your case as a lot of comercial moviles will be a plus to fashion victims ( My female work college has his laptop, movile phone and mp3 all in hello-kitty pink!!!) but in this stage of the process where developers are the target, no matter what case neo has, meanwhile it do the job of protect their precious inner electronics. I not agree with the stiker solutions because is matter of time than the stiker become ugly rubbished and the hole phone become stiky. The paint-it-yourself solution if you find a combination of case material//markers really permanet will be an original and great feature. sure there are some aerograph artist within us than can make very cool designs. --- ramsesoriginal [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 11:49 PM, steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: what you guys actually want to see me dance? Oh hm... YES! xD and also some of my female (and even male) friends asked about coloring: the preferred ones: -red -pink (yes, really) -blue -kiwi-green -- My corner of the web: http://blog.ramsesoriginal.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Tu correo también desde el móvil. Descárgate gratis Yahoo! Go. http://es.mobile.yahoo.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update
I wanna see a video of that happy dance xD --- steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I think Michael and I were supposed to test the 8GB version. Actually Michael tests and I say wow and great and then do the happy dance. He'll be back soon. We will revert on this. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marco Trevisan (Treviño) Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 4:30 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update Ivo Anjo wrote: Finally, the miniSD card, DEFINITELY leave it off, unless you get a really really really good deal, because you can buy very high-capacity nowadays, so it doesn't make much sense to pay for 512mb or such on the neo, and then buy a multi-gb one (I am definitely getting one of those myself). I agree, I'll buy one soon too, but what's the maximum capacity actually supported (I've seen the wiki, but there are no so much tests)? I'd like to buy an 8Gb Mini-SD card... -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Tu correo también desde el móvil. Descárgate gratis Yahoo! Go. http://es.mobile.yahoo.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Happy dance (Was FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update)
Well I hope you do only the celebration part of the video and those black things hited by the sticks are not neos steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: The Happy dance http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypnlOJjC368 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Samblas Martinez Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2008 6:17 AM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: RE: FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update I wanna see a video of that happy dance xD --- steve escribió: I think Michael and I were supposed to test the 8GB version. Actually Michael tests and I say wow and great and then do the happy dance. He'll be back soon. We will revert on this. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Marco Trevisan (Treviño) Sent: Monday, April 14, 2008 4:30 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update Ivo Anjo wrote: Finally, the miniSD card, DEFINITELY leave it off, unless you get a really really really good deal, because you can buy very high-capacity nowadays, so it doesn't make much sense to pay for 512mb or such on the neo, and then buy a multi-gb one (I am definitely getting one of those myself). I agree, I'll buy one soon too, but what's the maximum capacity actually supported (I've seen the wiki, but there are no so much tests)? I'd like to buy an 8Gb Mini-SD card... -- Treviño's World - Life and Linux http://www.3v1n0.net/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Tu correo también desde el móvil. Descárgate gratis Yahoo! Go. http://es.mobile.yahoo.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! Disfruta de una bandeja de entrada más inteligente.. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FreeRunner Pricing and PVT update
count on my vote on this one, Y cable must be a must ;) --- ramsesoriginal [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Ivo Anjo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It would be cool also if the Y-cable needed for powered usb host was included. Since I understand that the cable is kind of custom, and that's one of the highlights of the neo (being able to connect usb stuff directly to it), I think it should be included. [SNIP] Now that's a good idea. +1 on this one! -- My corner of the web: http://blog.ramsesoriginal.org ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Tu correo también desde el móvil. Descárgate gratis Yahoo! Go. http://es.mobile.yahoo.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: (no subject)
You have created a thread with more than 2 replies... YOU ARE IN Wellcome :), Now can be a little more precise on that need and maybe we can help a little more --- Thinesh thusinthaka [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I need to get into the community... add me in.. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! Disfruta de una bandeja de entrada más inteligente. http://es.docs.yahoo.com/mail/overview/index.html ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OpenMoko and accessories design
Hi Michele once I can adquire a GTA2 one of the hacking task I would like to do is to attach a common web cam and do pictures/video capture. If it works fine I will try to protototype a way to attach it to the neo that seems integrated with the phone it self. Another thing I'm wishing to do is use that webcam whitout the ir filter to use neo as night vision device ;) --- Michele Renda [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: I am happy this interest someone. The advantages of an external mini usb camera is: 1. It does not require reproject of hardware (it is nice to have autoalimented usb port :) 2. It can be bought only if a person want, who don't like don't buy it. 3. It can be upgrader with a better version if for example I need a 15 Mpixel webcam :) (I am joking) or if I need to replace because the cam is not well running (image noise) The disavantage: 1. is an external module and I think he need an clip to link well to the openmodo I don't think it must produced by openmoko firm, but it will be nice to be produced by an external firm that can have a very potential market. I want now that openmoko team will be concentrated on the develop of Openmoko (core) so I can change my phone :) The only thing that is needed is that: 1. Mini usb port support 2. Can clip stable to Freerunner phone (I don't think he can support only on mini-usb port) 3. The full support by linux kernel 4. (optional but it will be nice) open hardware specification My 2 cent 2008/3/13, Andy Green [EMAIL PROTECTED]: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: That is a nice idea, would like to have an accessory like that to make my neo into a camera, when I need it... It is a nice idea. The Y cable is a nice idea too. But (it's just my personal take) the problem with loading up any new things on this product right now is - we didn't sell any yet :-) - everyone is running around in headless chicken mode trying to finalize production, their brains are not configured for new tasks right now I think the way forward is to prototype these ideas on a GTA02 and document it and what it does, where it is useful, then after the current storm dies down it is accessible to explain what the idea is to the people that can yea or nay it. For these external USB accessories, it is exactly the kind of thing users can hack on, including the kernel side if needed (although USB device support in Linux can already be adequate for many tasks). If a couple of folks did it and are going on about how much it rocked and to show what they achieved this speaks very loudly. I started prototyping the Y cable, but of course the wiring for a mini USB cable does not include ID normally :-/ Later I will edit the cable of one of the chargers I have here to do it that way. Really I think this kind of user-driven Wah! We could do THIS!!! is great and it is exactly the idea of the product, but unlike a closed product we really CAN do it without petitioning the company, and within reason I'm pretty sure supporting this kind of hacking endeavour from my side is part of my job description. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFH2PRVOjLpvpq7dMoRAv2UAJkBwbnmzZjjs8H8kWfBvZaLFtC/2wCeJRgY hxMic6U/rxMSLPXgmCvuznk= =AO8g -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! El buzón de correo sin límite de almacenamiento. http://es.docs.yahoo.com/mail/overview/index.html ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: freerunner: charging and usb-host mutually exclusive?
I think this cable must be included in the basic packaging!!!( well in the advance packaging at last) If you can plug at time in dc power and usb periphals whith a usb hub and a keyboard (it can be bluetooth or usb!!) you can convert in few seconds a mobile phone in a mini ultraportable desktop computer you can carry any where in your pocket !!! --- Ivo Anjo [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Nice. So you'll only need a special cable do be able go charge and usb-host at the same time? As this cable is a custom one, might be an interesting addition to the openmoko store that was being discussed on some other thread, so hardware-challenged people like me can purchase it. Ivo On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 5:11 AM, Brad Midgley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: thanks joerg I've tried to write this up as succinctly as I can. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_GTA02_Hardware#USB_Host In the end this means: the 47k ID-R should be in the Y-adapter, and you may use arbitrary usb-chargers (1A) with it for quick-charge. However the OM-charger will most probably have an own 47k, so you can use it without the Y-adapter. -- Brad ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! El correo favorito de los internautas. http://es.docs.yahoo.com/mail/overview/index.html ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Using Qemu for GTA02
I'm interested too, seems that there is some work done http://svnweb.openmoko.org/trunk/src/host/qemu-neo1973/openmoko/README?rev=3614view=markup to simulate the wifi , but I don't see anything on accelerometers simulation. More detailed information will be apreciated --- François TOURDE [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Hi, I've not found in the Wiki how to run GTA02 and associated OM images on a qemu. Is it possible? Thanks in advance for any link/idea. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! Disfruta de una bandeja de entrada más inteligente. http://es.docs.yahoo.com/mail/overview/index.html ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: MiniOne
News from http://www.meizu-spain.es/ ** Noticias mundo MEIZU ** El móvil M8 Mini One, no estará a la venta hasta el tercer trimestre 2008. Translation: The movil phone M8 Mini One will not be aviable to buy until last tree months of 2008 Who will arrive first FreeRunner or M8? Gabriel Ambuehl [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Thursday 06 March 2008 09:57:22 Mario Wewer wrote: Hello community, does anyone of you already have a Meizu MiniOne Phone? You mean it's *not* vapor ware but actually for sale? ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - Enviado desde Correo Yahoo! Disfruta de una bandeja de entrada más inteligente.. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Any experience with this BT keyboard?
I was dreaming/whishing/fantasizing about owning a Freerunner and I finally decide that for a lot of funny things(make long documents, programing, be more geeker, etc..) it will be very recomendable to have an external Keyboard, but as portable as the Neo itself so. I was googling and I have found this affordable BT keyboard (in spanish layout also :)) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=150219917678ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:US:1123 I have found no any reference in linux about compatibility(or lack of it) so if any one has experience or has a Neo and want to try If it works I maybe buy one of this before the phone __ ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? Sé un mejor Amigo. Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas http://es.answers.yahoo.com/info/welcome ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
screen orientation sensible already developed?
After see this video, is clear that change the orientation of the screen is already in almost one openmoko relesase , doesn't care if in real alpha state or not, it exist and works almost one time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btY2SFVrOscNR=1 where can I find actualice information about status of development and if in almost usable state donwload to see how is done ( I barely understand on bash code, sigh ) but to I have been able to develop and successufully compile a (great qualified) mathematical simulation on C whith treads control on my old faithful jornada 680 sh3 processor at 133 Mz with 32M in a minimal a but wonderfull Jlime gnu/Linux distribution. I suppose I will be able to hack anything when this precious arribe at my hands,... So the cuestion s are: Is have been developed interaction with the accelerometers, yet?, What's the library/ies to interact that include the rotate_mokocanvas_freaking _sweet(degrees deg) function? What's the library/ies to interact that include the int Hey_dude_how_many_horizontal_degrees_you_are_right_now() function/daemon? regards - ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? - Sé un mejor Amigo Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: iPhone Acquired!
Shawn Rutledge [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Kyle Bassett wrote: I am still debating lending the phone out to those who want to play with it, depending on the interest of the community, we'll see where it goes. Sounds like Mickey needs to play with it so he can see what all the fuss is about. :-) After that, uh hack it? port Linux to it? :-) (but naturally that's in the works already) Where is information about this works??? - ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? - Sé un mejor Amigo Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 25 native [iPhone|OpenMoko] we hope to see
I agree with kenneth , visit http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_Core_Applications and http://projects.openmoko.org to do the matching beetween this list and the developed/working progress/planned application for openmoko but there is one on this list that is not in any of the pages above. 22. Digital level Is any side of the phone straigh enough to be able to develop such a freaking geek widget? I could be a funny exercice to play with the accelerometers. --- kenneth marken [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Monday 03 March 2008 13:44:53 Breakable wrote: Hello there, I found this link in Google news. Its a list of applications users might want for iPhone. http://www.macworld.com/article/132322/2008/03/iphoneapps.html I think by replacing iPhone with OpenMoko we would not make a big mistake. Regards, Ignas heh, i suspect that many of those are in the works or will show up as the openmoko phones start to spread out. some of those can even be done by ports of existing software, like pidgin for im support of any kind. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? Sé un mejor Amigo. Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas http://es.answers.yahoo.com/info/welcome ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 25 native [iPhone|OpenMoko] we hope to see
I was thinking on freerunner not 1973 sorry gora Andrea Debortoli [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: FreeRunner has accelerometers... http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner_GTA02_Hardware#Accelerometers GTA01 does not :-( 2008/3/3, Gora Mohanty [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 16:17:42 +0100 (CET) David Samblas Martinez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [...] 22. Digital level Is any side of the phone straigh enough to be able to develop such a freaking geek widget? I could be a funny exercice to play with the accelerometers. [...] The Neo 1973 does not have accelerometers, does it? The above would tickle my geek bone enough to do it if the Neo 1973 had accelerometers. I have an old Simputer that does have accelerometers, and has a great game which is a computer analogue of a child's handheld game. The real-life game is usually made out of cheap plastic, and has a series of concentric circular ridges with offset openings. A set of (usually) three ball bearings can be rolled around along the ridges. The objective of the game is to get all three bearings into the inner most circle. See http://brainchunk.blogspot.com/2007/11/n95-application-wishlist-golgoli-game.html for a picture of the game. Regards, Gora ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? - Sé un mejor Amigo Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Picture Viewer geocaching
I was reading about the software will be implemented on OM in the wiki and I found that http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Picture_Viewer. I was thinking about gps and usb host capabilities of the Neo Freerunner, and that nearby any digital photo camera is recogniced as usb mass storage so if you plug a digital camera to the usb port of the neo we can geomark writing the exif information in the pictures. To be able to do this a gps traker log has to be recorded previously on the neo (for sure this will be a default feature on the neo) , the digital camera has to be time syncroniced with the neo (any digital camera can change his hour/date in the setup) and that's all!!!, because there is software already developed and GPLed that can do the rest gpscorrelate http://freefoote.dview.net/linux_gpscorr.html Can do the matching on the gps data loged (GPX format)and the exif time information of the picture and writes the gps data in the exif tag of the picture GPSBabel http://www.gpsbabel.org Able to translate any Gps format(including raw NMEA 0183 sentences) to a lot of other formats (GPX included) Exiv2 http://www.exiv2.org/ Library to read/write exif information So the only work to do is to integrate all this in the Picture Viewer maybe with some scripting or directily ind the Picture viewer code. This can make the neo a very usefull companion to any digital camera. Once the Picture Viewer development is more advanced I will like to be involved to include this feature to it So I got a few questions, Any usb issue known? I gess the 100mA power usb host will be enough to use whit the camera (maybe not to charge the battery but to read/write the photos) I have to edit the wiki page to include this feature in the picture viewer or first it has to be discussed here to know if the community wants it or not? Is the picture viewer the real place to do that? If the picture viewer can select and perform actions(rotate,delete,...)can add geocatch action to them. But any othe idea that simplifies the procces will be wellcome An geocatch deamon to automatic geocath the picures once the camera is pluged on the neo if gps data in this time frame is available is a complementary solution 24 hour of gps data log how big (in bytes or multiples) can be? I have no expercience with gps tracking so I hope I have not said any no sense idea Keep on going, guys/girls!!! __ ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? Sé un mejor Amigo. Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas http://es.answers.yahoo.com/info/welcome ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Picture Viewer geocaching
Ok I will auto-answer to this question based on you answer with more accuracy data based on http://www.eoss.org/pubs/nmeafaq.htm NMEA 0183 sentences= up to 82 Ascii chars--one sentence per second--82 bytes per second so 60*60*24*82=7084800 based on zzip examples text compresion http://debin.net/zzip/results.php aprox 5:1 ratio text compresion so 7084800/5=1416960---1,35Mbytes each day of raw NMEA zziped data For sure there will be more efficient ways to store GPS Track information (maybe GPX xml format, or JOSM storage data format) but as worst case NMEA raw format makes me think you can store easyly a full week of gps data in less than 10MB. So I hope this information will be usefull to any one , for me it has been a good exercice to know more about gps --- Schmidt András [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: David Samblas Martinez wrote: 24 hour of gps data log how big (in bytes or multiples) can be? I have no expercience with gps tracking so I hope I have not said any no sense idea That's easy to count. Let's say you log 100 bytes every second (that's more than enough for longitude, latitude, timestamp, velocity, height and some satellite information). Then that will be 60*60*24*100=864 bytes for a whole day. That's about 9M. If you just need location and timestamp then it is 16-20 bytes per sample and can be dramatically compacted using differential encoding. If you are interested in Geocaching you should check the Yama map viewer project: http://yamamap.wiki.sourceforge.net/ It has an online Demo applet here: http://yamamap.org/demo.php Schmidt András ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community __ ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? Sé un mejor Amigo. Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas http://es.answers.yahoo.com/info/welcome ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
official Photo browser/manager in openMoko?
Hi all, I was searching for any clue about this topic in the wiki or in pojects web site and I didn't found anything clear yet. There is any Photo browser/manager that will be distributed with openmoko? If there isn't yet, there is any candidate in development/adaptation? (doesn't care if is pre-pre-pre alpha) Regards David PD. I will start some treads about diferent isuess (no spamming) becouse I prefer to maitain them separate to clear reading __ ¿Con Mascota por primera vez? Sé un mejor Amigo. Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas http://es.answers.yahoo.com/info/welcome ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: YAMA - Map Application intended for OpenMoko
Hey!!! this looks very interesting!!!, in spite of I have a good score in C practices , I were unable to afford a c development , and nor even understand very well what others are doing in their code. But java is easier(for me, is a totally subjective opinion olny formed for my skills and knowledge, no flames please) and I think a really working open java machine running on a ultra portable machine with acces to a gps, a wifi, gprs, accelerometers I'm salivating as Hommer in front of a beer fountain. I'm waiting for the v2 to spend those amount of money (yes is cheaper than any other with this characteristics even cheaper than more with a lot less characteristis, but for me stills a money effort :) ) and have it as substitute of my phone/mp3/Jornada 680 handheld(runnig Jlime, I have done my OS practice with this little one) and even with a keyboard as a laptop replacement some times. But now I think I even can develop apps on(and for) it. Any one have experience in Jlimo , in openmoko? , even an emulated one?... I will try to setup an Virutal neo on my machine to try it , when I finish the exams on January. Al Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: On Thursday 06 December 2007, Bartlomiej Zdanowski [Zdanek] wrote: Is somebody planning to let out Java on OpenMoko? https://wiki.evolvis.org/jalimo/index.php/Main_Page ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - ¿Chef por primera vez? - Sé un mejor Cocinillas. Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WOW this video is really impressive, if there was not for the little swinging of the camera at the end of the video , seems too smooth to be real as a photoshoped thing of fake, but the mistakes, perhaps mistake is to hard to descrive it better mechanical noises in zoom and positioning, or the author is a little advanced on infographics or it seems very real!!! By the way. The Neo will come with the pen/pointer used in the video?? Jonathon Suggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: That does look pretty impressive especially considering that hardware acceleration isn't implemented. But now my question is how does e17, OKL4, raster, etc. all fit into the overall OpenMoko equation? -Jonathon -Original Message- From: Oliver Reply-To: List for OpenMoko community discussion To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 19:45:52 +0100 Hey guys, there's even a video of fancypants showing video on the Neo: http://www.fluffyspider.com/demos/live_videos/flv/fancypants-openmoko-neo1973-video-browser-phone-dialer.html Woo! /Oliver ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community - ¡Descubre una nueva forma de obtener respuestas a tus preguntas! Entra en Yahoo! Respuestas. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE:Multitouch
Refering to Multitouch, any one have take a look at MPX: The Multi-Pointer X Server (http://wearables.unisa.edu.au/mpx/) seems to bee what we are talking about.. and open-source. Any brave dev try to compile it on the little machine? Regards Sé un Mejor Amante del Cine ¿Quieres saber cómo? ¡Deja que otras personas te ayuden! http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/reto/entretenimiento.html ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re Multitouch
:) It looks like I have read more before open my mouth. Thank Flo to discover me this interesting part of the wiki. Regarding the open question about Will the neo/openmoko graphics system be powerful enough for such uses? in the end of the wiki, there any conclusion yet? An regardin is multi touch really that awesome? I think yes of course, but maybe not in a so little screen and surelly it is not worth the trouble of re-coding a lot of stuff to make it work. Sé un Mejor Amante del Cine ¿Quieres saber cómo? ¡Deja que otras personas te ayuden! http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/reto/entretenimiento.html ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
