Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
It has never sat well with me to offer discounts to larger companies that have multiple desks or memberships. If anything, they have more resources so I want to charge them more!! Angel On Tuesday, November 6, 2018 at 6:46:01 PM UTC-7, Alex Hillman wrote: > > This rules. Also a perfect lesson in using basic economics to incentivize > the preferred outcomes. > > I actually have thought about charging MORE for teams than individuals as > they grow, rather than bulk discounts. But I love this solution and the > outcome. Well done. > > Alex > On Nov 6, 2018, 8:42 PM -0500, Carl Sullivan >, wrote: > > This is all great stuff and a good launch point to form an action list to > implement over the next 12 months. > > One point that I have already taken action on is our community has always > been designed for creative businesses and most of our (Companies who are) > members identify as a Social / Design / Web / SEO / Architectural / Graphic > Design / Literacy / PR... Agency. But we fell into the trap of charging > more (read Sydney market prices) because we could, not because it was the > best thing for the teams. > > The learning here is that we value the diversity our small 1-4 person > companies brought to the community, but incentivised larger companies > through cheaper desks (because they bought more), the old pricing structure > was: > > 1-3 Desks... $750 a month > 4-8 Desks... $700 a month > 9+ Desks... $650 a month > > But we have now just changed it to a flat $650 per desk per month > regardless of numbers, and surprisingly (or not) 6 of our smaller companies > instantly committed to taking additional desks, which is going to > completely replace a company of 10 that are due to move out at the start of > December. > > @Angel your article was great, thanks for writing it and linking to it. > > @Alex your points on what is the actual value to members was the final > prompt for me to change the pricing up for our members, and now the > challenge is to reconnect with the community to identify other ways to > bring them value and actively support them in leaner times > > - Carl, Your Desk > > > On Friday, November 2, 2018 at 10:01:34 PM UTC+11, Jeannine van der Linden > wrote: >> >> Oh yes, so much this. >> >> I find it sort of humorous that we are now talking about whether >> coworking can survive a recession, there are serious articles from back >> then (and it wasn't that long ago) about whether coworking was really just >> a manifestation of recession and whether it would go away as soon as the >> economy took an upturn. >> >> To which I sad then as I say now, come back in ten years, we'll see then >> who's still standing. >> >> On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 4:22:10 PM UTC+1, Angel Kwiatkowski >> wrote: >>> >>> Jeanine, >>> I remember this woman who was familiar with Cohere but was working in a >>> regular job in the next town. She showed up on our doorstep one day after >>> lunch and proclaimed, "I just got laid off. I didn't want to go home so I >>> came here instead." >>> >>> A >>> >>> On Wednesday, October 31, 2018 at 3:37:30 AM UTC-6, Jeannine van der >>> Linden wrote: This right here. I opened my first space just as the last recession was hitting -- though it was a slower, shallower curve here in Europe, the sudden shift to mandatory entrepreneurship came in like a bomb. Suddenly people were being confronted with doing the same job they always had done as an employee, as a freelancer. They were nervous and worried and not at all sure they were up for this Brave New World. I intentionally made that space homey and personal and intimate. A shiny, corporate environment was exactly what they did not want. We had a guy from the tax office come in and give lessons on how to keep books and records as a freelancer, we had intentional freelancers come in and talk about what it's like to freelance, we had folks come in and talk about how to manage your retirement now you are a freelancer. We are now two cycles away from that and have changed a lot of things since then. I sort of miss it sometimes, though I am glad those folks are settled now mostly. Tip for Coworking in a recession: keep your costs low and your powder dry. :-) On Tuesday, October 30, 2018 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1, Alex Hillman wrote: > > > > Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last > recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - some > by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, they were > *looking > for people* who were already independent and they might be able to > learn from. That was literally the foundation of our first wave of > growth. > > In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something >
Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
This rules. Also a perfect lesson in using basic economics to incentivize the preferred outcomes. I actually have thought about charging MORE for teams than individuals as they grow, rather than bulk discounts. But I love this solution and the outcome. Well done. Alex On Nov 6, 2018, 8:42 PM -0500, Carl Sullivan , wrote: > This is all great stuff and a good launch point to form an action list to > implement over the next 12 months. > > One point that I have already taken action on is our community has always > been designed for creative businesses and most of our (Companies who are) > members identify as a Social / Design / Web / SEO / Architectural / Graphic > Design / Literacy / PR... Agency. But we fell into the trap of charging more > (read Sydney market prices) because we could, not because it was the best > thing for the teams. > > The learning here is that we value the diversity our small 1-4 person > companies brought to the community, but incentivised larger companies through > cheaper desks (because they bought more), the old pricing structure was: > > 1-3 Desks... $750 a month > 4-8 Desks... $700 a month > 9+ Desks... $650 a month > > But we have now just changed it to a flat $650 per desk per month regardless > of numbers, and surprisingly (or not) 6 of our smaller companies instantly > committed to taking additional desks, which is going to completely replace a > company of 10 that are due to move out at the start of December. > > @Angel your article was great, thanks for writing it and linking to it. > > @Alex your points on what is the actual value to members was the final prompt > for me to change the pricing up for our members, and now the challenge is to > reconnect with the community to identify other ways to bring them value and > actively support them in leaner times > > - Carl, Your Desk > > > On Friday, November 2, 2018 at 10:01:34 PM UTC+11, Jeannine van der Linden > wrote: > > Oh yes, so much this. > > > > I find it sort of humorous that we are now talking about whether coworking > > can survive a recession, there are serious articles from back then (and it > > wasn't that long ago) about whether coworking was really just a > > manifestation of recession and whether it would go away as soon as the > > economy took an upturn. > > > > To which I sad then as I say now, come back in ten years, we'll see then > > who's still standing. > > > > On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 4:22:10 PM UTC+1, Angel Kwiatkowski wrote: > > > Jeanine, > > > I remember this woman who was familiar with Cohere but was working in a > > > regular job in the next town. She showed up on our doorstep one day after > > > lunch and proclaimed, "I just got laid off. I didn't want to go home so I > > > came here instead." > > > > > > A > > > > > > On Wednesday, October 31, 2018 at 3:37:30 AM UTC-6, Jeannine van der > > > Linden wrote: > > > > This right here. > > > > > > > > I opened my first space just as the last recession was hitting -- > > > > though it was a slower, shallower curve here in Europe, the sudden > > > > shift to mandatory entrepreneurship came in like a bomb. Suddenly > > > > people were being confronted with doing the same job they always had > > > > done as an employee, as a freelancer. They were nervous and worried and > > > > not at all sure they were up for this Brave New World. > > > > > > > > I intentionally made that space homey and personal and intimate. A > > > > shiny, corporate environment was exactly what they did not want. We > > > > had a guy from the tax office come in and give lessons on how to keep > > > > books and records as a freelancer, we had intentional freelancers come > > > > in and talk about what it's like to freelance, we had folks come in and > > > > talk about how to manage your retirement now you are a freelancer. > > > > > > > > We are now two cycles away from that and have changed a lot of things > > > > since then. I sort of miss it sometimes, though I am glad those folks > > > > are settled now mostly. > > > > > > > > Tip for Coworking in a recession: keep your costs low and your powder > > > > dry. :-) > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, October 30, 2018 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1, Alex Hillman wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last > > > > > recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - > > > > > some by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, > > > > > they were looking for people who were already independent and they > > > > > might be able to learn from. That was literally the foundation of our > > > > > first wave of growth. > > > > > > > > > > In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something > > > > > similar except that a decade later the physical and social > > > > > infrastructure to support a newly minted independent is WAY better. I > > > > > think this will likely be a good thing for
Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
This is all great stuff and a good launch point to form an action list to implement over the next 12 months. One point that I have already taken action on is our community has always been designed for creative businesses and most of our (Companies who are) members identify as a Social / Design / Web / SEO / Architectural / Graphic Design / Literacy / PR... Agency. But we fell into the trap of charging more (read Sydney market prices) because we could, not because it was the best thing for the teams. The learning here is that we value the diversity our small 1-4 person companies brought to the community, but incentivised larger companies through cheaper desks (because they bought more), the old pricing structure was: 1-3 Desks... $750 a month 4-8 Desks... $700 a month 9+ Desks... $650 a month But we have now just changed it to a flat $650 per desk per month regardless of numbers, and surprisingly (or not) 6 of our smaller companies instantly committed to taking additional desks, which is going to completely replace a company of 10 that are due to move out at the start of December. @Angel your article was great, thanks for writing it and linking to it. @Alex your points on what is the actual value to members was the final prompt for me to change the pricing up for our members, and now the challenge is to reconnect with the community to identify other ways to bring them value and actively support them in leaner times - Carl, Your Desk On Friday, November 2, 2018 at 10:01:34 PM UTC+11, Jeannine van der Linden wrote: > > Oh yes, so much this. > > I find it sort of humorous that we are now talking about whether coworking > can survive a recession, there are serious articles from back then (and it > wasn't that long ago) about whether coworking was really just a > manifestation of recession and whether it would go away as soon as the > economy took an upturn. > > To which I sad then as I say now, come back in ten years, we'll see then > who's still standing. > > On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 4:22:10 PM UTC+1, Angel Kwiatkowski wrote: >> >> Jeanine, >> I remember this woman who was familiar with Cohere but was working in a >> regular job in the next town. She showed up on our doorstep one day after >> lunch and proclaimed, "I just got laid off. I didn't want to go home so I >> came here instead." >> >> A >> >> On Wednesday, October 31, 2018 at 3:37:30 AM UTC-6, Jeannine van der >> Linden wrote: >>> >>> This right here. >>> >>> I opened my first space just as the last recession was hitting -- though >>> it was a slower, shallower curve here in Europe, the sudden shift to >>> mandatory entrepreneurship came in like a bomb. Suddenly people were being >>> confronted with doing the same job they always had done as an employee, as >>> a freelancer. They were nervous and worried and not at all sure they were >>> up for this Brave New World. >>> >>> I intentionally made that space homey and personal and intimate. A >>> shiny, corporate environment was exactly what they did not want. We had a >>> guy from the tax office come in and give lessons on how to keep books and >>> records as a freelancer, we had intentional freelancers come in and talk >>> about what it's like to freelance, we had folks come in and talk about how >>> to manage your retirement now you are a freelancer. >>> >>> We are now two cycles away from that and have changed a lot of things >>> since then. I sort of miss it sometimes, though I am glad those folks are >>> settled now mostly. >>> >>> Tip for Coworking in a recession: keep your costs low and your powder >>> dry. :-) >>> >>> On Tuesday, October 30, 2018 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1, Alex Hillman wrote: Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - some by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, they were *looking for people* who were already independent and they might be able to learn from. That was literally the foundation of our first wave of growth. In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something similar except that a decade later the physical and social infrastructure to support a newly minted independent is WAY better. I think this will likely be a good thing for coworking spaces, with a caveat that people see and feel a sense of connection to the other members. If not, the coworking space is simply a cost that can be removed/reduced. And I think *that's* going to hurt a lot of spaces, especially the larger ones. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Coworking" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
Oh yes, so much this. I find it sort of humorous that we are now talking about whether coworking can survive a recession, there are serious articles from back then (and it wasn't that long ago) about whether coworking was really just a manifestation of recession and whether it would go away as soon as the economy took an upturn. To which I sad then as I say now, come back in ten years, we'll see then who's still standing. On Thursday, November 1, 2018 at 4:22:10 PM UTC+1, Angel Kwiatkowski wrote: > > Jeanine, > I remember this woman who was familiar with Cohere but was working in a > regular job in the next town. She showed up on our doorstep one day after > lunch and proclaimed, "I just got laid off. I didn't want to go home so I > came here instead." > > A > > On Wednesday, October 31, 2018 at 3:37:30 AM UTC-6, Jeannine van der > Linden wrote: >> >> This right here. >> >> I opened my first space just as the last recession was hitting -- though >> it was a slower, shallower curve here in Europe, the sudden shift to >> mandatory entrepreneurship came in like a bomb. Suddenly people were being >> confronted with doing the same job they always had done as an employee, as >> a freelancer. They were nervous and worried and not at all sure they were >> up for this Brave New World. >> >> I intentionally made that space homey and personal and intimate. A >> shiny, corporate environment was exactly what they did not want. We had a >> guy from the tax office come in and give lessons on how to keep books and >> records as a freelancer, we had intentional freelancers come in and talk >> about what it's like to freelance, we had folks come in and talk about how >> to manage your retirement now you are a freelancer. >> >> We are now two cycles away from that and have changed a lot of things >> since then. I sort of miss it sometimes, though I am glad those folks are >> settled now mostly. >> >> Tip for Coworking in a recession: keep your costs low and your powder >> dry. :-) >> >> On Tuesday, October 30, 2018 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1, Alex Hillman wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last >>> recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - some >>> by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, they were >>> *looking >>> for people* who were already independent and they might be able to >>> learn from. That was literally the foundation of our first wave of growth. >>> >>> In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something >>> similar except that a decade later the physical and social infrastructure >>> to support a newly minted independent is WAY better. I think this will >>> likely be a good thing for coworking spaces, with a caveat that people see >>> and feel a sense of connection to the other members. If not, the coworking >>> space is simply a cost that can be removed/reduced. And I think *that's* >>> going to hurt a lot of spaces, especially the larger ones. >>> >>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Coworking" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
Jeanine, I remember this woman who was familiar with Cohere but was working in a regular job in the next town. She showed up on our doorstep one day after lunch and proclaimed, "I just got laid off. I didn't want to go home so I came here instead." A On Wednesday, October 31, 2018 at 3:37:30 AM UTC-6, Jeannine van der Linden wrote: > > This right here. > > I opened my first space just as the last recession was hitting -- though > it was a slower, shallower curve here in Europe, the sudden shift to > mandatory entrepreneurship came in like a bomb. Suddenly people were being > confronted with doing the same job they always had done as an employee, as > a freelancer. They were nervous and worried and not at all sure they were > up for this Brave New World. > > I intentionally made that space homey and personal and intimate. A shiny, > corporate environment was exactly what they did not want. We had a guy > from the tax office come in and give lessons on how to keep books and > records as a freelancer, we had intentional freelancers come in and talk > about what it's like to freelance, we had folks come in and talk about how > to manage your retirement now you are a freelancer. > > We are now two cycles away from that and have changed a lot of things > since then. I sort of miss it sometimes, though I am glad those folks are > settled now mostly. > > Tip for Coworking in a recession: keep your costs low and your powder > dry. :-) > > On Tuesday, October 30, 2018 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1, Alex Hillman wrote: >> >> >> >> Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last >> recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - some >> by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, they were >> *looking >> for people* who were already independent and they might be able to learn >> from. That was literally the foundation of our first wave of growth. >> >> In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something >> similar except that a decade later the physical and social infrastructure >> to support a newly minted independent is WAY better. I think this will >> likely be a good thing for coworking spaces, with a caveat that people see >> and feel a sense of connection to the other members. If not, the coworking >> space is simply a cost that can be removed/reduced. And I think *that's* >> going to hurt a lot of spaces, especially the larger ones. >> >> >>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Coworking" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
This right here. I opened my first space just as the last recession was hitting -- though it was a slower, shallower curve here in Europe, the sudden shift to mandatory entrepreneurship came in like a bomb. Suddenly people were being confronted with doing the same job they always had done as an employee, as a freelancer. They were nervous and worried and not at all sure they were up for this Brave New World. I intentionally made that space homey and personal and intimate. A shiny, corporate environment was exactly what they did not want. We had a guy from the tax office come in and give lessons on how to keep books and records as a freelancer, we had intentional freelancers come in and talk about what it's like to freelance, we had folks come in and talk about how to manage your retirement now you are a freelancer. We are now two cycles away from that and have changed a lot of things since then. I sort of miss it sometimes, though I am glad those folks are settled now mostly. Tip for Coworking in a recession: keep your costs low and your powder dry. :-) On Tuesday, October 30, 2018 at 6:09:25 PM UTC+1, Alex Hillman wrote: > > > > Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last > recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - some > by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, they were > *looking > for people* who were already independent and they might be able to learn > from. That was literally the foundation of our first wave of growth. > > In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something > similar except that a decade later the physical and social infrastructure > to support a newly minted independent is WAY better. I think this will > likely be a good thing for coworking spaces, with a caveat that people see > and feel a sense of connection to the other members. If not, the coworking > space is simply a cost that can be removed/reduced. And I think *that's* > going to hurt a lot of spaces, especially the larger ones. > > >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Coworking" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to coworking+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [Coworking] Re: Running Coworking During a Recession....
This is a super interesting thread - I agree with *lots* of the advice/perspective in Angel's article (and not just the stuff attributed to me lol). An important thing I wanted to expand on a bit: People who cancel for the reason "I'm not using it enough" is probably among the most common reasons (behind people changing jobs and/or moving). But I've learned to read this as *"I don't see value in staying a part of this community now that I don't need a desk"* which is only a short hop to either *"I haven't really connected with anyone here"* or *"I'm not aware of the other ways to get value besides using a desk" *and in both cases I consider that a failure of communication on OUR part. We I can look at their profile for our online community and see that they never created an account, or never intro'd themselves. We can go back to their tour notes and get a sense that they came in with an expectation of "I can rent a desk here" and we didn't do a good job of showing them how they could participate in other ways. There isn't a correct way or pace for people to discover their place in a community, but we DO look at *early* indicators that they weren't actively seeking a sense of belonging. And that's okay! Lots of people aren't, at least not actively. But quite often, people just aren't actively aware of the options that already exist (like a membership option that lets them downgrade instead of cancel) or that they have the agency to create something that they want, but doesn't exist. They haven't asked for it, and we haven't done a good job of showing them that it's possible. Another thing is that when we opened (at the beginning of the last recession) we had an INFLUX of people who were "newly independent" - some by choice, many by force. They weren't looking for an office, they were *looking for people* who were already independent and they might be able to learn from. That was literally the foundation of our first wave of growth. In our next economic downturn, I expect we're going to see something similar except that a decade later the physical and social infrastructure to support a newly minted independent is WAY better. I think this will likely be a good thing for coworking spaces, with a caveat that people see and feel a sense of connection to the other members. If not, the coworking space is simply a cost that can be removed/reduced. And I think *that's* going to hurt a lot of spaces, especially the larger ones. All of this is to say: people join coworking spaces for lots of reasons, but the reasons they *stay* are fairly consistent, and that's the relationships. I can tie retention patterns *directly* to active and passive relationship building, and the interactions that our members have with each other. -Alex -- *The #1 mistake in community building is doing it by yourself.* Better Coworkers: http://indyhall.org Weekly Coworking Tips: http://coworkingweekly.com My Audiobook: https://theindyhallway.com/ten On Tue, Oct 30, 2018 at 12:37 PM Angel Kwiatkowski wrote: > Thanks Tracy! If a recession comes, I'll be SO curious to see how it > affects coworking esp. if there is a major difference in chain vs. indie > coworking. > > Angel > > On Friday, October 26, 2018 at 4:25:59 PM UTC-6, Tracy Wilson wrote: >> >> Angel - This is great. I hope that operators keep this in a handy spot >> to pull out when (assuming) the next economic downturn comes. As someone >> that opened centers in both 2008 and 2009 - when I thought things were >> tough but had no idea what misery was to come - I would say a lot of this >> is 'right on.' There is no substitution for the creativity and flexibility >> required to keep things going during those times - and your piece will be a >> good framework for those people needing some fresh ideas for looking at >> their operation. Probably the hardest thing was finding the balance >> between holding to optimism and making the really tough decisions, and >> having the faith to know when each was the required course. And, that no >> matter what, I'd survive. >> >> On Wednesday, October 24, 2018 at 1:34:13 PM UTC-7, Angel Kwiatkowski >> wrote: >>> >>> I *just* wrote an article on Recession-Proofing your Coworking Business >>> >>> https://www.diycoworking.com/blog/2018/10/24/how-to-recession-proof-your-coworking-business >>> >>> Angel >>> >>> On Tuesday, October 23, 2018 at 5:04:27 PM UTC-6, Carl Sullivan wrote: Hey Guys, I have seen with increasing regularity, news articles are not being written daily about the "impending market crash/correction" both in Australia, in Asia, across Europe and in the US. I founded Your Desk in 2011, three years after the GFC hit the world, but unlike almost every other country, Australia never saw any real negative effects from that time in history. So it would be fair to say that while I started coworking in the aftermath of one of the (only) market crashes I
