Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On 5/7/2015 3:52 PM, Viesturs Lācis wrote: 2015-05-08 0:38 GMT+03:00 andy pugh bodge...@gmail.com: On 7 May 2015 at 22:31, Viesturs Lācis viesturs.la...@gmail.com wrote: but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. Does the sanding machine exist? One option might be to drop the sanding drum underneath the wood on the return pass. It does not exist yet, but they need something big, approximately like this: https://www.google.lv/search?q=SANDHYA+900rlz=1C1LENP_enLV616LV616es_sm=93source=lnmstbm=ischsa=Xei=A95LVYajCaTkyAOjx4GwCQved=0CAcQ_AUoAQbiw=1407bih=780#tbm=ischq=SANDYA+900nfpr=1imgrc=xhDvGEpPzcCvhM%253A%3BpNwp_Hw5nndubM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fpartners.scmgroup.com%252Fmedia%252Fuserfiles%252Ffile%252Fsuper%252520finitore%252520zoom.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fpartners.scmgroup.com%252Fgatech%252Fproducts.asp%253Fp%253D11965%3B770%3B1155 This one in the picture is one of the potential machines with 3 sanding belts (because they need to remove up to 1 mm from the thickness of the plate). So there is no option of dropping the drum below. Theoretically I could get a job of building the sanding machine (and place a sanding belts also for bottom side), but I feel that there are too much technical details about the whole process that I should know for successful result, so I lean towards skipping such an endeavor and build only the conveyor and the unit that turns the plates over. I'd want a machine that can sand both sides in a single pass. Use textured metal rollers on the infeed and rubber rollers on the outfeed. Instead of doing the bulk of the removal with sandpaper, look into indexable carbide insert planer drums. They use multiple helical rows of inserts, offset to cover the whole surface. If an insert gets chipped just rotate or replace it. Much less down time than pulling, sharpening or replacing then re-setting a long knife. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
2015-05-08 3:12 GMT+03:00 Kirk Wallace kwall...@wallacecompany.com: Maybe? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9NODBXqfNI Awesome, thank you very much!!! An existing example of something like this is exactly what I was looking for - looks simple, doable and would help to move the plates sideways to return conveyor, so that it can be loaded in sander from the input side. Viesturs -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 5:52 PM, Viesturs Lācis viesturs.la...@gmail.com wrote: 2015-05-08 0:38 GMT+03:00 andy pugh bodge...@gmail.com: On 7 May 2015 at 22:31, Viesturs Lācis viesturs.la...@gmail.com wrote: but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. Does the sanding machine exist? One option might be to drop the sanding drum underneath the wood on the return pass. It does not exist yet, but they need something big, approximately like this: https://www.google.lv/search?q=SANDHYA+900rlz=1C1LENP_enLV616LV616es_sm=93source=lnmstbm=ischsa=Xei=A95LVYajCaTkyAOjx4GwCQved=0CAcQ_AUoAQbiw=1407bih=780#tbm=ischq=SANDYA+900nfpr=1imgrc=xhDvGEpPzcCvhM%253A%3BpNwp_Hw5nndubM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fpartners.scmgroup.com%252Fmedia%252Fuserfiles%252Ffile%252Fsuper%252520finitore%252520zoom.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fpartners.scmgroup.com%252Fgatech%252Fproducts.asp%253Fp%253D11965%3B770%3B1155 This one in the picture is one of the potential machines with 3 sanding belts (because they need to remove up to 1 mm from the thickness of the plate). So there is no option of dropping the drum below. Theoretically I could get a job of building the sanding machine (and place a sanding belts also for bottom side), but I feel that there are too much technical details about the whole process that I should know for successful result, so I lean towards skipping such an endeavor and build only the conveyor and the unit that turns the plates over. Viesturs Damn! Wouldna mind havin' one a them in my shop![?] -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On 7 May 2015, at 22:31, Viesturs Lācis wrote: Hello! I built some pretty large gluing press for a customer. Here are 2 pics of it during the build. Here is the whole rotating platform (5m long, 1,6m wide): http://picpaste.com/IMG_20150403_140923-6uIvoq8i.jpg Here is some material loaded in it: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20150324_185227-meOk5ilU.jpg It can glue together wood plates of size up to 5000x1200x60 mm (max weight can reach 200+ kg, depending on particular wood used). The thing is that those plates need to be sanded from both sides to get smooth surface, but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. There are large sanding machines to sand both sides of a door simultaneously, and those are available commercially. They are called dual drum sanders. Maybe the manufacturers of those have larger machines, or could make a larger machine, if you don't want that job? The doors go into the machine as if they were a letter being posted into a letterbox, so the flat surfaces face up and down. Marcus Can anyone share some pics or suggestions on what would best practice to do so? I believe that somebody somewhere already must have faced this kind of issue. I am not sure that my current ideas about cylindrical structure, which has an opening at one end to move the plate in and out is the best solution for this task. Any viable suggestions will be appreciated :) Viesturs -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On 8 May 2015 at 01:12, Kirk Wallace kwall...@wallacecompany.com wrote: Maybe? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9NODBXqfNI Belts on the arms that are red in that version could easily return the panel to the starting position. -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On 05/07/2015 02:31 PM, Viesturs Lācis wrote: ... snip top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. ... snip Maybe? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9NODBXqfNI -- Kirk Wallace http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/ http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/ -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
Something a lot like the existing press, but made of belt conveyors ought to work as a flipper. It would almost certainly need to be pneumatically clamped to stop the workpiece slipping sideways during the flip and then have hard-stops so that releasing the pressure on the new top side aligned the rotating conveyor to the sanding machine. Maybe a drive chain wrapped round a semicircle to be the rotation actuator. -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
If this is for production, meaning the customer plans on doing this on a regular basis, I'd think about buying or building two wide drum sanders with power feed on the input side - one to sand the top of the board and one to sand the bottom of the board. In other words, one drum sander is mounted upside down. I'd try to avoid flipping the large slab of wood. For that size, it might be as inexpensive to custom build drum sanders if you need two of them rather than buy them, and you'd have something custom tailored to the customer's need. The design is spread across two units, and there are a lot of parts in common. Given the very nice gluing rack you made, this would seem to be well within your fabrication skills. On 05/07/2015 06:22 PM, Viesturs Lācis wrote: 2015-05-08 1:04 GMT+03:00 John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm: How many plates do they process? Do they need to turn a plate over once a day or every five minutes? Totally different scale of investement for those two cases. -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On 5/7/2015 3:31 PM, Viesturs Lācis wrote: Hello! I built some pretty large gluing press for a customer. Here are 2 pics of it during the build. Here is the whole rotating platform (5m long, 1,6m wide): http://picpaste.com/IMG_20150403_140923-6uIvoq8i.jpg Here is some material loaded in it: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20150324_185227-meOk5ilU.jpg It can glue together wood plates of size up to 5000x1200x60 mm (max weight can reach 200+ kg, depending on particular wood used). The thing is that those plates need to be sanded from both sides to get smooth surface, but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. Can anyone share some pics or suggestions on what would best practice to do so? I believe that somebody somewhere already must have faced this kind of issue. I am not sure that my current ideas about cylindrical structure, which has an opening at one end to move the plate in and out is the best solution for this task. Any viable suggestions will be appreciated :) Put that pivoting glue up fixture at the end of a roller conveyor to the sanding machine. Out of the glue up, through the sander. Raise the sander head so the plate can be pushed back through it into the glue up where it's flipped over then pushed back onto the roller conveyor. If the glue up rig has to be modified to enable it to flip 360 degrees, that would be easier to do and use less room than a dedicated flipper. Alternately, you could build a flipper in the middle of the roller conveyor and still pass it back through the sanding machine to be flipped. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On 7 May 2015 at 22:31, Viesturs Lācis viesturs.la...@gmail.com wrote: but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. Does the sanding machine exist? One option might be to drop the sanding drum underneath the wood on the return pass. -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
2015-05-08 1:04 GMT+03:00 John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm: How many plates do they process? Do they need to turn a plate over once a day or every five minutes? Totally different scale of investement for those two cases. Here is a suggestion if they don't need to do it very often: Ok, thank you, got the idea. I was thinking of something similar - 2 (or more) such circles connected together to make a rotating cylinder, where plate can enter/exit at one end, so that it moves on conveyor in the cylinder, gets turned over and then moves out. I just am not sure, how to handle te case, when plates would move in both directions on the conveyor (at least in certain parts of it). Well, the plate could pass the cylinder right through, but then the whole thing would become very long and take up too much space, so it does not feel like the most optimal way of doing this. About the quantity - cannot tell for sure as I delivered that machine only yesterday, they are not yet using it :) But I know that they would like something that does not involve much of labor - as automatic as possible is preferred. Viesturs -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
2015-05-08 0:38 GMT+03:00 andy pugh bodge...@gmail.com: On 7 May 2015 at 22:31, Viesturs Lācis viesturs.la...@gmail.com wrote: but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. Does the sanding machine exist? One option might be to drop the sanding drum underneath the wood on the return pass. It does not exist yet, but they need something big, approximately like this: https://www.google.lv/search?q=SANDHYA+900rlz=1C1LENP_enLV616LV616es_sm=93source=lnmstbm=ischsa=Xei=A95LVYajCaTkyAOjx4GwCQved=0CAcQ_AUoAQbiw=1407bih=780#tbm=ischq=SANDYA+900nfpr=1imgrc=xhDvGEpPzcCvhM%253A%3BpNwp_Hw5nndubM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fpartners.scmgroup.com%252Fmedia%252Fuserfiles%252Ffile%252Fsuper%252520finitore%252520zoom.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fpartners.scmgroup.com%252Fgatech%252Fproducts.asp%253Fp%253D11965%3B770%3B1155 This one in the picture is one of the potential machines with 3 sanding belts (because they need to remove up to 1 mm from the thickness of the plate). So there is no option of dropping the drum below. Theoretically I could get a job of building the sanding machine (and place a sanding belts also for bottom side), but I feel that there are too much technical details about the whole process that I should know for successful result, so I lean towards skipping such an endeavor and build only the conveyor and the unit that turns the plates over. Viesturs -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] How to swap over a large wood plate?
On Thu, May 7, 2015, at 05:31 PM, Viesturs Lācis wrote: Hello! I built some pretty large gluing press for a customer. Here are 2 pics of it during the build. Here is the whole rotating platform (5m long, 1,6m wide): http://picpaste.com/IMG_20150403_140923-6uIvoq8i.jpg Here is some material loaded in it: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20150324_185227-meOk5ilU.jpg It can glue together wood plates of size up to 5000x1200x60 mm (max weight can reach 200+ kg, depending on particular wood used). The thing is that those plates need to be sanded from both sides to get smooth surface, but sanding machines process only one side (usually top surface) so customer needs a device that would swap them over between the operations. Can anyone share some pics or suggestions on what would best practice to do so? I believe that somebody somewhere already must have faced this kind of issue. I am not sure that my current ideas about cylindrical structure, which has an opening at one end to move the plate in and out is the best solution for this task. Any viable suggestions will be appreciated :) Viesturs How many plates do they process? Do they need to turn a plate over once a day or every five minutes? Totally different scale of investement for those two cases. Here is a suggestion if they don't need to do it very often: (Not sure if I can communicate this without a picture, but here goes) Since the maximum width of the plate to be turned is 1200mm, make four half-circular pieces of diameter 1300mm. Maybe welded up out of steel or aluminum. Make them wide enough that they won't fall over if you set them on edge - maybe 100mm. Put holes on the flat sides so that they can be bolted together in pairs to make complete circles. Lift the wooden plate on a forklift. Set one half-circle on the floor at each end, with the round side on the floor and the flat side under the plate. Lower the forklift just enough that the plate rests lightly on the two half-circles. Set two more half-circles on top of the plate, flat side down and round side up. Bolt the upper half-circles to the lower ones with bolts at the outer corners, so they clamp the wood plate between them. Now you have a wood plate with wheels on each end. Lower the forklift, roll the plate and wheels one-half revolution, put the forklift back under it, lift, and remove the half-circles. -- John Kasunich jmkasun...@fastmail.fm -- One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight. http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
