Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Alex Harui]

Hi Carlos,

I'm not quite sure what you meant here.  I think without a deadline there
is no chance they will approve.  Is the deadline what you meant by "other
option"?

-Alex

On 11/2/17, 4:36 PM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com on behalf of Carlos Rovira"
 wrote:

>Hi,
>
>since nobody is responding to the latest plan of put static html site on
>our repo, I think this could be what we want and could get it live even
>without a concrete deadline so we can go with other solution with more or
>less time. Let me try to ask in the current thread with trademarks if it's
>ok to do this although we didn't get any response on legal, if they put
>some problems we could see that other option. do you agree?
>
>Thanks
>
>2017-11-02 22:49 GMT+01:00 Harbs :
>
>> I would ask for 90 days to give us a bit more time, but I think this is
>>a
>> good idea.
>>
>> > On Nov 2, 2017, at 11:44 PM, Alex Harui 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > FWIW, maybe the least effort choice right now is to ask ASF Trademarks
>> and
>> > Infra for a 60 day exception to redirect royale.a.o to
>> > royale.codeoscopic.com
>>>odeoscopic.com%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cbab2e5f3273d44537f9f08d5224a909c%7Cfa
>>7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636452626010525995=gB4SXym
>>lfdv2HPJX%2Fa5KwkLKXYH%2F98Iyh6CgbqVwHUI%3D=0>.  That'll keep
>> us for burning more energy trying to
>> > make this work some other way so we can get other stuff done,
>>including
>> > creating a similar site the traditional way based on the things we
>>liked
>> > from royale.codeoscopic.
>> >
>> > Thoughts?
>> > -Alex
>> >
>> > On 10/30/17, 3:45 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com > carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of Carlos Rovira"
>> >  on behalf of
>> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com >
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi Alex,
>> >>
>> >> notice that the actual preview site is only that. We told about to
>>get
>> the
>> >> site to some compromise point when we could evaluate it.
>> >> As I get to that point, folks agree about the direction of the site.
>>We
>> >> are
>> >> know seeing how to put this working for us. It seems that current
>>talk
>> >> with
>> >> Greg and others is going on the good track. So If we end pushing the
>> >> preview site to royale.apache.org, I'll be working ASAP to finish the
>> rest
>> >> of the site in order to get it final.
>> >>
>> >> Let's see what happen.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks
>> >>
>> >> Carlos
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 2017-10-30 4:13 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui :
>> >>
>> >>> I think there were objections to that as well.  Also note that the
>> >>> current
>> >>> state of
>> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co
>>>felinks=02%7C01%7C%7Cbab2e5f3273d44537f9f08d5224a909c%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34
>>438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636452626010525995=MyV%2BUtPretK0tCC
>>WBESOLTjLF0Bck%2Fljj%2FSwOURKJYE%3D=0.
>> protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co>
>> >>> deoscopic.com
>>>c.com%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cbab2e5f3273d44537f9f08d5224a909c%7Cfa7b1b5a7b3
>>4438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636452626010525995=DV1IQrOAv1xBeBzT
>>3iBX3PH%2FK3spZ%2BkEQw19FyvQtL4%3D=0>=02%7C01%7C%
>> 7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af6195108d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b
>> >>> 5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636449571756882295&
>> sdata=0899xFFPDf8
>> >>> NmBRpAp%2FlHVCzspV5ed7fKnf6WwJPIlM%3D=0 may need some other
>> >>> adjustments to
>> >>> be approved by Apache's VP Branding as a valid home page for an
>>Apache
>> >>> project.  This page [1] mentions a "Donate" button and some other
>> >>> things.
>> >>>
>> >>> Carlos has done a great job and spent plenty of his precious time on
>> >>> this
>> >>> already, but the choice of commercial themes is turning out to be a
>> >>> problem.  One option I think we have is to see what changes Carlos
>> would
>> >>> have to make to his site for it to be ruled as a "fan site" and
>>build a
>> >>> simpler and conforming site on royale.a.o with CSS that "looks
>>similar"
>> >>> but with conforming content.
>> >>>
>> >>> My 2 cents,
>> >>> -Alex
>> >>>
>> >>> [1]
>> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apach
>>>felinks=02%7C01%7C%7Cbab2e5f3273d44537f9f08d5224a909c%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34
>>438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636452626010525995=MyV%2BUtPretK0tCC
>>WBESOLTjLF0Bck%2Fljj%2FSwOURKJYE%3D=0.
>> protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apach>
>> >>> e.org 
>>>=02%7C01%7C%7Cbab2e5f3273d44537f9f08d5224a909c%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794a

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

Hi,

since nobody is responding to the latest plan of put static html site on
our repo, I think this could be what we want and could get it live even
without a concrete deadline so we can go with other solution with more or
less time. Let me try to ask in the current thread with trademarks if it's
ok to do this although we didn't get any response on legal, if they put
some problems we could see that other option. do you agree?

Thanks

2017-11-02 22:49 GMT+01:00 Harbs :

> I would ask for 90 days to give us a bit more time, but I think this is a
> good idea.
>
> > On Nov 2, 2017, at 11:44 PM, Alex Harui 
> wrote:
> >
> > FWIW, maybe the least effort choice right now is to ask ASF Trademarks
> and
> > Infra for a 60 day exception to redirect royale.a.o to
> > royale.codeoscopic.com .  That'll keep
> us for burning more energy trying to
> > make this work some other way so we can get other stuff done, including
> > creating a similar site the traditional way based on the things we liked
> > from royale.codeoscopic.
> >
> > Thoughts?
> > -Alex
> >
> > On 10/30/17, 3:45 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com  carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of Carlos Rovira"
> >  on behalf of
> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com >
> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Alex,
> >>
> >> notice that the actual preview site is only that. We told about to get
> the
> >> site to some compromise point when we could evaluate it.
> >> As I get to that point, folks agree about the direction of the site. We
> >> are
> >> know seeing how to put this working for us. It seems that current talk
> >> with
> >> Greg and others is going on the good track. So If we end pushing the
> >> preview site to royale.apache.org, I'll be working ASAP to finish the
> rest
> >> of the site in order to get it final.
> >>
> >> Let's see what happen.
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >> Carlos
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> 2017-10-30 4:13 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui :
> >>
> >>> I think there were objections to that as well.  Also note that the
> >>> current
> >>> state of
> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co  protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co>
> >>> deoscopic.com =02%7C01%7C%
> 7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af6195108d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b
> >>> 5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636449571756882295&
> sdata=0899xFFPDf8
> >>> NmBRpAp%2FlHVCzspV5ed7fKnf6WwJPIlM%3D=0 may need some other
> >>> adjustments to
> >>> be approved by Apache's VP Branding as a valid home page for an Apache
> >>> project.  This page [1] mentions a "Donate" button and some other
> >>> things.
> >>>
> >>> Carlos has done a great job and spent plenty of his precious time on
> >>> this
> >>> already, but the choice of commercial themes is turning out to be a
> >>> problem.  One option I think we have is to see what changes Carlos
> would
> >>> have to make to his site for it to be ruled as a "fan site" and build a
> >>> simpler and conforming site on royale.a.o with CSS that "looks similar"
> >>> but with conforming content.
> >>>
> >>> My 2 cents,
> >>> -Alex
> >>>
> >>> [1]
> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apach  protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apach>
> >>> e.org %2Ffoundation%2Fmarks%2Fpmcs=02%7C01%
> 7C%7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af619510
> >>> 8d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> 7C6364495717568822
> >>> 95=wkvJSvbx7mZ4ZlVaI5pp36eed0MEE6BdROZVTJu7nfs%3D=0
> >>>
> >>> On 10/29/17, 10:51 AM, "omup...@gmail.com 
> on behalf of OmPrakash
> >>> Muppirala"  on behalf of
> bigosma...@gmail.com > wrote:
> >>>
>  I agree.  We might want to avoid that.
> 
>  Looks like the option of pointing to a wp.com  site
> has been done
> >>> already.
> 
>  Can we push for this?
> 
>  Thanks,
>  Om
> 
>  On Oct 29, 2017 10:37 AM, "Carlos Rovira"
> >>> >
>  wrote:
> 
> > Hi Om,
> >
> > I think that's the better option, but my question is how to do this.
> >
> > How we can put the static generated site live under
> royale.apache.org 
> > without having that code on some repo? (the latest is very important)
> > can we do this? do you know how to do it?
> >
> > note: remember that we don't want to upload the actual website code
> >>> to
> > some
> > public repo due to commercial code licenses (movedo theme license)
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Carlos
> >
> >
> >
> > 2017-10-29 2:10 GMT+01:00 OmPrakash Muppirala  

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Harbs]

I would ask for 90 days to give us a bit more time, but I think this is a good 
idea.

> On Nov 2, 2017, at 11:44 PM, Alex Harui  wrote:
> 
> FWIW, maybe the least effort choice right now is to ask ASF Trademarks and
> Infra for a 60 day exception to redirect royale.a.o to
> royale.codeoscopic.com .  That'll keep us for 
> burning more energy trying to
> make this work some other way so we can get other stuff done, including
> creating a similar site the traditional way based on the things we liked
> from royale.codeoscopic.
> 
> Thoughts?
> -Alex
> 
> On 10/30/17, 3:45 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com 
>  on behalf of Carlos Rovira"
>  on behalf of 
> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com > wrote:
> 
>> Hi Alex,
>> 
>> notice that the actual preview site is only that. We told about to get the
>> site to some compromise point when we could evaluate it.
>> As I get to that point, folks agree about the direction of the site. We
>> are
>> know seeing how to put this working for us. It seems that current talk
>> with
>> Greg and others is going on the good track. So If we end pushing the
>> preview site to royale.apache.org, I'll be working ASAP to finish the rest
>> of the site in order to get it final.
>> 
>> Let's see what happen.
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> Carlos
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 2017-10-30 4:13 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui :
>> 
>>> I think there were objections to that as well.  Also note that the
>>> current
>>> state of 
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co 
>>> 
>>> deoscopic.com 
>>> =02%7C01%7C%7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af6195108d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b
>>> 5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636449571756882295=0899xFFPDf8
>>> NmBRpAp%2FlHVCzspV5ed7fKnf6WwJPIlM%3D=0 may need some other
>>> adjustments to
>>> be approved by Apache's VP Branding as a valid home page for an Apache
>>> project.  This page [1] mentions a "Donate" button and some other
>>> things.
>>> 
>>> Carlos has done a great job and spent plenty of his precious time on
>>> this
>>> already, but the choice of commercial themes is turning out to be a
>>> problem.  One option I think we have is to see what changes Carlos would
>>> have to make to his site for it to be ruled as a "fan site" and build a
>>> simpler and conforming site on royale.a.o with CSS that "looks similar"
>>> but with conforming content.
>>> 
>>> My 2 cents,
>>> -Alex
>>> 
>>> [1] 
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apach 
>>> 
>>> e.org 
>>> %2Ffoundation%2Fmarks%2Fpmcs=02%7C01%7C%7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af619510
>>> 8d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C6364495717568822
>>> 95=wkvJSvbx7mZ4ZlVaI5pp36eed0MEE6BdROZVTJu7nfs%3D=0
>>> 
>>> On 10/29/17, 10:51 AM, "omup...@gmail.com  on 
>>> behalf of OmPrakash
>>> Muppirala"  on behalf of 
>>> bigosma...@gmail.com > wrote:
>>> 
 I agree.  We might want to avoid that.
 
 Looks like the option of pointing to a wp.com  site has 
 been done
>>> already.
 
 Can we push for this?
 
 Thanks,
 Om
 
 On Oct 29, 2017 10:37 AM, "Carlos Rovira"
>>> >
 wrote:
 
> Hi Om,
> 
> I think that's the better option, but my question is how to do this.
> 
> How we can put the static generated site live under royale.apache.org 
> 
> without having that code on some repo? (the latest is very important)
> can we do this? do you know how to do it?
> 
> note: remember that we don't want to upload the actual website code
>>> to
> some
> public repo due to commercial code licenses (movedo theme license)
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Carlos
> 
> 
> 
> 2017-10-29 2:10 GMT+01:00 OmPrakash Muppirala  >:
> 
>> I suggest we just release what Carlos as a static website for now.
>> As time goes by, volunteers can build up a separate website using
>>> just
>> Royale.  At some point we can simply swap out the wp.com 
>>  site with
>>> the
> new
>> Royale based website.
>> 
>> There is absolutely no requirement that the new site has to look
>>> like
> the
>> wp.com .  So, worrying about legal implications of 
>> maintaining the
>>> same
>> look
>> and feel is premature.
>> 
>> Let's not make perfect the enemy of the good.
>> 
>> Thanks,

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Alex Harui]

FWIW, maybe the least effort choice right now is to ask ASF Trademarks and
Infra for a 60 day exception to redirect royale.a.o to
royale.codeoscopic.com.  That'll keep us for burning more energy trying to
make this work some other way so we can get other stuff done, including
creating a similar site the traditional way based on the things we liked
from royale.codeoscopic.

Thoughts?
-Alex

On 10/30/17, 3:45 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com on behalf of Carlos Rovira"
 wrote:

>Hi Alex,
>
>notice that the actual preview site is only that. We told about to get the
>site to some compromise point when we could evaluate it.
>As I get to that point, folks agree about the direction of the site. We
>are
>know seeing how to put this working for us. It seems that current talk
>with
>Greg and others is going on the good track. So If we end pushing the
>preview site to royale.apache.org, I'll be working ASAP to finish the rest
>of the site in order to get it final.
>
>Let's see what happen.
>
>Thanks
>
>Carlos
>
>
>
>2017-10-30 4:13 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui :
>
>> I think there were objections to that as well.  Also note that the
>>current
>> state of 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co
>>deoscopic.com=02%7C01%7C%7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af6195108d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b
>>5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636449571756882295=0899xFFPDf8
>>NmBRpAp%2FlHVCzspV5ed7fKnf6WwJPIlM%3D=0 may need some other
>>adjustments to
>> be approved by Apache's VP Branding as a valid home page for an Apache
>> project.  This page [1] mentions a "Donate" button and some other
>>things.
>>
>> Carlos has done a great job and spent plenty of his precious time on
>>this
>> already, but the choice of commercial themes is turning out to be a
>> problem.  One option I think we have is to see what changes Carlos would
>> have to make to his site for it to be ruled as a "fan site" and build a
>> simpler and conforming site on royale.a.o with CSS that "looks similar"
>> but with conforming content.
>>
>> My 2 cents,
>> -Alex
>>
>> [1] 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apach
>>e.org%2Ffoundation%2Fmarks%2Fpmcs=02%7C01%7C%7Cbd5f09b6f99c4af619510
>>8d51f8370fa%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C6364495717568822
>>95=wkvJSvbx7mZ4ZlVaI5pp36eed0MEE6BdROZVTJu7nfs%3D=0
>>
>> On 10/29/17, 10:51 AM, "omup...@gmail.com on behalf of OmPrakash
>> Muppirala"  wrote:
>>
>> >I agree.  We might want to avoid that.
>> >
>> >Looks like the option of pointing to a wp.com site has been done
>>already.
>> >
>> >Can we push for this?
>> >
>> >Thanks,
>> >Om
>> >
>> >On Oct 29, 2017 10:37 AM, "Carlos Rovira"
>>
>> >wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi Om,
>> >>
>> >> I think that's the better option, but my question is how to do this.
>> >>
>> >> How we can put the static generated site live under royale.apache.org
>> >> without having that code on some repo? (the latest is very important)
>> >> can we do this? do you know how to do it?
>> >>
>> >> note: remember that we don't want to upload the actual website code
>>to
>> >>some
>> >> public repo due to commercial code licenses (movedo theme license)
>> >>
>> >> Thanks
>> >>
>> >> Carlos
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 2017-10-29 2:10 GMT+01:00 OmPrakash Muppirala :
>> >>
>> >> > I suggest we just release what Carlos as a static website for now.
>> >> > As time goes by, volunteers can build up a separate website using
>>just
>> >> > Royale.  At some point we can simply swap out the wp.com site with
>> the
>> >> new
>> >> > Royale based website.
>> >> >
>> >> > There is absolutely no requirement that the new site has to look
>>like
>> >>the
>> >> > wp.com.  So, worrying about legal implications of maintaining the
>> same
>> >> > look
>> >> > and feel is premature.
>> >> >
>> >> > Let's not make perfect the enemy of the good.
>> >> >
>> >> > Thanks,
>> >> > Om
>> >> >
>> >> > On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 1:12 PM, Carlos Rovira
>> >>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > Thanks Yishay for your words
>> >> > >
>> >> > > 2017-10-28 19:09 GMT+02:00 Yishay Weiss :
>> >> > >
>> >> > > > Carlos, I agree that our resources are limited and this this
>>might
>> >> not
>> >> > be
>> >> > > > the best way to spend them at this point. However, there are
>>some
>> >> > points
>> >> > > > that have not been mentioned in this discussion that make me
>> >>think we
>> >> > > > should try to move our site to Royale.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > One is that we claim to be different to other frameworks in
>>that
>> >> > overhead
>> >> > > > can be much smaller. A site that performs at the level of a
>> >>classic
>> >> > > static
>> >> > > > site would be a significant proof of concept. If it doesn’t
>> >>perform
>> >> > well
>> >> > > > enough we’ll have some information 

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[OmPrakash Muppirala]

I suggest we just release what Carlos as a static website for now.
As time goes by, volunteers can build up a separate website using just
Royale.  At some point we can simply swap out the wp.com site with the new
Royale based website.

There is absolutely no requirement that the new site has to look like the
wp.com.  So, worrying about legal implications of maintaining the same look
and feel is premature.

Let's not make perfect the enemy of the good.

Thanks,
Om

On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 1:12 PM, Carlos Rovira 
wrote:

> Thanks Yishay for your words
>
> 2017-10-28 19:09 GMT+02:00 Yishay Weiss :
>
> > Carlos, I agree that our resources are limited and this this might not be
> > the best way to spend them at this point. However, there are some points
> > that have not been mentioned in this discussion that make me think we
> > should try to move our site to Royale.
> >
> > One is that we claim to be different to other frameworks in that overhead
> > can be much smaller. A site that performs at the level of a classic
> static
> > site would be a significant proof of concept. If it doesn’t perform well
> > enough we’ll have some information on where we can improve in that
> regard.
> >
> > Related, we need to finally start eating our dog food. The more visible
> > our dog food, the more feedback we’ll get.
> >
> > Also, if new people really want to contribute to out site, I’d much
> rather
> > have them learn Royale than WP.
> >
>
> That's ok. I  only said that we are run out of resources and I don't see
> many people available to make this effort.
> In my case, my plan was to focus on design to bring something good to
> production, but didn't expect such problems with something we should put
> online, complete with real content and focus on other things.
> In my case, I would prefer to donate my tiny time in other things more
> needed. In concrete I prefer to donate in "theme" feature, styling express,
> and so on...
> But if someone wants to work on replicate the site with Royale our other
> html plain code, that's right.
>
>
> >
> > In other words, whether or not Royale ends up being a good tool for
> > classic web sites I see some reasons to try and achieve that for our own
> > site.
> >
> > Finally, suppose I wanted to replicate your site in Royale just for the
> > heck of it. Would that be ok from a legal stand-point? I couldn’t
> > understand that from the thread so far.
> >
>
> If we recreate the site with our own set of CSS, JS, that's right. Nobody
> could say us nothing since no commercial code is involved there.
> As well, If we put the actual static generated site online, without having
> to upload the code to any repo, that's alright as well, since is the normal
> use, and the rest of people using that theme is doing the same.
>
> Thanks for your considerations.
>
> Carlos
>
>
>
> >
> > Thanks, and great work so far.
> >
> >
> >
>

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

Thanks Yishay for your words

2017-10-28 19:09 GMT+02:00 Yishay Weiss :

> Carlos, I agree that our resources are limited and this this might not be
> the best way to spend them at this point. However, there are some points
> that have not been mentioned in this discussion that make me think we
> should try to move our site to Royale.
>
> One is that we claim to be different to other frameworks in that overhead
> can be much smaller. A site that performs at the level of a classic static
> site would be a significant proof of concept. If it doesn’t perform well
> enough we’ll have some information on where we can improve in that regard.
>
> Related, we need to finally start eating our dog food. The more visible
> our dog food, the more feedback we’ll get.
>
> Also, if new people really want to contribute to out site, I’d much rather
> have them learn Royale than WP.
>

That's ok. I  only said that we are run out of resources and I don't see
many people available to make this effort.
In my case, my plan was to focus on design to bring something good to
production, but didn't expect such problems with something we should put
online, complete with real content and focus on other things.
In my case, I would prefer to donate my tiny time in other things more
needed. In concrete I prefer to donate in "theme" feature, styling express,
and so on...
But if someone wants to work on replicate the site with Royale our other
html plain code, that's right.


>
> In other words, whether or not Royale ends up being a good tool for
> classic web sites I see some reasons to try and achieve that for our own
> site.
>
> Finally, suppose I wanted to replicate your site in Royale just for the
> heck of it. Would that be ok from a legal stand-point? I couldn’t
> understand that from the thread so far.
>

If we recreate the site with our own set of CSS, JS, that's right. Nobody
could say us nothing since no commercial code is involved there.
As well, If we put the actual static generated site online, without having
to upload the code to any repo, that's alright as well, since is the normal
use, and the rest of people using that theme is doing the same.

Thanks for your considerations.

Carlos



>
> Thanks, and great work so far.
>
>
>

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

Hi Alex

2017-10-26 23:38 GMT+02:00 Alex Harui :

>
> 1) keep pushing to allow hosting on WP for royale.a.o.
>

ok


> 2) Do one static export and copy to the Git repo currently behind roe.a.o
>

I think we can't do this as I commented before. We can't upload code from
movedo theme in ASF repos. And the static version generated will have code
from movedo clearly recognized.

But, again, we as Apache Royale, are not interested in upload any website
code to a repo, since is not our mission. We are interested in upload code
to Apache Royale SDK.


> 3) try to recreate the look and feel in standard CSS/HTML/JS.
>

yes. But we can't expect to do this soon although someone wants to make
this effort



-- 
Carlos Rovira
http://about.me/carlosrovira

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Alex Harui]

.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Harbs is right,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> to get something that looks cool and consistent is difficult and
>>for
>> >> this
>> >> >> reason I use wordpress+theme (in this case movedo). Is the same
>> >>thing as
>> >> >> why people use flex or royale. Is the way to start from a point
>>where
>> >> you
>> >> >> are more efficient and maintenance can be assumed.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Alex, you see lots of difference since I customized via movedo
>> >>interface
>> >> >> but as well did some tweaks in custom css (for example the footer
>> >>column
>> >> >> menus)
>> >> >>
>> >> >> So could we rework the site without wp and movedo. Sure, as I
>>stated
>> >>all
>> >> >> sites can be write in different ways, but the long term reason to
>> >>adopt
>> >> a
>> >> >> CMS like WP is to have a backend to introduce content of quality
>>in
>> >>the
>> >> >> most easy way while preserving quality on presentation (styles,
>> >>fonts,
>> >> >> effects...)
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I think we are in a situation where "the Apache way" fails
>>completely
>> >> >> since
>> >> >> we should be able to make this quick and easy and concentrate in
>>our
>> >> >> Royale
>> >> >> code, that is why we are here, and why I tried to go this path: to
>> >>get
>> >> >> something that looks good and professional but to spend very few
>>time
>> >> for
>> >> >> our part.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I'm very pragmatic, and like to go to the point. All Apache rules
>> >>should
>> >> >> be
>> >> >> focused in protect the code we release, and we should have less
>> >>trouble
>> >> >> with tools like WP, Jira, Nexus, and the rest. In fact Apache is
>> >>using
>> >> >> those tools all along the way, why is so hard to do this?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> We only need:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> * Some host for a Wordpress instance: this could be the current
>> >> >> Codeoscopic
>> >> >> subdomain or whatever people like. I'd be more happy if the wp
>> >>instance
>> >> is
>> >> >> in some server that could be controlled and maintained by ASF. I
>> >>don't
>> >> >> know
>> >> >> if this could be WP.com or some ASF's virtual machine that could
>>host
>> >> >> that.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> * The Movedo theme: I write to Dimitri, from greatives. He is very
>> >> >> supportive and very like the idea, but is not in their hands. He
>> >>point
>> >> me
>> >> >> to talk with envato, and I write to them, but still doesn't have a
>> >> >> response. My thinking here is that we really don't need nothing of
>> >>this.
>> >> >> Envato could donate a license but is only 59$, so is something
>> >> affordable
>> >> >> by a simple donation.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> * Finaly to generate an static site from WP. This is as well not
>> >>needed,
>> >> >> but we can do it. People use to generate wp static version in
>>order
>> >>to
>> >> >> protect their sites from hacking. That's the only relevant point
>>to
>> >>do
>> >> >> this. So for me is something we can do if the rest of community
>>wants
>> >> it.
>> >> >> Is very easy to do.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Additionaly: As we are not uploading any website code to any ASF
>> >>repo,
>> >> >> since as I said, it would be like to upload the JIRA source code
>>to
>> >>our
>> >> >> repos, and that doesn't give us anything (we're here to release
>>only
>> >> >> apache
>> >> >> royale code). we can :
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 1.- Use the royale.codeoscopic.com wp instance as the tool for us
>>to
>> >> >> m

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

Some host for a Wordpress instance: this could be the current
> >> >> Codeoscopic
> >> >> subdomain or whatever people like. I'd be more happy if the wp
> >>instance
> >> is
> >> >> in some server that could be controlled and maintained by ASF. I
> >>don't
> >> >> know
> >> >> if this could be WP.com or some ASF's virtual machine that could host
> >> >> that.
> >> >>
> >> >> * The Movedo theme: I write to Dimitri, from greatives. He is very
> >> >> supportive and very like the idea, but is not in their hands. He
> >>point
> >> me
> >> >> to talk with envato, and I write to them, but still doesn't have a
> >> >> response. My thinking here is that we really don't need nothing of
> >>this.
> >> >> Envato could donate a license but is only 59$, so is something
> >> affordable
> >> >> by a simple donation.
> >> >>
> >> >> * Finaly to generate an static site from WP. This is as well not
> >>needed,
> >> >> but we can do it. People use to generate wp static version in order
> >>to
> >> >> protect their sites from hacking. That's the only relevant point to
> >>do
> >> >> this. So for me is something we can do if the rest of community wants
> >> it.
> >> >> Is very easy to do.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Additionaly: As we are not uploading any website code to any ASF
> >>repo,
> >> >> since as I said, it would be like to upload the JIRA source code to
> >>our
> >> >> repos, and that doesn't give us anything (we're here to release only
> >> >> apache
> >> >> royale code). we can :
> >> >>
> >> >> 1.- Use the royale.codeoscopic.com wp instance as the tool for us to
> >> >> modify
> >> >> the site (people in our community will have user/pass in this wp
> >> instance
> >> >> to create post and pages)
> >> >> (in this way is similar to the server Alex had on his own to make
> >>some
> >> >> apache flex task, correct me if I'm wrong)
> >> >> Again, it can be royale.codeoscopic.com or other hosting ASF wants.
> >> >>
> >> >> 2.- Each time something changes: generate static site and deploy to
> >> >> royale.apache.org
> >> >> (in this case the set of static generated html/js/css could not be
> >> >> uploaded
> >> >> to any ASF repo since we don't want to release the website code, that
> >> must
> >> >> be served in the same way ASF serves JIRA, or whatever other
> >>commercial
> >> >> tool
> >> >>
> >> >> Hosting a generated site with a movedo commercial theme needs of a
> >>59$
> >> >> license that could be donated by envato or donated for other
> >> >> person/company
> >> >> (for example Codeoscopic)
> >> >>
> >> >> For me this is quick and easy and I think we're not making something
> >> wrong
> >> >> in legal terms
> >> >>
> >> >> Carlos
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> 2017-10-26 9:24 GMT+02:00 Harbs <harbs.li...@gmail.com>:
> >> >>
> >> >>> It’s using greatives’ CSS and JS files for styling, layout and
> >>effects.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Generally, these themes have a lot of flexibility to change the
> >>look of
> >> >>> a
> >> >>> site without messing with CSS and JS.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Can we re-write the CSS and JS to do the same kind of thing?
> >>Probably.
> >> >>> But
> >> >>> it would be a considerable amount of work.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> What’s included in the license? I’m really not sure.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> It gives rights to us the theme in WordPress. Does that allow
> >> >>> repurposing
> >> >>> the CSS and JS files for use elsewhere? I don’t know.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Harbs
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> On Oct 26, 2017, at 9:56 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVAL

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

tatic site and deploy to
> >> royale.apache.org
> >> (in this case the set of static generated html/js/css could not be
> >> uploaded
> >> to any ASF repo since we don't want to release the website code, that
> must
> >> be served in the same way ASF serves JIRA, or whatever other commercial
> >> tool
> >>
> >> Hosting a generated site with a movedo commercial theme needs of a 59$
> >> license that could be donated by envato or donated for other
> >> person/company
> >> (for example Codeoscopic)
> >>
> >> For me this is quick and easy and I think we're not making something
> wrong
> >> in legal terms
> >>
> >> Carlos
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> 2017-10-26 9:24 GMT+02:00 Harbs <harbs.li...@gmail.com>:
> >>
> >>> It’s using greatives’ CSS and JS files for styling, layout and effects.
> >>>
> >>> Generally, these themes have a lot of flexibility to change the look of
> >>> a
> >>> site without messing with CSS and JS.
> >>>
> >>> Can we re-write the CSS and JS to do the same kind of thing? Probably.
> >>> But
> >>> it would be a considerable amount of work.
> >>>
> >>> What’s included in the license? I’m really not sure.
> >>>
> >>> It gives rights to us the theme in WordPress. Does that allow
> >>> repurposing
> >>> the CSS and JS files for use elsewhere? I don’t know.
> >>>
> >>> Harbs
> >>>
> >>>> On Oct 26, 2017, at 9:56 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm still confused about something.
> >>>>
> >>>> Can someone explain how creativity and licensing are interconnected?
> >>> I'm not familiar with WP themes, but I think they are templates with
> >>> placeholders for particular aspects of a web page/blog.  I've been told
> >>> that this Royale site prototype is based on the Movedo theme.  When I
> >>> searched for it on the internet I ended up here:
> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fgreatives
> >>> .eu%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cdb97bd994ab24ee2f91c08d51c49
> 6496%7Cfa7b1b5a7b344
> >>> 38794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636446023931803217=
> VI0EOLywsaxbKgmhAe
> >>> F08cdZNQjcgtIjyFvJ2R33hlo%3D=0
> >>> themeforest/themeswitcher/?product=movedo#movedo
> >>>>
> >>>> It doesn't look at all like the prototype at
> >>>
> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Froyale.co
> >>> deoscopic.com=02%7C01%7C%7Cdb97bd994ab24ee2f91c08d51c49
> 6496%7Cfa7b1b
> >>> 5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636446023931803217&
> sdata=3GHfDzdFp6B
> >>> 4RQMLuP00jKAHmwQ1QMubUd4dgz3FdTA%3D=0.  Maybe the menu bar
> >>> along the top?
> >>>>
> >>>> So what did we license from greatives?   Can Carlos or someone else
> >>> try
> >>> to reproduce the prototype without looking at the current CSS and maybe
> >>> use
> >>> AL licensed fonts or something like that?
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks,
> >>>> -Alex
> >>>>
> >>>> From: Dave Fisher
> >>> <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
> >>>> Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> >>>> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 11:06 AM
> >>>> To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> >>>> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
> >>>>
> >>>> Hi Alex,
> >>>>
> >>>> We will need to ask Carlos to list out all of the themes he uses and
> >>> then we will need to track things down and ask questions.
> >>>>
> >>>> Here is the site for what looks like the main theme:
> >>>
> >>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fgreative
> >>> s.ticksy.com%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cdb97bd994ab24ee2f91c08d51c49
> 6496%7Cfa7b
> >>> 1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636446023931803217&
> sdata=KBxlYi2QO
> >>> PDqNGhTsU6GJMhdUggdHVZjiYetcIcE8vE%3D=0
> >>>>
> >>>> It is the Move Do theme.
> >>>>
> &

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Harbs]

It’s using greatives’ CSS and JS files for styling, layout and effects.

Generally, these themes have a lot of flexibility to change the look of a site 
without messing with CSS and JS.

Can we re-write the CSS and JS to do the same kind of thing? Probably. But it 
would be a considerable amount of work.

What’s included in the license? I’m really not sure.

It gives rights to us the theme in WordPress. Does that allow repurposing the 
CSS and JS files for use elsewhere? I don’t know.

Harbs

> On Oct 26, 2017, at 9:56 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
> 
> I'm still confused about something.
> 
> Can someone explain how creativity and licensing are interconnected?   I'm 
> not familiar with WP themes, but I think they are templates with placeholders 
> for particular aspects of a web page/blog.  I've been told that this Royale 
> site prototype is based on the Movedo theme.  When I searched for it on the 
> internet I ended up here: 
> http://greatives.eu/themeforest/themeswitcher/?product=movedo#movedo
> 
> It doesn't look at all like the prototype at http://royale.codeoscopic.com.  
> Maybe the menu bar along the top?
> 
> So what did we license from greatives?   Can Carlos or someone else try to 
> reproduce the prototype without looking at the current CSS and maybe use AL 
> licensed fonts or something like that?
> 
> Thanks,
> -Alex
> 
> From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
> Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 11:06 AM
> To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
> 
> Hi Alex,
> 
> We will need to ask Carlos to list out all of the themes he uses and then we 
> will need to track things down and ask questions.
> 
> Here is the site for what looks like the main theme: 
> https://greatives.ticksy.com/
> 
> It is the Move Do theme.
> 
> Regards,
> Dave
> 
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:56 AM, Alex Harui 
> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:
> 
> Hi Dave,
> 
> I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we have 
> the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
> understand who owns the creative content.
> 
> Thoughts?
> -Alex
> 
> From: Dave Fisher 
> <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net><mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
> Reply-To: 
> <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org><mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
> To: 
> <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org><mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
> 
> Hi Alex,
> 
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui 
> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID><mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>>
>  wrote:
> 
> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
> outside of WP.
> 
> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
> 
> 
> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
> 
> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if 
> needed. For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org><http://OpenOffice.org> we 
> use the legacy html pulling out the title and content body and place it 
> within a markdown template.
> 
> 
> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
> Is there a patch process for WP content?
> 
> Possibly.
> 
> 
> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
> 
> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
> simplified as we find the best way.
> 
> Regards,
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> -Alex
> 
> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, 
> "carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Alex Harui]

I'm still confused about something.

Can someone explain how creativity and licensing are interconnected?   I'm not 
familiar with WP themes, but I think they are templates with placeholders for 
particular aspects of a web page/blog.  I've been told that this Royale site 
prototype is based on the Movedo theme.  When I searched for it on the internet 
I ended up here: 
http://greatives.eu/themeforest/themeswitcher/?product=movedo#movedo

It doesn't look at all like the prototype at http://royale.codeoscopic.com.  
Maybe the menu bar along the top?

So what did we license from greatives?   Can Carlos or someone else try to 
reproduce the prototype without looking at the current CSS and maybe use AL 
licensed fonts or something like that?

Thanks,
-Alex

From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 11:06 AM
To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site

Hi Alex,

We will need to ask Carlos to list out all of the themes he uses and then we 
will need to track things down and ask questions.

Here is the site for what looks like the main theme: 
https://greatives.ticksy.com/

It is the Move Do theme.

Regards,
Dave

On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:56 AM, Alex Harui 
<aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:

Hi Dave,

I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we have 
the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
understand who owns the creative content.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Dave Fisher 
<dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net><mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
Reply-To: 
<dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org><mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
To: 
<dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org><mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site

Hi Alex,

On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui 
<aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID><mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>>
 wrote:

There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
outside of WP.

We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.


If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.

We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if needed. 
For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org><http://OpenOffice.org> we use the 
legacy html pulling out the title and content body and place it within a 
markdown template.


Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
Is there a patch process for WP content?

Possibly.


Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.

It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
simplified as we find the best way.

Regards,
Dave



Thanks,
-Alex

On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, 
"carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com>
 on behalf of Carlos
Rovira" 
<carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com>
 on behalf of
carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com>>
 wrote:

Thanks Dave,

I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
better to migrate to WP.com<http://WP.com><http://WP.com> before continue 
working on content so we can
detect whatever issue we could get.

Thanks!

Carlos



2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher 
<dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net><mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>:

Hi Carlos,

On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
<carlosrov...@apache.org<mailto:carlosrov...@apache.org><mailto:carlosrov...@apache.org>>
wrote:

Hi,

just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
preview
site with success. I use this plugin :

https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
s.org<http://s.org/>%2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

Hi Harbs

2017-10-24 20:10 GMT+02:00 Harbs <harbs.li...@gmail.com>:

> Here’s how I see things:
>
> 1. For the immediate, we want a good web presence. If putting the
> WordPress site on wordpress.com <http://wordpress.com/> with a CNAME
> entry pointing to royale.apache.com <http://royale.apache.com/> is the
> fastest way to get there, we should start with that.
>

If we do that, don't need to generate static content, wp.com can serve it
directly.
Static content make the site more fast, but we really don't need with your
solution, so for me is ok.


> 2. We should look into getting a static version of the site, so the site
> can be edited on Github and pushed to royale.apache.com <
> http://royale.apache.com/>. That is more ideal than having private access
> to a WordPress installation.
>

following your point 1, royale.apache.org will be pointing to WP.com so no
need to upload the site.
In the other hand, I continue saying that we really don't need to upload
the site to a repo since is not our business. Our business is to spend our
time working on make Apache Royale source code better and better, so this
is only a tool to expose what we do.


> 3. We should contact greatives and see if they would give us permission to
> reuse the css and js for a static site. (possibly with attribution)
>

That's a good idea, I can contact them and ask for this.


> 4. We should ask trademarks@ and/or legal@ whether the terms (assuming we
> get them) are ok from an Apache perspective.
>

Rigth, I can ask first to trademarks, before asking greatives


> 5. Assuming #4 and #5 work out, we will probably want various pieces of
> our site constructed using this styling i.e. main site, docs, blog (as a
> WordPress installation), examples.
>

That would be an option for the future, but from my point of view, I'll
prefer to spend that time making some App example to put on showcase, or
make the "Try it now" App, or working in a Apache Royale Theme, or in any
feature we need, forms, validation, AMF,...and so on...this could happen
some years in the future since there's already too much to do.

Thanks

Carlos



>
> Harbs
>
> > On Oct 24, 2017, at 8:56 PM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Dave,
> >
> > I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we
> have the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't
> understand who owns the creative content.
> >
> > Thoughts?
> > -Alex
> >
> > From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
> > Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> > Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
> > To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> > Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
> >
> > Hi Alex,
> >
> > On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<
> mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:
> >
> > There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
> > will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
> > right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
> > to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
> > be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
> > don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
> > commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
> > outside of WP.
> >
> > We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
> >
> >
> > If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
> > use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
> > as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
> >
> > We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if
> needed. For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org> we use the legacy html
> pulling out the title and content body and place it within a markdown
> template.
> >
> >
> > Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch
> of
> > the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
> > Is there a patch process for WP content?
> >
> > Possibly.
> >
> >
> > Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
> >
> > It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will
> get simplified as we find the best way.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> > -Alex

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Dave Fisher]

Hi -

> On Oct 24, 2017, at 11:10 AM, Harbs <harbs.li...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Here’s how I see things:
> 
> 1. For the immediate, we want a good web presence. If putting the WordPress 
> site on wordpress.com <http://wordpress.com/> with a CNAME entry pointing to 
> royale.apache.com <http://royale.apache.com/> is the fastest way to get 
> there, we should start with that.

Here is nslookup for feathercast:

nslookup feathercast.apache.org
Server: 192.168.1.1
Address:192.168.1.1#53

Non-authoritative answer:
feathercast.apache.org  canonical name = feathercastapache.wordpress.com.
feathercastapache.wordpress.com canonical name = lb.wordpress.com.
Name:   lb.wordpress.com
Address: 192.0.78.12
Name:   lb.wordpress.com
Address: 192.0.78.13
.

This suggests that royaleapache would be the subdomain from WP.com 
<http://wp.com/>.

We may want this domain to be blog.royale.apache.org

> 2. We should look into getting a static version of the site, so the site can 
> be edited on Github and pushed to royale.apache.com 
> <http://royale.apache.com/>. That is more ideal than having private access to 
> a WordPress installation.
> 3. We should contact greatives and see if they would give us permission to 
> reuse the css and js for a static site. (possibly with attribution)
> 4. We should ask trademarks@ and/or legal@ whether the terms (assuming we get 
> them) are ok from an Apache perspective.

I think we should ask infrastructure and then possibly legal-discuss about any 
theme terms.

> 5. Assuming #4 and #5 work out, we will probably want various pieces of our 
> site constructed using this styling i.e. main site, docs, blog (as a 
> WordPress installation), examples.

Regards,
Dave

> 
> Harbs
> 
>> On Oct 24, 2017, at 8:56 PM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Dave,
>> 
>> I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we 
>> have the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
>> understand who owns the creative content.
>> 
>> Thoughts?
>> -Alex
>> 
>> From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
>> Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
>> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
>> To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
>> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
>> 
>> Hi Alex,
>> 
>> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui 
>> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:
>> 
>> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
>> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
>> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
>> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
>> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
>> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
>> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
>> outside of WP.
>> 
>> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
>> 
>> 
>> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
>> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
>> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
>> 
>> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if 
>> needed. For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org> we use the legacy html 
>> pulling out the title and content body and place it within a markdown 
>> template.
>> 
>> 
>> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
>> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
>> Is there a patch process for WP content?
>> 
>> Possibly.
>> 
>> 
>> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
>> 
>> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
>> simplified as we find the best way.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> -Alex
>> 
>> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, 
>> "carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of Carlos
>> Rovira" <carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of
>> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks Dave,
>> 
>> I'll write an email to

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Dave Fisher]

Hi Carlos,

> On Oct 24, 2017, at 11:09 AM, Carlos Rovira  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi Alex, Dave,
> 
> to create some Apps in Royale that conform to the actual theme is easy and
> while we make it with our own code it will be completly legal. This about a
> button. If we need to put a button that is equal to other button, we can
> create a CSS rule that makes that button looks almost equal to the other
> one, but with our own css classname. Being said that I think we don't need
> to create "try it now" app (for example) with the same branding, since is a
> tool inside, and you can see other similar efforts done by others (i.e:
> Typescript) where you are showing an app with a text editor and execution
> window. This should look as what it is...more like an editor of source code
> with pre and code tags and monospace fonts ;)
> 
> regarding the rest of the site. As we talked in the other thread with
> Harbs, we don't need to upload source code of the site (I talked in some
> occasions about the JIRA similarity, of a tool that we use but we don't
> need to expose or upload to some repo the source code). So people will want
> instead to generate some article, a post or an example (like
> flexexamples.org from Peter's blog that we want to make at some time for
> Royale). So we already want to give folks some easy tool to make this
> community effort possible. For me actual Apache CMS content is what we want
> to avoid, since is something cumbersome and at least for me made me does
> not work on this before.
> 
> With the path I propose, al people that wants to make something in the site
> will have a WP.com user with "EDITOR" profile that will allow them to
> create a post or a page and make some content.
> 
> To go live we regenerate the site and publish in the production url.
> 
> Hope you'll find this procedure ok? I think is the way more easy and will
> allow us to focus on what really matters: Apache Royale source code. At the
> end of the day, we don't want to spend more time in the web that absolutely
> needed since is not the product we develop.

Rather than republishing the whole site each time I would prefer that it be 
done as a diff. But that is a detail to work out later.

There may be parts of the site where we want the template to be the WP themed 
page with the content being something from the examples.

Regards,
Dave

> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2017-10-24 19:50 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher :
> 
>> Hi Alex,
>> 
>> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui  wrote:
>> 
>> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
>> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
>> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
>> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
>> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
>> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
>> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
>> outside of WP.
>> 
>> 
>> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
>> 
>> 
>> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
>> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
>> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
>> 
>> 
>> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if
>> needed. For OpenOffice.org we use the legacy html pulling out the title
>> and content body and place it within a markdown template.
>> 
>> 
>> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
>> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
>> Is there a patch process for WP content?
>> 
>> 
>> Possibly.
>> 
>> 
>> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
>> 
>> 
>> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will
>> get simplified as we find the best way.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> -Alex
>> 
>> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com on behalf of Carlos
>> Rovira" > carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks Dave,
>> 
>> I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
>> better to migrate to WP.com before continue working on content so we can
>> detect whatever issue we could get.
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Carlos
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher :
>> 
>> Hi Carlos,
>> 
>> On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
>> 
>> preview
>> 
>> site with success. I use this plugin :
>> 
>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
>> 

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Harbs]

I belive this is there web presence:
https://greatives.eu/ <https://greatives.eu/>

> On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:06 PM, Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> Hi Alex,
> 
> We will need to ask Carlos to list out all of the themes he uses and then we 
> will need to track things down and ask questions.
> 
> Here is the site for what looks like the main theme: 
> https://greatives.ticksy.com/ <https://greatives.ticksy.com/>
> 
> It is the Move Do theme.
> 
> Regards,
> Dave
> 
>> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:56 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID 
>> <mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Dave,
>> 
>> I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we 
>> have the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
>> understand who owns the creative content.
>> 
>> Thoughts?
>> -Alex
>> 
>> From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net 
>> <mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net><mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net 
>> <mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>>
>> Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org 
>> <mailto:dev@royale.apache.org><mailto:dev@royale.apache.org 
>> <mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>>
>> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
>> To: <dev@royale.apache.org 
>> <mailto:dev@royale.apache.org><mailto:dev@royale.apache.org 
>> <mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>>
>> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
>> 
>> Hi Alex,
>> 
>> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID 
>> <mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID><mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID 
>> <mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>>> wrote:
>> 
>> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
>> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
>> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
>> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
>> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
>> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
>> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
>> outside of WP.
>> 
>> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
>> 
>> 
>> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
>> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
>> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
>> 
>> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if 
>> needed. For OpenOffice.org <http://openoffice.org/><http://OpenOffice.org 
>> <http://openoffice.org/>> we use the legacy html pulling out the title and 
>> content body and place it within a markdown template.
>> 
>> 
>> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
>> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
>> Is there a patch process for WP content?
>> 
>> Possibly.
>> 
>> 
>> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
>> 
>> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
>> simplified as we find the best way.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> -Alex
>> 
>> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com>> on behalf of Carlos
>> Rovira" <carlos.rov...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com 
>> <mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com>> on behalf of
>> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com 
>> <mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com><mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com 
>> <mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com>>> wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks Dave,
>> 
>> I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
>> better to migrate to WP.com <http://wp.com/><http://WP.com <http://wp.com/>> 
>> before continue working on content so we can
>> detect whatever issue we could get.
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Carlos
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net 
>> <mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net><mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net 
>> <mailto:dave2w...@comc

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Harbs]

Here’s how I see things:

1. For the immediate, we want a good web presence. If putting the WordPress 
site on wordpress.com <http://wordpress.com/> with a CNAME entry pointing to 
royale.apache.com <http://royale.apache.com/> is the fastest way to get there, 
we should start with that.
2. We should look into getting a static version of the site, so the site can be 
edited on Github and pushed to royale.apache.com <http://royale.apache.com/>. 
That is more ideal than having private access to a WordPress installation.
3. We should contact greatives and see if they would give us permission to 
reuse the css and js for a static site. (possibly with attribution)
4. We should ask trademarks@ and/or legal@ whether the terms (assuming we get 
them) are ok from an Apache perspective.
5. Assuming #4 and #5 work out, we will probably want various pieces of our 
site constructed using this styling i.e. main site, docs, blog (as a WordPress 
installation), examples.

Harbs

> On Oct 24, 2017, at 8:56 PM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
> 
> Hi Dave,
> 
> I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we have 
> the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
> understand who owns the creative content.
> 
> Thoughts?
> -Alex
> 
> From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
> Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
> To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
> 
> Hi Alex,
> 
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui 
> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:
> 
> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
> outside of WP.
> 
> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
> 
> 
> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
> 
> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if 
> needed. For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org> we use the legacy html 
> pulling out the title and content body and place it within a markdown 
> template.
> 
> 
> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
> Is there a patch process for WP content?
> 
> Possibly.
> 
> 
> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
> 
> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
> simplified as we find the best way.
> 
> Regards,
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> -Alex
> 
> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, 
> "carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of Carlos
> Rovira" <carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of
> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com>> wrote:
> 
> Thanks Dave,
> 
> I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
> better to migrate to WP.com<http://WP.com> before continue working on content 
> so we can
> detect whatever issue we could get.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Carlos
> 
> 
> 
> 2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher 
> <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>:
> 
> Hi Carlos,
> 
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
> <carlosrov...@apache.org<mailto:carlosrov...@apache.org>>
> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
> preview
> site with success. I use this plugin :
> 
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
> s.org<http://s.org/>%2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f
> 08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033
> 702=RPTFT7Qq0bq1AKmh1fqnLuMJ0hWIpnrieARat1lz2bk%3D=0
> 
> and we can generate all static content with relative or absolute urls.
> The
> final preview site in static is 134mb
> 
> An

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Carlos Rovira]

Hi Alex, Dave,

to create some Apps in Royale that conform to the actual theme is easy and
while we make it with our own code it will be completly legal. This about a
button. If we need to put a button that is equal to other button, we can
create a CSS rule that makes that button looks almost equal to the other
one, but with our own css classname. Being said that I think we don't need
to create "try it now" app (for example) with the same branding, since is a
tool inside, and you can see other similar efforts done by others (i.e:
Typescript) where you are showing an app with a text editor and execution
window. This should look as what it is...more like an editor of source code
with pre and code tags and monospace fonts ;)

regarding the rest of the site. As we talked in the other thread with
Harbs, we don't need to upload source code of the site (I talked in some
occasions about the JIRA similarity, of a tool that we use but we don't
need to expose or upload to some repo the source code). So people will want
instead to generate some article, a post or an example (like
flexexamples.org from Peter's blog that we want to make at some time for
Royale). So we already want to give folks some easy tool to make this
community effort possible. For me actual Apache CMS content is what we want
to avoid, since is something cumbersome and at least for me made me does
not work on this before.

With the path I propose, al people that wants to make something in the site
will have a WP.com user with "EDITOR" profile that will allow them to
create a post or a page and make some content.

To go live we regenerate the site and publish in the production url.

Hope you'll find this procedure ok? I think is the way more easy and will
allow us to focus on what really matters: Apache Royale source code. At the
end of the day, we don't want to spend more time in the web that absolutely
needed since is not the product we develop.

Thanks






2017-10-24 19:50 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher :

> Hi Alex,
>
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui  wrote:
>
> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
> outside of WP.
>
>
> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
>
>
> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
>
>
> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if
> needed. For OpenOffice.org we use the legacy html pulling out the title
> and content body and place it within a markdown template.
>
>
> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
> Is there a patch process for WP content?
>
>
> Possibly.
>
>
> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
>
>
> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will
> get simplified as we find the best way.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
>
>
>
> Thanks,
> -Alex
>
> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com on behalf of Carlos
> Rovira"  carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks Dave,
>
> I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
> better to migrate to WP.com before continue working on content so we can
> detect whatever issue we could get.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Carlos
>
>
>
> 2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher :
>
> Hi Carlos,
>
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
>
> wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
>
> just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
>
> preview
>
> site with success. I use this plugin :
>
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
> s.org%2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f
> 08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033
> 702=RPTFT7Qq0bq1AKmh1fqnLuMJ0hWIpnrieARat1lz2bk%3D=0
>
>
> and we can generate all static content with relative or absolute urls.
>
> The
>
> final preview site in static is 134mb
>
> Another thing I was searching was to use a WP to Jekyll exporter but
>
> this
>
> is not what I wanted since it seems Jekyll is all about markdown and
>
> we
>
> want a full html site with all the eye candy JS+CSS resources. In the
>
> end,
>
> and thinking more about it, is not what we want since although the
>
> site
>
> 

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Dave Fisher]

Hi Alex,

We will need to ask Carlos to list out all of the themes he uses and then we 
will need to track things down and ask questions.

Here is the site for what looks like the main theme: 
https://greatives.ticksy.com/ <https://greatives.ticksy.com/>

It is the Move Do theme.

Regards,
Dave

> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:56 AM, Alex Harui <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
> 
> Hi Dave,
> 
> I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we have 
> the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
> understand who owns the creative content.
> 
> Thoughts?
> -Alex
> 
> From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
> Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
> To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
> Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site
> 
> Hi Alex,
> 
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui 
> <aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:
> 
> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
> outside of WP.
> 
> We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.
> 
> 
> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.
> 
> We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if 
> needed. For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org> we use the legacy html 
> pulling out the title and content body and place it within a markdown 
> template.
> 
> 
> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
> Is there a patch process for WP content?
> 
> Possibly.
> 
> 
> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.
> 
> It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
> simplified as we find the best way.
> 
> Regards,
> Dave
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> -Alex
> 
> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, 
> "carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of Carlos
> Rovira" <carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of
> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com>> wrote:
> 
> Thanks Dave,
> 
> I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
> better to migrate to WP.com<http://WP.com> before continue working on content 
> so we can
> detect whatever issue we could get.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Carlos
> 
> 
> 
> 2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher 
> <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>:
> 
> Hi Carlos,
> 
> On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
> <carlosrov...@apache.org<mailto:carlosrov...@apache.org>>
> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
> preview
> site with success. I use this plugin :
> 
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
> s.org<http://s.org/>%2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f
> 08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033
> 702=RPTFT7Qq0bq1AKmh1fqnLuMJ0hWIpnrieARat1lz2bk%3D=0
> 
> and we can generate all static content with relative or absolute urls.
> The
> final preview site in static is 134mb
> 
> Another thing I was searching was to use a WP to Jekyll exporter but
> this
> is not what I wanted since it seems Jekyll is all about markdown and
> we
> want a full html site with all the eye candy JS+CSS resources. In the
> end,
> and thinking more about it, is not what we want since although the
> site
> would be exported ok, we don't want to upload it to the GitHub pages
> like
> we discusses in the other thread due to expose part of the code of a
> commercial wp theme.
> 
> So, the workflow we can use is: Use the WP backend to enter new
> content
> and
> modify existing want with ease (this is important is we want people
> con

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Alex Harui]

Hi Dave,

I'm still wondering, even if we can see and reuse the CSS/JS/HTML, do we have 
the rights to replicate use of that look-and-feel elsewhere?  I don't 
understand who owns the creative content.

Thoughts?
-Alex

From: Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>
Reply-To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 at 10:50 AM
To: <dev@royale.apache.org<mailto:dev@royale.apache.org>>
Subject: Re: Apache Royale static web site

Hi Alex,

On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui 
<aha...@adobe.com.INVALID<mailto:aha...@adobe.com.INVALID>> wrote:

There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
outside of WP.

We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.


If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.

We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if needed. 
For OpenOffice.org<http://OpenOffice.org> we use the legacy html pulling out 
the title and content body and place it within a markdown template.


Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
Is there a patch process for WP content?

Possibly.


Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.

It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
simplified as we find the best way.

Regards,
Dave



Thanks,
-Alex

On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> 
on behalf of Carlos
Rovira" <carlos.rov...@gmail.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@gmail.com> on behalf of
carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com<mailto:carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com>> wrote:

Thanks Dave,

I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
better to migrate to WP.com<http://WP.com> before continue working on content 
so we can
detect whatever issue we could get.

Thanks!

Carlos



2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher 
<dave2w...@comcast.net<mailto:dave2w...@comcast.net>>:

Hi Carlos,

On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
<carlosrov...@apache.org<mailto:carlosrov...@apache.org>>
wrote:

Hi,

just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
preview
site with success. I use this plugin :

https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
s.org<http://s.org/>%2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f
08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033
702=RPTFT7Qq0bq1AKmh1fqnLuMJ0hWIpnrieARat1lz2bk%3D=0

and we can generate all static content with relative or absolute urls.
The
final preview site in static is 134mb

Another thing I was searching was to use a WP to Jekyll exporter but
this
is not what I wanted since it seems Jekyll is all about markdown and
we
want a full html site with all the eye candy JS+CSS resources. In the
end,
and thinking more about it, is not what we want since although the
site
would be exported ok, we don't want to upload it to the GitHub pages
like
we discusses in the other thread due to expose part of the code of a
commercial wp theme.

So, the workflow we can use is: Use the WP backend to enter new
content
and
modify existing want with ease (this is important is we want people
contributing here). Next, with all changes done, generate a static
version
and replace the entire site with a fresh generated static site at
royale.apache.org<http://royale.apache.org/>. and as well route the more 
friendly domain to this
if
board is ok with that.

Yes! External domain royalysdk.org<http://royalysdk.org/> is redirected to 
royale.apache.org<http://royale.apache.org/> as
discussed.


We can check with apache board or trademarks what they propose about
to
create a Wordpress.com<http://wordpress.com/> account managed by Apache and 
migrate from my
server
to that account, and all this stuff from there, since if I remember
some
people said that would be more ok with Apache.I'd end removing my temp
subdomain after this.

The advantage of using the Wordpress.com<http://wordpress.com/> location is 
twofold:

(1) Wordpress keeps security up to date.
(2) If something happens to you or your company then we have better
access.

I suspect though that with the statu

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Dave Fisher]

Hi Alex,

> On Oct 24, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Alex Harui  wrote:
> 
> There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
> will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
> right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
> to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
> be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
> don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
> commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
> outside of WP.

We need to examine the static export of the CSS and HTML.

> 
> If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
> use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
> as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.

We should be able to adapt. Site building in the CMS can get complex if needed. 
For OpenOffice.org we use the legacy html pulling out the title and content 
body and place it within a markdown template.

> 
> Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
> the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
> Is there a patch process for WP content?

Possibly.

> 
> Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.

It will get complex first as we figure out how to embed and then it will get 
simplified as we find the best way.

Regards,
Dave


> 
> Thanks,
> -Alex
> 
> On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com 
>  on behalf of Carlos
> Rovira"  on behalf of
> carlos.rov...@codeoscopic.com > wrote:
> 
>> Thanks Dave,
>> 
>> I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
>> better to migrate to WP.com before continue working on content so we can
>> detect whatever issue we could get.
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Carlos
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher :
>> 
>>> Hi Carlos,
>>> 
 On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
>>> wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
>>> preview
 site with success. I use this plugin :
 
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres 
>>> 
>>> s.org 
>>> %2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f
>>> 08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033
>>> 702=RPTFT7Qq0bq1AKmh1fqnLuMJ0hWIpnrieARat1lz2bk%3D=0
 
 and we can generate all static content with relative or absolute urls.
>>> The
 final preview site in static is 134mb
 
 Another thing I was searching was to use a WP to Jekyll exporter but
>>> this
 is not what I wanted since it seems Jekyll is all about markdown and
>>> we
 want a full html site with all the eye candy JS+CSS resources. In the
>>> end,
 and thinking more about it, is not what we want since although the
>>> site
 would be exported ok, we don't want to upload it to the GitHub pages
>>> like
 we discusses in the other thread due to expose part of the code of a
 commercial wp theme.
 
 So, the workflow we can use is: Use the WP backend to enter new
>>> content
>>> and
 modify existing want with ease (this is important is we want people
 contributing here). Next, with all changes done, generate a static
>>> version
 and replace the entire site with a fresh generated static site at
 royale.apache.org . and as well route the more 
 friendly domain to this
>>> if
 board is ok with that.
>>> 
>>> Yes! External domain royalysdk.org  is redirected to 
>>> royale.apache.org  as
>>> discussed.
>>> 
 
 We can check with apache board or trademarks what they propose about
>>> to
 create a Wordpress.com  account managed by Apache 
 and migrate from my
>>> server
 to that account, and all this stuff from there, since if I remember
>>> some
 people said that would be more ok with Apache.I'd end removing my temp
 subdomain after this.
>>> 
>>> The advantage of using the Wordpress.com  location 
>>> is twofold:
>>> 
>>> (1) Wordpress keeps security up to date.
>>> (2) If something happens to you or your company then we have better
>>> access.
>>> 
>>> I suspect though that with the status export method this will not be as
>>> great a concern.
>>> 
 
 What do you think? Can I move this with the people we were talking
>>> some
 weeks ago?
>>> 
>>> Either you or I can email Trademarks with the plan.
>>> 
>>> We can then discuss the redirection with Infrastructure 

Re: Apache Royale static web site

[Alex Harui]

There is something I don't think I understand.  AIUI, at some point, we
will want the Apache Royale site to include actual Royale applications,
right?  And I would think we would want the styling of those applications
to be consistent with the rest of the site.  So I'm not clear how we will
be able to implement the styling/theme of these Royale applications if we
don't have rights to the styling.  I don't understand how WP themes and
commercial licensing works if we want to replicate that user experience
outside of WP.

If we can use those visuals outside of WP, then why must we continue to
use WP to generate the site?  I would hope the theme would be implemented
as CSS and some templates we could use without WP.

Also, if someone wants to patch the site, they can't just offer a patch of
the HTML right?  They would need to figure out where in WP it comes from?
Is there a patch process for WP content?

Sorry if there is some basic thing I am missing.

Thanks,
-Alex

On 10/24/17, 10:19 AM, "carlos.rov...@gmail.com on behalf of Carlos
Rovira"  wrote:

>Thanks Dave,
>
>I'll write an email to trademarks to start with the process. I think is
>better to migrate to WP.com before continue working on content so we can
>detect whatever issue we could get.
>
>Thanks!
>
>Carlos
>
>
>
>2017-10-24 18:56 GMT+02:00 Dave Fisher :
>
>> Hi Carlos,
>>
>> > On Oct 24, 2017, at 9:30 AM, Carlos Rovira 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > just let you know that I tried to create an static version of the
>>preview
>> > site with success. I use this plugin :
>> > 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwordpres
>>s.org%2Fplugins%2Fsimply-static%2F=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f
>>08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033
>>702=RPTFT7Qq0bq1AKmh1fqnLuMJ0hWIpnrieARat1lz2bk%3D=0
>> >
>> > and we can generate all static content with relative or absolute urls.
>> The
>> > final preview site in static is 134mb
>> >
>> > Another thing I was searching was to use a WP to Jekyll exporter but
>>this
>> > is not what I wanted since it seems Jekyll is all about markdown and
>>we
>> > want a full html site with all the eye candy JS+CSS resources. In the
>> end,
>> > and thinking more about it, is not what we want since although the
>>site
>> > would be exported ok, we don't want to upload it to the GitHub pages
>>like
>> > we discusses in the other thread due to expose part of the code of a
>> > commercial wp theme.
>> >
>> > So, the workflow we can use is: Use the WP backend to enter new
>>content
>> and
>> > modify existing want with ease (this is important is we want people
>> > contributing here). Next, with all changes done, generate a static
>> version
>> > and replace the entire site with a fresh generated static site at
>> > royale.apache.org. and as well route the more friendly domain to this
>>if
>> > board is ok with that.
>>
>> Yes! External domain royalysdk.org is redirected to royale.apache.org as
>> discussed.
>>
>> >
>> > We can check with apache board or trademarks what they propose about
>>to
>> > create a Wordpress.com account managed by Apache and migrate from my
>> server
>> > to that account, and all this stuff from there, since if I remember
>>some
>> > people said that would be more ok with Apache.I'd end removing my temp
>> > subdomain after this.
>>
>> The advantage of using the Wordpress.com location is twofold:
>>
>> (1) Wordpress keeps security up to date.
>> (2) If something happens to you or your company then we have better
>>access.
>>
>> I suspect though that with the status export method this will not be as
>> great a concern.
>>
>> >
>> > What do you think? Can I move this with the people we were talking
>>some
>> > weeks ago?
>>
>> Either you or I can email Trademarks with the plan.
>>
>> We can then discuss the redirection with Infrastructure and get the site
>> checked in.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>>
>> >
>> > Let me know in order to start making the next steps
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Carlos Rovira
>> > 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%
>>2Fcarlosrovira=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1
>>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033702=1q5B1u1lLR
>>HGdnDh8VH9pkaTkdCPk51wt%2FCUJgzQo0c%3D=0
>>
>>
>
>
>-- 
>
>scopic.com=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b
>34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033702=Y%2Fkytu4lJUWu5H
>zinyiNAxCBpRGAfK3GFX9REzYNI%2F0%3D=0>
>
>Carlos Rovira
>
>Director General
>
>M: +34 607 22 60 05
>
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.codeos
>copic.com=02%7C01%7C%7Cb448363ee5984b3b3e0f08d51b0373f8%7Cfa7b1b5a7b3
>4438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636444624020033702=Y%2Fkytu4lJUWu5Hz