subject:"\[FairfieldLife\] Re\: Unfoldments of Brahman"

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi Rory:
 
 Would you be able to share some here on the course and what's 
been  
 said? 

When I was attending, a very large number of course participants 
were describing Unity and at least some of the paradoxical qualities 
of Brahman, many on an ongoing basis. I personally have been very 
pleased with their ability to recognize me. :-) Many of them still 
seemed to be focussed on the particle- or experiencer-end of the 
equation, not overtly recognizing their identity with the One Mind 
whose simple thoughts *create* those experiences.  I believe a great 
many are at the crux-point, which MMY has been describing as the 
Lamp at the Door (between the Absolute and Relative).  

I haven't attended the conferences directly with MMY lately, but I 
am told he is now elaborating on what I've called the Dark Night of 
the Soul, which he apparently is calling Durgatamas. He has 
reportedly lately been saying one has to go through Hell (the 
undivinized relative) to get to Heaven, wherein the relative 
(chandas) becomes lit with and identical to consciousness (rishi), 
turning Durgatamas into Madhachandas -- which cardemeister could 
translate better than I, but appears to be the honey-gold Heart-
reality of the absolute relative, the Solar Angel or Brahma(n). It 
is a lot of fun to see him embracing and describing stuff I had to 
make up words for, or felt I had to go foraging into other 
traditions to find concepts for.

For me one of the best parts of the course was and has been 
realizing on a much more profound level the *utter* spontaneity of 
the so-called siddhis (which I had/have no conscious attention on or 
desire for) arising as simple thoughts/profound fulfillments from 
the One Mind enjoying its own Being -- and the apparent science 
behind the precise *sequence* of those apparently-spontaneous 
thoughts. But better even than that is all the Enlightened company I 
am getting -- that's what is turning this place into Heaven on 
Earth :-)






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

Hi, Akasha! Apologies for the delay in responding to this. I set it 
aside to give it the thought it deserved :-)

NM: For me, your posts have always had a Theosophy Society flavor -- 
I
 presume thats your path of integrating your past studies and models
 with presentness. Experientially, I have always found the Theosopy
 flavor of their books and your posts to be detailed spider webs --
 along the lines of  stories our Wholeness and our particles have 
been
 telling us/themselves that prolong the estrangment from This is 
what
 we have always been, and what we always will be. 

R: I played with some of the Theosophical concepts for a year or two 
after awakening, yes. While imperfect, they provided some framework 
for expressing the unfoldments that took place after realizing That 
Alone Is. Because for me at least, there remained much more to be 
done. It has been a lot of fun and most fulfilling to see others now 
describing the *precise* same experiences, in the same sequence, I 
went through then, and to hear MMY's terminology and description and 
still-deeper understanding of them.

NM: And paticles within Brahman,  and one being the Brahman for 
others
 or particles -- such notions bespeak a quite different, and IMO,
 limited Brahman. 

R: The collapse of Brahman into particles is as a direct result of 
realizing there must be more than simply THAT, ALL THAT IS. When I 
wanted to know how all of THIS came to appear to be, THAT laughed, 
and shattered into an infinite number of Is -- each still 
containing ALL-THAT-IS, but each now concentrated into an 
infinitesimal point. So now we have the possibility of something 
more than ALL-THAT-IS. We have the geometries or mechanics of 
multiplicity, of Maya. 

Perhaps more to the point, THAT became recognized as too flat, too 
impersonal, too uncaring, to be enough. For me this unfoldment 
came when I realized that if THAT is big enough to be infinite, it 
can certainly be big enough to be small enough to care about me -- 
whereon it collapsed into a bliss-point with *personality* -- with 
charm -- Krishna. ALL-THAT-IS -- and more. The very quintessence of 
THAT, concentrated THAT.

I also found that by paying attention to these bliss-particles 
inside my physical body, I was appearing as something larger than 
they -- as a kind of Avatar to them. Then I noticed that a still-
larger form of me was giving *me* the same loving attention I had 
been giving the tiny particles. Finally I realized that it was all 
the same Me -- that I was simply collapsing into my particles to 
experience the extraordinary effect of my ordinary thought. I create 
these particles, in other words, as devatas or devotees to 
experience and enjoy the cosmic values of myself.

Over time, I came to appreciate that not only are We are all of the 
above, but also none of the above -- we are still utterly 
Unqualified, as well -- and it is from this Unqualified stance that 
we can play with our particles, give them whatever they most 
desire, and experience the supreme bliss that is their love for Us.

NM: The thing is, IT IS. In my experience, there is no some of IT, 
or
 partial Brahmans as background for someones partial awareness --
 unless the experience and/or imagination of IT is in some quite
 limited ways.

R: Yes, IT IS...and IT also appears limited, with partial awareness
(es) for the fun of playing with ITself and continual rediscovery of 
ITself from different angles.
 
R:   From here, the process continues -- with any and every 
particle we 
  find within ourSelf. 
 
NM: I know Self -- or in this case ourSelf, are words english
 translators  use for what sanskrit texts (hardly the only ones that
 dwell on such) term Atman and Brahman. But Self has always 
seemed 
 bogus or foreign from the experience. IT IS, and has nothing to 
do
 with individuality which is a mirage. Or an individuality owning
 Brahman. The individuality never becomes Brahman, an individuality
 never becomes enlightened, IT IS. 

R: I am finding otherwise, but I respect that this is true for you 
in this moment.
 
R:  We first
  find ourselves identifying 
 
NM: And who is the we (kimosobe? :)) and why did this finding 
come
 first ? :)

R: The unqualified Us, the Indescribable. The identification with a 
particle came first in spacetime, as it took Us a while to 
appreciate that we are not that, and still longer to appreciate that 
that is indeed Us, or one aspect of Us, emerging and returning to 
Us. As we pay attention to that aspect of not-us, that thought or 
story or whatever, it warms up into divine/devata/devotee, and it 
becomes good enough to eat. Meanwhile back in spacetime, that 
particle-us is witnessing its brains out (when we separate it from 
Us), then beginning to see that the Impersonal God is personal after 
all (when we give it our loving attention), and finally realizing 
with a slight shock that the Beloved and It are One (when we see 
ourself in it) -- and then we eat it, and it

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread Vaj



On Oct 12, 2006, at 11:36 AM, Rory Goff wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  Hi Rory:  Would you be able to share some here on the course and what's  been   said?   When I was attending, a very large number of course participants  were describing Unity and at least some of the paradoxical qualities  of Brahman, many on an ongoing basis. I personally have been very  pleased with their ability to recognize "me". :-) Many of them still  seemed to be focussed on the particle- or experiencer-end of the  equation, not overtly recognizing their identity with the One Mind  whose simple thoughts *create* those experiences.  I believe a great  many are at the crux-point, which MMY has been describing as the  Lamp at the Door (between the Absolute and Relative).  I always loved that metaphor, which comes from ancient collections of sayings preserved in the Sutras of Nyaya, the dehlidipa (dehalIdIpa ?), the light of the threshold which illuminates two-things-at-once.  I haven't attended the conferences directly with MMY lately, but I  am told he is now elaborating on what I've called the Dark Night of  the Soul, which he apparently is calling Durgatamas. He has  reportedly lately been saying one has to go through Hell (the  undivinized relative) to get to Heaven, wherein the relative  (chandas) becomes lit with and identical to consciousness (rishi),  turning Durgatamas into Madhachandas -- which cardemeister could  translate better than I, but appears to be the honey-gold Heart- reality of the "absolute" relative, the Solar Angel or Brahma(n). It  is a lot of fun to see him embracing and describing stuff I had to  make up words for, or felt I had to go foraging into other  traditions to find concepts for.This is great stuff. Thanks for sharing this. In my practice tradition we call it "The Mind of Near Black Attainment". That's the first time though I'd heard of Durgatamas. Even the Kabbalist's have methods for arriving across the abyss, into the lead-blackness of binah, and they descend into daath/the abyss and emerge (hopefully) on the "other side". The Gnostic "IAO" can also be seen as Isis-Apophis-Osiris, where this is a formula concealing easy practice (Isis), death-hell-dark night and reemergence (Apophis, the Destroyer), transformation, arising transfiguration/resurrection (Osiris, Jesus, etc).  For me one of the best parts of the course was and has been  realizing on a much more profound level the *utter* spontaneity of  the so-called siddhis (which I had/have no conscious attention on or  desire for) arising as simple thoughts/profound fulfillments from  the One Mind enjoying its own Being -- and the apparent science  behind the precise *sequence* of those apparently-spontaneous  thoughts. But better even than that is all the Enlightened company I  am getting -- that's what is turning this place into Heaven on  Earth :-) 
__._,_.___





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread curtisdeltablues

For me one of the best parts of the course was and has been
realizing on a much more profound level the *utter* spontaneity of
the so-called siddhis (which I had/have no conscious attention on or
desire for) arising as simple thoughts/profound fulfillments from
the One Mind enjoying its own Being -- and the apparent science
behind the precise *sequence* of those apparently-spontaneous
thoughts.


Hi Rory,

I have been reading your posts with considerable interest.  I don't
know if you have any desire to communicate with a person who is
unenlightened (and loves it) but if you care to respond, I would
appreciate it.

It seems from your statement above that you can perform siddhis (non
trademarked spelling respected) but don't desire it. For a
materialistic guy like me, it would be the ability to actually fly, as
one example, that would really take the whole discussion of higher
states of consciousness to another level for me.  The rest of the
language about your awakening is of a subjective nature that is harder
for me to relate to as meaningful to my own experience.  But the
rubber-meets-the-road proof that there are such things as higher
states of consciousness with higher abilities are, according to MMY,
the performance of siddhis like actual flying.  If everyone who gets
awakened decides that they don't desire to fly, it is really the same
as me claiming that I can in my unenlightened state, but choose not
to.  I thought they were meant to be tests of the state of consciousness.

On a broader note, thanks for sharing your experiences.  I am happy
for you if you are in a cool place mentally that you enjoy.  I am
also, so we share that joy of being in a good place with our sense of
self.  These days more and more people are describing experiences that
sound like yours.  As a 15 year serious MMY practicer, and now 17 year
drop-out from all his programs, I appreciate any time you take to
answer my questions.  I am not just a garden variety A-hole trying to
bust your balls about being enlightened.  Although I might view what
it all means differently, I respect your experiences and dig the fact
that you seem to be having a great time, as I am, in this wonderful world.


Thanks,

Curtis

PS Just to save some people a few posts, I do admit to being a non
graden variety A-hole!



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote:
 
  Hi Rory:
  
  Would you be able to share some here on the course and what's 
 been  
  said? 
 
 When I was attending, a very large number of course participants 
 were describing Unity and at least some of the paradoxical qualities 
 of Brahman, many on an ongoing basis. I personally have been very 
 pleased with their ability to recognize me. :-) Many of them still 
 seemed to be focussed on the particle- or experiencer-end of the 
 equation, not overtly recognizing their identity with the One Mind 
 whose simple thoughts *create* those experiences.  I believe a great 
 many are at the crux-point, which MMY has been describing as the 
 Lamp at the Door (between the Absolute and Relative).  
 
 I haven't attended the conferences directly with MMY lately, but I 
 am told he is now elaborating on what I've called the Dark Night of 
 the Soul, which he apparently is calling Durgatamas. He has 
 reportedly lately been saying one has to go through Hell (the 
 undivinized relative) to get to Heaven, wherein the relative 
 (chandas) becomes lit with and identical to consciousness (rishi), 
 turning Durgatamas into Madhachandas -- which cardemeister could 
 translate better than I, but appears to be the honey-gold Heart-
 reality of the absolute relative, the Solar Angel or Brahma(n). It 
 is a lot of fun to see him embracing and describing stuff I had to 
 make up words for, or felt I had to go foraging into other 
 traditions to find concepts for.
 
 For me one of the best parts of the course was and has been 
 realizing on a much more profound level the *utter* spontaneity of 
 the so-called siddhis (which I had/have no conscious attention on or 
 desire for) arising as simple thoughts/profound fulfillments from 
 the One Mind enjoying its own Being -- and the apparent science 
 behind the precise *sequence* of those apparently-spontaneous 
 thoughts. But better even than that is all the Enlightened company I 
 am getting -- that's what is turning this place into Heaven on 
 Earth :-)






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I always loved that metaphor, which comes from ancient collections 
of  
 sayings preserved in the Sutras of Nyaya, the dehlidipa  
 (dehalIdIpa ?), the light of the threshold which illuminates two- 
 things-at-once.

R: Very cool! Many thanks.

R:  I haven't attended the conferences directly with MMY lately, 
but I
  am told he is now elaborating on what I've called the Dark Night 
of
  the Soul, which he apparently is calling Durgatamas. He has
  reportedly lately been saying one has to go through Hell (the
  undivinized relative) to get to Heaven, wherein the relative
  (chandas) becomes lit with and identical to consciousness 
(rishi),
  turning Durgatamas into Madhachandas -- which cardemeister could
  translate better than I, but appears to be the honey-gold Heart-
  reality of the absolute relative, the Solar Angel or Brahma
(n). It
  is a lot of fun to see him embracing and describing stuff I had 
to
  make up words for, or felt I had to go foraging into other
  traditions to find concepts for.
 
V: This is great stuff. Thanks for sharing this. In my practice  
 tradition we call it The Mind of Near Black Attainment. That's 
the  
 first time though I'd heard of Durgatamas. Even the Kabbalist's 
have  
 methods for arriving across the abyss, into the lead-blackness of  
 binah, and they descend into daath/the abyss and emerge 
(hopefully)  
 on the other side. The Gnostic IAO can also be seen as Isis- 
 Apophis-Osiris, where this is a formula concealing easy practice  
 (Isis), death-hell-dark night and reemergence (Apophis, the  
 Destroyer), transformation, arising transfiguration/resurrection  
 (Osiris, Jesus, etc).

Yes! Then there's what I would call another blackness (appearing 
for me after Dark Night/Durgatamas, but perhaps the same from 
another vantage point), appearing as a maternal velvety black, from 
which emerge the unfoldments of prakriti...A course participant was 
describing this early on in the course, and MMY was giving the 
sequence, and pointing out the velvety-grainy texture as being the 
particles of creation, of *memory* ... which while exactly the 
sequence in which all that unfolded for me (and some others) many 
years ago, I had never thought to look at as memory...meanwhile I 
was remembering all of this *lol* and also (over the whole course) 
experiencing the unfoldments of prakriti *again* from a whole new 
clarity/profundity, as the result of my innocent ordinary attention 
on my particle/devatas...

Anyway, a lot of fun! :-)




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread jim_flanegin

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
snip
Yes! Then there's what I would call another blackness (appearing 
 for me after Dark Night/Durgatamas, but perhaps the same from 
 another vantage point), appearing as a maternal velvety black, 
from 
 which emerge the unfoldments of prakriti...A course participant 
was 
 describing this early on in the course, and MMY was giving the 
 sequence, and pointing out the velvety-grainy texture as being the 
 particles of creation, of *memory* ... which while exactly the 
 sequence in which all that unfolded for me (and some others) many 
 years ago, I had never thought to look at as memory...meanwhile I 
 was remembering all of this *lol* and also (over the whole course) 
 experiencing the unfoldments of prakriti *again* from a whole new 
 clarity/profundity, as the result of my innocent ordinary 
attention 
 on my particle/devatas...
 
 Anyway, a lot of fun! :-)

My experience is that the maternal/paternal nature of the velvety 
blackness comes about once the particles are fully known in their 
entirety in memory (and not some bastardized concept of them arising 
from an imperfect impression). So that each time any of them are 
referenced from memory, the impression is maternal/paternal and 
supportive and nurturing, vs the clarity of the dark night of the 
soul, which is the same 'stuff' seen clearly, only without the 
merging of the absolute and relative having occurred, so it appears 
alone and bleak and even scary- death-like.

Seen another way, it is the difference between seeing something 
clearly for the first time and either rejecting it or accepting it. 
Same object, different impression. First time, not a part of God-- 
second time, All God, All The Time. Ha-Ha!  




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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread Vaj



On Oct 12, 2006, at 1:40 PM, Rory Goff wrote:Yes! Then there's what I would call "another" blackness (appearing  for me after Dark Night/Durgatamas, but perhaps the same from  another vantage point), appearing as a maternal velvety black, from  which emerge the unfoldments of prakriti...A course participant was  describing this early on in the course, and MMY was giving the  sequence, and pointing out the velvety-grainy texture as being the  particles of creation, of *memory* ... which while exactly the  sequence in which all that unfolded for me (and some others) many  years ago, I had never thought to look at as memory...meanwhile I  was remembering all of this *lol* and also (over the whole course)  experiencing the unfoldments of prakriti *again* from a whole new  clarity/profundity, as the result of my innocent ordinary attention  on my particle/devatas...  Anyway, a lot of fun! :-) The mechanics of Dark Night are a long and old tradition in both the Buddhist and Hindu tantras which is hidden, encoded in the Twilight Language through various poetic metaphors, most notably the infamous "Shiva becomes Shava without Shakti." On one level it hints that kundalini must be awakened, but on a hidden level it is referring to Shavasana, the Corpse Pose, as the greatest of asanas and working with this position is a central part of "learning to die, die deeper." It turns out Shavasana has deeper variations which are instructed to students when they're ready, ready to die into the gap completely. Therefore one becomes shava, the corpse, is killed by kundalini and then resurrected, to become Shiva. Shava becomes Shiva through Shakti and Shavasana. The inner practices of shavasana are the sadhanas of this death.
__._,_.___





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread nablus108

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 On Oct 12, 2006, at 11:36 AM, Rory Goff wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote:
 
  Hi Rory:
 
  Would you be able to share some here on the course and what's
  been
  said?
 
  When I was attending, a very large number of course participants
  were describing Unity and at least some of the paradoxical 
qualities
  of Brahman, many on an ongoing basis. I personally have been very
  pleased with their ability to recognize me. :-) Many of them 
still
  seemed to be focussed on the particle- or experiencer-end of the
  equation, not overtly recognizing their identity with the One Mind
  whose simple thoughts *create* those experiences.  I believe a 
great
  many are at the crux-point, which MMY has been describing as the
  Lamp at the Door (between the Absolute and Relative).
 
 I always loved that metaphor, which comes from ancient collections 
of  
 sayings preserved in the Sutras of Nyaya, the dehlidipa  
 (dehalIdIpa ?), the light of the threshold which illuminates two- 
 things-at-once.
 
 
  I haven't attended the conferences directly with MMY lately, but I
  am told he is now elaborating on what I've called the Dark Night 
of
  the Soul, which he apparently is calling Durgatamas. He has
  reportedly lately been saying one has to go through Hell (the
  undivinized relative) to get to Heaven, wherein the relative
  (chandas) becomes lit with and identical to consciousness (rishi),
  turning Durgatamas into Madhachandas -- which cardemeister could
  translate better than I, but appears to be the honey-gold Heart-
  reality of the absolute relative, the Solar Angel or Brahma(n). 
It
  is a lot of fun to see him embracing and describing stuff I had to
  make up words for, or felt I had to go foraging into other
  traditions to find concepts for.
 
 This is great stuff. Thanks for sharing this. In my practice  
 tradition we call it The Mind of Near Black Attainment. That's 
the  
 first time though I'd heard of Durgatamas. Even the Kabbalist's 
have  
 methods for arriving across the abyss, into the lead-blackness of  
 binah, and they descend into daath/the abyss and emerge 
(hopefully)  
 on the other side. The Gnostic IAO can also be seen as Isis- 
 Apophis-Osiris, where this is a formula concealing easy practice  
 (Isis), death-hell-dark night and reemergence (Apophis, the  
 Destroyer), transformation, arising transfiguration/resurrection  
 (Osiris, Jesus, etc).
 
 
  For me one of the best parts of the course was and has been
  realizing on a much more profound level the *utter* spontaneity of
  the so-called siddhis (which I had/have no conscious attention on 
or
  desire for) arising as simple thoughts/profound fulfillments from
  the One Mind enjoying its own Being -- and the apparent science
  behind the precise *sequence* of those apparently-spontaneous
  thoughts. But better even than that is all the Enlightened 
company I
  am getting -- that's what is turning this place into Heaven on
  Earth :-)

These are beautiful posts from both of you. Thanks !

In a discussion in Boppard, 1982, I believe Maharishi touched upon 
this theme for the first time saying that to be established in 
Brahman, all of Nature must be lived. 

All that which is Light and all that which is Dark must be 
experienced.

There where no further questions. I think the majority listening was 
in some kind of shock hearing this, as Maharishi always emphatized 
identification with lightness, positivity.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

Very nice! Many thanks, Vaj.

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 The mechanics of Dark Night are a long and old tradition in both 
the  
 Buddhist and Hindu tantras which is hidden, encoded in the 
Twilight  
 Language through various poetic metaphors, most notably the 
infamous  
 Shiva becomes Shava without Shakti. On one level it hints that  
 kundalini must be awakened, but on a hidden level it is referring 
to  
 Shavasana, the Corpse Pose, as the greatest of asanas and working  
 with this position is a central part of learning to die, die  
 deeper. It turns out Shavasana has deeper variations which are  
 instructed to students when they're ready, ready to die into the 
gap  
 completely. Therefore one becomes shava, the corpse, is killed by  
 kundalini and then resurrected, to become Shiva. Shava becomes 
Shiva  
 through Shakti and Shavasana. The inner practices of shavasana 
are  
 the sadhanas of this death.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 My experience is that the maternal/paternal nature of the velvety 
 blackness comes about once the particles are fully known in their 
 entirety in memory (and not some bastardized concept of them 
arising 
 from an imperfect impression). So that each time any of them are 
 referenced from memory, the impression is maternal/paternal and 
 supportive and nurturing, vs the clarity of the dark night of the 
 soul, which is the same 'stuff' seen clearly, only without the 
 merging of the absolute and relative having occurred, so it 
appears 
 alone and bleak and even scary- death-like.
 
 Seen another way, it is the difference between seeing something 
 clearly for the first time and either rejecting it or accepting 
it. 
 Same object, different impression. First time, not a part of God-- 
 second time, All God, All The Time. Ha-Ha!

HA! Yeah, I buy that, Jim; thanks. Another interesting thing that 
comes up from this, is that *all experience is memory* -- and is 
eternal. Kind of as if the whole flow of spacetime itself merely 
appears to move and be ephemeral because our attention-flow is 
moving across permanently-embedded particles of God, each being an 
eternal cel or frame -- a multi-dimensional movie!






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablus108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 In a discussion in Boppard, 1982, I believe Maharishi touched upon 
 this theme for the first time saying that to be established in 
 Brahman, all of Nature must be lived. 
 
 All that which is Light and all that which is Dark must be 
 experienced.
 
 There where no further questions. I think the majority listening was 
 in some kind of shock hearing this, as Maharishi always emphatized 
 identification with lightness, positivity.

*lol* Yes. That would have been nice to hear. Interesting timing, 1982 
was when I woke up through that. Not expecting it, it came as quite a 
shock when all the Unity died into That ... But I expect MMY could 
have said it right to my face, and I wouldn't have heard. It was just 
too big to get my head around...:-)





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread Peter

Rory, thanks for the reports! They're great fun to
read and have that subtle impact on consciousness
deep, deep down.
-Peter 

--- Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 Yes! Then there's what I would call another
 blackness (appearing 
 for me after Dark Night/Durgatamas, but perhaps the
 same from 
 another vantage point), appearing as a maternal
 velvety black, from 
 which emerge the unfoldments of prakriti...A course
 participant was 
 describing this early on in the course, and MMY was
 giving the 
 sequence, and pointing out the velvety-grainy
 texture as being the 
 particles of creation, of *memory* ... which while
 exactly the 
 sequence in which all that unfolded for me (and some
 others) many 
 years ago, I had never thought to look at as
 memory...meanwhile I 
 was remembering all of this *lol* and also (over the
 whole course) 
 experiencing the unfoldments of prakriti *again*
 from a whole new 
 clarity/profundity, as the result of my innocent
 ordinary attention 
 on my particle/devatas...
 
 Anyway, a lot of fun! :-)
 
 
 
 
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread Peter



--- Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablus108
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 wrote:
  In a discussion in Boppard, 1982, I believe
 Maharishi touched upon 
  this theme for the first time saying that to be
 established in 
  Brahman, all of Nature must be lived. 
  
  All that which is Light and all that which is
 Dark must be 
  experienced.
  
  There where no further questions. I think the
 majority listening was 
  in some kind of shock hearing this, as Maharishi
 always emphatized 
  identification with lightness, positivity.
 
 *lol* Yes. That would have been nice to hear.
 Interesting timing, 1982 
 was when I woke up through that. Not expecting it,
 it came as quite a 
 shock when all the Unity died into That ... But I
 expect MMY could 
 have said it right to my face, and I wouldn't have
 heard. It was just 
 too big to get my head around...:-)

That consciousness projected into all aspects of
objectivity/subjectivity has so, so many hooks of
attachment. It all has to be eaten by Brahman; total
regeneration from the most tamasic to the most
sattvic.




 
 
 
 
 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread jim_flanegin

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin jflanegi@ 
 wrote:
 
  
  My experience is that the maternal/paternal nature of the 
velvety 
  blackness comes about once the particles are fully known in 
their 
  entirety in memory (and not some bastardized concept of them 
 arising 
  from an imperfect impression). So that each time any of them are 
  referenced from memory, the impression is maternal/paternal and 
  supportive and nurturing, vs the clarity of the dark night of 
the 
  soul, which is the same 'stuff' seen clearly, only without the 
  merging of the absolute and relative having occurred, so it 
 appears 
  alone and bleak and even scary- death-like.
  
  Seen another way, it is the difference between seeing something 
  clearly for the first time and either rejecting it or accepting 
 it. 
  Same object, different impression. First time, not a part of God-
- 
  second time, All God, All The Time. Ha-Ha!
 
 HA! Yeah, I buy that, Jim; thanks. Another interesting thing that 
 comes up from this, is that *all experience is memory* -- and is 
 eternal. Kind of as if the whole flow of spacetime itself merely 
 appears to move and be ephemeral because our attention-flow is 
 moving across permanently-embedded particles of God, each being an 
 eternal cel or frame -- a multi-dimensional movie!

Ha-Ha! Exactly, the acceptance of the attention-flow, or not, alters 
the perceived qualities of the permanently embedded particles of 
God, which don't in themselves change; as greater and greater 
acceptance or relaxation occurs (through the catalyst of love), the 
same object is perceived successively until all of its truth stands 
full and self evident, a full milking of the soma; The Mind Of God- 
The Divine Mother. 






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi Rory,
 
 I have been reading your posts with considerable interest.  I don't
 know if you have any desire to communicate with a person who is
 unenlightened (and loves it) but if you care to respond, I would
 appreciate it.

Hi, Curtis! Great to meet you; I have been enjoying your posts since 
you joined FFL. I have already responded to this post of yours once 
in some detail, but my reply got swallowed up by (some) Yahoo, so I 
will try again. 

Consciously loving where you are *is* enlightenment, as far as I am 
concerned. But if you are unenlightened, then so am I, as there is 
only one of Us; denying yourself is denying me. So I'll make a deal 
with you -- I will agree to be unenlightened in your world with you, 
if you will agree to be simultaneously enlightened in mine, with 
me :-)

C:  It seems from your statement above that you can perform siddhis 
(non
 trademarked spelling respected) but don't desire it. 

R: Not exactly. It's not that I can perform siddhis; siddhis get 
performed if the spontaneous desire arises. I have no control over 
what I truly desire; nor can I demonstrate them for another if the 
genuine desire/need in both of Us isn't there. If there is 
sufficient grace-flow between Us, anything can happen :-)

C: For a
 materialistic guy like me, it would be the ability to actually 
fly, as
 one example, that would really take the whole discussion of higher
 states of consciousness to another level for me.  

R: I understand that. For four years after I awoke, I had a burning 
desire to fly, and I bent all of my inquiry in that direction. 
Finally after some internal stages and an intermediary external 
stage (Tibetan Stride), I spontaneously wondered what it would like 
to be an Ascended Master, and THEN flew, ONCE, lifting off, 
dematerializing, eventually rematerializing and dropping back to 
earth (completely blowing my bodymind all over again; there were 
four of us participating). Since then, the desire has not arisen, at 
least for me as an individual. 

I have once or twice desired that all the course participants (my 
particles) fly, and experienced an immediate outpouring of Bliss 
throughout the Dome and coherent hopping like crazy, but so far, 
that's it. I can't push it from my side, except by loving attention 
to all my particles. The bottom line is, I don't generally really 
care if I can fly, or even if you can fly. What I care about is how 
much you unconditionally love me/yourself and my/your creation. The 
rest is gravy :-)

C: The rest of the
 language about your awakening is of a subjective nature that is 
harder
 for me to relate to as meaningful to my own experience.  But the
 rubber-meets-the-road proof that there are such things as higher
 states of consciousness with higher abilities are, according to 
MMY,
 the performance of siddhis like actual flying.  If everyone who 
gets
 awakened decides that they don't desire to fly, it is really the 
same
 as me claiming that I can in my unenlightened state, but choose not
 to.  

R: And that would be entirely accurate from my POV, except for 
the unenlightened part :-)

C: I thought they were meant to be tests of the state of 
consciousness.

R: Yes, but they are subjective tests -- until we have enlightened 
enough of our particles to mutually enjoy a consensus (objective) 
reality. The siddhis are spontaneous fulfillments of spontaneous 
desires. They appear quite ordinary, from our standard POV. Did you 
think that communicating with animals *wasn't* a siddhi? :-)
 
C:  On a broader note, thanks for sharing your experiences.  I am 
happy
 for you if you are in a cool place mentally that you enjoy.  I am
 also, so we share that joy of being in a good place with our sense 
of
 self.  

R: That's what it's all about :-)

C: These days more and more people are describing experiences that
 sound like yours.  As a 15 year serious MMY practicer, and now 17 
year
 drop-out from all his programs, 

R: *lol* Gotcha beat -- I was a 24-year drop-out from all of his 
programs! The joke was on me though -- the fact is *you can't drop 
out* -- if you are following yourSelf, you're doing what MMY wants 
you to do. The grace-flow continues, doesn't it? My guess is, 
you dropped out when you woke up into spontaneous practice...:-)

C: I appreciate any time you take to
 answer my questions.  I am not just a garden variety A-hole trying 
to
 bust your balls about being enlightened.  Although I might view 
what
 it all means differently, I respect your experiences and dig the 
fact
 that you seem to be having a great time, as I am, in this 
wonderful world.

R: Amen, brother! Amen. Heart to Heart. :-)




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 Ha-Ha! Exactly, the acceptance of the attention-flow, or not, 
alters 
 the perceived qualities of the permanently embedded particles of 
 God, which don't in themselves change; as greater and greater 
 acceptance or relaxation occurs (through the catalyst of love), 
the 
 same object is perceived successively until all of its truth 
stands 
 full and self evident, a full milking of the soma; The Mind Of God-
 
 The Divine Mother.

MOST interesting you would say that; I have really been enjoying the 
fact that all experience, all memory is NOW, and we go back over 
*overwhelming* experiences as many times as necessary to milk them 
dry, Understanding them fully! 

*L*L*L*







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread jim_flanegin

--- In 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tomandcindytraynoratfairfieldlis 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 more on particles:
 
 from Jed McKennas 2nd book p301  Spiritually Incorrect 
enlightenment
 
 The entirety of mankind's science can be summarily discarded by 
anyone
 who understands the First Law of Objective Reality which states: 
There
 Ain't None. You can't tell the science guys that, though. They 
work to
 create a theory of everything, but they have no idea what 
everything
 really means. They talk about the Big Bang theory of how the 
universe
 began, like a vase shattering into a million tiny bits, but that's
 wrong too. The way I see it, it's more the film of their shattered
 vase running backward; all the millions of tiny particles and
 fragments following incalculably precise trajectories back to
 wholeness, fitting themselves together with such miraculous an
 unerring accuracy that by observing the perfection of any, we can 
know
 the perfection of the whole.
 
 I discovered the secret of the sea in meditation upon a
 dewdrop.-Kahlil Gibran
 
 -What's not a miracle? Which piece of the vase is less than
 another? Everything fits, everything belongs. None are lost. All 
will
 arrive.
 
 The one is the source of the many, returning is the motion of the 
TAO
 and the science guys got it ass-backward. The universe isn't flying
 apart, it's flying together.

Its funny how all of a sudden, talking in terms of particles makes 
sense- The big spiritual concept of oneness, an indivisible reality 
composed of infinite components is easier to understand and grasp 
experientially in terms of particles. It all makes sense, whereas 
before it was a bit of a struggle for everything to have appropriate 
emphasis. It seems like an additional lens has been added to my 
subjective camera; wider angle. Now all of a sudden there is greater 
clarity. 

Perhaps it is as simple as the original posting being 
called 'Unfoldments of Brahman'- with each successive posting 
carrying that title regardless of the content, like a mantra. I 
don't know, except it was like a fresh wind coming in, cleaning up, 
and moving on. And your sharing the ideas above Tom also removes 
some subtle ignorance about this big bang theory, which is the first 
part of the reality, but leaves things lost and in chaos without the 
second part as stated, ...the universe isn't flying apart, its 
flying together

I'm always sensitive to these kinds of influences; can't easily 
sleep on a full moon night; get kind of stoned in hardware stores 
around the bug spray; feel and see angels around hospitals; 
transcend easily on lavender and other perfumes--




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Rory, thanks for the reports! They're great fun to
 read and have that subtle impact on consciousness
 deep, deep down.
 -Peter 
 
My pleasure, Peter! It has been a privilege to know you. Our different 
perspectives on your State of Consciousness (C.C. vs. Brahman, G.C. 
vs. K.C., and so on) has helped me better understand the play of 
Nirguna and Saguna, the Emptifulness and the Particles, within myself. 




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread new . morning

Hi Rory,

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi, Akasha! Apologies for the delay in responding to this. I set it 
 aside to give it the thought it deserved :-)

No problem. I often do that -- but the the time never comes. 
 
 NM: And paticles within Brahman,  and one being the Brahman for 
 others
  or particles -- such notions bespeak a quite different, and IMO,
  limited Brahman. 
 
 R: The collapse of Brahman into particles is as a direct result of 
 realizing there must be more than simply THAT, ALL THAT IS. When I 
 wanted to know how all of THIS came to appear to be, THAT laughed, 
 and shattered into an infinite number of Is -- each still 
 containing ALL-THAT-IS, but each now concentrated into an 
 infinitesimal point. So now we have the possibility of something 
 more than ALL-THAT-IS. We have the geometries or mechanics of 
 multiplicity, of Maya. 

That, in TMO terminology, the above appears to be a GC type grook. In
my terminolgy and experiece, that the flatness for which there most be
more, is not the utimate Wholeness  -- for which is a sort of black
whole -- no lack escapes from it to manifest as there must be
something more. More a flatness of consciousness here vs the
wholness of Consciuousness IS.

 
 Perhaps more to the point, THAT became recognized as too flat, too 
 impersonal, too uncaring, to be enough. For me this unfoldment 
 came when I realized that if THAT is big enough to be infinite, it 
 can certainly be big enough to be small enough to care about me -- 
 whereon it collapsed into a bliss-point with *personality* -- with 
 charm -- Krishna. ALL-THAT-IS -- and more. The very quintessence of 
 THAT, concentrated THAT.

Again, GC. Krishna. Not that the black-hole of Completness or the
livliness of the world flowing and glowing in love are better than
another -- but they are different. IMO, its not the heirarchtrical
structure of TMO SoC. The I appreciate Shankaras finality that the
Wholensss is all that IS. The rest is contained within it. (which is
perhaps a misguided undderstanding of Shankara, but it mine.)


 I also found that by paying attention to these bliss-particles 
 inside my physical body, I was appearing as something larger than 
 they -- as a kind of Avatar to them. Then I noticed that a still-
 larger form of me was giving *me* the same loving attention I had 
 been giving the tiny particles. Finally I realized that it was all 
 the same Me -- that I was simply collapsing into my particles to 
 experience the extraordinary effect of my ordinary thought. I create 
 these particles, in other words, as devatas or devotees to 
 experience and enjoy the cosmic values of myself.

For 20 years I have had perhaps a parallel experience -- where i
consciously both bless and bow to each of the 10 trillion cells in my
body (it takes some time, :)) and the wonderous parts and processes
with each cell, and the 100 billion synapes -- and then flip it and
realize i am living in what I call Krishna's Apartment or Krishna's
Condo -- the experience of the body of Krishna being a meta-universal
sized condo complex, and each of us have our own space, but are also
all part of body of Krishna. Krishna's Condo is sort of a in-the
world mantra for me, it invokes that state when I want it.

 Over time, I came to appreciate that not only are We are all of the 
 above, but also none of the above -- we are still utterly 
 Unqualified, as well -- and it is from this Unqualified stance that 
 we can play with our particles, give them whatever they most 
 desire, and experience the supreme bliss that is their love for Us.

Thats fine. But still there is nothing moving within that black whole
of Completeness in which all the particles are absorbed in -- yet, in
their terms, they are flowing and jiving and shucking  and all.
 
 NM: The thing is, IT IS. In my experience, there is no some of IT, 
 or
  partial Brahmans as background for someones partial awareness --
  unless the experience and/or imagination of IT is in some quite
  limited ways.
 
 R: Yes, IT IS...and IT also appears limited, with partial awareness
 (es) for the fun of playing with ITself and continual rediscovery of 
 ITself from different angles.

Sounds more like the play of divinity than the black whole of
Completeness breaking into parts. Which you may say are the same,
perhaps. To me its more Love/fertile potential  flowing within the BH
of Completeness. The flow is flowing from its perspective, but Its
Complete and Still from the perspective of the Completeness. Like
General Relativity -- you are on earth, or on the space ship at
99/100s the speed of light. Very different perspectives. Krishna's
Condo and the River of Love and the Sactified Heart and the Holy Steps
of every Footstep, are all happening form their view, but are al
contained within The BHoC which is Completenes and Stillness.



  
 R:   From here, the process continues -- with any and every 
 particle we 
   find within

[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-12 Thread curtisdeltablues

Great post Rory, thanks.  This is why I post here, to hear where
people are at, how they view the world these days.  Your openness in
expressing your experiences is greatly appreciated.  I too place a
high value in expressing positive friendliness and your post has that
quality in spades!  As a person dedicated to non-spiritual
experiences, it is always a nice stretch to hear someone like yourself
who is so comfortable in that world and obviously having a blast. 
High five on that.  Laughter and joy binds us all together in a way
that anyone can relate to, no matter what their philosophy or
perspective.  Finding rapport with people from radically different
perspectives is my version of Unity.  It enriches my life.

When I was writing about my love of communicating with animals I
didn't want to imply that it was like a siddhi power.  I think Steve
Irwin believed he had a subtle connection with animals.  For me it is
a lifetime of observations made in delightful appreciation of animals.
 I learned about bird's posture language by having a few birds and
watching how they made friends with each other in a ritual of posture
and use of eye contact.  I spend time making friends with parrots in
pet stores and have two friend's who rescue parrots, so I get a lot of
practice making friends with birds who would like to take my finger
off at first.  Seeing them transform into trusting, loving creatures
is a peak experience for me.  I live with a hybrid Asian Leopard Cat,
a bengal. and an Abyssinian now.  They both are obedient like dogs
though communication and training.  People underestimate cat's
abilities for training.  You just have to know their game.  I think it
makes them happier pets to have rich communication.

Posting on FFL has allowed me to revisit all the old terminology of
consciousness to see how I feel about it these days, what I can relate
to, and what I don't feel anymore. The human connection is primary.  I
really appreciate that you seem to hold that value too.  I'll keep
enjoying your posts and thanks for taking the time to post twice!




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
 curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
 
  Hi Rory,
  
  I have been reading your posts with considerable interest.  I don't
  know if you have any desire to communicate with a person who is
  unenlightened (and loves it) but if you care to respond, I would
  appreciate it.
 
 Hi, Curtis! Great to meet you; I have been enjoying your posts since 
 you joined FFL. I have already responded to this post of yours once 
 in some detail, but my reply got swallowed up by (some) Yahoo, so I 
 will try again. 
 
 Consciously loving where you are *is* enlightenment, as far as I am 
 concerned. But if you are unenlightened, then so am I, as there is 
 only one of Us; denying yourself is denying me. So I'll make a deal 
 with you -- I will agree to be unenlightened in your world with you, 
 if you will agree to be simultaneously enlightened in mine, with 
 me :-)
 
 C:  It seems from your statement above that you can perform siddhis 
 (non
  trademarked spelling respected) but don't desire it. 
 
 R: Not exactly. It's not that I can perform siddhis; siddhis get 
 performed if the spontaneous desire arises. I have no control over 
 what I truly desire; nor can I demonstrate them for another if the 
 genuine desire/need in both of Us isn't there. If there is 
 sufficient grace-flow between Us, anything can happen :-)
 
 C: For a
  materialistic guy like me, it would be the ability to actually 
 fly, as
  one example, that would really take the whole discussion of higher
  states of consciousness to another level for me.  
 
 R: I understand that. For four years after I awoke, I had a burning 
 desire to fly, and I bent all of my inquiry in that direction. 
 Finally after some internal stages and an intermediary external 
 stage (Tibetan Stride), I spontaneously wondered what it would like 
 to be an Ascended Master, and THEN flew, ONCE, lifting off, 
 dematerializing, eventually rematerializing and dropping back to 
 earth (completely blowing my bodymind all over again; there were 
 four of us participating). Since then, the desire has not arisen, at 
 least for me as an individual. 
 
 I have once or twice desired that all the course participants (my 
 particles) fly, and experienced an immediate outpouring of Bliss 
 throughout the Dome and coherent hopping like crazy, but so far, 
 that's it. I can't push it from my side, except by loving attention 
 to all my particles. The bottom line is, I don't generally really 
 care if I can fly, or even if you can fly. What I care about is how 
 much you unconditionally love me/yourself and my/your creation. The 
 rest is gravy :-)
 
 C: The rest of the
  language about your awakening is of a subjective nature that is 
 harder
  for me to relate to as meaningful to my own experience.  But the
  rubber-meets-the-road

[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote: 
 
 That, in TMO terminology, the above appears to be a GC type grook.

R: Yes; that's what I am saying. GC from the POV of the particle; KC 
from the unqualified Us.

NM: In
 my terminolgy and experiece, that the flatness for which there 
most be
 more, is not the utimate Wholeness  -- for which is a sort of black
 whole -- no lack escapes from it to manifest as there must be
 something more. More a flatness of consciousness here vs the
 wholness of Consciuousness IS.

R: Yes, the wholeness of Consciousness-IS would be simply Us, 
Ourselves.
 
(R)  Perhaps more to the point, THAT became recognized as too 
flat, too 
  impersonal, too uncaring, to be enough. For me this unfoldment 
  came when I realized that if THAT is big enough to be infinite, 
it 
  can certainly be big enough to be small enough to care about me -
- 
  whereon it collapsed into a bliss-point with *personality* -- 
with 
  charm -- Krishna. ALL-THAT-IS -- and more. The very quintessence 
of 
  THAT, concentrated THAT.

NM: Again, GC. Krishna. 

R: Yes,exactly;  GC and KC being the same from different (opposite) 
POVs.

NM:Not that the black-hole of Completness or the
 livliness of the world flowing and glowing in love are better than
 another -- but they are different. IMO, its not the heirarchtrical
 structure of TMO SoC. The I appreciate Shankaras finality that the
 Wholensss is all that IS. The rest is contained within it. 
(which is
 perhaps a misguided undderstanding of Shankara, but it mine.)

R: No arguments there, except maybe that appears to be a particular 
POV, unless by Wholeness you mean Us, Ourself. 
 
(R)  I also found that by paying attention to these bliss-particles 
  inside my physical body, I was appearing as something larger 
than 
  they -- as a kind of Avatar to them. Then I noticed that a still-
  larger form of me was giving *me* the same loving attention I 
had 
  been giving the tiny particles. Finally I realized that it was 
all 
  the same Me -- that I was simply collapsing into my particles to 
  experience the extraordinary effect of my ordinary thought. I 
create 
  these particles, in other words, as devatas or devotees to 
  experience and enjoy the cosmic values of myself.

NM: For 20 years I have had perhaps a parallel experience -- where i
 consciously both bless and bow to each of the 10 trillion cells in 
my
 body (it takes some time, :)) and the wonderous parts and processes
 with each cell, and the 100 billion synapes -- and then flip it and
 realize i am living in what I call Krishna's Apartment 
or Krishna's
 Condo -- the experience of the body of Krishna being a meta-
universal
 sized condo complex, and each of us have our own space, but are 
also
 all part of body of Krishna. Krishna's Condo is sort of a in-the
 world mantra for me, it invokes that state when I want it.

R: Sounds a lot like the same thing ... Yes, I too started noticing 
this a couple of decades ago, but never thought to connect it with 
MMY's AGNI: Absolute collapsing on itself for some time 
thereafter; even when seeing the mechanics of that collapse, it was 
a while before I realized that that process is ongoing in every 
moment. As MMY says, the collapse is frictionless. Have you been 
noticing that the ordinary thoughts you have w/r/t the particles are 
utterly overwhelming from their POV? The Dome helped ramp up this 
clarity for me, say, a hundredfold.  :-) 

And since these particles are our senses, divinizing them divinizes 
our environment, so that (again using MMY's terms) the chandas 
itself becomes rishi, becomes Madhachandas. The point being, of 
course,  to assimilate all the denied not-Self, not-good demons -- 
anger, lust, and so on -- and love them (and thus our bodymind, and 
thus our world) back into primordial radiant holiness.
 
(R)  Over time, I came to appreciate that not only are We are all 
of the 
  above, but also none of the above -- we are still utterly 
  Unqualified, as well -- and it is from this Unqualified stance 
that 
  we can play with our particles, give them whatever they most 
  desire, and experience the supreme bliss that is their love for 
Us.

NM: Thats fine. But still there is nothing moving within that black 
whole
 of Completeness in which all the particles are absorbed in -- yet, 
in
 their terms, they are flowing and jiving and shucking  and all.

R: Again, no argument there, except that that black whole of 
completeness is a particular or particle's perception of Us :-)
  
  NM: The thing is, IT IS. In my experience, there is no some of 
IT, 
  or
   partial Brahmans as background for someones partial awareness -
-
   unless the experience and/or imagination of IT is in some quite
   limited ways.
 
  (R): Yes, IT IS...and IT also appears limited, with partial 
awareness
  (es) for the fun of playing with ITself and continual 
rediscovery of 
  ITself from different angles.
 
NM: Sounds more like

[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote:
 
 Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.

Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
content to mouth the words of others...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote:
  
  Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
 
 Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
 dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
 content to mouth the words of others...

Because I dare speak from my experience to observe some of his
statements seem to be odd, not consistent with my experience? 

All glory to he with the raddest story i guess.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote:
  
   Hi Rory,
   
   I understand you are participating in the current dome course. Have
   you taken the opportunity to share your experiential insights,
below,
   with Maharishi? What were his comments?
   
   If you have not shared with him, why the reluctance for such a nice
   opportunity to manifestly express some of the gratitude you have?
  
  Hi akasha. Thanks for the questions. Maharishi is my Guru Dev; he is 
  my true I and knows me better than I know myself. He created me, he 
  sustains me, he destroys me. I attended the course for two weeks
while 
  this Understanding was driven home deeper and deeper every day. 
  Without my saying a word, my (his) every thought, word and experience 
  was commented upon, verified, and deepened by him. The intimate play 
  between the Wholeness and the particle is heart-breaking in its 
  innocence and simple splendor. His love and grace are boundless; in 
  knowing him even to whatever small degree I do, I am exalted and 
  humbled beyond measure. And all of this is perfectly ordinary.
  
  I have posted this material here only to clarify and correct some of 
  the finer details of the unfoldment of Brahman I gave here last year. 
  I am not interested in debating or discussing them particularly. They 
  were simply some loose ends that had to be tied up. 
  
  All glory to Guru Dev
  
  :-)
 
 
 Guarantee you that MMY would scream you out of the room if you 
 claimed that shit in his presence.

Ah, the blissful certainty of someone who (if I am
not mistaken) has never even been in the same room
with Maharishi...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Lawson, you are one jealous mofo.  Maybe cause Rory managed say 
 more, inspire more, in one post than you have in over 10,000.  

You nailed it, Lurk. That's probably the biggest
issue for the compulsive reactives -- reacting 
uncontrollably (and jealously) every time someone
posts about personal experience they've never had.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:
  
  Guarantee you that MMY would scream you out of the
  room if you 
  claimed that shit in his 
   presence.
  
  Lawson, you are one jealous mofo.  Maybe cause Rory
  managed say 
  more, inspire more, in one post than you have in
  over 10,000.  
 
 Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
 profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
 personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
 silence.

Exactly. And it's been going on forever, since
at least Fiuggi, where at least two people I 
knew were sent home from the course for 
reporting CC experiences.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
 snip
  Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
  profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
  personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
  silence.
 
 How profound can the experiences be if the person
 having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
 that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?

But *why* do you react negatively? Consistently?

Could it possibly be...uh...jealousy? Having done
everything you've been told to do for over thirty
years and never having experienced diddley-squat,
while those who do what the fuck they want have
lots of cool experiences? There's a lesson in 
there, if you were just intelligent enough to
perceive it...









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 But *why* do you react negatively? Consistently?
 
 Could it possibly be...uh...jealousy? Having done
 everything you've been told to do for over thirty
 years and never having experienced diddley-squat,
 while those who do what the fuck they want have
 lots of cool experiences? There's a lesson in 
 there, if you were just intelligent enough to
 perceive it...


So cool experiences is where it's at?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread t3rinity

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I know what he's said and done in the past...

Try to be more in the present. Expect miracles and wonders..





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread t3rinity

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
 profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
 personality!)...

Thats what MMY says himself. Did you read Love and God?






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread Peter



--- authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 snip
  Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
  profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
  personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
  silence.
 
 How profound can the experiences be if the person
 having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
 that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?

I take them at face value. Why would someone's
reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 




 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
 snip
  Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
  profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
  personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
  silence.
 
 How profound can the experiences be if the person
 having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
 that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?

The Rory I saw at Revs yesterday was far from bruised and withdrawn.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 
 --- authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
  drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 I take them at face value. Why would someone's
 reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
 diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
 are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
 withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
 experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
 again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 

Well said, Peter. And, Rory's declining to debate his recent post is
completely consistent with his lack of participation on FFL lately.
I've spoken with him about this before, and FFL is simply no longer
where he wants to direct lots of time, energy, and attention. 

Better to just take him at face value when he writes, I have posted
this material here only to clarify and correct some of the finer
details of the unfoldment of Brahman I gave here last year. I am not
interested in debating or discussing them particularly. They were
simply some loose ends that had to be tied up.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote:
  
  Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
 
 Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
 dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
 content to mouth the words of others...

Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
no longer a TMer).

Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
to, Barry?







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ 
wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 But *why* do you react negatively? Consistently?

Why do *I* react consistently negatively?

I haven't made a single comment about Rory's
post, negative *or* positive.

Barry, you gotta do something about your
hallucinations.

 Could it possibly be...uh...jealousy? Having done
 everything you've been told to do for over thirty
 years

And another hallucination...

 and never having experienced diddley-squat,

...and yet another.

 while those who do what the fuck they want have
 lots of cool experiences? There's a lesson in 
 there, if you were just intelligent enough to
 perceive it...

Well, actually, there's a lesson for you in the
fact that none of what you just attributed to me
is the case.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 The Rory I saw at Revs yesterday was far from bruised
 and withdrawn.

Peter appears to think he has been driven into 
silence.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 
 --- authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
  drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 I take them at face value. Why would someone's
 reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
 diminish such experiences?

Exactly my point.

 How do we know said parties
 are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
 withdraw into silence.

That's what you seemed to me to be suggesting.

 When someone characterizes your
 experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
 again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 

I don't recall anyone suggesting that the
experiences Rory posted were sh*t, but even
if someone had, that's one someone on a forum
read by quite a few people.  Why would you fold
your tents and steal away because of one, or
even a few, negative comments?

If there was a veritable *barrage* of attacks,
such that it appeared nobody was receptive to
the account of experiences, then it would make
sense (pearls before swine and all that).

But that simply hasn't been the case with the
reaction to Rory's post.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread jyouells2000

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote:
   
   Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
  
  Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
  dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
  content to mouth the words of others...
 
 Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
 yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
 from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
 one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
 but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
 very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
 no longer a TMer).
 
 Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
 to, Barry?


 I thought he was refering to the reaction over time here on FFL, when
someone comes forward with direct experience, not this specific post
by Rory.

JohnY 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
 j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
   snip
Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
silence.
   
   How profound can the experiences be if the person
   having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
   that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
  
  The Rory I saw at Revs yesterday was far from bruised
  and withdrawn.
 
 Peter appears to think he has been driven into 
 silence.

If that's the case, then Peter is mistaken.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ 
 wrote:
 
  
  
  --- authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
   drpetersutphen@ wrote:
   snip
Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
silence.
   
   How profound can the experiences be if the person
   having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
   that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
  
  I take them at face value. Why would someone's
  reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
  diminish such experiences?
 
 Exactly my point.
 
  How do we know said parties
  are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
  withdraw into silence.
 
 That's what you seemed to me to be suggesting.
 
  When someone characterizes your
  experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
  again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 
 
 I don't recall anyone suggesting that the
 experiences Rory posted were sh*t, but even
 if someone had, that's one someone on a forum
 read by quite a few people.  Why would you fold
 your tents and steal away because of one, or
 even a few, negative comments?
 
 If there was a veritable *barrage* of attacks,
 such that it appeared nobody was receptive to
 the account of experiences, then it would make
 sense (pearls before swine and all that).
 
 But that simply hasn't been the case with the
 reaction to Rory's post.

Ok, duh. Now I see where you're coming from. I interpreted your
earlier comment as smackdown on Rory, and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself, I went into
knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory, and I was with him
when he died.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ 
wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ 
wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ 
wrote:

Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
   
   Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
   dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
   content to mouth the words of others...
  
  Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
  yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
  from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
  one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
  but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
  very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
  no longer a TMer).
  
  Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
  to, Barry?
 
  I thought he was refering to the reaction over time
 here on FFL, when someone comes forward with direct
 experience, not this specific post by Rory.

Barry was clearly referring to the reaction to Rory's
post as an *example* of piling on.

My point is that Barry's comment was yet another
example of his desperate need to find an occasion for
a putdown of TMers, even if he has to manufacture that
putdown out of thin air, as in this case--and
subsequently today, when he accused me in a later post
of always reacting negatively to posts about experiences
when I hadn't said a word about Rory's post.

(In fact, you'd be hard put to find me making negative
comments about someone's reported experiences.)







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ 
  wrote:
  
   --- authfriend jstein@ wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
drpetersutphen@ wrote:
snip
 Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
 profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
 personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
 silence.

How profound can the experiences be if the person
having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
   
   I take them at face value. Why would someone's
   reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
   diminish such experiences?
  
  Exactly my point.
  
   How do we know said parties
   are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
   withdraw into silence.
  
  That's what you seemed to me to be suggesting.
  
   When someone characterizes your
   experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
   again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 
  
  I don't recall anyone suggesting that the
  experiences Rory posted were sh*t, but even
  if someone had, that's one someone on a forum
  read by quite a few people.  Why would you fold
  your tents and steal away because of one, or
  even a few, negative comments?
  
  If there was a veritable *barrage* of attacks,
  such that it appeared nobody was receptive to
  the account of experiences, then it would make
  sense (pearls before swine and all that).
  
  But that simply hasn't been the case with the
  reaction to Rory's post.
 
 Ok, duh. Now I see where you're coming from. I interpreted your
 earlier comment as smackdown on Rory

Not at all, it was a smackdown on Peter.

I think the whole story that seems to have become
established here about TMers putting down other
people's reported experiences is a crock, frankly.

But *if* a few negative comments about someone's
experiences would actually drive that person away
(and I have no reason whatsoever to think that's
the case with Rory), then I have to wonder about
the degree of confidence the person has in those
experiences.

I can certainly understand the person not feeling
the need to defend the experiences against challenge,
but that doesn't seem to me to be what Peter was
suggesting.

, and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
 he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself,
 I went into knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory,
 and I was with him when he died.

Ain't gonna touch that one!  Care to expand?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

I believe his detailed description of his awareness and state of
consciousness was a dramatic and imaginative way to describe the peak
experiences that we all have, in or out of TM.  

I went to a private zoo yesterday in perfect pre-Fall weather.  I had
amazing experiences interacting with the big cats.  In this zoo you
can get really close and I was often alone with them, since it was a
weekday.  I got charged by a white tiger and a lion, one playful, and
one seemed pretty serious, although she chilled out before she hit the
fence.  The experience of them locking onto my eyes and running
towards me was such a peak experience for me.  It made me feel alive
in a sudden burst of clarity.  The lion roared for me to make our
relationship clear, and the sound was Rig Veda on steroids!  She made
her whole throat into a straight tube and it reverberated throughout
the whole zoo. I  got to speak to the mountain lion from very close,
and he reacted like my own cats, displaying all the friendly face
rubbing behaviors that I am familiar with.  Such a beautiful animal. 
So much presence behind those eyes.  They also had three 5 month old
Bengal white tiger cubs, and watching them play/fight, honing their
ambush and kill techniques made me laugh out loud many times.  They
were so full of playful menace. Each lighthearted game ended with one
of them clamped down on the other's neck!  I could never work with big
cats myself, but I admire those who do.  Communicating with animals is
one of my most cherished experiences, but I don't think I have the
nerve to put it all on the line in the life and death potential of
working with these animals.  It was enough to be as close as I felt
yesterday.  It was a great day!






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ 
wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ 
wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff 
rorygoff@ wrote:

Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
   
   Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
   dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
   content to mouth the words of others...
  
  Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
  yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
  from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
  one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
  but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
  very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
  no longer a TMer).
  
  Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
  to, Barry?
 
 
  I thought he was refering to the reaction over time here on FFL, 
when
 someone comes forward with direct experience, not this specific 
post
 by Rory.
 
 JohnY

I personally see it as a case of where there is no longer thirst, 
there is no longer water.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread cardemaister

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
 
  Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
  profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
  personality!)...
 
 Thats what MMY says himself. Did you read Love and God?


Don't mind checking that out right now, but I seem to recall
the word brahma(n)* is inflected like a neuter gender word,
but is otherwise treated as a masculine word. I guess that
means e.g. that the personal pronoun used to refer to Brahman
is He (sa[H], so [pron: saw]), not It (tat, tad).

*) nominative singular is brahma (neuter), not brahmaa(masc.).
Cf aatman - nom.sing. aatmaa (masc.), NOT aatma (neut.).
Also, in the case of neuter gender words, as in Latin, in Sanskrit
they are identical in form both in nominative and in accusative.
Accusative singular of aatmaa is aatmaanam, but acc.sing.
of brahma, is, well, brahma.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
 
  --- authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
   drpetersutphen@ wrote:
   snip
Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
silence.
   
   How profound can the experiences be if the person
   having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
   that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
  
  I take them at face value. Why would someone's
  reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
  diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
  are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
  withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
  experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
  again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 
 
 Well said, Peter. And, Rory's declining to debate his recent post is
 completely consistent with his lack of participation on FFL lately.
 I've spoken with him about this before, and FFL is simply no longer
 where he wants to direct lots of time, energy, and attention. 
 
 Better to just take him at face value when he writes, I have posted
 this material here only to clarify and correct some of the finer
 details of the unfoldment of Brahman I gave here last year. I am not
 interested in debating or discussing them particularly. They were
 simply some loose ends that had to be tied up.

In other words, Rory posted with grace and dignity,
something I'm not sure I can say about some of the
posts that reacted to what he said.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 --- authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
  drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 I take them at face value. Why would someone's
 reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
 diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
 are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
 withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
 experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
 again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 

The thing that astounds me is that some folks
seem to feel that the personal experiences of
others *have* to be responded to critically,
or even negatively. Why? For me, for instance,
I have *zero* instance in the sorts of things
Rory was talking about; they don't map to my
life at all. But I perceive that they are *his*
experiences, that *he* considers them valuable,
and that he is unafraid enough of the negative
reaction that he *knows* by now he's going to
get here to share them. 

That deserves a pat on the back and support 
from me, no matter how I feel about the content
of what he's sharing. 








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
  to, Barry?
 
 I thought he was refering to the reaction over time here on FFL, when
 someone comes forward with direct experience, not this specific post
 by Rory.

Bingo. 







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 ...  Communicating with animals is
 one of my most cherished experiences, but I don't think I have the
 nerve to put it all on the line in the life and death potential of
 working with these animals.  It was enough to be as close as I felt
 yesterday.  It was a great day!

My favorites at zoos are the wolves, hawks, and snakes. 
They will lock eyes with you and maintain the focus,
pretty much until *you* look away. Most animals won't.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
 
  But *why* do you react negatively? Consistently?
  
  Could it possibly be...uh...jealousy? Having done
  everything you've been told to do for over thirty
  years and never having experienced diddley-squat,
  while those who do what the fuck they want have
  lots of cool experiences? There's a lesson in 
  there, if you were just intelligent enough to
  perceive it...
 
 So cool experiences is where it's at?

Actually, for many of us, yes it is.

I always liked one teacher's breakdown of the
two types of spiritual seekers. One type is
content to read about -- and be inspired by --
other people's experiences. The other type 
likes that, too, but it isn't enough for them.
They want to have these experiences themselves,
and if the tradition they're part of is not
delivering them, after a suitable period of
time, they move on to a tradition that *does*
deliver.

Haven't you ever considered the possibility
that the TMO's We don't talk about our experiences
stance was developed because people weren't having
very *many* of them? 

That's not true in many other traditions. And
interestingly enough, the traditions in which
seekers never go a month (and rarely a week)
without having some extraordinary experience 
almost never have any dogma that says, Don't 
talk about them. In fact, the structure of such 
organizations is such that it's considered a normal 
thing to talk freely about one's experiences. 

I'm suggesting that you would *not* have reacted
negatively to a fellow seeker of enlightenment
talking about his personal experiences of enlight-
enment if you hadn't been *taught* to react that 
way. You were.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 jyouells@ 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
   to, Barry?
  
  I thought he was refering to the reaction over time here
  on FFL, when someone comes forward with direct experience,
  not this specific post by Rory.
 
 Bingo.

In fact, you were using the reaction to this
specific post by Rory as an *example* of what
you call piling on.

Responding to new morning apologizing to Rory for
his directness, you wrote:

Again with the 'pile on' approach to anyone who
dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
content to mouth the words of others...

Except, of course, that there was no piling on
(as I noted); and that the whole idea of piling
on by TMers is something you invented to start
with.

And you went on to accuse me of joining this
nonexistent piling on in response to Rory's
post *when I hadn't said a word about it one
way or the other*.

Bingo.  Barry's hallucinations are taking over.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  
  --- authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
   drpetersutphen@ wrote:
   snip
Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
silence.
   
   How profound can the experiences be if the person
   having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
   that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
  
  I take them at face value. Why would someone's
  reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
  diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
  are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
  withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
  experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
  again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 
 
 The thing that astounds me is that some folks
 seem to feel that the personal experiences of
 others *have* to be responded to critically,
 or even negatively.

Who here feels this, Barry?

 Why? For me, for instance,
 I have *zero* instance in the sorts of things
 Rory was talking about; they don't map to my
 life at all.

Which was what the *single* negative reaction
here was pointing out: Rory's experience did not
map to the poster's own experience.

 But I perceive that they are *his*
 experiences, that *he* considers them valuable,
 and that he is unafraid enough of the negative
 reaction that he *knows* by now he's going to
 get here to share them.

Given the paucity of negative reaction, I would
certainly hope Rory was confident enough of the
authenticity of his experiences that it wouldn't
drive him away into silence.
 


 That deserves a pat on the back and support 
 from me, no matter how I feel about the content
 of what he's sharing.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

I speak pretty good bird.  I have good relationships with parrots and
their posture, eye-contact based communications.  I don't speak great
canine so I doubt I could get into great rapport with wolves.  I have
heard that their language is very different from dogs, who are more
group animals than pack animals without the strict hierarchy of wolf
packs even in wild dog groups.

As a kid I raised a squirrel monkey for about 7 years, and he had a
very detailed system of eye contact to convey relationships.  Every
day he asked me with his eyes, are you sure you are in charge again
today?  It was a daily ritual to remind him.  Anyone raising kids can
probably relate!  

Looking into any animal's eyes is fascinating, especially when you
begin to understand the rules of how they use eye contact.  Catching a
domestic cats eye and then blinking or looking away is such a powerful
rapport technique.

I got eye contact with a couple of the huge pythons, but it didn't
seem like there was any communication except perhaps them wondering if
they could get their unhinged jaws over my head!



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues
 curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
 
  ...  Communicating with animals is
  one of my most cherished experiences, but I don't think I have the
  nerve to put it all on the line in the life and death potential of
  working with these animals.  It was enough to be as close as I felt
  yesterday.  It was a great day!
 
 My favorites at zoos are the wolves, hawks, and snakes. 
 They will lock eyes with you and maintain the focus,
 pretty much until *you* look away. Most animals won't.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread jyouells2000




--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "curtisdeltablues" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe his detailed description of his "awareness" and "state of consciousness" was a dramatic and imaginative way to describe the peak experiences that we all have, in or out of TM.I went to a private zoo yesterday in perfect pre-Fall weather.  I had amazing experiences interacting with the big cats.  In this zoo you can get really close and I was often alone with them, since it was a weekday.  I got charged by a white tiger and a lion, one playful, and one seemed pretty serious, although she chilled out before she hit the fence.  The experience of them locking onto my eyes and running towards me was such a peak experience for me.  It made me feel alive in a sudden burst of clarity.  The lion roared for me to make our relationship clear, and the sound was Rig Veda on steroids!  She made her whole throat into a straight tube and it reverberated throughout the whole zoo. I  got to speak to the mountain lion from very close, and he reacted like my own cats, displaying all the friendly face rubbing behaviors that I am familiar with.  Such a beautiful animal.  So much presence behind those eyes.  They also had three 5 month old Bengal white tiger cubs, and watching them play/fight, honing their ambush and kill techniques made me laugh out loud many times.  They were so full of playful menace. Each lighthearted game ended with one of them clamped down on the other's neck!  I could never work with big cats myself, but I admire those who do.  Communicating with animals is one of my most cherished experiences, but I don't think I have the nerve to put it all on the line in the life and death potential of working with these animals.  It was enough to be as close as I felt yesterday.  It was a great day!Each lighthearted game ended with one of them clamped down on the other's neck!They're training for a stint on Fairfield Life :-) JohnY


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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
snip I'm suggesting that you would *not* have reacted
 negatively to a fellow seeker of enlightenment
 talking about his personal experiences of enlight-
 enment if you hadn't been *taught* to react that 
 way. You were.

Hi, I never saw this as TMO dogma- I used to talk about all kinds of 
things to Movement people and was never told not to, or generated a 
negative reaction. As an unspoken rule in the Movement, I just didn't 
find any message not to talk about this stuff. Lots of mood making and 
fundamentalism though, which used to just drive me nuts... 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread jyouells2000


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 jyouells@
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@
 wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@
 wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff
 rorygoff@ wrote:

 Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
   
Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
content to mouth the words of others...
  
   Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
   yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
   from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
   one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
   but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
   very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
   no longer a TMer).
  
   Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
   to, Barry?
  
 
   I thought he was refering to the reaction over time here on FFL,
 when
  someone comes forward with direct experience, not this specific
 post
  by Rory.
 
  JohnY
 
 I personally see it as a case of where there is no longer thirst,
 there is no longer water.


I don't understand your reference, Jim... must have my dense hat on...

JohnY






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 In other words, Rory posted with grace and dignity,
 something I'm not sure I can say about some of the
 posts that reacted to what he said.

NM: 
I am heartened that you appear to hold grace and dignity as a
standard for FFL posts. We all do, I beleive. We all welcome you from
your long estrangement on the dark side. Perhaps it is another sign
of  the effect of the Invincible America course. Your transition would
make a great talking point example for John Hagelin.

Turq: 
The thing that astounds me is that some folks
seem to feel that the personal experiences of
others *have* to be responded to critically,
or even negatively. 

NM: 
That would be sad if true. Who do you feel has a compusion that they
*HAVE* to respond to all experiences negatively? Perhaps we should
take them out back and shoot them.

However, occaisionally offering up an alternative view of experiences,
and a questioning of terminology used, when a post is unclear, or
experiences differ from ones own, is healthy. Do you feel otherwise?

I have a long history of discussion of experiences with Rory. Taken as
a whole, they clearly cannot be characterized negative and piling on.
There was / has been a gradual transition in my approach to his
discourses -- when I care to comment and raise questions (on a small
minority of his posts) to call for clarification, and to bring out 
issues that his posts raise.

My recent post, IMO, my intent, was not at all critical or negative of
Rory's experience. I was pointing out two things. First, my experience
differs from Rory's. I find that interesting, not a criticism, or
*piling on* as you oddly seem to feel. It lends creedence to the
hypothesis of many paths, many peaks -- a counter view to the
embedded belief perenial philosophy view of many that everyone's
experience is ultimately the same -- its only words that are
different. I think the discussion of such, exaples of such is
interesting, and perhaps even of value and merit. Sorry if you get
angry or feel threatned if that hypothesis is raised. 

The second point of my post, another theme explored on FFL over the
years, is that most of us come from a common tradition and
vocabularly. A by product of that is that it can accelerate
communications in that a word or phrase can be understood in a common
way and used in a discussion without five paragraphs of explanation. 
That is not to say that this lexicon is better, more correct, etc than
other lexicons. Its just that when some words are used in this forum,
there is an assumption of a common understanding of how those words
are being used. A point I tried to initiate about Rory's post is that
he appears to be using a Rory lexicon IMO based on Theosophy or
other mystical traditions, that differ from standard FFL lexicons.
Again, neither is better or worse. But I feel that if one is using
common FFL words in a different way, ouside of common understandings
of the connotation, it is helpful, even incumbent upon the poster, to
clarify their alternative meaning of words they use. Perhaps you
disagree. Ok, but its a reasonable theme for discussion, IMO.

Thus, my two underlying themes in my post, intended, and hopefully
manifest in most readers minds, was that different folks may have
different experiences, and they may use different lexicons. And when
the later occurs, its helpful to make that explicit. If you find such
themes *negative* or *piling on* perhaps that says more about you than
Rory or myself.

Turq:
I have *zero* instance in the sorts of things
Rory was talking about; they don't map to my
life at all. 

NM: 
My experiences map partial with his map, and some not at all -- such
as his partial Brahmans / Wholenesses.  Thats a reasonable  area for
discussion, IMO

Turq:
But I perceive that they are *his*
experiences, that *he* considers them valuable,

NM:
Sure. 

Turq
and that he is unafraid enough of the negative
reaction that he *knows* by now he's going to
get here to share them.

NM: 
Where was the negative reaction to his experience? ARe you recieving
posts I am not? 

I assume rory is relatively cognitively balanced -- reads things as
they are on the page -- and does not fly off-into knee-jerk reactions
to things imagined to be on the page.

Regardless, I also assume. from experience, that he is  pretty thick
skinned. 

And in the past, he has enjoyed alternative views on things. Why that
would have changed, I don't know why. If he cares not ot discuss his
posts fine. But that we should take his or anyone's posts as apostles,
not to be questioned is, well, pretty cultish. I had pegged you as one
who values open discussion. Perhaps that is not the case.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I speak pretty good bird.  I have good relationships with parrots 
and
 their posture, eye-contact based communications.  I don't speak 
great
 canine so I doubt I could get into great rapport with wolves.  I 
have
 heard that their language is very different from dogs, who are more
 group animals than pack animals without the strict hierarchy of 
wolf
 packs even in wild dog groups.
 
 As a kid I raised a squirrel monkey for about 7 years, and he had a
 very detailed system of eye contact to convey relationships.  Every
 day he asked me with his eyes, are you sure you are in charge 
again
 today?  It was a daily ritual to remind him.  Anyone raising kids 
can
 probably relate!  
 
 Looking into any animal's eyes is fascinating, especially when you
 begin to understand the rules of how they use eye contact.  
Catching a
 domestic cats eye and then blinking or looking away is such a 
powerful
 rapport technique.
 
 I got eye contact with a couple of the huge pythons, but it didn't
 seem like there was any communication except perhaps them 
wondering if
 they could get their unhinged jaws over my head!
 
 
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues
  curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
  
   ...  Communicating with animals is
   one of my most cherished experiences, but I don't think I have 
the
   nerve to put it all on the line in the life and death 
potential of
   working with these animals.  It was enough to be as close as I 
felt
   yesterday.  It was a great day!
  
  My favorites at zoos are the wolves, hawks, and snakes. 
  They will lock eyes with you and maintain the focus,
  pretty much until *you* look away. Most animals won't.
 

Hey zoo people! I am really enjoying this thread. I liked reading 
your big cat experiences Curtis- Those animals are a complete trip- 
especially that they are lightning quick and completely beautiful 
and yet sleep 18 hours a day. Amazing! I also dig all of the others. 
Speaking of hawks I was coming home last week and just as I pulled 
in my driveway, a very large hawk (wingspan 3.5 feet) was chasing a 
crow in and through the tree in the front yard. It was awesome! PS I 
always wanted to build a croc pond in my backyard, covered with a 
rebar cage, but doubt the city or neighbors would go for it... 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
 j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
[snip]
 , and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
  he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself,
  I went into knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory,
  and I was with him when he died.
 
 Ain't gonna touch that one!  Care to expand?

Just me being silly. The second sentence is a reference to that nutbag
who said he loved JonBenet Ramsey and was with her when she died. My
sense of humor is a bit warped at times.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
  j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
 [snip]
  , and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
   he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself,
   I went into knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory,
   and I was with him when he died.
  
  Ain't gonna touch that one!  Care to expand?
 
 Just me being silly. The second sentence is a reference to that nutbag
 who said he loved JonBenet Ramsey and was with her when she died. My
 sense of humor is a bit warped at times.

Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
didn't want to pile on just in case it was
one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin jflanegi@
 wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jyouells2000 jyouells@
  wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ 
wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@
  wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning 
no_reply@
  wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff
  rorygoff@ wrote:
 
  Apologies for my directness, if you find such not 
pleasing.

 Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
 dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
 content to mouth the words of others...
   
Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
no longer a TMer).
   
Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
to, Barry?
   
  
I thought he was refering to the reaction over time here on 
FFL,
  when
   someone comes forward with direct experience, not this specific
  post
   by Rory.
  
   JohnY
  
  I personally see it as a case of where there is no longer thirst,
  there is no longer water.
 
 
 I don't understand your reference, Jim... must have my dense hat 
on...
 
 JohnY

Lack of thirst is either due to not being thirsty, or not trusting 
the well. Either way there is no water to drink.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

PS I
always wanted to build a croc pond in my backyard, covered with a
rebar cage, but doubt the city or neighbors would go for it...

Jim,

If you do build a croc pond, you should do all your business
negotiations sitting around it like a charactor in a James Bond movie.
 It would add the right vib to your offers, especially during feeding
time!

Nice hawk story.  I dig crows, they are really intelligent.  Usually
they gang up on hawks so this one must have gotten one alone.  Not so
tough now biatch!






--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
 curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
 
  I speak pretty good bird.  I have good relationships with parrots 
 and
  their posture, eye-contact based communications.  I don't speak 
 great
  canine so I doubt I could get into great rapport with wolves.  I 
 have
  heard that their language is very different from dogs, who are more
  group animals than pack animals without the strict hierarchy of 
 wolf
  packs even in wild dog groups.
  
  As a kid I raised a squirrel monkey for about 7 years, and he had a
  very detailed system of eye contact to convey relationships.  Every
  day he asked me with his eyes, are you sure you are in charge 
 again
  today?  It was a daily ritual to remind him.  Anyone raising kids 
 can
  probably relate!  
  
  Looking into any animal's eyes is fascinating, especially when you
  begin to understand the rules of how they use eye contact.  
 Catching a
  domestic cats eye and then blinking or looking away is such a 
 powerful
  rapport technique.
  
  I got eye contact with a couple of the huge pythons, but it didn't
  seem like there was any communication except perhaps them 
 wondering if
  they could get their unhinged jaws over my head!
  
  
  
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues
   curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
   
...  Communicating with animals is
one of my most cherished experiences, but I don't think I have 
 the
nerve to put it all on the line in the life and death 
 potential of
working with these animals.  It was enough to be as close as I 
 felt
yesterday.  It was a great day!
   
   My favorites at zoos are the wolves, hawks, and snakes. 
   They will lock eyes with you and maintain the focus,
   pretty much until *you* look away. Most animals won't.
  
 
 Hey zoo people! I am really enjoying this thread. I liked reading 
 your big cat experiences Curtis- Those animals are a complete trip- 
 especially that they are lightning quick and completely beautiful 
 and yet sleep 18 hours a day. Amazing! I also dig all of the others. 
 Speaking of hawks I was coming home last week and just as I pulled 
 in my driveway, a very large hawk (wingspan 3.5 feet) was chasing a 
 crow in and through the tree in the front yard. It was awesome! PS I 
 always wanted to build a croc pond in my backyard, covered with a 
 rebar cage, but doubt the city or neighbors would go for it...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
 j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
   j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
  [snip]
   , and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself,
I went into knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory,
and I was with him when he died.
   
   Ain't gonna touch that one!  Care to expand?
  
  Just me being silly. The second sentence is a reference to that nutbag
  who said he loved JonBenet Ramsey and was with her when she died. My
  sense of humor is a bit warped at times.
 
 Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
 didn't want to pile on just in case it was
 one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...

Darn, I thought it was Rory entering the 28th Nakshatra state of
consciousness, the hidden one, beyond the 27 he has enumerated (but
oddly seems reluctant to reveal this huge uncoveringor 27+Nakshatra
States of Consciousness to his Guru Deva), and his Solar angels' Solar
Angel's, Solar Angels -- sort of the parampara Solar Angel --  who was
Rory --  was crucified on the cross of Pure Knowledge, as the 27 prior
states exploded in his solar plexus, the fusion of all lower and
higher states, in the form of an inverted golden polyhedron, with 108
dancing rudras around its axis, all while his head, which was a big
Brahman,  craddled in Alex's arms, a lesser Brahman, on the floor of
Revelations -- (a particle of Brahman-- not yet realizing that) 
(Revelations -- literally and figuratively), while the devas wept. 

Like Judy, I didn't comment, not wanting to pile on -- and be seen
by the wise and dignified like Turq, as questioning a heavy
experience. Besides, I had that experience last year, its so passe.





   






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 PS I
 always wanted to build a croc pond in my backyard, covered with a
 rebar cage, but doubt the city or neighbors would go for it...
 
 Jim,
 
 If you do build a croc pond, you should do all your business
 negotiations sitting around it like a charactor in a James Bond 
movie.
  It would add the right vib to your offers, especially during 
feeding
 time!
 
 Nice hawk story.  I dig crows, they are really intelligent.  
Usually
 they gang up on hawks so this one must have gotten one 
alone.  Not so
 tough now biatch!

Ha-Ha! Good suggestion for the croc pond- I'm looking for the 
longhaired white cat and diamond pinkie ring as we speak...
PS The crow escaped by flying low to the ground and near to the 
houses. I'm sure the hawk was having quite the wtf experience trying 
to catch prey in the suburbs, though I've seen him before and he 
looks a little chubby- plenty of pigeons and squirrels around here...




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
 
 
  In other words, Rory posted with grace and dignity,
  something I'm not sure I can say about some of the
  posts that reacted to what he said.
 
 NM: 
 I am heartened that you appear to hold grace and dignity as a
 standard for FFL posts.

ROTFL!






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

I'm sure the hawk was having quite the wtf experience trying
to catch prey in the suburbs, though I've seen him before and he
looks a little chubby- plenty of pigeons and squirrels around here...

Not to mention an abundance of slow running RU kids!


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
 curtisdeltablues@ wrote:
 
  PS I
  always wanted to build a croc pond in my backyard, covered with a
  rebar cage, but doubt the city or neighbors would go for it...
  
  Jim,
  
  If you do build a croc pond, you should do all your business
  negotiations sitting around it like a charactor in a James Bond 
 movie.
   It would add the right vib to your offers, especially during 
 feeding
  time!
  
  Nice hawk story.  I dig crows, they are really intelligent.  
 Usually
  they gang up on hawks so this one must have gotten one 
 alone.  Not so
  tough now biatch!
 
 Ha-Ha! Good suggestion for the croc pond- I'm looking for the 
 longhaired white cat and diamond pinkie ring as we speak...
 PS The crow escaped by flying low to the ground and near to the 
 houses. I'm sure the hawk was having quite the wtf experience trying 
 to catch prey in the suburbs, though I've seen him before and he 
 looks a little chubby- plenty of pigeons and squirrels around here...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread vashtirama

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
  j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
   [snip]
, and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
 he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself,
 I went into knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory,
 and I was with him when he died.

Ain't gonna touch that one!  Care to expand?
   
   Just me being silly. The second sentence is a reference to that
nutbag
   who said he loved JonBenet Ramsey and was with her when she died. My
   sense of humor is a bit warped at times.
  
  Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
  didn't want to pile on just in case it was
  one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...
 
 Darn, I thought it was Rory entering the 28th Nakshatra state of
 consciousness, the hidden one, beyond the 27 he has enumerated (but
 oddly seems reluctant to reveal this huge uncoveringor 27+Nakshatra
 States of Consciousness to his Guru Deva), and his Solar angels' Solar
 Angel's, Solar Angels -- sort of the parampara Solar Angel --  who was
 Rory --  was crucified on the cross of Pure Knowledge, as the 27 prior
 states exploded in his solar plexus, the fusion of all lower and
 higher states, in the form of an inverted golden polyhedron, with 108
 dancing rudras around its axis, all while his head, which was a big
 Brahman,  craddled in Alex's arms, a lesser Brahman, on the floor of
 Revelations -- (a particle of Brahman-- not yet realizing that) 
 (Revelations -- literally and figuratively), while the devas wept. 
 
 Like Judy, I didn't comment, not wanting to pile on -- and be seen
 by the wise and dignified like Turq, as questioning a heavy
 experience. Besides, I had that experience last year, its so passe.


I kinda thought so too, for reasons very close to what you just
described, except I don't know why you say Darn, and I'm not sure
about the devas weeping.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

Dear Vaj,

Yes, I don't think it is my place to give details of the course, but 
I will say that being on it was (and is) immensely freeing, and 
confirmed the program I have been spontaneously practicing over 
the last 24 years or so, when I awoke and left the Dome. Indeeed, it 
confirmed my whole Being, as I realized on ever deeper levels that 
obeying mySelf *is* and always has been obeying MMY, and vice versa 
(the mula mantra value, and all that). 

Returning to the Dome was so beautiful -- I left because everything 
was the same, so why work in someone else's factory? When I 
returned, I found that it was *my* factory, a kind of huge amplifier 
or particle accelerator manifesting on the outer what I had been 
practicing on the inner since awakening. Appreciating the Absolute-
me collapsing again and again into the particle-mes, to experience 
the profound effects of my own simple, ordinary thoughts from the 
level of my own devatas/devotees creating ever richer fabrics of 
creation, and all of it appreciated by the course participants and 
commented on by MMY...wow. 

A great many of Us are waking up (and more) here now. Heaven on 
Earth is evidently here now, and though some of Us are still 
overwhelmed by the ordinary perfect supernal beauty, our Is are 
adjusting. If anyone really wants to get Enlightened in this 
lifetime, and feels any pull to come here, I heartily urge them to 
drop whatever they're doing and take advantage of this opportunity. 
It doesn't come along every lifetime, and I don't know how long the 
window will remain open. On the other hand, if their Selves tell 
them otherwise, that's perfect too :-)

Rena and I are truly Home here, and are considering selling the 
house in Maine by next spring.

Love, Light  Laughter always and always,

R.





--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi Rory:
 
 Would you be able to share some here on the course and what's 
been  
 said? Is it true, or did I hear it wrong, have they changed the 
TMSP  
 or overall program in some way? I of course understand if you 
don't  
 want to post it to such a public list. Perhaps you could post it 
on  
 Spiritual Chat.
 
 Hope you're enjoying your new home in FF. Are you still coming 
back  
 to New England or are now officially an Iowan? ;-) It would be  
 interesting to hear your story since we last heard from you.
 
 TIA,
 
 Vaj
 
 On Oct 10, 2006, at 1:51 PM, Rory Goff wrote:
 
  With deepest gratitude to MMY and Guru Dev, we wish to correct 
some
  Understandings of Brahman we gave here last year. Within the 27
  Nakshatra-states, the middle third or 9 central ones are those of
  Brahma(n), or Light, or Consciousness:
 
  Brahma-Shiva-Shiva (B-S-S) or Mahaturiya
  Brahma-Shiva-Brahma (B-S-B) or Maharishi (Brahman)
  Brahma-Shiva-Vishnu (B-S-V) or Mahadevata (Krishna)
  Brahma-Brahma-Shiva (B-B-S) or Mahachandas (Shiva)
  Brahma-Brahma-Brahma (B-B-B) or Solar Angel, Lamp at the Door
  Brahma-Brahma-Vishnu (B-B-V), or chandas (U.C.)
  Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva (B-V-S), or devata (G.C.)
  Brahma-Vishnu-Brahma (B-V-B), or rishi (C.C.)
  Brahma-Vishnu-Vishnu (B-V-V), or turiya (T.C.)
 
  Within these 9, the centermost one is Brahma-Brahma-Brahma (B-B-
B),
  the Lamp at the Door, the Solar Angel who resides in the Sacred
  Heart (Solar Plexus) as the intermediary between the Absolute
  (Rudra, Shiva, or Purusha) and the Relative (Indra, Vishnu or
  Shakti).
 
  In truth, this is the only state of Consciousness that actually
  exists -- the supreme radiance of the perfect Now, the juncture-
  point of Heaven and Earth. From here, we can (eventually) see 
that
  all the states that led here -- T.C. or Turiya (Brahma-
Vishnu-
  Vishnu; B-V-V), C.C. or Rishi (Brahma-Vishnu-Brahma; B-V-B) G. 
C.
  or Devata(Brahma-Vishnu-Shiva; B-V-S), and U.C.
  or Chandas(Brahma-Brahma-Vishnu; B-B-V) are but identification
  with a time-bound particle or I within Our wholeness. We have 
been
  approaching the Now from an (unconscious) identification with a
  particle on the Relative side.
 
  But in actuality, there has been a very simple, innocent,
  unqualified  Absolute side of Us approaching this Now as the
  Wholeness or container of the experience(s), in perfect 
reflection
  to the Relative side. When our particle-self thinks it is in 
T.C. (B-
  V-V), our Wholeness is Mahaturiya (B-S-S); when our particle-
self
  attains C.C. or Rishi (B-V-B), our Wholeness is Brahman itself:
  that particle's Witness, its Maharishi (B-S-B); when our
  particle-self attains G.C. or Devata (B-V-S), our Wholeness is
  that particle's loving Personal God or Krishna-Avatar,
  its Mahadevata (B-S-V); and when our particle-self attains U.C.
  or Chandas (B-B-V), our Wholeness is that particle's Shiva,
  its Mahachandas (B-B-S).
 
  These two sides -- the Absolute and the Relative, the Whole and
  the Particle -- culminate in their fusion in the mid-most state 
of
  Brahma-Brahma-Brahma (B-B-B). The simple,

[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote:
   
   Apologies for my directness, if you find such not pleasing.
  
  Again with the pile on approach to anyone who
  dares to speak from his own experience, and isn't
  content to mouth the words of others...
 
 Lessee now, by my count this pile on approach has
 yielded precisely three negative reactions: one
 from new morning speaking from *his* experience;
 one from Lawson questioning not Rory's experiences
 but his assertion that MMY is his Guru Dev; and one
 very brief, mildly flip comment from Curtis (who is
 no longer a TMer).
 
 Do these constitute the piling on you're referring
 to, Barry?


To be clear, it doesn't matter (in this context) what Rory thinks about MMY's 
status--my 
comment, and I shouldn't have used the word shit I agree, was about how MMY 
would 
react to being referred to as gurudev.

Everything I have seen and heard tells me that MMY would be very upset.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 
 
 --- authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
  drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  snip
   Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
   profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
   personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
   silence.
  
  How profound can the experiences be if the person
  having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
  that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
 
 I take them at face value. Why would someone's
 reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
 diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
 are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
 withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
 experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
 again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 

I'll make it clear: last I heard, referring to MMY as your guru in his hearing 
or doing pujas 
to him in his presence gets you banned from his presence for a very long time.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, vashtirama [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


   Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
   didn't want to pile on just in case it was
   one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...
  
  Darn, I thought it was Rory entering the 28th Nakshatra state of
  consciousness, the hidden one, beyond the 27 he has enumerated (but
  oddly seems reluctant to reveal this huge uncoveringor 27+Nakshatra
  States of Consciousness to his Guru Deva), and his Solar angels' Solar
  Angel's, Solar Angels -- sort of the parampara Solar Angel --  who was
  Rory --  was crucified on the cross of Pure Knowledge, as the 27 prior
  states exploded in his solar plexus, the fusion of all lower and
  higher states, in the form of an inverted golden polyhedron, with 108
  dancing rudras around its axis, all while his head, which was a big
  Brahman,  craddled in Alex's arms, a lesser Brahman, on the floor of
  Revelations -- (a particle of Brahman-- not yet realizing that) 
  (Revelations -- literally and figuratively), while the devas wept. 
  
  Like Judy, I didn't comment, not wanting to pile on -- and be seen
  by the wise and dignified like Turq, as questioning a heavy
  experience. Besides, I had that experience last year, its so passe.
 
 
 I kinda thought so too, for reasons very close to what you just
 described, except I don't know why you say Darn, and I'm not sure
 about the devas weeping.


Hi Vashti, 

Nice to have you back. My post was a flowing humor rift/parody  -- so
i am not sure I can explain in full. Darn was sort of mock
disappointment at Alex saying it was not a real death of
ego/individuality thing -- and thus mock disappointment at not having
some colorful Rory story of what that paticular death was all about. 

As far as the devas wept -- I could have gone a number of ways with
that -- but I sort of was trying to get at wept with joy  at the
evolutionary stroke of it all, yet wept with grief at the loss off
such a shining and stellar soul/individuality.

Humor (if thats what one can call my rift -- its what I was aiming at
-- and with the expectation that Rory would get a big belly laugh from
it) just sort of flows out. I write the flow, particularly if it makes
me laugh or smile. But as turq will tell you I am a pissant, snake,
poor excuse for a human being with huge issues :) so what makes me
laugh may not coincide with mainstream humor. 

new.morning (aka akasha / OMG)




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley
 j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote:
  
   --- authfriend jstein@ wrote:
   
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter
drpetersutphen@ wrote:
snip
 Yeah, the pathology of the TMO in a nutshell. Have
 profound experiences (like the Absolute having a
 personality!) and you are attacked and driven into
 silence.

How profound can the experiences be if the person
having them is so bruised by a few negative comments
that he feels he has to withdraw into silence?
   
   I take them at face value. Why would someone's
   reactions to negative comments somehow negate or
   diminish such experiences? How do we know said parties
   are bruised and are wimpy-wimps because they
   withdraw into silence. When someone characterizes your
   experience as sh*t why would anyone speak about them
   again? Sharing experiences is not a debate. 
  
  Well said, Peter. And, Rory's declining to debate his recent post is
  completely consistent with his lack of participation on FFL lately.
  I've spoken with him about this before, and FFL is simply no longer
  where he wants to direct lots of time, energy, and attention. 
  
  Better to just take him at face value when he writes, I have posted
  this material here only to clarify and correct some of the finer
  details of the unfoldment of Brahman I gave here last year. I am not
  interested in debating or discussing them particularly. They were
  simply some loose ends that had to be tied up.
 
 In other words, Rory posted with grace and dignity,
 something I'm not sure I can say about some of the
 posts that reacted to what he said.


Meaning me. And you're right. I was completely out of line in how I said what I 
said.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I'm sure the hawk was having quite the wtf experience trying
 to catch prey in the suburbs, though I've seen him before and he
 looks a little chubby- plenty of pigeons and squirrels around 
here...
 
 Not to mention an abundance of slow running RU kids!
 
Ha-Ha! Funny imagewaait!! No RU kids here 
though that I know of. Always thought I'd get my daughter to meditate 
but she's a pretty enlightened 16 yr. old, so we have both lost 
interest in that project...now that halloween's coming up maybe I'll 
give the kids $5 off coupons towards their next initiation, instead of 
candy...and then act perplexed the next morning when I see my car has 
been egged... 




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote:
 
  I know what he's said and done in the past...
 
 Try to be more in the present. Expect miracles and wonders..


And him embracing people who declare him their guru?

I don't think so. Even that stuff with the rajas that was on last week on 
mou.org didn't have 
them addressing him as guru, though I noted his promotion to divine holiness.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
  
   But *why* do you react negatively? Consistently?
   
   Could it possibly be...uh...jealousy? Having done
   everything you've been told to do for over thirty
   years and never having experienced diddley-squat,
   while those who do what the fuck they want have
   lots of cool experiences? There's a lesson in 
   there, if you were just intelligent enough to
   perceive it...
  
  So cool experiences is where it's at?
 
 Actually, for many of us, yes it is.
 
 I always liked one teacher's breakdown of the
 two types of spiritual seekers. One type is
 content to read about -- and be inspired by --
 other people's experiences. The other type 
 likes that, too, but it isn't enough for them.
 They want to have these experiences themselves,
 and if the tradition they're part of is not
 delivering them, after a suitable period of
 time, they move on to a tradition that *does*
 deliver.
 
 Haven't you ever considered the possibility
 that the TMO's We don't talk about our experiences
 stance was developed because people weren't having
 very *many* of them? 
 
 That's not true in many other traditions. And
 interestingly enough, the traditions in which
 seekers never go a month (and rarely a week)
 without having some extraordinary experience 
 almost never have any dogma that says, Don't 
 talk about them. In fact, the structure of such 
 organizations is such that it's considered a normal 
 thing to talk freely about one's experiences. 
 
 I'm suggesting that you would *not* have reacted
 negatively to a fellow seeker of enlightenment
 talking about his personal experiences of enlight-
 enment if you hadn't been *taught* to react that 
 way. You were.


Sigh, my reaction was to the MMY is my gurudev thing. I didn't make that 
clear.

And as for cool experiences, I'm a devout Buddha-killer at heart. And even THAT 
is 
worthing of assasination...




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
 j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote:
  
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Alex Stanley 
   j_alexander_stanley@ wrote:
  [snip]
   , and since Rory is my Guru Dev;
he is my true I and knows me better than I know myself,
I went into knee-jerk defensive mode. Truth is, I loved Rory,
and I was with him when he died.
   
   Ain't gonna touch that one!  Care to expand?
  
  Just me being silly. The second sentence is a reference to that nutbag
  who said he loved JonBenet Ramsey and was with her when she died. My
  sense of humor is a bit warped at times.
 
 Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
 didn't want to pile on just in case it was
 one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...

For me, deep experiences consist of being here now and loving what
is with respect to all the various aspects of who I am. From my
perspective, it's mundane stuff. 

Rory can listen to my experiences, and language it back to me in terms
of Brahman, particles, CC, GC, etc., but I have no ah ha recognition
when I hear his perspective. That's not to say there aren't 27 levels
of Nakshatrian wonderfulness going on; I just don't have the clarity
to see it.




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote:
snip
  I'm suggesting that you would *not* have reacted
  negatively to a fellow seeker of enlightenment
  talking about his personal experiences of enlight-
  enment if you hadn't been *taught* to react that 
  way. You were.
 
 Sigh, my reaction was to the MMY is my gurudev thing.
 I didn't make that clear.

You made it perfectly clear.

Barry *assumed* any post from you responding to
Rory would be critical of Rory's experiences, so
he didn't need to read what you actually wrote.

And with me, he assumed I would make a critical
response, so he didn't even need to *see* one to
accuse me of always reacting negatively to other
people's experiences.  Which is a good thing,
because I never made such a post.

Barry just lives in a different world than the
rest of us do, in which his expectations determine
what happens.



 And as for cool experiences, I'm a devout Buddha-killer at
 heart. And even THAT is worthing of assasination...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread vashtirama

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, vashtirama vashtirama@ wrote:
 
 
Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
didn't want to pile on just in case it was
one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...
   
   Darn, I thought it was Rory entering the 28th Nakshatra state of
   consciousness, the hidden one, beyond the 27 he has enumerated (but
   oddly seems reluctant to reveal this huge uncoveringor 27+Nakshatra
   States of Consciousness to his Guru Deva), and his Solar angels'
Solar
   Angel's, Solar Angels -- sort of the parampara Solar Angel -- 
who was
   Rory --  was crucified on the cross of Pure Knowledge, as the 27
prior
   states exploded in his solar plexus, the fusion of all lower and
   higher states, in the form of an inverted golden polyhedron,
with 108
   dancing rudras around its axis, all while his head, which was a big
   Brahman,  craddled in Alex's arms, a lesser Brahman, on the floor of
   Revelations -- (a particle of Brahman-- not yet realizing that) 
   (Revelations -- literally and figuratively), while the devas
wept. 
   
   Like Judy, I didn't comment, not wanting to pile on -- and be seen
   by the wise and dignified like Turq, as questioning a heavy
   experience. Besides, I had that experience last year, its so passe.
  
  
  I kinda thought so too, for reasons very close to what you just
  described, except I don't know why you say Darn, and I'm not sure
  about the devas weeping.
 
 
 Hi Vashti, 
 
 Nice to have you back. My post was a flowing humor rift/parody  -- so
 i am not sure I can explain in full. Darn was sort of mock
 disappointment at Alex saying it was not a real death of
 ego/individuality thing -- and thus mock disappointment at not having
 some colorful Rory story of what that paticular death was all about. 
 
 As far as the devas wept -- I could have gone a number of ways with
 that -- but I sort of was trying to get at wept with joy  at the
 evolutionary stroke of it all, yet wept with grief at the loss off
 such a shining and stellar soul/individuality.
 
 Humor (if thats what one can call my rift -- its what I was aiming at
 -- and with the expectation that Rory would get a big belly laugh from
 it) just sort of flows out. I write the flow, particularly if it makes
 me laugh or smile. But as turq will tell you I am a pissant, snake,
 poor excuse for a human being with huge issues :) so what makes me
 laugh may not coincide with mainstream humor. 
 
 new.morning (aka akasha / OMG)


new.morning (hi OMG!)--and Rory:
I forget to watch for the unintended ways emails can sound so I meant
that I enjoyed yours, got the lightheartedness you meant, I could
easily hear a ringing laugh from Rory over it, and responded in the
same spirit--not from a critical place in case you wondered--that I
thought it cleverly written and would tweak the devas part; more
likely singing in marvelous choruses, and the why 'darn'? because it
must have happened like that on some level as opposed to you being
mistaken. But of course weeping from joy works just as well, and adds
just a touch of poignant ambiguity.

Rory, you sound radiantly happy there! I am glad for you.
Vashti




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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, vashtirama [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, vashtirama vashtirama@
wrote:
  

 
 new.morning (hi OMG!)--and Rory:

 I forget to watch for the unintended ways emails can sound so I meant
 that I enjoyed yours, got the lightheartedness you meant, I could
 easily hear a ringing laugh from Rory over it, and responded in the
 same spirit--not from a critical place in case you wondered

Yes, I understood. :)

--that I
 thought it cleverly written and would tweak the devas part; more
 likely singing in marvelous choruses, and the why 'darn'? because it
 must have happened like that on some level as opposed to you being
 mistaken. 

It was an unedited flow of consciousness. Such can usually be
tightened up. But I have to keep my quota of posts up (recent FFL
events joke) so I just whip them out. 

But of course weeping from joy works just as well, and adds
 just a touch of poignant ambiguity.

Yes, for me it sort of captured something I was going for. But maybe
you had to be there. (inside my head -- a scary place indeed!)


 Rory, you sound radiantly happy there! I am glad for you.
 Vashti

Yes, he did. His and other posts have me actually thinking, vageely,
of moving back to FFL for a stint. 






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

Thank you both! 

Yes, vashti, you are absolutely correct -- I am supremely happy, in 
an ordinary sort of way. Home is where the heart is, all right :-)

And as it happens, OMG/Akasha/Newmorning(samechit?) is also 
absolutely correct. When collapsing into the particle-mes I did a 
*lot* of weeping with joy in the Dome. While the overall particle-
appreciation of my ordinary/cosmic qualities was utterly 
overwhelming, and they/we were most pleased with the beauty of 
everyOne, I suspect that to most bysitters the divine snot 
streaming out of my nose wasn't all that pretty. Flow, soma, in a 
sweet and invigorating stream... :-)


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, vashtirama [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ 
wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, vashtirama vashtirama@ 
wrote:
  
  
 Well, I did think it sounded a bit weird, but I
 didn't want to pile on just in case it was
 one-a-them, you know, deep experiences...

Darn, I thought it was Rory entering the 28th Nakshatra 
state of
consciousness, the hidden one, beyond the 27 he has 
enumerated (but
oddly seems reluctant to reveal this huge uncoveringor 
27+Nakshatra
States of Consciousness to his Guru Deva), and his Solar 
angels'
 Solar
Angel's, Solar Angels -- sort of the parampara Solar Angel --
 
 who was
Rory --  was crucified on the cross of Pure Knowledge, as 
the 27
 prior
states exploded in his solar plexus, the fusion of all lower 
and
higher states, in the form of an inverted golden polyhedron,
 with 108
dancing rudras around its axis, all while his head, which 
was a big
Brahman,  craddled in Alex's arms, a lesser Brahman, on the 
floor of
Revelations -- (a particle of Brahman-- not yet realizing 
that) 
(Revelations -- literally and figuratively), while the 
devas
 wept. 

Like Judy, I didn't comment, not wanting to pile on -- and 
be seen
by the wise and dignified like Turq, as questioning a heavy
experience. Besides, I had that experience last year, its so 
passe.
   
   
   I kinda thought so too, for reasons very close to what you just
   described, except I don't know why you say Darn, and I'm not 
sure
   about the devas weeping.
  
  
  Hi Vashti, 
  
  Nice to have you back. My post was a flowing humor rift/parody  -
- so
  i am not sure I can explain in full. Darn was sort of mock
  disappointment at Alex saying it was not a real death of
  ego/individuality thing -- and thus mock disappointment at not 
having
  some colorful Rory story of what that paticular death was all 
about. 
  
  As far as the devas wept -- I could have gone a number of ways 
with
  that -- but I sort of was trying to get at wept with joy  at 
the
  evolutionary stroke of it all, yet wept with grief at the loss 
off
  such a shining and stellar soul/individuality.
  
  Humor (if thats what one can call my rift -- its what I was 
aiming at
  -- and with the expectation that Rory would get a big belly 
laugh from
  it) just sort of flows out. I write the flow, particularly if it 
makes
  me laugh or smile. But as turq will tell you I am a pissant, 
snake,
  poor excuse for a human being with huge issues :) so what 
makes me
  laugh may not coincide with mainstream humor. 
  
  new.morning (aka akasha / OMG)
 
 
 new.morning (hi OMG!)--and Rory:
 I forget to watch for the unintended ways emails can sound so I 
meant
 that I enjoyed yours, got the lightheartedness you meant, I could
 easily hear a ringing laugh from Rory over it, and responded in the
 same spirit--not from a critical place in case you wondered--that I
 thought it cleverly written and would tweak the devas part; more
 likely singing in marvelous choruses, and the why 'darn'? 
because it
 must have happened like that on some level as opposed to you being
 mistaken. But of course weeping from joy works just as well, and 
adds
 just a touch of poignant ambiguity.
 
 Rory, you sound radiantly happy there! I am glad for you.
 Vashti






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

Yes, I don't do pujas to MMY, as I am not a teacher, and I still 
affirm he is my Guru Dev, as he is my living fount of divine 
holiness. What does one's Guru Dev do but show you one's own 
divinity, one's own Self? How does S/He do this but by showing one 
how to back up or relax into Him, into Her, into deeper and deeper 
Wholeness of the Self? Clearly his Guru Dev conveyed this grace to 
MMY, and it is through MMY that this grace embraced me.

I don't say MMY is *his* Guru Dev, though in truth, from the devata-
particle-me POV, the particles don't see any real difference between 
the ordinary-Absolute-me, the MMY-me, the Guru Dev-me, or the 
Shiva-me. However, there is at the same time a distinct lineage of 
grace-transmission from Self to Self to Self, and it seems clear 
that in spacetime, the predecessor always is deeper into Being the 
Self than the successor. No doubt it was MMY's keen awareness of 
this that caused him to keep our attention on his Guru Dev. With all 
gratitude to his Guru Dev, I still must give credit where credit is 
due -- and as far as this me is concerned, MMY is the living 
fount. If my saying this were to cause him to scream and drive me 
from his presence, then so be it. Love is Love and Grace is Grace, 
no matter the appearance :-)

JGD

R



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, t3rinity no_reply@ wrote:
 
  --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig sparaig@ wrote:
  
   I know what he's said and done in the past...
  
  Try to be more in the present. Expect miracles and wonders..
 
 
 And him embracing people who declare him their guru?
 
 I don't think so. Even that stuff with the rajas that was on last 
week on mou.org didn't have 
 them addressing him as guru, though I noted his promotion 
to divine holiness.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman

2006-10-11 Thread Vaj

Fantastic. Thanks for sharing that. It make me surprised more haven't showed, if not at least as a touchstone for their own growth. I don't know know where it's colder in the winter, Maine or Iowa, but it sounds like the hearts there will keep you plenty warm. Congrats on your "new" home.Best,-VajOn Oct 11, 2006, at 2:15 PM, Rory Goff wrote:Dear Vaj, Yes, I don't think it is my place to give details of the course, but I will say that being on it was (and is) immensely freeing, and confirmed the "program" I have been spontaneously practicing over the last 24 years or so, when I awoke and left the Dome. Indeeed, it confirmed my whole Being, as I realized on ever deeper levels that obeying mySelf *is* and always has been obeying MMY, and vice versa (the mula mantra value, and all that). Returning to the Dome was so beautiful -- I left because everything was the same, so why work in someone else's factory? When I returned, I found that it was *my* factory, a kind of huge amplifier or particle accelerator manifesting on the outer what I had been practicing on the inner since awakening. Appreciating the Absolute- me collapsing again and again into the particle-mes, to experience the profound effects of my own simple, ordinary thoughts from the level of my own devatas/devotees creating ever richer fabrics of creation, and all of it appreciated by the course participants and commented on by MMY...wow. A great many of Us are waking up (and more) here now. Heaven on Earth is evidently here now, and though some of Us are still overwhelmed by the ordinary perfect supernal beauty, our "I"s are adjusting. If anyone really wants to "get Enlightened" in this lifetime, and feels any pull to come here, I heartily urge them to drop whatever they're doing and take advantage of this opportunity. It doesn't come along every lifetime, and I don't know how long the window will remain open. On the other hand, if their Selves tell them otherwise, that's perfect too :-) Rena and I are truly Home here, and are considering selling the house in Maine by next spring. Love, Light Laughter always and always, R.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Unfoldments of Brahman