Re: GNU screen hangs
On Thu, Sep 03, 2009 at 12:59:50AM -0400, Dave Steenburgh wrote: On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 8:26 PM, Christopher Faylor wrote: On Wed, Sep 02, 2009 at 04:14:11PM -0400, Andrew Schulman wrote: screen is difficult to debug, because it uses two communicating processes, one in the foreground to talk to your terminal, and one in the background to talk to the processes in each window. That's not that hard to debug. ?You just attach two different copies of gdb to each process after screen starts running. ...but you still need to know what you're looking at, and what to look for. It also helps to be well-versed with gdb, and I am not. I was actually talking to Andrew Schulman, the screen maintainer. cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Sorry [Re: [OT] Re: GNU screen hangs]
I'm feeling a bit bad how things got out of hand, and I'm sorry for it. The etiquette of this list is unusually strict, I have never met anything like it, and I don't understand it. The trigger-happy banning behaviour really put me off the course. This clearly isn't a place for me, so I'm going to stay away, but sorry anyway. -- Tuomo -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
/me returns to the original topic. I occasionally have trouble with screen as well, and as far as I can tell, it always happens when trying to create a new screen. (To be clear, when I start screen the first time or when I press: ctrl-a c) So, it may be that screen itself is not the problem in my case. Because this occurs only rarely, I have no idea how to duplicate it, and I think disabling any programs that /might/ be interfering would be inconclusive at best. If it happens again, is there anything I can do that would lead to a proper diagnosis? I should probably also point out that when I work with cygwin, I work almost exclusively with text-based programs. So, I rarely have a need for X, and I use a command prompt window. Is there a better terminal for those circumstances? -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Sorry [Re: [OT] Re: GNU screen hangs]
TV wrote: I'm feeling a bit bad how things got out of hand, and I'm sorry for it. The etiquette of this list is unusually strict, I have never met anything like it, and I don't understand it. The trigger-happy banning behaviour really put me off the course. This clearly isn't a place for me, so I'm going to stay away, but sorry anyway. I bow to your good grace. Thank you. cheers, DaveK -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Sorry [Re: [OT] Re: GNU screen hangs]
I'm feeling a bit bad how things got out of hand, and I'm sorry for it. Accepted. Andrew. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Sorry [Re: [OT] Re: GNU screen hangs]
On Wed, Sep 02, 2009 at 12:03:15PM +, TV wrote: I'm feeling a bit bad how things got out of hand, and I'm sorry for it. The etiquette of this list is unusually strict, I have never met anything like it, and I don't understand it. The trigger-happy banning behaviour really put me off the course. This clearly isn't a place for me, so I'm going to stay away, but sorry anyway. I've removed the blocks that were put in place. Hopefully this will free up both of our time since I won't have to be adding new addresses to the block list and you won't have to be inventing new email addresses to circumvent said blocks. cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 09/02/2009 10:19 AM, Dave Steenburgh wrote: I should probably also point out that when I work with cygwin, I work almost exclusively with text-based programs. So, I rarely have a need for X, and I use a command prompt window. Is there a better terminal for those circumstances? There's always a better terminal! ;-) Cygwin has mintty and rxvt that don't require X. Then there's poderosa and Console2 (at least) that you can hunt down on the net. Poderosa and Console2 have tabs, if you like that kind of thing. ;-) -- Larry Hall http://www.rfk.com RFK Partners, Inc. (508) 893-9779 - RFK Office 216 Dalton Rd. (508) 893-9889 - FAX Holliston, MA 01746 _ A: Yes. Q: Are you sure? A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. Q: Why is top posting annoying in email? -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
I occasionally have trouble with screen as well, and as far as I can tell, it always happens when trying to create a new screen. (To be clear, when I start screen the first time or when I press: ctrl-a c) So, it may be that screen itself is not the problem in my case. Because this occurs only rarely, I have no idea how to duplicate it, and I think disabling any programs that /might/ be interfering would be inconclusive at best. If it happens again, is there anything I can do that would lead to a proper diagnosis? I don't know. Maybe someone else here does. screen is difficult to debug, because it uses two communicating processes, one in the foreground to talk to your terminal, and one in the background to talk to the processes in each window. screen in Cygwin has had trouble in the past reattaching to detached sessions. It would seem that communication between the two processes breaks down in some way at detachment or reattachment, but I don't know how to debug that, especially when the problem is intermittent and fairly rare. For whatever reasons, such reports are less common in the last few years, but there have been a few. I should probably also point out that when I work with cygwin, I work almost exclusively with text-based programs. So, I rarely have a need for X, and I use a command prompt window. Is there a better terminal for those circumstances? First, as /usr/share/doc/screen/README.Cygwin explains, if you're using a DOS terminal, you need to set CYGWIN=tty in the environment before you start your terminal, or you're likely to have problems reattaching to detached screen sessions. Personally, I much prefer PuTTYcyg. rxvt and MinTTY are also popular, but they both require X. You might also like Poderosa (http://en.poderosa.org/). Good luck, Andrew. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Andrew Schulman wrote: Personally, I much prefer PuTTYcyg. rxvt and MinTTY are also popular, but they both require X. You might also like Poderosa (http://en.poderosa.org/). Actually, neither rxvt nor MinTTY require X. I use them both without X daily. I believe MinTTY is actually based on PuTTYcyg. -Jeremy -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Andrew Schulman wrote: Personally, I much prefer PuTTYcyg. rxvt and MinTTY are also popular, but they both require X. You might also like Poderosa (http://en.poderosa.org/). Actually, neither rxvt nor MinTTY require X. I use them both without X daily. I believe MinTTY is actually based on PuTTYcyg. Right-- thanks. A. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On Wed, Sep 02, 2009 at 04:14:11PM -0400, Andrew Schulman wrote: screen is difficult to debug, because it uses two communicating processes, one in the foreground to talk to your terminal, and one in the background to talk to the processes in each window. That's not that hard to debug. You just attach two different copies of gdb to each process after screen starts running. cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 8:26 PM, Christopher Faylor wrote: On Wed, Sep 02, 2009 at 04:14:11PM -0400, Andrew Schulman wrote: screen is difficult to debug, because it uses two communicating processes, one in the foreground to talk to your terminal, and one in the background to talk to the processes in each window. That's not that hard to debug. You just attach two different copies of gdb to each process after screen starts running. ...but you still need to know what you're looking at, and what to look for. It also helps to be well-versed with gdb, and I am not. There was another hanging today, but this time I paid a little more attention, and I think bash was the problem, not screen. I never got a prompt in that window, but I could create another window and I did get a prompt there. If that's what's been going on, I'm not terribly concerned about it. However, it would be nice to figure out what and why and how to fix it. On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:14 PM, Andrew Schulman wrote: ...if you're using a DOS terminal, you need to set CYGWIN=tty in the environment before you start your terminal... Fortunately, I figured that out at some point. However, I haven't bothered to look into what that really does, so it seems like voodoo to me. On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at various times, various people wrote: mintty, rxvt, puttycyg, poderosa, console2 Thank you all for the suggestions. (Did I miss any?) Hopefully I will find one of them agreeable. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Christopher Faylor cgf-use-the-mailinglist-ple...@cygwin.com wrote: Apparently you don't know who I am. An even bigger pile of shit than this project. A project leader pretending to be an army sergeant with users rookies required to follow his ridiculous commands. I guess I'm going to complete my transition from Linux to Windows, and ditch Cygwin too. It has no hope with such piles of shit at the top. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
TV wrote: On 2009-08-31, Christopher Faylor cgf-use-the-mailinglist-ple...@cygwin.com wrote: Apparently you don't know who I am. An even bigger pile of Don't kid yourself: it's you that's at fault, not the whole rest of the world. You've been rude and arrogant from your first post. It's certainly not just him who thinks so, I was going to reply about three separate times until I saw what you were doing. Posting people's email addresses gets them spammed. It's not just a petty rule, it's a verified fact proven by scientific experimentation and measurement. Here's proof: http://www.cdt.org/speech/spam/030319spamreport.shtml Deliberately violating list netiquette and morphing your From: line to evade a ban is regarded as network abuse pretty much everywhere. It's certainly anti-social. DaveK -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-09-01, Dave Korn da...@googlemail.com wrote: Don't kid yourself: it's you that's at fault, not the whole rest of the world. You've been rude and arrogant from your first post. Oh, this is must be a cultural thing about americans and their tanned tongues. Can't stay to the facts, have to make everything dripping with sugar, otherwise it's considered rude. Posting people's email addresses gets them spammed. And the addresses are right there in the From-fields. -- Be an early adopter! Beat the herd! Choose Windows today! -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On Tue, Sep 01, 2009 at 10:23:58AM +, TV wrote: On 2009-09-01, Dave Korn da...@googlemail.com wrote: Don't kid yourself: it's you that's at fault, not the whole rest of the world. You've been rude and arrogant from your first post. Oh, this is must be a cultural thing about americans and their tanned tongues. Can't stay to the facts, have to make everything dripping with sugar, otherwise it's considered rude. Heh. DaveK is an American now. When did that happen? cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
[OT] Re: GNU screen hangs
TV wrote: On 2009-09-01, Dave Korn wrote: Wow. You kind of quoted my email address, but then you went and changed it into some poor innocent bystander's account. Whoever that is won't be pleased with you. this space left blank for Tuomo to explain why that's the innocent bystander's fault, and not his for using a buggy newsreader Don't kid yourself: it's you that's at fault, not the whole rest of the world. You've been rude and arrogant from your first post. Oh, this is must be a cultural thing about americans and their tanned tongues. I'm not even a little bit American, you silly little bigot. Can't stay to the facts, have to make everything dripping with sugar, otherwise it's considered rude. Nonsense, it's got nothing to do with the way you say it, it's the content of your message that nobody likes: self-regarding vanity, arrogance and me-first egotism. Unwarranted self-importance, much? Posting people's email addresses gets them spammed. And the addresses are right there in the From-fields. Spammers don't subscribe to mailing lists to harvest addresses. They scrape them off the web archives. The headers are munged in the archives. The bodies are not. You're just trying to justify lazy selfishness. DaveK -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: [OT] Re: GNU screen hangs
Ah, censorship. The Official Truth will become the Truth, when the opposition is censored. On 2009-09-01, Dave Korn davek.spamt...@googlemail.com wrote: Nonsense, it's got nothing to do with the way you say it, it's the content of your message that nobody likes: self-regarding vanity, arrogance and me-first egotism. Unwarranted self-importance, much? You clearly read the messages through some anti-tuomov glasses, as most of the FOSS herd does. It's not like I'm liked much for pointing out where it's all heading, and my anti-distro licensing. So the herd attacks the message thanks to the messenger. Spammers don't subscribe to mailing lists to harvest addresses. They scrape them off the web archives. The headers are munged in the archives. The bodies are not. You're just trying to justify lazy selfishness. Any sane archive will obfuscate both content and headers, if it all. This list is archived at http://news.gmane.org/gmane.os.cygwin/, and available by NNTP through news.gmage.org, both of which spammers can use. The former poorly obfuscates both (with @ replaced by at), the latter doesn't. Gmane can be configured to fully obsfuscate addresses, but nobody has done it for this list. And yet people carelessly post their real addresses in the headers... as if it's worth the effort of trying to keep addresses out of spammers' hands. Better stay of the 'net. No, the real reason for complaining about quoting an address has nothing to do with spam. You just wanted some excuse for attacking me with some nitpicky rules... on a list that is listed as the only place for users to report bugs, trying to help both the project and themselves. But, no, the attitude among FOSS developers these days is tha their project has no bugs, and they don't want to hear about it, so it's made extremely difficult to report them... registering on some suckzilla, subscribing on a mailing list (because apparently accessing through NNTP isn't really allowed, even when available), listening to power-blind assholes complain about some ridiculous directives hidden in some tome of Sacred Etiquette. Signing off. Pitäkää tunkkinne! -- Tuomo -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: [OT] Re: GNU screen hangs
One more time wrote: Ah, censorship. zOMG we is suppressing your freedumb of speach! O noes! Call for the WH-bulance! Seriously, that is the kind of pathetic nonsense spammers come out with. You clearly read the messages through some anti-tuomov glasses, as most of the FOSS herd does. It's not like I'm liked much for pointing out where it's all heading, and my anti-distro licensing. So the herd attacks the message thanks to the messenger. Oh, so you are a noble fighter for freedom, a voice crying out in the wilderness, and anyone who thinks you're a jerk is just a gullible fool with no independent thought, following the herd. Ha ha, no. Sure, they laughed at Galileo, they laughed at Copernicus, they laughed at Columbus and Newton and Einstein. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown. You're not trying to help anyone out or point the way. You posted a RRAGEE-filled angry self-pitying rant. And then you expect to be treated as some kind of hero. Like I said, narcissistic vanity. It makes you an unpleasant person to be around. Face the facts: I have never met or heard of you before; it's entirely down to the unpleasant tone of your first post and your subsequent descent into full-on trollhood. I am not following any herd, I made my own mind up, and long before you started being deliberately rude for no reason over the issue of quoting people's email addresses; it's precisely because I have an independent mind that I think you're a jerk. I've set the Followup-to header to the suitable list for continuing this off-topic discussion. DaveK -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
TV wrote: Oh, this is must be a cultural thing about americans and their tanned tongues. Excuse me, I'm off to the tongue tanning salon... ;-) -- Andrew DeFaria http://defaria.com The gene pool sure could use a little chlorine. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On Tue, Sep 01, 2009 at 07:12:51AM -0700, Andrew DeFaria wrote: TV wrote: Oh, this is must be a cultural thing about americans and their tanned tongues. Excuse me, I'm off to the tongue tanning salon... ;-) Ok. I've got to stop drinking coffee while reading the cygwin list... cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Christopher Faylor wrote: On Tue, Sep 01, 2009 at 07:12:51AM -0700, Andrew DeFaria wrote: TV wrote: Oh, this is must be a cultural thing about americans and their tanned tongues. Excuse me, I'm off to the tongue tanning salon... ;-) Ok. I've got to stop drinking coffee while reading the cygwin list... Or wear noseplugs. cheers, DaveK -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Andrew DeFaria wrote: Excuse me, I'm off to the tongue tanning salon... ;-) Crazy Americans! Tanning one end while bleaching the other! What's going on in this country?! -- Mark J. Reed markjr...@gmail.com -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Mark J. Reed wrote: Andrew DeFaria wrote: Excuse me, I'm off to the tongue tanning salon... Â ;-) Crazy Americans! Tanning one end while bleaching the other! What's going on in this country?! Here in America we treat both black and white equally! ;-) Now what was I supposed to be bleaching again... -- Andrew DeFaria http://defaria.com Can fat people go skinny-dipping? -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Cygwin (1.7 -- 1.5 is useless due to non-existent locale/UTF-8 support, although 1.7 doesn't shine in that either) was up to just a few weeks ago in a completely unusable state, because fg was broken, in addition to the X server, which has been unreliable for a couple of months now, crashing every 5 minutes. Then an update a couple of weeks ago fixed fg, so Cygwin become somewhat usable through the putty cygterm. But X still could not be relied upon. Then a couple of days ago there was a new set of updates available, including some to X, so of course I tried them. X wasn't fixed... but GNU screen had been broken, making Cygwin again completely unusable, because screen is necessary with the primitive Windows window management. (Tabbed putty would help.) The more specific problem is that GNU screen has started having random hangs, locking up the entire terminal. The hung screen sessions can not be reattached from a new terminal either; screen -r will just wait seemingly forever, although can be stopped with ^C. Even -list fails usually, although once I managed to get a list, but not attach anything, and -wipe removed everything. The hung screen process stayd there in the process listing Cygwin generally leaves a _lot_ of these zombies around, you have to do a manual clean-up at least once a week. Tuomo, I don't know what would be causing this, and I can't reproduce it in my 1.7 installation. The screen package hasn't changed in the last 2 years or so. I have LANG=en_US, but I set it to en_US.UTF-8 and ran screen without any problems. My terminal is PuTTYcyg. Please post the results of cygcheck -svr, as described at http://cygwin.com/problems.html . FWIW, I've been using both screen and the Cygwin X server in 1.7 for many months now, and I've never seen any of the instability that you're describing. As for screen, hung or unreattachable sessions and zombie processes used to be a common complaint, but that's been several years now. Andrew. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Andrew Schulman schulman.and...@epamail.epa.gov wrote: Cygwin (1.7 -- 1.5 is useless due to non-existent locale/UTF-8 support, although 1.7 doesn't shine in that either) was up to just a few weeks ago in a completely unusable state, because fg was broken, in addition to the X server, which has been unreliable for a couple of months now, crashing every 5 minutes. Then an update a couple of weeks ago fixed fg, so Cygwin become somewhat usable through the putty cygterm. But X still could not be relied upon. Then a couple of days ago there was a new set of updates available, including some to X, so of course I tried them. X wasn't fixed... but GNU screen had been broken, making Cygwin again completely unusable, because screen is necessary with the primitive Windows window management. (Tabbed putty would help.) The more specific problem is that GNU screen has started having random hangs, locking up the entire terminal. The hung screen sessions can not be reattached from a new terminal either; screen -r will just wait seemingly forever, although can be stopped with ^C. Even -list fails usually, although once I managed to get a list, but not attach anything, and -wipe removed everything. The hung screen process stayd there in the process listing Cygwin generally leaves a _lot_ of these zombies around, you have to do a manual clean-up at least once a week. Tuomo, I don't know what would be causing this, and I can't reproduce it in my 1.7 installation. The screen package hasn't changed in the last 2 years or so. I have LANG=en_US, but I set it to en_US.UTF-8 and ran screen without any problems. My terminal is PuTTYcyg. I don't know how to reproduce it. It just sometimes happens. Likewise with X, it just sometimes crashes when I press a key. (And, no, it isn't a key caught by the WM.) Please post the results of cygcheck -svr, as described at http://cygwin.com/problems.html . There. (No attachments: using slrn.) Cygwin Configuration Diagnostics Current System Time: Mon Aug 31 19:05:37 2009 Windows XP Professional Ver 5.1 Build 2600 Service Pack 3 Path: C:\cygwin\home\tuomov\bin C:\cygwin\usr\local\bin C:\cygwin\bin C:\cygwin\usr\X11R6\bin Output from C:\cygwin\bin\id.exe (nontsec) UID: 1003(tuomov) GID: 513(None) 0(root) 544(Administrators) 545(Users) 513(None) Output from C:\cygwin\bin\id.exe (ntsec) UID: 1003(tuomov) GID: 513(None) 0(root) 544(Administrators) 545(Users) 513(None) SysDir: C:\WINDOWS\system32 WinDir: C:\WINDOWS USER = 'tuomov' PWD = '/home/tuomov' CYGWIN = 'codepage:utf8' HOME = '/home/tuomov' HOMEPATH = '\Documents and Settings\tuomov' APPDATA = 'C:\Documents and Settings\tuomov\Application Data' MANPATH = '/usr/local/man:/usr/share/man:/usr/man::/usr/ssl/man' HOSTNAME = 'noi2' RR = 'C:\Program Files\Lenovo\Rescue and Recovery' TVTCOMMON = 'C:\Program Files\Common Files\Lenovo' PROCESSOR_IDENTIFIER = 'x86 Family 6 Model 13 Stepping 8, GenuineIntel' SHELL = '/bin/bash' TERM = 'screen' WINDIR = 'C:\WINDOWS' TVTPYDIR = 'C:\Program Files\Common Files\Lenovo\Python24' TEXDOCVIEW_txt = 'cygstart %s' TVT = 'C:\Program Files\Lenovo' TEXDOCVIEW_dvi = 'cygstart %s' OLDPWD = '/home/tuomov/bin' USERDOMAIN = 'NOI2' ALLUSERSPROFILE = 'C:\Documents and Settings\All Users' OS = 'Windows_NT' !:: = '::\' COMMONPROGRAMFILES = 'C:\Program Files\Common Files' TEMP = '/c/DOCUME~1/tuomov/LOCALS~1/Temp' LS_COLORS = 'rs=0:di=01;34:ln=01;36:pi=40;33:so=01;35:do=01;35:bd=40;33;01:cd=40;33;01:or=40;31;01:su=37;41:sg=30;43:ca=30;41:tw=30;42:ow=34;42:st=37;44:ex=01;32:*.tar=01;31:*.tgz=01;31:*.arj=01;31:*.taz=01;31:*.lzh=01;31:*.lzma=01;31:*.zip=01;31:*.z=01;31:*.Z=01;31:*.dz=01;31:*.gz=01;31:*.bz2=01;31:*.bz=01;31:*.tbz2=01;31:*.tz=01;31:*.deb=01;31:*.rpm=01;31:*.jar=01;31:*.rar=01;31:*.ace=01;31:*.zoo=01;31:*.cpio=01;31:*.7z=01;31:*.rz=01;31:*.jpg=01;35:*.jpeg=01;35:*.gif=01;35:*.bmp=01;35:*.pbm=01;35:*.pgm=01;35:*.ppm=01;35:*.tga=01;35:*.xbm=01;35:*.xpm=01;35:*.tif=01;35:*.tiff=01;35:*.png=01;35:*.svg=01;35:*.svgz=01;35:*.mng=01;35:*.pcx=01;35:*.mov=01;35:*.mpg=01;35:*.mpeg=01;35:*.m2v=01;35:*.mkv=01;35:*.ogm=01;35:*.mp4=01;35:*.m4v=01;35:*.mp4v=01;35:*.vob=01;35:*.qt=01;35:*.nuv=01;35:*.wmv=01;35:*.asf=01;35:*.rm=01;35:*.rmvb=01;35:*.flc=01;35:*.avi=01;35:*.fli=01;35:*.flv=01;35:*.gl=01;35:*.dl=01;35:*.xcf=01;35:*.xwd=01;35:*.yuv=01;35:*.axv=01;35:*.anx=01;35:*.ogv=01;35:*.ogx=01;35:*.aac=00;36:*.au=00;36:*.flac=00;36:*.mid=00;36:*.midi=00;36:*.mka=00;36:*.mp3=00;36:*.mpc=00;36:*.ogg=00;36:*.ra=00;36:*.wav=00;36:*.axa=00;36:*.oga=00;36:*.spx=00;36:*.xspf=00;36:' TERMCAP = 'SC|screen|VT 100/ANSI X3.64 virtual terminal:\ :DO=\E[%dB:LE=\E[%dD:RI=\E[%dC:UP=\E[%dA:bs:bt=\E[Z:\ :cd=\E[J:ce=\E[K:cl=\E[H\E[J:cm=\E[%i%d;%dH:ct=\E[3g:\ :do=^J:nd=\E[C:pt:rc=\E8:rs=\Ec:sc=\E7:st=\EH:up=\EM:\ :le=^H:bl=^G:cr=^M:it#8:ho=\E[H:nw=\EE:ta=^I:is=\E)0:\
Re: GNU screen hangs
I don't know how to reproduce it. It just sometimes happens. What terminal are you using? Not DOS by any chance? /usr/share/doc/screen/README.Cygwin warns that if you're using a DOS terminal, you must set CYGWIN=tty before starting your terminal, or you'll have problems resuming screen sessions. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
Tuomo Valkonen wrote: There. (No attachments: using slrn.) Great! Now, every time someone searches the cygwin archives for 'xrdb', they'll find your message. I'm sure that will be quite helpful. If you can't send attachments using slrn, and this list specifically requests that cygcheck results be sent as attachments, you had two choices: 1) deliberately send inline, ignoring list policy 2) use a different email program for this one message You chose poorly. -- Chuck -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Charles Wilson cyg...@cwilson.fastmail.fm wrote: If you can't send attachments using slrn, and this list specifically requests that cygcheck results be sent as attachments, you had two choices: 1) deliberately send inline, ignoring list policy 2) use a different email program for this one message You chose poorly. slrn is not an email program; it's an NNTP program. I'm reading this list through news.gmane.org; I try not to subscribe to mailing lists as mail, because it's too much pain to procmail them all, and too much stuff I don't need in my inbox. NNTP is a much better protocol for the purpose. -- Be an early adopter! Beat the herd! Choose Windows today! -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 8/31/2009 12:14 PM, Tuomo Valkonen wrote: Potential app conflicts: ZoneAlarm Personal Firewall Have you ruled out BLODA? See http://cygwin.com/faq/faq.using.html#faq.using.bloda Ken -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Ken Brown kbr...@cornell.edu wrote: Have you ruled out BLODA? See All I can say is that things used to work fine until a cygwin update less than a week ago, which did install new cygwin dlls. After that I have had screen hang a couple of times. -- Tuomo -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Andrew Schulman schulman.and...@epamail.epa.gov wrote: I don't know how to reproduce it. It just sometimes happens. What terminal are you using? Puttycyg, as I've already mentioned. -- Stop Gnomes and other pests! Purchase Windows today! http://iki.fi/tuomov/b/archives/2009/07/21/T17_26_09/ -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Tuomo Valkonen tuo...@iki.fi wrote: On 2009-08-31, Ken Brown kbr...@cornell.edu wrote: Have you ruled out BLODA? See All I can say is that things used to work fine until a cygwin update less than a week ago, which did install new cygwin dlls. After that I have had screen hang a couple of times. Some new information in: I was just running X and xterm, trying if I could get more info about the X crashes, when suddenly one of my xterms hung, completely unresponsive. So it seems like this could be a general PTY problem. This time, I was actually running darcs in the xterm, which is a very-very-poorly-working native Windows binary (that depends on Cygwin for the build process!), because darcs can't be built for Cygwin due to no GHC (Glasgow Haskell Compiler) for Cygwin... and the GHC folks don't seem very interested in getting it to build on Cygwin. I was able to recover the xterm by killing darcs (with Windows task manager), however. I'm not sure what I was running in screen when it hung, but at least one of the times, it could have been texify from MiKTeX. (Needed Yap from it, since Cygwin X can not be relied upon for doing any work in, so might just as well stick to MiKTeX entirely, instead of Cygwin TeTeX.) So, it could be that these hangs have something to do with the PTY interface code (or whatever -- I don't know the architecture) to native Windows binaries failing. -- [Fashion] is usually a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months. -- Oscar Wilde -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 8/31/2009 2:28 PM, Tuomo Valkonen wrote: On 2009-08-31, Ken Brown x...@xxx.xxx wrote: http://cygwin.com/acronyms/#PCYMTNQREAIYR Have you ruled out BLODA? See All I can say is that things used to work fine until That's an interesting response. Aren't you interested in trying to see if your problems are caused by BLODA? Is it too much trouble to disable or uninstall ZoneAlarm to see if that helps? No reply is necessary. But if you do reply, please don't quote my email address again. Ken -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Ken Brown kbr...@cornell.edu wrote: That's an interesting response. Aren't you interested in trying to see if your problems are caused by BLODA? Is it too much trouble to disable or uninstall ZoneAlarm to see if that helps? Don't have such a thing installed. Another firewall, though. And I'm not disabling it. If a firewall blocking traffic blocks cygwin, it's cygwin's fault, for doing blocking IO. -- In 1995, Linux was almost a bicycle; an alternative way of live to the Windows petrol beasts that had to be taken to the dealer for service. By 2008, Linux has bloated into a gas-guzzler, and the cycle paths have been replaced with polluted motorways. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Ken Brown kbr...@cornell.edu wrote: That's an interesting response. Aren't you interested in trying to see if your problems are caused by BLODA? Is it too much trouble to disable or uninstall ZoneAlarm to see if that helps? Don't have such a thing installed. Another firewall, though. And I'm not disabling it. If a firewall blocking traffic blocks cygwin, it's cygwin's fault, for doing blocking IO. oy Perhaps you should read http://cygwin.com/faq/faq.using.html#faq.using.bloda . Overall, I have to say that you seem to have a big chip on your shoulder about this whole problem. We're sorry that things are working right for you, and a fair number of long time contributors to this list have patiently offered their advice. Your responses have been fairly rude. For my part, I'm done with you. Best of luck with your problem. Andrew. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 09:09:25PM +, Tuomo Valkonen wrote: On 2009-08-31, Ken Brown x...@xxx.xxx wrote: That's an interesting response. Aren't you interested in trying to see if your problems are caused by BLODA? Is it too much trouble to disable or uninstall ZoneAlarm to see if that helps? No reply is necessary. But if you do reply, please don't quote my email address again. Don't have such a thing installed. Another firewall, though. And I'm not disabling it. If a firewall blocking traffic blocks cygwin, it's cygwin's fault, for doing blocking IO. It is very rude to ignore a request not to quote an email address. Please do not do this again. (Assuming anyone is actually interested in helping you now) cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-31, Christopher Faylor cgf-use-the-mailinglist-ple...@cygwin.com wrote: It is very rude to ignore a request not to quote an email address. Please do not do this again. It's very rude to make such lame requests. What is it for? Spam? The address is glaring there bright in from-fields. Any archive software that obfuscates headers can obfuscate content. -- In 1995, Linux was almost a bicycle; an alternative way of live to the Windows petrol beasts that had to be taken to the dealer for service. By 2008, Linux has bloated into a gas-guzzler, and local vendors and artisans have had to yield to all under one roof big box hypermarkets. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 10:22:43PM +, Tuomo Valkonen wrote: On 2009-08-31, Christopher Faylor wrote: It is very rude to ignore a request not to quote an email address. Please do not do this again. It's very rude to make such lame requests. What is it for? Spam? The address is glaring there bright in from-fields. Any archive software that obfuscates headers can obfuscate content. Apparently you don't know who I am. Allow me introduce myself. I'm the guy who just added you to the cygwin mailing list blacklist, i.e., *PLONK* cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
default encoding (was: Re: GNU screen hangs)
Tuomo Valkonen: Firstly Xlib/libc communication seems to be broken/unimplemented. This has frequently been a problem on Linux too, Xlib not being aware of libc locales. (Xlib usually won't work without the .encoding part in LC_CTYPE, which frequently isn't there, as libc seemingly can get the information from elsewhere.) If a locale is specified without an encoding, Cygwin 1.7 uses the Windows system's default ANSI codepage, i.e. CP1252 or such like. Presumably X implements the encodings itself rather than use setlocale(LC_CTYPE, ) and rely on the standard conversion functions? Hence, for proper interoperability, it would need to duplicate the fallback to the Windows ANSI codepage as well. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a standard interface for finding out what charset is being used with a locale setting that doesn't explicitly specify one. Another problem is that a after an upgrade a couple of months, various Python software (duplicity and eyeD3 at least) stopped working with UTF-8 file names (and probably other input too). This is fixed by adding the call locale.setlocale(locale.LC_CTYPE, ) in the programs. Not sure where the fault is, or if it has been fixed by now. Strictly speaking, the default C locale is ASCII only, so programs shouldn't rely on anything that happens to be working on a particular system. Having said that, handling of non-ASCII characters in Cygwin's C locale has indeed changed. Not sure how and why though. See my The C Locale post. Andy -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: default encoding (was: Re: GNU screen hangs)
On 2009-08-30, Andy Koppe andy.ko...@gmail.com wrote: If a locale is specified without an encoding, Cygwin 1.7 uses the Windows system's default ANSI codepage, i.e. CP1252 or such like. Presumably X implements the encodings itself rather than use setlocale(LC_CTYPE, ) and rely on the standard conversion functions? Hence, for proper interoperability, it would need to duplicate the fallback to the Windows ANSI codepage as well. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a standard interface for finding out what charset is being used with a locale setting that doesn't explicitly specify one. I have LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8, of course. And still Xlib fails. Another problem is that a after an upgrade a couple of months, various Python software (duplicity and eyeD3 at least) stopped working with UTF-8 file names (and probably other input too). This is fixed by adding the call locale.setlocale(locale.LC_CTYPE, ) in the programs. Not sure where the fault is, or if it has been fixed by now. Strictly speaking, the default C locale is ASCII only, so programs shouldn't rely on anything that happens to be working on a particular system. Having said that, handling of non-ASCII characters in Cygwin's C locale has indeed changed. Not sure how and why though. See my The C Locale post. I'm not sure how this is relevant. The problem seems to be that since that one update (might have been a minor version change in Python), Python programs aren't in multibyte/locale-aware mode by default anymore, which that call above enables, my setting being LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8. Now, the question is whether 1. Have Cygwin packagers somehow disabled the Python interpreter from calling setlocale? 2. Or has it been disabled in Python entirely? There was no problem previously. I think the Python interpreter should call setlocale, instead of having Python programs themselves do it, because it is half-an-OS and does lots of character set mangling, that Python software shouldn't have to be aware of. Anyway, I think this problem may have been fixed already -- not 100% certain -- since eyeD3 no longer dies on some tested file names that do not fit into the ASCII range, and I never hacked it to include the setlocale call, just some custom id3 tag backup scripts using its library. -- Stop Gnomes and other pests! Purchase Windows today! http://iki.fi/tuomov/b/archives/2009/07/21/T17_26_09/ -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: default encoding (was: Re: GNU screen hangs)
Tuomo Valkonen: I have LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8, of course. And still Xlib fails. Oh well. Someone more knowledgeable about X will need to step in here. I think the Python interpreter should call setlocale, instead of having Python programs themselves do it, because it is half-an-OS and does lots of character set mangling, that Python software shouldn't have to be aware of. C programs have to call it themselves too, so it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect Python programs to do the same. I guess the important thing is that it's defined one way or the other. I've got no idea whether it is. Sorry, not very helpful. Andy -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
2009/8/29 Tuomo Valkonen: Cygwin (1.7 -- 1.5 is useless due to non-existent locale/UTF-8 support, although 1.7 doesn't shine in that either) Any specific problems regarding the latter? Andy -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: GNU screen hangs
On 2009-08-29, Andy Koppe andy.ko...@gmail.com wrote: 2009/8/29 Tuomo Valkonen: Cygwin (1.7 -- 1.5 is useless due to non-existent locale/UTF-8 support, although 1.7 doesn't shine in that either) Any specific problems regarding the latter? A couple. Firstly Xlib/libc communication seems to be broken/unimplemented. This has frequently been a problem on Linux too, Xlib not being aware of libc locales. (Xlib usually won't work without the .encoding part in LC_CTYPE, which frequently isn't there, as libc seemingly can get the information from elsewhere.) So XSetLocale will fail, and FontSets will not be usable, or XSetLocale will not fail, but FontSets will still be loaded incorrectly. Or something like that. Currently Ion can't display non-ASCII characters, although they work fine in Xterm that does hack raw DrawString16 stuff expecting an unicode font. (I won't touch the blur-fascist shit known as Xft/fontconfig with a long stick... part of the reason for my switch to Windows XP.) I guess there were also some problems with some of the X terminal emulators as well (I got basic non-uxterm xterm working anyway), but I don't feel like starting X now to check, because it'll just crash soon afterwards. Another problem is that a after an upgrade a couple of months, various Python software (duplicity and eyeD3 at least) stopped working with UTF-8 file names (and probably other input too). This is fixed by adding the call locale.setlocale(locale.LC_CTYPE, ) in the programs. Not sure where the fault is, or if it has been fixed by now. Maybe there were a few other problems, but they haven't bugged my since my initial attempts at getting things to work well enough. And as long as things work in terminal programs and xterm, it's good enough for my cygwin uses. -- In 1995, Linux was almost a bicycle; an alternative way of live to the Windows petrol beasts that had to be taken to the dealer for service. By 2008, Linux has bloated into a gas-guzzler, and local vendors and artisans have had to yield to all under one roof big box hypermarkets. -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
