Re: Sound Engineering Practice
Tongue-In-Check Answer: Sound Engineering Practice never makes a mistake. Practical Answer: Perform a risk analysis and fix any hazards. Remember that the risk analysis covers intended and unintended uses and normal and abnormal conditions. In the United States, the signature of a Professional Engineer on the drawings is usually accepted by a Court that sound engineering practices were followed. I think that is true in Europe, but I do not have personal knowledge of that. Best Regards Bob Schlentz appro...@minn.net --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
RE: Sound Engineering Practice
John, mind-enhancing substances: Is the caffeine in coffee (or tea or carbonated beverages) a mind-enhancing substance? IF SO where would many engineers be without it?! Program managers would be very upset if engineers were no longer able to operate under the influence of caffeine! Many light night / early am trouble shooting sessions at the OATS have been fueled by caffeine. In addition to design efforts... Have a good Friday chuckle! Daren A. Nerad EMC Engineer 815.226.6123 -Original Message- From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 4:47 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: Sound Engineering Practice I read in !emc-pstc that lcr...@tuvam.com wrote (in 3187EE460C488A458D4 dc186f40edc21049...@exchdan.us.tuvworld.com) about 'Sound Engineering Practice', on Thu, 6 Sep 2001: I am struggling with one of those darned European directives, the pressure equipment directive. One aspect of conformance is dependent on the application of Sound Engineering Practice. Does anyone have a practical or authoritative definition of Sound Engineering Practice?. It's and idea that easy often thrown about, but it seem very hard to define. Sure, it's a catch-all in cases where the engineering is more an art than a science (i.e. more than seven independent variables!). It's 'what you see in well-designed products'. For example, where you can't design something by using recognized mathematical methods, you base your design on previously successful ones, not on dimensions, etc. revealed to you under the influence of mind-enhancing substances. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Eat mink and be dreary! --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server. --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
RE: Sound Engineering Practice
Lauren, I spend a significant part of my free time working with mobile pressure vessels. As a steam railway locomotive fireman and repairer, I have to rely, for my continued well-being, on sound engineering practice. This has been developed over the last 200 years, often learning from some spectacular failures. When we rebuild a boiler, it is subjected to detailed third party inspection and proof testing before we can obtain insurance cover to use the loco. Every year, a boiler inspector comes to perform a repeat inspection and safety test, so that we can continue for the next year. Sometimes this involves an ultrasound test for plate corrosion. After ten years, all the fire-tubes are removed and any suspect plates or stays replaced. This is in addition to the visual inspection I perform before lighting the fire at the start of the day. The sound engineering practice relies not only on the original plate thickness and rivet spacing, but also on regular maintenance, inspection and testing throughout the working life of the pressure vessel. A combination of good original design followed by regular verification, with the bottom line being the ability to satisfy an insurance company's inspector. Best regards, Geoff Lister Senior Engineer Motion Media Technology Ltd., Bristol, UK. http://www.motion-media.com http://www.motion-media.com/ -Original Message- From: lcr...@tuvam.com [mailto:lcr...@tuvam.com] Sent: 06 September 2001 21:35 To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Sound Engineering Practice I am struggling with one of those darned European directives, the pressure equipment directive. One aspect of conformance is dependent on the application of Sound Engineering Practice. Does anyone have a practical or authoritative definition of Sound Engineering Practice?. It's and idea that easy often thrown about, but it seem very hard to define. Thanks for any ideas Lauren Crane TUV Product Service
Re: Sound Engineering Practice
In the case of the PED, it's specifically defined (although I can't remember where just now, and don't have time to look). In this context, SEP is intended to mean the national practice/standards of a member state prior to the implementation of harmonised standards for pressure equipment. In the UK, that would be PD5500, but (of likely more relevance to you) my understanding is that it also means the ASME pressure vessel codes. Drop me a line if you need more help. regards Nick. At 16:35 -0400 6/9/2001, lcr...@tuvam.com wrote: I am struggling with one of those darned European directives, the pressure equipment directive. One aspect of conformance is dependent on the application of Sound Engineering Practice. Does anyone have a practical or authoritative definition of Sound Engineering Practice?. It's and idea that easy often thrown about, but it seem very hard to define. Thanks for any ideas Lauren Crane TUV Product Service --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: Sound Engineering Practice
I read in !emc-pstc that lcr...@tuvam.com wrote (in 3187EE460C488A458D4 dc186f40edc21049...@exchdan.us.tuvworld.com) about 'Sound Engineering Practice', on Thu, 6 Sep 2001: I am struggling with one of those darned European directives, the pressure equipment directive. One aspect of conformance is dependent on the application of Sound Engineering Practice. Does anyone have a practical or authoritative definition of Sound Engineering Practice?. It's and idea that easy often thrown about, but it seem very hard to define. Sure, it's a catch-all in cases where the engineering is more an art than a science (i.e. more than seven independent variables!). It's 'what you see in well-designed products'. For example, where you can't design something by using recognized mathematical methods, you base your design on previously successful ones, not on dimensions, etc. revealed to you under the influence of mind-enhancing substances. -- Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Eat mink and be dreary! --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Re: Sound Engineering Practice
Hi Lauren: Does anyone have a practical or authoritative definition of Sound Engineering Practice?. The key word is sound. Presumably we all know what engineering practice is. I checked Merriam-Webster's on-line Collegiate Dictionary and found the following definition. The 3rd definition would seem to apply in this case. Main Entry: sound Pronunciation: 'saund Function: adjective Etymology: Middle English, from Old English gesund; akin to Old High German gisunt healthy Date: 13th century 1 a : free from injury or disease : exhibiting normal health b : free from flaw, defect, or decay sound timber 2 : SOLID, FIRM; also : STABLE 3 a : free from error, fallacy, or misapprehension sound reasoning b : exhibiting or based on thorough knowledge and experience sound scholarship c : legally valid a sound title d : logically valid and having true premises e : agreeing with accepted views : ORTHODOX 4 a : THOROUGH b : deep and undisturbed a sound sleep c : HARD, SEVERE a sound whipping 5 : showing good judgment or sense synonym see HEALTHY, VALID Presumably, all engineering practice (at least by the subscribers of this forum) is (or should be) sound. Indeed, I suggest that sound engineering is nearly a tautology. (Look that up in your dictionary!) Given the definition, I would suggest that the determination of whether a design represents sound engineering practice will be in the eyes of the regulator, not in the eyes of the designer. Its a lose-win situation. You lose, the regulator wins. You do the best job you can to soundly design the product in accordance with the standard. This may mean that the designer should get up from his chair and take specific actions in regard of 3a, 3b, 3d, and 3e of the definition. You said, One aspect of conformance is dependent on the application of Sound Engineering Practice. I think it is smoke. The statement would be nonsense without the word sound. Its a weasel-word that says the standard doesn't cover everything. Which they could not say. Best regards, Rich --- This message is from the IEEE EMC Society Product Safety Technical Committee emc-pstc discussion list. Visit our web site at: http://www.ewh.ieee.org/soc/emcs/pstc/ To cancel your subscription, send mail to: majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc For help, send mail to the list administrators: Michael Garretson:pstc_ad...@garretson.org Dave Healddavehe...@mediaone.net For policy questions, send mail to: Richard Nute: ri...@ieee.org Jim Bacher: j.bac...@ieee.org All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: No longer online until our new server is brought online and the old messages are imported into the new server.
Sound Engineering Practice
I am struggling with one of those darned European directives, the pressure equipment directive. One aspect of conformance is dependent on the application of Sound Engineering Practice. Does anyone have a practical or authoritative definition of Sound Engineering Practice?. It's and idea that easy often thrown about, but it seem very hard to define. Thanks for any ideas Lauren Crane TUV Product Service
