Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 04:46:52PM +0100, John Murphy wrote: Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? I remember seeing that error message somewhere, but do not remember where or if it was in FreeBSD. jerry Seem to recall it occurring when I deleted the directory I was 'in'. I may have imagined it though! -- John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Jerry McAllister wrote: On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 04:46:52PM +0100, John Murphy wrote: Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? I remember seeing that error message somewhere, but do not remember where or if it was in FreeBSD. It's a fortune. Whether it has also ever been an error message I cannot say, but not in 5.4 unless it's well hidden. Gee, Toto, I don't think we are in Kansas anymore. find /usr/src -type f -print0 | xargs -0 egrep -l Kansas --Alex ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Alex Zbyslaw wrote: Jerry McAllister wrote: On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 04:46:52PM +0100, John Murphy wrote: Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? I remember seeing that error message somewhere, but do not remember where or if it was in FreeBSD. It's a fortune. Whether it has also ever been an error message I cannot say, but not in 5.4 unless it's well hidden. Gee, Toto, I don't think we are in Kansas anymore. find /usr/src -type f -print0 | xargs -0 egrep -l Kansas Seems it was replaced in 2000 with unable to return to working directory. http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/usr.sbin/pkg_install/delete/perform.c.diff?r1=1.20;r2=1.21 -- John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Favourite worst written error message in history: Keyboard not found. Press F1 to continue. I have always loved this one!! Who made that up!? Someone at IBM. That's what the original IBM PC, PC-AT, and (presumably) PC-XT displayed if the keyboard was dead or not plugged in. It was probably a case of modular code: any problem in POST would display a message and return a fail status, and the generic code would append Press F1 to continue. and wait. Not a bad idea at all -- certainly better than blindly trying to boot the machine without giving the operator a chance to decide what to do about the problem -- but this particular combination does have a chicken- egg aspect :( ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] This still happened on my fairly recent ASUS p4s8x Pentium 4 motherboard. I think you could make almost any motherboard yield that error, even these days. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 08:14:44PM -0700, Garrett Cooper wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The entirety of Perl falls under the GPL and Artistic license at this time. Read the perl-porters archives for more debate on Perl licensing. More to the point, Perl is dual-licensed -- redistributable under the terms of either the GPL or the Artistic License, at your discretion. As such, I tend to think of my Perl installs as being Artistic License, not GPL. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] MacUser, Nov. 1990: There comes a time in the history of any project when it becomes necessary to shoot the engineers and begin production. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Anything you have actually seen is fair game. Ted -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of doug Sent: Wednesday, July 04, 2007 12:19 PM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! How far do we get to go back in time? From the first online fortran compiler: ugh1 and ugh2. In fairness these were conditions that were not supposed to happen, but somehow they always do. In more recent times I always liked, invalid page fault this perhaps as late as win98. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Wasn't there, once upon a time, an error message in FreeBSD which reported 'This doesn't look like Kansas, Toto'? Seem to recall it occurring when I deleted the directory I was 'in'. I may have imagined it though! -- John. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Chad Perrin Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:39 AM To: FreeBSD Questions Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 08:14:44PM -0700, Garrett Cooper wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The entirety of Perl falls under the GPL and Artistic license at this time. Read the perl-porters archives for more debate on Perl licensing. More to the point, Perl is dual-licensed -- redistributable under the terms of either the GPL or the Artistic License, at your discretion. Not correct. The Artistic license is less restrictive than the GPL so GPL advocates can take a Perl install and call it GPLd perl - but the Perl FAQ makes it very clear the intent of the Perl maintainers is not to use GPL. As they said, there is no GNU Perl I challenge you to point to one, single Perl scrap of code, that is ONLY gpled. As far as I know, anyone submitting patches or modifications to the Perl maintainers has been required to license their patches under Artistic for them to be included. Of course, if people put Perl extensions under GPL the Perl maintainers cannot help that. I do not think, however, that any extensions that are included with the default install are GPL-only. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, Jul 05, 2007 at 09:19:00AM -0700, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Chad Perrin Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:39 AM To: FreeBSD Questions Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! More to the point, Perl is dual-licensed -- redistributable under the terms of either the GPL or the Artistic License, at your discretion. Not correct. The Artistic license is less restrictive than the GPL so GPL advocates can take a Perl install and call it GPLd perl - but the Perl FAQ makes it very clear the intent of the Perl maintainers is not to use GPL. As they said, there is no GNU Perl I challenge you to point to one, single Perl scrap of code, that is ONLY gpled. Nothing I said should in any way be construed to mean that Perl, or any part of it, is in any way solely GPLed. I have no idea where you would have gotten such an impression. See above, where I point out that Perl is dual-licensed -- *not* solely GPLed. Also see the rest of what I said in the earlier email, in text you cut out of the quote, indicating that for my purposes Perl is installed under terms of the Perl Artistic License (and not the GPL). Nothing you have said suggests at all that my statement was incorrect, except the two words not correct. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Dr. Ron Paul: Liberty has meaning only if we still believe in it when terrible things happen and a false government security blanket beckons. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, 3 Jul 2007 22:05:50 -0600 Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 11:41:13PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Is it part of the default install without being part of the base system, then? I don't recall needing to install it after system install on this laptop (using FreeBSD 6.2-RELEASE). A huge number of ports and packages have it as a dependency. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Bill Campbell Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 9:36 AM To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, Martin McCormick wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms. While perl has a well deserved reputation for looking like modem noise, it's certainly no worse than shell scripts. Actually perl has a lot of problems too. One of the biggest is that perl script writers always seem to think like you, in that perl is consistent across all platforms. The biggest problems I've seen with perl scripts are when people use perl extensions that are not on the system. You then have to go find the extension they use and very few of the perl script writers seem to be smart enough to put a section at the beginning of their scripts that define the CPAN location of the particular extensions they are using. The second biggest problem is perl script writers using constructs that are valid in Perl 5.6 and later but not valid in Perl 5.0 I don't know how many times I've wanted to strangle someone when trying to run a perl script under Perl 5.0 that had ONE single friggin statement in the entire thousand line script that isn't valid under 5.0 but is under 5.6 And I've also run across a number of Perl extensions that won't run under 5.0 as well, even though the authors are supposed to regression test under 5.0 Pure /bin/sh is very limited in its constructs compared to other shells such as ksh, bash, etc. ksh is consistent across platfroms, of course, you generally have to compile it for the system your on. If you cannot work within a limited construct set your not much of a programmer. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 7:34 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. The second you put in gmake, gmake requires iconv, readline and all the other nasty libraries, and from that point on if you build something you never know if it's going to link in to one of those libraries. Lots of programs use configure and if they don't see the gnu libraries they will use the more traditional bsd ones, but if they see the gnu stuff they will silently use it. For example, one I see a lot is programs using gdbm if they see it, and if they don't they will use ndbm. This can cause major problems for commercial users. I'd love for someone to modify the gmake port to have a variable you can set that would build all the GNUified dependency libraries, build and install gmake and statically link in all it's GNUified libraries, then remove all the GNUified libraries. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Wed, Jul 04, 2007 at 12:26:01PM +0100, RW wrote: On Tue, 3 Jul 2007 22:05:50 -0600 Chad Perrin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 11:41:13PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Is it part of the default install without being part of the base system, then? I don't recall needing to install it after system install on this laptop (using FreeBSD 6.2-RELEASE). A huge number of ports and packages have it as a dependency. Yes, of course -- there's a great deal of Perl-based software on various unices that is written in Perl. I seem to recall having Perl available before I had most of my usual software installed on this system, however. In retrospect, though, I think something associated with Portupgrade uses Perl -- and I would have had that installed by the time I recall having Perl available -- so that's probably the culprit in this case. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] print substr(Just another Perl hacker, 0, -2); ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
How far do we get to go back in time? From the first online fortran compiler: ugh1 and ugh2. In fairness these were conditions that were not supposed to happen, but somehow they always do. In more recent times I always liked, invalid page fault this perhaps as late as win98. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) Unable to delete file: not enough free space available. Fatal error: the operation completed successfully -- Fuzzy love, -CyberLeo Technical Administrator CyberLeo.Net Webhosting http://www.CyberLeo.Net [EMAIL PROTECTED] Furry Peace! - http://www.fur.com/peace/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Wed, 4 Jul 2007, CyberLeo Kitsana wrote: Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) Unable to delete file: not enough free space available. Fatal error: the operation completed successfully -- IBM: keyboard no present, press F1 to continue. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Eduardo Viruena Silva wrote: On Wed, 4 Jul 2007, CyberLeo Kitsana wrote: Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) Unable to delete file: not enough free space available. Fatal error: the operation completed successfully -- IBM: keyboard no present, press F1 to continue. Perhaps this has been mentioned before from Unix, I don't know: Bad Magic Number -- Tim Daneliuk [EMAIL PROTECTED] PGP Key: http://www.tundraware.com/PGP/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The second you put in gmake, gmake requires iconv, readline and all the other nasty libraries, and from that point on if you build something you never know if it's going to link in to one of those libraries. ... This can cause major problems for commercial users. How? Last I heard, the *L*GPL only requires making the *library* source available (and that only if the library has been modified). It doesn't extend to the using application. I'd love for someone to modify the gmake port to have a variable you can set that would build all the GNUified dependency libraries, build and install gmake and statically link in all it's GNUified libraries, then remove all the GNUified libraries. Or, change all the gnu ports to install into something like /usr/local/gnu or /usr/local/gpl instead of straight into /usr/local. You'd still have the gnu libs when needed, but without having them included in normal search paths. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Except that bash requires all the icky GNU utilities to build so you have to GNUify your system. And perl doesn't? It was GPL last I knew. The entirety of Perl falls under the GPL and Artistic license at this time. Read the perl-porters archives for more debate on Perl licensing. The second you put in gmake, gmake requires iconv, readline and all the other nasty libraries, and from that point on if you build something you never know if it's going to link in to one of those libraries. ... This can cause major problems for commercial users. How? Last I heard, the *L*GPL only requires making the *library* source available (and that only if the library has been modified). It doesn't extend to the using application. I'd love for someone to modify the gmake port to have a variable you can set that would build all the GNUified dependency libraries, build and install gmake and statically link in all it's GNUified libraries, then remove all the GNUified libraries. Or, change all the gnu ports to install into something like /usr/local/gnu or /usr/local/gpl instead of straight into /usr/local. You'd still have the gnu libs when needed, but without having them included in normal search paths. That would seriously muck up a lot of people's assumptions on locations for programs, and would be incredibly necessary. Plus it would make searching for programs in $PATH a slight bit more time consuming (on the order of milliseconds I know, but those milliseconds are the exact reason why I have to manually profile pkg_install to determine bottlenecks). Also, please don't muck up email addresses. It's not cool, by any means. -Garrett ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Martin McCormick Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. Check engine - CEL It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. Most people take the tack that if the CEL comes on and the engine is still running and the car still goes, that they can let it slide. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Reminds me of a typical windows user i dealt with who saw an error about explorer.exe and how it could not be read and let it slide. :-P using my wicked non user friendly skillz of the damned, i personally like the concept of a simple pebkac error when bind refuses to start due to a named.conf setting or similar. sortof creates a challenge, an adventure to find what's causing the issue yourself. wait. i shouldn't be promoting ideas on how make things worse off on freebsd-questions. pardon this useless email. -ben Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Martin McCormick Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. Check engine - CEL It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. Most people take the tack that if the CEL comes on and the engine is still running and the car still goes, that they can let it slide. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Mon, Jul 02, 2007 at 03:11:56PM -0500, Martin McCormick wrote: #! /bin/sh a = 5 that's enough to make it happen. Run that, and you get: a: not found Interestingly enough, if you run that same script in a Debian Linux environment, you get: ./testfile: line 2: a: command not found This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~]$ uname -s Linux [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~]$ ls -l `which bash sh` -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 616248 Aug 13 2006 /bin/bash lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 4 Mar 25 20:36 /bin/sh - bash -- Paul Chvostek [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. Martin ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, 03 Jul 2007 08:44:14 -0500 Martin McCormick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's why there is a POSIX standard, and why many people think it's bad idea to get into the habit of using bash specific scripts. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
You could make it more zen-like, perhaps: You are out of tune with the Universe, grasshopper. Continue your studies And, if everything was correct it could issue: awakening has been attained, entering zazen Ted -Original Message- From: nawcom [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2007 2:24 AM To: Ted Mittelstaedt Cc: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! Reminds me of a typical windows user i dealt with who saw an error about explorer.exe and how it could not be read and let it slide. :-P using my wicked non user friendly skillz of the damned, i personally like the concept of a simple pebkac error when bind refuses to start due to a named.conf setting or similar. sortof creates a challenge, an adventure to find what's causing the issue yourself. wait. i shouldn't be promoting ideas on how make things worse off on freebsd-questions. pardon this useless email. -ben Ted Mittelstaedt wrote: -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Martin McCormick Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. Check engine - CEL It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. Most people take the tack that if the CEL comes on and the engine is still running and the car still goes, that they can let it slide. Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, Martin McCormick wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms. While perl has a well deserved reputation for looking like modem noise, it's certainly no worse than shell scripts. Pure /bin/sh is very limited in its constructs compared to other shells such as ksh, bash, etc. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC URL: http://www.celestial.com/ PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 Marijuana will be legal some day, because the many law students who now smoke pot will someday become congressmen and legalize it in order to protect themselves. -- Lenny Bruce ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, 2007-07-03 at 09:36 -0700, Bill Campbell wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, Martin McCormick wrote: Paul Chvostek writes: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash. You'll see the latter error if you type `a = 5` in bash in any OS. It just so happens that most Linux distributions don't have a real sh: I kind of thought that was the real issue. While something like this is maybe slightly annoying at times, the differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms. While perl has a well deserved reputation for looking like modem noise, it's certainly no worse than shell scripts. Pure /bin/sh is very limited in its constructs compared to other shells such as ksh, bash, etc. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC URL: http://www.celestial.com/ PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 Marijuana will be legal some day, because the many law students who now smoke pot will someday become congressmen and legalize it in order to protect themselves. -- Lenny Bruce sh should always be sh compatible on every platform (surprisingly). It may even be defined in one of the POSIX standards. This is why you write shell scripts in sh, even if you prefer csh, ksh or bash as your actual shell. Tom signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 07:34:20PM -0700, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Amazon.com interview candidate: When C++ is your hammer, everything starts to look like your thumb. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 11:41:13PM -0400, Robert Huff wrote: Chad Perrin writes: Isn't Perl part of the base system these days? Perl has not been part of the base system for several years and was deprecated for some time before that. Is it part of the default install without being part of the base system, then? I don't recall needing to install it after system install on this laptop (using FreeBSD 6.2-RELEASE). -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Baltasar Gracian: A wise man gets more from his enemies than a fool from his friends. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) One of the reasons I started using perl almost 20 years ago was that it was cleaner and more consistent than tying a bunch of utilities together with the shell (not to mention only having to master one type of regular expressions :-). I now use python for the vast majority of my development work instead of perl as I find it much cleaner with better object oriented features. When I write shell scripts, I use a very limited set of features which are /bin/sh compatible. As soon as I start having to do anything much more than run a program against a list of files, I switch to python. Bill -- INTERNET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bill Campbell; Celestial Software LLC URL: http://www.celestial.com/ PO Box 820; 6641 E. Mercer Way FAX:(206) 232-9186 Mercer Island, WA 98040-0820; (206) 236-1676 ``Intellectually, teachers fall between education theorists and bright cocker spaniels. (Probably closer to the education theorists. The AKC has been doing wonders with spaniels.) If you think I'm kidding look at the GREs for education majors, whose scores are the lowest of all fields, and remember that these are the smart ones.'' -- http://www.FredOnEverything.net ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Tue, Jul 03, 2007 at 09:29:03PM -0700, Bill Campbell wrote: On Tue, Jul 03, 2007, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is actually just the difference between sh and bash ... differences in, say, arithmetic handling and loops can sometimes mean rewriting parts of shell scripts depending on whether it is going to run in BSD or Linux. That's a major argument for doing things in python or perl as they are consistent across all platforms ... If one is going to require the installation of something that may not be part of a base system, that something might as well be bash :) One of the reasons I started using perl almost 20 years ago was that it was cleaner and more consistent than tying a bunch of utilities together with the shell (not to mention only having to master one type of regular expressions :-). I now use python for the vast majority of my development work instead of perl as I find it much cleaner with better object oriented features. I'm of a similar mind, except that for OOP stuff I prefer Ruby, and for non-OOP stuff I still generally use Perl. Python doesn't really whet my whistle, so to speak. When I write shell scripts, I use a very limited set of features which are /bin/sh compatible. As soon as I start having to do anything much more than run a program against a list of files, I switch to python. $language =~ s/python/Perl/ Otherwise, ditto what you said. Much like PHP, I find that shell languages as scripting syntaxes don't really scale well in terms of maintainability. YMMV, of course. -- CCD CopyWrite Chad Perrin [ http://ccd.apotheon.org ] Baltasar Gracian: A wise man gets more from his enemies than a fool from his friends. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Jeffrey Goldberg writes: I still remember as a newcomer to Unix a long long time ago getting Bad magic number In retrospect, I suspect that I'd typed ld where I'd meant to type ls. I have been doing things on Unix systems since about 1990 and the thing I run across that makes me ready to split a brick with my bare hands to this very day is the not found message one can get in a badly written shell script such as the following: #! /bin/sh a = 5 that's enough to make it happen. Run that, and you get: a: not found Interestingly enough, if you run that same script in a Debian Linux environment, you get: ./testfile: line 2: a: command not found Most of you will probably instantly see what I did wrong in that there shouldn't be any spaces between the variable name, the = sign and the 5 which could be anything else. I just picked a 5 for the heck of it. If you are in a big messy shell script, just seeing a: not found Doesn't tell me much except I know it's not working. The problem could be either that there is a typo or it could be that $a is null. I usually find that I snuck a space in and didn't even think about it at the time. I don't know if error messages from other OS's are off limits, but some of the ones from the most widely-used OS on Earth are treasures. How about running a gigantic piece of commercial software that does God knows what on your computer, and getting an error like: The software has performed an illegal operation. I bet there is a second line that they had to print in text using the same forground and background color so as to keep from getting fired that reads: Now, try and find it. Ha ha ha ha! Then, there is the ultimate, the Check engine. light on the modern car. It would be so nice if it said some indication as to the seriousness of the problem so that one knows whether to get it fixed now and maybe save $5,000 worth of repair costs or let it slide a few days until a better time. I like the quotation I read once that said that Unix is a user-friendly operating system. It is just particular about who it makes friends with. Martin McCormick WB5AGZ Stillwater, OK Systems Engineer OSU Information Technology Department Network Operations Group ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thursday 31 May 2007, Tom Wilson wrote: I always liked one of the messages from an old version of the VMS (4 or 5?) C compiler(may not be exactly it, but this was included): Bad Code Or the Level I BASIC error messages on a TRS-80. What? How? Sorry? And that's all folks. The entire repertoire of error reporting on Level I Basic :-) Of course, fitting a BASIC interpretor and OS into only 4K of ROM was quite an achievement in itself. I doubt there were many spare bytes for more informative error reports. -- Dave ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
At 14:38 31/05/2007, Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits And the Need 0KB more memory to manage memory from MacOS system7? A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Jun 5, 2007, at 4:39 PM, Eduardo Morras wrote: At 14:38 31/05/2007, Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits And the Need 0KB more memory to manage memory from MacOS system7? I still remember as a newcomer to Unix a long long time ago getting Bad magic number In retrospect, I suspect that I'd typed ld where I'd meant to type ls. -j -- Jeffrey Goldberghttp://www.goldmark.org/jeff/ ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Robert Huff Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2007 5:39 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9! =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: IBM PS/2 POST messages were definitely the worst. Any error would simply issue a numeric code - no text whatsoever. You were to look the numeric code up in some manual or other. That was fine if the code came from a system on the motherboard. It was not fine if the code came from a non-IBM peripheral card since there was no master listing of 3rd party codes back in the old days. Here's a sample list: http://bioscentral.com/misc/ibmdiag.htm Ted ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) bye av. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, May 31, 2007 at 02:53:44PM +0200, Andrea Venturoli wrote: Robert Huff wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits Well, there's always Windows' Insufficient Memory, which usually means anything but memory being full :-) To continue with the tortured construction ... Favourite worst written error message in history: Keyboard not found. Press F1 to continue. Or how about favourite most useless man page entry: The notion of errors is ill defined. Come to think of it, that last one is almost poetic, isn't it? In a Zen sort of way. Anyone recall which manpage it's from? -- George Still working on figuring what PC Load Letter means ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, 31 May 2007 08:38:41 -0400 Robert Huff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Kyrre_Nyg=E5rd?= writes: It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits That's not entirely fair. IIRC that was originally intended only for developer use, but after CBM got their hands on the Amiga, they cut corners and it just got left in The UNIX Hater's Handbook quotes a surreal message from sendmail: Deferred: Not a typewriter ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On 5/31/07, George [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or how about favourite most useless man page entry: The notion of errors is ill defined. Come to think of it, that last one is almost poetic, isn't it? In a Zen sort of way. Anyone recall which manpage it's from? grep says netstat(1). In the Bugs section, which seems like a good place for that information. - Bob ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits That's not entirely fair. IIRC that was originally intended only for developer use, but after CBM got their hands on the Amiga, they cut corners and it just got left in Some of the old I.B.M. abend messages were also ... intersting. Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On 5/31/07, Bob Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 5/31/07, George [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or how about favourite most useless man page entry: The notion of errors is ill defined. Come to think of it, that last one is almost poetic, isn't it? In a Zen sort of way. Anyone recall which manpage it's from? grep says netstat(1). In the Bugs section, which seems like a good place for that information. - Bob ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, 31 May 2007 06:56:51 -0700 George [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Favourite worst written error message in history: Keyboard not found. Press F1 to continue. I have always loved this one!! Who made that up!? Rico ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
It has to be the worst written error message in history. Not even close. I commend to you the Amiga's BSOD: Software Guru Meditation Number very long string of hex digits That's not entirely fair. IIRC that was originally intended only for developer use, but after CBM got their hands on the Amiga, they cut corners and it just got left in Some of the old I.B.M. abend messages were also ... intersting. I always liked one of the messages from an old version of the VMS (4 or 5?) C compiler(may not be exactly it, but this was included): Bad Code -Tom Wilson Robert Huff ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
On Thu, 31 May 2007 12:02:26 -0400 Bob Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 5/31/07, George [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or how about favourite most useless man page entry: The notion of errors is ill defined. Come to think of it, that last one is almost poetic, isn't it? In a Zen sort of way. Anyone recall which manpage it's from? grep says netstat(1). In the Bugs section, which seems like a good place for that information. - Bob Not actually one of the worst error messages, per se, but one I found most amusing the first time I saw it: Running procmail's mailstat program without any arguments yields the following: Most people don't type their own logfiles; but, what do I care? :-) -- Conrad J. Sabatier [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT: Re: The worst error message in history belongs to... BIND9!
Favourite worst written error message in history: Keyboard not found. Press F1 to continue. I have always loved this one!! Who made that up!? Someone at IBM. That's what the original IBM PC, PC-AT, and (presumably) PC-XT displayed if the keyboard was dead or not plugged in. It was probably a case of modular code: any problem in POST would display a message and return a fail status, and the generic code would append Press F1 to continue. and wait. Not a bad idea at all -- certainly better than blindly trying to boot the machine without giving the operator a chance to decide what to do about the problem -- but this particular combination does have a chicken- egg aspect :( ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
