Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
And here I thought that these programs were used by some hams with a USB -- RS232 converter. :-) I really don't see any problem for a USB interface designer including a hub on the radio side of the USB interface and a USB -- RS232 chip on one port of the hub. Other ports of the hub would provide other USB interfaces which would appear separately on the computer. One could be a sound card interface, one a headphone interface etc. We still don't have USB in full generality to the radio, but we could have a useful number of devices for ham radio with one wire to the computer. Fred, K6DGW: I hear you comments about calling it wireless. Cheers - Bill, AE6JV (only 201 unread Elecraft list emails) On 11/10/12 at 1:31 AM, ftowns...@sbcglobal.net (Fred Townsend) wrote: MORE IMPORTANTLY, if you replace RS232 with either an interface or USB, you break the code of every ham radio program out there that uses an RS232 interface. That is not a trivial matter. It's still a shovel with a rope handle. --- Bill Frantz| Truth and love must prevail | Periwinkle (408)356-8506 | over lies and hate. | 16345 Englewood Ave www.pwpconsult.com | - Vaclav Havel | Los Gatos, CA 95032 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
Please see comments below: -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Brian Alsop Sent: Friday, November 09, 2012 4:26 AM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request On 11/9/2012 04:55, David G4DMP wrote: In a recent message, Gary Smith g...@ka1j.com writes I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. It would put the cost up, Gary. I understand that USB is like Dolby in that it is a proprietary protocol for which equipment designers would have to pay a premium. There is nothing proprietary about USB at all. It is a standard, not a protocol. This expense would consequently be passed to the customer. RS232 or its 9-pin equivalent is so much simpler. 73 de David G4DMP And should the desired USB be USB2 OR USB3? USB3 is supposed to be backwards compatible. However, USB port specs are apparently not frozen in design. I don't know what other meaning you give the word 'specification'. You either met the spec or you can not use the USB logo. Granted there some parts of the spec, like backward compatibility, that are 'musts' and other parts, like sourcing power, which are 'mays'. I think you miss some very import points. USB is a very general purpose computer bus with hundreds of thousands of applications. Why would you want to get burdened by compatibility issues when what you really want is an interface? MORE IMPORTANTLY, if you replace RS232 with either an interface or USB, you break the code of every ham radio program out there that uses an RS232 interface. That is not a trivial matter. It's still a shovel with a rope handle. 73 Fred, AE6QL Also note that the USB3 specs seem to imply that USB3 should be able to supply 1.5A (sometimes 6). Thus the K3 would most likely be required to supply this additional power. More cost and complexity. Plus the DC supply to the K3 would most likely have to be upgraded to provide this extra current. 73 de Brian/K3KO - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2441/5384 - Release Date: 11/09/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
Actually, in many cases a USB port is used in conjunction with a USB-Serial converter chip, like the FTDI series, precisely to allow a product to be accessed over USB without changing the serial protocol originally used over the RS232 interface. The USB interface is exposed to software on the PC via a virtual COM port, by means of the driver supplied by the USB-Serial port converter chip vendor. Existing programs continue to work just fine. I've done this for years at work, adding a USB port to our products using an FTDI converter chip which is demanded by those customers using laptops without an RS232 interface (and who do not want to mess around with outboard USB-Serial converter cables). In many cases the product retains the original RS232 interface with DB9 connector as well, so the device can be accessed one way or the other. The serial control protocol is unchanged. Even firmware updates are done over the USB interface, just as they were done over the RS232 interface. It's no big deal to do this if all you need to do is sustain an existing serial control protocol and PC software, rather than implement digital audio transport over the USB interface. Bob NW8L On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 01:31:11 -0800 Fred Townsend ftowns...@sbcglobal.net wrote: MORE IMPORTANTLY, if you replace RS232 with either an interface or USB, you break the code of every ham radio program out there that uses an RS232 interface. That is not a trivial matter. It's still a shovel with a rope handle. 73 Fred, AE6QL __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
Gary there are inline BlueTooth products that will work with your QC15. They are a bit pricie and hard to find. I know Sony made one. Be wary of the cell phone versions. There are not stereo. More comments below: -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gary Smith Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 9:51 PM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request Fred, Ah. What you say makes sense. I'm familiar with the Northbridge Southbridge chips but I don't know the limitations of hardware software with the K3. The North and South chips are intended for another purpose and totally impractical for use with the K3. I think TI and Atmel make single chip USB solutions that might work. The question then becomes how do you communicate with the USB chip and my guess would be I2C (yet another bus). I had high hopes that Yaesu was on track with their motorcycle radios but they turned out a miserable product. Someday somebody will figure it out. 73 Fred, AE6QL It really is nice to have no wire to the headphones and I use this setup whenever I use google to make free phone calls (Better acoustics on both end than my cell phone does) If I get up to do something 10' away I just leave the headphones on forget about them. The bose QC-15 are much more comfortable and the audio with the noise cancelling is impressive, I can't even hear the blower in my amp with them on. Still, they are tethered. Maybe I need to put some thought into how to run the K3 audio/mic functions through the computer and use that to hear the K3 with these wireless mics. 73, Gary KA1J Gary I can't speak for Elecraft but I really doubt you will ever see a USB port of the kind you want. Take a look at the third letter in USB. It stands for 'Bus'. In the PC there is a pretty good sized chip called the 'South Bridge' chip that de-multiplexes the bus. Sure you can do the job with other chips but it's not a trivial task. Then think of the software. Every USB device needs a driver so you would need to load a driver for your earphones. There is no hard disk so where are you going to store your drivers? In the end it becomes a shovel with rope handle. 73 Fred, AE6QL -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gary Smith Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 4:15 PM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request I don't know why my text was stripped but here it is again... --- I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. Although I far prefer my Bose Q-15 headphones, I've bought a pair of Logitech wireless headphones for use with my computer and they come with a boom mike. Yes, the Bose are infinitely better but the mic is this Logitech is excellent and they are stereo. They work great with the computer and being wireless, they would be ideal with the K3. There's a tiny dongle transmitter/receiver the headphones pair with which plugs into a usb port but alas, the only port for the K3 is the antiquated RS-232 port and mine is dedicated to connecting the K3 to my computer for my logging program via the serialUSB adapter. Any chance for some USB ports on the K3? Gary KA1J __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
On 11/9/2012 04:55, David G4DMP wrote: In a recent message, Gary Smith g...@ka1j.com writes I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. It would put the cost up, Gary. I understand that USB is like Dolby in that it is a proprietary protocol for which equipment designers would have to pay a premium. This expense would consequently be passed to the customer. RS232 or its 9-pin equivalent is so much simpler. 73 de David G4DMP And should the desired USB be USB2 OR USB3? USB3 is supposed to be backwards compatible. However, USB port specs are apparently not frozen in design. Also note that the USB3 specs seem to imply that USB3 should be able to supply 1.5A (sometimes 6). Thus the K3 would most likely be required to supply this additional power. More cost and complexity. Plus the DC supply to the K3 would most likely have to be upgraded to provide this extra current. 73 de Brian/K3KO - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2441/5384 - Release Date: 11/09/12 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
[Elecraft] K3 USB request
__ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
I don't know why my text was stripped but here it is again... --- I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. Although I far prefer my Bose Q-15 headphones, I've bought a pair of Logitech wireless headphones for use with my computer and they come with a boom mike. Yes, the Bose are infinitely better but the mic is this Logitech is excellent and they are stereo. They work great with the computer and being wireless, they would be ideal with the K3. There's a tiny dongle transmitter/receiver the headphones pair with which plugs into a usb port but alas, the only port for the K3 is the antiquated RS-232 port and mine is dedicated to connecting the K3 to my computer for my logging program via the serialUSB adapter. Any chance for some USB ports on the K3? Gary KA1J __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
Gary I can't speak for Elecraft but I really doubt you will ever see a USB port of the kind you want. Take a look at the third letter in USB. It stands for 'Bus'. In the PC there is a pretty good sized chip called the 'South Bridge' chip that de-multiplexes the bus. Sure you can do the job with other chips but it's not a trivial task. Then think of the software. Every USB device needs a driver so you would need to load a driver for your earphones. There is no hard disk so where are you going to store your drivers? In the end it becomes a shovel with rope handle. 73 Fred, AE6QL -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gary Smith Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 4:15 PM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request I don't know why my text was stripped but here it is again... --- I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. Although I far prefer my Bose Q-15 headphones, I've bought a pair of Logitech wireless headphones for use with my computer and they come with a boom mike. Yes, the Bose are infinitely better but the mic is this Logitech is excellent and they are stereo. They work great with the computer and being wireless, they would be ideal with the K3. There's a tiny dongle transmitter/receiver the headphones pair with which plugs into a usb port but alas, the only port for the K3 is the antiquated RS-232 port and mine is dedicated to connecting the K3 to my computer for my logging program via the serialUSB adapter. Any chance for some USB ports on the K3? Gary KA1J __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
In a recent message, Gary Smith g...@ka1j.com writes I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. It would put the cost up, Gary. I understand that USB is like Dolby in that it is a proprietary protocol for which equipment designers would have to pay a premium. This expense would consequently be passed to the customer. RS232 or its 9-pin equivalent is so much simpler. 73 de David G4DMP -- + - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - + | David M Pratt, Kippax, Leeds. | | Website: http://www.g4dmp.co.uk | + - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - + __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request
Fred, Ah. What you say makes sense. I'm familiar with the Northbridge Southbridge chips but I don't know the limitations of hardware software with the K3. It really is nice to have no wire to the headphones and I use this setup whenever I use google to make free phone calls (Better acoustics on both end than my cell phone does) If I get up to do something 10' away I just leave the headphones on forget about them. The bose QC-15 are much more comfortable and the audio with the noise cancelling is impressive, I can't even hear the blower in my amp with them on. Still, they are tethered. Maybe I need to put some thought into how to run the K3 audio/mic functions through the computer and use that to hear the K3 with these wireless mics. 73, Gary KA1J Gary I can't speak for Elecraft but I really doubt you will ever see a USB port of the kind you want. Take a look at the third letter in USB. It stands for 'Bus'. In the PC there is a pretty good sized chip called the 'South Bridge' chip that de-multiplexes the bus. Sure you can do the job with other chips but it's not a trivial task. Then think of the software. Every USB device needs a driver so you would need to load a driver for your earphones. There is no hard disk so where are you going to store your drivers? In the end it becomes a shovel with rope handle. 73 Fred, AE6QL -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gary Smith Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2012 4:15 PM To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB request I don't know why my text was stripped but here it is again... --- I would love for there to be a USB connection for the K3 without the serial to USB adapter. Although I far prefer my Bose Q-15 headphones, I've bought a pair of Logitech wireless headphones for use with my computer and they come with a boom mike. Yes, the Bose are infinitely better but the mic is this Logitech is excellent and they are stereo. They work great with the computer and being wireless, they would be ideal with the K3. There's a tiny dongle transmitter/receiver the headphones pair with which plugs into a usb port but alas, the only port for the K3 is the antiquated RS-232 port and mine is dedicated to connecting the K3 to my computer for my logging program via the serialUSB adapter. Any chance for some USB ports on the K3? Gary KA1J __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
