How to suppress/handle junction points in CIFS-mounting Windows 7 shares on Linux?
When mounting a Windows 7 share on Linux, how *can Windows junction points be
suppressed* (or otherwise handled so that one that points up to a containing
directory can't cause an endless loop)?
For example, the (standard, Windows-created) junction point at "C:\Users\someuser\Application
Data\" links back up to "C:\Users\someuser\".
When I try to mount C: on Linux and run a command that recursively traverses
down subdirectories (e.g., find, du) the command iterates through (the Linux
pathnames for):
* C:\Users\someuser\Application Data\
* C:\Users\someuser\Application Data\Application Data\
* C:\Users\someuser\Application Data\Application Data\Application Data\
* etc.
until hitting some limit and then hanging.
Apparently, Linux and/or the commands see the junction point as a regular
directory, not recognizing it as a symbolic link or other structure that can
cause a filesystem traversal loop.
(In Windows Explorer, the junction point shows up as a folder that can't be opened
("Access is denied"). In CygWin on Windows, the junction point seems to show up
as a regular Unix symlink, so the find command normally skips it, and even with -follow
specified, find can recognize and cut the traversal loop.)
So, *how can junction point be suppressed or handled?* Is there any way to:
- Tell *Windows to suppress* reporting *junction points* as directories?
- Get *Linux*'s CIFS mounting to recognize junction points and *present them as
symbolic links?*
- Get *Linux*'s CIFS mounting to recognize junction points and simply
*suppr**ess them?*
(I've tried with both the administrative share for C: (C$) and a user-created
share of C:.)
Thanks,
Daniel
Re: Are the assigned capacities sufficient for my setup?
gajuph4pre@yahoo, Andy Smith wrote: Hello, On Tue, Jul 28, 2020 at 08:53:57PM +, gajuph4...@yahoo.com wrote: I have manually partitioned my hard disk drive as follows: /boot is assigned 200MB /root is assigned 10GB /swap is assigned 20GB /home is assigned 35GB /var is assigned 10GB /usr is assigned 5GB /usr-local is assigned 5GB /opt is assigned 5GB /srv is assigned 5GB This is a terrible idea. It's near impossible to predict how your usage will evolve so almost certainly one or more of these will fill while others remain near empty. If you want to do this, use LVM and pick minimal capacities for all Definitely. If you really want to have separate file systems for all those mount points (and maybe even if you only have a few separate ones), use LVM. Instead of having your mount points' file systems directly on real disk partitions, which are harder to re-size, sometimes needing time-consuming copying to empty space on a disk, you'd have your file systems on virtual partitions (LVM logical volumes) that can be re-sized easily. (LVM uses the real disk partitions as LVM physical volumes, from which space can be allocated to the LVM logical volumes. One suggestion: When you set things up, learn how to extend a logical volume and enlarge its contained file system and then write down instructions/reminders for yourself. When you run out of space in some file system in the middle of doing something else (likely months down the road), you probably won't remember the LVM details you haven't thought about since you set things up. (I have my file systems set up on LVM logical volumes, the LVM physical volumes set up on RAID arrays, and the RAID arrays set up on pairs of partitions on my two disks. Having detailed instructions, for, e.g., enlarging a file system and for replacing a failed disk, already written down saved a lot of time and headaches and avoided mistakes.) Daniel the above, leaving the majority unallocated. You can then grow logical volumes as needed and the problem goes away. Cheers, Andy
Re: Debian is testing Discourse
rhkra...@gmail.com wrote: On Wednesday, April 29, 2020 12:49:53 PM Daniel Barclay wrote: How do people not understand that the word "forum" does not exclude e-mail or even non-digital communication (that "forum" does not mean only a web-based forum)? What word would you suggest be used for the things that people do call forums but excluding email / maillists? I don't know of a single-word name, but "web forum" or "web-based forum" at least clarifies that it's not e-mail or whatever, and saying "xyx forum" implies that "forum" means something else (something more general). I feel the need to distinguish those -- I like email for communication, I don't like the web based things that are often called forums. Definitely. Daniel
Re: Debian is testing Discourse
Brian wrote: On Wed 29 Apr 2020 at 12:20:37 -0400, Daniel Barclay wrote: Andrei POPESCU wrote: ... The best thing about a wiki is that anyone can edit it[1]. Having to check with others first would, in my opinion, just hinder contributions. Reverts are much easier to do than edits ;) How about tentative or provisional edits--changes that perhaps show up before being approved/confirmed by owners/experts/approvers, but are rendered as unconfirmed edits, so readers know their status? (That way, new information can get to readers quickly (before confirmation), and in case the new information is wrong, readers were alerted to that possibility (its higher probability).) How about users creating pages or altering existing ones to reflect what they consider to be in the best interests of the wiki? By itself? What one random user considers to be in the best interest of the wiki might be wrong and might be something that a regular editor/approver of the page could catch and fix or delete. Combined with what I suggested? Yes, that would be fine, but then isn't that what I just suggested? What are you counter-suggesting or objecting to? I'm buggered if I will await the contribution of some approver, who could, presumably, could have improved the page with or without my intervention. What awaiting are you talking about? In my proposal, the only awaiting would be for being able to see the changed text without the special rendering/marking (indicating that it's a not-yet-vetted user-made change) rather then seeing the changed text rendered normally. Daniel
Re: Debian is testing Discourse
Andrei POPESCU wrote: On Mi, 29 apr 20, 13:03:47, Daniel Barclay wrote: Nate Bargmann wrote: This topic has been on LWN.net for the past several days and should be free to view in the next day or two: https://lwn.net/Articles/817668/ And subscribing is required even just to *see* the "Debian discusses Discourse" discussions? That's, well, ... at least ironic. How so? Using Discourse, at least its web interface, would requiring logging in, and that discussion of using Discourse requires creating and account and logging in just to _read_ the discussion. Daniel
Re: Debian is testing Discourse
Nate Bargmann wrote: This topic has been on LWN.net for the past several days and should be free to view in the next day or two: https://lwn.net/Articles/817668/ And subscribing is required even just to *see* the "Debian discusses Discourse" discussions? That's, well, ... at least ironic. Daniel
Re: Debian is testing Discourse
Sven Hartge wrote: ... As Russ noted in https://lists.debian.org/debian-project/2020/04/msg00103.html in 3) "... more comfortable with forums than with email. [...]" ... How do people not understand that the word "forum" does not exclude e-mail or even non-digital communication (that "forum" does not mean only a web-based forum)? (It's like thinking "turf" means "artificial turf"--as did some local newscasters who reported that some schools were changing their athletic fields from turf back to grass. Huh?) Daniel
Re: Debian is testing Discourse
Andrei POPESCU wrote: > ... > The best thing about a wiki is that anyone can edit it[1]. Having to > check with others first would, in my opinion, just hinder contributions. > > Reverts are much easier to do than edits ;) How about tentative or provisional edits--changes that perhaps show up before being approved/confirmed by owners/experts/approvers, but are rendered as unconfirmed edits, so readers know their status? (That way, new information can get to readers quickly (before confirmation), and in case the new information is wrong, readers were alerted to that possibility (its higher probability).) Daniel
Re: scrollbar on left side
lee wrote: On Thu, Oct 21, 2010 at 11:39:22PM +0200, Andreas Weber wrote: On 2010-10-21 22:48, lee wrote: On a side note: Someone once asked me why the text is moving up when you move the scrollbar down. Where´s the logic in that? Why isn´t the text moving up together with the scroll bar? Seriously? It indicates the position in the document, and so it behaves. Yes, seriously, and I do see the point. You move the text with the scrollbar, so why does the text move into the opposite direction of the scrollbar? Because it models moving a _viewer_ (e.g., the far end of binoculars or a telescope) down the text rather than moving the _text_ up. And the inconsistency causing your why? is that the actual viewer (the viewport drawn on your screen) is not moving, and instead the text is actually moving up. On http://maps.google.com/, try dragging in the scroller (the smaller view in the lower right corner) and then try dragging in the main map, and notice how in one case the map moves in the opposite direction. If dragging in the middle of the text window scrolled the text in the opposite direction, that really would be confusing and very backwards. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4cc1de2b.6050...@fgm.com
Re: umount without sync
Scott Ferguson wrote: On 17/09/10 22:25, T o n g wrote: ... umount swap? I suspect you mean swapoff (though I can't think of many uses). There probably aren't many, but one is to reclaim disk space. For example, if you use swap files (as opposed to partitions) and the file system containing a swap file becomes full or low on space, if you're not currently using too much swap space, you can use swapoff to stop using a swap file, delete that file, and then have that space available for other files. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c9384bb.8040...@fgm.com
Re: Proposed Fluxbox style for Debian
Donald MacKinnon wrote: Dale wrote: ... I have been working on a new Fluxbox style[1] ... Comments and/or suggestions more than welcome ... [1] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianArt/Themes/Debian_LibStick Hello Dale, I for one am not keen on black on a darkish blue. There is too little contrast between the two. This is especially true if the writing is small. A lighter shade of blue would improve the legibility. It's not just you--human vision has lower spatial resolution for blue, than it does for green or red, so it's harder to see things, especially small things (e.g., features of letters in text), in colors that differ only in how much blue they contain (e.g., blue vs. black, white vs. yellow). Bigger visual elements can work with lower contrast or with contrast just in the blue component. Smaller visual elements usually need higher contrast. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c938833.1070...@fgm.com
Re: Unicode Character key-in problem
Phil Requirements wrote: On 2010-09-10 18:56:03 -0400, Daniel Barclay wrote: Phil Requirements wrote: ... GNU/Linux has an *improved* method of inputting these special characters. In Windows, you have to memorize these four digit codes that don't mean anything. In GNU/Linux, I memorize two-letter codes that actually hint at the meaning. On the other hand, a method based on hexadecimal character codes can handle a lot more characters than you can memorize two-key combinations for, and ... [you] can use standard Unicode code point numbers for characters (which are also used in HTML, [etc.]). the character in those other places; learning a hex code would.) I agree with your point that the ability to enter hex codes would be portable in a certain way. However, they are not mnemonic at all, and are difficult to memorize. I was trying to address the very specific problem the original poster had laid out. He had certain characters that he needed frequently, which he had memorized the decimal ASCII code for. In that situation (an average user who needs to enter some special characters now and then) I still think that the two-letter mnemonic codes are an improvement over memorizing decimal ASCII codes. It's a good and valid point about working with Unicode codes. But my email that you are quoting was written on a simpler level than that. I didn't mean that GNU/Linux isn't improved because it adds the composition method (or that the composition is an improvement in many cases). I just meant to point out that it wouldn't clearly be an improvement if Linux(/GTK/X11/etc.) had also dropped the numeric entry method. (I'm thinking of when Macintoshes first came out--they added (relative to typical computers of the day) the mouse, which was a big improvement in most cases, but they dumbly dropped the left and right arrow keys. That combination definitely was _not_ an improvement in cases such as correcting a typo a couple of characters back from the text cursor.) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c924577.2050...@fgm.com
Re: Unicode Character key-in problem
Phil Requirements wrote: ... GNU/Linux has an *improved* method of inputting these special characters. In Windows, you have to memorize these four digit codes that don't mean anything. In GNU/Linux, I memorize two-letter codes that actually hint at the meaning. On the other hand, a method based on hexadecimal character codes can handle a lot more characters than you can memorize two-key combinations for, and instead of using keyboard-layout-specific combinations, can use standard Unicode code point numbers for characters (which are also used in HTML, XML, JavaScript, Java, Ruby I think, and who know where else). (That is, learning learning a multi-key compose combination for a character won't help you when you want to enter the encoded form of the character in those other places; learning a hex code would.) An improvment over Windows would be giving you _both_ types of methods. (Then you can use the composition method for, say, common characters, and can still use the numeric method when you need to.) (From Celejar(?)'s Control-Shift-U comment, it sounds like Linux does provide both types of methods.) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c8ab783.2080...@fgm.com
Re: Understanding LVM UUIDS
Aaron Toponce wrote: UUIDs are unique to the device/filesystem. Are these (disk) UUIDs stored somewhere in the partition (in the filesystem), or are they stored at or generated from a lower level? In particular, if one used dd to copy the contents (a file system) of one partition to another partition, does the target partition end up with the same UUID or a different UUID? If you did a byte-for-byte copy of an entire disk to another disk of the exact same size (and model, but different serial number), would the UUIDs of partitions change or still be the same on the target disk?) (Is it similar to, or different than, the situation with filesystem labels (specifically, that if you copied a partition as above you'd end up with two partitions with the same label, and you'd have to change one (or otherwise deal with the non-uniqueness))?) Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c2e249c.6090...@fgm.com
Re: Misleading Debian's installer choice
Alan Chandler wrote: On 30/06/10 09:29, Merciadri Luca wrote: I find this perfect, but it should be coupled with the impossibility of putting on two partitions the same stuff, i.e. putting /var on two partitions, for example. You are still talking backwards You put the partition (/dev/sdXY) on /var not the other way round. You DON'T put /var on /dev/sdXY Not exactly. Yes, it's the other way around when you're talking about _mounting_ the partition at the mount point. However, you can certainly talk about putting /var on a partition, to refers to putting the subtree of file and directories rooted at /var on that partition (or to causing that to happen, by assigning the (initial empty) directory /var to a partition by saying to mount that partition at /var (and then have the installer populate it)). Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c2b8ed7.9040...@fgm.com
Re: (OT) suggestion on terse wording of IT Helpdesk
Chris Davies wrote: Jochen Schulz wrote: ... In my experience, many web forms just don't accept plus characters in email addresses at all. Daniel Barclay dan...@fgm.com wrote: Then those forms are broken (not accepting e-mail addresses properly), right? Yes. But that doesn't help those of us needing to enter information into those forms. IMO it's a valid question. What? I wasn't questioning whether anything was a valid question. I was just trying to confirm my understanding that plus characters in e-mail address are officially allowed by the e-mail specs. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c1286db.5090...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Stephan Seitz wrote: On Tue, Jun 01, 2010 at 10:58:09AM -0400, Daniel Barclay wrote: ... That's why the ISO date formats are numeric: As long as one uses [whatever the right name for our Arabic-digit-based decimal system is], one can read the ISO date format. Only if you know, it is ISO date format. Using the name for the month does not make things more complicated with the exception of parsing the output with another program. Yes, it does make things more complicated: That other program has to have 12 month strings--and then one set of 12 for each language that might need to be recognized. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c07cc47.3040...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Ron Johnson wrote: On 06/01/2010 10:06 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: Andrei Popescu wrote: ... You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date format is used. Let me see... -rwx-- 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg -rwx-- 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How (I'd really like to know)? The third of May, because it's recognizable as the ISO date/time format (because of the hyphens, and, in that case, because of the time format (no am or pm) and position (after the date part)). Yes, that depends on there not being any similar format that uses hyphens but a different number order, but there isn't, is there? And even if one doesn't already know the ISO format, one could easily recognize from the year, hour, and minute that the components are in descending size order (year before month, month before day of month, etc.) 03-05-2010 There's no way on Earth to *know* whether this date is May 3rd or March 5th. So? (What's your point? We were talking about the ISO date format, the ISO date format when time fields are present, and, earlier, common local data formats. Your example clearly isn't one of the first two. Are you claiming that some local data format uses that component order _and_ uses hyphens?) Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c07ca2f.8010...@fgm.com
Re: Disk problems or worse?
Ralph, Jochen Schulz wrote: Ralph Katz: Lenny install on newly acquired used Dell hangs and throws errors to syslog. Do I have two bad disks or a more serious hardware problem? Another option: it might be a kernel problem. I don't remember the specifics anymore, but on one of my systems I had similar errors. After replacing the disk and still getting these errors, I found hints that the kernel might be at fault. I then installed a newer kernel from backports.org and the problems went away. What processor and chipset does your motherboard use? Do you get Does changing your IDE/ATA controllers from DMA mode to PIO mode stop the message? (I had similar problems (got similar log message) with a dual-processor AMD Athlon MP board. Apparently, the AMD chipset apparently had some bug, the Linux didn't work around that particular bug, and the kernel's IDE DMA code (or maybe filesystem code) wasn't very robust--it didn't retry an operation that failed because of a detected DMA timeout, and it didn't even detect that the operation failed and stop (panic or something) before things (disk and filesystem state) became inconsistent.) Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c07d027.9020...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Stephan Seitz wrote: ... That's why the ISO date formats are numeric: As long as one uses [whatever the right name for our Arabic-digit-based decimal system is], one can read the ISO date format. Only if you know, it is ISO date format. Oh, also: Yes, but the ISO date format is fairly easy to recognize because (as far as I know) no traditional numeric-only date format uses hyphens. (I've seen only slashes, dots, etc.) And any hypenated date format with the year after something else is clearly not the ISO date format. That leaves only the orders -MM-DD and -DD-MM. As long as no one starts using the really illogical format -DD-MM, there won't really be any ambiguity.) Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c07d281.8030...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Ron Johnson wrote: On 06/03/2010 10:28 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: Ron Johnson wrote: On 06/01/2010 10:06 AM, Daniel Barclay wrote: Andrei Popescu wrote: ... You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date format is used. Let me see... -rwx-- 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg -rwx-- 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How (I'd really like to know)? The third of May, because it's recognizable as the ISO date/time format 03-05-2010 There's no way on Earth to *know* whether this date is May 3rd or March 5th. So? (What's your point? We were talking about the ISO date format, the ISO date format when time fields are present, and, earlier, common local data formats. Your example clearly isn't one of the first two. Are you claiming that some local data format uses that component order _and_ uses hyphens?) I interpreted Andrei's email as referring to the ambiguities in the file *names* (like 03052010065.jpg), not the fs timestamps. Okay, gotcha now. Yes, I was addressing the ls timestamp output. Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c07d31d.9070...@fgm.com
Re: lilo removal in squeeze (or, please test grub2)
Stan Hoeppner wrote: The problem, in and of itself, is booting. Period. There is [no] way to test it but to replace LILO with Grub2 and see if the system boots afterward. I cannot do this on production servers, obviously. Cloning drives to play with on a lab machine would be a good idea, but I can't take production servers offline to clone the disks. How about temporarily booting from an alternate partition, disk, etc? For example: 1. Install a second instance of your current LILO installation on some other boot device. - Then boot from that device to make sure that booting from that device can boot your system normally. If not, boot from your normal boot partition, try to fix that second LILO installation, and try again. Once it works, proceed to step 2. 2. Install Grub2 on the main boot device. - Try booting. - If doesn't work, reboot from the device with the backup LILO installation in step one and try to fix the Grub2 installation, and try again. Once it works, you're done. Actually, you'd probably want to install the new loader (Grub2) on an alternative device first, so your system by default would still boot using the old boot loader setup. Then, when you think you have your Grub2 configuration worked out, create and test the LILO backup boot device as above, and install Grub2 on your main boot device. If it works, you're done; if it doesn't, you can reboot from the LILO backup boot device to work on your main-device Grub2 installation. That takes several reboots rather than just one, but then it means you're never more than one reboot away from a working system, rather than possibly dead in the water until you can figure out and fix whatever the problem is (either by fixing the Grub2 problem or by booting enough (viaa rescue disc) to re-install your LILO configuration. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c051c29.60...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Andrei Popescu wrote: For me dd mmm is very clear ... Even when the month abbreviation is in a language you don't know? That's why the ISO date formats are numeric: As long as one uses [whatever the right name for our Arabic-digit-based decimal system is], one can read the ISO date format. Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c052001.9040...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Andrei Popescu wrote: ... You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date format is used. Let me see... -rwx-- 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg -rwx-- 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How (I'd really like to know)? The third of May, because it's recognizable as the ISO date/time format (because of the hyphens, and, in that case, because of the time format (no am or pm) and position (after the date part)). Yes, that depends on there not being any similar format that uses hyphens but a different number order, but there isn't, is there? And even if one doesn't already know the ISO format, one could easily recognize from the year, hour, and minute that the components are in descending size order (year before month, month before day of month, etc.) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c0521ed.9040...@fgm.com
Re: ls has stopped using the ISO date format
Ron Johnson wrote: On 05/30/2010 05:51 PM, Andrei Popescu wrote: [snip] You example shows only dates where it is quite obvious what date format is used. Let me see... -rwx-- 1 amp amp 891837 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010065.jpg -rwx-- 1 amp amp 733361 2010-05-03 22:55 03052010066.jpg Can you tell if these files were created 5th march or 3rd may? How (I'd really like to know)? That's the point... Which is why -MM-DD HH:mm is the only rational format. Well, except for the ISO variation -MM-DDTHH:mm, good for when you want to avoid spaces (e.g., in filenames). :-) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4c052336.7020...@fgm.com
Re: file transfer from removable flash memory: time stamps and case
H.S. wrote: ... When I copy files from a flash memory (inserted in a USB card reader) to my Testing desktop, I notice that the filenames are upper case and the time stamp of the transferred files is the time they were transferred and not when they were originally created. How do I avoid these and get lower case filenames and original timestamps? The flash memories are all vfat. 1. Add the option shortname=winnt (or maybe some other shortname= values (see the manual page for the mount command)) to your mount options (in /etc/fstab, your command line, or whatever on your system mounts the filesystem on the flash memory). 2. If you're using the cp command to copy, consider the -p or -a options. Since you're probably dragging and dropping in a file manager, you'll have to find that file manager's equivalent of cp's -p and/or -a. Daniel -- (Plain text sometimes corrupted to HTML courtesy of Microsoft Exchange.) [F] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4bfffae4.6030...@fgm.com
Re: (OT) suggestion on terse wording of IT Helpdesk
Jochen Schulz wrote: ... In my experience, many web forms just don't accept plus characters in email addresses at all. Then those forms are broken (not accepting e-mail addresses properly), right? -- (Plain text sometimes corrupted to HTML courtesy of Microsoft Exchange.) [F] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4bfc1d56.5090...@fgm.com
Re: Unix-ify File Names
Frank Terbeck wrote: Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Frank Terbeck wrote: Daniel B. [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Frank Terbeck wrote: Mike McClain [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Frank Terbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... ... people think spaces are bad in filenames. (They are not bad, ... In what sense are they not bad? ... However, they and other special characters do make it more difficult to handle arbitrary file names. No. They are never bad. It just takes a bit of practice to get used to do things in a robust way. But some common Unix tools aren't robust enough, in the sense of providing consistent escape/encoding mechanisms to handle special characters. For example, Emacs' tags files use commas as delimiters, and (last I knew) don't have an escape/encoding mechansim for representing a comma _in_ a file name, so (again, last I knew) a Linux kernel file with a comma in its name doesn't get processed right. So? Just because there are programs that limit the namespace of the files they are working with (which is _absolutely_ okay), does not mean, that shell scripts must obey to these programs' behaviours. How did you infer that I was arguing that the shells should follow those programs' behaviors? I wasn't arguing for that. I was pointing out that using shell-special characters in filenames was (somewhat) bad--it triggers problems with non-robust programs. Some commands do provide fully general mechanisms. (For example, find's -print0 and xargs' -0 option can handle any possible file pathname, including one with newline characters.) However, many commands do not. That typically makes it very difficult to handle special characters. ... Btw: xargs is not needed if your find binary is reasonably POSIX compliant. Just use '+' instead of ';' with the -exec option. (Yes, I know that GNU find didn't support this for quite some time.) Which version of find supports that? My (Sarge) system's man page for find doesn't seem to mention it yet. Does the + make find invoke the command with multiple filenames at once? However, what about the general case? It sounds like for i in `...` doesn't have an escaping/encoding mechanism that is sufficient to handle both (unescaped) asterisks that represent wildcards and escaped/encoded asterisks that represent literal asterists. I don't think you really understand, what is happening here. [snip] % foo='bar\ baz' ; % for i in `echo $foo` ; do echo ($i) ; done (bar\) (baz) [snap] You _cannot_ escape things there. So how am I misunderstanding it? (I said it sounds like the shell for loop doesn't support escaping. You said one cannot escape things there. Those statements are consistent with each other. So how am I not understanding it? You see, this is not the type of thing, you want to teach beginners. Hence, 'for i in `...`' loops should be avoided by beginners (did you realize, that you dropped 'ls *glob*' from the backtick expression? Yes. Did you realize that I was trying to talk about cases that are more general that just globbing done by the shell? (By the way, why do keep sticking extraneous commas in the middle your sentences?) What about when one is building up a command string in a variable, say CMD, and then executing the assembled command via $CMD? The string contained in the variable is parsed as a normal command, right? So any logical string values that contain shell-special characters needs to be encoded with the usual shell escape-sequence syntax, right? (E.g., if I want to delete a file named xx*yy, I would have to type something like: rm xx\*yy on a manual command line, so if I wanted the command line $CMD to execute that same rm command, CMD would have to contain the string rm xx\*yy (e.g., set by the command line: CMD=rm xx\\*yy ) [...] Is there any such command (or, say, built-in function)? It sounds like you are looking for 'eval'. Yes, that does seem like the easier (and safer) (right) way. But this has got noting to do with the original subject. And this misunderstanding leads me to the conclusion, that you should read up on how various expansions in POSIX shells work (and probably on a few common pitfalls, like maximum size of arguments for external processes, too.); Yeah, I know about that one (well, that there is a limit, if not details). No offence. Next time, you might want to avoid telling something they don't understand for the things you then immediately proceed to show they have already understood. Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Unix-ify File Names
Frank Terbeck wrote: Daniel B. [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Frank Terbeck wrote: Mike McClain [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Frank Terbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: for FILE in `ls *$1` ; do ... b) it breaks on filenames with spaces (and other special characters). ... Using 'for i in `ls *`'-type loops breaks this and is one of the main reasons why people think spaces are bad in filenames. (They are not bad, ... In what sense are they not bad? Yes, they're certainly legal per the filesystem and most tools that take filenames. However, they and other special characters do make it more difficult to handle arbitrary file names. No. They are never bad. It just takes a bit of practice to get used to do things in a robust way. But some common Unix tools aren't robust enough, in the sense of providing consistent escape/encoding mechanisms to handle special characters. For example, Emacs' tags files use commas as delimiters, and (last I knew) don't have an escape/encoding mechansim for representing a comma _in_ a file name, so (again, last I knew) a Linux kernel file with a comma in its name doesn't get processed right. Some commands do provide fully general mechanisms. (For example, find's -print0 and xargs' -0 option can handle any possible file pathname, including one with newline characters.) However, many commands do not. That typically makes it very difficult to handle special characters. For example, if someone wants to use ls's feature of sorting by date (e.g., ls -t *$1), they cant combine it with the for-loop construct above (reliably). Okay, I admit that sorting is one of the rare cases where [snip] find . -printf '%Ts:%p\n' | sort -rn | cut -d: -f2 | while IFS= read -r ; do ... done [snap] or ... loops are justified. I think you missed my point--the question of how to (or whether one can) use for i in `...` to loop over a list of file names that are output by some arbitrary program. The particular example of starting with sorting by date with ls -d has the solution of changing to an entirely different solution (using find and sorting as above). However, what about the general case? It sounds like for i in `...` doesn't have an escaping/encoding mechanism that is sufficient to handle both (unescaped) asterisks that represent wildcards and escaped/encoded asterisks that represent literal asterists. Hey, is there any command for taking a filename and escaping/encoding shell-special characters to make a string that, when parsed by the shell, specifies that filename? I'm thinking of something that would work like this: for i in `encode_for_shell *` ; ... [...] No, that is not how shells work. Maybe I gave the wrong kind of example (a for loop, which apparently doesn't parse and interpreting things enough) for asking about an encode command. What about when one is building up a command string in a variable, say CMD, and then executing the assembled command via $CMD? The string contained in the variable is parsed as a normal command, right? So any logical string values that contain shell-special characters needs to be encoded with the usual shell escape-sequence syntax, right? (E.g., if I want to delete a file named xx*yy, I would have to type something like: rm xx\*yy on a manual command line, so if I wanted the command line $CMD to execute that same rm command, CMD would have to contain the string rm xx\*yy (e.g., set by the command line: CMD=rm xx\\*yy ) So if I were listing file names (e.g., with file -print0 and maybe some further filtering with, say grep) and I wanted to assemble a command that operated on the named files without interpreting any shell-special characters in the file names when the assembled command line was parsed by the shell and executed, I would need to map the actual file names to the shell represention of those file names. For example, if the list included the name xx*xx, an encoder could map that string to the string xx\*xx (probably written xx\\*xx as a literal in sh/bash/etc.), which could be appended to the command string being assembled (and surrounded by whatever separators were needed to separate it from earlier and later tokens in the command line). My encode_for_shell command would be applicable to that case. Is there any such command (or, say, built-in function)? ... But if you are writing real scripts, that are supposed to work (with data, you potentially don't know in the first place), you will need to do things in a proper and robust way. Definitely. Sorry for the lengthy mail. I hope I could make myself a little clearer and didn't spread buggy code. :-) No problem. I agree with counteracting error-prone suggestions. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Very disturbing feature in icedove
Steve Lamb wrote: Daniel B. wrote: ... (When you logically tentatively delete a message from the Inbox folder and Seamonkey logically moves it to the Trash folder, there's still a physical copy of the data in the file that implements the Inbox folder. That physical copy is never available to the user through the tool.) Not so. If that's not so, then tell me how Seamonkey makes those messages available to the user. Was there not mention of extensions that do in fact display they logically marked messages? An extension is a different tool. (Or Seamonkey with an extension is a different tool.) If not, are you positive such a tool could not be written? Why do you ask if I've positive? I never said such a tool could not be written? Furthermore when was through the *current* tool the litmus test on what the current tool should or should not do? What the heck are you talking about? I wasn't talking about whether the tool should continue doing only what it does now (not providing access to deleting messages in a folder or should do more (e.g., providing access). I was talking about what view of the data the tool provides to the user. Currently, the tool does not provide any view of that type of deleted message except that you have to compact folders once in a while to reclaim the space. Just because my MTA logs are not accessible through the MTA means they should not be created in the first place? Rotated... ever? Heaven forbid I use less to search my MTA logs and cron to rotate them. How is that related to the discussion about Seamonkey and its mail files? An MTA's documented interface to the administrator includes its log files. Does Seamonkey document its mail file format and expected (end) users to do anything with them using any tool except Seamonkey itself (not counting external-only operations like backing up or moving whole files)? Surely you're not ignorant of that reality. Of course I'm not, but what does that have to do with Seamonkey? I ask the same of you. Do you honestly believe user preference extends only to a single, default installed application? Huh? (User preference about what? Or, which user preferences? (What are you asking? Your question is a bit ambiguous.)) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: iceweasel not being recognized by ISP website
Greg Folkert wrote: On Tue, 2007-02-06 at 17:26 -0500, Daniel B. wrote: Chris Bannister wrote: On Sun, Feb 04, 2007 at 11:42:22AM -0800, Andrew Sackville-West wrote: Raju's point about employment with capitalone is entirely different. CapitalOne is not (at least ostensibly) a web content company. As such they can (IMO) be somehwat forgriven for having non-compliant stuff on the web. That said, their web folks should be slapped around a bit. make sense? http://linuxmafia.com/ What about it? (Is there any particular part of the http://linuxmafia.com/ site you meant to be pointing to?) If you don't know who the red headed step child of applying clue-by-four technology adjustments... then you havent even begun to read the site. Well, duh. Of course I haven't read the site. Why do think I asked if you were alluding to any particular part (or aspect) of it? (I'm not about to waste my time browsing the whole site for no good reason, but if you were referring to something relevant I might have taken a look at that.) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Attracting newbies
Douglas Allan Tutty wrote: RE: how to write the documentation, where to put it. It seems that wget won't crawl through a wiki, it will just grab the one page. Its no different than saving the page with the browser. Wget crawls my wiki site just fine. Are you using the right wget options? Does the wiki do something unusual with links (or disable crawling with /robots.txt)? Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: iceweasel not being recognized by ISP website
H.S. wrote: The website ... suggests I either download Firefox or IE 6 or 7, all for Windows. They do not support any non-Windows browser at all! Firefox runs on Linux. Or do you mean that website says or implies that it only works with the Windows version of Firefox (and not others, e.g., the Linux version)? Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Removing desktop environments
Greg Folkert wrote: ... The issue here is that you only need to backup your data. Backups of /usr and /var and so on mean nothing. I think you're giving bad advice. Think about /var a little more, for example: /var/spool/mail/ /var/spool/cron/crontabs/ /var/lib/dpkg/info/ /var/log/ A /usr on a CD does you a crap-load of no-good if you system is toast. Doesn't it let you copy it back to the system (e.g., when booted from a rescue disk)? Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: bad anti-aliasing; what thinks my CRT is an LCD display
Florian Kulzer wrote: ... ...if an LCD screen is detected. You can avoid this by choosing Never if you suspect that there is a problem with the LCD detection. Where is the LCD detection performed? I have now worked around the problem (currently by turning off anti- aliasing entirely, soon by trying just turning off RGB antialiaing), but I am trying to find the actual source of the problem so I can fix it right (maybe overriding the autodetection, maybe by identifying and reporting an autodetection bug). Furthermore, the hinting style (native or autohinter) also has a significant influence on how fonts look on the screen. I would recommend to try different settings .. Thanks. I'll look into that too. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Configuring inittab
Michelle Konzack wrote: Hello Tarvin, Am 2006-02-19 18:02:20, schrieb Digby Tarvin: Debian by default does not make good use (IMHO) of the runlevel mechanism. Oh yes, it does. No, it does not. The runlevel mechanism allocates 4 multi-user levels. Debian uses only one. (Making all four the same, it effectively has only one.) That certainly is not making good use of the multi-user part of the mechanism. Debian give[s] you the freedom to configure your rcX.d HOW YOU WANT! How that does that differ from any other system in which you can customize rcX.d? The traditional usage I was familiar with was 2 - multi-user, no network No Network is stupid by default. So have the default level be a level (say, level 3) with networking. Having a level with networking disabled isn't so stupid: Maybe you want to shut down network services (e.g., because of an attack) without knocking all users off the system (by going to single-user mode). By the way: geez, what is your problem? Anyway, the infrastructure is there, and you can fix it if you want. I am sure there was a good reason for the change, but I sure as hell can't think what it would have been... Debian does not force users. - ... But Debian does _support_ users--it tries to provide useful things so users don't have to do everything themselvs. With Debian you have the choice or use another Distribution if you do not agree... Great attitude there--like it exactly the way it is (don't report problems or suggest improvements) or get lost. This is 100% freedom. No, telling people to go elsewhere is not 100% freedom. You've denied Digby freedom to try to improve Debian (by implying he should go elsewhere). (maybe to simplify package management for packages that involve additions to system startup - so they wouldn't need to ask about with runlevel things get added to??) Provide a patch! - The BTS is open for it. Telling people to fix problems themselves isn't all that helpful either. (It's one thing to say that regular developers don't have time or priority to implement a given suggestion and suggest that requestors do the work themselves. However, if you reject ideas (especially in such a derogatory manner) and then suggest that they submit a patch, how on earth would they have any hope that the patch wouldn't also be summarily rejected?) Daniel -- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Missing public keys in aptitude - SOLVED (Sarge debmirror case)
Florian Kulzer wrote: Yann Lejeune wrote: ... ... gpg --armor --export keyid | apt-key add - ... wget http://ftp-master.debian.org/ziyi_key_2005.asc -O - | apt-key add - wget http://ftp-master.debian.org/ziyi_key_2006.asc -O - | apt-key add - ... I think that these things don't work for the people using Sarge and debmirror; ... Right -- apt-key does not (seem to) exist in Sarge. (The fact that this question was inserted into a thread about aptitude in Sid makes it more difficult to give an appropriate answer, of course.) (Yeah, it does seem to have jumped from my debmirror-in-sarge thread to this one.) So let me try again: It seems to me (man debmirror, search for key) that debmirror expects to find the archive signing key in the public keyring of the user which runs it, i.e. ~/.gnupg/pubring.gpg Therefore I think it will be enough to import the signing key with gpg: gpg --keyserver keyring.debian.org --recv-keys 2D230C5F (with 2D230C5F being the key ID of the 2006 archive signing key), as long as you run this command as the same user who will later run debmirror. I hope this works. Yes, that seems to have worked (with the modification that for Sarge it's the key with ID 4F368D5D (Debian Archive Automatic Signing Key (2005) [EMAIL PROTECTED]). When will I need to get a new key (regarding Sarge)? For example, if/when 3.1r2 is created, will its Release.gpg file be signed using the 2005 key (the key that was current when Sarge was first released (3.1r0)), or will it be signed using the key that is current when 3.1r2 is released? Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: debmirror can't find public key to validate Release files
Hans Ekbrand wrote: ...Perhaps something like this would work for you too? # gpg --keyserver subkeys.pgp.net --recv-keys 2D230C5F # gpg --export -a 2D230C5F | apt-key add - No--the command apt-key doesn't exist in sarge. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Pros/Cons Kde vs Gnome?
Steve Lamb wrote: Paul Scott wrote: But that's a CLI job anyway. Tab-completion and history and the rest of the shell goodies makes the CL easier for most of that stuff :) Most, not all. Shell's not to fond of partial selecions across a large list which is handled quite nicely in a properly implemented GUI with CNTL and SHIFT (note, Pan being a prime example of not doing it correctly). Actually the shell is, for cases like rm *.o. (That's why I wish graphical shells retained the advantages of command lines when they added the graphical advantages. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT Why GB English is different] Re: Mozilla firefox en-gb
William Ballard wrote: On Thu, May 06, 2004 at 10:22:31AM -0400, Daniel B. wrote: I wonder if Damon or his teacher confused the dropping of ands other than the last with dropping all ands. My teacher used to tell us: where do you see an and written there? Huh? Written where? And is your teacher's comment anything other than idiotic? In 123 there is no one or twenty three written there, but that doesn't mean those words aren't used in pronouncing the number written as 123. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT Why GB English is different] Re: Mozilla firefox en-gb
Damon L. Chesser wrote: Daniel B. wrote: Travis Crump wrote: ... Going through it in my mind, I pretty much treat it as any other list, dropping every 'and' but the last one. Put another way, say you have 'One thousand women, 3 hundred men, and 46 children'. How many people do you have? 'One thousand people, 3 hundred people, and 46 people'. Factor out people so that you only say it once and you have 'One thousand, 3 hundred, and 46 people'. Hmm. I never thought of it as a list, but you might have something there. To me (USA), 223,456 to me would be two hundred twenty three thousand four hundred and fifty six; 123,000 would be one hundred and twenty three thousand (or a hundred and twenty three thousand); for a check for $123.45, I'd write it out as one hundred twenty three and 45/100 dollars. Well, this kind of proves the point, does it not? Which point? It certainly does NOT prove a claim that one hundred and twenty three means 100.23 and doesn't mean 123. It does support the claim that it's like a list. You write out one hundred twenty three *and* 45/100 dollars. That is because you do not want *any* confusion on the amount that will be drafted from your account. I think you are completely confused. 1. One reason I write that and is because one hundred twenty three 45/100 dollars would make no sense. 2. One reason I didn't write the and in one hundred and twenty three is because there was an and following it, and we write A, B, and C and not (usually) A and B and C. (The reason is not because one hundred and twenty three would mean anything other than 123.) 3. The fact that one hundred and 45/100 or one hundred and forty five hundredths means 100.45 can NOT be used to argue that one hundred and forty-five doesn't mean 145 and means 100.45 instead. There is a big difference between forty five and forty five hundredths. (Actually, I think there official supposed to be hyphens in places like twenty-three thousand.) FWIW I think you are right about hyphens. I just wish I remembered better where they go and where they don't. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Writing numbers longhand
Paul Johnson wrote: Damon L. Chesser [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ... I learned how to write numbers long-hand in 1989. The only time and comes into play is to separate the integer from the fraction. 1,234,567.89 is one million, two-hundred-thirty-four thousand, five-hundred-sixty-seven and eighty-nine one-hundredths. What about when there is no fraction? Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Writing numbers longhand
richard lyons wrote: On Thursday 06 May 2004 14:43, Paul Johnson wrote: ...1,234,567.89 is one million, two-hundred-thirty-four thousand, five-hundred-sixty-seven and eighty-nine one-hundredths. Oh come on - I never heard anyone pedantic enough to spell out the decimals like that. That's not pedantic. That's the original form before we started abbreviating as you refer to next. Everyone says one million, two hundred (and) thirtyfour thousand, five hundred (and) sixtyseven point eight nine... Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT Why GB English is different] Re: Mozilla firefox en-gb
richard lyons wrote: ... But it is entirely rational, since we write the smallest order digit at the right of numbers, to put this in the order 2004/05/06 if we are being orderly and businesslike. ...and given that write times with smaller units to the right. (Of course, we write addresses with bigger units (e.g., country) later...) Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT Why GB English is different] Re: Mozilla firefox en-gb
Paul Johnson wrote: ... Checks will bounce unless dated like 5/6/2004, 6 MAY 2004 or May 6, 2004. Bull. I've been writing my checks like that for years. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT Why GB English is different] Re: Mozilla firefox en-gb
Paul Johnson wrote: Roel Schroeven [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ... One way to avoid the confusion is by using the ISO format: /mm/dd. Also makes it very easy to sort by date. Still has potential for ambiguity. Not really. The only system in use that puts the year first puts the month next and the second last. Yes, you could make up a system that puts the month last, but no one uses such a system, so when you see /xx/xx, you can know how to interpet it. Which is why when you know other people you're communicating with use other date formats, it's probably best to use something neutral like 6 MAY 2004... What about when they use other _languages_? Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT Why GB English is different] Re: Mozilla firefox en-gb
William Ballard wrote: ... As I said in another post, year-first is ...bad for person to person communication. That's not true in geneology, even for person-to-person communication. You're confused about what makes it good or bad. It's not computers vs. people, it's something else. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Does using debconf with X server preclude swapping Control/Caps Lock?
JG wrote: Hi, Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Woody (3.0r1), when installing xserver-xfree8, does using debconf to configure the server preclude using the standard XFree86 keyboard options to swap the Control and Caps Lock keys? Debconf encloses the entire XF86Config-4 file inside its: ### BEGIN DEBCONF SECTION and ... and just, 4 lines below that: # If you want your changes to this file preserved by dexconf, only make changes# before the ### BEGIN DEBCONF SECTION line above, and/or after the # ### END DEBCONF SECTION line below. ... I've been looking at XML too long--I was thinking that the X configuration file had a top-level construct enclosing the others. Never mind. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Does using debconf with X server preclude swapping Control/Caps Lock?
Brian Nelson wrote: Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Woody (3.0r1), when installing xserver-xfree8, does using debconf to configure the server preclude using the standard XFree86 keyboard options to swap the Control and Caps Lock keys? Hmm, I thought there was a debconf question for this. Maybe it appeared post-Woody. Does dpkg-reconfigure -plow xserver-xfree86 ask it? Do you mean the question about whether you want to use debconf to manage parts of XF86Config? Yes, that's the first question it asks. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Why startx files on /dev/agpgart when xf86cfg runs? (XFree86 4.3 for Woody)
If xf86cfg can successfully run the X server, why would running X with startx die with an error saying: (EE) GARTInit: Unabled to open /dev/agpgart (No such device) (WW) I810(0): /dev/agpgart is either not available, or no memory is available for allocation. Using pre-allocated memory only. ? This with the XFree86 4.3 backport to Woody, kernel 2.4.18, and an Intel 845G/GL graphics controller. Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
can't load agpgart module for XFree86 i810 for i845G/GL controller (Woody, 2.4.18)
Has anyone gotten an Intel 82845G/GL graphics controller working with the XFree86 4.3 backport to woody? Currently, I'm having trouble loading the agpgart module that X apparently needs. The X server dies saying: (EE) GARTInit: Unabled to open /dev/agpgart (No such device) (although xf86cfg started X server okay). Assuming that that message means that I need to load the agpgart module, I tried insmod agpgart, but got the error: /lib/modules/2.4.18-686/kernel/drivers/char/agp/agpgart.o: init_module: No such device Does that mean that 2.4.18's agpgart module is too old to recognize the 845G? Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Why startx files on /dev/agpgart when xf86cfg runs? (XFree86 4.3 for Woody)
Daniel Barclay wrote: If xf86cfg can successfully run the X server, why would running X with startx die with an error saying: (EE) GARTInit: Unabled to open /dev/agpgart (No such device) (WW) I810(0): /dev/agpgart is either not available, or no memory is available for allocation. Using pre-allocated memory only. ? This with the XFree86 4.3 backport to Woody, kernel 2.4.18, and an Intel 845G/GL graphics controller. Never mind. The X server wasn't dying; it was just exiting because I hadn't installed something xinit needed. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Does using debconf with X server preclude swapping Control/Caps Lock?
Brian Nelson wrote: ... No, this question: Template: xserver-xfree86/config/inputdevice/keyboard/options Type: string Description: Please select your keyboard options. For the X server to handle your keyboard as you desire, keyboard options may be entered. Available options depend on which XKB rule set was previously selected. Not all options will work with every keyboard model and layout. . For example, if you wish the Caps Lock key to behave as an additional Control key, you may enter ctrl:nocaps; if you would like to switch the Caps Lock and left Control keys, you may enter ctrl:swapcaps. No, I've never seen anything about Control and Caps Lock from debconf. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Does using debconf with X server preclude swapping Control/Caps Lock?
On Woody (3.0r1), when installing xserver-xfree8, does using debconf to configure the server preclude using the standard XFree86 keyboard options to swap the Control and Caps Lock keys? Debconf encloses the entire XF86Config-4 file inside its: ### BEGIN DEBCONF SECTION and ### END DEBCONF SECTION lines. Does that mean that one can't set keyboard options without risking having debconf delete one's customizations? Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: disable boot logo from LILO (kernel boot command line)?
Roberto Sanchez wrote: Daniel B. wrote: ... (You can no longer use vga= in lilo.conf to use a high-resolution text mode to see kernel boot messages. If you run less on the console, the top lines of the file aren't visible, apparently because less thinks the screen is 24 lines high, but the first 4 lines don't work because of the boot logo.) That is very weird. I have the logo on my machine (I even installed the new booticons pacakge) and it disappears partway through the boot process. I do see something happening partway through the boot process: The colors change to really weird, unintentional colors. Something is changing the color map, as if that something is partially reinitializing the video mode. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: disable boot logo from LILO (kernel boot command line)?
Andrés Roldán wrote: Just for the sake of being clear, LILO does not change anything in the kernel, it just passes parameters to the kernel and then, when the kernel has been completely loaded, LILO has nothing to do hereafter. Right, except that before booting the kernel, LILO can set the video mode (e.g., 60 x 132 characters instead of just 24 x 80) before booting the kernel. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: package for bug regarding system installation and boot logo
Brian Nelson wrote: The little penguin at the top of the screen while the kernel is loading? Bugs for that should be filed against kernel, I believe. Thanks. Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
what exactly does init_module: No such device mean?
When trying to load a driver reports init_module: No such device, what exactly does that mean? Does it mean that the module couldn't find any instances of the type of hardware device that the module handles, using whatever degree of scanning or probing that that particular module performs? (Does device means devices at the hardware level with PCI bus locations and Vendor and Device IDS, or does it means devices at the level of ide0, lo0, etc., listed /proc/devices?) If a driver reports init_module: No such device, does that necessarily mean that the driver doesn't recognize your hardware, or do you sometimes have to tell the driver an I/O address or IRQ number so it can find your hardware? Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
package for bug regarding system installation and boot logo
What's the right package or pseudo-package to use to report a bug about the boot logo in a new installation? Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
disable boot logo from LILO (kernel boot command line)?
Is it possible to disable the boot logo from LILO (e.g., via a kernel boot parameter)? With vga=ask in lilo.conf, when I boot and select a video mode, it seems LILO changes the video mode but the kernel immediately changes the mode back (to whatever supports the logo). I want to boot using a higher resolution mode (to get more lines and wider lines on the console) and without the logo taking up space and messing up full-text-screen programs like less. Thanks, Daniel -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: fsck finding thousands of errors
Levi Waldron wrote: ... Do you think there could be a problem with the bios or memory now that is now scrambling a previously good hdd through the fsck process? Do you have IDE disks? Are you using DMA? If so, what kind of motherboard and/or IDE controller cards are you using? Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
packages with configuration prompt twice
When I install packages that require configuration, each one goes through configuration (its sequence of questions on the console, or its Dialog-based menus) twice. Is this normal, or do I have debconf set up wrong? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to fix Couldn't find valid RAM disk image starting at 0?
Rob Weir wrote: On Mon, Feb 10, 2003 at 11:55:54PM -0500, Daniel Barclay wrote: ... When I try to boot a new kernel, it says: ... Hmmm...have you rerun lilo? Yes. I couldn't be booting the new kernel if I hadn't. Anyway, I did find the Debian Reference Chapter 7 ( http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/reference/ch-kernel.en.html ) which helpfully says: Manoj Srivastava wrote: --initrd requires a Debian-only cramfs patch but which unhelpfully doesn't say how to get the damn patch! Next, it says: Herbert Xu wrote: No it does not, all you have to do to use a filesystem other than CRAMFS is to set MKIMAGE in /etc/mkinitrd/mkinitrd.conf. Of course, it doesn't say anything about what you can set MKIMAGE to do that. My etc/mkinitrd/mkinitrd.conf says: MKIMAGE='mkcramfs %s %s /dev/null' but no other mk*fs executable on my system takes the same arguments that mkcramfs does. It seems that make-kpkg can only build Debian-customized kernel source unless you really know what you're doing. Any pointers to how to build a generic kernel (with make-kpkg)? Thanks. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: How to fix Couldn't find valid RAM disk image starting at 0?
I wrote: ... Next, it says: Herbert Xu wrote: No it does not, all you have to do to use a filesystem other than CRAMFS is to set MKIMAGE in /etc/mkinitrd/mkinitrd.conf. Of course, it doesn't say anything about what you can set MKIMAGE to [to] do that. My etc/mkinitrd/mkinitrd.conf says: MKIMAGE='mkcramfs %s %s /dev/null' but no other mk*fs executable on my system takes the same arguments that mkcramfs does. Okay, I found and installed genromfs. That got a ramdisk built. Unfortunately, it was too big. Fortunately, lilo's ramdisk=xxx option solved that problem. Unfortunately, after the booting kernel says that it found a romfs file system, it says: cramfs: bad magic So how do I get the kernel to access a romfs initrd image? Or is there a way to make a cramfs filesystem? (Recall that I'm trying to build from vanilla kernel sources (2.4.20), not from Debian-patches sources (latest 2.4.18 in woody).) Thanks. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Thorsten Haude wrote: ... I'm not intimate with the datails of Netscape's usage; you arbitrary send the mail to two addresses where one is enough to do the work. Please explain where the value is in sending the mail twice. I didn't claim there's any value in sending the message twice. I was just countering your (apparent) claim that I was manually adding CC: entries. I was not doing that. I was doing enough to do the work (using Reply All instead of Reply to get replies back to the list. I just wasn't manually _deleting_ the author's e-mail address. In any case now I am deleting the author's e-mail address from the To:/Cc: list (unless I forget). Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Paul Johnson wrote: On Sun, Feb 09, 2003 at 09:54:40PM -0500, Daniel Barclay wrote: How would that _not_ drop whatever features my current (non-mutt) MUA has? Mutt, and it's KDE frontend kmail, are *far* more featureful and far faster than Netscape is. Trust us on this and give it a try before you knock it. I don't think you heard the same thing I said. I'm NOT arguing that Netscape is better that your suggested MUAs. I'm simply saying that switching from one mailer to another, in addition to adding whatever features the new one has that the old one doesn't have, also drops whatever features the old one had that the new one doesn't also have. That was in answer your someone's (your?) question about why I was mentioning dropping features. That's almost a tautology, so I didn't expect much argument there. True, sometimes the dropped features set is a small set, but it's not usually an empty set. At a higher level, people can't just switch mailers to get new features; newer mailers don't always cover old-mailer features people use (even if the new mailer is better overall). And when they can switch, there may be more pressing needs (such as figuring out which kernel version minimizes the risk of IDE disk corruption). Netscape is not a full replacement for any other mailer. I never said it was. I said (in other words) that for most values of X and Y in the set of MUAs, X is not a _full_ replacement for Y. Anyway, I'll try to avoid contributing too much more to this runaway thread. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Paul Johnson wrote: ... There's positive features to NS4 mail? Were you trying to have a real discussion or not? If not, never mind. If so, see my other reply about what I meant about adding/dropping features. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
How to fix Couldn't find valid RAM disk image starting at 0?
I've been having trouble booting from kernels I've built with make-kpkg with the --initrd option. My /etc/lilo.conf does has initrd=... lines. When I try to boot a new kernel, it says: Couldn't find valid RAM disk image starting at 0 and says something about device 1601 / 16:01 (which disk and partition is that?). I built a kernel before with make-kpkg and --initrd and got it working just fine, but can't figure out what I'm doing differently (and wrong) this time. Any pointers? By the way, Lilo's lba32 option implies that keeping things below the 1024th cylinder of a disk is no longer relevant. Is that actually correct? Is it also correct for initrd images (/boot/initrd.img-...)? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Thorsten Haude wrote: ... However, I think the better approach is to lean back a moment and think about it: Why would anyone want to have the reply twice? Well, someone could want list messages that are replies to them to show up in the their regular mailbox so they notice them quickly, and also want all list messages to show up in a mailbox thatis specific to the mailing list. (By the way, where is that message header defined? I just searched through all the IETF RfCs but couldn't find it.) Whatever the RFCs say, ... Wait a minute. You can't just start demanding arbitrary behavior of other people. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Martin, martin f krafft wrote: also sprach Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2003.02.08.1934 +0100]: Please do not CC me when replying to lists that I read! ... (I think your wording probably doesn't say what you mean.) How would you say it? Don't modify lists with that I read. I think you meant something like: ...to lists, which I read. or ...to lists; I read them. Actually, that's what I was originally commenting on--wording that didn't say what you meant, and told the reader to determine which lists you read and which lists you didn't read. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Colin Watson wrote: On Sat, Feb 08, 2003 at 03:46:53PM -0500, Daniel Barclay wrote: Colin Watson wrote: ... follow his Mail-Followup-To: ... But how would you propose I do that? Do a View Source on every message? Use a mailer that supports it automatically, like mutt or (I believe) modern gnus? I should change mail software just for the Mail-Followup-To: header? I should drop all the positive features of my current mailer (Netscape Communicator 4) just to get automatic Mail-Followup-To: support? Get real. (Well, when Mozilla gets the ability to edit bookmarks as well as Netscape Communicator 4, then I will upgrade.) It's not an officially standardized header, ... Also, see http://www.debian.org/MailingLists/, Code of conduct: the default on Debian mailing lists is stated there as not to copy the original poster. So Debian ~standardized on a pattern that can't be handled by standard Reply vs. Reply-to-All functions? Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
2.4 patch for AMD 760MPX/786 / A7M266-D IDE DMA filesystem corruption?
I'm having trouble figuring out if there's a kernel 2.4.x patch to solve problems with IDE DMA-related filesystem corruption involving the AMD 760MPX chipset (AMD 768 southbridge, on an Asus A7M266-D motherboard). Doesn't anyone know if one exists, or what's the recommended workaround for getting the fastest IDE disk performance without risking filesystem corruption? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Thorsten Haude wrote: ... But I don't. If you want to call it 'demand', I demand that you *avoid* arbitrary behavior by adding addresses to your mails. What arbitrary behavior are you talking about? I'm not arbitrarily adding any addresses. If I use Netscape Communicator's Reply function (which I think implements the standard Reply-to-author function), it only goes to the author and doesn't get back to the mailing list. So instead I use its Reply All function (which I think implements the standard Reply-to-all function) to get the reply back to the list. I'll try to delete the non-list addresses, but how the hell is what I've been doing arbitrary behavior? Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] More detailed post ...
Nori Heikkinen wrote: on Sun, 09 Feb 2003 01:02:46PM -0500, Daniel Barclay insinuated: Thorsten Haude wrote: ... However, I think the better approach is to lean back a moment and think about it: Why would anyone want to have the reply twice? Well, someone could want list messages that are replies to them to show up in the their regular mailbox so they notice them quickly, and also want all list messages to show up in a mailbox thatis specific to the mailing list. then that person shouldn't set the Mailto-Followup header! So? I was replying to his implication that sitting back and thinking about it could yield only his implied conclusion. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
martin f krafft wrote: also sprach Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2003.02.09.1902 +0100]: Well, someone could want list messages that are replies to them to show up in the their regular mailbox so they notice them quickly, and also want all list messages to show up in a mailbox thatis specific to the mailing list. You can easily do that on the client side with procmail and the References: header. Is there any chance that elimination of duplicate messages can be done (relatively easily) with procmail? Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
martin f krafft wrote: also sprach Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2003.02.09.1922 +0100]: I should change mail software just for the Mail-Followup-To: header? I should drop all the positive features of my current mailer (Netscape Communicator 4) just to get automatic Mail-Followup-To: support? Nobody said to drop features. You are adding. We are not even going to start to compare Netscape to mutt! Geez. Pay attention. You suggested that I use mutt. How would that _not_ drop whatever features my current (non-mutt) MUA has? (In general, the suggestion use modern mailer isn't all that helpful when the members of that set aren't full replacements for currently used software.) Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
how to determine whether (first) printer is lp0 or lp1?
Is there a direct way determine whether the (first) printer is /dev/lp0 or /dev/lp1? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
martin f krafft wrote: ... Please do not CC me when replying to lists that I read! How are others supposed to know which lists you read (vs. which you have just posted to)? (I think your wording probably doesn't say what you mean.) Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] Capitalism (was Re: columbia -- what really happened)
Jack Nguy wrote: Why is this on this mailing list again? By the way, your message asks for a return receipt, which I would guess isn't everyone's preferred setting for a mailing list. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Disk Corruption: SOLVED
Jonathan Brandmeyer wrote: ... A detailed read of /usr/share/doc/lilo/Manual.txt reveales this telling entry: --quote-- Two disks, Linux on second disk, first disk has no extended partition - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - If there is neither a Linux partition nor an extended partition on the first disk, then there's only one place left, where a LILO boot sector could be stored: the master boot record. That documentation is wrong. You can also use a diskette. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how to determine whether (first) printer is lp0 or lp1?
Seneca wrote: On Sat, Feb 08, 2003 at 02:17:58PM -0500, Scott Henson wrote: On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 13:45, Seneca wrote: On Sat, Feb 08, 2003 at 12:43:05PM -0500, Daniel Barclay wrote: Is there a direct way determine whether the (first) printer is /dev/lp0 or /dev/lp1? ... Doesnt always work. ... That, too, doesn't always work. Is there any relevant node in the /proc filesystem ? Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: More detailed post ...
Colin Watson wrote: ... You could always follow his Mail-Followup-To: header, which is designed for exactly this purpose: Mail-Followup-To: Debian [EMAIL PROTECTED] But how would you propose I do that? Do a View Source on every message? (By the way, where is that message header defined? I just searched through all the IETF RfCs but couldn't find it.) Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Swap capslock-control in console?
Hans Wilmer wrote: ... Is there a tool that can load that same ~/.Xmodmap on the console or convert the file for use with loadkeys, so that I have the same keyboard layout on X11 and on the console? It's not so nice always having to edit two files to keep the keyboard layouts the same. I don't know for sure, but that rings a bell. I think there's something in the reverse direction: X can inherit some keyboard characteristics from the virtual console's keyboard settings. I don't recall if it's the whole keyboard layout or not. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] Re: shuttle disaster
Paul E Condon wrote: ... Witness 'alchemy'. Why do people today believe it is impossible? Because our folk culture has accepted, without really understanding, some limitations on the human spirit. So you don't believe the results of decades of atomic/nuclear research into the observed behavior that transmuting one element into another takes significantly more advanced equipment than the alchemists had? And that even our current advanced equipment can't transmute arbitrary pairs of elements? Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] Re: shuttle disaster
Mike M wrote: On Monday 03 February 2003 18:38, Daniel Barclay wrote: Kenward Vaughan wrote: ... In a completely rational society, the best of us would aspire to be _teachers_ and the rest of us would have to settle for something less, because passing civilization along from one generation to the next ought to be the highest honor and the highest responsibility anyone could have. - Lee Iacocca Wouldn't that be society resting on its laurels? And stagnating? (With no one creating additional civilization.) Socrates was stagnant and resting on his society's laurels? Good teaching inspires creativity. I didn't say Socrates was stagnant. I didn't say teachers were stagnant. No, I said (well...meant) that society would be stagnant if passing on knowledge were the _only_ highest aspiration. Someone's got to be creating/discovering/generating new knowldge or the pool of knowledge doesn't grow. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: shuttle disaster
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ... Personally, I feel that more money should be thrown at space research and technology, by either ... or the very rich (as in Redmond), As long as they don't get monopoly rights. Sorry dear Linux/FreeBSD/etc. user (or small country), we're blocking out your patch of sky because you haven't paid your Microsoft tax. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [SOLVED] backport of ICH4 IDE support
Gregory Seidman wrote: It turns out that 2.4.20 has support for the ICH4 IDE DMA modes. Little did I know. What's ICH4? Is there any that that support might be related to avoiding disk corruption when trying to use IDE DMA on an A7M266-D motherboard with AMD's 760MPX chipset? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: columbia -- what really happened (OT)
Ron Johnson wrote: ... Unfortunately, it's just proof that so many in the media are tres' clueless. Don't say that--too many of us(we?) Americans are monolingual. :-) Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: A7M266-D CM8738 problems: Pcm control of various mixers don't work
Johan Kullstam wrote: Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Is anyone familar with this problem?: Since I've upgraded from a system with a SoundBlaster 16 to a A7M266-D motherboard with an on-board C-Media CM8738 chip, the Pcm control of mixer programs (tkmixer, aumix, wmmixer, kmix) no longer work. Is there any special setup for the CM8738 that I should be aware of? I didn't do anything special. I am using the kernel stock driver. Did you install any of the Alsa packages? What do you have in more /etc/modules.conf file? Thanks. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Swap capslock-control in console?
Johan Kullstam wrote: I have swap-caps-ctrl in X, why shouldn't I want it in console too? Yeah, I wish Debian (and other Linuxes) had that as as standard an option as X11 has it. [Yes, a different wording would have been more easily parsable.] But alas, so many computer users are going through life not knowing the convenience of having the control key in its easily reachable original location. And not realizing that Emacs and Bash authors weren't mutant freaks (with pinkies that bend in impossible directions). What's the Debian package name to user for the installer (to submit an enhancement request that the initial keyboard configuration include an option to swap the Control and Caps Lock keys)? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] Re: shuttle disaster
Kenward Vaughan wrote: ... In a completely rational society, the best of us would aspire to be _teachers_ and the rest of us would have to settle for something less, because passing civilization along from one generation to the next ought to be the highest honor and the highest responsibility anyone could have. - Lee Iacocca Wouldn't that be society resting on its laurels? And stagnating? (With no one creating additional civilization.) Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: instructions for setting up sound?
Stephen Gran wrote: This one time, at band camp, Daniel Barclay said: Can anyone point me to instructions for setting up audio that addresses kernel messages such as: modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-0-0 This is because ... Thanks for the fish, but what I'm really looking for is the fishing textbook. (You know, the give a man (person) a fish.../teach him to fish... proverb.) I have yet to find any document/web page/manual page that explains what all the various sound-service-0-0/etc. module names are for. (I've found many web pages that say to use alias sound-service-x-y xyz for particular cases (e.g., using Alsa sound), but none that explains what's going on or how to determine what's needed in any particular case.) If anybody knows of good documentation in that area, I'd appreciate a pointer. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: instructions for setting up sound?
Kent West wrote: Daniel Barclay wrote: Can anyone point me to instructions for setting up audio that addresses kernel messages such as: modprobe: modprobe: Can't locate module sound-service-0-0 ... What does lspci say your sound card is (assuming it's a PCI card - if it's (E)ISA, Yikes! I'm outta here . . .)? 02:04.0 Multimedia audio controller: C-Media Electronics Inc CM8738 (rev 10) Subsystem: Asustek Computer, Inc.: Unknown device 8077 Control: I/O+ Mem- BusMaster+ SpecCycle- MemWINV- VGASnoop- ParErr- Step ping+ SERR- FastB2B- Status: Cap+ 66Mhz- UDF- FastB2B- ParErr- DEVSEL=medium TAbort- TAbort - MAbort- SERR- PERR- Latency: 32 (500ns min, 6000ns max) Interrupt: pin A routed to IRQ 17 Region 0: I/O ports at a800 [size=256] Capabilities: [c0] Power Management version 2 Flags: PMEClk- DSI- D1+ D2+ AuxCurrent=0mA PME(D0-,D1-,D2-,D3hot -,D3cold-) Status: D0 PME-Enable- DSel=0 DScale=0 PME- I've got sound, and some mixer controls work (the CD-specific level control works), but the PCM-specific level control does not. Note that what I'm looking for a good explanation of how things work. (E.g., where does the string sound-service-0-0 come from (what portion comes from what part of the kernel, or what would I see in mixer source), what are all those virtual (aliasable) modules names for (what does each do), etc.) Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
A7M266-D CM8738 problems: Pcm control of various mixers don't work
Is anyone familar with this problem?: Since I've upgraded from a system with a SoundBlaster 16 to a A7M266-D motherboard with an on-board C-Media CM8738 chip, the Pcm control of mixer programs (tkmixer, aumix, wmmixer, kmix) no longer work. Also, no control besides the master volume control affect the volume of audio from the computer. (The CD slider does work for the volume of audio directly from the CD-ROM drive.) Additionally, the overall output volume seems a little low, as if there is a PCM mixer setting (in the hardware) that is initialized to less than a full-scale value I'm currently using a 2.4 kernel with the cmpci module. Is there any special setup for the CM8738 that I should be aware of? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: IDE disk corruption - A7M266-D; which kernel patches? or other solution
Pigeon wrote: On Sat, Jan 18, 2003 at 11:27:28AM -0500, Daniel Barclay wrote: I'm getting disk corruption if I try to enable DMA mode for my IDE disks. ... If you have a VIA chipset try making sure that VIA chipset support is included in the kernel. No, it's an Asus A7M266-D, which has an AMD 768(?) southbridge chip. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: IDE disk corruption - A7M266-D; which kernel patches? or othersolution
Ron Johnson wrote: On Sun, 2003-01-19 at 15:48, Bob Proulx wrote: ... ... But the A7M266-D doesn't use a Via chipset. From http://usa.asus.com/mb/socketa/a7m266-d/overview.htm : The A7M266-D leverages the technology of the AMD 760MPX chipset A quick google, and the *first* URL shown on the query: ... is http://www.uwsg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0209.3/0382.html Now, maybe this relates to your error, and maybe not, but it looks like it has something to do with it. Interesting. No, it doesn't seem to be the problem I'm having, since I do use a PS/2 mouse. Just for reference, my rev. 1.04 A7M266-D has a version B2 southbridge (with fixed USB 1.1). Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
IDE disk corruption - A7M266-D; which kernel patches? or other solution
I'm getting disk corruption if I try to enable DMA mode for my IDE
disks.
I get mesages like:
hdc: timeout waiting for DMA
ide_dmaproc: chipset supported ide_dma_timeout func. only: 14
hdc: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady, SeekComplete, DataRequest }
hdc: drive not ready for command
The linux-kernel mailing list archives seem to indicate that there
is a patch for a kernel bug that can cause disk corruption.
Does anybody know which 2.4.x kernel patches are supposed to fix that?
Or is the problem something else?
Thanks,
Daniel
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unresolved symbols with make-kpkg but not with make, make modules, etc.
What does it mean when compiling a kernel using make-kpkg yields a number of unresolved symbols but using make or make modules compiles with no errors? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
which 2.4 kernel and patch(es) to avoid IDE disk corruption when DMA on?
I've been having a heck of a time with repeated IDE disk corruption when I try to enable DMA mode, and with trying to figure out which versions of the stable (2.4) kernel actually are stable. What is the recommended combination of base kernel versions and patches to avoid IDE disk corruption and system hangs with a dual Athlon MP system (A7M266-D motherboard)? Thanks, Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which 2.4 kernel and patch(es) to avoid IDE disk corruption when DMA on?
nate wrote: ... DMA problems are most often caused by buggy IDE controllers or perhaps the *driver* [emphasis added]. Exactly--that's why I'm trying to figure out which version of the driver (kernel and modules) is (thought to be) the most stable and bug-fixed. There are a number of messages on the Linux kernel mailing list about IDE disk corruption, and there a number of patches for various versions of the 2.4.1x kernel, but it's not clear which patches fixes known problems vs. which try to add new functionality to the otherwise-stable 2.4 kernel series. Daniel -- Daniel Barclay [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
