Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 2024-05-19 09:38, Jon Turney via Cygwin wrote: On 19/05/2024 00:17, Mark Geisert via Cygwin wrote: FWIW Although this wording seems to indicate Cygwin is still supported on 32-bit Windows, just discouraged. This seems like a willfully context-blind reading. The table above lists Windows versions for which support has been discontinued, which includes "All 32-bit". Further, https://cygwin.com/ plainly states "The Cygwin DLL currently works with all recent, commercially released x86_64 versions of Windows ...", which seems pretty unambiguous. Suggestions on how to improve this obviously welcomed. (but I'm not a big fan of "put fact A in place X as well as place Y, so people who ignored it in place Y because it didn't fit there priors can continue to ignore it in place X as well.") Best practice for any communication is: Tell them what you are going to tell them, Tell them what you want them to know, Tell them what you told them. -- Aristotelian Triptych That is presumably triply true for unwelcome news! "The human brain evidently operates on some variation of the famous principle enunciated in 'The Hunting of the Snark': 'What I tell you three times is true.'" -- Norbert Weiner, "Cybernetics" -- Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada La perfection est atteinte Perfection is achieved non pas lorsqu'il n'y a plus rien à ajouter not when there is no more to add mais lorsqu'il n'y a plus rien à retirer but when there is no more to cut -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 19/05/2024 00:17, Mark Geisert via Cygwin wrote: [...] FWIW Although this wording seems to indicate Cygwin is still supported on 32-bit Windows, just discouraged. This seems like a willfully context-blind reading. The table above lists Windows versions for which support has been discontinued, which includes "All 32-bit". Further, https://cygwin.com/ plainly states "The Cygwin DLL currently works with all recent, commercially released x86_64 versions of Windows ...", which seems pretty unambiguous. Suggestions on how to improve this obviously welcomed. (but I'm not a big fan of "put fact A in place X as well as place Y, so people who ignored it in place Y because it didn't fit there priors can continue to ignore it in place X as well.") -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 17/05/2024 17:30, Eliot Moss via Cygwin wrote: On 5/17/2024 11:21 AM, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 16:50, Brian Inglis via Cygwin wrote: On 2024-05-17 01:48, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install Practical reason is 32 bit usage < 1% I would agree for commercial, well-funded enterprises. The situation is much different for funding-starved education, i.e. schools and universities, where Win10 32bit is squatting cheap computers in the *millions*. For example the schools in Paris alone have 22000 active Win10 32bit licenses in 2022 (last time this was counted). and Cygwin is all volunteer, with professionally and/or personally busy developers lacking time to do more. You are on your own with 32 bit dropped, Does Cygwin 3.6 still compile on 32bit? AFAIK, yes, though most folks don't compile it themselves. This is not correct, it does not. Even if it did, it seems wildly optimistic to assume it just works, when no-one has been ensuring that it does. -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 17/05/2024 10:30, Dimitry Andric via Cygwin wrote: On 17 May 2024, at 09:48, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install How exactly does it "refuse to install" ? If it says "mbox : Cygwin is not supported on 32-bit Windows", you may not have followed the instructions at https://cygwin.com/pipermail/cygwin/2022-November/252542.html, which say: This links to https://cygwin.com/install.html#unsupported which contains those instructions (and is kept up to date). I'm not entirely sure how the OP managed to obtain an x86 installer, without coming across those instructions. -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? https://cygwin.com/install.html has the following... =A note about 32-bit Cygwin =The limited address space of 32-bit Windows means that random failures =in the fork(2) system call are more likely. Therefore, we recommend =using 32-bit Cygwin only in limited scenarios, with only a minimum of =necessary packages installed, and only if there's no way to run 64-bit =Cygwin instead. FWIW Although this wording seems to indicate Cygwin is still supported on 32-bit Windows, just discouraged, no Cygwin DLL since 3.3.6 has been released for 32-bit Windows. Features of later Cygwin DLLs are unlikely to be backported. I look forward (not) to future discussions about what merits a backport or updated release and who should be doing it. ..mark -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 2024-05-18 14:13, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: On Sat, 18 May 2024 at 13:22, Roland Mainz via Cygwin wrote: On Fri, May 17, 2024 at 9:48 AM Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install Maybe the Cygwin 32bit setup wants to make sure only people who read the instructions can use it ? :-) This should work from an Admin cmd.exe console. snip # Install Cygwin 32bit on Windows 10 32bit with packages required by "ms-nfs41-client" (Windows NFSv4.1 client) # get installer from https://www.cygwin.com/setup-x86.exe setup-x86.exe --allow-unsupported-windows -q --no-verify --site http://ctm.crouchingtigerhiddenfruitbat.org/pub/cygwin/circa/2022/11/23/063457 cygwin,cygwin-devel,cygrunsrv,cygutils,cygutils-extra,bash,bzip2,coreutils,getent,gdb,grep,hostname,less,libiconv,libiconv2,pax,pbzip2,procps-ng,sed,tar,time,util-linux,wget,libnfs,make,git,dos2unix snip That does only install the default packages for me, but not wget or cygrunserv. Is there a setup-x86.exe option just to add packages to an existing installation? Missing option -P/--packages before package list, which may be comma or (within quotes) space delimited. Installing cygport is equivalent of build essential on other distros. -- Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada La perfection est atteinte Perfection is achieved non pas lorsqu'il n'y a plus rien à ajouter not when there is no more to add mais lorsqu'il n'y a plus rien à retirer but when there is no more to cut -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On Sat, 18 May 2024 at 13:22, Roland Mainz via Cygwin wrote: > > On Fri, May 17, 2024 at 9:48 AM Cedric Blancher via Cygwin > wrote: > > Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on > > 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to > > create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but > > setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install > > Maybe the Cygwin 32bit setup wants to make sure only people who read > the instructions can use it ? :-) > > This should work from an Admin cmd.exe console. > snip > # Install Cygwin 32bit on Windows 10 32bit with packages required by > "ms-nfs41-client" (Windows NFSv4.1 client) > # get installer from https://www.cygwin.com/setup-x86.exe > setup-x86.exe --allow-unsupported-windows -q --no-verify --site > http://ctm.crouchingtigerhiddenfruitbat.org/pub/cygwin/circa/2022/11/23/063457 > cygwin,cygwin-devel,cygrunsrv,cygutils,cygutils-extra,bash,bzip2,coreutils,getent,gdb,grep,hostname,less,libiconv,libiconv2,pax,pbzip2,procps-ng,sed,tar,time,util-linux,wget,libnfs,make,git,dos2unix > snip That does only install the default packages for me, but not wget or cygrunserv. Is there a setup-x86.exe option just to add packages to an existing installation? Ced -- Cedric Blancher [https://plus.google.com/u/0/+CedricBlancher/] Institute Pasteur -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On Fri, May 17, 2024 at 9:48 AM Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: > Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on > 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to > create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but > setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install Maybe the Cygwin 32bit setup wants to make sure only people who read the instructions can use it ? :-) This should work from an Admin cmd.exe console. snip # Install Cygwin 32bit on Windows 10 32bit with packages required by "ms-nfs41-client" (Windows NFSv4.1 client) # get installer from https://www.cygwin.com/setup-x86.exe setup-x86.exe --allow-unsupported-windows -q --no-verify --site http://ctm.crouchingtigerhiddenfruitbat.org/pub/cygwin/circa/2022/11/23/063457 cygwin,cygwin-devel,cygrunsrv,cygutils,cygutils-extra,bash,bzip2,coreutils,getent,gdb,grep,hostname,less,libiconv,libiconv2,pax,pbzip2,procps-ng,sed,tar,time,util-linux,wget,libnfs,make,git,dos2unix snip Bye, Roland P.S.: Offtopic, just noting it here because I wasted a lot of time: Windows 10/32bit (Win10_22H2_German_x32v1.iso) on VMware Workstation 17.5 crashes randomly on first *update* after installation if you use the VMware NVME driver, only SATA etc. works -- __ . . __ (o.\ \/ /.o) roland.ma...@nrubsig.org \__\/\/__/ MPEG specialist, C&&& programmer /O /==\ O\ TEL +49 641 3992797 (;O/ \/ \O;) -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 5/17/2024 11:21 AM, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 16:50, Brian Inglis via Cygwin wrote: On 2024-05-17 01:48, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install Practical reason is 32 bit usage < 1% I would agree for commercial, well-funded enterprises. The situation is much different for funding-starved education, i.e. schools and universities, where Win10 32bit is squatting cheap computers in the *millions*. For example the schools in Paris alone have 22000 active Win10 32bit licenses in 2022 (last time this was counted). and Cygwin is all volunteer, with professionally and/or personally busy developers lacking time to do more. You are on your own with 32 bit dropped, Does Cygwin 3.6 still compile on 32bit? AFAIK, yes, though most folks don't compile it themselves. I just download things. so ask questions on forums like SO. What is SO? StackOverflow. Cheers - Eliot Moss -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 16:50, Brian Inglis via Cygwin wrote: > > On 2024-05-17 01:48, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: > > Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on > > 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to > > create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but > > setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install > > Practical reason is 32 bit usage < 1% I would agree for commercial, well-funded enterprises. The situation is much different for funding-starved education, i.e. schools and universities, where Win10 32bit is squatting cheap computers in the *millions*. For example the schools in Paris alone have 22000 active Win10 32bit licenses in 2022 (last time this was counted). > and Cygwin is all volunteer, with > professionally and/or personally busy developers lacking time to do more. > You are on your own with 32 bit dropped, Does Cygwin 3.6 still compile on 32bit? > so ask questions on forums like SO. What is SO? Ced -- Cedric Blancher [https://plus.google.com/u/0/+CedricBlancher/] Institute Pasteur -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 2024-05-17 01:48, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install Practical reason is 32 bit usage < 1% and Cygwin is all volunteer, with professionally and/or personally busy developers lacking time to do more. You are on your own with 32 bit dropped, so ask questions on forums like SO. -- Take care. Thanks, Brian Inglis Calgary, Alberta, Canada La perfection est atteinte Perfection is achieved non pas lorsqu'il n'y a plus rien à ajouter not when there is no more to add mais lorsqu'il n'y a plus rien à retirer but when there is no more to cut -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
On 17 May 2024, at 09:48, Cedric Blancher via Cygwin wrote: > > Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on > 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to > create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but > setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install How exactly does it "refuse to install" ? If it says "mbox : Cygwin is not supported on 32-bit Windows", you may not have followed the instructions at https://cygwin.com/pipermail/cygwin/2022-November/252542.html, which say: > To install the last cygwin version for x86, run setup using the options > '--allow-unsupported-windows option --site circa_URL', where circa_URL can be > one of: > * The URL for any sourceware mirror[1], followed by cygwin-archive/20221123 > * > http://ctm.crouchingtigerhiddenfruitbat.org/pub/cygwin/circa/2022/11/23/063457 I tried exactly that just now (with the second URL), and it installed OK, with the default package set. This is on a Windows 10 22H2 x64 host. The resulting Cygwin installation appears to work fine, with light testing. -Dimitry -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows?
Good morning! Is there a technical reason why 32bit Cygwin cannot be installed on 64bit Windows? We like to create a CI build pipeline, and want to create binaries for 32bit and 64bit Cygwin on the same machine, but setup.exe for 32bir Cygwin refuses to install Ced -- Cedric Blancher [https://plus.google.com/u/0/+CedricBlancher/] Institute Pasteur -- Problem reports: https://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: https://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation:https://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: https://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
