Re: [Tinkerphones] Fwd: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko: a dream comes true :)

[Norayr Chilingarian]

wow,
going to start it. (:


On Fri, 23 Feb 2018, H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:


Hi,


Am 23.02.2018 um 12:28 schrieb Norayr Chilingarian <nor...@arnet.am>:

I would prefer it to be on github.

Though usually I am the one who supports decentralization, but here are some 
arguments:

* github is a public place, where it is much more probable that your project 
can be discovered by the people who potentially can get involved, even if they 
did not know about the project before.

(many different ways - accidentally, or by following your friends' "likes", or 
by search, or by other means)

* github stimulates people to fork/make pull requests, this work is public, and 
it increases people's social status, when they contribute to the project on the 
public place, where it is noticeable by their community.

On the contrary, by keeping the separate, even public git tree, the chances to 
be discovored and contributed to are much lower.


Your wish is already fulfilled...

It is also (mirrored) on github:

https://github.com/goldelico/gta04-qtmoko

And the page http://git.goldelico.com/?p=gta04-qtmoko.git lists it in the "URL" 
section as

g...@github.com:goldelico/gta04-qtmoko.git

Hope this helps.

BR,
Nikolaus





On Fri, 23 Feb 2018, H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:


Sent again due to 40k message limit on this list...

 Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:
Von: "H. Nikolaus Schaller" <h...@goldelico.com>
Betreff: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko: a dream comes true :)
Datum: 21. Februar 2018 um 20:53:12 MEZ
An: Tinkerphones Community <commun...@tinkerphones.org>, List for
communicating with real GTA04 owners <gta04-ow...@goldelico.com>
Kopie: List for Openmoko community discussion
<community@lists.openmoko.org>
Antwort an: List for communicating with real GTA04 owners
<gta04-ow...@goldelico.com>
Hi,I am happy to announce that after years of
abandonment and obsolescence, QtMoko is back in
maintained mode.
After several failed attempts, we now have a git
tree and a build system where we can apply
modifications and accept patches. And we
need testers :)
Currently, we have a Wheezy and a Jessie based
(different git branches) and both run on the
GTA04(A3, A4, A5) with latest Letux kernels.
Basically QtMoko also starts and runs on the Pyra,
but there is nothing to see on the display yet.
It simply remains black...
Here are the key resources:
Project Home: http://projects.goldelico.com/p/gta04-qtmoko/ - also for
reporting issues
Git: http://git.goldelico.com/?p=gta04-qtmoko.git;a=heads
Downloads: http://download.goldelico.com/letux-debian-rootfs/?C=M;O=D
- look for *-qtmoko.tbz
Install on µSD: DEV=/dev/sdb ./makesd qtmoko - to install a Jessie
based system
Letux-Debian: apt-get install letux-qtmoko - to install if you have
installed a different Letux system
Here are screen photos of QtMoko/Jessie/Kernel-4.15.2
running on a GTA04:


 Some things are not yet working and missing and
some Apps crash after starting, but we are just at
the beginning to be able to fix things.
Of course our little team can't do all that alone.
We need you and the broader community to help with
coding, testing or simply donations if you appreciate
our effort:
http://shop.goldelico.com/wiki.php?page=Product=9607
BR and thanks,
Nikolaus
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Re: Fwd: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko: a dream comes true :)

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I would prefer it to be on github.

Though usually I am the one who supports decentralization, but here are 
some arguments:


* github is a public place, where it is much more probable that your 
project can be discovered by the people who potentially can get involved, 
even if they did not know about the project before.


(many different ways - accidentally, or by following your friends' 
"likes", or by search, or by other means)


* github stimulates people to fork/make pull requests, this work is 
public, and it increases people's social status, when they contribute to 
the project on the public place, where it is noticeable by their 
community.


On the contrary, by keeping the separate, even public git tree, the 
chances to be discovored and contributed to are much lower.


On Fri, 23 Feb 2018, H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:


Sent again due to 40k message limit on this list...

  Anfang der weitergeleiteten Nachricht:

Von: "H. Nikolaus Schaller" 
Betreff: [Gta04-owner] QtMoko: a dream comes true :)
Datum: 21. Februar 2018 um 20:53:12 MEZ
An: Tinkerphones Community , List for
communicating with real GTA04 owners 
Kopie: List for Openmoko community discussion

Antwort an: List for communicating with real GTA04 owners


Hi,I am happy to announce that after years of
abandonment and obsolescence, QtMoko is back in
maintained mode.

After several failed attempts, we now have a git
tree and a build system where we can apply
modifications and accept patches. And we
need testers :)

Currently, we have a Wheezy and a Jessie based
(different git branches) and both run on the
GTA04(A3, A4, A5) with latest Letux kernels.

Basically QtMoko also starts and runs on the Pyra,
but there is nothing to see on the display yet.
It simply remains black...

Here are the key resources:

Project Home: http://projects.goldelico.com/p/gta04-qtmoko/ - also for
reporting issues
Git: http://git.goldelico.com/?p=gta04-qtmoko.git;a=heads
Downloads: http://download.goldelico.com/letux-debian-rootfs/?C=M;O=D
- look for *-qtmoko.tbz
Install on µSD: DEV=/dev/sdb ./makesd qtmoko - to install a Jessie
based system
Letux-Debian: apt-get install letux-qtmoko - to install if you have
installed a different Letux system

Here are screen photos of QtMoko/Jessie/Kernel-4.15.2
running on a GTA04:




  Some things are not yet working and missing and
some Apps crash after starting, but we are just at
the beginning to be able to fix things.

Of course our little team can't do all that alone.
We need you and the broader community to help with
coding, testing or simply donations if you appreciate
our effort:

http://shop.goldelico.com/wiki.php?page=Product=9607

BR and thanks,
Nikolaus

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kde plasma mobile

[Norayr Chilingarian]

yet another possibility https://youtu.be/auuQA0Q8qpM

https://dot.kde.org/2015/07/25/plasma-mobile-free-mobile-platform

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Re: State of FreeCalypso

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Reiser's case is more complicated than that. Anyway let's not bring it.

05/25/15 03:03 -ին Bob Hamը գրել է.
 On Sun, 2015-05-24 at 01:54 -0700, Brolin Empey wrote:
 Bob Ham wrote:
 
 I don't know any other free software developers who
 threaten to murder those who get in the way of their work.

 Hans Reiser? ;-)
 
 Hans Reiser murdered his wife who had left him, not someone who got in
 the way of his work.  Your response is inappropriate and in extremely
 bad taste.
 
 
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Re: GTA02 PCB layout files found!

[Norayr Chilingarian]

okay now i was able to read the full thread and notice that it is the
same project.

04/13/15 01:08 -ին Norayr Chilingarianը գրել է.
 btw there is a free software cellular baseband project
 https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/free-software-cellular-baseband
 
 On Sat, 11 Apr 2015, Spacefalcon the Outlaw wrote:
 
 Nick openmoko-commun...@njw.me.uk wrote:

 Where does that leave the indiegogo campaign? Is the money not
 needed now?

 It is indeed no longer needed for the original purpose for which the
 campaign was started when the original PCB files were believed to have
 been lost.  The campaign page has been updated to reflect this new
 development.  However, if anyone would like to continue donating, the
 money would help me and Shannon - see the update at the bottom of the
 story page.

 Eventually you'll need more funds, presumably, for the
 production parts of the project.

 Yes, and I am not even considering production as in production for
 sale at all at this point - way too premature to even think about it.
 Instead, what the project may need money for in a few months will be
 physical production of the first lab prototypes.

 I am approaching this project in a very different way from how a
 business person would do it.  Business people always talk about what
 they call opportunity costs, and whenever they consider doing any
 project or venture, they always consider the option of *not* doing it.
 When they look at costs, they generally estimate the total cost upfront
 (the total cost to get to the end result), and decide whether or not
 to do the project based on that total cost among other factors.

 But I work differently: I concentrate all of my effort, energy and
 attention on whatever is the immediate next step at each given moment,
 and deliberately abstain from thinking about what costs or challenges
 lie ahead.  I deviate from the proper business way because in that
 proper business way the purpose of realistically estimating the
 total cost to the finish line is to decide whether or not to do the
 project at all, and for me not doing my project is NOT an option: I
 need this project in order to give my life purpose and meaning.
 Therefore, I keep my attention focused on the immediate next step, and
 simply hope for the best when it comes to future difficulties and/or
 costs further down the road.

 Right now the immediate next step is for me and my PCB layout partner
 to produce our own layout for the first prototype we seek to build,
 based on the just-recovered Openmoko one and other available references
 like the Pirelli DP-L10.  This step is pure desk work, i.e., editing
 design files on a computer with the appropriate software tools, so no
 money is needed for the project itself at this point - although my
 family could very much use any help given.

 After this step is done, the results of it will be publicly released:
 a PCB design file in a free EDA tool format and a set of gerbers which
 one can send to a fab to produce a physical board.  (In fact, all work
 is being done in a public source repository, so it's really in a state
 of continuous release, no need to wait for completion.)  Only after
 the design is complete and we have the gerbers for the first prototype
 will I start looking into how much it would cost to physically produce
 that first prototype board from those gerbers.  It will probably be
 several months from now, so hopefully by then my personal/family
 financial situation will improve (the current hardship is expected to
 last about 4 months), and I may be able to afford that step on my own
 - and if not, it'll be time for another crowdfunding campaign then.

 Speaking of which, are you planning
 to sell the phones you produce yourself, eventually? Or outsource
 it?

 I do plan on offering finished products (initially standalone modems
 for playful use with laptops etc, and later phones) up for retail sale
 to end users, but whenever someone complains about my asking price
 being too high, I'll point them to the freely released gerber, BOM etc
 files and invite them to try producing it themselves for less.

 VLR,
 SF

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Re: GTA02 PCB layout files found!

[Norayr Chilingarian]

btw there is a free software cellular baseband project 
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/free-software-cellular-baseband


On Sat, 11 Apr 2015, Spacefalcon the Outlaw wrote:


Nick openmoko-commun...@njw.me.uk wrote:


Where does that leave the indiegogo campaign? Is the money not
needed now?


It is indeed no longer needed for the original purpose for which the
campaign was started when the original PCB files were believed to have
been lost.  The campaign page has been updated to reflect this new
development.  However, if anyone would like to continue donating, the
money would help me and Shannon - see the update at the bottom of the
story page.


Eventually you'll need more funds, presumably, for the
production parts of the project.


Yes, and I am not even considering production as in production for
sale at all at this point - way too premature to even think about it.
Instead, what the project may need money for in a few months will be
physical production of the first lab prototypes.

I am approaching this project in a very different way from how a
business person would do it.  Business people always talk about what
they call opportunity costs, and whenever they consider doing any
project or venture, they always consider the option of *not* doing it.
When they look at costs, they generally estimate the total cost upfront
(the total cost to get to the end result), and decide whether or not
to do the project based on that total cost among other factors.

But I work differently: I concentrate all of my effort, energy and
attention on whatever is the immediate next step at each given moment,
and deliberately abstain from thinking about what costs or challenges
lie ahead.  I deviate from the proper business way because in that
proper business way the purpose of realistically estimating the
total cost to the finish line is to decide whether or not to do the
project at all, and for me not doing my project is NOT an option: I
need this project in order to give my life purpose and meaning.
Therefore, I keep my attention focused on the immediate next step, and
simply hope for the best when it comes to future difficulties and/or
costs further down the road.

Right now the immediate next step is for me and my PCB layout partner
to produce our own layout for the first prototype we seek to build,
based on the just-recovered Openmoko one and other available references
like the Pirelli DP-L10.  This step is pure desk work, i.e., editing
design files on a computer with the appropriate software tools, so no
money is needed for the project itself at this point - although my
family could very much use any help given.

After this step is done, the results of it will be publicly released:
a PCB design file in a free EDA tool format and a set of gerbers which
one can send to a fab to produce a physical board.  (In fact, all work
is being done in a public source repository, so it's really in a state
of continuous release, no need to wait for completion.)  Only after
the design is complete and we have the gerbers for the first prototype
will I start looking into how much it would cost to physically produce
that first prototype board from those gerbers.  It will probably be
several months from now, so hopefully by then my personal/family
financial situation will improve (the current hardship is expected to
last about 4 months), and I may be able to afford that step on my own
- and if not, it'll be time for another crowdfunding campaign then.


Speaking of which, are you planning
to sell the phones you produce yourself, eventually? Or outsource
it?


I do plan on offering finished products (initially standalone modems
for playful use with laptops etc, and later phones) up for retail sale
to end users, but whenever someone complains about my asking price
being too high, I'll point them to the freely released gerber, BOM etc
files and invite them to try producing it themselves for less.

VLR,
SF

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Re: OT: Ubuntu phone HTML5 / QML

[Norayr Chilingarian]

also there is sailfish.

03/21/15 12:40 -ին Norayr Chilingarianը գրել է.
 meanwhile, let's not forget that Ubuntu Touch can be ported to thus
 installed on GTA04/5 board.
 
 03/19/15 11:31 -ին Matthias Apitzը գրել է.
 El día Monday, March 16, 2015 a las 08:46:09AM +0100, Ed Kapitein escribió:

 I did order the ubuntu phone and can't wait to test it out!

 Hi Ed,

 Could you please send me a signal when yours arrive. I ordered mine on
 March 12 and have already the discount on my creditcard, but no device
 yet :-)

 Do you know any good mailing list or forum (read: for tech people) to 
 interchange
 questions and test results etc.?

 Thx

  matthias

 
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Re: OT: Ubuntu phone HTML5 / QML

[Norayr Chilingarian]

meanwhile, let's not forget that Ubuntu Touch can be ported to thus
installed on GTA04/5 board.

03/19/15 11:31 -ին Matthias Apitzը գրել է.
 El día Monday, March 16, 2015 a las 08:46:09AM +0100, Ed Kapitein escribió:
 
 I did order the ubuntu phone and can't wait to test it out!
 
 Hi Ed,
 
 Could you please send me a signal when yours arrive. I ordered mine on
 March 12 and have already the discount on my creditcard, but no device
 yet :-)
 
 Do you know any good mailing list or forum (read: for tech people) to 
 interchange
 questions and test results etc.?
 
 Thx
 
   matthias
 

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Re: Free phone: smart or not?

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Hey,

I don't talk on phone. I just don't talk. I chat. I email.
That's why I don't need a dumbphone. I need a device with a full operating 
system so I can compile my preferred applications for it. If I need a gsm 
then I need it to get an Internet connection. Then I can use ssl/tor for 
chatting, browsing, whatever.


On Mon, 16 Mar 2015, Spacefalcon the Outlaw wrote:


g...@unixarea.de wrote:


I'm using since 2008 the FR as my one and only cellphone. This is not
lying, it is just a fact. And I do not know any other person from this
list who is doing so.


Nick openmoko-commun...@njw.me.uk followed:


I am too. The only thing that makes me tempted to switch phones is=20
redphone or chatsecure, basically. The GTA02 sucks, in some ways,=20
but I have no plans to buy a less free phone than it, so I'll stay=20
where I am for now.


I am very glad to see a couple of people using their Freerunners and
not switching to anything less free.  But I just can't help but wonder:
are you using your FR because it's free or because it's a smartphone?
In other words, if there were a phone just as free as the FR, i.e.,
full source code for everything (including the GSM radio interface)
without any binary blobs, full hardware schematics, free bootloader
w/o any locks etc, but a dumbphone instead of a smartphone - a small,
non-touch-sensitive LCD, a traditional numeric button pad for dialing
and T9 texting, a processor with just enough horsepower to make/receive
calls and send/receive SMS and not one iota more, and an OS-less
firmware architecture optimized specifically for those functions -
would you wish to use such a phone?

What I find almost tragic about the history of this community is that
someone effectively jumped the gun on evolution: produced a free
smartphone (Openmoko) without producing a free dumbphone first.  Some
of us are life-long dumbphone users, but are very unhappy about the
fact that all existing dumbphones are 100% closed and proprietary,
with no ability for an end user to fix functional bugs herself or to
make her own changes to the user interface code in the firmware.

I currently use my Freerunner as a development platform and nothing
more: I use its modem block as a BUV (bring-up vehicle) to run my
experimental FreeCalypso firmware before porting the latter to
dumbphone hardware targets.  But I don't use it as my personal phone
with an end user hat on.  I don't do the latter because I have too
much intrinsic personal revulsion against the idea of using an entire
second processor running a full-blown GNU/Linux OS just to make a
phone call - when I know full well that this functionality has been
very successfully implemented on a tiny ARM7TDMI processor @ 52 MHz
with a total of 4 MiB of flash, 256 KiB of fast SRAM and 512 KiB of
slow SRAM (specific numbers from Mot C139) running a real-time
firmware environment without any full-blown OS.

So I wonder how other Freerunner users feel about this issue: do you
actually *like* the fact that it is a smartphone, or would you rather
use a dumbphone, but are using the FR and tolerating its smart aspects
because no free dumbphone currently exists?

VLR,
SF

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Re: Openmoko GTA06

[Norayr Chilingarian]

04/12/14 01:41 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:

Joerg R. and others on this list have already explained quite well the
pointlessness of those IMEI changes when it comes to privacy.

If you mean this

call numbers that are getting called by 0.5mio users per day).
Simply compare who called number A during last year, and who also called
number B during last year already reduces number of individuals to max 
10.
Then check which of those 10 individuals doesn't use her/his old IMEI 
anymore
and here you are: old IMEI linked to new fake IMEI. With only 2 calls 
done
from your new SIM and IMEI to your wife and your mother (or any other 
 arbitrary two normal phone numbers you called before)


then this doesn't relate to me, if I don't use calls/sms and I use only 
Internet. Then they need to filter who uses same Internet services as 
me. This case it's much harder to make sure that me is me, right?


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Re: Openmoko GTA06

[Norayr Chilingarian]

04/13/14 03:50 -ում, joerg Reisenweber-ը գրել է:

On Sun 13 April 2014 15:26:34 Norayr Chilingarian wrote:

Then they need to filter who uses same Internet services as
me. This case it's much harder to make sure that me is me, right?


Nope, since your internet traffic is a way better richer fingerprint of you than
the numbers you could call (or don't, according to your planned use)
Logging in on a single forum or webmail-service or polling your mail via POP3
or registering with a VoIP registrar already suffices. Heck even a more or less
arbitrary cookie left in your browser suffices.
And as already explained a IMEI popping up out of nowhere is *always* highly
suspicious and will usually already suffice to put you into the group of those
20 subjects that currently frequently use fake changing IMEIs. For the rest a
rough geolocation will do to identify you as subject #8 of those 20 subjects.
It's like you running the streets wearing a gorilla mask, and then changing
your gorilla mask to a pig mask and then 100m further you swap that for a
donkey mask. *Everybody* will look at you and there's not much doubt who you
are, despite you never showing your real face.
OOOH, I almost forgot: tell me which internet service you may use without a
SIM you paid for. They will probably die from laughing about you when you
constantly swap your IMEI without constantly swapping your SIM *and your
geolocation* exactly same time.

/j



Okay, I agree with all you written.
No doubt, when doing IMEI change, many details should be considered. And 
no doubt, if mail/chat etc service providers cooperate with your local 
intelligence agency, then you are even more vulnerable.


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Re: Openmoko GTA06

[Norayr Chilingarian]

04/11/14 03:08 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:

I don't know how things stand in your part of the world, but here in
USA the carriers only want to sell mobile data services while giving
voice and SMS away for free - so it is the direct opposite of what you
are picturing: old-fashioned voice calls and SMS are free here,
whereas Internet packet data costs $$$.
Yes, probably because they have this call and sms possibility. But I 
am quite sure, in your part of the world they must have possibility to 
get a plan, where calls and texts are prohibited, but Internet is 
unlimited, and just pay for it monthly fee.


Then, if their friends know how to use Internet for calls and texts 
they can refuse from using phones  as devices, like washing machines, 
designed for specific tasks, in this case - calls via carriers, and I 
see carriers gradually would become just an ISP's, not less and not more.


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Re: Openmoko GTA06

[Norayr Chilingarian]

need to add that the other thing we need, apart from encrypted calls, 
via gsm, as in your case, or over tcp/ip, as in my case, we need, yes, 
possibility to change IMEI's and use anonymous SIM cards, in order to 
prevent permanent tracking.



04/11/14 10:37 -ում, Norayr Chilingarian-ը գրել է:

04/11/14 03:08 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:

I don't know how things stand in your part of the world, but here in
USA the carriers only want to sell mobile data services while giving
voice and SMS away for free - so it is the direct opposite of what you
are picturing: old-fashioned voice calls and SMS are free here,
whereas Internet packet data costs $$$.

Yes, probably because they have this call and sms possibility. But I
am quite sure, in your part of the world they must have possibility to
get a plan, where calls and texts are prohibited, but Internet is
unlimited, and just pay for it monthly fee.

Then, if their friends know how to use Internet for calls and texts
they can refuse from using phones  as devices, like washing machines,
designed for specific tasks, in this case - calls via carriers, and I
see carriers gradually would become just an ISP's, not less and not more.

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Re: Openmoko GTA06

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Michael,

just would like to mention my needs, and unfortunately I cannot satisfy 
them with your project. I would even tell, I don't have a need for voice 
communications. But if I were, I would use something over Internet, like 
Jabber.
So I don't need a phone, but a mobile computer, which may benefit from 
having a microphone and speaker.
Also, routing voice traffic through the Intrenet is a way to not be 
obliged to pay to carrier per minute or per text message. I think that 
carriers earn too much money just because not all the people still used 
to Internet.
I prefer getting a data plan and pay monthly, while using encrypted 
communications for mail and chat.


So I use gprs only in order to have Internet. Not to call or receive 
regular calls. I believe, if we get Internet, then we can manage the 
rest without carriers.


04/02/14 07:00 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:

Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller h...@computer.org wrote:


I have received a rumor that somebody is working on a
truly free and open phone


This part is in fact true.


with the following specs:


But the specs you have in mind are wrong.


* Quad-Core Intel Z3770D (1.5 - 2.5 GHz)


Nope, it's an ARM7TDMI @ 52 MHz, chip made by TI, codename Calypso,
from TI's Greek mythology series.


* 4GB RAM


Don't need that much; 8 MiB of pSRAM (combined with NOR flash as part
of the S71PL129NC0 MCP by Spansion) is way more than enough for a good
phone.  (For comparison, the Motorola C139 I'm currently playing with
makes do just fine with only 512 KiB.)


* 128 GB eMMC


Again, unnecessary complexity and bloat.  Mine will have 16 MiB of NOR
flash instead: S71PL129NC0 provides two flash banks of 8 MiB each; one
will be for the firmware (execute in place), the other for user data
storage.  (For comparison, the user data flash partition on the C139
is only 320 KiB.)


* LTE with free and open baseband


GSM, not LTE - much better for plain old voice phone calls, which is
what a *phone* is for.  But the free and open part is absolutely
correct!


* 5 inch full HD display


Unnecessary for a phone.  I plan on using a 128x160 pixel 1.77 color
LCD (TFT), which is quite luxurious compared to Mot C139/V66/etc.


* 100g


That sounds about right.


* 4000 mAh battery


Not sure if I can get a battery with such capacity, but because I'm
using TI's source code with proper power management (unlike OsmocomBB),
even a 1000 mAh battery can last a good while.


* runs any x86 OS (i.e. Linux, Windows, Hackintosh, ...)


It is beyond me why would anyone in his or her right mind want to run
such complex, bloated and unreliable software on a *phone*, a device
whose primary purpose is to provide ultra-reliable voice communication
when all else fails, including emergency communication for potentially
life-threatening situations.


* shall cost less than Nexus 5


The very limited number of units I will physically produce myself will
probably have a very steep price tag, but unlike you I'm going to put
the gerber files, BOM and everything else on ftp.ifctf.org, so any
community member will be able to produce it herself at whatever price
her chosen PCB fab + parts suppliers + assembly house + RF calibration
lab charge.


Looks like some dream machine :)


You and I have different dreams.

Oh, and if someone were to build your April Fool's device for real, it
should NOT be called GTA-anything, because it is not GSM-TI-AGPS.  I
am not calling my Free Dumb Phone GTAxx either - while the 'G' and 'T'
parts are true for my design, the 'A' part is not.  I do like the
3 letters + 2 digits model naming scheme, but my letters won't be GTA.

VLR,
SF

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Re: ffs-edit-tools

[Norayr Chilingarian]

nice. is there a way to upload those tools to qtmoko official repo?

02/09/14 02:12 -ում, David Matthews-ը գրել է:
 I made a debian package for Qtmoko - it's here if you're interested:-
 
 http://winterveldt.co.za/ffs-edit-kit.html
 --
 David Matthews
 m...@dmatthews.org
 
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Re: testing the free calypso software

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Does anyone know what will happen in a cellular network where there is
more than one device has the same IMEI. In other words, if we all
could change our IMEI numbers, and use one imaginary number, are there
technical reasons for network to not work.

I mean, MAC address is used on a physical layer, so if two network
cards connected to the same switch have same MAC adresses, network
won't work. I guess switch will down both ports connected to those
devices.

But I don't know how IMEI's work. Are they technically necessary so
that 3G/gsm network can be operational, or they are only used to
identify (and track) customers by devices? I am just curious.

01/29/14 12:39 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 And yes, there is that file named /pcm/IMEI in there, with quite 
 obvious content.  Use cat -h as it's a binary file, two IMEI
 digits per byte, using the least significant nibble first - so it
 looks counter-intuitive in a hex dump.


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Re: testing the free calypso software

[Norayr Chilingarian]

01/27/14 10:26 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 Even in the case of the FFS with the RF calibration values etc, there
 is absolutely no danger of corrupting this FFS if you issue loadtool
 commands exactly per the instructions.  Saving a backup copy of the
 FFS sectors is a precaution just in case you erase or write to the
 wrong part of the flash.  If you have this backup saved, you can
 always restore it.
 
 In the absolute worst case scenario imaginable, if someone does lose
 their RF calibration values and has no backup copy anywhere, you
 should be able to send your FR to some lab to get it recalibrated.  I

If someone has no backup of calibration data, can she use calibration
data from other phone?
Then we can send our data to that person. Or it won't work this way?
I probably don't understand it well.

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Re: testing the free calypso software

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I did not publish it in the mailing list, so here is link to my manual:

http://norayr.arnet.am/log/?p=113

If anyone who has wiki account wants to use it as reference, or even
to copy the text entirely, feel free and encouraged to do that.

01/27/14 07:17 -ում, Giacomo 'giotti' Mariani-ը գրել է:
 Hi David, Michael, all, thanks a lot for your work, it is very
 emotional to see this little piece of freedom rising!
 
 I'm still not brave enough to risk my only (I mean in all my life
 time so far) mobile phone, but I will soon ;-)
 
 By the way, I think that your work, with the right notes about
 being experimental and so on of course, should also be in the
 official wiki.
 
 A small question about the procedure you describe: is the t191
 cable only needed to backup the vital parts of the calypso memory
 or also to write the new firmware?
 
 By the way, yes, a distro able to flash and back-up everything
 without additional cables would be very appreciated.
 
 Internationalist greetings, Giacomo
 


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the second operating system

[Norayr Chilingarian]

There is an osnews article named The second operating system hiding in
every mobile phone, and I guess some people in this list may be
interested. Not that we didn't know about it, just wanted to share an
article with you.

http://www.osnews.com/story/27416/The_second_operating_system_hiding_in_every_mobile_phone


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

So, I were getting messages in SHR, that the SIM SMS card storage is
full, and I need to remove some messages.
However by running SMS program in SHR I could not get list of messages
previously. Neither I can get this list now.
What is interesting, is that after second reboot it had received a
bunch of messages, each of them I could remove upon reading.
Those messages were actually old. I had to see them and remove long time
ago.
May be that's SHR issue, because as far as I remember, SMS program in
QtMoko could get list of messages.

What's also interesting, I have an impression, that power managment
works much better. With turned on gsm, it lasts more than 3-4 hours, as
before. I'll measure how long will it stay today. But I already see it's
becoming usable. Yes, I did not fix hardware. No, I did not enable deep
sleep in /etc/frameworkd.conf. So I did not do anything to fix the
issue. It seems that just with this firmware power management works
better. That was also one of the reasons I wanted to try this firmware.
Though I did not have great hopes it will make change, because I have
read that hardware fix is necessary, but anyway, at least there is an
improvement for sure.
I had moko11 before.

Another note.
Previously, probably after sleep (SHR puts device to sleep by default)
GSM did not want to return very often. Now, once it did not return, and
simply turning off on on GSM from the Settings helped very fast. As far
as I remember, with moko11 firmware, usually reboot was necessary to get
the GSM back.

Now this is truly interesting - are you saying that you are seeing
differences in SMS handling behaviour between moko11 and my leo2moko,
and that leo2moko works better for you in this regard? Details, please!


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I have documented what I have done, and I have a manual draft on my
computer.
If I can get a wiki account, I will add the information there.

11/10/13 01:33 -ում, Norayr Chilingarian-ը գրել է:
 So, I were getting messages in SHR, that the SIM SMS card storage is
 full, and I need to remove some messages.
 However by running SMS program in SHR I could not get list of messages
 previously. Neither I can get this list now.
 What is interesting, is that after second reboot it had received a
 bunch of messages, each of them I could remove upon reading.
 Those messages were actually old. I had to see them and remove long time
 ago.
 May be that's SHR issue, because as far as I remember, SMS program in
 QtMoko could get list of messages.

 What's also interesting, I have an impression, that power managment
 works much better. With turned on gsm, it lasts more than 3-4 hours, as
 before. I'll measure how long will it stay today. But I already see it's
 becoming usable. Yes, I did not fix hardware. No, I did not enable deep
 sleep in /etc/frameworkd.conf. So I did not do anything to fix the
 issue. It seems that just with this firmware power management works
 better. That was also one of the reasons I wanted to try this firmware.
 Though I did not have great hopes it will make change, because I have
 read that hardware fix is necessary, but anyway, at least there is an
 improvement for sure.
 I had moko11 before.

 Another note.
 Previously, probably after sleep (SHR puts device to sleep by default)
 GSM did not want to return very often. Now, once it did not return, and
 simply turning off on on GSM from the Settings helped very fast. As far
 as I remember, with moko11 firmware, usually reboot was necessary to get
 the GSM back.

 Now this is truly interesting - are you saying that you are seeing
 differences in SMS handling behaviour between moko11 and my leo2moko,
 and that leo2moko works better for you in this regard? Details, please!


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

What I would write in wiki is step by step instructions how to build the
firmware, free loader, and flash it.
I don't think it can confuse someone in some way.

What about moderation, then, well, what you are saying is against
collaborative work, like it is in Wikipedia.
Everyone, by even not having Wikipedia account could go and write
everything he wants. However, as we see, there are more sane people
rather than idiots, and Wikipedia is mostly correct.

I believe no one should decide what I have a right to write before even
seeing the text.
And when that's done after, then it's often called censorship - when
someone does not want some information published. I believe in
discussions, in talks. When all the points of view are expressed, and
people may choose between them, or new idea is born.

Also, people choose themselves whether they want to be misleaded. They
have a right to choose.

11/10/13 06:10 -ում, joerg Reisenweber-ը գրել է:
 On Sun 10 November 2013 11:15:22 Norayr Chilingarian wrote:
 I have documented what I have done, and I have a manual draft on my
 computer.
 If I can get a wiki account, I will add the information there.
 A good example why we should keep wiki in moderated mode. All you could 
 contribute based on your reports so far is mere random noise confusing the 
 hell out of users.


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I know, that people tend to make connection between events.
I know, that often it is useful, and often it is wrong to make those
connections.
I don't know why do I see an improvement, and I accept the possibility,
that it's because of other firmware.
How can we know if it is? More testing, more users trying it.
Try the firmware and write there your observations. Measure something if
you can.

11/10/13 05:56 -ում, joerg Reisenweber-ը գրել է:
 On Sun 10 November 2013 10:33:47 Norayr Chilingarian wrote:
 What's also interesting, I have an impression, that power managment
 works much better. With turned on gsm, it lasts more than 3-4 hours, as
 before. I'll measure how long will it stay today. But I already see it's
 becoming usable. Yes, I did not fix hardware. No, I did not enable deep
 sleep in /etc/frameworkd.conf. So I did not do anything to fix the
 issue.
 Are you *sure* about that? Starting your room heating may already suffice - 
 no 
 kidding. Please don't try to outsmart the experts. #1024 been pretty complex 
 and I suggest you learn about it before claiming moko11 has a bug regarding 
 that. :-/

 cheers
 jOERG


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Okay, I see what you say.
As Nick mentioned I would write instructions in wiki. As I have written
previously in this mailing list, it would be good if someone could
document how to build and flash it step by step.
Wiki is good for collaborative editing, and if I have made unnecessary
steps, someone may fix my howto. It's editable. On the other side nobody
can prevent me from writing any bullishit at my own site or wiki, where
only I have access to. Thus collaborative wiki is always more trustable
than separate one with controlled access.
Even if I were writing there nonsense, the text is digital and editable,
unlike cuneiform it's cut in stone.

11/10/13 09:19 -ում, joerg Reisenweber-ը գրել է:
 On Sun 10 November 2013 18:03:36 Norayr Chilingarian wrote:
 I know, that people tend to make connection between events.
 I know, that often it is useful, and often it is wrong to make those
 connections.
 I don't know why do I see an improvement, and I accept the possibility,
 that it's because of other firmware.
 How can we know if it is? More testing, more users trying it.
 Try the firmware and write there your observations. Measure something if
 you can.
 Pretty evil and rogue approach to suggest coming up with some nonsense that 
 other more competent people tell you is definitely unrelated, and suggest 
 other 
 people should waste their time on trying to reproduce your findings, while 
 you 
 can't come up with any sane story why those patches or fixes you claim to 
 see are real.

 How about this: my last 3 firmware flashes were in the night between 3:00 and 
 3:30, I claim this could mean something worth investigating and now I ask 
 other users to get up in the night and reflash their modem firmware to verify 
 they see more responsiveness in scrolling screens after that.

 *maybe* you're able to get my point. And no, this is NOT about censorship, 
 this is about taking care of OM's customer base, protecting them from 
 suggestions to clean their device in dishwasher engine and the like.

 BR
 jOERG


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Also, I never did write anything about moko11 bugs.
I don't know about them.
I did write that my perception is, this firmware seem to have better
power management.

I believe in medicine, and I don't believe in ghosts.
If you say, it's unrelated, I don't argue.
What can I say now, it worked ~10 hours with GSM turned on, had two
reboots, and still has 63% of battery power.
May be that's connected to heating or something else. But my device
became usable, I was writing that it had problems in this mailing list a
couple of weeks ago.

About wiki, first of all, we have new, legally free (in those repressive
countries (: ) tool - the flasher. Secondly we have the alternative
firmware _with_source code.
I belive it worth to write there about free flasher, how to build it,
and how to use it, not only with leo2moko port. The flasher can be used
to flash moko11 too. Also, it worth to write there how to build the
leo2moko firmware. Anyone may add whatever political concern she has to
the same wiki page.

11/10/13 09:32 -???, joerg Reisenweber-?  ?:
 On Sun 10 November 2013 18:27:45 Nick wrote:
 Quoth Norayr Chilingarian:
 What I would write in wiki is step by step instructions how to build the
 firmware, free loader, and flash it.
 I don't think it can confuse someone in some way.

 What about moderation, then, well, what you are saying is against
 collaborative work, like it is in Wikipedia.
 Everyone, by even not having Wikipedia account could go and write
 everything he wants. However, as we see, there are more sane people
 rather than idiots, and Wikipedia is mostly correct.
 I think Joerg was worried about you writing a page saying this
 firmware improves power consumption before more testing and
 consulting with more knowledgeable people. I'm sure we all agree
 that a place to discuss ideas and possibilities (as wrong as they
 may turn out to be) is valuable, but Joerg has no doubt been around
 long enough to have to deal with the fallout of those discussions /
 conjectures being left in places where people take theories that had
 been disproved elsewhere as fact, and shared the disinformation
 wider. Which ultimately can give a bad impression to a project, as
 well as bad experience to others.

 Which is a long way of saying: the mailing list is the best place
 for discussion, and the wiki should be reserved for things which we
 are more sure about. So instructions on building and loading the
 firmware would be fine for the wiki, but speculations about its
 power saving (or sms receiving) improvements are best for the
 mailing list. Which I know is what you suggested, but that wasn't
 clear initially.
 !00% ACK, sorry if that wasn't clear enough from what I wrote. Thanks for 
 helping me out :-)
 /j


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Okay, so first thing I did is I have compiled loadtools, as planned
right on freerunner.

opkg install gcc
opkg install gcc-symlinks
opkg install libc6-dev
opkg install binutils
opkg install make

and synced time before build.

/etc/init.d/fsotdld restart

then I have edited makefile, as suggested in readme, set CFLAGS to
CFLAGS= -O2 -march=armv4t -mtune=arm920t -DGTA0x_AP_BUILD

and
EXTRA_OBJ=gtapower.o

After short build I have three binaries installed
fc-iram fc-loadtool fc-xram

I believe they will run.

Then, I have tried to compile the firmware with supplied wine environment.

Downloaded nowhine.c, built and installed it.

Unpacked environment in drive_c directory of .wine in my home.

Inspite of using nowhine, I saw a lot of fontconfig warnings .

Build fails, failed a couple of times, both by using nowhine or wine
without wrappers.

Because one windows utility, probably linker, fails
http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/wine_error.png
Error details
http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/wine_error_details.png
Backtrace: http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/backtrace.txt
Report: http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/report.txt

I wonder, if the problem is in my wine version or system setup.
I have 32 bit wine running on x86_64 GNU/Linux, use it sometimes, and it
worked fine before.


I am sure, it would be much easier to debug and understand the problem
in case of using native Unix build environment. Or error would not
present at all.
Thanks for any further hints.

Norayr


10/30/13 12:42 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 dmatthews.org m...@dmatthews.org wrote:

 This is something I've quietly had an interest in for a year plus.
 Yup, I remember you from 2011. :-)

 I'd like to suggest that it would be beneficial not only to have some hand
 holding for people that want to compile, but also sample binary for those of
 us that may not have easy access to necessary hardware and software.
 Compiling the leo2moko version of the GSM fw from the semi-src does
 not require any special software, let alone hardware: the hardware is
 any regular PC, the software is your favourite GNU/Linux distribution
 with working Wine.  Nothing more is needed: if you have a system with
 working Wine, just unpack my tarballs and run the winebuild.sh script.

 However, having a prebuilt binary of the leo2moko GSM fw (to encourage
 prospective testers from the shy-land) does sound like a good idea, so
 I have just put one out:

 ftp://ftp.ifctf.org/pub/GSM/FreeCalypso/leo2moko-r1-bin.tar.bz2

 Or was your reference to necessary hardware and software regarding
 the flashing process, rather than compiling the gsm-fw.m0 image
 itself?

 Regarding the flashing process, I do agree that the current barrier to
 entry is still a little too high and could use some lowering.  As
 things stand right now, if you want to do your own flashing operations
 on the GSM modem in your GTA02, the following skills/tools are
 required:

 1. Whatever distro you are running on your FR, you need to know it
inside out: you need to know how to ssh into your phone, how to
kill gsmd or whatever process talks to the modem (and to ensure
that it doesn't get restarted until you are done flashing your new
fw and wish to test it live), and how to twiddle the power_on and
download controls for the modem under /sys, as appropriate for
whichever GTA02 kernel version you are running.

 2a. You need to be able to cross-compile my fc-loadtool utility to run
 on the application (Linux) processor of your GTA02, and do it in a
 way that will be compatible with your distro from the previous
 paragraph.  (I could send you my binary, built with some
 CodeSourcery toolchain for my Buildroot AP environment, but I
 doubt that one would be able to just plop it into SHR or QtMoko or
 whatever, and have it just work.)

 -or-

 2b. You need to buy a T191 unlock cable that would plug into your
 Neo's headset jack - in that case you would be able to run
 fc-loadtool from your GNU/Linux PC, removing the need to build it
 for running from inside the Neo.  But even with this magic cable,
 you would still need to satisfy requirement 1 above: you still
 need to ensure that there is no gsmd etc running, and you'll need
 to twiddle the download and power_on modem sysfs nodes by sshing
 into the phone.

 I'm thinking that one possible way to lower this entry barrier would
 be to produce and publish a bootable SD card image with the following
 features:

 * A known environment, eliminating the whatever FR distro you happen
   to be running factor;

 * Specifically designed for manual poking at the GSM modem - no gsmd
   and no normal functionality;

 * Have the special Linux image come up with the headset jack serial
   channel enabled and with the device screen showing pressable buttons
   for Modem ON and Modem OFF - thus anyone using the headset jack
   serial cable method 

Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Hehe, flashed your image!

http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/Screenshot-2_patched.png

Thanks a lot.
Let's see how it works. I don't use gsm usually, I'll check how gprs
works over gsm.
It did not work before, usually SHR did not want to connect.
But I also had problems with iliwi, so I usually connect to wifi by
hands, from terminal.
That way it works. So may be I am doing something wrong. But I would
like to learn to establish gprs connection from console.

Anyway, this was off topic.

The firmware flashed, will continue testing.

Thank you.

P. S. one day I'll play with IMEI too.


11/09/13 05:18 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 Norayr Chilingarian nor...@arnet.am wrote:

 Okay, so first thing I did is I have compiled loadtools, as planned
 right on freerunner.
 [...]
 After short build I have three binaries installed
 fc-iram fc-loadtool fc-xram

 I believe they will run.
 Congrats, you have successfully navigated one part which I thought
 would be very hard for most users.

 Using the loadtools you've got installed on your FR now, you can do
 another important step: make a backup copy of your modem FFS.

 Step 1: run fc-loadtool like this (from inside the FR):

 fc-loadtool -h gta02 /dev/ttySAC0

 You should see a bunch of messages followed by a loadtool prompt.

 Step 2: when you reach that prompt, enter this command:

 flash dump2bin my-flashdump.bin

 You should get a dump of your modem flash content in a file whose name
 will be whatever you've entered as the last argument.  The file should
 be 4 MiB long.  Transfer it from your FR to your PC and examine it
 with your favourite hex viewer.  You should see the original fw image
 (moko10 or moko11 or whatever you are running) in the first 2.25 MiB
 or so, then blank flash (all FF bytes) until offset 0x38, then 7
 sectors of 64 KiB each (0x7 bytes total) of FFS (flash file system),
 then blank flash again for the last 64 KiB.

 Verify that the content of the flash dump is as expected, and save it
 securely - having this backup copy will keep your FR from becoming a
 brick in the case that some subsequent operation will destroy the RF
 calibration values in FFS.

 Then, I have tried to compile the firmware with supplied wine environment.
 [...]
 Inspite of using nowhine, I saw a lot of fontconfig warnings .
 I never got those on my system; the whines I get from my wine are the
 ones you can see in my cheesy nowhine.c source.  You are more than
 welcome to edit nowhine.c and make it suppress whatever whines _you_
 get. :-)))

 Build fails, failed a couple of times, both by using nowhine or wine
 without wrappers.

 Because one windows utility, probably linker, fails
 http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/wine_error.png
 Yes, it is the linker indeed, which is bad news because one can't
 build a firmware image without passing the linker step. :-(

 Error details
 http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/wine_error_details.png
 Backtrace: http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/backtrace.txt
 Not much I can do with these: I don't have source for TI's compiler
 toolchain any more than you do, and I'm not a wine expert either.
 See below regarding what system I use.

 Report: http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/report.txt
 Looks as it should, except for the wine page fault error when running
 vlnk470.

 I wonder, if the problem is in my wine version or system setup.
 I have 32 bit wine running on x86_64 GNU/Linux, use it sometimes, and it
 worked fine before.
 I use Slackware (a GNU/Linux distro for Luddites like me), all 32-bit
 only, nothing x86_64 at all:

 hec@darkstar:~$ uname -a
 Linux darkstar 2.6.37.6-smp #1 SMP Sun Jan 27 05:32:33 GMT 2013 i686 Intel(R) 
 Core(TM)2 Duo CPU P8600  @ 2.40GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux
 hec@darkstar:~$ cat /etc/slackware-version
 Slackware 13.37.0
 hec@darkstar:~$ wine --version
 wine-1.5.23

 I am sure, it would be much easier to debug and understand the problem
 in case of using native Unix build environment.
 Yeah, no kidding!  Firmware that can only be built with a proprietary
 compiler which exists only as Weendoze binaries for which none of us
 has any source is not really free - hence my chosen subject for this
 whole thread: First small steps toward free GSM firmware, not Free
 GSM fw is finally here.  What we have so far is indeed only the first
 small steps, not a complete victory yet.

 I am working on it, albeit at a snail's pace.  I've got an ex-TI person
 helping me with my FreeCalypso project (when TI shut their Wireless
 Terminal Business Unit down, a lot of people were out of a job - wasn't
 fun for those people, but guess why my FTP site now sports 4 different
 TI source leaks :), and with that person's help I was able to
 understand the overall architecture of how the major pieces fit
 together.  Now I have an arduous task in front of me: in order to
 rebuild the firmware in a sane environment (using gcc and all that
 good stuff), I have

Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I can already tell that I could not use sms's previously, they did not
work. I just received many sms's after reboot, and I was able to remove
them.
It did not work before.

11/09/13 11:42 -ում, Norayr Chilingarian-ը գրել է:
 Hehe, flashed your image!

 http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/Screenshot-2_patched.png

 Thanks a lot.
 Let's see how it works. I don't use gsm usually, I'll check how gprs
 works over gsm.
 It did not work before, usually SHR did not want to connect.
 But I also had problems with iliwi, so I usually connect to wifi by
 hands, from terminal.
 That way it works. So may be I am doing something wrong. But I would
 like to learn to establish gprs connection from console.

 Anyway, this was off topic.

 The firmware flashed, will continue testing.

 Thank you.

 P. S. one day I'll play with IMEI too.


 11/09/13 05:18 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 Norayr Chilingarian nor...@arnet.am wrote:

 Okay, so first thing I did is I have compiled loadtools, as planned
 right on freerunner.
 [...]
 After short build I have three binaries installed
 fc-iram fc-loadtool fc-xram

 I believe they will run.
 Congrats, you have successfully navigated one part which I thought
 would be very hard for most users.

 Using the loadtools you've got installed on your FR now, you can do
 another important step: make a backup copy of your modem FFS.

 Step 1: run fc-loadtool like this (from inside the FR):

 fc-loadtool -h gta02 /dev/ttySAC0

 You should see a bunch of messages followed by a loadtool prompt.

 Step 2: when you reach that prompt, enter this command:

 flash dump2bin my-flashdump.bin

 You should get a dump of your modem flash content in a file whose name
 will be whatever you've entered as the last argument.  The file should
 be 4 MiB long.  Transfer it from your FR to your PC and examine it
 with your favourite hex viewer.  You should see the original fw image
 (moko10 or moko11 or whatever you are running) in the first 2.25 MiB
 or so, then blank flash (all FF bytes) until offset 0x38, then 7
 sectors of 64 KiB each (0x7 bytes total) of FFS (flash file system),
 then blank flash again for the last 64 KiB.

 Verify that the content of the flash dump is as expected, and save it
 securely - having this backup copy will keep your FR from becoming a
 brick in the case that some subsequent operation will destroy the RF
 calibration values in FFS.

 Then, I have tried to compile the firmware with supplied wine environment.
 [...]
 Inspite of using nowhine, I saw a lot of fontconfig warnings .
 I never got those on my system; the whines I get from my wine are the
 ones you can see in my cheesy nowhine.c source.  You are more than
 welcome to edit nowhine.c and make it suppress whatever whines _you_
 get. :-)))

 Build fails, failed a couple of times, both by using nowhine or wine
 without wrappers.

 Because one windows utility, probably linker, fails
 http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/wine_error.png
 Yes, it is the linker indeed, which is bad news because one can't
 build a firmware image without passing the linker step. :-(

 Error details
 http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/wine_error_details.png
 Backtrace: http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/backtrace.txt
 Not much I can do with these: I don't have source for TI's compiler
 toolchain any more than you do, and I'm not a wine expert either.
 See below regarding what system I use.

 Report: http://norayr.arnet.am/tmp/2013-11-09/openmoko/report.txt
 Looks as it should, except for the wine page fault error when running
 vlnk470.

 I wonder, if the problem is in my wine version or system setup.
 I have 32 bit wine running on x86_64 GNU/Linux, use it sometimes, and it
 worked fine before.
 I use Slackware (a GNU/Linux distro for Luddites like me), all 32-bit
 only, nothing x86_64 at all:

 hec@darkstar:~$ uname -a
 Linux darkstar 2.6.37.6-smp #1 SMP Sun Jan 27 05:32:33 GMT 2013 i686 
 Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU P8600  @ 2.40GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux
 hec@darkstar:~$ cat /etc/slackware-version
 Slackware 13.37.0
 hec@darkstar:~$ wine --version
 wine-1.5.23

 I am sure, it would be much easier to debug and understand the problem
 in case of using native Unix build environment.
 Yeah, no kidding!  Firmware that can only be built with a proprietary
 compiler which exists only as Weendoze binaries for which none of us
 has any source is not really free - hence my chosen subject for this
 whole thread: First small steps toward free GSM firmware, not Free
 GSM fw is finally here.  What we have so far is indeed only the first
 small steps, not a complete victory yet.

 I am working on it, albeit at a snail's pace.  I've got an ex-TI person
 helping me with my FreeCalypso project (when TI shut their Wireless
 Terminal Business Unit down, a lot of people were out of a job - wasn't
 fun for those people, but guess why my FTP site now sports 4 different
 TI source leaks :), and with that person's help I

Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

No, it's not fixed. I'll try one day. (:

10/30/13 12:50 -???, Radek Polak-?  ?:
  

 Do you have fixed hardware and enabled deep sleep? I can get standby
 of 4 days with my Freerunner.

  

 BR

  

 Radek


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I believe that I can do all those steps without difficulty. Also, I am 
motivated to try this firmware because with current moko11 fw, battery is 
getting drained too fast, it doesn't work for whole day. May be the battery is 
in bad condition, but anyway, I can do it. I just need a free day, I hope to 
find a couple of free hours in the nearest Sunday, or may be the next one..

Ahmm, asking for some level of maturity before one is willing to
even *test* a piece of software is rather dysfunctional.  How would
the sw *ever* reach any level of maturity without some people testing
it early on, reporting their experiences, sending bug reports etc?
Therefore, *someone* needs to be willing to act as an adventurous
alpha tester, trying out what exists currently.


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

okay (:

10/29/13 02:03 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 P.S. If anyone manages to get as far as the loadtool prompt, please
 give me a shout before you type any flash erase or flash program
 commands - I would not want you to ruin your device by wiping out its
 very hard-to-recover RF calibration data. 


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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Why not add information about free fw and loader to the mentioned wiki page?
So that people who are not in this mailing list, may know about this fw
and a free fc-load tool.

Also, it would be good to have step by step instructions like get this
source here, compile it like that, get another source there, compile it,
and run this command with these arguments.

10/22/13 10:21 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 Jose Luis Perez Diez jl...@escomposlinux.org wrote:

 The procces to flash GSM firmware used linux, the serial port,
 and the fluid binary see 

 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM/Flashing#Manual_Update_.28GTA01.2C_GTA02.29_.2F_geek_way
 Yes, and that exact same procedure should work just as well if you
 substitute your own *.m0 image built from my leo2moko-r1.tar.xz source
 in the place of calypso-moko11.m0.  I say should because I haven't
 tried it myself - like Richard Stallman, I avoid proprietary software,
 so I use my own fc-loadtool instead of that fluid.exe for which I have
 no corresponding source.

 Just give it a try - if you don't like my illegally-free GSM fw, you
 can always reflash back to the official calypso-moko11.m0.
 Patryk Benderz patryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote:

 Can't we just use dfu-util?
 The GSM modem has its own processor, its own independent address space,
 its own address and data buses, and its own independent flash memory
 (NOR in a Multi-Chip Package combined with SRAM).  Neither dfu-util
 nor the AP (application processor) bootloader it is talking to knows
 anything about that separate hardware block.

 In order to reflash the GSM modem, one needs to establish communication
 with Calypso's own boot ROM.  That can be done either from a running
 Linux system on the phone's AP (i.e., from inside the phone) or
 externally via a classic T191 unlock cable plugged into the headset
 jack.  (The latter approach makes more sense for FreeCalypso
 developers.)  Either way, one needs Linux software running on the
 phone's AP in order to control the power to the modem and to enable
 the headset jack serial channel if you wish to use the latter.

 VLR,
 SF

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Re: First small steps toward free GSM firmware

[Norayr Chilingarian]

then flash into your GTA0x GSM modem

Wait, it works both on gta-02 and gta-04?

Also, did you test if data connection works? I don't use phone calls,
only encrypted ssl over tcp over 3g/wifi.

I am very interested if this can be flashed to gta-02 device,
(unfortunately I don't own gta-04). Also, is there is a possibility to
change IMEI during flashing?

Sorry if my questions are a little bit off topic. Anyway I am very
interested in free fw for my devices - OM gta-02 and n900.

10/13/13 06:08 -ում, Michael Spacefalcon-ը գրել է:
 Hello Om community,

 I am very pleased to announce that after many years of searching, I
 have finally found a copy of TI's firmware deliverable package for
 their Leonardo development board, i.e., for their Calypso/Iota/Rita
 chipset reference platform.  It is the package which TI must have
 given to all of their chipset customers including Nokia, Motorola,
 Compal, FIC/Openmoko, LG, BenQ and many others, and which was used by
 all of these companies as the starting point for making their unique
 proprietary firmwares.  This Leonardo firmware source can be found
 here:

 ftp://ftp.ifctf.org/pub/GSM/TI_src/Sotovik/

 It is a source with some object blobs unfortunately (but that was
 expected), but it is complete in that one can build a functional fw
 image from the included sources and object libraries.  This original
 code will NOT run on a GTA0x modem; it runs on the Leonardo board
 instead.  If you are curious as to what the Leonardo board looks
 like, you can see a picture of it on page 10 of this TI document:

 ftp://ftp.ifctf.org/pub/GSM/Calypso/chipsets+refdesigns.pdf

 However, I have known for a long time that Om's GSM modem is actually
 very close to the Leonardo board in terms of how the Calypso/Iota/RF
 chip interconnections are wired.  (I already knew this fact ~2y ago
 when I first saw the doc/calypso-signals.txt file in the OsmocomBB git
 tree - read that text file and judge for yourselves.)  The implication
 from this hardware similarity is that it should be quite easy to take
 firmware code that runs on the Leonardo board and port it to run on
 the GTA0x modem instead.

 I have just proven the above hypothesis by producing a leo2moko port,
 i.e., a port from Leonardo to moko.  You can find the Wine-buildable
 source here:

 ftp://ftp.ifctf.org/pub/GSM/FreeCalypso/

 You can build that source under Wine (see instructions in the README
 file inside the tarball) and produce an S-record image which you can
 then flash into your GTA0x GSM modem with fc-loadtool - the latter is
 my free replacement for TI's proprietary FLUID.

 My own limited experiments indicate that this firmware is able to dial
 voice calls (makes the other party's phone ring), receive voice calls
 (I dial the number of the test SIM card in my GTA02 and see RING
 messages appearing in the AT command channel), and even make CSD
 (circuit-switched data) calls successfully - being the outlaw that I
 am, I take great joy in playing with CSD (which I plan on using for
 encrypted voice further down the road) and thereby showing my middle
 finger to the NSA etc.  However, I have NOT fully tested the normal
 voice call operation: I have only verified that the fw places and
 answers these calls, but I haven't tested the actual voice audio.  The
 latter omission exists because I have very poor understanding of the
 Linux-based software that needs to run on the GTA0x AP, and on my test
 GTA02 I run a very minimal buildroot environment on the AP.  I have
 not yet figured out how to configure the AP-controlled audio system to
 pass the voice path between the GSM modem and the physical earpiece
 and mic, hence my current inability to test this voice path.

 Therefore, I encourage other community members to play with this
 firmware and see if it actually works end-to-end for voice calls.

 Viva la Revolucion,
 SF

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Re: GTA04-N900 vel. Neo900

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Non-free maemo isn't redistributable.
There's must be free maemo version.
The existing version won't be possible to flash to gta-04 because it is
currently not possible to do that. It's different hardware.
Otherwise it won't be necessary to port SHR to n900, that's obvious.
So, in order to redistribute GTA-04 version of maemo, there must be free
redistributable maemo.

Also, I believe many apps like GPS apps which use liblocation won't
work, because liblocation is proprietary, and needs to be rewritten with
the same interface. Otherwise, full compatibility is just not possible,
without replacing those proprietary parts with free parts.

I personally have no problem using SHR on n900 like device. But you are
the one who considers maemo compatibility to be the key feature. That's
why I am writing this.

The maemo fremantle porting project is not targeted at creating a fork
or new release of maemo OS, but strictly to keep compatibility from
N900 to Neo900 so users can ideally restore a backup from their old N900
to their new Neo900 and the device acts exactly like user got used to.
Also we don't plan to recompile the repositories with all the
applications, and for the much needed core apps like dialer we even
can't do that since they are closed. However you're free to run any
distro you like on GTA04 and GTA04-N900 aka Neo900, just the maemo
community fremantle porting task force will not bother about rebasing
on debian or whatever, the goals of that task force are clearly defined.

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Re: GTA04-N900 vel. Neo900

[Norayr Chilingarian]

I would say, maemo fremantle is great.
if we could manage to make it free, i. e. rewrite it's non-free parts,
and make it available on more platforms, like nexus, it'll be great.
having free hardware in n900 case it good too.
but first of all let's get working free, indeed free maemo. not the
proprietary one that could be flashed from nokia images.
but the one which is possible to port to different devices. so may be
someone does not like n900 and want to use it on n9 or nexus. or
whatever phone he has.
I like SHR for that reason - there are at least a couple of platforms
supported.

08/27/13 12:57 -???, joerg Reisenweber-?  ?:
 On Mon 26 August 2013 14:35:50 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak wrote:
 [...]
 Joerg's idea includes full port of Maemo 5 (Fremantle) to allow N900
 users to have drop-in upgrade - just like now GTA04 is for GTA01/02
 owners. I think that can increase interest a lot!
 Indeed I consider maemo fremantle compatibility a key feature of this 
 project, 
 since fremantle is proven on OMAP3 platform, both for power management and 
 general every day usability. And userbase at maemo mostly expects 
 compatibility.
 We (would) need to adapt GTA04 to mach resp resemble N900 enough so that all 
 remaining differences can get handled on kernel/driver level.
 On an encouraging sidenote, we have already at least 2 volunteers for doing 
 that kernel morphing, one of them even a ex-nokian kernel maintainer \o/

 There are still some _severe_ issues that need to get evaluated/tackled ASAP:
 *) instabilities/issues reported for GTA04, with power management and modem
 **) USB / musb core in OMAP which is a greedy hog as long as powered.
 *) camera (N900 has 5MP with autofocus)
 *) N900 has 32GB eMMC
 *) interfacing the flex circuit board (aka ribbon cable) connection to  to 
 screen half, that also has ALS, secondary (VGA?) camera, proxy sensor, 3color 
 LED
 *) component sourcing for speakers, antennae, et al
 *) completely different charging (N900 uses bq24150)
 *) AV-connector with auto-detection of headphones, headset, AV (maybe simply 
 replace that in userland by a requester to pick type of cable/connection
 *) audio at large, N900 has a quite different circuitry for whole audio, and 
 fremantle has some nasty PA modules, some of them even closed blobs (XPROT 
 speaker protection, some limiter/compressor/EQ/overtemp-cutout)

 *)... I'm afraid there's more to come, that I don't see right now

 Anyway, the general mood is best described by extremely excited and it 
 seems 
 it's maybe worth following this idea some further, even with the above points 
 pending to get solved.

 See http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=91142

 I hope I didn't state anything that Nikolaus will bash me for when tomorrow 
 he 
 reads all the stuff that happened.

 The poll I added on that ^^^ thread on tmo however shows that 7/8 of users 
 are 
 expecting us to compete with Samsung for the price range. Well, that been 
 expected. The resulting discussion is maybe helpful nevertheless.


 cheers
 jOERG


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Re: Releasing GTA04 hardware source files (was: community Digest, Vol 353, Issue 3)

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Excuse me very much, I don't mean to offend anyone, I actually care 
about project a lot.

I really appreciate the project and I would like to have a gta04 based device, 
probably tablet. It's just too expensive for me now.

Recently I became a lucky owner of a freerunner, got one used, and 
need to tell, that I had a lot of problems both under SHR and QtMoko.

I believe it's solvable.
Unfortunately the device is not very useful because I cannot get stable 
connection to the internet to run pidgin, due to power management probably, also in 
recent SHR releases most of the time sim card don't get recognized.  And I 
feel that n810 as mobile computer is more useable. That's why I would like 
to find a used openpandora, because it's open, and it's mobile computer. I 
don't need a phone, if I have jabber with ssl connection.


Anyway, I just want to add, that indeed, if one needs to OCR a pdf, then 
it's more like reverse engineering, rather than source. It's of course 
arguable, but I don't see why don't share the actual source files? Why?


On Sat, 24 Aug 2013, Bob Ham wrote:


On Sat, 2013-08-24 at 11:21 +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:

Am 24.08.2013 um 02:10 schrieb Bob Ham:



We have schematics in a .pdf file but nothing else.


Yes. And the PDF is the source.


I don't believe this is the case.  I believe the PDF was compiled from
designs that came from other files.  I don't believe your circuit
designs were written in the PDF language.  If they came from other
files, the PDF is not the source, the other files are the source.



You can run OCR and convert it into any
format you like. And modify it as you like. What else do you expect? More
convenience?


It's not so much about convenience.  Let me quote the GPL 2:

The source code for a work means the preferred form of the work for
making modifications to it.



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Re: Building a new totally free phone

[Norayr Chilingarian]

Nick, you raised very good questions.

I believe, that we don't need GSM at all. I don't use it for two years 
now.
When we use GSM we use carrier services. Can we be sure that carrier does 
not track us, don't record our calls etc?
For instance, in my country secret service has direct access to the 
carrier's switches, and can follow calls of any person in real time. They 
also can write a paper and request this or that person's locations from 
the carrier.


We don't use gmail, because we know they are watching us, then why do we 
use carriers?


The way to be secure is to use trusted service providers, and carriers are 
too big to be trusted.


However we can use own SIP or XMPP servers, we can create small community 
servers where we trust our service providers. And use them for chat/talk. 
Should I mention that we use encryption, in both cases - server to server, 
and client to server.


Here we have connectivity problem. Okay, everybody has a wifi at home (or 
may have). But what if you would like to call someone from the forest?


Here what we can do: get an Internet only tariff, use it for making 
calls/chat etc.
But our location still can be tracked if the carrier requires you to 
identiy yourself when buying a sim card. Here we can do nothing except may 
be mass exchange of sim cards with random people. Like make an action, 
when 1000 people goes to get a card, and then they all exchange cards with 
people they don't even know and won't see most probably in the future.


This also has another plus: why pay for each sms? We can chat in internet 
as long as we wish.


---
sent with alpine
https://spyurk.am/u/norayr
http://norayr.arnet.am/weblog

On Fri, 23 Aug 2013, Nick wrote:


Your free phone idea appeals to me enormously, Michael. And I,
(unlike I suspect some others on the list) very much like your
framing of the issues, too. I fully support the idea that if a law
makes private conversation illegal, it is a bad law, and regulatory
blocks on GSM that forbid inspectable and modifiable cannot but be
such.

However, can GSM really be a base for secure communication anyway?
I've heard that the encryption used is really crappy, and while some
things like MITM forced reregistration to disable encryption and
ease surveillance could be countered by appropriate phone settings,
if the best encryption algorithm available can be cracked by a home
PC in a few days, you're still screwed.

A truly free phone is a worthy and very important thing for other
reasons, but could such a thing be strongly secure too? Or is the
only solution there to rely on something like ZRTP in voip, and give
up wishing that GSM could provide security?

I've always been somewhat vague about how modems and their
processors interact with other parts of a system. Am I correct in
thinking that once the first firmware part of your project was
complete, one could flash load that the GTA02 modem, and have a (far
more 'smart' and Linux-y than you're ultimately planning) free
openmoko phone? Or would the modem firmware have to be programmed
differently for the GTA02 compared to your feature phone? While I am
more interested in a feature phone than a 'smart' phone, I would be
very happy to have a really free modem firmware on my GTA02 in the
meantime.

It's interesting to think of the meanings of 'free' in your message.
Because one of the nice things of free software traditionally has
been the ability to say it's free software, so I can do what I like
with it, and you can't invoke state violence against me for doing
so, due to a careful 'respect' of the copyrights of people who
don't want their stuff to be free. While regulatory reigimes
seemingly make this impossible anyway with GSM, I don't relish the
idea of essentially giving more power to other people to wield the
law against the project or its' users. But I understand that writing
a firmware from scratch for something like the Calypso would be a
massive amount of work, and I would rather have a reusable and
inspectable firmware that breaks copyright law, than none at all,
particularly for something as directly dangerous to one's security
as a phone.

With this in mind, I do wonder why the OsmocomBB work isn't
appropriate as a base for your work? Can you explain this a bit more
why it isn't? Is it just that they are quite a long way from
producing a complete firmware for a phone?


And because it is so totally incomprehensible to my mind how someone
can be like you, and be able to live with yourself while watching
someone else's life wither away because of your selfishness, I find
myself at a complete loss as to how one should interact with people
like you.


I do think you need to be more careful, kind, and forgiving of
perceived differences, when speaking to others in the community.
We're all in a similar position here, working towards helping people
communicate freely. Sure, people have different things they will
compromise in order to try to effect this, but ultimately I find it