[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: As I've been saying the process is unique not the experience. People are saying the experience is unique. I never claimed the results are unique, nor did Maharishi. There are many ways to Rome, you can walk or fly supersonic etc...
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Meditation, as Maharishi pointed out, is ANY mediation that allows the mind to experience pure Being (that aspect of consciousness that is not localized, but the abstract basis of nature/mind.) Bhairitu wrote: Oh, so then it is okay to rename say PowerTouch Yoga to TM by your understanding? Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. But it has already been established that TM is based on the Adwaita Vedanta, which is the only way a person can reach 'moksha'. Otherwise, you'd just have to settle for the various siddhis. The meditation program I'm currently doing has been around a lot longer than TM. How would you know? The first historical yogin in India was Shakya the Muni who taught a meditation that is transcendental. Did he teach 'PowerTouch Yoga'? If so, he didn't mention it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings no_re...@... wrote: Get back to me when you can demonstrate fully any of the sidhis. Can you do the same.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
On Mar 31, 2009, at 9:33 AM, Richard J. Williams wrote: Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. I never said that. This is just a typical Willy Boy, RD and Judy tactic (if in factthey're actually different people): misrepresenting what you said, what you meant or what you intended. It's the SCI Shuffle!
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Its the SCI shuffle!-- says the man who lives his life in a box, thus to him, everyone else lives in a box too. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradh...@... wrote: On Mar 31, 2009, at 9:33 AM, Richard J. Williams wrote: Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. I never said that. This is just a typical Willy Boy, RD and Judy tactic (if in factthey're actually different people): misrepresenting what you said, what you meant or what you intended. It's the SCI Shuffle!
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, enlightened_dawn11 no_re...@... wrote: Its the SCI shuffle!-- says the man who lives his life in a box... Commented on by the man who lives his life pretending to be a woman. :-) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Mar 31, 2009, at 9:33 AM, Richard J. Williams wrote: Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. I never said that. This is just a typical Willy Boy, RD and Judy tactic (if in factthey're actually different people): misrepresenting what you said, what you meant or what you intended. It's the SCI Shuffle!
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
and is this opinion, Barry, or fact? please tell us, we're all ears... --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, enlightened_dawn11 no_reply@ wrote: Its the SCI shuffle!-- says the man who lives his life in a box... Commented on by the man who lives his life pretending to be a woman. :-) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Mar 31, 2009, at 9:33 AM, Richard J. Williams wrote: Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. I never said that. This is just a typical Willy Boy, RD and Judy tactic (if in factthey're actually different people): misrepresenting what you said, what you meant or what you intended. It's the SCI Shuffle!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
nablusoss1008 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: As I've been saying the process is unique not the experience. People are saying the experience is unique. I never claimed the results are unique, nor did Maharishi. There are many ways to Rome, you can walk or fly supersonic etc... Enjoy your walk. ;-)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Richard J. Williams wrote: Meditation, as Maharishi pointed out, is ANY mediation that allows the mind to experience pure Being (that aspect of consciousness that is not localized, but the abstract basis of nature/mind.) Bhairitu wrote: Oh, so then it is okay to rename say PowerTouch Yoga to TM by your understanding? Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. No you can't. TM is a registered trademark. You missed the forest for the tree. :-D But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. Vaj doesn't know what I'm practicing and PowerTouch Yoga is our brand of entry level meditation. But it has already been established that TM is based on the Adwaita Vedanta, which is the only way a person can reach 'moksha'. Otherwise, you'd just have to settle for the various siddhis. The meditation program I'm currently doing has been around a lot longer than TM. How would you know? The first historical yogin in India was Shakya the Muni who taught a meditation that is transcendental. Did he teach 'PowerTouch Yoga'? If so, he didn't mention it. Look up the word obfuscate. That is what a bunch of you are doing to maintain your role as TM Supremacists. :-D
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Vaj wrote: On Mar 31, 2009, at 9:33 AM, Richard J. Williams wrote: Maybe you missed the point: there's only one transcendent - you can call it any name you want to. But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. I never said that. This is just a typical Willy Boy, RD and Judy tactic (if in factthey're actually different people): misrepresenting what you said, what you meant or what you intended. It's the SCI Shuffle! It's just another fun day on FFL with the TM Supremacists chasing their tails (or is it tales). ;-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. Vaj wrote: I never said that. You didn't say that yoga was pluralistic and that only the non-dual realization can produce moksha? After a while--20 30 years in most people--one will develop witnessing as an artifact of this style of meditation, that's all. Not liberation. The scientific evidence on meditation backs this assertion. Mantra style meditation will eventually lead to a EEG where the witnessing bands are present. In higher forms of meditation, this band disappears and the EEG essentially goes blank. If you stop dyeing the cloth and keep it exposed to the sun, the cloth will fade, irregardless of how many times it had been dyed before. And this is what the Shankaracharya tradition teaches--yoga will not produce permanent results, only formless, non-dual meditation will. Read more: From: Vaj Subject: Re: Samadhi? Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga Date: Fri, Jun 24 2005 http://tinyurl.com/cjs29o
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. Vaj wrote: I never said that. This is just a typical Willy Boy, RD and Judy tactic... Bhairitu wrote: It's just another fun day on FFL with the TM Supremacists chasing their tails (or is it tales). Yeah, another day of bullshit from Vaj, Turq, and Bharat2! If you were to go to my guru and ask for a meditation technique he would give you what he calls a yogic meditation technique which I also teach. You also learn this technique as the first step when you want to become a tantric BUT you will later replace it with the guru mantra which is imparted through a special initiation. For the tantric shishya the techniques are also vast but for the public they are limited to things they can easily integrate into their lives. Read more: Subject: Re: TM/TMSP not a complete Path? From: Bhairitu Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: Tues, Dec 6 2005 http://tinyurl.com/dfpgwp
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Bhairitu wrote: It's just another fun day on FFL with the TM Supremacists chasing their tails (or is it tales). Yeah, I guess so. The bija mantra is used quite differently in outer and inner tantras than it is in TM and other Shinay-type meditations. They are not the same thing. One is the seed of manifestation of the deities mandala, another is simply an Ishta mantra commonly given to a householder to give them some spiritual benefits which are helpful in the worldly sense, while providing some beginning on the path. Read more: From: Vaj Subject: Re: Where there is Light, there is no nescience Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: Thurs, Oct 6 2005 http://tinyurl.com/ctzcqt
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
On Mar 31, 2009, at 3:07 PM, Richard J. Williams wrote: But Vaj says you're practicing a preliminary yoga that is based on a dualism. If so, then 'PowerTouch Yoga' is just another pluralistic yoga. Vaj wrote: I never said that. You didn't say that yoga was pluralistic and that only the non-dual realization can produce moksha? No, you've been hanging around The Stone too long, you're sounding a lot like her! What no posts on parchment written by someone named Vaj in 1880? This appears to be an old post with no connection to any recent posts! There's no mention of pluralism, moksha, or realization. And our understanding of the significance off EEG and meditation has changed a lot since the person who wrote this. I can't help but notice there's also no mention of PowerTouch Yoga or shaktipat... After a while--20 30 years in most people--one will develop witnessing as an artifact of this style of meditation, that's all. Not liberation. The scientific evidence on meditation backs this assertion. Mantra style meditation will eventually lead to a EEG where the witnessing bands are present. In higher forms of meditation, this band disappears and the EEG essentially goes blank. If you stop dyeing the cloth and keep it exposed to the sun, the cloth will fade, irregardless of how many times it had been dyed before. And this is what the Shankaracharya tradition teaches--yoga will not produce permanent results, only formless, non-dual meditation will.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
You didn't say that yoga was pluralistic and that only the non-dual realization can produce moksha? Vaj wrote: No, you've been hanging around The Stone too long... Holy shit, Vaj, I guess you didn't say anything about yoga being dualistic! LOL!!! Funny thing is, Barry2 agrees that PowerTouch Yoga is a dualistic tantric technique. It's also important to distinguish outer more dualistic types of bliss with the nondual levels of bliss experienced in inner yoga IMO. In that light, mental mantra arising bliss, without any sort of inner yoga training, will always tend towards more outer bliss, even when experienced internally. If there's any method or technique, there's no way to get around this fundamental dualistic basis. In the Patanjali tradition the word prayatna means technique and effort, so this shows this same bind. Any technique will always rely on dualism as it's modus operandi and thus it's fruit will always contain dualistic elements. In order to go to the next, subtler and deeper level, the yogin applies techniques on finer and finer levels, setting up the circumstances to where prana stops. Read more: From: Vaj Subject: The Passion of Shiva Forum: Yahoo! FairfieldLife Sat Jul 5, 2008 9:24 am http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/182808
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Richard J. Williams wrote: You didn't say that yoga was pluralistic and that only the non-dual realization can produce moksha? Vaj wrote: No, you've been hanging around The Stone too long... Holy shit, Vaj, I guess you didn't say anything about yoga being dualistic! LOL!!! Funny thing is, Barry2 agrees that PowerTouch Yoga is a dualistic tantric technique. And I never said that either. In fact I don't care about intellectual dissections of meditation techniques. There are much simpler definitions to follow. Everything else is just cake icing. Effectiveness and safety are important. No one wants to give somebody a meditation technique that may make a person crazy. Stop chasing your tail. It looks ridiculous.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: nablusoss1008 wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: As I've been saying the process is unique not the experience. People are saying the experience is unique. I never claimed the results are unique, nor did Maharishi. There are many ways to Rome, you can walk or fly supersonic etc... Enjoy your walk. ;-) I always fly Business Class, thank you very much :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
Funny thing is, Barry2 agrees that PowerTouch Yoga is a dualistic tantric technique. Bhairitu wrote: Stop chasing your tail. It looks ridiculous... It is the inescapable nature of any meditation form with supports/props--any, not just TM--that if there are supports, alambanas, i.e. an object of meditation and a meditator who meditates through some method on an object (breath, visualization, mantra), there will always be some (subtle) effort involved. The only case where there is no effort is in higher forms of nondual mediation, often referred to as contemplation, as the nature of the meditation is quite different. Some schools of meditation actually consider meditation forms which are too slack to be dangerous, as they allow defects to arise. Read more: From: Vaj Subject: Free Web Event Foorum: Yahoo! FairfieldLife Date: Mon Mar 30, 2009 http://tinyurl.com/ctswxp
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
On Mar 31, 2009, at 3:47 PM, Richard J. Williams wrote: You didn't say that yoga was pluralistic and that only the non-dual realization can produce moksha? Vaj wrote: No, you've been hanging around The Stone too long... Holy shit, Vaj, I guess you didn't say anything about yoga being dualistic! LOL!!! Funny thing is, Barry2 agrees that PowerTouch Yoga is a dualistic tantric technique. It's also important to distinguish outer more dualistic types of bliss with the nondual levels of bliss experienced in inner yoga IMO. In that light, mental mantra arising bliss, without any sort of inner yoga training, will always tend towards more outer bliss, even when experienced internally. If there's any method or technique, there's no way to get around this fundamental dualistic basis. In the Patanjali tradition the word prayatna means technique and effort, so this shows this same bind. Any technique will always rely on dualism as it's modus operandi and thus it's fruit will always contain dualistic elements. In order to go to the next, subtler and deeper level, the yogin applies techniques on finer and finer levels, setting up the circumstances to where prana stops. Richard, this is from another totally different topic! Interesting, yes, but different. Why this need for you to post old outdated, unassociated materials?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: Ketu (who signifies the occult) seems to be stirring up some problems on FFL. The marshybots are on the march bringing up once again that TM is so unique and the bestess. Wow, is that disingenuous! It wasn't TM supporters who brought up the issue of TM's uniqueness this time, toots. Go back and look at how it began. Nor were any of us (except Nabby) saying TM was the bestess (sic). (You can't even spell bestest.) We were disputing Vaj's insistence that TM was the worstest, or at least defective compared to the ones he does. As I have said many a time on FFL, TM is a form of yogic meditation. duh And those kinds of meditation programs are numerous. It is as if in times past people in India went to a guru and asked if there was anything for people who couldn't take the time to be a disciple. So they invented these techniques that could be used in everyday life. TM is just one of those. And you know this because you were there when TM was invented, right? Presumably all these methods were different from each other in some respect. So what's your big objection to our saying TM is unique? So were all the others.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
off_world_beings wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: Ketu (who signifies the occult) seems to be stirring up some problems on FFL. The marshybots are on the march bringing up once again that TM is so unique and the bestess. Those of us who know jyotish can see why this is manifesting at the moment and a good demonstration of why jyotish does work and IS a science. It is just not an EXACT science as some people tend to believe. Those of us who have studied jyotish especially away from the Maharishi brand know better and have experience with other folks from other traditions having met them at seminars. I also met some fairly strong but open minded TM folks at those too. As I have said many a time on FFL, TM is a form of yogic meditation. And those kinds of meditation programs are numerous. Your opinion has more to do with your lack of understanding of the transcendent and its relationship to meditation. Transcendental Meditation, as Maharishi pointed out, is ANY mediation that allows the mind to experience pure Being (that aspect of consciousness that is not localized, but the abstract basis of nature/mind.) Oh, so then it is okay to rename say PowerTouch Yoga to TM by your understanding? But I don't think the TMO lawyers would agree with that. :-D I experience the transcendent which I would call samadhi a more traditional term when I practice meditation. So I think I have a find understanding. But say anything you want to obfuscate the argument to benefit your fundamentalist concept. Doesn't mean you're right. ANY meditation that does this IS actually TM, as Maharishi pointed out. If you transcend on a regular basis every time you look at a particular flower, then that would be a form of transcendental meditation. However, if it is not systematized and repeatable day after day, assimilatable, able to be practiced effortlessly by anyone who can think a thought, and proven to have benefits in many research studies, published in respected peer-reviewed journals throughout the world, then it is just rumor and heresay - a kind of mythology. Once proven by science to be of real benefit, of course, then no-one cares what it is called, or what the practice is. You obviously didn't read my comment to Roberts post a couple days back. I said the transcending thought is not original with TM. It is known as samadhi. When you went to TTC (or did you) you learned the teaching process. TM is a process and what I'm saying differentiates TM from other traditions because of the PROCESS. Comprende? IOW, the process is unique. The experience is not. Other traditions have similar processes but not exactly the same. Anything that is useful to life will flourish, anything that is not-useful will fade (hence the fading of the Republican party for example, and the fading of US aggression around the world.) All the meditations you speak of have about 30 years of research to catch up to be even considered by society (not me) to be worthy of attention. These are the facts of life, not an opinion. Get used to it. This is the transition phase. That which falls will fall, and that which flourishes will flourish. Only your prejudice can rail against scientific research -- and your prejudice against science will fade over time. Any meditation that creates enlightenment will flourish, and in this scientific age, only those that are proven by science to have actual benefits will survive. The rest will be lost in time. These are the facts of life, not an opinion. Get used to it. Reason is King, not sectarian opinion. Science Rules. Period --- OffWorld The meditation program I'm currently doing has been around a lot longer than TM.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: Ketu (who signifies the occult) seems to be stirring up some problems on FFL. The marshybots are on the march bringing up once again that TM is so unique and the bestess. Wow, is that disingenuous! It wasn't TM supporters who brought up the issue of TM's uniqueness this time, toots. Go back and look at how it began. It doesn't matter the issue was stirred up by the transits which provided the weather condition for the storm. :-D Sorry your favorite d word doesn't apply. Nor were any of us (except Nabby) saying TM was the bestess (sic). (You can't even spell bestest.) We were disputing Vaj's insistence that TM was the worstest, or at least defective compared to the ones he does. As I have said many a time on FFL, TM is a form of yogic meditation. duh Uhuh and what is yogic meditation? And those kinds of meditation programs are numerous. It is as if in times past people in India went to a guru and asked if there was anything for people who couldn't take the time to be a disciple. So they invented these techniques that could be used in everyday life. TM is just one of those. And you know this because you were there when TM was invented, right? When was TM invented, Judy, since you seem to know? Presumably all these methods were different from each other in some respect. So what's your big objection to our saying TM is unique? So were all the others. As I've been saying the process is unique not the experience. People are saying the experience is unique.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: off_world_beings wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: Ketu (who signifies the occult) seems to be stirring up some problems on FFL. The marshybots are on the march bringing up once again that TM is so unique and the bestess. Those of us who know jyotish can see why this is manifesting at the moment and a good demonstration of why jyotish does work and IS a science. It is just not an EXACT science as some people tend to believe. Those of us who have studied jyotish especially away from the Maharishi brand know better and have experience with other folks from other traditions having met them at seminars. I also met some fairly strong but open minded TM folks at those too. As I have said many a time on FFL, TM is a form of yogic meditation. And those kinds of meditation programs are numerous. Your opinion has more to do with your lack of understanding of the transcendent and its relationship to meditation. Transcendental Meditation, as Maharishi pointed out, is ANY mediation that allows the mind to experience pure Being (that aspect of consciousness that is not localized, but the abstract basis of nature/mind.) Oh, so then it is okay to rename say PowerTouch Yoga to TM by your understanding? But I don't think the TMO lawyers would agree with that. :-D I experience the transcendent which I would call samadhi a more traditional term when I practice meditation. So I think I have a find understanding. But say anything you want to obfuscate the argument to benefit your fundamentalist concept. Doesn't mean you're right. ANY meditation that does this IS actually TM, as Maharishi pointed out. If you transcend on a regular basis every time you look at a particular flower, then that would be a form of transcendental meditation. However, if it is not systematized and repeatable day after day, assimilatable, able to be practiced effortlessly by anyone who can think a thought, and proven to have benefits in many research studies, published in respected peer-reviewed journals throughout the world, then it is just rumor and heresay - a kind of mythology. Once proven by science to be of real benefit, of course, then no-one cares what it is called, or what the practice is. You obviously didn't read my comment to Roberts post a couple days back. I said the transcending thought is not original with TM. It is known as samadhi. When you went to TTC (or did you) you learned the teaching process. TM is a process and what I'm saying differentiates TM from other traditions because of the PROCESS. Comprende? IOW, the process is unique. The experience is not. Other traditions have similar processes but not exactly the same. Anything that is useful to life will flourish, anything that is not-useful will fade (hence the fading of the Republican party for example, and the fading of US aggression around the world.) All the meditations you speak of have about 30 years of research to catch up to be even considered by society (not me) to be worthy of attention. These are the facts of life, not an opinion. Get used to it. This is the transition phase. That which falls will fall, and that which flourishes will flourish. Only your prejudice can rail against scientific research -- and your prejudice against science will fade over time. Any meditation that creates enlightenment will flourish, and in this scientific age, only those that are proven by science to have actual benefits will survive. The rest will be lost in time. These are the facts of life, not an opinion. Get used to it. Reason is King, not sectarian opinion. Science Rules. Period --- OffWorld The meditation program I'm currently doing has been around a lot longer than TM. Can I re-name the act of driving a ski-doo in winter, or changing a tire in 100 degrees weather, to TM ? Of course not. TM is TM, anything is something else. Why on earth would you want to change everything to be called TM? That would be silly. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: off_world_beings wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: Ketu (who signifies the occult) seems to be stirring up some problems on FFL. The marshybots are on the march bringing up once again that TM is so unique and the bestess. Those of us who know jyotish can see why this is manifesting at the moment and a good demonstration of why jyotish does work and IS a science. It is just not an EXACT science as some people tend to believe. Those of us who have studied jyotish especially away from the Maharishi brand know better and have experience with other folks from other traditions having met them at seminars. I also met some fairly strong but open minded TM folks at those too. As I have said many a time on FFL, TM is a form of yogic meditation. And those kinds of meditation programs are numerous. Your opinion has more to do with your lack of understanding of the transcendent and its relationship to meditation. Transcendental Meditation, as Maharishi pointed out, is ANY mediation that allows the mind to experience pure Being (that aspect of consciousness that is not localized, but the abstract basis of nature/mind.) Oh, so then it is okay to rename say PowerTouch Yoga to TM by your understanding? But I don't think the TMO lawyers would agree with that. :-D Can I re-name the act of driving a ski-doo in winter, or changing a tire in 100 degrees weather to TM ? Of course not. TM is TM, anything is something else. Why on earth would you want to change everything to be called TM? That would be silly. I experience the transcendent which I would call samadhi a more traditional term when I practice meditation. So I think I have a find understanding. But say anything you want to obfuscate the argument to benefit your fundamentalist concept. Doesn't mean you're right. So you are anti-science now Bhairitu? THAT is pretty much the definition of a fundamentalist. I am not the fundamentalsit you are. I go by science, and science is pen to change, but until the facts are found to be different, you cannot possibly get around hundreds of studies published in respected peer-reviewed journals at this time. It will take you 30 more years. Come back and ask me then. Menawhile the rest of modern society is working with what we know from science. Not your mythologies of some idea that has no proof in research. ANY meditation that does this IS actually TM, as Maharishi pointed out. If you transcend on a regular basis every time you look at a particular flower, then that would be a form of transcendental meditation. However, if it is not systematized and repeatable day after day, assimilatable, able to be practiced effortlessly by anyone who can think a thought, and proven to have benefits in many research studies, published in respected peer-reviewed journals throughout the world, then it is just rumor and heresay - a kind of mythology. Once proven by science to be of real benefit, of course, then no-one cares what it is called, or what the practice is. You obviously didn't read my comment to Roberts post a couple days back. I said the transcending thought is not original with TM. It is known as samadhi. So what? You obviously did not understand Maharishi when he used the term samadhi, and that TM was for that. If you transcend, the method is that you experiece finer and finer levels of existence/mind and experience the abstract basis of existence - Being. This process, Mahrishi called Transcendental Meditation. He also said his was the most efficient way for the masses. This can be disputed of course, but so can your claim. What cannot be disputed is 100's of published studies that show the benefit of TM. I suppose you now want to call any form of mediations TM ? Well, let's just call stroking the cat TM or kcik boxing. Your argument is just silly. When you went to TTC (or did you) you learned the teaching process. TM is a process and what I'm saying differentiates TM from other traditions because of the PROCESS. Comprende? Incorrect. Maharishi said that any method that gives the experience of transcending is that porcess. He used a systematized version of the process so that the maximum number of people could transcend from it. I guess you did not transcend with TM is that what you are saying? IOW, the process is unique. The experience is not. Other traditions have similar processes but not exactly the same. It is not unique, there IS ONLY ONE PROCESS. If you find a better way to do it - go ahead, but society will not care about your rantings until there is a similar grounding of 100's of published studies. That will take any meditation, no matter how ancient, about 30 years to achieve. Ain't gonna happen. No-one in the real world cares about 'theoretical results', they want proven results. It is too late for other
[FairfieldLife] Re: Harsh Transits and FFL
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: Ketu (who signifies the occult) seems to be stirring up some problems on FFL. The marshybots are on the march bringing up once again that TM is so unique and the bestess. Those of us who know jyotish can see why this is manifesting at the moment and a good demonstration of why jyotish does work and IS a science. It is just not an EXACT science as some people tend to believe. Those of us who have studied jyotish especially away from the Maharishi brand know better and have experience with other folks from other traditions having met them at seminars. I also met some fairly strong but open minded TM folks at those too. As I have said many a time on FFL, TM is a form of yogic meditation. And those kinds of meditation programs are numerous. Your opinion has more to do with your lack of understanding of the transcendent and its relationship to meditation. Transcendental Meditation, as Maharishi pointed out, is ANY mediation that allows the mind to experience pure Being (that aspect of consciousness that is not localized, but the abstract basis of nature/mind.) ANY meditation that does this IS actually TM, as Maharishi pointed out. If you transcend on a regular basis every time you look at a particular flower, then that would be a form of transcendental meditation. However, if it is not systematized and repeatable day after day, assimilatable, able to be practiced effortlessly by anyone who can think a thought, and proven to have benefits in many research studies, published in respected peer-reviewed journals throughout the world, then it is just rumor and heresay - a kind of mythology. Once proven by science to be of real benefit, of course, then no-one cares what it is called, or what the practice is. Anything that is useful to life will flourish, anything that is not-useful will fade (hence the fading of the Republican party for example, and the fading of US aggression around the world.) All the meditations you speak of have about 30 years of research to catch up to be even considered by society (not me) to be worthy of attention. These are the facts of life, not an opinion. Get used to it. This is the transition phase. That which falls will fall, and that which flourishes will flourish. Only your prejudice can rail against scientific research -- and your prejudice against science will fade over time. Any meditation that creates enlightenment will flourish, and in this scientific age, only those that are proven by science to have actual benefits will survive. The rest will be lost in time. These are the facts of life, not an opinion. Get used to it. Reason is King, not sectarian opinion. Science Rules. Period --- OffWorld
