Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Thanks to all for the good-spirited sharing of your "mic for K3" tips. Very, very helpful. And I see that it prompted a few other queries on the topic. 73! KE1CY On Sun, Dec 4, 2016 at 11:06 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire <r...@cobi.biz> wrote: > Fun is whatever is fun for you. If a nice looking new microphone is it, go > for it! > > Half a century ago when microphones were still hand-made the more expensive > ones were significantly better than the cheap variety. Considerably more > labor went into assembling each element, and more elements failed to meet > specs and so had to be discarded or reworked. > > But these days microphone manufacturing is entirely automated and a machine > can crank out endless identically-performing high-quality elements in a > tiny > fraction of the time a human could. It's also why you can buy a > first-quality wristwatch at an absurdly low cost today. > > A really fine microphone element can be bought for under USD$5. > > The rest of the cost is in the case, chrome, stand, etc., just as the cost > of the wristwatch is in its case and band. In both cases, the cost can be > anything from reasonable to the absurd. It's all in what you want to spend. > > 73, Ron AC7AC > > -Original Message- > From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of > Bruce > Chadbourne > Sent: Sunday, December 4, 2016 6:24 AM > To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > Subject: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new) > > Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. > I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X > crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new > 'phone. > Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a > recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. > Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade > for > yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned mic(?). > 73 to all, Merry Christmas > Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message > delivered to r...@elecraft.com > > -- Bruce Chadbourne PgMP/BRMP 1034 W Beagle Run Loop Hernando, FL 34442 Office phone: 352-453-5456 If urgent, the best way to reach me is by phone. Thank you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
I've taken a number of old, cheap microphone housings (hamfest acquisitions), and inserted an inexpensive electret cartridge. Every one of them worked great! Truth is, I think you can probably buy most any electret cartridge and get it to do just fine. Some may be a bit more responsive than others, but I have yet to find one that doesn't do a good job. That way you can pick and choose what housing you like. All the Elecraft rigs provide the necessary bias right in the radios, so it is not a difficult bit of surgery. My favorite headset is the Yamaha CM-500, gut I've also successfully used various computer headsets that are even cheaper. You just don't need to spend a lot of money, unless you are looking for something special besides the mic element itself. When it comes to headsets, I'm more concerned about the headphone part. I've not had very good results from various Heils I have around here. Dave W7AQK __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
> That system applies a positive voltage in the > range of 18 - 48VDC through close-tolerance, equal value resistors to > the two sides of the balanced signal circuit (pins 2 and 3 of the > XL-connector) with return for DC going to the cable shield (Pin 1). While modern professional condenser mics use phantom power applied through high value resistors, the *original* connection was between the *center tap* of the audio console input transformer and shield of the cable. In those days a much higher current was required to power *tube preamplifiers*. 73, ... Joe, W4TV On 12/5/2016 12:32 AM, Jim Brown wrote: On Sun,12/4/2016 8:36 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: Ham microphones are the Electret type, pro-audio Condenser microphones are different. Yes, they are POWERED differently, but the vast majority (I'd guess 90%) of pro mics that are called condenser mics are electrets. BUT -- that powering system REQUIRES that they feed a balanced input and have "balanced phantom power." That system applies a positive voltage in the range of 18 - 48VDC through close-tolerance, equal value resistors to the two sides of the balanced signal circuit (pins 2 and 3 of the XL-connector) with return for DC going to the cable shield (Pin 1). The unbalanced electret mics we use in ham radio only require a positive voltage as bias for a FET-follower stage that transforms the very high output impedance of the capsule to an impedance low enough to drive mic inputs. The balanced outputs of pro electrets have an additional gain stage with an output impedance low enough to drive a long mic cable. 48V phantom is applied through 6.8K resistors; 18V phantom is applied through resistors of lower value. Virtually all pro mics will work with 48V, and most will work with 18V, but most non-electret condensers require 48V. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to li...@subich.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Bruce, i use a Shure 450 Series II and it works fine and you dont need the TXEQ or BIAS. Roger DL2YDP -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/Appropriate-Mic-for-K3-new-tp7624456p7624472.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
On Sun,12/4/2016 8:36 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: Ham microphones are the Electret type, pro-audio Condenser microphones are different. Yes, they are POWERED differently, but the vast majority (I'd guess 90%) of pro mics that are called condenser mics are electrets. BUT -- that powering system REQUIRES that they feed a balanced input and have "balanced phantom power." That system applies a positive voltage in the range of 18 - 48VDC through close-tolerance, equal value resistors to the two sides of the balanced signal circuit (pins 2 and 3 of the XL-connector) with return for DC going to the cable shield (Pin 1). The unbalanced electret mics we use in ham radio only require a positive voltage as bias for a FET-follower stage that transforms the very high output impedance of the capsule to an impedance low enough to drive mic inputs. The balanced outputs of pro electrets have an additional gain stage with an output impedance low enough to drive a long mic cable. 48V phantom is applied through 6.8K resistors; 18V phantom is applied through resistors of lower value. Virtually all pro mics will work with 48V, and most will work with 18V, but most non-electret condensers require 48V. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
I hesitate to refer to the common electret microphones as "condenser" mics. While many refer to the electret element microphones as "condenser" microphones, be aware that in the pro-audio world, "condenser" microphones are different - they usually require 48 volt Phantom Voltage. They may be similar in the basic element, but the implementation is different. An Electret mic element requires only a bias through a 5K to 10k resistor to the AF line. If you invest in a pro-audio "condenser" microphone, it will not work on the bias voltage designed for electret elements. Ham microphones are the Electret type, pro-audio Condenser microphones are different. 73, Don W3FPR On 12/4/2016 11:20 PM, Matt Zilmer wrote: *Piggybacking on Ron, since I couldn't find the original email. I use a Heil Goldline with H4 and H5 elements, and I have an MH3. I've used both and no one can tell the difference because of the TX EQ. I suspect Don's earlier reply is spot-on as well. You can tailor any modern mass-produced mic to your wishes with the EQ, and it should work quite well. This includes inexpensive condenser(electret) mics. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Hi Bruce, As others have noted, almost any mic that isn't "broke" can be made to sound very good with the TXEQ in your K3. Something like 8 years ago, a member of our contest club who is, like me, an audio professional, the Yamaha CM500 boom mic headset and introduced our club to it. I've used it ever since, and am quite happy with it. It's very comfortable to wear, both headphones and mic sound great with the radio. It plugs straight into the rear panel. A few tweaks and you're ready to go. Other very good SSB operators have recommended a competing model, the Koss SB-45, which is described as quite similar. FWIW, I always liked Turner mics for the paging systems that I maintained as a young engineer just starting out. A year or so ago, I prepared a tutorial on the topic of how to get good audio on the air. It's here. http://k9yc.com/ContestAudio.pdf 73, Jim K9YC On Sun,12/4/2016 6:24 AM, Bruce Chadbourne wrote: Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
*Piggybacking on Ron, since I couldn't find the original email. I use a Heil Goldline with H4 and H5 elements, and I have an MH3. I've used both and no one can tell the difference because of the TX EQ. I suspect Don's earlier reply is spot-on as well. You can tailor any modern mass-produced mic to your wishes with the EQ, and it should work quite well. This includes inexpensive condenser(electret) mics. 73, matt W6NIA On 12/4/2016 8:06 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Fun is whatever is fun for you. If a nice looking new microphone is it, go for it! Half a century ago when microphones were still hand-made the more expensive ones were significantly better than the cheap variety. Considerably more labor went into assembling each element, and more elements failed to meet specs and so had to be discarded or reworked. But these days microphone manufacturing is entirely automated and a machine can crank out endless identically-performing high-quality elements in a tiny fraction of the time a human could. It's also why you can buy a first-quality wristwatch at an absurdly low cost today. A really fine microphone element can be bought for under USD$5. The rest of the cost is in the case, chrome, stand, etc., just as the cost of the wristwatch is in its case and band. In both cases, the cost can be anything from reasonable to the absurd. It's all in what you want to spend. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bruce Chadbourne Sent: Sunday, December 4, 2016 6:24 AM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new) Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade for yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned mic(?). 73 to all, Merry Christmas Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to r...@elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to mzil...@roadrunner.com -- Always store beer in a dark place. - R. Heinlein Matt Zilmer, W6NIA [Shiraz] __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Fun is whatever is fun for you. If a nice looking new microphone is it, go for it! Half a century ago when microphones were still hand-made the more expensive ones were significantly better than the cheap variety. Considerably more labor went into assembling each element, and more elements failed to meet specs and so had to be discarded or reworked. But these days microphone manufacturing is entirely automated and a machine can crank out endless identically-performing high-quality elements in a tiny fraction of the time a human could. It's also why you can buy a first-quality wristwatch at an absurdly low cost today. A really fine microphone element can be bought for under USD$5. The rest of the cost is in the case, chrome, stand, etc., just as the cost of the wristwatch is in its case and band. In both cases, the cost can be anything from reasonable to the absurd. It's all in what you want to spend. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bruce Chadbourne Sent: Sunday, December 4, 2016 6:24 AM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new) Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade for yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned mic(?). 73 to all, Merry Christmas Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to r...@elecraft.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
I have a Heil HM-12. Inexpensive and good sound. Sent from my iPhone ...nr4c. bill > On Dec 4, 2016, at 9:24 AM, Bruce Chadbourne> wrote: > > Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. > I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X > crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new > 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a > recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. > Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade > for yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned > mic(?). > 73 to all, Merry Christmas > Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to n...@widomaker.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
I have 2 mics one on an old articulated lamp arm dynamic I bought at a surplus store. It was a cheep knock of of a shure SM58 cost me $4.00 get tons of good audio remarks. just makes me wonder why others need $300 condensers. Second and a popular one on K3 is the Yamaha CM500 headset with boom mic. good audio both listening and transmit.the truth is any comfortable computer headset with mic will work very well for you. the transmit EQ is your friend with any mic. David Moes VE3SD --- Original message --- Subject: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new) From: Bruce Chadbourne <bruce.chadbou...@gmail.com> To: <Elecraft@mailman.qth.net> Date: Sunday, 04/12/2016 9:25 AM Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade for yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned mic(?). 73 to all, Merry Christmas Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to dm...@nexicom.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Bruce, You'll get a ton of responses and most will be, "don't spend a lot"; most mics work fine with the K3's EQ. I do agree with Nate. I use a Kenwood 60A (keep preamp off) and do quite well. There are potential issues with RF, but the fix is pretty easy. Because there has been a bad reputation of RF issues with the mic, you can usually pick up used ones pretty inexpensively and if it hasn't been modified, it's an easy fix (15 min) to do so. Also, the same pinouts make the Kenwood mic a "plug and play." Joe W1GO > On Dec 4, 2016, at 09:24, Bruce Chadbournewrote: > > Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. > I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X > crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new > 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a > recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. > Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade > for yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned > mic(?). > 73 to all, Merry Christmas > Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net > __ > Elecraft mailing list > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm > Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html > Message delivered to w...@icloud.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Bruce, If you want to go really cheap, get a "computer" microphone, plug it into the back of the K3, turn on bias, turn the TX EQ two lowest bands down as far as they will go and the third band down 6dB. If you want some high frequency shaping, increase the highest 3 bands a bit. 73, Don W3FPR On 12/4/2016 9:24 AM, Bruce Chadbourne wrote: Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
For a desk mic I use a Kenwood MC-60A. It has some known issues and I did some work on it to quell some RFI though the best improvement was getting a good ground into the shack. It seems to work well. 73, Nate -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] Appropriate Mic for K3 (new)
Greetings - I've had my K3 for 5 years, mostly a CW and digital operator. I've never done much with my microphone - just repurposing an Turner454X crystal mic. I keep wondering if I'd be having more phun with a new 'phone. Without starting a holy war, perhaps a few of you could make a recommendation as to a specific slightly-better-than budget model. Better still, with Christmas coming, maybe you're eyeing a fancy upgrade for yourself and would like to sell me your modestly-priced pre-owned mic(?). 73 to all, Merry Christmas Bruce KE1CY @ arrl.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com