Re: [FairfieldLife] Facebook loses $151 billion in one day

[Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]]

Try a Facebook corporate chart.

On 07/26/2018 12:37 PM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:



I don't have Zuckerberg's birth data.  So, I can't determine what is 
causing this loss in his life.  If anyone has his birth data, please 
let us know.



---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote :

A lot of tech companies have fallen into unethical practices.  But 
you're an astrologer and should know that many of them rose to success 
due to a good planetary period and will fall when they hit a bad one.  
Most companies become "has beens" when the fall hits.


I never did Facebook because I had my own web sites. Funny thing was 
recently Facebook HR was offering me employment there.  I couldn't 
believe they were serious but they were and apparently tired of 
wasting money on young college grads with degrees but no talent nor 
experience in life.


On 07/26/2018 12:30 AM, jr_esq@... 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:

I don't believe anyone saw this fall coming.  We're lucky if this 
loss was limited to this company. There may be others.



_https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/how-facebooks-dollar151-billion-rout-could-rewrite-the-history-books/ar-BBL45Hx?ocid=spartanntp_

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ethics and Spiritual Teaching

[Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]]

The recommended procedure when looking for a guru is to test them for 
some time before becoming a student.  That can be months (in some cases 
years).


On 07/26/2018 09:26 AM, skymt...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


I am simply suggesting that some better levels of validation would be 
useful when teachers make claims about their attainments and the 
effectiveness of their methods to enable students to achieve the same.



If a teacher is not making such claims, then validation is not an issue.

Using Batgap interviews as a large sample of teachers, most are making 
claims, at least implicitly, about their attainments and the 
effectiveness of their teaching.    So I think validation is a 
legitimate issue in the larger non-dual community.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Facebook loses $151 billion in one day

[jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]]

 I don't have Zuckerberg's birth data.  So, I can't determine what is causing 
this loss in his life.  If anyone has his birth data, please let us know.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote :

 A lot of tech companies have fallen into unethical practices.  But you're an 
astrologer and should know that many of them rose to success due to a good 
planetary period and will fall when they hit a bad one.  Most companies become 
"has beens" when the fall hits.  
 
 I never did Facebook because I had my own web sites.  Funny thing was recently 
Facebook HR was offering me employment there.  I couldn't believe they were 
serious but they were and apparently tired of wasting money on young college 
grads with degrees but no talent nor experience in life.
 
 On 07/26/2018 12:30 AM, jr_esq@... mailto:jr_esq@... [FairfieldLife] wrote:
 
   I don't believe anyone saw this fall coming.  We're lucky if this loss was 
limited to this company.  There may be others.
 
 
 
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/how-facebooks-dollar151-billion-rout-could-rewrite-the-history-books/ar-BBL45Hx?ocid=spartanntp
 
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/how-facebooks-dollar151-billion-rout-could-rewrite-the-history-books/ar-BBL45Hx?ocid=spartanntp
 
 
 
 

 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ethics and Spiritual Teaching

[skymt...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]]

I am simply suggesting that some better levels of validation would be useful 
when teachers make claims about their attainments and the effectiveness of 
their methods to enable students to achieve the same. 

 If a teacher is not making such claims, then validation is not an issue. 
 

 Using Batgap interviews as a large sample of teachers, most are making claims, 
at least implicitly, about their attainments and the effectiveness of their 
teaching.So I think validation is a legitimate issue in the larger non-dual 
community. 
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ethics and Spiritual Teaching

[skymt...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]]

"However, clearly Science does not yet have a measurement handle on shakti in 
the human psycho spiritual body. MRI’s, EEG’s, blood chemistry and such as 
tools are yet way too coarse"
 

 People can have lots of shakti and not be enlightened. Measuring shakti is not 
the primary objective. fMRIs can measure remarkably subtle brain activity. Many 
related and other technologies and methods are emerging. While there may be 
subtle changes and phenomenon that are currently beyond measurement, there 
clearly are a vast number of factors that can be measured and studied. Advanced 
states of awakening clearly must have neurophysiological correlates, for 
example, new or more developed brain networks which can be "viewed" and studied 
with fMRIs. Much can be learned from comprehensive studies on practitioners, in 
deep meditation and during active tasks, who have cultivated their nervous 
systems to sustain such states. Clear models of enlightened neurophysiology do 
not yet exist, but will emerge and become clearer over time. However, there are 
a number of markers common in advanced practitioners. Beyond neurophysiological 
studies, in-depth cognitive studies should identify a myriad of changes in 
performance tasks, memory, sensory acuity, fluid intelligence, etc. 
 

 Relying on a teachers' followers for evaluations has serious limitations. 
Followers tend to be biased, both in the evaluation of their progress, their 
teacher's capabilities and what they share with others. 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Facebook loses $151 billion in one day

[Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]]

A lot of tech companies have fallen into unethical practices.  But 
you're an astrologer and should know that many of them rose to success 
due to a good planetary period and will fall when they hit a bad one.  
Most companies become "has beens" when the fall hits.


I never did Facebook because I had my own web sites.  Funny thing was 
recently Facebook HR was offering me employment there.  I couldn't 
believe they were serious but they were and apparently tired of wasting 
money on young college grads with degrees but no talent nor experience 
in life.


On 07/26/2018 12:30 AM, jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


I don't believe anyone saw this fall coming.  We're lucky if this loss 
was limited to this company.  There may be others.



_https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/how-facebooks-dollar151-billion-rout-could-rewrite-the-history-books/ar-BBL45Hx?ocid=spartanntp_

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Ethics and Spiritual Teaching

[Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]]

It's kinda laughable to have the unenlightened make rules for the 
enlightened.  Yogis and Buddhist monks will certainly find it good for a 
laugh.


Music teachers often teach students that achieve far more in their 
careers than their teachers did.  Music teachers teach techniques and 
methods for achieving success in music.  Similarly gurus do nothing more 
than teach methods and techniques for achieving enlightenment.  AND they 
don't NEED to be enlightened to do so. You just need to know the 
techniques to teach.


No greater example of this than TM where teachers were given techniques 
to give many of whom were still experiencing "lots of thoughts" during 
TM and little enlightenment.  BUT they may have taught people who did 
begin having experiences of enlightenment.


I think Doug has it right.  Some of you are looking for saints not 
enlightened teachers.


On 07/25/2018 08:09 AM, skymt...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


A core ethical issue for the non-dual community is whether teachers 
are offering something of value, if they are delivering what they 
promise, and if they can speak with high veracity and confidence 
supporting these claims.  That is,


a) have they achieved the states and live the attributes that they 
claim to be able to teach others,


b) are they able to effectively teach others to attain them,

c) if so, what time frames are required, how much commitment is 
necessary (time and money), and


d) are all, or only a subset of students, able to attain these states.

It seems reasonable that there may be a correlation between teachers 
and organizations pursuing unethical actions and the degree to which 
they are more bluster than bliss, more talk than performance. 
 Addressing performance could in turn address unethical actors in the 
community.


A strong objective framework for evaluating a teacher’s attainments 
and their method’s effectiveness is testing and measurement by the 
tools of cognitive science. For example, a lot could be gained if the 
teacher, along with their top 10 or 25 students offered to undergo a 
standardized set of evaluation measures (fMRI, advanced EEG, blood 
work, comprehensive sophisticated batteries of cognitive tests, etc.) 
 While the results of these tests do not, at least per current models 
of consciousness, provide definitive proof of any Enlightened state, 
they can provide insight into whether the practitioners have achieved 
various markers of achieved by other advanced practitioners. And 
possibly exceeding thresholds or prior studies, and or novel brain 
activity or cognitive responses.


If on the other hand, the results of the test showed nothing special 
or unique of the normal non-practicing populace, one would question 
what the practice is achieving. If no change in brain, cognitive, 
neurotransmitter or other activity is observed, then claims of refined 
mental, cognitive or emotional capabilities would be in doubt.


I would think that a group called Science and Non-Duality would be 
aggressively seeking to validate non-duality states with 
state-of-the-art research (and help identify / weed out, 
non-performing teachers and organizations.) Yet I don’t see any 
research agenda on the SAND website. SAND or other non-dual groups 
could become a powerful conduit of advanced practitioners to the many 
university and research centers doing research on meditative methods. 
 How to facilitate and fund such research is a larger topic which I 
may try to address in a separate post.


At a minimum, core ethical values and codes of conduct revolving 
around full disclosure and a culture of transparency would be of 
value. Some useful areas of for consideration:


1)Encourage all non-dual teachers and organizations to provide 
evidence of the teachers’ attainments and the effectiveness of their 
teaching methods.


2)Guidelines as to what to do when witnessing or experiencing ethical 
breaches by spiritual teachers and/or organizations. Possibly 
implementation of hotlines or database of unethical reports.


3)Full disclosure of possible adverse effects of the practices.

4)Financial transparency. Ability to audit the financials.

5)Ethical considerations of requesting or promoting “Surrendering to 
the Teacher”


6)Disclosure (or some indication of) what’s in the back rooms

 (the esoteric teaching, the weird and wild stuff that may not become 
evident for several years after the student has made substantial time, 
effort, identity and financial investments in the teachings, 
practices, etc.)


7)Seva -- work/study/service practices.

A time-honored and useful tradition in many circumstances and 
implementations where students work at ashrams, retreat centers, 
teaching centers, etc. for room and board and often reduction of 
tuition and fees for courses and instruction. However, over time, in 
some situations, this may evolve into a type of indentured servitude 
or guilt-driven labor bondage. Some ethical guidelines would be useful 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ethics and Spiritual TeachingHowever, clearly Science does not yet have a measurement handle on shakti in the human psycho spiritual body. MRI’s, EEG’s, blood chemistry and such

[skymt...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]]

"However, clearly Science does not yet have a measurement handle on shakti in 
the human psycho spiritual body. MRI’s, EEG’s, blood chemistry and such as 
tools are yet way too coarse"
 

 People can have lots of shakti and not be enlightened. Measuring shakti is not 
the primary objective. fMRIs can measure remarkably subtle brain activity. Many 
related and other technologies and methods are emerging. While there may be 
subtle changes and phenomenon that are currently beyond measurement, there 
clearly are a vast number of factors that can be measured and studied. Advanced 
states of awakening clearly must have neurophysiological correlates, for 
example, new or more developed brain networks which can be "viewed" and studied 
with fMRIs. Much can be learned from comprehensive studies on practitioners, in 
deep meditation and during active tasks, who have cultivated their nervous 
systems to sustain such states. Clear models of enlightened neurophysiology do 
not yet exist, but will emerge and become clearer over time. However, there are 
a number of markers common in advanced practitioners. Beyond neurophysiological 
studies, in-depth cognitive studies should identify a myriad of changes in 
performance tasks, memory, sensory acuity, fluid intelligence, etc. 
 

 Relying on a teachers' followers for evaluations has serious limitations. 
Followers tend to be biased, both in the evaluation of their progress, their 
teacher's capabilities and what they share with others. 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Ethics and Spiritual Teaching

[dhamiltony...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]]

 Good framework for thinking about this, Sky.  
 However, clearly Science does not yet have a measurement handle on shakti in 
the human psycho spiritual body. 
 MRI’s, EEG’s, blood chemistry and such as tools are yet way too coarse.  
People’s experience and the transparency of the internet age of communication 
about people’s experience with spiritual people is probably the best Consumer’s 
Report about spiritual people that we have to protect ourselves from 
organizational cultures of fraud or bad behavioral morality in particular 
teachers. 
 Already there are some web pages that have comparisons. But the #MeToo means 
of report has its own reality in effect now with the internet.
 ..

 

 skymtsea writes:

 

 437491Ethics and Non-Dual Teachers and Organizations 

 A core ethical issue for the non-dual community is whether teachers are 
offering something of value, if they are delivering what they promise, and if 
they can speak with high veracity and confidence supporting these claims.  
 That is, 
 a) have they achieved the states and live the attributes that they claim to be 
able to teach others, 
 b) are they able to effectively teach others to attain them, 
 c) if so, what time frames are required, how much commitment is necessary 
(time and money), and 
 d) are all, or only a subset of students, able to attain these states.   
 

 It seems reasonable that there may be a correlation between teachers and 
organizations pursuing unethical actions and the degree to which they are more 
bluster than bliss, more talk than performance.  Addressing performance could 
in turn address unethical actors in the community. 
 

 A strong objective framework for evaluating a teacher’s attainments and their 
method’s effectiveness is testing and measurement by the tools of cognitive 
science. For example, a lot could be gained if the teacher, along with their 
top 10 or 25 students offered to undergo a standardized set of evaluation 
measures (fMRI, advanced EEG, blood work, comprehensive sophisticated batteries 
of cognitive tests, etc.)  While the results of these tests do not, at least 
per current models of consciousness, provide definitive proof of any 
Enlightened state, they can provide insight into whether the practitioners have 
achieved various markers of achieved by other advanced practitioners. And 
possibly exceeding thresholds or prior studies, and or novel brain activity or 
cognitive responses. 
 

 If on the other hand, the results of the test showed nothing special or unique 
of the normal non-practicing populace, one would question what the practice is 
achieving. If no change in brain, cognitive, neurotransmitter or other activity 
is observed, then claims of refined mental, cognitive or emotional capabilities 
would be in doubt.
 

 I would think that a group called Science and Non-Duality would be 
aggressively seeking to validate non-duality states with state-of-the-art 
research (and help identify / weed out, non-performing teachers and 
organizations.) Yet I don’t see any research agenda on the SAND website. SAND 
or other non-dual groups could become a powerful conduit of advanced 
practitioners to the many university and research centers doing research on 
meditative methods.  How to facilitate and fund such research is a larger topic 
which I may try to address in a separate post. 
 

 At a minimum, core ethical values and codes of conduct revolving around full 
disclosure and a culture of transparency would be of value. Some useful areas 
of for consideration:  
 

 1) Encourage all non-dual teachers and organizations to provide evidence of 
the teachers’ attainments and the effectiveness of their teaching methods. 
 

 2) Guidelines as to what to do when witnessing or experiencing ethical 
breaches by spiritual teachers and/or organizations. Possibly implementation of 
hotlines or database of unethical reports.
 

 3) Full disclosure of possible adverse effects of the practices.
 

 4) Financial transparency. Ability to audit the financials.
 

 5) Ethical considerations of requesting or promoting “Surrendering to the 
Teacher”
 

 6) Disclosure (or some indication of) what’s in the back rooms
  (the esoteric teaching, the weird and wild stuff that may not become evident 
for several years after the student has made substantial time, effort, identity 
and financial investments in the teachings, practices, etc.)
 

 7) Seva -- work/study/service practices. 
 A time-honored and useful tradition in many circumstances and implementations 
where students work at ashrams, retreat centers, teaching centers, etc. for 
room and board and often reduction of tuition and fees for courses and 
instruction. However, over time, in some situations, this may evolve into a 
type of indentured servitude or guilt-driven labor bondage. Some ethical 
guidelines would be useful in this arena. 
 

 Rick Writes:

 


 A Code of Ethics and “The Association of Professional Spiritual Teachers”
 

[FairfieldLife] Facebook loses $151 billion in one day

[jr_...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]]

I don't believe anyone saw this fall coming.  We're lucky if this loss was 
limited to this company.  There may be others.
 

 
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/how-facebooks-dollar151-billion-rout-could-rewrite-the-history-books/ar-BBL45Hx?ocid=spartanntp
 
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/how-facebooks-dollar151-billion-rout-could-rewrite-the-history-books/ar-BBL45Hx?ocid=spartanntp