RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
FYI - the link to subscribe to Flashnewbies is right below the option to subscribe to this list. chattyfig.figleaf.com or: http://training.figleaf.com/resources/ Jason Merrill Bank of America GTO Learning Leadership Development eTools Multimedia Team ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
Re: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
This might help: http://osflash.org/flashcoders/etiquette This list is about the programming side of Flash. Anything else should be asked elsewhere (IMO), e.g. flashnewbies. Before asking a question you should at least do some research first: RTFM: http://livedocs.adobe.com/flash/8/index.html Search Google: http://www.google.com Search FlashCoders archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/private/flashcoders/ http://muzakdeezign.com/flashcoders/ Search the Adobe site for articles/tutorials http://www.adobe.com/ regards, Muzak - Original Message - From: Teresa Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Flashcoders mailing list flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:23 PM Subject: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. I have to cast a vote here too because it is encouraging to see that other people have run into the same stumbling blocks. I found Flashcoders first and was referred to Flashnewbies in response to a question. Unfortunately, the same question was posted to Flashcoders a couple weeks later and answered without a referral to Flashnewbies. I am not whining. I am still listening to both lists. (with the help of the filter in gmail.) However, I have sat for too long wondering where to post based on the level of the question. So some guidelines are definitely in order. It would be very valuable to recommend directions and levels to the two groups on the subscribe pages of both, and/or on the confirmation email. It is also an opportunity to recommend Flashnewbies as a first check. Flashcoders came up first in my searches. I cast my vote for keeping the two groups, not four, not one, two groups properly advertised for their discussion level. And thanks to Jason and all the others who are answering questions on both. The two forums have been a great help to me over the past few months. Teresa ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
I'm already getting two copies of each post in this group. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Muzak Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 11:26 AM To: flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Subject: Re: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. This might help: http://osflash.org/flashcoders/etiquette This list is about the programming side of Flash. Anything else should be asked elsewhere (IMO), e.g. flashnewbies. Before asking a question you should at least do some research first: RTFM: http://livedocs.adobe.com/flash/8/index.html Search Google: http://www.google.com Search FlashCoders archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/private/flashcoders/ http://muzakdeezign.com/flashcoders/ Search the Adobe site for articles/tutorials http://www.adobe.com/ regards, Muzak - Original Message - From: Teresa Hardy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Flashcoders mailing list flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2007 7:23 PM Subject: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. I have to cast a vote here too because it is encouraging to see that other people have run into the same stumbling blocks. I found Flashcoders first and was referred to Flashnewbies in response to a question. Unfortunately, the same question was posted to Flashcoders a couple weeks later and answered without a referral to Flashnewbies. I am not whining. I am still listening to both lists. (with the help of the filter in gmail.) However, I have sat for too long wondering where to post based on the level of the question. So some guidelines are definitely in order. It would be very valuable to recommend directions and levels to the two groups on the subscribe pages of both, and/or on the confirmation email. It is also an opportunity to recommend Flashnewbies as a first check. Flashcoders came up first in my searches. I cast my vote for keeping the two groups, not four, not one, two groups properly advertised for their discussion level. And thanks to Jason and all the others who are answering questions on both. The two forums have been a great help to me over the past few months. Teresa ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
I appreciate the arguments and kind words, but I vote to keep them separate. Here's why: 1) Flashnewbies does have some rather advanced topics from time to time, but we need to help those people graduate to flashcoders, or if they don't get an answer, encourage them to ask on Flashcoders. 2) Flashnewbies is low-traffic (but not REAL low, I still see a dozen or more messages a day), but that's a good thing in some ways. 3) Flashnewbies is a good place to ask non-coding Flash questions, like questions about the IDE or general strategy. 4) Flashbnewbies is (sorry to say), so much more polite, personal, and friendly than Flashcoders. Mixing the two, we'd lose that. Flashcoders is a huge 2000-unit townhome development in the city. Flashnewbies is a small 10 home neighborhood in the country. 5) People who don't get the help they need on Flashnewbies should ask on Flashcoders anyway. 6) Flashcoders don't want to see a bunch of newbie questions on this list, especially when the same questions get asked over and over. It will add traffic they don't want to have to sort or mentally ignore. 7) More Flashcoders should consider subscribing to Flashnewbies just to help people out. Think of it as community service. You might even learn some things (I do). :) 8) If this proposal requires further consideration, we should at least open the same thread on Flashnewbies to get input from people over there. Anyway, nice ideas, but personally, I don't think it would be the best thing to combine the lists, no offense. Jason Merrill Bank of America GTO Learning Leadership Development eTools Multimedia Team -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Count Schemula Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2007 8:54 PM To: flashcoders list Subject: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. Hear me out before freaking out. 1. Half of the posts in Coders are more or less Newbie posts anyhow. 2. There is just not a lot of traffic in Newbies. So, it's hard to pick Coders brains and honestly, most Newbie questions can be answered by a Coder in less than a minute. I post in Newbies, but answers can take days. Seems like Jason Merrill is one of the few Coders dedicated to helping out those less fortunate. 3. Making Newbies stronger benefits all. After a while, a typical dedicated Newbie will be able to field a lot of the other Newbie questions and the situation will level out. 4. But oh, the increased traffic! Please. I have a dedicated gmail account for this list. It threads the posts together and has practically unlimited storage and very good search. 5. Pound home the idea that Newbies need to title their posts as such No0b: How do I make a movie clip? Coders don't have to do anything. 6. What's good for Flash developers is good for the Flash Platform. Getting more Newbies to an intermediate level benefits the Flash Platform as a whole with better apps, better people in jobs to lobby for Flash, etc, etc. Ok, now you can freak out. -- count_schemula ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
I wasn't even aware of Flash Newbies before finding FlashCoders. I'm sure I posted a few questions here that were better suited for Flash Newbies. I think it's a publicity problem more than anything - when I did a Google search to find flash help, I don't think I ever got an archived version of a FlashNewbies in the response, but quite a few from FlashCoders. I've just subscribed to flash newbies, so hopefully I'll be able to help out. I think encouraging flashcoders to also subscribe to flash newbies would be the best solution. Daniel Holth I.S. Programmer x5217 || J401 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Merrill, Jason Sent: Monday, May 14, 2007 9:16 AM To: flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Subject: RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. I appreciate the arguments and kind words, but I vote to keep them separate. Here's why: 1) Flashnewbies does have some rather advanced topics from time to time, but we need to help those people graduate to flashcoders, or if they don't get an answer, encourage them to ask on Flashcoders. 2) Flashnewbies is low-traffic (but not REAL low, I still see a dozen or more messages a day), but that's a good thing in some ways. 3) Flashnewbies is a good place to ask non-coding Flash questions, like questions about the IDE or general strategy. 4) Flashbnewbies is (sorry to say), so much more polite, personal, and friendly than Flashcoders. Mixing the two, we'd lose that. Flashcoders is a huge 2000-unit townhome development in the city. Flashnewbies is a small 10 home neighborhood in the country. 5) People who don't get the help they need on Flashnewbies should ask on Flashcoders anyway. 6) Flashcoders don't want to see a bunch of newbie questions on this list, especially when the same questions get asked over and over. It will add traffic they don't want to have to sort or mentally ignore. 7) More Flashcoders should consider subscribing to Flashnewbies just to help people out. Think of it as community service. You might even learn some things (I do). :) 8) If this proposal requires further consideration, we should at least open the same thread on Flashnewbies to get input from people over there. Anyway, nice ideas, but personally, I don't think it would be the best thing to combine the lists, no offense. Jason Merrill Bank of America GTO Learning Leadership Development eTools Multimedia Team -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Count Schemula Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2007 8:54 PM To: flashcoders list Subject: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. Hear me out before freaking out. 1. Half of the posts in Coders are more or less Newbie posts anyhow. 2. There is just not a lot of traffic in Newbies. So, it's hard to pick Coders brains and honestly, most Newbie questions can be answered by a Coder in less than a minute. I post in Newbies, but answers can take days. Seems like Jason Merrill is one of the few Coders dedicated to helping out those less fortunate. 3. Making Newbies stronger benefits all. After a while, a typical dedicated Newbie will be able to field a lot of the other Newbie questions and the situation will level out. 4. But oh, the increased traffic! Please. I have a dedicated gmail account for this list. It threads the posts together and has practically unlimited storage and very good search. 5. Pound home the idea that Newbies need to title their posts as such No0b: How do I make a movie clip? Coders don't have to do anything. 6. What's good for Flash developers is good for the Flash Platform. Getting more Newbies to an intermediate level benefits the Flash Platform as a whole with better apps, better people in jobs to lobby for Flash, etc, etc. Ok, now you can freak out. -- count_schemula ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com This e-mail and its attachments are intended only for the use of the addressee(s) and may contain privileged, confidential or proprietary information. If you are not the intended recipient, or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, displaying, copying, or use of this information is strictly prohibited. If you have received
Re: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
On 5/14/07, Merrill, Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I appreciate the arguments and kind words, but I vote to keep them separate. Here's why: I agree, and just signed up for the community service. Over the years, I found I read FlashCoders less and less. FlashCoders used to be a must-read list a few years ago. What I learned from this list is invaluable. You could stay up to date with what was happening in the Flash world and learn everything you needed to know just by reading this list, there was no need for anything else. For me, this has changed for several reasons, some of them personal (switching to haXe, not using mx.* and simply knowing more by myself), some of them related to the growth of the Flash Platform itself (it used to be possible to know and use pretty much everything related to AS coding, nowadays there simply are too many aspects to it for them to be relevant for everybody -- common component kits, video or not, RIA development or fancy menus, AS1/2/3, FMS, various OS projects, the list goes on), and, yes, questions that should better be posted on Newbies. The latter can be solved by making that list more attractive, i.e. by signing up and helping out as Jason suggested. But generally, I'd rather have FlashCoders split up into /more/ lists rather than combining it with FlashNewbies. A list each for AS2, AS3, FMS, architecture, components and so on. We could then choose which ones to subscribe to, and those of us gifted with the seemingly rare ability to set up email folders could organize them as they please. For me, personally, that would mean I'd subscribe to all and collect those I'm not currently interested in in a general knowledge-base folder for possible later use. That would reduce the number of mails that I personally consider noise (although they are perfectly legitimate in a general FlashCoders list) and thus greatly increase the value the rest has for me, making me read more of it. I imagine that would work the same for most. My 2ct. Just an idea. Mark ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
Flashnewbies?? There is a list called flashnewbies?? Never knew that. Subscribing as we speak. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Merrill, Jason Sent: maandag 14 mei 2007 16:16 To: flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com Subject: RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. I appreciate the arguments and kind words, but I vote to keep them separate. Here's why: 1) Flashnewbies does have some rather advanced topics from time to time, but we need to help those people graduate to flashcoders, or if they don't get an answer, encourage them to ask on Flashcoders. 2) Flashnewbies is low-traffic (but not REAL low, I still see a dozen or more messages a day), but that's a good thing in some ways. 3) Flashnewbies is a good place to ask non-coding Flash questions, like questions about the IDE or general strategy. 4) Flashbnewbies is (sorry to say), so much more polite, personal, and friendly than Flashcoders. Mixing the two, we'd lose that. Flashcoders is a huge 2000-unit townhome development in the city. Flashnewbies is a small 10 home neighborhood in the country. 5) People who don't get the help they need on Flashnewbies should ask on Flashcoders anyway. 6) Flashcoders don't want to see a bunch of newbie questions on this list, especially when the same questions get asked over and over. It will add traffic they don't want to have to sort or mentally ignore. 7) More Flashcoders should consider subscribing to Flashnewbies just to help people out. Think of it as community service. You might even learn some things (I do). :) 8) If this proposal requires further consideration, we should at least open the same thread on Flashnewbies to get input from people over there. Anyway, nice ideas, but personally, I don't think it would be the best thing to combine the lists, no offense. Jason Merrill Bank of America GTO Learning Leadership Development eTools Multimedia Team -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Count Schemula Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2007 8:54 PM To: flashcoders list Subject: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies. Hear me out before freaking out. 1. Half of the posts in Coders are more or less Newbie posts anyhow. 2. There is just not a lot of traffic in Newbies. So, it's hard to pick Coders brains and honestly, most Newbie questions can be answered by a Coder in less than a minute. I post in Newbies, but answers can take days. Seems like Jason Merrill is one of the few Coders dedicated to helping out those less fortunate. 3. Making Newbies stronger benefits all. After a while, a typical dedicated Newbie will be able to field a lot of the other Newbie questions and the situation will level out. 4. But oh, the increased traffic! Please. I have a dedicated gmail account for this list. It threads the posts together and has practically unlimited storage and very good search. 5. Pound home the idea that Newbies need to title their posts as such No0b: How do I make a movie clip? Coders don't have to do anything. 6. What's good for Flash developers is good for the Flash Platform. Getting more Newbies to an intermediate level benefits the Flash Platform as a whole with better apps, better people in jobs to lobby for Flash, etc, etc. Ok, now you can freak out. -- count_schemula ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com This e-mail and any attachment is for authorised use by the intended recipient(s) only. It may contain proprietary material, confidential information and/or be subject to legal privilege. It should not be copied, disclosed to, retained or used by, any other party. If you are not an intended recipient then please promptly delete this e-mail and any attachment and all copies and inform the sender. Thank you. ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
RE: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
But generally, I'd rather have FlashCoders split up into /more/ lists rather than combining it with FlashNewbies. A list each for AS2, AS3, FMS, architecture, components and so on. We could then choose which ones to subscribe to, and those of us gifted with the seemingly rare ability to set up email folders could organize them as they please. For me, personally, that would mean I'd subscribe to all and collect those I'm not currently interested in in a general knowledge-base folder for possible later use. That would reduce the number of mails that I personally consider noise (although they are perfectly legitimate in a general FlashCoders list) and thus greatly increase the value the rest has for me, making me read more of it. I imagine that would work the same for most. I understand the theory but unfortunately there's a down-side. For *reading* lists, it's great to have them categorised in this way, but for *posting* to them, it can cause problems. As a Director user, I have quite a few lists to choose from, among which are Dir3d-l, devoted to 3d issues, and dirGames-L, devoted to games programming (in Flash too, incidentally - it's a good list and might benefit from some Flash heads). Now, when I have an issue related to 3d in a games context, which list do I post to to ensure the right people read it? Either I have to choose one or the other, resulting in missing out on some potential advice, or I cross-post, with the result that those who read both lists (a fair proportion) get two copies of the same message. Neither really is ideal. In the end, a general list for experts can be more useful, with a serious naming and shaming of those who post messages with crappy subject lines. I'm not saying the idea is unworkable, but it's worth pointing out what we lose by it. Danny ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
Re: [Flashcoders] Motion to combine coders and newbies.
On 5/14/07, Danny Kodicek [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I understand the theory but unfortunately there's a down-side. For *reading* lists, it's great to have them categorised in this way, but for *posting* to them, it can cause problems. As a Director user, I have quite a few lists to choose from, among which are Dir3d-l, devoted to 3d issues, and dirGames-L, devoted to games programming (in Flash too, incidentally - it's a good list and might benefit from some Flash heads). Now, when I have an issue related to 3d in a games context, which list do I post to to ensure the right people read it? Either I have to choose one or the other, resulting in missing out on some potential advice, or I cross-post, with the result that those who read both lists (a fair proportion) get two copies of the same message. Neither really is ideal. In the end, a general list for experts can be more useful, with a serious naming and shaming of those who post messages with crappy subject lines. I'm not saying the idea is unworkable, but it's worth pointing out what we lose by it. Hmm... Good point. There probably would be plenty of cross posts. Still, I believe there are aspects that could be separated. The Flash JS API. mx.*. Stuff like that. There probably are special lists for those, but if they would be under the same Figleaf umbrella it would be easier to refer people to it and the community would stay intact. Anyway, I would very much appreciate a Flash oriented list discussing design (in the technical sense). If somebody knows of something like that, please let me know. Mark ___ Flashcoders@chattyfig.figleaf.com To change your subscription options or search the archive: http://chattyfig.figleaf.com/mailman/listinfo/flashcoders Brought to you by Fig Leaf Software Premier Authorized Adobe Consulting and Training http://www.figleaf.com http://training.figleaf.com
