FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
Thanks Carla, On 22/01/2009, at 3:53 AM, Martinek, Carla wrote: > > > === > > You will notice that the F8 and F9 shortcuts DO NOT work the same as > previous versions. This is really really bad. So what you're saying is that it only responds to the first letter you press and if you press the second it then jumps to the style that starts with that, if there is one? Sorry, but I have never had any faith in Adobe's desire to listen. In general our requests for changes have gone unheard/ignored. I think that may well be a deal breaker for me - all the other good stuff aside. I use FM purely as a production tool. I use it because it is not a DTP app. and I need to get through large amounts of text without fussing with the program. This changes renders FM about as useful for me as InDesign. Alan
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
On 22/01/2009, at 8:16 AM, Martinek, Carla wrote: > > > Please, file your comments with Adobe. Let them know that YOU find > this > a deal-breaker, and why. > Where? But as I said, whistling in the wind... > Now, all that said, a couple of the beta testers who write > FrameScripts > said they could probably come up with a script to solve this issue. > I'd > certainly pay for the script if they do. That would mean buying the scripts, buying FrameScript to run them when this functionality should be a core part of the application. Just being an independent means I don't a lot of money to chuck at filling holes the developers have exposed simply because they wanted to add more 'features'. Gotta say, I am starting to look at other applications. Building a class file in LaTeX would be as time consuming, and in the end possible productive. Alan
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
OK. Can anyone confirm if the other commands are lost too? Such as the meta key commands? I can't install this new version onto my old computer. Alan
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
One issue that came up during beta testing was the paragraph sort order. Some of you may have noticed that it changed in one of the FM8 patches. Many of us created templates that had style names in a particular order so that we could make easy use of keyboard shortcuts. Prior to FM8p277, these two styles would sort in this order: 1_Heading1 1k_HeadingKit In FM8p277 and on, they sorted in this order (the underscore came at the *end* of the sort list, instead of at the beginning): 1k_HeadingKit 1_Heading1 In FM9, the catalog sort order can be controlled in two ways through a flag in maker.ini. The default behavior continues to what was introduced with 8.0 p277 onwards but the old behavior can be achieved by toggling this flag. This can be done by switching the setting using SymbolSortingBeforeAlphaNumeric=On in the maker.ini file. === You will notice that the F8 and F9 shortcuts DO NOT work the same as previous versions. If you press F8 or F9, and then a letter or number, you will go to the first style that starts with that character. In the following example, pressing b would take you to the b1_body style. However, previously I could press b3 to select the b3_bullet1 style. Now you either have to press b three times, or press b and then the down arrow twice to get to the b3 style. b1_body1 b2_body2 b3_bullet1 b4_bullet2 c1_cellbody1 You may or may not find this inconvenient. In our case, this reduced functionality has basically rendered the keyboard shortcuts useless for many styles. To get to the c7 style, I'd have to press c seven times, or c once and the down arrow six times. I might as well use the mouse at that point. (If you find this intolerable, please let Adobe know. Now that the release is out, perhaps they can go back and address this problem and fix it in a patch release.) OTHERWISE, I find most of the improvements to be quite nice, and most Framers will be quite comfortable with the new features in a short time. -Carla - CONFIDENTIAL- This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential, and may also be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not review, use, copy, or distribute this message. If you receive this email in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply email and then delete this email. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
Thanks Carla, On 22/01/2009, at 3:53 AM, Martinek, Carla wrote: === You will notice that the F8 and F9 shortcuts DO NOT work the same as previous versions. This is really really bad. So what you're saying is that it only responds to the first letter you press and if you press the second it then jumps to the style that starts with that, if there is one? Sorry, but I have never had any faith in Adobe's desire to listen. In general our requests for changes have gone unheard/ignored. I think that may well be a deal breaker for me - all the other good stuff aside. I use FM purely as a production tool. I use it because it is not a DTP app. and I need to get through large amounts of text without fussing with the program. This changes renders FM about as useful for me as InDesign. Alan ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
Martinek, Carla wrote: [stuff deleted] === You will notice that the F8 and F9 shortcuts DO NOT work the same as previous versions. . . . . . To get to the c7 style, I'd have to press c seven times, or c once and the down arrow six times. I might as well use the mouse at that point. (If you find this intolerable, please let Adobe know. Now that the release is out, perhaps they can go back and address this problem and fix it in a patch release.) Maybe they will fix it in FM10, thus giving us a good reason to buy that release. . . ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
RE: FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
-Original Message- This is really really bad. So what you're saying is that it only responds to the first letter you press and if you press the second it then jumps to the style that starts with that, if there is one? Exactly. If you type t2 and press enter, the first style starting with a t will highlight, and then it switches to the first heading style that starts with the number 2, and enter will select the 2 style. Sorry, but I have never had any faith in Adobe's desire to listen. In general our requests for changes have gone unheard/ignored. We tried to tell them this during beta. According to the developers, FM9 is built on a whole new platform, and they were unable to duplicate exactly some of the features we've used for years. They finally listened when we told them that the para sort order was a big issue, and they provided the option to change it in the last beta build. Several of us said that the default setting for SymbolSortingBeforeAlphaNumeric in the maker.ini file should be ON, not OFF, but at least we CAN change it. I think that may well be a deal breaker for me - all the other good stuff aside. Please, file your comments with Adobe. Let them know that YOU find this a deal-breaker, and why. Now, all that said, a couple of the beta testers who write FrameScripts said they could probably come up with a script to solve this issue. I'd certainly pay for the script if they do. -Carla - CONFIDENTIAL- This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential, and may also be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not review, use, copy, or distribute this message. If you receive this email in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply email and then delete this email. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
On 22/01/2009, at 8:16 AM, Martinek, Carla wrote: Please, file your comments with Adobe. Let them know that YOU find this a deal-breaker, and why. Where? But as I said, whistling in the wind... Now, all that said, a couple of the beta testers who write FrameScripts said they could probably come up with a script to solve this issue. I'd certainly pay for the script if they do. That would mean buying the scripts, buying FrameScript to run them when this functionality should be a core part of the application. Just being an independent means I don't a lot of money to chuck at filling holes the developers have exposed simply because they wanted to add more 'features'. Gotta say, I am starting to look at other applications. Building a class file in LaTeX would be as time consuming, and in the end possible productive. Alan ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
OK. Can anyone confirm if the other commands are lost too? Such as the meta key commands? I can't install this new version onto my old computer. Alan ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
Re: FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
On my (pre-release/beta) 9 install, all the format shortcuts are working. Art Art Campbell art.campb...@gmail.com ... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl. -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Alan Litchfield a...@alphabyte.co.nzwrote: OK. Can anyone confirm if the other commands are lost too? Such as the meta key commands? I can't install this new version onto my old computer. Alan ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campb...@gmail.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. ___ You are currently subscribed to Framers as arch...@mail-archive.com. Send list messages to fram...@lists.frameusers.com. To unsubscribe send a blank email to framers-unsubscr...@lists.frameusers.com or visit http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/archive%40mail-archive.com Send administrative questions to listad...@frameusers.com. Visit http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info.
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
One issue that came up during beta testing was the paragraph sort order. Some of you may have noticed that it changed in one of the FM8 patches. Many of us created templates that had style names in a particular order so that we could make easy use of keyboard shortcuts. Prior to FM8p277, these two styles would sort in this order: 1_Heading1 1k_HeadingKit In FM8p277 and on, they sorted in this order (the underscore came at the *end* of the sort list, instead of at the beginning): 1k_HeadingKit 1_Heading1 In FM9, the catalog sort order can be controlled in two ways through a flag in maker.ini. The default behavior continues to what was introduced with 8.0 p277 onwards but the old behavior can be achieved by toggling this flag. This can be done by switching the setting using "SymbolSortingBeforeAlphaNumeric=On" in the maker.ini file. === You will notice that the F8 and F9 shortcuts DO NOT work the same as previous versions. If you press F8 or F9, and then a letter or number, you will go to the first style that starts with that character. In the following example, pressing "b" would take you to the b1_body style. However, previously I could press "b3" to select the b3_bullet1 style. Now you either have to press "b" three times, or press "b" and then the down arrow twice to get to the b3 style. b1_body1 b2_body2 b3_bullet1 b4_bullet2 c1_cellbody1 You may or may not find this inconvenient. In our case, this reduced functionality has basically rendered the keyboard shortcuts useless for many styles. To get to the c7 style, I'd have to press c seven times, or c once and the down arrow six times. I might as well use the mouse at that point. (If you find this intolerable, please let Adobe know. Now that the release is out, perhaps they can go back and address this problem and fix it in a patch release.) OTHERWISE, I find most of the improvements to be quite nice, and most Framers will be quite comfortable with the new features in a short time. -Carla - CONFIDENTIAL- This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential, and may also be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not review, use, copy, or distribute this message. If you receive this email in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply email and then delete this email.
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
Martinek, Carla wrote: [stuff deleted] > === > > You will notice that the F8 and F9 shortcuts DO NOT work the same as > previous versions. . . > . . . To get to the c7 style, I'd have to press c seven times, or > c once and the down arrow six times. I might as well use the mouse at > that point. (If you find this intolerable, please let Adobe know. Now > that the release is out, perhaps they can go back and address this > problem and fix it in a patch release.) Maybe they will fix it in FM10, thus giving us a good reason to buy that release. . .
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
-Original Message- > This is really really bad. So what you're saying is that > it only responds to the first letter you press and if you > press the second it then jumps to the style that starts > with that, if there is one? Exactly. If you type "t2" and press enter, the first style starting with a "t" will highlight, and then it switches to the first heading style that starts with the number 2, and enter will select the "2" style. > Sorry, but I have never had any faith in Adobe's desire to listen. > In general our requests for changes have gone unheard/ignored. We tried to tell them this during beta. According to the developers, FM9 is built on a whole new platform, and they were unable to duplicate exactly some of the features we've used for years. They finally listened when we told them that the para sort order was a big issue, and they provided the option to change it in the last beta build. Several of us said that the default setting for SymbolSortingBeforeAlphaNumeric in the maker.ini file should be ON, not OFF, but at least we CAN change it. > I think that may well be a deal breaker for me - all the other good stuff aside. Please, file your comments with Adobe. Let them know that YOU find this a deal-breaker, and why. Now, all that said, a couple of the beta testers who write FrameScripts said they could probably come up with a script to solve this issue. I'd certainly pay for the script if they do. -Carla - CONFIDENTIAL- This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential, and may also be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, you may not review, use, copy, or distribute this message. If you receive this email in error, please notify the sender immediately by reply email and then delete this email.
FM 9 - Sort Order for Paragraphs, F8/F9 keyboard shortcuts
On my (pre-release/beta) 9 install, all the format shortcuts are working. Art Art Campbell art.campbell at gmail.com "... In my opinion, there's nothing in this world beats a '52 Vincent and a redheaded girl." -- Richard Thompson No disclaimers apply. DoD 358 On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Alan Litchfield wrote: > OK. Can anyone confirm if the other commands are lost too? Such as the > meta key commands? > > I can't install this new version onto my old computer. > > Alan > ___ > > > You are currently subscribed to Framers as art.campbell at gmail.com. > > Send list messages to framers at lists.frameusers.com. > > To unsubscribe send a blank email to > framers-unsubscribe at lists.frameusers.com > or visit > http://lists.frameusers.com/mailman/options/framers/art.campbell%40gmail.com > > Send administrative questions to listadmin at frameusers.com. Visit > http://www.frameusers.com/ for more resources and info. >
