[FairfieldLife] 'Bubba Vs. Barack'
Bill Vs. Barack by Ryan Lizza May 5, 2008 On the Thursday before the Pennsylvania primary, Bill Clinton spoke to a crowd of college students at a gymnasium in Lock Haven. The event was typical of the stops—forty-seven of them—that the former President had made in the state during the seven weeks leading up to the vote. Lock Haven is a small town (pop. 9,000), hours away from Pittsburgh or Philadelphia, and the crowd was modest (half the gym’s floor space was empty). Within the campaign, Clinton’s enthusiasm for rustling votes in these remote corners was a source of amusement. When I asked what he was doing on Election Day, a Clinton campaign adviser said, “I think he’s leading a caravan of Wal-Mart greeters to the polls.” On the stump, the former President dispensed idiosyncratic political analysis. “One of the reasons that she won Ohio that nobody wrote about,” he said, without explanation, “is that Ohio has a plant that produces the largest number of solar reflectors in America.” He offered commentary about his wife’s earlier limitations as a candidate: “I think Hillary’s become a much better speaker.” But, most of all, Bill Clinton talked about Bill Clinton: The headquarters of my foundation is in Harlem. . . . My Presidential library and school of public service are in Arkansas. . . . I try to save this generation of children from the epidemic of childhood obesity. . . . I am working on rebuilding the Katrina area in New Orleans. . . . I have major global-warming projects in cities all around America. . . . Most of the time I am out in America on the streets. . . . I once gave a speech to a million people in Ghana. When Hillary Clinton’s Presidential campaign was launched, in January, 2007, her supporters feared that Bill would overshadow her, as he had when they both spoke at the funeral of Coretta Scott King, a year earlier. Now the constant fear is that he will embarrass her. When he makes news, it is rarely a good day for his spouse. Whether he was publicly comparing Barack Obama’s primary victory in South Carolina to Jesse Jackson’s campaigns in the eighties or privately, and apoplectically, complaining that Bill Richardson broke his word by endorsing Obama, every story has seemed to reinforce an image of Clinton as a sort of ill-tempered coot driven a little mad by Obama’s success. “I think this campaign has enraged him,” the adviser told me. “He doesn’t like Obama.” In private conversations, he has been dismissive of his wife’s rival. James Clyburn, an African-American congressman from South Carolina, told me that Clinton called him in the middle of the night after Obama won that state’s primary and raged at him for fifty minutes. “It’s pretty widespread now that African-Americans have lost a whole lot of respect for Bill Clinton,” Clyburn said. But, as Clinton campaigned in Pennsylvania, he was rarely the cartoon politician portrayed in the press. He still connects better with voters than his wife or Obama. “Hillary is in this race today because of people like you,” he told one white working-class audience. “She’s in it for you and she’s in it because of you. People like you have voted for her in every single state in the country.” People like you. The phrase hung in the air and the room quieted. Clinton didn’t say what the people who voted for Obama were like, but the suggestion was that they were somehow different. While Obama downplays wonkiness and Hillary presents her plans as tedious laundry lists, Bill makes connections and translates abstractions into folksy humor. To underscore the relationship between America’s budget deficit, paid for by loans from countries like China, and lax enforcement of the trade violations of those countries, he asked voters to imagine barging into the local bank president’s office and smacking him. “Say, ‘I can’t take it anymore!’ Bam!” he told the Lock Haven audience as he pantomimed a punch and then paused for comic effect. “Do you think you could get a loan tomorrow afternoon?” People laughed and shook their heads. Clinton is angry that this side of him has been nearly absent from the coverage. “You don’t ever read about this stuff! This is never part of the political debate!” he said at one event. “But this is what matters.” Adjusting to the modern, gaffe-centric media environment has been wrenching. At most of his Pennsylvania stops, the national press was represented mainly by a pair of young TV-network “embeds,” whom Clinton regards not as reporters but as media jackals who record his every utterance yet broadcast only his outbursts, a phenomenon that has helped transform him into a YouTube curiosity and diminished him—perhaps permanently. “It’s like he’s been plucked out of time and thrown into the middle of this entirely new kind of campaign,” the adviser told me. Jay Carson, a senior Clinton campaign official and Bill’s former spokesman, said, “Because of the way he is covered, the only thing anyone ever sees is fifteen seconds that is deemed
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh Please, Bhairitu! Jyotish is the biggest pile of unmitigated shit, if there is such a thing! No one has predicted anything with jyotish except retrospectively. I love how you call it an inexact science. Isn't that a bit of an oxymoron? I think that the belief in Jyotish and astrology is related to the belief in techniques (of meditation, performing siddhis, etc.) that work for everyone. Such a belief is based upon the idea that there *can* be such a thing as an exact science, and that following a bunch of prescribed steps can lead you to a predicted goal. I don't buy it. I'm not convinced that the statements Jyotish is accurate or that My technique for insert desired goal here is better than your technique are that much different than the state- ment, Jesus is the only way. They are statements that reinforce the idea of exclusivity -- We (who believe this) know stuff that you peons don't. I could be wrong, but that's really what I tend to believe. I have not encountered even *one* technique in the realm of self discovery that works as advertised for everyone. Not one. And I don't ever expect to. Especially if there is a price tag attached...
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hugheshugo wrote: I need to be convinced that there is anything to it by way of a good reading that would reveal things I'd never told and make accurate predictions, even if only about trends. However this mechanism may function, until I can tell the signal from the noise I will doubt that my analysis is a strawman. The best way to test Jyotish is to learn it. Use something easy like the System's Approach which is easy to learn and pretty much based on Parashara anyway. Unlike other approaches it is a distillation of the rules that Parashara laid out which I believe were a compilation of the way astrology was a practiced at the time in India. My only doubts are that the planets except for the Moon and Sun have little effect on our lives and that astrology is tracking natural cycles that the planets provided handy markers for. I have never found someone who has given me proper birthtime to be off as far as their profession and their success at it nor problems relating to bad planetary cycles. It is also not an exact science though we have a lot of jyotishis who think it is (down to the minute). Think of it more like a weather report. But it is less abstract than the (not so) Amazing Randi would have you think. :) So far, I wouldn't say it was science at all. But if you have some software and enough experience to be confident I'll send you my birth details and we can do an experiment. I'm not convinced anything has happened to me emotionally or career wise that I couldn't account for just by looking at myself and what's happened, influences from parents, school etc. So the idea that planets can act as markers would mean someone with my birth chart could have predicted all of it, otherwise things wouldn't match up; I'd be able to look back and see things that came out of nowhere. In short, it should be obvious that I've been dancing on the strings of unseen powers rather than subject to the cause and effect of a life lived among other people just making it up as they go along. I'm up for the experiment, sounds like fun. Whaddya think? I've always been a fan of Randi, he put his money where his mouth is, $1,000,000 to be precise, and never had anyone convince him there is anything supernatural going on. Could've been a money spinner for the TMO I always thought.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma quote
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The success of one's life depends upon one's ability to forget what is not relevant to the present moment. - Amma Nice. Another way of saying, What you focus on, you become. Now look at Fairfield Life, with this in mind. We've got yer folks who only chime in when some- thing is said that uplifts and touches them, and we've got yer token vampire, who sits around for five to six days of the week focused on darkness, just waiting to be allowed to come back here and spread it around, and to suck as many people as possible into that darkness. I think that it is possible to rephrase the olde TM instruction for meditation (When you become aware that you are not thinking the mantra, gently come back to it.) as a useful technique for posters on FFL: When you become aware that someone whose life is such horror that they have been incapable of making even *one* positive post in months has sucked you into an argument -- and thus into her horror movie -- gently come back to reality. Not only do some people *not* believe in the value of Amma's saying above, they feel threatened by it. It suggests that they have a *choice* about what they focus on, and about the things that their mind habitually dwells upon. And their whole subjective experience is that they have *no* choice in this, that these things have been what they have been focused on for years, decades, and possibly their whole lives. They want *everyone* to focus on the same dark things that fill their lives. So Amma's saying is a *threat* to them. Those who not only focus habitually on negativity and argu- mentation but who *also* do their best to suck other people into those mindstates RESENT being told that they have a *choice* about what they focus on. They don't *want* to believe that they have a choice, because they don't *want* to ever change. They *like* the negativity and argument- ation that they focus on. They'd like *everyone* to be focused on the same negativity and argu- mentation. Any suggestion from a spiritual teacher that reminds others that they don't have to focus on such things undermines their efforts. Satvadude got it right. Such people are vampires. They want to suck not your blood but your attention. They want to take that attention *away* from posi- tive and uplifting subjects and draw it down to the low mindstates they live in, and force you to focus on and argue about the things that *they* focus on. That's what's really going on here IMO. And that is what is going to begin again next Saturday, as it has every Saturday since the posting limits began to be enforced. The vampire was forced to sit in the dark focusing on her dark thoughts for 3, 4, 5, or even 6 days of the week, unable to feed on the attention she needs so badly. But then Saturday rolls around, and she can try once again to get people to focus their attention on her, and on the lowlife things *she* wants them to focus on and argue about. My advice is to ignore her silly undead ass, and focus on better things. Walk softly and carry a big fuckin' wooden stake.
[FairfieldLife] What Muslims Really Think
What Muslims Really Think By Dinesh D'Souza Monday, April 28,2008 While on the debating circuit pounding atheists--a pastime I am really getting to enjoy--I have just started reading Dalia Mogahed and John Esposito's Who Speaks for Islam: What a Billion Muslims Really Think. It's one of the first books to put some real data behind a much-disputed question. For several years now liberal and conservative pundits have been pontificating about the Muslim world, usually without a shred of data. I was amused last year to cross swords with some of my fellow conservatives like Scott Johnson and Victor Davis Hanson. These ideologues seem of the opinion that the average Muslim is a crazed polygamist who is ready to blow himself up. No surprise: this is supposedly what Muslims all learn in the school where they read nothing but the Koran! Only pundits who have no exposure to Muslim countries, Muslim history and Muslim people can go on like this. For such gurus, Islam itself is the problem and nothing short of an Islamic Reformation headed by ex-Muslims like Hirsi Ali and will show the Muslim world where it has gone wrong over the past five centuries. I admire Ali and sympathize with her hardships, but how likely is it that Muslims will follow a woman who the author of a book titled Infidel? In Christianity, the Reformation was led by a devout Martin Luther and not by skeptics and freethinkers like Hume or Voltaire. Practical difficulties aside, we often forget the simple fact that Islam has been around for 1300 years and Islamic terrorism has been around for a few decades. Yes, one can find isolated instances in Islamic history of fanatical groups like the Assassins, but these are hardly typical of the Islamic regimes that have ruled for centuries. The intelligent questions to ask are, what is it about Islam today that has made it an incubator of radicalism and terrorism? And second, what do most Muslims really think about the West? Fortunately there is an increasing body of reliable data on Muslim beliefs. One source is the World Values Survey, which has the benefit of tracking opinions over a period of decades. Another is the Gallup surveys which are now under the aegis of the Gallup Center for Muslim Studies, a group headed by Mogahed. Esposito is one of the most respected American authorities on Islam. I am only getting into their book, but here I offer my own hypothesis, and then I'm going to find out if their data vindicate it. The problem for Muslims is not Christianity or Judaism. In fact, Islam sees itself as incorporating both in much the same way that Christianity sees itself as incorporating Judaism. Moses and Christ are considered prophets in Islam. If you read the propaganda of the radical Muslims, they almost never condemn the West for being a Christian society. They typically describe the West as an atheist and immoral society. Bin Laden has called America “the leading power of the pagans and unbelievers.” The problem for most Muslims is Western liberalism. But here we must distinguish between two kinds of liberalism. There is the classical liberalism of the American founding. Call this Liberalism 1. This liberalism is reflected in such principles as the right to vote, to assemble freely, to debate issues, to trade with others, to practice one’s religion, political and religious toleration, and so on. Then there is the modern liberalism of the 1960s. Call this Liberalism 2. This liberalism is defined by such tenets as the right to blaspheme, the complete exclusion of religious symbols from the public square, the right of teenage boys and girls to receive sex education and contraceptives, the right to abortion, prostitution as a worker's right, pornography as a protected form of expression, gay rights and gay marriage, and so on. It is this second type of liberalism that seems to drive the social agenda of today's Democratic Party. For example, Hillary Clinton chaired a presidential task force during the 1990s that promoted prostitution as an international right for workers. Now we are in a better position to understand Islamic attitudes regarding the West. The vast majority of Muslims worldwide embrace Liberalism 1 while rejecting Liberalism 2. They are generally comfortable with classical liberalism while abhorring the tenets of modern liberalism. And by equating America with such things as blasphemy, pornography, prostitution and homosexuality, the radical Muslims appeal to ordinary Muslims to join their cause in a battle against the Great Satan. This is what I have argued in my recent book The Enemy at Home. The book is just out in paperback, with an Afterward responding to my critics on the right and the left. I always try and learn from my critics, and I’m also interested to see how my thesis stands up in light of Mogahed and Esposito's data. Of course today's liberals will chafe at the idea that their values are producing a powerful blowback from the House of Islam. That's why
[FairfieldLife] Re: The symbology of Arjuna's bow in the Bhagavad Gita.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Arjuna's bow is symbolic of the physical spine and the importance of keeping it straight during meditation. Any orthopedic back doctor will tell you to sit straight with a small pillow for the small of the back, this position resembles an *archers bow* in a radiologic x-ray! Why did Guru Dev meditate all of those years in the full lotus position? Because this is the optium asana (posture) for samadhi meditation, Oh yeah! Sez YKU: uurvor upari ced dhatte ubhe paadatale yathaa padmaasanaM bhaved etat sarvapaapapraNaashanam(sp?) So, according to YKU, padmaasana is destroyer of all sins (sarva[all]-paapa[sin]-praNaashanam[destroying])?
[FairfieldLife] Bless What Appears to be Lightless
Bless What Appears to be Lightless Gillian MacBeth-Louthan TheQuantumAwakening As the velocity of your dreams coming true increases in dimension and depth you come to an intersection of time where all of your past dreams overlap and merge with all of your new creations. It is here that they meld into a physical format that holds a vast array of possibilities. It is at this point of multiplicity that one can breath more life into their dreams or just allow them to make it on their own. It is as this sacred placement that you can also adjust the pattern and pathway that the dreams are flowing into, When one has received the gift of a dream made manifest it is important to realize that said person has rightly earned it. For to manifest anything of vast potential one has to walk through the shadows of self and fear and other imparted limitations. One has to come face to face with the beast within that gnaws upon lost dreams. Moving into higher octaves of manifestation demands that one become brave beyond fears crested by self or others. It requires one to fill in the designated field of inquiry with red ink so one can be seen in the fullness of time and all requests can be processed accordingly. Seeing your dreams into full manifestation takes guts with little glory. It asks you to integrate into a system that you may not agree with and yet by your very integration you change the outcome of what is to be. Every thing upon earth has a deep livingness housed within it and this livingness (quantum consciousness) responds to all thoughts with no exceptions. You are continually fueling what is to be or not to be by every thoughtful energy. In the process of creation you are not allowed to doubt yourself one iota. For even one stray thought of failure will taint the entire batch of creation. As we move closer to all that we seek to be true we will find that every place we go has the divine potential to be a vessel of light. Whether that vessel of light comes in the form of a gas station, a grocery store or a furniture store every place can be used to house what is good and high of Light and integrity. Each place that you work or live or drive is influenced by your energies in accordance with your daily thoughts. All places of employment hold the vibrations of their employees, their joys and their angers, their good days and their bad days. That ratio changes daily with every action and interaction. Many employees feel that they have no control over their lives or jobs but they are affecting/or infecting their place of work all day long. At this time on earth the angels fold up their wings and wear a costume of humanness to be able to walk among the masses. These angels come not with a special tag but are often seen on the very corners of your hometown street begging for food and money. The holier than thou vibration of judgement is coming into diluted form as those of a higher heart are asked not to judge by another's clothes or car or looks or ethic group. The very Christ child himself was born amongst the lowliest of animals in a place that did not seem appropriate for the Son of God. Many have searched for areas of holy light in war filled places. They have looked to ancient history to find the locations of the sacred cities and sites but said places are now beaten up and war torn. The universe comes to announce during this 11:11 gateway that the places of light that you seek to fill you with what you think is holy, need to first be filled by you with love. If you enter a place that feels negative or misused, (sacred place, church or Wal-Mart for that matter) do not run with your tale between your legs pointing at its darkness and failure to have light. Stop for a full minute and bless what appears to be lightless. Maybe the dormant light waits on your recognition of it to be made whole and luminescent. The time for judgement and finger pointing is over and gone. God's entire world is a holy place, from the dumps to the mountaintops. The light needs you to speak it into existence. Without your participation it just lays dormant and silent. The substations of light that awaken as the 11:11 doorway is activated hold a strong potential for giving to those still in doubt a little infusion of light and hope and a glimpse of how dreams were born to come true. Peoples of all creeds and colors and dominions will enter theses substations (in the form of stores, insurance companies, coffee shops, restaurants etc) and they will feel the love the hope the smile of another in acknowledging thier soul value. What lives deep within the people of earth has more value than all the gold and diamonds on earth. One soul who finally sees them selves as a holy vessel is priceless. One soul who remembers their divine identity is worth risking everything for. People have felt so beat down and beat up. They have felt cheated and taken advantage of when they are good hearted giving people. So many try
[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma quote
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer rick@ wrote: The success of one's life depends upon one's ability to forget what is not relevant to the present moment. - Amma Nice. Another way of saying, What you focus on, you become. (snip) Nice quote... It just means 'Be Here Now'... When we are focused on the past or future, then we are not 'here'. Here, is all that really exists. Back there, or someday, only exist in one's mind. The space and time of now, is infinite. The space and time of yesterday is limited. The space and time of tomorrow is limited. Now is unlimited. This is as good as it gets.
[FairfieldLife] 'Baghdad Story'
April 16, 2008 Please Let Me Marry Her and Then Kill MePlease let me marry her and then kill me – those words torture a man who has no regrets but one. He was a killer imprisoned in Camp Bucca; his daily nightmares forced him to quit sleeping and to cry, tears that I doubt will make up for the one victim of his that he regrets, as he forgets the others. Other prisoners around him didn’t ask one question, as he was a member of the feared Al Qaeda organization in Iraq. Days later, the man's nightmares kept taking his sleep away, one day they asked him and he talked. He told them how he killed a young man in Al Anbar province west of Iraq. This killer along with his gang stopped cars and buses on the highway passing through Al Anbar to Jordan and Syria. He said he took aside one of the men to kill. He was begging the killer not to kill him, his tears were not in fear of death, were not to beg to spare his life, it was for the sake of the woman he loved. Please let me marry her then kill me the killer recalled him saying. In his conversations with other prisoners, including my cousin who told me this story, the killer recalled his victim as saying his Juliet's family refused their marriage for ten years and then his family called him in Syria to tell him that her family agreed at last. He was coming back to get married to the woman of his dreams, and she was waiting for him. The killer told the men surrounding him that the young man begged him not to kill him, and he promised he would come back after ten days - but what love can this killer understand? He shot him in the head and killed him on the spot. In the killer's nightmares, the young man says to him, I begged you … Please let me marry her then kill me, I promised you to come back, Why? He told the men surrounding him that he had killed many but he doesn’t remember or regret any of them but killing this man. The killer was sentenced to death. One of the inmates who was waiting for his imminent release thought it worthwhile to go and to find that woman and tell her: Your man begged for his life to marry you -- not for fear of death itself -- and he didn’t let you down. He was murdered in the middle of nowhere. So, he asked the killer to give him the name of the victim. The killer replied he didn’t know, he asked from what tribe? |The killer didn’t know, he asked from what sect? The killer didn’t know, he asked him from what province? The killer didn’t know. Then he asked him, then why you killed him? The killer said he cannot remember, whether it was the victim's haircut or the way he was dressed or the music pouring from his car. I hope and wish that one day someone will tell the woman he loved how he died; someone will tell her that those killers who kill every day do not distinguish between people, their color or their belief. Someone to tell her that those killers are addicted to killing and one way or another they are punished. Someone to tell her that your man didn’t fear death; his fear was to die without marrying you. Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[FairfieldLife] Re: The symbology of Arjuna's bow in the Bhagavad Gita.
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. wgm4u@ wrote: Arjuna's bow is symbolic of the physical spine and the importance of keeping it straight during meditation. Any orthopedic back doctor will tell you to sit straight with a small pillow for the small of the back, this position resembles an *archers bow* in a radiologic x-ray! Why did Guru Dev meditate all of those years in the full lotus position? Because this is the optium asana (posture) for samadhi meditation, Oh yeah! Sez YKU: uurvor upari ced dhatte ubhe paadatale yathaa padmaasanaM bhaved etat sarvapaapapraNaashanam(sp?) So, according to YKU, padmaasana is destroyer of all sins (sarva[all]-paapa[sin]-praNaashanam[destroying])? Yes...*padma asana* the full lotus posture conducive to 'destroy' all sinssee Wiki on this most optimum posture for meditation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_position
[FairfieldLife] Re: Hillary promises to murder millions if elected
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander mailander111@ wrote: Judy: The first condition is to explain what you (Angela or anyone) think of Vaj's subject heading. If you can't get that right, you don't have the minimum integrity for me to be willing to debate with you. Lemme get this straight, Judy. First I have to express an opinion on Vaj's subject heading that you agree with before you think I have a minimum amount of integrity for you to be willing to debate with me? No, you have to express the *right* opinion on it. Spoken without a hint of irony. Yikes. It makes the blood...uh, I mean attention...taste so much better if you force the victim to capitulate even before you suck them dry, doncha know? http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa249/illpic/Vampire8.gif ( My apologies in advance for the choice of photo. Judy will probably claim that it does not represent her accurately, and in this case she would be correct. I couldn't find any photos of ugly female vampires. )
[FairfieldLife] Top 100 film blockbusters...or are they?
This is from my brother, who does this sort of thing for fun. I find it pretty fascinating, another example of how statistics can be completely misleading. Every ten-best or 100-best list of anything that spans more than a few years should be adjusted for inflation. For example, here is the traditional list of top 100 US grosses for theater play: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/domestic.htm This only counts dollars, but dollars come in different sizes every year. Here is the top 100 list adjusted to 2008 dollars, and a very, very different and much more accurate picture of popularity. This list is ranked, effectively, by the number of tickets sold. http://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/adjusted.htm Facts gleaned from a brief study of the two lists: * The dollars list makes you think it's all about heroes, antiheroes, superheroes, and explosions. The adujsted list has timeless romances in positions 1 and 8 and a musical in 3. * Despite the above, there are no Bond films in the by- dollars list, but two when correctly adjusted. * Truly great movies like The Best Years of Our Lives that look in dollars like they made a pittance were very popular when released. * The 1963 Cleopatra, famous for being a disaster, was not. It took in more than its production budget, and it is now #37 on the all-time adjusted list. This means a lot of people saw it in theaters when new. I was one. * Children, are, in fact, paying customers. 16% (16 of 100) of the adjusted top grossing movies of all time are animated. * When all the pennies are counted, Rocky Horror was a blockbuster, and a bigger one than Men in Black, Jurassic Park, or Top Gun.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Question for Rick
I was trying to be funny...oh well! --- Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 6:29 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Question for Rick On behalf of Rick, WTF is this? Rick also might have once beat his dog and kept his grandmother locked in the attic! Is this a new age swiftboat attack? Peter, hes referring to Ammas visits to Mt. Pleasant, not to the mental hospital there. So its a sincere question, not an attack. My answer is that the witness has been growing in clarity ever since I started meditating. I used to witness very clearly while lecturing in the early 70s. these days, the silence is always there, but its more noticeable in contrasting situations, such as travel. Amma has definitely been a boost to my spiritual growth. --- The Secret HYPERLINK mailto:L.Shaddai%40Gmail.com[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rick, You might have once stated that there is a silent witness within you. May I ask if this witness was there while you were going to the Dome before your trips to Mt. Pleasant or afterwards? No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.5/1400 - Release Date: 4/27/2008 9:39 AM Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi?????????
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There had been talk of others hearing him crying out in pain in the months leading up to the death, as he was in some bad pain (so much for the samadhi and bliss, huh?). Samadhi and bliss can't coexist with body experiencing pain? It's my impression that Ramana Maharshi screaming out in agonizing pain from the cancer destroying his body is held up as an example of just that: transcendental bliss coexisting with body experiencing extreme pain.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi?????????
On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:55 AM, Alex Stanley wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There had been talk of others hearing him crying out in pain in the months leading up to the death, as he was in some bad pain (so much for the samadhi and bliss, huh?). Samadhi and bliss can't coexist with body experiencing pain? It's my impression that Ramana Maharshi screaming out in agonizing pain from the cancer destroying his body is held up as an example of just that: transcendental bliss coexisting with body experiencing extreme pain. I'd heard different stories of Ramana, but most seemed to emphasize his ability to remain aloof and blissfully happy; 'it's just the body'. So yeah, I think the two can exist together. In Ramana's case I believe he remained seated in asana even after death and his devotees were allowed one last darshan of his physical body. Video I've seen of this was amazing, as even though he was actually dead, there seemed to be some thing still there which radiated presence, some deathless spirit. When he was suffering from cancer in the arm a disciple ran away crying because he could not bear to see his master in pain. Ramana only smiled and spoke to a disciple nearby. Duraswami is crying because he thinks I am suffering agonies! My body is suffering but I am not suffering. When will he realise that I am not this body?
[FairfieldLife] Hyper Physics Chart
Index Video/Demo Index Class Home AAPT Connections to: Chemistry Geophysics Biology Focused Applications Example problems Tables About HyperPhysicsHyperMathTranslation Projects: ChineseEspañol Go BackMerlot Snapshot Merlot Classic Award winner for 2005This site was honored because of its comprehensive coverage of most of physics, the creative use of multimedia and linking, and the impact it has had on students worldwide. Online tutorials cover a wide range of physics topics, including modern physics and astronomy. Material is organized through extensive concept maps. Index Mechanics references HyperPhysicsGo Back About HyperPhysics Rationale for DevelopmentHyperPhysics is an exploration environment for concepts in physics which employs concept maps and other linking strategies to facilitate smooth navigation. For the most part, it is laid out in small segments or cards, true to its original development in HyperCard. The entire environment is interconnected with thousands of links, reminiscent of a neural network. The bottom bar of each card contains links to major concept maps for divisions of physics, plus a go back feature to allow you to retrace the path of an exploration. The side bar contains a link to the extensive Index, which itself is composed of active links. That sidebar also contains links to relevant concept maps. The rationale for such concept maps is to provide a visual survey of conceptually connected material, and it is hoped that they will provide some answers to the question where do I go from here?. Whether you need further explanation of concepts which underly the current card content, or are seeking applications which go beyond it, the concept map may help you find the desired information. Part of the intent for this exploration environment is to provide many opportunities for numerical exploration in the form of active formuli and standard problems implemented in Javascript. An active exploration in physics will typically lead you to something which needs to be quantified, and it is hoped that the many Javascript-enabled calculations will provide many opportunities to answer What if .. type questions. New content for HyperPhysics will be posted as it is developed. The intent is to maintain the entire HyperPhysics project on the Web with stable locations so that links to it may be established with confidence that they will be there for an extended period of time. As the basic phase nears completion, the author is interested in extensions to specific applied areas. If you are interested in developing specific material for a specialized course, you might consider building it upon this framework with links to HyperPhysics to provide the basic conceptual background. The entire HyperPhysics project can be made available on a cross-platform CD ROM since it will remain compatible with the standard web browsers. Who is using HyperPhysics?A resource that was initiated as a resource for local high school physics teachers whom I had taught has expanded into an intensively used website worldwide. CD versions have been sent to 71 countries to date, and translations into German and Italian have been licensed and are underway. Call for TranslatorsChineseThis is an offer to post translated versions of HyperPhysics for free access worldwide, just as the English version is offered. If you wish to translate parts of HyperPhysics for the use of your students, we will post a full mirror version of HyperPhysics dedicated to your language with all links so that your translated portions will have full access to the links to all of HyperPhysics. It is suggested that just the displayed text be translated, leaving all the links intact, therby reducing the labor of translation. While the Copyright of HyperPhysics must remain with the project, our commitment is to provide you with a CD version of the full HyperPhysics website with a license for a closed mirror (at least password protected) at your institution so that you can make full use of your translation efforts for teaching at your institution, even during the early stages of translation. When a large portion has been translated, a more flexible license will be provided to make sure you are not hindered from making use of your own work of translation. The hit rate reached about 50 million file hits per year in the fifth year and logging was suspended. Informal statistics from the server log indicate about 15 hits per user on average, so 50 million hits translates to over 3 million users per year. Email traffic has increased proportionately, and an informal tally of the emails indicates the following frequency of users. Students.High school teachers.Engineering and technical personnel in industry.Independent learners.Search engines give over 200,000 links to HyperPhysics, mostly from educators or educational institutions. Please respect the Copyright
[FairfieldLife] Re: Hillary promises to murder millions if elected
TurquoiseB wrote: It makes the blood...uh, I mean attention...taste so much better if you force the victim to capitulate even before you suck them dry, doncha know? It may be that someone needs to point out that Hillary never actually promised to murder millions if elected.
[FairfieldLife] Ru Prom 2008 with David Lynch, Moby, Donovan, Chrysta Bell, et al
Videos: http://youtube.com/user/bobomoore57
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: hugheshugo wrote: I need to be convinced that there is anything to it by way of a good reading that would reveal things I'd never told and make accurate predictions, even if only about trends. However this mechanism may function, until I can tell the signal from the noise I will doubt that my analysis is a strawman. The best way to test Jyotish is to learn it. Use something easy like the System's Approach which is easy to learn and pretty much based on Parashara anyway. Unlike other approaches it is a distillation of the rules that Parashara laid out which I believe were a compilation of the way astrology was a practiced at the time in India. My only doubts are that the planets except for the Moon and Sun have little effect on our lives and that astrology is tracking natural cycles that the planets provided handy markers for. I have never found someone who has given me proper birthtime to be off as far as their profession and their success at it nor problems relating to bad planetary cycles. It is also not an exact science though we have a lot of jyotishis who think it is (down to the minute). Think of it more like a weather report. But it is less abstract than the (not so) Amazing Randi would have you think. :) So far, I wouldn't say it was science at all. But if you have some software and enough experience to be confident I'll send you my birth details and we can do an experiment. I'm not convinced anything has happened to me emotionally or career wise that I couldn't account for just by looking at myself and what's happened, influences from parents, school etc. So the idea that planets can act as markers would mean someone with my birth chart could have predicted all of it, otherwise things wouldn't match up; I'd be able to look back and see things that came out of nowhere. In short, it should be obvious that I've been dancing on the strings of unseen powers rather than subject to the cause and effect of a life lived among other people just making it up as they go along. I'm up for the experiment, sounds like fun. Whaddya think? I've always been a fan of Randi, he put his money where his mouth is, $1,000,000 to be precise, and never had anyone convince him there is anything supernatural going on. Could've been a money spinner for the TMO I always thought.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Rick
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was trying to be funny...oh well! Nah, we KNOW its just your pent up anger. :)
[FairfieldLife] Re: questions about Hill and WMD
Angela Mailander wrote: I think it was convenient at the time to make Ritter out to be a nut case. This guy Scott Ritter IS a genuine nut. What in the world was Ritter thinking when he wrote that Saddam should be allowed to develop a peaceful nuclear program? What a nut case! One thing is fer sure: the U.N. weapons inspectors and the U.N. sanctions failed. Scott Ritter was correct when he wrote that the U.N. sanctions did nothing but kill Iraqi children from starvation. How many children were killed due to U.N. sanctions? Altogether Saddam was responsible for the murder of over 2 million people. The sad thing is, Saddam would still be in power today if the U.S. had not sent in military forces to unseat him. Read more: 'Endgame: Solving the Iraq Crisis' by Scott Ritter Simon Schuster, 1999 http://tinyurl.com/56335q Reader's Comments: Given the fraud and deceit Ritter details it is inexplicable that the author recommends dropping economic sanctions if Saddam promises not to develop weapons of mass destruction. Further, Ritter's suggestion that Iraq be allowed to develop a peaceful nuclear program borders on the bizarre. The author never explains why a regime with a history of compulsive lying should be trusted. - J. Gillespie
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi?????????
--- Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:55 AM, Alex Stanley wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There had been talk of others hearing him crying out in pain in the months leading up to the death, as he was in some bad pain (so much for the samadhi and bliss, huh?). Samadhi and bliss can't coexist with body experiencing pain? It's my impression that Ramana Maharshi screaming out in agonizing pain from the cancer destroying his body is held up as an example of just that: transcendental bliss coexisting with body experiencing extreme pain. I'd heard different stories of Ramana, but most seemed to emphasize his ability to remain aloof and blissfully happy; 'it's just the body'. So yeah, I think the two can exist together. In Ramana's case I believe he remained seated in asana even after death and his devotees were allowed one last darshan of his physical body. Video I've seen of this was amazing, as even though he was actually dead, there seemed to be some thing still there which radiated presence, some deathless spirit. When he was suffering from cancer in the arm a disciple ran away crying because he could not bear to see his master in pain. Ramana only smiled and spoke to a disciple nearby. Duraswami is crying because he thinks I am suffering agonies! My body is suffering but I am not suffering. When will he realise that I am not this body? For about 24 hours after a persons death there is a profound silence that radiates from the body. It is quite amazing. Its like a door opens into the transcendent. I experienced that with my uncle recently and also our cat a few years ago! Eventually the body shifts in some way and then its just decaying organic matter. I think because we hide death so well in Western culture we're not commonly exposed to this profound experience. Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
[FairfieldLife] UFO sightings around the world
Important events are taking place in many parts of the world. People everywhere will be astonished by the reports. These will include, in unprecedented numbers, of spacecraft from our neighbouring planets, Mars and Venus in particular. (Benjamin Creme's Master, `The gathering of the Forces of Light', SI March 2007) NASA's UFO records emerge Film of a NASA space experiment being swarmed by UFOs has attracted almost 400,000 hits on the website Youtube. On 25 February 1996 the US space shuttle Columbia on mission STS-75 was running an experiment in generating electrical energy for in- orbit propulsion by collecting high-energy electrons in the Earth's ionosphere and magnetic fields. A 12-mile long electrical conductor cable known as an electrodynamic tether was run out from the Columbia, but an unexpected voltage overload severed the tether from the shuttle and it coiled away into space. As the full length of the tether drifts away, the NASA footage shows hundreds of circular, flashing UFOs swarming and darting around it until, some 80 miles away, it can be seen completely straightened out and doubled over on itself. (See `UFO NASA's unexplained tether overload incident' at www.youtube.com) (Benjamin Creme's Master confirms that the Space Brothers repaired and controlled the broken tether.) United Nations debate UFO policy Following an interview with French aviation expert Gilles Lorant on French radio station Ici et Maintenant, his account was published on various websites of a series of United Nations meetings to discuss the UFO phenomenon. According to Lorant's information, approximately 40 representatives of 28 UN member nations attended a series of secret meetings from 12- 14 February 2008 at the New York headquarters to discuss issues of security and public information, in light of increasing UFO sightings in recent years. Lorant is an attaché to the Centre National de la Recherche Scientifique (National Center for Scientific Research), a government- funded research organization under the authority of France's Ministry of Research. He is also a member of the Institute of Advanced Studies for National Defense and was invited to attend the UN meetings in a professional capacity. According to Lorant, the meetings were convened at the request of nation states concerned about the impact of increased UFO sightings. Their main focus was to co-ordinate international policy regarding the phenomenon; 2009 was agreed on as the year when an official policy of openness to extraterrestrial craft sightings would replace the denial and debunking policy pursued since the early 1950s. However, this policy shift would be dependent on certain global conditions being met: a state of peace and stability in the G8 nations; developing countries committed to liberal democratic conditions; and a continuation of UFO sightings at current levels. A major concern was that adverse public reaction could have a serious negative impact on the US economy and lead to further economic crises and recession throughout the world. A confidential report discussed in the meetings had been prepared by the US Air Force and a branch of the National Guard at the request of three US senators, whose comments were included, and who it seems were also at the meetings. The date of official public disclosure was given as 2013, or at such time as extraterrestrial presence was considered unambiguous. A report of the meetings is expected to be issued from the United Nations at the end of March 2008 to member nations who did not attend the meetings. (Source: opednews.com; ufodigest.com; exopolitics.org) Astronauts speak of UFOs NASA's UFO records go back years, and include sightings reported by US astronauts on the 1969 Apollo 11 mission, both en route to the moon and after landing. Though many such reports were suppressed and documentation and photographs `lost', there are now increasing numbers of former astronauts and NASA personnel speaking out about their experiences, often on television talk shows. Among them is Christopher Kraft, director of NASA's Houston tracking base during the Apollo lunar mission. Since leaving NASA, Kraft has confirmed a key conversation between Houston and astronauts Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin on the moon about watching UFOs lined up on the other side of the crater. The conversation not publicly aired owing to an `unexplained' two-minute break in NASA's public transmission was monitored by hundreds of independent civilian VHF radio operators, including Soviet radio operators who published the transcript in Moscow. (Source: youtube.com; The Canadian, Canada) UFO sightings around the world USA New York: Posted on the youtube website in February 2008 is a video called `Massive UFO Brigade Over NYC'. Filmed with a handy-cam in November 2007 in New York City at around 2.45pm, the footage shows masses of small, bright, UFO's moving quickly in various
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
TurquoiseB wrote: I have not encountered even *one* technique in the realm of self discovery that works as advertised for everyone. Not one. And I don't ever expect to. Especially if there is a price tag attached... This would assume that you've tried every technique known to man, which obviously you have not. In fact, from what I've read of from your writings, you've tried only a few. And I don't understand how you think you'd be able to find out if any worked on anyone else at all.
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Church of Oprah, Exposed
Doug, wow, the video covers so much ground, drawing the connections through Oprah and Tolle to Obama and an ominous Department of Peace. Perfect at the end where it closes with martial-sounding music, drumbeats (of war) and a Wagnerian operatic choir with the image of Jesus on the Cross. What a perfect illustration of exactly what Tolle and the Church of Oprah is talking about giving up. Thanks ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JW4LLwkgmqAfeature=related
[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi?????????
Got a link to that video? Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 8:55 AM, Alex Stanley wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: There had been talk of others hearing him crying out in pain in the months leading up to the death, as he was in some bad pain (so much for the samadhi and bliss, huh?). Samadhi and bliss can't coexist with body experiencing pain? It's my impression that Ramana Maharshi screaming out in agonizing pain from the cancer destroying his body is held up as an example of just that: transcendental bliss coexisting with body experiencing extreme pain. I'd heard different stories of Ramana, but most seemed to emphasize his ability to remain aloof and blissfully happy; 'it's just the body'. So yeah, I think the two can exist together. In Ramana's case I believe he remained seated in asana even after death and his devotees were allowed one last darshan of his physical body. Video I've seen of this was amazing, as even though he was actually dead, there seemed to be some thing still there which radiated presence, some deathless spirit. When he was suffering from cancer in the arm a disciple ran away crying because he could not bear to see his master in pain. Ramana only smiled and spoke to a disciple nearby. Duraswami is crying because he thinks I am suffering agonies! My body is suffering but I am not suffering. When will he realise that I am not this body?
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not convinced anything has happened to me emotionally or career wise that I couldn't account for just by looking at myself and what's happened, influences from parents, school etc In short, it should be obvious that I've been dancing on the strings of unseen powers rather than subject to the cause and effect of a life lived among other people just making it up as they go along. You perhaps are mistaking cause and correlation. I can understand how some in the past 1000 years took the notion of planets correlate to events with the planets cause events. But jyotish never said that (that I have ever read or heard. Its been 10 years since I have done anything with jyotish, but back then I read 10 or so books, saw maybe 8 or so jyotishees. Went to a national convention that happened to be in my home town. I never hard any claim of causality.) Your watch may be able to tell when its five o'clock, and someone may tell you that the train comes at 5, but in no way does the watch striking 5 CAUSE the train to come. And no one claims that it does. Wristwatch, jytoish clock, no one claims causality. Why then expect or look for causality? And people may be acting randomly but collectively are certain trends more apparent when the temperature rises? Higher crime? More bar fights? More road rage? I see jyotish (if there is anything to it -- jury still is out) as something like that. Its going to be hot for a while, and we can expect more events that occur when its hot to actually occur. Not a lot of woo woo rays in that. (Or , Its going to be a bumpy ride .. fasten your seatbelt)
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Church of Oprah, Exposed
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Marek Reavis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Doug, wow, the video covers so much ground, drawing the connections through Oprah and Tolle to Obama and an ominous Department of Peace. Perfect at the end where it closes with martial-sounding music, drumbeats (of war) and a Wagnerian operatic choir with the image of Jesus on the Cross. What a perfect illustration of exactly what Tolle and the Church of Oprah is talking about giving up. It made me wonder if Tolle needs bodyguards now. It's almost a given that Oprah does, and has for years, just because of her celebrity. But before he was a visual nonentity...very few even knew what he looked like. Now millions do, some of them Christian nut cases. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JW4LLwkgmqAfeature=related
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: TurquoiseB wrote: I have not encountered even *one* technique in the realm of self discovery that works as advertised for everyone. Not one. And I don't ever expect to. Especially if there is a price tag attached... This would assume that you've tried every technique known to man, which obviously you have not. In fact, from what I've read of from your writings, you've tried only a few. And I don't understand how you think you'd be able to find out if any worked on anyone else at all. Yes. Its as valid as saying, I saw two films. They were terrible. THEREFORE, all films are terrible. Jeeesh
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
And people may be acting randomly but collectively are certain trends more apparent when the temperature rises? Higher crime? More bar fights? More road rage? I see jyotish (if there is anything to it -- jury still is out) as something like that. Its going to be hot for a while, and we can expect more events that occur when its hot to actually occur. Not a lot of woo woo rays in that. In this example heat is a cause for people to lose their tempers. It is a physical effect. I don't know if it is a urban myth or not but is sounds plausible. In the your case for Joitish not describing causation, you invoke an equally woo woo principle of correlation between objects in space and in our life's events. This doesn't help in making the claim less fantastic. The final woo woo aspect is the claim that humans could know about such a connection using ancient scriptures from a pre-scientific culture who believed in many forms of divination. Do people with big ears really have a better chance to become wealthy? Finally, the use of gems to magically mitigate the influence of plants seems to throw the whole claim of causation back into play doesn't it? Humans naturally desire to know about and control future events. But one thing seems to jump out from studying history: we totally suck at this. We always have, and that includes the Vedic era in India. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: I'm not convinced anything has happened to me emotionally or career wise that I couldn't account for just by looking at myself and what's happened, influences from parents, school etc In short, it should be obvious that I've been dancing on the strings of unseen powers rather than subject to the cause and effect of a life lived among other people just making it up as they go along. You perhaps are mistaking cause and correlation. I can understand how some in the past 1000 years took the notion of planets correlate to events with the planets cause events. But jyotish never said that (that I have ever read or heard. Its been 10 years since I have done anything with jyotish, but back then I read 10 or so books, saw maybe 8 or so jyotishees. Went to a national convention that happened to be in my home town. I never hard any claim of causality.) Your watch may be able to tell when its five o'clock, and someone may tell you that the train comes at 5, but in no way does the watch striking 5 CAUSE the train to come. And no one claims that it does. Wristwatch, jytoish clock, no one claims causality. Why then expect or look for causality? And people may be acting randomly but collectively are certain trends more apparent when the temperature rises? Higher crime? More bar fights? More road rage? I see jyotish (if there is anything to it -- jury still is out) as something like that. Its going to be hot for a while, and we can expect more events that occur when its hot to actually occur. Not a lot of woo woo rays in that. (Or , Its going to be a bumpy ride .. fasten your seatbelt)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi?????????
On Apr 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Duveyoung wrote:Got a link to that video? Edg http://www.arunachala.org/bookstall/videos/The Sage of Arunachala - The Life and Times of Sri Ramana MaharshiIn this seventy-three-minute, professionally-produced documentary, the unique life and teachings of Sri Ramana Maharshi are artistically unfolded in a chronology of photographs, interviews, narration and archival film footage.Follow the Sage from his birth in a small South Indian village to his final mortal day, as grieving crowds push in from all sides to have their last darshan.Released after a two year effort of archival film restoration, interviews, research and travel. Narrated by John Flynn, a nationally recognized television and film talent. Edited by James Hartel, and music by internationally famous artists.73 min, narrated, color, musicDVD $20.00 video clip
[FairfieldLife] One says 25,000; the other 60
On this 22nd anniversay of Chernobyl, there is renewed discussion of its effects. One source claims as many as 25,000 people died as a result: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/26/2228063.htm Another, the author Gwyneth Cravens who wrote The Truth about Nuclear Energy and our Changing Climate, claims that only 60 people died: http://www.cravenspowertosavetheworld.com/content/view/13/30/ Why the discrepancy and who do you think is right? I wonder: how many deaths will occur from so-called Global Warming and the burning of coal to produce electricity compared to how many deaths would occur if we switched to nuclear to generate the same amount of electricity?
[FairfieldLife] Re: One says 25,000; the other 60
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On this 22nd anniversay of Chernobyl, there is renewed discussion of its effects. One source claims as many as 25,000 people died as a result: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/26/2228063.htm Another, the author Gwyneth Cravens who wrote The Truth about Nuclear Energy and our Changing Climate, claims that only 60 people died: http://www.cravenspowertosavetheworld.com/content/view/13/30/ Why the discrepancy and who do you think is right? I wonder: how many deaths will occur from so-called Global Warming and the burning of coal to produce electricity compared to how many deaths would occur if we switched to nuclear to generate the same amount of electricity? Not directly directed to your question, but related. You can start counting in the millions: Question: Have the ecologists really said that planet Earth has just 15 to 20 years left? Is that an exaggeration? A. Not the ecologists but the Masters have said that we do not have 50 to 100 years (as many ecologists believe) but 15 to 20 years to rescue the planet before it reaches a stage in which the problems become irreversible. http://shareintl.org/magazine/SI_current.htm
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You bring a lot of nice side-shows to the table. Not much to do with the premise I suggested, but entertaining. Dancing bears and all. And people may be acting randomly but collectively are certain trends more apparent when the temperature rises? Higher crime? More bar fights? More road rage? I see jyotish (if there is anything to it -- jury still is out) as something like that. Its going to be hot for a while, and we can expect more events that occur when its hot to actually occur. Not a lot of woo woo rays in that. In this example heat is a cause for people to lose their tempers. It is a physical effect. I don't know if it is a urban myth or not but is sounds plausible. In the your case for Joitish not describing causation, you invoke an equally woo woo principle of correlation between objects in space and in our life's events. It just as woo woo as the watch predicting the train coming. These are two independent events. No woo woo rays. But they do corrleate. This doesn't help in making the claim less fantastic. Not sure I agree. But lets explore other examples that support or dis the case. The final woo woo aspect is the claim that humans could know about such a connection using ancient scriptures from a pre-scientific culture who believed in many forms of divination. Huh? Are you suggesting that ancient cultures bring absolutely nothing to the table? No valid knowledge of ANYTHING? Whew. We have different views there. Do people with big ears really have a better chance to become wealthy? Is the term strawman in your vocabulary? Finally, the use of gems to magically mitigate the influence of plants seems to throw the whole claim of causation back into play doesn't it? Um where did I say anything about gems? I have said there may be lots of mud around the um, gems of insight from ancient cultures. There is a need to wash off the mud. By the way, I saw a recording of a recent ER. The new doc, apparently ER's answer to McSteamy on Gray's Anatomy, said to a patient, Oh, is that a ruby? (on a necklace). In ancient vedic culture, rubies were a sign of Interesting he said vedic as if it was 'common lingo. Humans naturally desire to know about and control future events. Perhaps. But what does that have to do with this discussion? O you are still stuck in the same misconception as HUGO that this is about casuation. Neti Neti. But one thing seems to jump out from studying history: we totally suck at this. We always have, and that includes the Vedic era in India. You can rant on about whole civilizations. I was talking about jyotish. But why we are talking non-sequiturs, sportscasters suck at predicting who is going to win Wimbledon. Should we line em all up and shoot them? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: I'm not convinced anything has happened to me emotionally or career wise that I couldn't account for just by looking at myself and what's happened, influences from parents, school etc In short, it should be obvious that I've been dancing on the strings of unseen powers rather than subject to the cause and effect of a life lived among other people just making it up as they go along. You perhaps are mistaking cause and correlation. I can understand how some in the past 1000 years took the notion of planets correlate to events with the planets cause events. But jyotish never said that (that I have ever read or heard. Its been 10 years since I have done anything with jyotish, but back then I read 10 or so books, saw maybe 8 or so jyotishees. Went to a national convention that happened to be in my home town. I never hard any claim of causality.) Your watch may be able to tell when its five o'clock, and someone may tell you that the train comes at 5, but in no way does the watch striking 5 CAUSE the train to come. And no one claims that it does. Wristwatch, jytoish clock, no one claims causality. Why then expect or look for causality? And people may be acting randomly but collectively are certain trends more apparent when the temperature rises? Higher crime? More bar fights? More road rage? I see jyotish (if there is anything to it -- jury still is out) as something like that. Its going to be hot for a while, and we can expect more events that occur when its hot to actually occur. Not a lot of woo woo rays in that. (Or , Its going to be a bumpy ride .. fasten your seatbelt)
[FairfieldLife] Re: One says 25,000; the other 60
Before you buy nuclear power plants, discover who owns most of the uranium in the world -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about nuclear use is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking. Who owns the uranium? The Queen of England owns all the uranium in Canada. Google it. Then google depleted uranium bullets and see the connection to the nuclear industry as it tries to get rid of it's waste by selling it as small murder pellets. Then google the BushCo connections to the Royal Family and the Bank of England. Didja think BushCo was going to stop marauding consumers after the oil was all gone? Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On this 22nd anniversay of Chernobyl, there is renewed discussion of its effects. One source claims as many as 25,000 people died as a result: http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/26/2228063.htm Another, the author Gwyneth Cravens who wrote The Truth about Nuclear Energy and our Changing Climate, claims that only 60 people died: http://www.cravenspowertosavetheworld.com/content/view/13/30/ Why the discrepancy and who do you think is right? I wonder: how many deaths will occur from so-called Global Warming and the burning of coal to produce electricity compared to how many deaths would occur if we switched to nuclear to generate the same amount of electricity?
[FairfieldLife] Re: One says 25,000; the other 60
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Before you buy nuclear power plants, discover who owns most of the uranium in the world -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about nuclear use is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking. [snip] Before you buy into Al Gore's wacky theory about Global Warming, discover who owns stock in Green industries -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about Global Warming is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking: http://newsbusters.org/node/11149
[FairfieldLife] Re: One says 25,000; the other 60
I don't believe in Global Warming -- my jury's still out, and I told you this repeatedly long ago. I made it very clear that global pollution by industry was THE issue. What make-believe world are you living within? Do you just think that any thought you have is valid cuz you had it? Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung no_reply@ wrote: Before you buy nuclear power plants, discover who owns most of the uranium in the world -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about nuclear use is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking. [snip] Before you buy into Al Gore's wacky theory about Global Warming, discover who owns stock in Green industries -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about Global Warming is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking: http://newsbusters.org/node/11149
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Snip The final woo woo aspect is the claim that humans could know about such a connection using ancient scriptures from a pre-scientific culture who believed in many forms of divination. Huh? Are you suggesting that ancient cultures bring absolutely nothing to the table? No valid knowledge of ANYTHING? Whew. We have different views there. I was putting my finger on the epistemological basis for the claims of Joitish. They come from ancient scriptures, not from any empirical basis. I was challenging that people can know about such a mechanism and proposing that pre-scientific cultures tended to believe assertions from priestly classes without any verification required. There is plenty of stuff from pre-scientific cultures that has passed modern standards of proof. Joitish is not one of them. Do people with big ears really have a better chance to become wealthy? Is the term strawman in your vocabulary? Physiognomy is a branch of Joitish. This claim came from one of Maharishi's favorite Joitishis. I am pointing out that there is a cluster of beliefs that need to be examined through some testing rather than accepted on face value. Finally, the use of gems to magically mitigate the influence of plants seems to throw the whole claim of causation back into play doesn't it? Um where did I say anything about gems? I have said there may be lots of mud around the um, gems of insight from ancient cultures. There is a need to wash off the mud. It is in the system. You don't need to mention it for me to bring it up. I agree that there is a lot of mud to wash off in human knowledge of all eras of our history. Humans naturally desire to know about and control future events. Perhaps. But what does that have to do with this discussion? O you are still stuck in the same misconception as HUGO that this is about casuation. Neti Neti. Snip And you seem to be stuck in the misconception that a claim of causation is somehow more fantastic than the claim that there is a correlation in Vedic astrology. They are equally baseless as assertions of unproven claims from an ancient culture. This doesn't mean that they didn't know anything, just that we shouldn't assume they had the whole mechanics of creation figured out to such a precise degree that they can accurately predict future events. But one thing seems to jump out from studying history: we totally suck at this. We always have, and that includes the Vedic era in India. You can rant on about whole civilizations. I was talking about jyotish. But why we are talking non-sequiturs, sportscasters suck at predicting who is going to win Wimbledon. Should we line em all up and shoot them? rant ummm And I said we should shoot Joitish guys where? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: I'm not convinced anything has happened to me emotionally or career wise that I couldn't account for just by looking at myself and what's happened, influences from parents, school etc In short, it should be obvious that I've been dancing on the strings of unseen powers rather than subject to the cause and effect of a life lived among other people just making it up as they go along. You perhaps are mistaking cause and correlation. I can understand how some in the past 1000 years took the notion of planets correlate to events with the planets cause events. But jyotish never said that (that I have ever read or heard. Its been 10 years since I have done anything with jyotish, but back then I read 10 or so books, saw maybe 8 or so jyotishees. Went to a national convention that happened to be in my home town. I never hard any claim of causality.) Your watch may be able to tell when its five o'clock, and someone may tell you that the train comes at 5, but in no way does the watch striking 5 CAUSE the train to come. And no one claims that it does. Wristwatch, jytoish clock, no one claims causality. Why then expect or look for causality? And people may be acting randomly but collectively are certain trends more apparent when the temperature rises? Higher crime? More bar fights? More road rage? I see jyotish (if there is anything to it -- jury still is out) as something like that. Its going to be hot for a while, and we can expect more events that occur when its hot to actually occur. Not a lot of woo woo rays in that. (Or , Its going to be a bumpy ride .. fasten your seatbelt)
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish. I think that's a bit disengenious, it isn't me inflating the claims of jyotish, I get them from here; The Maharishi Vedic Astrology program -- Maharishi Jyotish program -- is the science of transformation and technology of prediction. It reveals the relationship of individual life with cosmic life and enlivens their fundamental basis in consciousness. It is a practical program which helps one to avert the danger that has not yet come and to take maximum advantage of the fortunate periods coming in one's life. According to this traditional knowledge, prediction of future events is possible because the same orderly and sequential Laws of Nature which govern the evolution of the universe also govern the life of the individual. Knowing any one point in the sequence, such as the time and place of birth, an expert can mathematically calculate forwards and backwards in time. In this way the Maharishi Vedic Astrology program offers valuable predictive insights concerning tendencies in all areas of life -- health, partnerships, finances, education, career and family relationships See that line = *an expert can mathematically calculate forwards and backwards in time*. This is what I'm asking, and I don't think it's being full of shit to want to put that to the test. To someone who has lived a full and varied life, such as myself, certain things should stand out and be obvious to any casual observer. I don't think it's asking too much of the science of transformation and technology of prediction to demonstrate it's effectiveness. Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. I didn't get bent out of shape about it, I just take the attitude that I won't believe something until it has demonstrated it's worth. Looks like that day aint coming soon.
[FairfieldLife] Re: One says 25,000; the other 60
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't believe in Global Warming I never said you do... -- my jury's still out, and I told you this repeatedly long ago. So, what's your point? I made it very clear that global pollution by industry was THE issue. What make-believe world are you living within? ...one in which all the women are naked and my Little Elvis is satisfied at the slightest whim. I am never denied. Do you just think that any thought you have is valid cuz you had it? Now here, Edge of Wetness, you are projecting...you are, of course, talking about yourself. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung no_reply@ wrote: Before you buy nuclear power plants, discover who owns most of the uranium in the world -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about nuclear use is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking. [snip] Before you buy into Al Gore's wacky theory about Global Warming, discover who owns stock in Green industries -- they'll be the one's profiting, and if all your information about Global Warming is coming from them, then you're just reading material that is like that propaganda printed up by the cigarette industry about the wonderful health improvements from smoking: http://newsbusters.org/node/11149
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:44 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Snip The final woo woo aspect is the claim that humans could know about such a connection using ancient scriptures from a pre-scientific culture who believed in many forms of divination. Huh? Are you suggesting that ancient cultures bring absolutely nothing to the table? No valid knowledge of ANYTHING? Whew. We have different views there. I was putting my finger on the epistemological basis for the claims of Joitish. They come from ancient scriptures, not from any empirical basis. What you're missing here is that these scriptures come from direct empirical insight from the sages who wrote them. And some of these are (allegedly) insights into people who would visit a particular Jyotishi ( I'm speaking of the Surya or Brighu samhita style Jyotishis here). For example I know a woman who was recognized as a reincarnation in the Shankaracharya order who presented herself to a reader of this type using her ordained name (a Sanskrit name), and after they figured out which palm leaf related to her life, the Jyotishi read it off and the palm leaf actually contained her birth name in English. The palms leaves were hundreds of years old. Also consider the following--I've had readings from a yogi who goes into brief samadhis and was able to read off my entire chart and birth time without ever having any details. He was also able to read my life in shocking, really breathtaking detail. Any person can, and I know of dozens who have, go visit this guy and he'll through his direct empirical insight, tell you the moment of your birth to the minute. He actually sees the moment of your birth like a hologram. Now take this one step further, if there is a sage today who can do this, isn't it also possible sages in the past could have similarly grokked the planetary machinery as mirror of karmic weather as a set of rules and techniques? The difference of course is that these texts rely on sophisticated rules and adherence to these rules to get some benefit, whereas the Jyotishi-sage has direct insight. There would clearly be more room for error in a Jyotishi who merely is attempting to apply rules grokked by an ancient rishi. I would challenge anyone who's interested to meet this sage on his next tour and see how you feel after that experience. How could you explain that someone could just, from scratch, cognize the moment of your birth and the precise position of planets in the sky? I was challenging that people can know about such a mechanism and proposing that pre-scientific cultures tended to believe assertions from priestly classes without any verification required. There is plenty of stuff from pre-scientific cultures that has passed modern standards of proof. Joitish is not one of them.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
But what does that have to do with this discussion? O you are still stuck in the same misconception as HUGO that this is about casuation. I am very much with you on this. It is so common to hear the argument astrology cannot work 'cos there is no known causal and physical mechanism between the planets and our lives etc etc. I think I am right in saying this was a favourite tack of the rabidly anti-astrology British astronomer Patrick Moore (who is otherwise wonderful of course). A very long time ago I seem to remember reading Karl Jung's Synchronicity which spelt out the alternative position that you are giving here. It seems a perfectly reasonable view to me (and may be true!). The fact that it is difficult to test (falsify) need not make it irrational. Is String theory or the multiverse of Quantum Mechanics any better off? Another misconception it seems to me is that if Astrology is knowledge it must be certain knowledge (the old joke about the astrologer who gets run over by a bus and didn't see that coming). I think all our knowledge is fallible knowledge, and so astrology should not be faulted for that alone. I know little about Jytotish - but spent a lot of time studying the I Ching at one time. I was deeply convinced that it WAS revealing something. Something was definitely going on. It's just that I couldn't figure out what exactly! So I came around to the ironic view that Astrology can probably work, but is hardly a practical pastime nevertheless.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: The Church of Oprah, Exposed
The scary thing is that the Christian nut cases have political clout. There was a meeting not long ago, that Cheney attended, of a Christian summit of sorts that advocates killing gays and unruly teens etc. I can maybe still find the links. a --- TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Marek Reavis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Doug, wow, the video covers so much ground, drawing the connections through Oprah and Tolle to Obama and an ominous Department of Peace. Perfect at the end where it closes with martial-sounding music, drumbeats (of war) and a Wagnerian operatic choir with the image of Jesus on the Cross. What a perfect illustration of exactly what Tolle and the Church of Oprah is talking about giving up. It made me wonder if Tolle needs bodyguards now. It's almost a given that Oprah does, and has for years, just because of her celebrity. But before he was a visual nonentity...very few even knew what he looked like. Now millions do, some of them Christian nut cases. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JW4LLwkgmqAfeature=related Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) Westerners always look to specifics out of astrology but Indians want more general answers to things like will I get married, will I have childrenor will I get a job? These are things that can be answered by looking at the status of the planetary indicators for these things. I've done charts for people where I could just about guess from the chart what their main question was going to be and often that was why am I not married? Well the 7th lord or other planets associated with marriage were just trashed in the chart. I've even seen very saintly Indian astrologers tell someone with that configuration to just have flings. :-) I can also about guess that the person who comes to me who says why is everything going bad for me right noew has about a 80-90% of a Rahu transit affliction going on in their horoscope. The great thing is you can often tell people that things are going to get better because these things only last for a while. Of course there are those who have such dreadful charts that it may be years before anything gets better. For those people remedial measures and things like meditation help them rise about the influence of the planets. If find that people who have been meditating a long time find the planetary events to be like lines drawn on water happening around them but not directly to them in any strong sense. I did once do a reading where the person thought it wasn't very good because I didn't pick up that she was pregnant which was something that is not easy to pick up from a chart. OTOH, I did a casual palmistry reading once for a friend's wife and mentioned that there appeared to be some health issues coming up. In that case those health were her getting pregnant a few months later. :-D new.morning wrote: In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
snip What you're missing here is that these scriptures come from direct empirical insight from the sages who wrote them. This just adds another layer of assertion that sages can have extrasensory experiences about how the world works doesn't it? And some of these are (allegedly) insights into people who would visit a particular Jyotishi I have to put your experiences with Jotishis in the same box with Turq's experiences with Rama. They are fascinating, but so far out of my personal experience that I can't really comment. It all sounds interesting and I wish I was there! I would love to see a video of the guy you are speaking about with great cold reading powers. That would be my best chance of determining if he was actually coming up with new accurate information. The read would have to be on a randomly selected person who had not spent hours in line speaking with other people about themselves. I'm not claiming to know that there aren't such people. I really don't know this. I just haven't seen proof myself. Fair enough? ( I'm speaking of the Surya or Brighu samhita style Jyotishis here). For example I know a woman who was recognized as a reincarnation in the Shankaracharya order who presented herself to a reader of this type using her ordained name (a Sanskrit name), and after they figured out which palm leaf related to her life, the Jyotishi read it off and the palm leaf actually contained her birth name in English. The palms leaves were hundreds of years old. Also consider the following--I've had readings from a yogi who goes into brief samadhis and was able to read off my entire chart and birth time without ever having any details. He was also able to read my life in shocking, really breathtaking detail. Any person can, and I know of dozens who have, go visit this guy and he'll through his direct empirical insight, tell you the moment of your birth to the minute. He actually sees the moment of your birth like a hologram. Now take this one step further, if there is a sage today who can do this, isn't it also possible sages in the past could have similarly grokked the planetary machinery as mirror of karmic weather as a set of rules and techniques? The difference of course is that these texts rely on sophisticated rules and adherence to these rules to get some benefit, whereas the Jyotishi-sage has direct insight. There would clearly be more room for error in a Jyotishi who merely is attempting to apply rules grokked by an ancient rishi. I would challenge anyone who's interested to meet this sage on his next tour and see how you feel after that experience. How could you explain that someone could just, from scratch, cognize the moment of your birth and the precise position of planets in the sky? I was challenging that people can know about such a mechanism and proposing that pre-scientific cultures tended to believe assertions from priestly classes without any verification required. There is plenty of stuff from pre-scientific cultures that has passed modern standards of proof. Joitish is not one of them.
[FairfieldLife] Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke
The Pentagon Strangles Our Economy: Why the U.S. Has Gone Broke By Chalmers Johnson, Le Monde diplomatique Alternet, April 27, 2008 http://www.alternet.org/story/83555/ The military adventurers in the Bush administration have much in common with the corporate leaders of the defunct energy company Enron. Both groups thought that they were the smartest guys in the room -- the title of Alex Gibney's prize-winning film on what went wrong at Enron. The neoconservatives in the White House and the Pentagon outsmarted themselves. They failed even to address the problem of how to finance their schemes of imperialist wars and global domination. As a result, going into 2008, the United States finds itself in the anomalous position of being unable to pay for its own elevated living standards or its wasteful, overly large military establishment. Its government no longer even attempts to reduce the ruinous expenses of maintaining huge standing armies, replacing the equipment that seven years of wars have destroyed or worn out, or preparing for a war in outer space against unknown adversaries. Instead, the Bush administration puts off these costs for future generations to pay or repudiate. This fiscal irresponsibility has been disguised through many manipulative financial schemes (causing poorer countries to lend us unprecedented sums of money), but the time of reckoning is fast approaching. There are three broad aspects to the U.S. debt crisis. First, in the current fiscal year (2008) we are spending insane amounts of money on defense projects that bear no relation to the national security of the U.S. We are also keeping the income tax burdens on the richest segment of the population at strikingly low levels. Second, we continue to believe that we can compensate for the accelerating erosion of our base and our loss of jobs to foreign countries through massive military expenditures -- military Keynesianism... By that, I mean the mistaken belief that public policies focused on frequent wars, huge expenditures on weapons and munitions, and large standing armies can indefinitely sustain a wealthy capitalist economy. The opposite is actually true. Third, in our devotion to militarism (despite our limited resources), we are failing to invest in our social infrastructure and other requirements for the long-term health of the U.S. These are what economists call opportunity costs, things not done because we spent our money on something else. Our public education system has deteriorated alarmingly. We have failed to provide health care to all our citizens and neglected our responsibilities as the world's number one polluter. Most important, we have lost our competitiveness as a manufacturer for civilian needs, an infinitely more efficient use of scarce resources than arms manufacturing. Fiscal disaster It is virtually impossible to overstate the profligacy of what our government spends on the military. The Department of Defense's planned expenditures for the fiscal year 2008 are larger than all other nations' military budgets combined. The supplementary budget to pay for the current wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, not part of the official defense budget, is itself larger than the combined military budgets of Russia and China. Defense-related spending for fiscal 2008 will exceed $1 trillion for the first time in history. The U.S. has become the largest single seller of arms and munitions to other nations on Earth. Leaving out President Bush's two on-going wars, defense spending has doubled since the mid-1990s. The defense budget for fiscal 2008 is the largest since the second world war... Read complete article at link: http://www.alternet.org/story/83555/
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. It's value may be psychological for people who want life to make sense in an orderly way. This criteria has nothing to do with the confidence we should place in its claims. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) I wondered how long it would take for this type of argument to emerge. Westerners always look to specifics out of astrology but Indians want more general answers to things like will I get married, will I have childrenor will I get a job? In my experience Western astrology focuses more on personality traits and Indians are the ones who want specific practical information. YOu can't get more specific than the claim for a specific time as auspicious' for weddings or business ventures. These are things that can be answered by looking at the status of the planetary indicators for these things. I've done charts for people where I could just about guess from the chart what their main question was going to be and often that was why am I not married? Well the 7th lord or other planets associated with marriage were just trashed in the chart. I've even seen very saintly Indian astrologers tell someone with that configuration to just have flings. :-) Would you care to test this ability on someone here? This should be fun. Not someone with as much personal information online as I have but someone who doesn't post her often? OTOH, I did a casual palmistry reading once for a friend's wife Duude! I can also about guess that the person who comes to me who says why is everything going bad for me right noew has about a 80-90% of a Rahu transit affliction going on in their horoscope. The great thing is you can often tell people that things are going to get better because these things only last for a while. Of course there are those who have such dreadful charts that it may be years before anything gets better. For those people remedial measures and things like meditation help them rise about the influence of the planets. If find that people who have been meditating a long time find the planetary events to be like lines drawn on water happening around them but not directly to them in any strong sense. I did once do a reading where the person thought it wasn't very good because I didn't pick up that she was pregnant which was something that is not easy to pick up from a chart. OTOH, I did a casual palmistry reading once for a friend's wife and mentioned that there appeared to be some health issues coming up. In that case those health were her getting pregnant a few months later. :-D new.morning wrote: In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. Belief in God has no proven value, and it's still around. People *like* to believe in fantasies. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) And, quite honestly, it seems to me that a few of the yea-sayers are talking out of attachment TO having done their homework, and having invested a great deal of belief and time and effort into something they can't prove has value, any more than they can prove the existence of or the value of God. What's fascinating is that the same folks who occasionally poke fun at the TB TMers for holding onto beliefs that they can't prove are acting remarkably *like* those TB TMers now that a few of the things that *they* believe in have been challenged. Attachment is attachment in my book.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 12:44 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: snip What you're missing here is that these scriptures come from direct empirical insight from the sages who wrote them. This just adds another layer of assertion that sages can have extrasensory experiences about how the world works doesn't it? Well, my overall point is that if there exists people alive today who do have that direct insight, it could have also occurred in the past. In extenso it is also possible then that these insights could have been codified into set of rules for those who lack such insight. This would, by it's very nature, be more prone to error and more user dependent. And some of these are (allegedly) insights into people who would visit a particular Jyotishi I have to put your experiences with Jotishis in the same box with Turq's experiences with Rama. They are fascinating, but so far out of my personal experience that I can't really comment. It all sounds interesting and I wish I was there! I would love to see a video of the guy you are speaking about with great cold reading powers. That would be my best chance of determining if he was actually coming up with new accurate information. Yes, I agree. The read would have to be on a randomly selected person who had not spent hours in line speaking with other people about themselves. Of course. It should be blinded. In my case, it was. I say that as someone who used to think Astrology was total BS. After meeting this guy (Yogi Karve) I can now understand how it is possible to project answers onto any pattern in nature really. I'm not claiming to know that there aren't such people. I really don't know this. I just haven't seen proof myself. Fair enough? Sure. Have you read any on Michel Gauquelin and his statistical analyses?
[FairfieldLife] good interview with Rev. Wright
Here's an interview with the Rev Wright that also gives you the context of that Damn America sound bite. http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/04252008/watch.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Barry, We've gone through this before. If you don't believe in a God, which is to say the Answer to all answers, how do you know what you're saying is correct? In fact, why should we listen to your speculations? For all we know, your ideas could just be noise from a distant galaxy. Here's another anomaly about your ideas. You say that you're an atheist, which means that you don't believe in anything. Then, why do you believe in reincarnation? It appears to me that you are afraid of disappearing into oblivion. In other words, you can't have your cake and eat it too. JR --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. Belief in God has no proven value, and it's still around. People *like* to believe in fantasies. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) And, quite honestly, it seems to me that a few of the yea-sayers are talking out of attachment TO having done their homework, and having invested a great deal of belief and time and effort into something they can't prove has value, any more than they can prove the existence of or the value of God. What's fascinating is that the same folks who occasionally poke fun at the TB TMers for holding onto beliefs that they can't prove are acting remarkably *like* those TB TMers now that a few of the things that *they* believe in have been challenged. Attachment is attachment in my book.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:44 AM, curtisdeltablues wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: Snip The final woo woo aspect is the claim that humans could know about such a connection using ancient scriptures from a pre-scientific culture who believed in many forms of divination. Huh? Are you suggesting that ancient cultures bring absolutely nothing to the table? No valid knowledge of ANYTHING? Whew. We have different views there. I was putting my finger on the epistemological basis for the claims of Joitish. They come from ancient scriptures, not from any empirical basis. What you're missing here is that these scriptures come from direct empirical insight from the sages who wrote them. And some of these are (allegedly) insights into people who would visit a particular Jyotishi ( I'm speaking of the Surya or Brighu samhita style Jyotishis here). For example I know a woman who was recognized as a reincarnation in the Shankaracharya order who presented herself to a reader of this type using her ordained name (a Sanskrit name), and after they figured out which palm leaf related to her life, the Jyotishi read it off and the palm leaf actually contained her birth name in English. The palms leaves were hundreds of years old. Also consider the following--I've had readings from a yogi who goes into brief samadhis and was able to read off my entire chart and birth time without ever having any details. He was also able to read my life in shocking, really breathtaking detail. Any person can, and I know of dozens who have, go visit this guy and he'll through his direct empirical insight, tell you the moment of your birth to the minute. He actually sees the moment of your birth like a hologram. Now take this one step further, if there is a sage today who can do this, isn't it also possible sages in the past could have similarly grokked the planetary machinery as mirror of karmic weather as a set of rules and techniques? The difference of course is that these texts rely on sophisticated rules and adherence to these rules to get some benefit, whereas the Jyotishi-sage has direct insight. There would clearly be more room for error in a Jyotishi who merely is attempting to apply rules grokked by an ancient rishi. I would challenge anyone who's interested to meet this sage on his next tour and see how you feel after that experience. How could you explain that someone could just, from scratch, cognize the moment of your birth and the precise position of planets in the sky? It would convince me that something was going on, can you post who he is and if he ever visits England. I was challenging that people can know about such a mechanism and proposing that pre-scientific cultures tended to believe assertions from priestly classes without any verification required. There is plenty of stuff from pre-scientific cultures that has passed modern standards of proof. Joitish is not one of them.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Barry, We've gone through this before. If you don't believe in a God, which is to say the Answer to all answers, how do you know what you're saying is correct? I don't. Did I suggest I did? In fact, why should we listen to your speculations? Indeed. Why should you? For all we know, your ideas could just be noise from a distant galaxy. Yes, they could. And I did NOT try to sell them to you. You are reacting as if I did. Here's another anomaly about your ideas. You say that you're an atheist... Actually, I think I have said many times that I prefer the term non-theist. 'Atheist' has too much baggage, some of it you are about to shoulder. ...which means that you don't believe in anything. Baggage. Ignorant baggage. I believe in many things, the transcendent and enlightenment among them. But there is no need for a sentient God in my model for how those things happen. Then, why do you believe in reincarnation? Because I remember the process. But do you hon- estly believe that having a belief in reincarn- ation requires a belief in God? I certainly don't. It appears to me that you are afraid of disappearing into oblivion. I'm a Buddhist. I *like* disappearing into oblivion. I *get off* on disappearing into oblivion. :-) In other words, you can't have your cake and eat it too. And possibly you shouldn't eat so much cake before posting. It makes you come across like someone who got his God button pushed, and lost his ability to reason. Have you been tested for hypoglycemia?
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish. I think that's a bit disengenious, it isn't me inflating the claims of jyotish, I get them from here; The Maharishi Vedic Astrology program -- Maharishi Jyotish program -- is the science of transformation and technology of prediction. It reveals the relationship of individual life with cosmic life and enlivens their fundamental basis in consciousness. It is a practical program which helps one to avert the danger that has not yet come and to take maximum advantage of the fortunate periods coming in one's life. According to this traditional knowledge, prediction of future events is possible because the same orderly and sequential Laws of Nature which govern the evolution of the universe also govern the life of the individual. Knowing any one point in the sequence, such as the time and place of birth, an expert can mathematically calculate forwards and backwards in time. In this way the Maharishi Vedic Astrology program offers valuable predictive insights concerning tendencies in all areas of life -- health, partnerships, finances, education, career and family relationships See that line = *an expert can mathematically calculate forwards and backwards in time*. This is what I'm asking, and I don't think it's being full of shit to want to put that to the test. To someone who has lived a full and varied life, such as myself, certain things should stand out and be obvious to any casual observer. I don't think it's asking too much of the science of transformation and technology of prediction to demonstrate it's effectiveness. Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. I didn't get bent out of shape about it, I just take the attitude that I won't believe something until it has demonstrated it's worth. Looks like that day aint coming soon. Jyotish has many specialties, which includes medical astrology. It requires a fully trained doctor to know all the subtleties of health. In spite of their training, not all of them can treat all the diseases known to man. IMO, medical astrology should be performed by people with medical backgrounds. Nonetheless, general jyotish practitioners should generally know the onset of health problems, but not the details.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) Westerners always look to specifics out of astrology but Indians want more general answers to things like will I get married, will I have childrenor will I get a job? These are things that can be answered by looking at the status of the planetary indicators for these things. I've done charts for people where I could just about guess from the chart what their main question was going to be and often that was why am I not married? Well the 7th lord or other planets associated with marriage were just trashed in the chart. I've even seen very saintly Indian astrologers tell someone with that configuration to just have flings. :-) I can also about guess that the person who comes to me who says why is everything going bad for me right noew has about a 80-90% of a Rahu transit affliction going on in their horoscope. The great thing is you can often tell people that things are going to get better because these things only last for a while. Of course there are those who have such dreadful charts that it may be years before anything gets better. For those people remedial measures and things like meditation help them rise about the influence of the planets. If find that people who have been meditating a long time find the planetary events to be like lines drawn on water happening around them but not directly to them in any strong sense. So, could you do mine and post it here? I'm interested, really. I'll be honest if I think it's a match for how things are for me right now. If you have time it would be fun. I did once do a reading where the person thought it wasn't very good because I didn't pick up that she was pregnant which was something that is not easy to pick up from a chart. OTOH, I did a casual palmistry reading once for a friend's wife and mentioned that there appeared to be some health issues coming up. In that case those health were her getting pregnant a few months later. :-D new.morning wrote: In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. Your story proves nothing. The experts doing Jyotish must master it completely otherwise it is of limited practical value. They should be from a long line of generations of professional Jyotishjis so that the many difficult levels of intellect have been transcended by their forefathers. This is Jyotish MahaPragya - to own the knowledge. Like a carpenter whos father and father before him passed on all those small details that makes the work easy, more effective. It becomes automatic, like for example when you entered the room of Triguna; he did not have to take your pulse because he felt every detail in your bloodstream once you entered the room. That is the result of generations of Vedic tradition. I have many excellent artists in my family, but no photographers, I wish I had. Perhaps I will start my own tradition :-) To be chronically tired is something a good Jyotishji certainly should have been able to see. The first wave of Jyotishjis that was going on Global Tours spent months in Vlodrop being tested by Purusha. Whats that word, flunked ? Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived, invited them to Holland and payed all the expenses. Some cried in joy when the left for home having so freely being given the Darshan, inspiration and upliftment of their lifetime.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke
From the Declaration of Independence in 1776 to World War 2 in 1945, America was trying to promote Democracy and Republicanism all over the world. At that time, the two major enemies of US was Britain and Spain.!! From 1945 when the world lapsed into an Ideological Cold War, The US position changed upside down and Promoting right-wing Dictatorships all over the world was considered the best strategy to combat Communism. Dictatorships are easier to control and democracies have complications. In September 11th 2001, the US position again changed upside down and Promoting Democracies all over the world was considered the best strategy by the Pentagon and the CIA. In other words, You guys are returning back to Pre-1945 position. In other words, You are back to square one.!! do.rflex [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 16:48:05 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke The Pentagon Strangles Our Economy: Why the U.S. Has Gone Broke By Chalmers Johnson, Le Monde diplomatique Alternet, April 27, 2008 http://www.alternet .org/story/ 83555/ The military adventurers in the Bush administration have much in common with the corporate leaders of the defunct energy company Enron. Both groups thought that they were the smartest guys in the room -- the title of Alex Gibney's prize-winning film on what went wrong at Enron. The neoconservatives in the White House and the Pentagon outsmarted themselves. They failed even to address the problem of how to finance their schemes of imperialist wars and global domination. As a result, going into 2008, the United States finds itself in the anomalous position of being unable to pay for its own elevated living standards or its wasteful, overly large military establishment. Its government no longer even attempts to reduce the ruinous expenses of maintaining huge standing armies, replacing the equipment that seven years of wars have destroyed or worn out, or preparing for a war in outer space against unknown adversaries. Instead, the Bush administration puts off these costs for future generations to pay or repudiate. This fiscal irresponsibility has been disguised through many manipulative financial schemes (causing poorer countries to lend us unprecedented sums of money), but the time of reckoning is fast approaching. There are three broad aspects to the U.S. debt crisis. First, in the current fiscal year (2008) we are spending insane amounts of money on defense projects that bear no relation to the national security of the U.S. We are also keeping the income tax burdens on the richest segment of the population at strikingly low levels. Second, we continue to believe that we can compensate for the accelerating erosion of our base and our loss of jobs to foreign countries through massive military expenditures -- military Keynesianism ... By that, I mean the mistaken belief that public policies focused on frequent wars, huge expenditures on weapons and munitions, and large standing armies can indefinitely sustain a wealthy capitalist economy. The opposite is actually true. Third, in our devotion to militarism (despite our limited resources), we are failing to invest in our social infrastructure and other requirements for the long-term health of the U.S. These are what economists call opportunity costs, things not done because we spent our money on something else. Our public education system has deteriorated alarmingly. We have failed to provide health care to all our citizens and neglected our responsibilities as the world's number one polluter. Most important, we have lost our competitiveness as a manufacturer for civilian needs, an infinitely more efficient use of scarce resources than arms manufacturing. Fiscal disaster It is virtually impossible to overstate the profligacy of what our government spends on the military. The Department of Defense's planned expenditures for the fiscal year 2008 are larger than all other nations' military budgets combined. The supplementary budget to pay for the current wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, not part of the official defense budget, is itself larger than the combined military budgets of Russia and China. Defense-related spending for fiscal 2008 will exceed $1 trillion for the first time in history. The U.S. has become the largest single seller of arms and munitions to other nations on Earth. Leaving out President Bush's two on-going wars, defense spending has doubled since the mid-1990s. The defense budget for fiscal 2008 is the largest since the second world war... Read complete article at link: http://www.alternet .org/story/ 83555/ * - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: In various ares of life, people seem to imagine such big things. Then knock something down because it does not meet their inflated expectations. Spouse or guru on a pedestal perhaps. Or, for example, They said I have high blood pressure and yet they couldn't even predict what would happen to me on May 3rd and what my bank account balance would be. or, That charlatan weatherman, he said there was 60% chance of rain, but didn't even predict that my cat would get sick, and my kid would lose his softball game. These are odd expectations that do not follow. And such crazy expectations are sure to disappoint. IMV, Jyotish, if it does anything (which is not established that it does -- but there are interesting antecdotal evidence) says things like, The next few years will likely have some pot holes in the roads. It doesn't say that you will hit one and break your axle. Or that you will run over one filled with water and splash the mayor when he is walking his dog. These and a billion other things may be more likely during this period. But trying to present you with detailed film into the future that you can watch clip by clip, detail by detail, is not what jyotish does. Though thats what people seem to expect. And when such a detailed film is not presented, they get all bent out of shape and say Jyotish is full of shit. In that case, something may be full of shit, but I don't believe its jyotish. I think that's a bit disengenious, it isn't me inflating the claims of jyotish, I get them from here; The Maharishi Vedic Astrology program -- Maharishi Jyotish program -- is the science of transformation and technology of prediction. It reveals the relationship of individual life with cosmic life and enlivens their fundamental basis in consciousness. It is a practical program which helps one to avert the danger that has not yet come and to take maximum advantage of the fortunate periods coming in one's life. According to this traditional knowledge, prediction of future events is possible because the same orderly and sequential Laws of Nature which govern the evolution of the universe also govern the life of the individual. Knowing any one point in the sequence, such as the time and place of birth, an expert can mathematically calculate forwards and backwards in time. In this way the Maharishi Vedic Astrology program offers valuable predictive insights concerning tendencies in all areas of life -- health, partnerships, finances, education, career and family relationships See that line = *an expert can mathematically calculate forwards and backwards in time*. This is what I'm asking, and I don't think it's being full of shit to want to put that to the test. To someone who has lived a full and varied life, such as myself, certain things should stand out and be obvious to any casual observer. I don't think it's asking too much of the science of transformation and technology of prediction to demonstrate it's effectiveness. Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. I didn't get bent out of shape about it, I just take the attitude that I won't believe something until it has demonstrated it's worth. Looks like that day aint coming soon. Jyotish has many specialties, which includes medical astrology. It requires a fully trained doctor to know all the subtleties of health. In spite of their training, not all of them can treat all the diseases known to man. IMO, medical astrology should be performed by people with medical backgrounds. Nonetheless, general jyotish practitioners should generally know the onset of health problems, but not the details. No, you're ducking and diving here. If jyotish can spot trends or 'pot-holes in the road ahead' - as NM put it - it should be able to spot a vast gaping chasm in someones life like this illness, which renders you bed-ridden for years and facing a long slow crawl back to health,
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:40 AM, Bhairitu wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. Religion's been around for centuries too. So have war and murder and all sorts of things that have very little or no value to most people. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) Physician, heal thyself. Why is the idea that the universe is a random place where stuff can just happen so threatening to some? Sal
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived, Good ol' no doubt Nabby! BTW I spent plenty of time with Triguna and he couldn't even cure my heart burn on repeated visits and taking all his foul medicines. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. Your story proves nothing. The experts doing Jyotish must master it completely otherwise it is of limited practical value. They should be from a long line of generations of professional Jyotishjis so that the many difficult levels of intellect have been transcended by their forefathers. This is Jyotish MahaPragya - to own the knowledge. Like a carpenter whos father and father before him passed on all those small details that makes the work easy, more effective. It becomes automatic, like for example when you entered the room of Triguna; he did not have to take your pulse because he felt every detail in your bloodstream once you entered the room. That is the result of generations of Vedic tradition. I have many excellent artists in my family, but no photographers, I wish I had. Perhaps I will start my own tradition :-) To be chronically tired is something a good Jyotishji certainly should have been able to see. The first wave of Jyotishjis that was going on Global Tours spent months in Vlodrop being tested by Purusha. Whats that word, flunked ? Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived, invited them to Holland and payed all the expenses. Some cried in joy when the left for home having so freely being given the Darshan, inspiration and upliftment of their lifetime.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 1:27 PM, hugheshugo wrote: It would convince me that something was going on, can you post who he is and if he ever visits England. His name is Yogi Karve and he has a tour email list on Yahoo! at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yogi_Karve
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke
Is it really democracy, or is it something more like corporate capitalism? --- Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From the Declaration of Independence in 1776 to World War 2 in 1945, America was trying to promote Democracy and Republicanism all over the world. At that time, the two major enemies of US was Britain and Spain.!! From 1945 when the world lapsed into an Ideological Cold War, The US position changed upside down and Promoting right-wing Dictatorships all over the world was considered the best strategy to combat Communism. Dictatorships are easier to control and democracies have complications. In September 11th 2001, the US position again changed upside down and Promoting Democracies all over the world was considered the best strategy by the Pentagon and the CIA. In other words, You guys are returning back to Pre-1945 position. In other words, You are back to square one.!! do.rflex [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 16:48:05 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke The Pentagon Strangles Our Economy: Why the U.S. Has Gone Broke By Chalmers Johnson, Le Monde diplomatique Alternet, April 27, 2008 http://www.alternet .org/story/ 83555/ The military adventurers in the Bush administration have much in common with the corporate leaders of the defunct energy company Enron. Both groups thought that they were the smartest guys in the room -- the title of Alex Gibney's prize-winning film on what went wrong at Enron. The neoconservatives in the White House and the Pentagon outsmarted themselves. They failed even to address the problem of how to finance their schemes of imperialist wars and global domination. As a result, going into 2008, the United States finds itself in the anomalous position of being unable to pay for its own elevated living standards or its wasteful, overly large military establishment. Its government no longer even attempts to reduce the ruinous expenses of maintaining huge standing armies, replacing the equipment that seven years of wars have destroyed or worn out, or preparing for a war in outer space against unknown adversaries. Instead, the Bush administration puts off these costs for future generations to pay or repudiate. This fiscal irresponsibility has been disguised through many manipulative financial schemes (causing poorer countries to lend us unprecedented sums of money), but the time of reckoning is fast approaching. There are three broad aspects to the U.S. debt crisis. First, in the current fiscal year (2008) we are spending insane amounts of money on defense projects that bear no relation to the national security of the U.S. We are also keeping the income tax burdens on the richest segment of the population at strikingly low levels. Second, we continue to believe that we can compensate for the accelerating erosion of our base and our loss of jobs to foreign countries through massive military expenditures -- military Keynesianism ... By that, I mean the mistaken belief that public policies focused on frequent wars, huge expenditures on weapons and munitions, and large standing armies can indefinitely sustain a wealthy capitalist economy. The opposite is actually true. Third, in our devotion to militarism (despite our limited resources), we are failing to invest in our social infrastructure and other requirements for the long-term health of the U.S. These are what economists call opportunity costs, things not done because we spent our money on something else. Our public education system has deteriorated alarmingly. We have failed to provide health care to all our citizens and neglected our responsibilities as the world's number one polluter. Most important, we have lost our competitiveness as a manufacturer for civilian needs, an infinitely more efficient use of scarce resources than arms manufacturing. Fiscal disaster It is virtually impossible to overstate the profligacy of what our government spends on the military. The Department of Defense's planned expenditures for the fiscal year 2008 are larger than all other nations' military budgets combined. The supplementary budget to pay for the current wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, not part of the official defense budget, is itself larger than the combined military budgets of Russia and China. Defense-related spending for fiscal 2008 will exceed $1 trillion for the first time in history. The U.S. has become the largest single seller of arms and munitions to other nations on Earth. Leaving out President Bush's two on-going wars, defense spending has doubled since the mid-1990s. The defense budget for fiscal 2008 is the largest since the second world war... Read complete article at link: http://www.alternet .org/story/ 83555/ *
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:40 AM, Bhairitu wrote: As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) Physician, heal thyself. Why is the idea that the universe is a random place where stuff can just happen so threatening to some? Why indeed? This has been an interesting discussion to watch. A few voices who usually come across as reasonable seem to have gotten their buttons pushed. It was OK as long as we were only disbelieving in the claims of the TMO, but we *crossed the line*, man...we started disbelieving in Jyotish and MBTI and God. And suddenly we've got trouble, with a capital T, right here in River City. :-) I think you nailed it. It's about chaos, and one's comfort level with that concept. Some, like me and seemingly you, just have NO PROBLEM with the concept of a chaotic universe. We don't know for sure that it IS a chaotic universe, but if it is, cool. Others seem to need a SYSTEM of some kind to keep the concept of chaos out of sight and out of mind. Astrology and Jyotish are systems that believe that they have made chaos under- standable and predictable. The MBTI is a sys- tem for reducing the chaos of possible person- ality types down to an even 16, and thus again rendering chaos understandable and predictable. A belief in God is probably the biggest system for believing that the universe is not chaotic. What I'm noticing in a lot of this discussion is that if you scratch the surface of a habitual skeptic about one system, what you just might find is a prosyletute for another system.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 1:27 PM, hugheshugo wrote: It would convince me that something was going on, can you post who he is and if he ever visits England. His name is Yogi Karve and he has a tour email list on Yahoo! at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yogi_Karve Cheers Vaj, it's probably me but the site appears to have no tour dates or anything really and the link to the universal society is a page of building society ads, have I done something wrong?
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. Your story proves nothing. At the very least it proves that this Maharishi trained jyotishee was a charlatan. The experts doing Jyotish must master it completely otherwise it is of limited practical value. They should be from a long line of generations of professional Jyotishjis so that the many difficult levels of intellect have been transcended by their forefathers. This is Jyotish MahaPragya - to own the knowledge. Like a carpenter whos father and father before him passed on all those small details that makes the work easy, more effective. It becomes automatic, like for example when you entered the room of Triguna; he did not have to take your pulse because he felt every detail in your bloodstream once you entered the room. That is the result of generations of Vedic tradition. I have many excellent artists in my family, but no photographers, I wish I had. Perhaps I will start my own tradition :-) To be chronically tired is something a good Jyotishji certainly should have been able to see. The first wave of Jyotishjis that was going on Global Tours spent months in Vlodrop being tested by Purusha. Whats that word, flunked ? Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived, invited them to Holland and payed all the expenses. Some cried in joy when the left for home having so freely being given the Darshan, inspiration and upliftment of their lifetime. So presumably, the jyotishee my friend saw passed the test.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--Chaos, as the term is used in dynamical systems, originated with the work of climatologist Edward Lorenz - died a few days ago (the Butterfly effect); and is an inherent property of some natural systems. However, the term chaos has a different connotation than used traditonally. Chaos simply means what especially in the presence of very slight changes in the original parameters (the metaphorical flapping of a butterfly's wing); down the road - the outcome will be virtually unpredictable. That's chaos, for example: weather patterns. Chaos does not imply lack of causation. Perhaps with a super-super computer, we may eventually be able to make more reliable predictions. Due to the unfathomable nature of karma, it's often virtually impossible to trace vast chains of causes and effects to their origin; but more importantly, even the wisest of Sages are dunces when it comes to prediction. There are rare exceptions. These are the Jyotish psychics. Find one and don't let him go. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:40 AM, Bhairitu wrote: As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;- ) Physician, heal thyself. Why is the idea that the universe is a random place where stuff can just happen so threatening to some? Why indeed? This has been an interesting discussion to watch. A few voices who usually come across as reasonable seem to have gotten their buttons pushed. It was OK as long as we were only disbelieving in the claims of the TMO, but we *crossed the line*, man...we started disbelieving in Jyotish and MBTI and God. And suddenly we've got trouble, with a capital T, right here in River City. :-) I think you nailed it. It's about chaos, and one's comfort level with that concept. Some, like me and seemingly you, just have NO PROBLEM with the concept of a chaotic universe. We don't know for sure that it IS a chaotic universe, but if it is, cool. Others seem to need a SYSTEM of some kind to keep the concept of chaos out of sight and out of mind. Astrology and Jyotish are systems that believe that they have made chaos under- standable and predictable. The MBTI is a sys- tem for reducing the chaos of possible person- ality types down to an even 16, and thus again rendering chaos understandable and predictable. A belief in God is probably the biggest system for believing that the universe is not chaotic. What I'm noticing in a lot of this discussion is that if you scratch the surface of a habitual skeptic about one system, what you just might find is a prosyletute for another system.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke
Corporate Capitalism withi it's feature of Limited Liability is one of the major causes of Industrial and economic development. Or else no trader or Business would take risks with unlimited liability. Pooling of Capital which no single individual can do it on his own was made possible. The Negative side is it led to irresponsible decison making and Greed. Corporate irresponsiblity is one of the major problems which we face today. The only solution is to introduce Partially extended Limited Liability in which about 5% percent of the total Capital pooled by the company be held in a permanently frozen deposit with the Federal Bank. Only when the company is Liqudated the Federal bank should release the funds to help the liquidation process. Angela Mailander [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 18:53:24 +0100 (BST) Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke Is it really democracy, or is it something more like corporate capitalism? --- Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From the Declaration of Independence in 1776 to World War 2 in 1945, America was trying to promote Democracy and Republicanism all over the world. At that time, the two major enemies of US was Britain and Spain.!! From 1945 when the world lapsed into an Ideological Cold War, The US position changed upside down and Promoting right-wing Dictatorships all over the world was considered the best strategy to combat Communism. Dictatorships are easier to control and democracies have complications. In September 11th 2001, the US position again changed upside down and Promoting Democracies all over the world was considered the best strategy by the Pentagon and the CIA. In other words, You guys are returning back to Pre-1945 position. In other words, You are back to square one.!! - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 2:05 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: Some, like me and seemingly you, just have NO PROBLEM with the concept of a chaotic universe. We don't know for sure that it IS a chaotic universe, but if it is, cool. Others seem to need a SYSTEM of some kind to keep the concept of chaos out of sight and out of mind. Astrology and Jyotish are systems that believe that they have made chaos under- standable and predictable. The MBTI is a sys- tem for reducing the chaos of possible person- ality types down to an even 16, and thus again rendering chaos understandable and predictable. A belief in God is probably the biggest system for believing that the universe is not chaotic. What I'm noticing in a lot of this discussion is that if you scratch the surface of a habitual skeptic about one system, what you just might find is a prosyletute for another system. One can believe the universe is chaotic and still have an interest in prediction and trend analysis. For example, weather prediction and global climate change are best modeled on Chaos and Complexity mathematics as it gives the best predictions! Chaos is an important basis for weather patterns, but we do use it quite successfully in weather prediction. However since it is chaotic, predictions are not absolute but follow a certain probability.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. Belief in God has no proven value, and it's still around. People *like* to believe in fantasies. Unless you define God as everything that is, was and will be, right? As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) And, quite honestly, it seems to me that a few of the yea-sayers are talking out of attachment TO having done their homework, and having invested a great deal of belief and time and effort into something they can't prove has value, any more than they can prove the existence of or the value of God. What's fascinating is that the same folks who occasionally poke fun at the TB TMers for holding onto beliefs that they can't prove are acting remarkably *like* those TB TMers now that a few of the things that *they* believe in have been challenged. We''re not talking Maharishi Jyotish here, are we? When TB TM'ers are poked fun at those poking fun are not poking fun at meditation in general, are they? Attachment is attachment in my book. You're attached to your book?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 2:11 PM, hugheshugo wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 1:27 PM, hugheshugo wrote: It would convince me that something was going on, can you post who he is and if he ever visits England. His name is Yogi Karve and he has a tour email list on Yahoo! at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yogi_Karve Cheers Vaj, it's probably me but the site appears to have no tour dates or anything really and the link to the universal society is a page of building society ads, have I done something wrong? The latter site does seem obsolete. As far as I can tell there are no current tour plans.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Vaj wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 12:44 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: snip What you're missing here is that these scriptures come from direct empirical insight from the sages who wrote them. This just adds another layer of assertion that sages can have extrasensory experiences about how the world works doesn't it? Well, my overall point is that if there exists people alive today who do have that direct insight, it could have also occurred in the past. In extenso it is also possible then that these insights could have been codified into set of rules for those who lack such insight. This would, by it's very nature, be more prone to error and more user dependent. I actually started out doing astrology reading via intuition which I still do today. My first astrology class was with a noted Indian astrologer and it an advanced class filled when most of the notable American jyotishis. It was quite a baptism of fire to say the least. :-D I learned the rules of astrology so I could explain in those terms what was happening.
[FairfieldLife] Re: good interview with Rev. Wright
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's an interview with the Rev Wright that also gives you the context of that Damn America sound bite. http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/04252008/watch.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com The entire sermon, or at least a good portion, is available via youtube, so I don't know why you need an interview to get the full context. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From the Declaration of Independence in 1776 to World War 2 in 1945, America was trying to promote Democracy and Republicanism all over the world. At that time, the two major enemies of US was Britain and Spain.!! From 1945 when the world lapsed into an Ideological Cold War, The US position changed upside down and Promoting right-wing Dictatorships all over the world was considered the best strategy to combat Communism. Dictatorships are easier to control and democracies have complications. In September 11th 2001, the US position again changed upside down and Promoting Democracies all over the world was considered the best strategy by the Pentagon and the CIA. In other words, You guys are returning back to Pre-1945 position. In other words, You are back to square one.!! An nobody listened to: We must face the fact that the United States is neither omnipotent or omniscient that we are only 6 percent of the world's population; that we cannot impose our will upon the other 94 percent of mankind; that we cannot right every wrong or reverse each adversity; and therefore there cannot be an American solution to every world problem. ~~ President John F Kennedy - from his speech delivered at the University of Washington in Seattle, November 16th, 1961 http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=8448 do.rflex [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 16:48:05 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke The Pentagon Strangles Our Economy: Why the U.S. Has Gone Broke By Chalmers Johnson, Le Monde diplomatique Alternet, April 27, 2008 http://www.alternet .org/story/ 83555/
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Vaj, Thanks for the link on Michel Gauquelin. I'll check it out. As far as your fascinating encounter with Yogi Karve, thats sounds like a blast. I would enjoy having my own pre-conceptions shaken. I'm more inclined to believe in people with exceptional intuitive powers than the system of astrology. There are some great therapist who exhibit great insight on little information. The NLP guys were big on modeling some of their techniques to see if it could be taught, like their work with Virginia Satir. Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived,a --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 12:44 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: snip What you're missing here is that these scriptures come from direct empirical insight from the sages who wrote them. This just adds another layer of assertion that sages can have extrasensory experiences about how the world works doesn't it? Well, my overall point is that if there exists people alive today who do have that direct insight, it could have also occurred in the past. In extenso it is also possible then that these insights could have been codified into set of rules for those who lack such insight. This would, by it's very nature, be more prone to error and more user dependent. And some of these are (allegedly) insights into people who would visit a particular Jyotishi I have to put your experiences with Jotishis in the same box with Turq's experiences with Rama. They are fascinating, but so far out of my personal experience that I can't really comment. It all sounds interesting and I wish I was there! I would love to see a video of the guy you are speaking about with great cold reading powers. That would be my best chance of determining if he was actually coming up with new accurate information. Yes, I agree. The read would have to be on a randomly selected person who had not spent hours in line speaking with other people about themselves. Of course. It should be blinded. In my case, it was. I say that as someone who used to think Astrology was total BS. After meeting this guy (Yogi Karve) I can now understand how it is possible to project answers onto any pattern in nature really. I'm not claiming to know that there aren't such people. I really don't know this. I just haven't seen proof myself. Fair enough? Sure. Have you read any on Michel Gauquelin and his statistical analyses?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
hugheshugo wrote: I'll be honest if I think it's a match for how things are for me right now. If you have time it would be fun. So, could you do mine and post it here? I'm interested, really. You can post your birth details to FFL and those here who are astrologers including myself will take a look at it. Problem is we know some things about you already so the best we can do is make predictions for your future and wait to see if they manifest. However let's not turn FFL into just another astrology group. There are already plenty of those on Yahoo. Most that teach a school where you should at least pretend you know some astrology and want some help understanding your chart otherwise most will think you're trying to get a free reading that many charge for (I don't it's more a hobby for me).
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:40 AM, Bhairitu wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. Religion's been around for centuries too. So have war and murder and all sorts of things that have very little or no value to most people. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) Physician, heal thyself. Why is the idea that the universe is a random place where stuff can just happen so threatening to some? Sal You're assuming that you know the answer, Sal. Who told you that the universe is random? If you have convinced yourself this generalization, how do you know you're right? Did someone from the cosmos reveal this secret to you? JR
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, matrixmonitor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --Chaos, as the term is used in dynamical systems, originated with the work of climatologist Edward Lorenz - died a few days ago (the Butterfly effect); and is an inherent property of some natural systems. However, the term chaos has a different connotation than used traditonally. Chaos simply means what especially in the presence of very slight changes in the original parameters (the metaphorical flapping of a butterfly's wing); down the road - the outcome will be virtually unpredictable. That's chaos, for example: weather patterns. Chaos does not imply lack of causation. Perhaps with a super-super computer, we may eventually be able to make more reliable predictions. Just checking...wouldn't a belief that we may eventually be able to make more reliable predic- tions imply a belief that it's possible? And wouldn't that imply a belief that there might possibly be a system? Due to the unfathomable nature of karma, it's often virtually impossible to trace vast chains of causes and effects to their origin; ... Why virtually impossible? Again, what's wrong with impossible? ...but more importantly, even the wisest of Sages are dunces when it comes to prediction. There are rare exceptions. These are the Jyotish psychics. Find one and don't let him go. You're not suggesting a kidnapping, are you? I just don't believe in Jyotish...I don't desire any Jyotishi harm or want to not let them go or anything like that. If you get off on that sorta thing, go for it...just be careful, so that we don't see any articles in the Enquirer about Jyotishi In Bondage. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, hugheshugo richardhughes103@ wrote: Here's a true story; I know a girl who has suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome for twenty years, this is a serious auto-immune disorder and has stopped her ever having a job or doing what she wants, and she is very bright and motivated. When she went to see a jyotishee she obviously expected some sort of news about when (if) she would make a recovery. After an hour of generalities and glib personality analysis the jyotishee asked if she had any questions. One, she said, when is my health going to improve? The chap checked his chart and said there was nothing wrong with her health. She got her money back. And I just felt more justified in my scepticism. Your story proves nothing. At the very least it proves that this Maharishi trained jyotishee was a charlatan. The experts doing Jyotish must master it completely otherwise it is of limited practical value. They should be from a long line of generations of professional Jyotishjis so that the many difficult levels of intellect have been transcended by their forefathers. This is Jyotish MahaPragya - to own the knowledge. Like a carpenter whos father and father before him passed on all those small details that makes the work easy, more effective. It becomes automatic, like for example when you entered the room of Triguna; he did not have to take your pulse because he felt every detail in your bloodstream once you entered the room. That is the result of generations of Vedic tradition. I have many excellent artists in my family, but no photographers, I wish I had. Perhaps I will start my own tradition :-) To be chronically tired is something a good Jyotishji certainly should have been able to see. The first wave of Jyotishjis that was going on Global Tours spent months in Vlodrop being tested by Purusha. Whats that word, flunked ? Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived, invited them to Holland and payed all the expenses. Some cried in joy when the left for home having so freely being given the Darshan, inspiration and upliftment of their lifetime. So presumably, the jyotishee my friend saw passed the test. Most probably not.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke
Well, whatever you call it, it seems irresponsible and, in all likelihood counterproductive, to impose it at the point of a gun. Moreover, I'm not convinced that the agenda is economic development rather than depopulation. And then, even if it's economic development, whose development are we talking about in the case of, say, Iraq--Iraqi development or American development? --- Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Corporate Capitalism withi it's feature of Limited Liability is one of the major causes of Industrial and economic development. Or else no trader or Business would take risks with unlimited liability. Pooling of Capital which no single individual can do it on his own was made possible. The Negative side is it led to irresponsible decison making and Greed. Corporate irresponsiblity is one of the major problems which we face today. The only solution is to introduce Partially extended Limited Liability in which about 5% percent of the total Capital pooled by the company be held in a permanently frozen deposit with the Federal Bank. Only when the company is Liqudated the Federal bank should release the funds to help the liquidation process. Angela Mailander [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 18:53:24 +0100 (BST) Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Why the [Invincible] U.S. Has Gone Broke Is it really democracy, or is it something more like corporate capitalism? --- Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From the Declaration of Independence in 1776 to World War 2 in 1945, America was trying to promote Democracy and Republicanism all over the world. At that time, the two major enemies of US was Britain and Spain.!! From 1945 when the world lapsed into an Ideological Cold War, The US position changed upside down and Promoting right-wing Dictatorships all over the world was considered the best strategy to combat Communism. Dictatorships are easier to control and democracies have complications. In September 11th 2001, the US position again changed upside down and Promoting Democracies all over the world was considered the best strategy by the Pentagon and the CIA. In other words, You guys are returning back to Pre-1945 position. In other words, You are back to square one.!! - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Sal Sunshine wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 11:40 AM, Bhairitu wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. Religion's been around for centuries too. So have war and murder and all sorts of things that have very little or no value to most people. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) Physician, heal thyself. Why is the idea that the universe is a random place where stuff can just happen so threatening to some? Sal Well perhaps because some of us do see a pattern in that random chaos? I love discussing predestiny to people who usually wind up one dimensional in their argument usually then I don't need to do anything anymore according to you. To which I respond, yes, if that is your destiny. :-D
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 2:05 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: Some, like me and seemingly you, just have NO PROBLEM with the concept of a chaotic universe. We don't know for sure that it IS a chaotic universe, but if it is, cool. Others seem to need a SYSTEM of some kind to keep the concept of chaos out of sight and out of mind. Astrology and Jyotish are systems that believe that they have made chaos under- standable and predictable. The MBTI is a sys- tem for reducing the chaos of possible person- ality types down to an even 16, and thus again rendering chaos understandable and predictable. A belief in God is probably the biggest system for believing that the universe is not chaotic. What I'm noticing in a lot of this discussion is that if you scratch the surface of a habitual skeptic about one system, what you just might find is a prosyletute for another system. One can believe the universe is chaotic and still have an interest in prediction and trend analysis. Tell me about it. I work in the field. For example, weather prediction and global climate change are best modeled on Chaos and Complexity mathematics as it gives the best predictions! Only in that case. Other algorithms work better in other cases. The same engine that solves effectively for MP problems wouldn't solve as effectively for CP problems. Chaos is an important basis for weather patterns, but we do use it quite successfully in weather prediction. However since it is chaotic, predictions are not absolute but follow a certain probability. And I have NO PROBLEM with probability. My issue is simply with the belief in the possibility of 100% accuracy, in an infallible system. That just doesn't seem to give the universe enough credit in my book.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Probably 30% were simply returned to India. Nevertheless Maharishi in his boundless generosity, knowing their shortcomings in detail no doubt long before they arrived, Good ol' no doubt Nabby! BTW I spent plenty of time with Triguna and he couldn't even cure my heart burn on repeated visits and taking all his foul medicines. Your heart burn ? How could anyone in the universe possible cure that but yourself ?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
curtisdeltablues wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Astrology has been around for centuries so if it truly had no value it would have disappeared long ago. It's value may be psychological for people who want life to make sense in an orderly way. This criteria has nothing to do with the confidence we should place in its claims. I got reading to see if I had selected the right career path in life. Not only did I select the proper career path but I couldn't help but do it. I have three planets in the third house including the income and career planets. The third house is the house of communications. Everything I've done career wise has been related to that. Not only that my ascendant lends itself to that too. I've seen this pattern with others. They often don't stray from the career path in the chart and when they do disaster arises unless it is some temporary job. As for the naysayers, most are talking out of their butt because they've never done their homework. ;-) I wondered how long it would take for this type of argument to emerge. Well if I said that the MPEG-4 codec uses long GOP frames and MPEG-2 usually doesn't you could claim I was speaking baloney when I would certainly think you haven't done your homework. :-D Westerners always look to specifics out of astrology but Indians want more general answers to things like will I get married, will I have childrenor will I get a job? In my experience Western astrology focuses more on personality traits and Indians are the ones who want specific practical information. YOu can't get more specific than the claim for a specific time as auspicious' for weddings or business ventures. But even those recommendations called Muhurtas have some latitude to them. It has been the centuries long experience that choosing the wrong Muhurta can be disastrous. Note too that Indians often just use a Panchang which has more to do with the Moon than other planets. My introduction to astrology was watching what was auspicious in a Moon calendar that a girlfriend gave me. It was remarkably insightful. These are things that can be answered by looking at the status of the planetary indicators for these things. I've done charts for people where I could just about guess from the chart what their main question was going to be and often that was why am I not married? Well the 7th lord or other planets associated with marriage were just trashed in the chart. I've even seen very saintly Indian astrologers tell someone with that configuration to just have flings. :-) Would you care to test this ability on someone here? This should be fun. Not someone with as much personal information online as I have but someone who doesn't post her often? Like I said let's not turn FFL into another Yahoo astrology group. There are plenty of those.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
hugheshugo wrote: I've always been a fan of Randi, he put his money where his mouth is, $1,000,000 to be precise, and never had anyone convince him there is anything supernatural going on. Could've been a money spinner for the TMO I always thought. Randi is an entertainer. It's not his money BTW, it is from backers who have in the past quickly pulled the offer when someone who has a good track record takes them on. His astrology research was very lame, based on newspaper horoscopes.
[FairfieldLife] Among Galactic Civilizations, Earth Is Class Zero
To All: I was watching a film clip on UTube last night which featured a Physics Professor Kaku from New York City University. He stated that, at the present time, there appears to be no evidence of any civilizations in the galaxy that have achieved mastery over nature. Physicists are using a classification system with the following achievement value: Class 1- a civilization that has achieved mastery in using the available resources in its own planet. Class 2 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the Sun, after exhausting the energy resources in its own planet. Class 3 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the galaxy, after exhausting its reliance on the Sun. Using this criteria, the professor believed that the Earth is Class Zero since the civilization of Earth is still relying on fossil fuels for its enery resource. In science fiction speak, Class 2 civilizations would be equivalent to the Star Trek spacefarers. Class 3 civilizations would be equivalent to the Empire in Star Wars.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Question for Rick
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I was trying to be funny...oh well! Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit OffWorld said...sarcastically. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Re: Among Galactic Civilizations, Earth Is Class Zero
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To All: I was watching a film clip on UTube last night which featured a Physics Professor Kaku from New York City University. He stated that, at the present time, there appears to be no evidence of any civilizations in the galaxy that have achieved mastery over nature. Physicists are using a classification system with the following achievement value: Class 1- a civilization that has achieved mastery in using the available resources in its own planet. Class 2 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the Sun, after exhausting the energy resources in its own planet. Class 3 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the galaxy, after exhausting its reliance on the Sun. Using this criteria, the professor believed that the Earth is Class Zero since the civilization of Earth is still relying on fossil fuels for its enery resource. In science fiction speak, Class 2 civilizations would be equivalent to the Star Trek spacefarers. Class 3 civilizations would be equivalent to the Empire in Star Wars. Yes, it would. Look at the words you're using. Mastery over the galaxy. Harnessing it. That's so Darth Vader, dude. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: good interview with Rev. Wright
Angela Mailander wrote: Here's an interview with the Rev Wright... Wright should probably have just kept his mouth shut; he's already cost Obama the Dem nomination. It's not likely he can overcome the media attention now riveted on his former pastor. For Obama, the reappearance of the Rev. Wright comes at just the wrong moment -- stealing time and attention Obama needs for himself, reminding superdelegates that, despite Obama's eloquent speech about race in America, the controversy likely will be a part of any general election campaign. Read more: 'For Obama, Wright the Latest in a Long Line of Tests' By Dan Balz Washington Post, Aprile 28, 2008 http://tinyurl.com/4vw4bu Africans have a different meter, and Africans have a different tonality, he said. Europeans have seven tones, Africans have five. White people clap differently than black people. Africans and African-Americans are right-brained, subject-oriented in their learning style, he said. They have a different way of learning. And so on. - Pastor Jeremiah Wright Read more: 'Jeremiah Wright, racial phrenologist' Posted by Michelle: Michelle Malkin, April 28, 2008 http://tinyurl.com/3psrq3
Re: [FairfieldLife] good interview with Rev. Wright
He has given two speeches since the interview one to the national press core and the other to the NAACP can anyone tell me where I can access these speeches... Angela Mailander [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here's an interview with the Rev Wright that also gives you the context of that Damn America sound bite. http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/04252008/watch.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Among Galactic Civilizations, Earth Is Class Zero
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To All: I was watching a film clip on UTube last night which featured a Physics Professor Kaku from New York City University. He stated that, at the present time, there appears to be no evidence of any civilizations in the galaxy that have achieved mastery over nature. Physicists are using a classification system with the following achievement value: Class 1- a civilization that has achieved mastery in using the available resources in its own planet. Class 2 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the Sun, after exhausting the energy resources in its own planet. Class 3 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the galaxy, after exhausting its reliance on the Sun. Using this criteria, the professor believed that the Earth is Class Zero since the civilization of Earth is still relying on fossil fuels for its enery resource. In science fiction speak, Class 2 civilizations would be equivalent to the Star Trek spacefarers. Class 3 civilizations would be equivalent to the Empire in Star Wars. What is 'civilization'? Is it better to have a billion ignorant people go into outer space, living in extra-terrestrial shopping malls, scratching around on the barren rocks they discover, and to boldly go where no ignaramous has gone before? Or is it better to have a few billion enlightened people living in tune with nature on Earth, nurturing the heart and soul of the inner spirit of life, and expanding the mind to its full self-sufficient invincible capacity? OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Bhairitu wrote: His astrology research was very lame, based on newspaper horoscopes. Most astrologers don't generally consider astrology to be particularly paranormal, so they probably wouldn't be interesting in having James Randi test any of their theories. Question: Why is it that most people, when discussing astrology, seem to always go to the extreme of trying to introduce conspiracy theories in their efforts to prove astrology? 'Flim-Flam!' Psychics, ESP, Unicorns, and Other Delusions by James Randi Prometheus Books, 1982 http://tinyurl.com/3ut3xf
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
Vaj wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 2:11 PM, hugheshugo wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 1:27 PM, hugheshugo wrote: It would convince me that something was going on, can you post who he is and if he ever visits England. His name is Yogi Karve and he has a tour email list on Yahoo! at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Yogi_Karve Cheers Vaj, it's probably me but the site appears to have no tour dates or anything really and the link to the universal society is a page of building society ads, have I done something wrong? The latter site does seem obsolete. As far as I can tell there are no current tour plans. I've had a reading from him. What he has done is memorize some charts that give him an anchor to where the planets were at the time. I learned to do this myself from one of my teachers. I can usually figure out mentally where the slow moving planets were during a year. The moon, mars, venus and mercury, forget it they move too fast. Ascendants can be approximated from the birth time because the Sun rises in the Sun sign of date. You can more or less add or subtract a sign every two hours maybe adjusting for the time of year and location for the earth's tilt. Then looking at the person to see if their features fit that ascendant. I totally spooked someone by inversely telling them what time of day they were born from looking at them.
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
---on 100% predictability: This is related to the Laplacean Deity conversation between Napoleon and the mathematician Laplace. But before getting into that, science as a whole discounts 100% prediction as an impossibility, a literal impossibility - not simply due to the lack of refinement of measurement tools. This is due to Heinsenberg's Uncertainty principle on a finely-grained quantum level. Given that one can posit an infinite level of precision in one conjugate variable (say momentum); then there's a tradeoff with position. Thus, the standard orthodox position is that 100% prediction on all levels is an impossibility. However, this in no way prevents experimental setups in which there is a constant improvement in predictive power. It's just that in most cases one will not reach 100% depending upon the experiment; since such predictions would require an infinite amount of information about all quantum particles. In chaotic systems, predictions at most work in a two-body system, say - predicting the positions of the earth vs the moon after x amount of time. But as soon as you create a 3-body problem (say earth, moon, and some other body); predictions become intractable after a few iterations. Now back to Laplace. Napoleon asked Laplace if he believed in God (i.e. the Judaeo-Christian Deity - given his knowledge of mathematics (Laplace also delved into physics). Laplace told Napoleon: I have no need of that hypothesis. What Laplace was getting is that in theory, an Omniscient Deity supposedly would have an infinite amount of knowledge concerning every particle in the universe and a perfect prophetic wisdom resulting from a perfect knowledge of the present and past. But Laplace new that was improbable (even way before the quantum revolution of the 1920's) - and without any knowledge of Heibsenberg's Uncertainty Principle. Laplace believed that the existence of such an all-knowing Being was contrary to what he already knew about natural laws and math. Thus, there is no evidence to this day, of a Laplacean Deity - an entity who has total knowledge of every particle in the universe (and who consequently could make 100% certain predictions). In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Apr 28, 2008, at 2:05 PM, TurquoiseB wrote: Some, like me and seemingly you, just have NO PROBLEM with the concept of a chaotic universe. We don't know for sure that it IS a chaotic universe, but if it is, cool. Others seem to need a SYSTEM of some kind to keep the concept of chaos out of sight and out of mind. Astrology and Jyotish are systems that believe that they have made chaos under- standable and predictable. The MBTI is a sys- tem for reducing the chaos of possible person- ality types down to an even 16, and thus again rendering chaos understandable and predictable. A belief in God is probably the biggest system for believing that the universe is not chaotic. What I'm noticing in a lot of this discussion is that if you scratch the surface of a habitual skeptic about one system, what you just might find is a prosyletute for another system. One can believe the universe is chaotic and still have an interest in prediction and trend analysis. Tell me about it. I work in the field. For example, weather prediction and global climate change are best modeled on Chaos and Complexity mathematics as it gives the best predictions! Only in that case. Other algorithms work better in other cases. The same engine that solves effectively for MP problems wouldn't solve as effectively for CP problems. Chaos is an important basis for weather patterns, but we do use it quite successfully in weather prediction. However since it is chaotic, predictions are not absolute but follow a certain probability. And I have NO PROBLEM with probability. My issue is simply with the belief in the possibility of 100% accuracy, in an infallible system. That just doesn't seem to give the universe enough credit in my book.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Among Galactic Civilizations, Earth Is Class Zero
TurquoiseB wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To All: I was watching a film clip on UTube last night which featured a Physics Professor Kaku from New York City University. He stated that, at the present time, there appears to be no evidence of any civilizations in the galaxy that have achieved mastery over nature. Physicists are using a classification system with the following achievement value: Class 1- a civilization that has achieved mastery in using the available resources in its own planet. Class 2 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the Sun, after exhausting the energy resources in its own planet. Class 3 - a civilization that has harnessed the power of the galaxy, after exhausting its reliance on the Sun. Using this criteria, the professor believed that the Earth is Class Zero since the civilization of Earth is still relying on fossil fuels for its enery resource. In science fiction speak, Class 2 civilizations would be equivalent to the Star Trek spacefarers. Class 3 civilizations would be equivalent to the Empire in Star Wars. Yes, it would. Look at the words you're using. Mastery over the galaxy. Harnessing it. That's so Darth Vader, dude. :-) He's quoting Michio Kaku who has taken up the mantle from Carl Sagan though Kaku is much less a butthead astronomer than Sagan: http://www.mkaku.org/
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
snip BTW I spent plenty of time with Triguna and he couldn't even cure my heart burn on repeated visits and taking all his foul medicines. Your heart burn ? How could anyone in the universe possible cure that but yourself ? My self and a little Prilosec OTC baby!
[FairfieldLife] Re: good interview with Rev. Wright
Louis McKenzie wrote: He has given two speeches since the interview... Pastor Wright sees his big chance so he's going to cash in on the news circuit. Barack Obama can kiss goodbye any chance he once had at the nomination. The Dems don't need any Repugs to make Obama look bad - his pastor can do that. This is a disaster for Obama - Pastor Wright is just another race-baiter, a hustler, and not a very bright one at that: We bombed a plant in Sudan to payback for the attack on our embassy, killed hundreds of hardworking people, mothers and fathers who left home to go that day not knowing that they would never get back home. - Pastor Jeremiah Wright 'After the Attacks' By Jane Perlez New York Times, August 22, 1998 http://tinyurl.com/6o757v The factory, which is about a half-mile square, was destroyed in the attack, though surrounding areas went unscathed. There were no known deaths at the plant, which was hit at night, when it was closed, but local reports said 10 people were hospitalized, 4 of them in critical condition.
[FairfieldLife] The black boxes just simply know it all
Anybody wondering who those meditation groups that used to meet in the seventies were? http://www.newsmonster.co.uk/paranormal-unexplained/have-scientists-disc\ overed-a-way-of-peering-into-the-future.html
Re: [FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
On Apr 28, 2008, at 1:34 PM, John wrote: Why is the idea that the universe is a random place where stuff can just happen so threatening to some? Sal You're assuming that you know the answer, Sal. Not at all. Who told you that the universe is random? Nobody. It's just personal observation. If you have convinced yourself this generalization, how do you know you're right? I have not convinced myself of it, nor do I have any particular stake in being right. I'd like to be wrong, in fact. It's just that personal observation and a lifetime of experience tell me I'm probably not. Did someone from the cosmos reveal this secret to you? No. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Jytotish is one man's rubbish, another's man's playground ( Re: Hillary the
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I totally spooked someone by inversely telling them what time of day they were born from looking at them. Good. You're a good beginner.
[FairfieldLife] How Racist Are You? -- The Game
So. How racist are you? That's the question asked by an online psychology test by the University of Chicago. The test involves showing you a series of photographs of 100 black or white men, either holding guns or cellphones. You have to decide - in a split second - whether to shoot them or to holster your gun. Go to: http://www.neatorama.com/2008/04/27/how-racist-are-you/ ** Marek's Score: 460 (I ended up shooting some guys with cellphones.) Average reaction time: Black Armed:685.92ms Black Unarmed:775.16ms White Armed:647.76ms White Unarmed:723.6ms
