Re: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Hey there, on a project last year i tinkered with AS3Dmod, a *great* little library for doing crazy 3D shape manipulations, compatible with away3d/papervision etc... http://www.derschmale.com/2009/03/16/cloth-simulation-modifier-in-as3dmod/ Here's the project we were working on... http://eightandahalf.org This was our first 3D flash project, and we went with Away3D because they were more bleeding edge (rather than papervision, unlike a previous comment) and they had proper bloody z-sorting, which papervision didn't seem to have at that time. But the docs were always either sparse or out-of-date (the downside of bleeding edge), so the learning curve was practically vertical. Next time I'd go with papervision, just because the community is larger, so much better support. good luck anyway! 2009/8/11 Henry Cooke aninfinitenumberofmonk...@gmail.com Hey Sebastian, While Away started life as a PV3D branch, they're pretty diverged by now - while they do occasionally share code, they're certainly two distinct engines and will remain so. General consensus here is that PV tends to have more whizzy features and is the more 'bleeding-edge' engine, while Away has better stability and a nicer API. YMMV. I don't know if either supports morphing out of the box, but it should be relatively simple to hack either engine to do it /relatively/ being the active word here :- It' not much hassle to get either working to a point where you can figure out which will be better suited to your needs; if you've got the time, I definitely recommend having a look at both. It's very much a question of personal taste and which engine has the better feature set for your project. Cheers, h. 2009/8/11 sebastian sebast...@360d.com Hello everyone, thank-you for your replies, very insightful. I have looked at some websites to get a feeling for what Away3D is compared to PV3D. Am I correct that Away3D is an off-shoot that will become merged into PV? If so, it would seem more sensible to stick with PV3D... right? This article in particular swayed me: http://blog.papervision3d.org/2007/05/16/papervision3d-to-merge-away3d-features/ I am hoping that I can find a way to have shapes merge between different polygon configurations in PV; as the client wants geometric shapes with 8 sides [diamond], 20 sided [big die], 12 sided etc. [think multi-sided Dice sets] they need to spin, have images on each side, and when you click on a side, opens the relative page in a light-box. The user will be able to switch dice shape [ploy-sides] with a click and I need to have it morph. If there is really no way to have this done dynamically; I suppose I can pre-render all possible variations [12 to 4, 12 to 8, 12 to 20 etc] -- but then I have the issue of how it looks different if in flash vs. how it would look from a 3d program... [and the only 3d program I know well enough to crank out stuff fast is: Lightwave] Thanks for any further comment or insight, best regards, Sebastian. On Aug 10, 2009, at 12:03 PM, Matt Gitchell wrote: PV3D's pretty good, tho there's a little bit of a curve to learning it. I haven't done any Away3D stuff but I've heard good reports about that too.You probably don't want to go down the custom road as once you start to deal with z-sorting and all that in earnest it balloons in complexity quickly. CS4's native 3D stuff is generally only good for planes, there's no native poly handling. I think the latest PV3D has been tweaked to take some advantage of the native FP10 3D stuff on the render side, but I didn't have that as an option on my last PV3D project and hence didn't explore it. As far as morphing shapes goes, you're probably going to have to do that in a dedicated 3D suite then export that animation to a Collada file. You can spin and move stuff (in PV3D), but actual manipulations of the shapes/polys in an object are going to be best handled in a more or less canned fashion, depending on the complexity you're looking for or if you want to write something that creates the polys dynamically, which is again easier in PV3D than Pure AS3. On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Kerry Thompson al...@cyberiantiger.biz wrote: Sebastian wrote: I was wondering if anyone had any feedback to my 3d inquiry? Because I have not received any input from the group. My guess is that not many of us work in 3D. I've had a look at Papervision, and, while it looks pretty good, I haven't explored it deeply enough to help. Does it have to be Flash? The dominant player in the online 3D world is still Director/Shockwave, and what you are describing could be done easily in Shockwave. If you're not familiar with Lingo, Director has an implementation of JavaScript that is a lot closer to ActionScript. I don't know how much of its 3D capabilities are available through JavaScript,
Re: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Hey Sebastian, While Away started life as a PV3D branch, they're pretty diverged by now - while they do occasionally share code, they're certainly two distinct engines and will remain so. General consensus here is that PV tends to have more whizzy features and is the more 'bleeding-edge' engine, while Away has better stability and a nicer API. YMMV. I don't know if either supports morphing out of the box, but it should be relatively simple to hack either engine to do it /relatively/ being the active word here :- It' not much hassle to get either working to a point where you can figure out which will be better suited to your needs; if you've got the time, I definitely recommend having a look at both. It's very much a question of personal taste and which engine has the better feature set for your project. Cheers, h. 2009/8/11 sebastian sebast...@360d.com Hello everyone, thank-you for your replies, very insightful. I have looked at some websites to get a feeling for what Away3D is compared to PV3D. Am I correct that Away3D is an off-shoot that will become merged into PV? If so, it would seem more sensible to stick with PV3D... right? This article in particular swayed me: http://blog.papervision3d.org/2007/05/16/papervision3d-to-merge-away3d-features/ I am hoping that I can find a way to have shapes merge between different polygon configurations in PV; as the client wants geometric shapes with 8 sides [diamond], 20 sided [big die], 12 sided etc. [think multi-sided Dice sets] they need to spin, have images on each side, and when you click on a side, opens the relative page in a light-box. The user will be able to switch dice shape [ploy-sides] with a click and I need to have it morph. If there is really no way to have this done dynamically; I suppose I can pre-render all possible variations [12 to 4, 12 to 8, 12 to 20 etc] -- but then I have the issue of how it looks different if in flash vs. how it would look from a 3d program... [and the only 3d program I know well enough to crank out stuff fast is: Lightwave] Thanks for any further comment or insight, best regards, Sebastian. On Aug 10, 2009, at 12:03 PM, Matt Gitchell wrote: PV3D's pretty good, tho there's a little bit of a curve to learning it. I haven't done any Away3D stuff but I've heard good reports about that too.You probably don't want to go down the custom road as once you start to deal with z-sorting and all that in earnest it balloons in complexity quickly. CS4's native 3D stuff is generally only good for planes, there's no native poly handling. I think the latest PV3D has been tweaked to take some advantage of the native FP10 3D stuff on the render side, but I didn't have that as an option on my last PV3D project and hence didn't explore it. As far as morphing shapes goes, you're probably going to have to do that in a dedicated 3D suite then export that animation to a Collada file. You can spin and move stuff (in PV3D), but actual manipulations of the shapes/polys in an object are going to be best handled in a more or less canned fashion, depending on the complexity you're looking for or if you want to write something that creates the polys dynamically, which is again easier in PV3D than Pure AS3. On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Kerry Thompson al...@cyberiantiger.biz wrote: Sebastian wrote: I was wondering if anyone had any feedback to my 3d inquiry? Because I have not received any input from the group. My guess is that not many of us work in 3D. I've had a look at Papervision, and, while it looks pretty good, I haven't explored it deeply enough to help. Does it have to be Flash? The dominant player in the online 3D world is still Director/Shockwave, and what you are describing could be done easily in Shockwave. If you're not familiar with Lingo, Director has an implementation of JavaScript that is a lot closer to ActionScript. I don't know how much of its 3D capabilities are available through JavaScript, but it's worth a look. You can download a 30-day free trial. Another up-and-coming 3D program is Unity--they're making some serious waves, and, from the reports I've heard, Unity is easier to work with than Director. Its main drawback is that it doesn't have the plugin penetration Shockwave has. HTH. Cordially, Kerry Thompson ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com
Re: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Hello flashcoders, I was wondering if anyone had any feedback to my 3d inquiry? Because I have not received any input from the group. Thanks! Sebastian. On Aug 7, 2009, at 12:01 PM, sebastian wrote: Hello everyone, Long time no speak! I've been out of the flash loop for about 9 months, and I'm about to work on a new flash project which requires some 3D animation. I need to make 3D polygons that spin and can morph from one shape to another. I also need to be able to skin each side of the polygon with a different image [loaded via XML form outside files] With my know-how form 9 months ago, I would either work this out in pure 3D code I would write from scratch or from a library, or I would try and look into something like papervision3D which I think does something like this already. I'm still on CS3 My question is: Is there a new, better and more elegant / pre-made way for working in 3D? Is there now a better package than papervision? Does flash CS4 make this in anyway easier? Thanks for any guidance and general direction answers you can provide. Kindly, Sebastian. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Hello Sebastien, Were it me, I'd go for either Papervision or Away3D. I absolutely wouldn't do it from scratch. There's already a lot of time and effort been spent on these projects, so why reinvent the wheel? Both certainly support 'skinning from images' (texturing). Morphing I am less sure about, but given they both handle animation, I'd be surprised if they didn't. At the very least, you can get hold of the mesh points and move them about programmatically yourself. HTH, Ian On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 8:01 PM, sebastiansebast...@360d.com wrote: Hello everyone, Long time no speak! I've been out of the flash loop for about 9 months, and I'm about to work on a new flash project which requires some 3D animation. I need to make 3D polygons that spin and can morph from one shape to another. I also need to be able to skin each side of the polygon with a different image [loaded via XML form outside files] With my know-how form 9 months ago, I would either work this out in pure 3D code I would write from scratch or from a library, or I would try and look into something like papervision3D which I think does something like this already. I'm still on CS3 My question is: Is there a new, better and more elegant / pre-made way for working in 3D? Is there now a better package than papervision? Does flash CS4 make this in anyway easier? Thanks for any guidance and general direction answers you can provide. Kindly, Sebastian. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
RE: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Sebastian wrote: I was wondering if anyone had any feedback to my 3d inquiry? Because I have not received any input from the group. My guess is that not many of us work in 3D. I've had a look at Papervision, and, while it looks pretty good, I haven't explored it deeply enough to help. Does it have to be Flash? The dominant player in the online 3D world is still Director/Shockwave, and what you are describing could be done easily in Shockwave. If you're not familiar with Lingo, Director has an implementation of JavaScript that is a lot closer to ActionScript. I don't know how much of its 3D capabilities are available through JavaScript, but it's worth a look. You can download a 30-day free trial. Another up-and-coming 3D program is Unity--they're making some serious waves, and, from the reports I've heard, Unity is easier to work with than Director. Its main drawback is that it doesn't have the plugin penetration Shockwave has. HTH. Cordially, Kerry Thompson ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
PV3D's pretty good, tho there's a little bit of a curve to learning it. I haven't done any Away3D stuff but I've heard good reports about that too.You probably don't want to go down the custom road as once you start to deal with z-sorting and all that in earnest it balloons in complexity quickly. CS4's native 3D stuff is generally only good for planes, there's no native poly handling. I think the latest PV3D has been tweaked to take some advantage of the native FP10 3D stuff on the render side, but I didn't have that as an option on my last PV3D project and hence didn't explore it. As far as morphing shapes goes, you're probably going to have to do that in a dedicated 3D suite then export that animation to a Collada file. You can spin and move stuff (in PV3D), but actual manipulations of the shapes/polys in an object are going to be best handled in a more or less canned fashion, depending on the complexity you're looking for or if you want to write something that creates the polys dynamically, which is again easier in PV3D than Pure AS3. On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Kerry Thompson al...@cyberiantiger.bizwrote: Sebastian wrote: I was wondering if anyone had any feedback to my 3d inquiry? Because I have not received any input from the group. My guess is that not many of us work in 3D. I've had a look at Papervision, and, while it looks pretty good, I haven't explored it deeply enough to help. Does it have to be Flash? The dominant player in the online 3D world is still Director/Shockwave, and what you are describing could be done easily in Shockwave. If you're not familiar with Lingo, Director has an implementation of JavaScript that is a lot closer to ActionScript. I don't know how much of its 3D capabilities are available through JavaScript, but it's worth a look. You can download a 30-day free trial. Another up-and-coming 3D program is Unity--they're making some serious waves, and, from the reports I've heard, Unity is easier to work with than Director. Its main drawback is that it doesn't have the plugin penetration Shockwave has. HTH. Cordially, Kerry Thompson ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
Re: [Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Hello everyone, thank-you for your replies, very insightful. I have looked at some websites to get a feeling for what Away3D is compared to PV3D. Am I correct that Away3D is an off-shoot that will become merged into PV? If so, it would seem more sensible to stick with PV3D... right? This article in particular swayed me: http://blog.papervision3d.org/2007/05/16/papervision3d-to-merge-away3d-features/ I am hoping that I can find a way to have shapes merge between different polygon configurations in PV; as the client wants geometric shapes with 8 sides [diamond], 20 sided [big die], 12 sided etc. [think multi-sided Dice sets] they need to spin, have images on each side, and when you click on a side, opens the relative page in a light- box. The user will be able to switch dice shape [ploy-sides] with a click and I need to have it morph. If there is really no way to have this done dynamically; I suppose I can pre-render all possible variations [12 to 4, 12 to 8, 12 to 20 etc] -- but then I have the issue of how it looks different if in flash vs. how it would look from a 3d program... [and the only 3d program I know well enough to crank out stuff fast is: Lightwave] Thanks for any further comment or insight, best regards, Sebastian. On Aug 10, 2009, at 12:03 PM, Matt Gitchell wrote: PV3D's pretty good, tho there's a little bit of a curve to learning it. I haven't done any Away3D stuff but I've heard good reports about that too.You probably don't want to go down the custom road as once you start to deal with z-sorting and all that in earnest it balloons in complexity quickly. CS4's native 3D stuff is generally only good for planes, there's no native poly handling. I think the latest PV3D has been tweaked to take some advantage of the native FP10 3D stuff on the render side, but I didn't have that as an option on my last PV3D project and hence didn't explore it. As far as morphing shapes goes, you're probably going to have to do that in a dedicated 3D suite then export that animation to a Collada file. You can spin and move stuff (in PV3D), but actual manipulations of the shapes/polys in an object are going to be best handled in a more or less canned fashion, depending on the complexity you're looking for or if you want to write something that creates the polys dynamically, which is again easier in PV3D than Pure AS3. On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 11:34 AM, Kerry Thompson al...@cyberiantiger.biz wrote: Sebastian wrote: I was wondering if anyone had any feedback to my 3d inquiry? Because I have not received any input from the group. My guess is that not many of us work in 3D. I've had a look at Papervision, and, while it looks pretty good, I haven't explored it deeply enough to help. Does it have to be Flash? The dominant player in the online 3D world is still Director/Shockwave, and what you are describing could be done easily in Shockwave. If you're not familiar with Lingo, Director has an implementation of JavaScript that is a lot closer to ActionScript. I don't know how much of its 3D capabilities are available through JavaScript, but it's worth a look. You can download a 30-day free trial. Another up-and-coming 3D program is Unity--they're making some serious waves, and, from the reports I've heard, Unity is easier to work with than Director. Its main drawback is that it doesn't have the plugin penetration Shockwave has. HTH. Cordially, Kerry Thompson ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
[Flashcoders] what is the current 3D best-practice?
Hello everyone, Long time no speak! I've been out of the flash loop for about 9 months, and I'm about to work on a new flash project which requires some 3D animation. I need to make 3D polygons that spin and can morph from one shape to another. I also need to be able to skin each side of the polygon with a different image [loaded via XML form outside files] With my know-how form 9 months ago, I would either work this out in pure 3D code I would write from scratch or from a library, or I would try and look into something like papervision3D which I think does something like this already. I'm still on CS3 My question is: Is there a new, better and more elegant / pre-made way for working in 3D? Is there now a better package than papervision? Does flash CS4 make this in anyway easier? Thanks for any guidance and general direction answers you can provide. Kindly, Sebastian. ___ Flashcoders mailing list Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders
