Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Lee I had exactly the same problem at FD this year. Before I illuminate the problem a little background. We were running 2A with additional GOTA and VHF stations. Last year the very noisy old 6KW generator puked a piston so it was time to retire it. We wanted a new generator that could be carried by one and quiet. We chose a Honda EU2000 thinking if we needed more capacity we could parallel it with a second generator. We set up each station with a 100ah battery with charger. The batteries would act as filters since the automotive chargers were totally without filtering or regulation. The batteries would act as power demand leveling as well since demand was expected to exceed 2KW with everyone key down. I was behind my K3 changing the unused antenna when my operating partner indicated the K3 had turned off. Thinking it was something I had done I circled around and turned the K3 back on. My partner resumed the contact but the K3 soon died again. A spin of K3 metering VFO2 dial showed 11VDC. I checked with our CW station who was still pounding brass. He indicated his Laptop had died so he was now paper logging. Finally we realized the generator had stopped. When refueling the generator it was cool indicating it had been off for some time. We had operated totally on batteries until the batteries started to fail, one by one. Conclusion: A little acoustical noise from the generator is a good thing. 73, Fred, AE6QL -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Lee Buller Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2012 7:16 PM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
* On 2012 25 Jun 14:43 -0500, Fred Townsend wrote: Conclusion: A little acoustical noise from the generator is a good thing. Heh! I was actually proposing the idea of an EU2000 or another quiet generator before next year's outing. Our current model is plenty loud and we've used batteries the past couple of years to preserve the peace in the park we operate FD from. Just how quiet is it? This year we did run the batteries down to where my K3 powered off and a third battery had to be pressed into service. Perhaps an LED lamp as an indicator that draws little current would provide an alert to the generator shutting down? 73, de Nate -- The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true. Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Rick I use Teflon wire for my battery leads. Teflon wire is silver plated. The Anderson power poles are silver plated too. While I can not quote chapter and verse most NASA applications require crimp (with certified crimper). There are at least two reasons. Solder wets and runs within silver braid very quickly so the solder runs into the insulated part of the wire and causes brittle fractures inside the insulation. Also the solder and flux can get into the power pole contact area and increase contact resistance. Flux has been known to flow out of solder connections years after installation. The flux flows when the contact heats. The two effects have been known to cause thermal runaway. Yes crimp is better than solder especially for high power DC. BTW most silver bearing solders the most common being Sn96Ag4 (not to be confused with silver solder) carry at most 4% silver. That doesn't offset the other 96% being a poorer conductor than copper. 73, Fred, AE6QL. -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Rick Bates Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2012 5:59 PM To: Ron D'Eau Claire Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED And if one uses silver based solder? Nope I don't and won't until I need to resupply; which will be quite a while from now. Rick wa6nhc Tiny iPhone keypad, sorry for typos On Jun 24, 2012, at 4:21 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire r...@cobi.biz wrote: Does anyone have actual measurements to indicate that one is *significantly* better than the other? Solder may not be as good a conductor as copper, but we're talking about a fraction of a millimeter of solder covering the entire mating surface of the cable and connector through which the current flows. IMX working on electronic systems we chose crimping over solder because crimping is faster than soldering. Even so, I have found that it is as easy to do a bad crimp job as it is to do a bad soldering job. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- A properly done crimp is better electrically than solder. For one thing, solder is not a very good conductor. A proper crimp is actually a weld joining the wire to the terminal. Sent from my iPad __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Sounds like you need to get an extended gas cap and tank for your EU2000 -- I have a 6-gallon boat tank hooked up to mine and it will run at full power output for well over 24 hours. With that setup you would fill it with gas at the start of the contest and just turn it off when you were done. At lower power demand levels it will run a couple of days without refiling the tank. Given the duty cycle of the rigs and the capacity of the battery, that generator must have been off for real long time to burn through a 100 AH battery. 73, Bob, WB4SON __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Every one should have one of these or another brand in their toolbox: http://www.amazon.com/GE-50542-Receptacle-Improper-Indicator/dp/B002LZTKIA/ref=pd_cp_hi_0 Aside from monitoring that AC is present it is a check that all the wiring and extensions were wired correctly. 73, Bob K2TK ex KN2TKR (1956) K2TKR On 6/25/2012 4:04 PM, Nate Bargmann wrote: Perhaps an LED lamp as an indicator that draws little current would provide an alert to the generator shutting down? 73, de Nate __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
As far as I know Teflon is a good insulator, capable of high temperatures and pressures. If you say teflon wire, you give it the false interpretation of being a conductor., like the guy that said solder was a poor conductor, really? I did volt drop tests , I have professional crimp sets and solder systems, being based in electrical trades for a living. A topend fluke MM told me that I achieved 0.15v better VD figures across the same cold weld (not weld), properly crimped connection for cable size and type. You will not minimise the volt drop to best achievable until soldered. Test @ 20 amps. A wet cloth wrap near the connection helps prevents solder run (capillary action) down the conductor/cable. A good ref here: http://www.virginiawind.com/tips/060801_01.asp On 25/06/2012 20:16, Fred Townsend wrote: Rick I use Teflon wire for my battery leads. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
and therefore have a slightly lower resistance than copper alone and since the power poles are silver plated as well, will not have any galvanic noise or corrosion. Teflon wire also solders easier than copper. Teflon insulation has both good and bad characteristics and is not approved for some NASA applications. 73, Fred -Original Message- From:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Adrian Sent: Monday, June 25, 2012 2:41 PM To:elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED As far as I know Teflon is a good insulator, capable of high temperatures and pressures. If you say teflon wire, you give it the false interpretation of being a conductor., like the guy that said solder was a poor conductor, really? I did volt drop tests , I have professional crimp sets and solder systems, being based in electrical trades for a living. A topend fluke MM told me that I achieved 0.15v better VD figures across the same cold weld (not weld), properly crimped connection for cable size and type. You will not minimise the volt drop to best achievable until soldered. Test @ 20 amps. A wet cloth wrap near the connection helps prevents solder run (capillary action) down the conductor/cable. A good ref here: http://www.virginiawind.com/tips/060801_01.asp On 25/06/2012 20:16, Fred Townsend wrote: Rick I use Teflon wire for my battery leads. __ Elecraft mailing list Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post:mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Apparently, based on the input here, I'm doing it all wrong by crimp and solder. But since I started that, I've not had a failure (back when Molex was king). Most times the actual connection is secured from motion (not vibration) while the tails are allowed to move, if needed. Yes, I use the proper crimp tool for the connector, but I doubt it is certified. Rick NHC -Original Message- From: Fred Townsend Rick I use Teflon wire for my battery leads. Teflon wire is silver plated. The Anderson power poles are silver plated too. While I can not quote chapter and verse most NASA applications require crimp (with certified crimper). There are at least two reasons. Solder wets and runs within silver braid very quickly so the solder runs into the insulated part of the wire and causes brittle fractures inside the insulation. Also the solder and flux can get into the power pole contact area and increase contact resistance. Flux has been known to flow out of solder connections years after installation. The flux flows when the contact heats. The two effects have been known to cause thermal runaway. Yes crimp is better than solder especially for high power DC. BTW most silver bearing solders the most common being Sn96Ag4 (not to be confused with silver solder) carry at most 4% silver. That doesn't offset the other 96% being a poorer conductor than copper. 73, Fred, AE6QL. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Hook a DMM up to the power pole connectors on the rig and do the load/no-load test to double chack the K3 numbers. Check the load/no- load voltage at the power supply as well. On 6/24/2012 12:06 AM, Lee Buller wrote: Well, the PS is a switcher...Astron ss-30. The voltage on the rig shows about 12.8 on Xmit with about 18.75 amps Nothing is hot. Wires. Connectors. Rig. PS. I am a little perturbed at the voltage drop on the ps. I would thing it would not drop that far, but I am not sure how accurate the meter in the K3 really is. Has not done it again. Never has it done it before either. Lee -- R. Kevin Stover AC0H ARRL FISTS #11993 SKCC #215 NAQCC #3441 __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
I have had similar problems which ended up being poor connections from the power supply, where crimped connections, like on the power poles are not making good contact. Now I solder all DC connections from power supply, if possible. Also, these poor connections lower the power/amps making it to the rig, causing strange problems. Good luck 73 Emory WM3M -Original Message- From: Lee Buller Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2012 10:16 PM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Recently, I built a new power cable...a shorter cable with automotive spade fuses. The Radio Shack Spade Fuse Holders are defective. Would not seat the fuse properly. Thus, the connection malfunctioned. I will be replacing those soon. Lee - K0WA From: Lee Buller k...@swbell.net To: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Sat, June 23, 2012 9:21:47 PM Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Glad you found it Lee! Many problems similar to this are caused by a bad crimp job on the Anderson connectors. I would encourage everyone to get the more expensive crimp tools with the right dies for the various amperage connectors used. Soldering is fine too but not needed if the cable is crimped properly. Mike W0MU W0MU-1 CC Cluster w0mu.net:23 or w0mu-1.dnsdynamic.com Http://www.w0mu.com On 6/24/2012 9:40 AM, Lee Buller wrote: Recently, I built a new power cable...a shorter cable with automotive spade fuses. The Radio Shack Spade Fuse Holders are defective. Would not seat the fuse properly. Thus, the connection malfunctioned. I will be replacing those soon. Lee - K0WA From: Lee Buller k...@swbell.net To: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Sat, June 23, 2012 9:21:47 PM Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
I do agree with Mike but to be safe I always solder. Murphy lives in my shack! 73, Tim Herrick, KQ8M Charter Member North Coast Contesters k...@kq8m.com K3 Serial #5934 AR-Cluster V6 kq8m.no-ip.org User Ports: 23, 7373 with local skimmer, 7374 without local skimmer Server Ports: V6 3607, V4 Active 3605, V4 Passive 3606 -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of W0MU Mike Fatchett Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2012 12:35 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED Glad you found it Lee! Many problems similar to this are caused by a bad crimp job on the Anderson connectors. I would encourage everyone to get the more expensive crimp tools with the right dies for the various amperage connectors used. Soldering is fine too but not needed if the cable is crimped properly. Mike W0MU W0MU-1 CC Cluster w0mu.net:23 or w0mu-1.dnsdynamic.com Http://www.w0mu.com On 6/24/2012 9:40 AM, Lee Buller wrote: Recently, I built a new power cable...a shorter cable with automotive spade fuses. The Radio Shack Spade Fuse Holders are defective. Would not seat the fuse properly. Thus, the connection malfunctioned. I will be replacing those soon. Lee - K0WA From: Lee Buller k...@swbell.net To: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Sat, June 23, 2012 9:21:47 PM Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
I am not a fan of Powerpole connectors, but use them for compatibility to other ham gear. I think they're better than Molex (as an example) but they are not mechanically secure enough (no locking tab) without adding an external piece (I tape the crap out of the attached connectors). For high current items (greater than a few amps), I crimp with the proper tool AND solder (pre-tinning the wire). One is a mechanical connection, the other is electrical; either should work; together is insurance. No I don't wear a belt and suspenders (are they still available?); but try to beat Murphy at his own game every chance I get. If I EVER get my hands on him... :o) 73, Rick wa6nhc -Original Message- From: W0MU Mike Fatchett Many problems similar to this are caused by a bad crimp job on the Anderson connectors. I would encourage everyone to get the more expensive crimp tools with the right dies for the various amperage connectors used. Soldering is fine too but not needed if the cable is crimped properly. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Absolutely. I bought a power cable from West Mountain and one of the leads (the red one) just fell out of the crimp connector. So much for trusting the professional. I do all of my crimps now and do not solder any. I use the best crimp tool. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2012, at 11:34 AM, W0MU Mike Fatchett w...@w0mu.com wrote: Glad you found it Lee! Many problems similar to this are caused by a bad crimp job on the Anderson connectors. I would encourage everyone to get the more expensive crimp tools with the right dies for the various amperage connectors used. Soldering is fine too but not needed if the cable is crimped properly. Mike W0MU W0MU-1 CC Cluster w0mu.net:23 or w0mu-1.dnsdynamic.com Http://www.w0mu.com On 6/24/2012 9:40 AM, Lee Buller wrote: Recently, I built a new power cable...a shorter cable with automotive spade fuses. The Radio Shack Spade Fuse Holders are defective. Would not seat the fuse properly. Thus, the connection malfunctioned. I will be replacing those soon. Lee - K0WA From: Lee Buller k...@swbell.net To: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Sat, June 23, 2012 9:21:47 PM Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
A properly done crimp is better electrically than solder. For one thing, solder is not a very good conductor. A proper crimp is actually a weld joining the wire to the terminal. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2012, at 1:13 PM, Rick Bates happymooseph...@gmail.com wrote: I am not a fan of Powerpole connectors, but use them for compatibility to other ham gear. I think they're better than Molex (as an example) but they are not mechanically secure enough (no locking tab) without adding an external piece (I tape the crap out of the attached connectors). For high current items (greater than a few amps), I crimp with the proper tool AND solder (pre-tinning the wire). One is a mechanical connection, the other is electrical; either should work; together is insurance. No I don't wear a belt and suspenders (are they still available?); but try to beat Murphy at his own game every chance I get. If I EVER get my hands on him... :o) 73, Rick wa6nhc -Original Message- From: W0MU Mike Fatchett Many problems similar to this are caused by a bad crimp job on the Anderson connectors. I would encourage everyone to get the more expensive crimp tools with the right dies for the various amperage connectors used. Soldering is fine too but not needed if the cable is crimped properly. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Does anyone have actual measurements to indicate that one is *significantly* better than the other? Solder may not be as good a conductor as copper, but we're talking about a fraction of a millimeter of solder covering the entire mating surface of the cable and connector through which the current flows. IMX working on electronic systems we chose crimping over solder because crimping is faster than soldering. Even so, I have found that it is as easy to do a bad crimp job as it is to do a bad soldering job. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- A properly done crimp is better electrically than solder. For one thing, solder is not a very good conductor. A proper crimp is actually a weld joining the wire to the terminal. Sent from my iPad __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
What does the maritime industry use? Anyone work at Boeing who can tell me why they (I think) crimp instead of solder? I thought I remembered that it's because crimps are stronger over the long-term under vibration. I could be making it all up. I'm just curious if there's a reason or if people are just talking for the sake of talking. I've had lots more solder joints fail than crimps, but I've had crimps fail too. On Sun, 24 Jun 2012, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Does anyone have actual measurements to indicate that one is *significantly* better than the other? Solder may not be as good a conductor as copper, but we're talking about a fraction of a millimeter of solder covering the entire mating surface of the cable and connector through which the current flows. IMX working on electronic systems we chose crimping over solder because crimping is faster than soldering. Even so, I have found that it is as easy to do a bad crimp job as it is to do a bad soldering job. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- A properly done crimp is better electrically than solder. For one thing, solder is not a very good conductor. A proper crimp is actually a weld joining the wire to the terminal. Sent from my iPad __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Hisashi T Fujinaka - ht...@twofifty.com BSEE(6/86) + BSChem(3/95) + BAEnglish(8/95) + MSCS(8/03) + $2.50 = latte __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
You've hit on why the auto industry uses crimp also (probably because of cost as much as anything too). When a wire is soldered, a bit of the solder tins up the wire strands and vibration or flexing can quickly cause the wire to break and negate the reason we use stranded wire in the first place. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2012, at 6:55 PM, Hisashi T Fujinaka ht...@twofifty.com wrote: What does the maritime industry use? Anyone work at Boeing who can tell me why they (I think) crimp instead of solder? I thought I remembered that it's because crimps are stronger over the long-term under vibration. I could be making it all up. I'm just curious if there's a reason or if people are just talking for the sake of talking. I've had lots more solder joints fail than crimps, but I've had crimps fail too. On Sun, 24 Jun 2012, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Does anyone have actual measurements to indicate that one is *significantly* better than the other? Solder may not be as good a conductor as copper, but we're talking about a fraction of a millimeter of solder covering the entire mating surface of the cable and connector through which the current flows. IMX working on electronic systems we chose crimping over solder because crimping is faster than soldering. Even so, I have found that it is as easy to do a bad crimp job as it is to do a bad soldering job. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- A properly done crimp is better electrically than solder. For one thing, solder is not a very good conductor. A proper crimp is actually a weld joining the wire to the terminal. Sent from my iPad __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Hisashi T Fujinaka - ht...@twofifty.com BSEE(6/86) + BSChem(3/95) + BAEnglish(8/95) + MSCS(8/03) + $2.50 = latte __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
Crimps are good if they are properly done with proper sized terminals and proper crimping tools for that type and size of terminal - there is no one size fits all crimping tool, and I believe there lies the problem with amateurs using crimped terminals - buying the proper crimping tool for each and every crimp terminal would be prohibitively expensive. Yes, there are consumer grade universalcrimping tools and terminals, but they grip the wire over only a short distance - professional crimps will make solid contact with the wire over a larger area, and will be a gas-tight connection where corrosion cannot get in. I believe soldering is a better alternative for amateur work. Soldering does have one disadvantage and that is solder will be wicked up the stranded wire for a small distance, AND if the wire is subject to vibration at that point, the wire will eventually break right where the wicked solder ends (under the insulation where that break cannot be immediately noticed). So in high vibration environments such as avionics, soldering is a definite no-no, but at the home station installation where the wires are seldom moved, soldering should be just as good or better than properly crimped terminals. In your mobile installations, you might want to consider either crimping or supporting the wire for about 3 inches away from the soldered terminal. 73, Don W3FPR On 6/24/2012 7:55 PM, Hisashi T Fujinaka wrote: What does the maritime industry use? Anyone work at Boeing who can tell me why they (I think) crimp instead of solder? I thought I remembered that it's because crimps are stronger over the long-term under vibration. I could be making it all up. I'm just curious if there's a reason or if people are just talking for the sake of talking. I've had lots more solder joints fail than crimps, but I've had crimps fail too. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
I agree about the inexpensive crimping tools...possibly not about prohibitively expensive. A small array of adequate crimping tools can cost several hundred dollars which I don't think is too much when you consider the money spent on just one high end transceiver. I think those flat plate crimpers you see in the automotive department at the hardware store ought to be outlawed from the hamshack. Sent from my iPad On Jun 24, 2012, at 7:19 PM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote: Crimps are good if they are properly done with proper sized terminals and proper crimping tools for that type and size of terminal - there is no one size fits all crimping tool, and I believe there lies the problem with amateurs using crimped terminals - buying the proper crimping tool for each and every crimp terminal would be prohibitively expensive. Yes, there are consumer grade universalcrimping tools and terminals, but they grip the wire over only a short distance - professional crimps will make solid contact with the wire over a larger area, and will be a gas-tight connection where corrosion cannot get in. I believe soldering is a better alternative for amateur work. Soldering does have one disadvantage and that is solder will be wicked up the stranded wire for a small distance, AND if the wire is subject to vibration at that point, the wire will eventually break right where the wicked solder ends (under the insulation where that break cannot be immediately noticed). So in high vibration environments such as avionics, soldering is a definite no-no, but at the home station installation where the wires are seldom moved, soldering should be just as good or better than properly crimped terminals. In your mobile installations, you might want to consider either crimping or supporting the wire for about 3 inches away from the soldered terminal. 73, Don W3FPR On 6/24/2012 7:55 PM, Hisashi T Fujinaka wrote: What does the maritime industry use? Anyone work at Boeing who can tell me why they (I think) crimp instead of solder? I thought I remembered that it's because crimps are stronger over the long-term under vibration. I could be making it all up. I'm just curious if there's a reason or if people are just talking for the sake of talking. I've had lots more solder joints fail than crimps, but I've had crimps fail too. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
And if one uses silver based solder? Nope I don't and won't until I need to resupply; which will be quite a while from now. Rick wa6nhc Tiny iPhone keypad, sorry for typos On Jun 24, 2012, at 4:21 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire r...@cobi.biz wrote: Does anyone have actual measurements to indicate that one is *significantly* better than the other? Solder may not be as good a conductor as copper, but we're talking about a fraction of a millimeter of solder covering the entire mating surface of the cable and connector through which the current flows. IMX working on electronic systems we chose crimping over solder because crimping is faster than soldering. Even so, I have found that it is as easy to do a bad crimp job as it is to do a bad soldering job. 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- A properly done crimp is better electrically than solder. For one thing, solder is not a very good conductor. A proper crimp is actually a weld joining the wire to the terminal. Sent from my iPad __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off - SOLVED
I have been told, sometimes by reliable sources, that proper crimping actually pressure welds the contact to the copper wire. Soldering on the other hand heats the copper to around 750F and it then cools fairly fast which hardens it. Then, under vibration, it fatigues and breaks. I've heard this said about soldering dipole connections too. I can tell you that NASA crimped [very carefully] and did not solder on the Apollo program. 73, Fred K6DGW - Northern California Contest Club - CU in the 2012 Cal QSO Party 6-7 Oct 2012 - www.cqp.org On 6/24/2012 4:55 PM, Hisashi T Fujinaka wrote: What does the maritime industry use? Anyone work at Boeing who can tell me why they (I think) crimp instead of solder? I thought I remembered that it's because crimps are stronger over the long-term under vibration. I could be making it all up. I'm just curious if there's a reason or if people are just talking for the sake of talking. I've had lots more solder joints fail than crimps, but I've had crimps fail too. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Is the power supply voltage dropping too low(below the threshold)? John N1JM -- View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-just-goes-off-tp7558040p7558041.html Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Loose connection in the supply line will do that. It only takes a momentary open to shut the K3 down until the POWER button is reset. Do you have a fuse in the supply line? Fuses often fail that way. Even running within their spec, they get warm in use. A defective fuse may open circuit from the heat and, when you cycle the power supply again, it has cooled and reconnected the circuit. Such a fuse will fail completely before long, but some will act that way for a while. If you are at a FD field site, severe RF feedback can result in unintended commands to the uP in the K3, which might include an OFF command. Just a few that come to mind. Hope you find it soon or it doesn't interfere with your FD score! 73, Ron AC7AC -Original Message- This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Any chance that the adjustable current limit (if you have that) on your power supply is set a bit too low? 73, Dale WA8SRA On 6/23/2012 10:16 PM, Lee Buller wrote: This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off
Well, the PS is a switcher...Astron ss-30. The voltage on the rig shows about 12.8 on Xmit with about 18.75 amps Nothing is hot. Wires. Connectors. Rig. PS. I am a little perturbed at the voltage drop on the ps. I would thing it would not drop that far, but I am not sure how accurate the meter in the K3 really is. Has not done it again. Never has it done it before either. Lee From: Lee Buller k...@swbell.net To: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Sat, June 23, 2012 9:21:47 PM Subject: [Elecraft] K3 just goes off This has not happened to me before Running some FD here on CW for about an hour in an AC room PA 35C FP 31C The rig just went off. Dead. Power supply is ON. Pressed the power buttoncomes back on. Anyone see this beforeI have not. Lee In our day and age it seems that Common Sense is in short supply. If you don't have any Common Sense - get some Common Sense and use it. If you can't find any Common Sense, ask for help from somebody who has some Common Sense. Is Common Sense divine? Common Sense is the image of the Creator expressing revealed truth in my mind. - John W. (Kansas) Never interfere with anything that isn't bothering you. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
