Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/17/2009 4:01 PM, Steve Polyack wrote: On 12/16/09 12:53, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote: I run multiple FreeBSD servers inside VMWare and I don't have this problem. Are you running VMWare workstation? Or ESX/ESXi? I am running VMware Server 2.0...thanks again. I would really recommend switching to VMware ESXi if at all possible. I have a lot of FreeBSD VMs running under ESXi 3.5 and 4.0 that work just great with kern.hz=100 and openntpd. I loaded ESXi and a FreeBSD 8.0 guest last night and this morning it is still keeping time OK without any changes to loader.conf. We actually kept everything running on Linux+VMware Server 1.0 until we could make the switch to ESXi; the VMware Server 2.0 product wasn't reliable for us at all and was a total pain to manage. I am using vSphere to manage, but I see even the standard version requires licensing in the amount of $795. Is there a free management software, or better yet, a way to manage via Linux? That's definitely something I like about VMware Server, that I can manage via a browser. I have not had any major problems with VMware Server 2.0 all running on CentOS 5.x hosts. --Robert ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/21/09 09:49, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote: On 12/17/2009 4:01 PM, Steve Polyack wrote: On 12/16/09 12:53, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote: I run multiple FreeBSD servers inside VMWare and I don't have this problem. Are you running VMWare workstation? Or ESX/ESXi? I am running VMware Server 2.0...thanks again. I would really recommend switching to VMware ESXi if at all possible. I have a lot of FreeBSD VMs running under ESXi 3.5 and 4.0 that work just great with kern.hz=100 and openntpd. I loaded ESXi and a FreeBSD 8.0 guest last night and this morning it is still keeping time OK without any changes to loader.conf. I'm trying to test this out now without openntpd, but with kern.hz=100 still set. You will definitely want kern.hz=100 or something lower than the default of 1000, otherwise your guests will use up a decent portion of your hosts CPU time, even when idle. Try it and see the difference. We actually kept everything running on Linux+VMware Server 1.0 until we could make the switch to ESXi; the VMware Server 2.0 product wasn't reliable for us at all and was a total pain to manage. I am using vSphere to manage, but I see even the standard version requires licensing in the amount of $795. Is there a free management software, or better yet, a way to manage via Linux? That's definitely something I like about VMware Server, that I can manage via a browser. I have not had any major problems with VMware Server 2.0 all running on CentOS 5.x hosts. ESXi can be managed by the VI (Virtual Infrastructure) Client, which I believe is windows-only, vSphere, or even the Remote-CLI and the barebones service console that can be unlocked. There is no browser management interface. Performance, however, is much better than VMware Server 1.0 and 2.0. -Steve Polyack ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/18/09 12:39, Chuck Swiger wrote: Hi-- On Dec 18, 2009, at 9:24 AM, Steve Polyack wrote: I haven't used Xen, but for ESX: I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the vmtools available for FreeBSD do not support synchronizing the host time to the guest OS. I know it is supported (and works) for Linux, but by what mechanism I do not know. On OpenBSD the kernel can be built to present a device which will use the synchronize time with guest feature of VMware to provide a clock source which can be specified in ntpd.conf. Perhaps you're right and all it takes is the switch in ESX. I've disabled ntpd on one of my VMs and I'll see if it drifts any by tomorrow. FYI the system has started to drift on the order of 100ms every 6 hours. OK. This leads me to believe that the synchronize time with guest feature of ESXi is not sufficient in FreeBSD with VMware tools. While using NTP, the system would reliably keep in sync within 30ms of local NTP relays. You supposedly need to re-run it periodically or enable an internal in some .vmx config file; see Enabling Periodic Synchronization: http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vmware_timekeeping.pdf Even with the following set in the virtual machine's .vmx configuration file, the clock still drifts without ntpd: tools.syncTime = TRUE $ ntpdate -q pool.ntp.org server 209.114.111.1, stratum 2, offset -2.093494, delay 0.10614 server 66.250.45.2, stratum 2, offset -2.082546, delay 0.04468 server 169.229.70.201, stratum 3, offset -2.092357, delay 0.11055 21 Dec 11:29:06 ntpdate[12781]: step time server 66.250.45.2 offset -2.082546 sec The vmware_timekeeping.pdf document also states that By default, the daemon checks the guest operating system clock only once per minute., meaning that we shouldn't have to adjust any of the other options to maintain synchornization. If this doesn't work in FreeBSD guest VMs, has anyone filed a bug report with them? I have not filed a bug report. I'm using open-vm-tools and have not tried the VMware-provided tools yet. I'll give them a shot if I get a chance and I'll see if will actively sync the time by itself. Can anyone else chime in on whether or not the tools.syncTime option and setting kern.hz=100 have been sufficient in keeping the time in sync with a FreeBSD guest? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/21/2009 10:22 AM, Steve Polyack wrote: I loaded ESXi and a FreeBSD 8.0 guest last night and this morning it is still keeping time OK without any changes to loader.conf. I'm trying to test this out now without openntpd, but with kern.hz=100 still set. You will definitely want kern.hz=100 or something lower than the default of 1000, otherwise your guests will use up a decent portion of your hosts CPU time, even when idle. Try it and see the difference. Yes, I see the difference using 100, thanks. I guess we're not able to install vmware-tools for 8.0 since the install does not find a FreeBSD8.0 kernel module? Not that I used them much on VMware Server, I was curious if they work any better on ESXi for FreeBSD8.0. Had to make changes to the script used to restart before and it didn't show IP, etc. I assume this hasn't changed though? --Robert ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/17/09 16:40, Steve Polyack wrote: On 12/17/09 16:23, Chuck Swiger wrote: The kern.hz=100 recommendation I can certainly agree with, but there is mostly no point in running ntpd or variants anywhere except on the host machine (host ESX for VMware, or Dom0 for Xen). For VMware, the vmtools stuff should provide a mechanism to sync time in VMs to the host clock. I haven't used Xen, but for ESX: I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the vmtools available for FreeBSD do not support synchronizing the host time to the guest OS. I know it is supported (and works) for Linux, but by what mechanism I do not know. On OpenBSD the kernel can be built to present a device which will use the synchronize time with guest feature of VMware to provide a clock source which can be specified in ntpd.conf. Perhaps you're right and all it takes is the switch in ESX. I've disabled ntpd on one of my VMs and I'll see if it drifts any by tomorrow. FYI the system has started to drift on the order of 100ms every 6 hours. This leads me to believe that the synchronize time with guest feature of ESXi is not sufficient in FreeBSD with VMware tools. While using NTP, the system would reliably keep in sync within 30ms of local NTP relays. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
Hi-- On Dec 18, 2009, at 9:24 AM, Steve Polyack wrote: I haven't used Xen, but for ESX: I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the vmtools available for FreeBSD do not support synchronizing the host time to the guest OS. I know it is supported (and works) for Linux, but by what mechanism I do not know. On OpenBSD the kernel can be built to present a device which will use the synchronize time with guest feature of VMware to provide a clock source which can be specified in ntpd.conf. Perhaps you're right and all it takes is the switch in ESX. I've disabled ntpd on one of my VMs and I'll see if it drifts any by tomorrow. FYI the system has started to drift on the order of 100ms every 6 hours. OK. This leads me to believe that the synchronize time with guest feature of ESXi is not sufficient in FreeBSD with VMware tools. While using NTP, the system would reliably keep in sync within 30ms of local NTP relays. You supposedly need to re-run it periodically or enable an internal in some .vmx config file; see Enabling Periodic Synchronization: http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vmware_timekeeping.pdf If this doesn't work in FreeBSD guest VMs, has anyone filed a bug report with them? Regards, -- -Chuck ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/16/09 12:53, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote: I run multiple FreeBSD servers inside VMWare and I don't have this problem. Are you running VMWare workstation? Or ESX/ESXi? I am running VMware Server 2.0...thanks again. I would really recommend switching to VMware ESXi if at all possible. I have a lot of FreeBSD VMs running under ESXi 3.5 and 4.0 that work just great with kern.hz=100 and openntpd. We actually kept everything running on Linux+VMware Server 1.0 until we could make the switch to ESXi; the VMware Server 2.0 product wasn't reliable for us at all and was a total pain to manage. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
Hi-- On Dec 17, 2009, at 1:01 PM, Steve Polyack wrote: I would really recommend switching to VMware ESXi if at all possible. I have a lot of FreeBSD VMs running under ESXi 3.5 and 4.0 that work just great with kern.hz=100 and openntpd. The kern.hz=100 recommendation I can certainly agree with, but there is mostly no point in running ntpd or variants anywhere except on the host machine (host ESX for VMware, or Dom0 for Xen). For VMware, the vmtools stuff should provide a mechanism to sync time in VMs to the host clock. Regards, -- -Chuck PS: Same thing for Xen, recently discussed on the NTP pool timekeepers list: Begin forwarded message: From: Chuck Swiger cswi...@mac.com Date: October 14, 2009 2:43:08 PM PDT To: PGNet Dev pgnet.dev+...@gmail.com Cc: timekeep...@fortytwo.ch Subject: Re: [time] what significance does the number 3.906 have in ntp? On Oct 14, 2009, at 2:10 PM, PGNet Dev wrote: Right, OK-- from your earlier mail, you mentioned something about running with Xen Dom0/DomU. There is absolutely no point to running ntpd in a guest domain-- you should only try to run ntpd in a normal OS, or, as a last resort, in the Dom0 domain. actually, that's not at all the recommendation I've repeatedly been getting from numerous sources. Which are? A google of ntpd DomU returns numerous reports of problems with this, and the strong recommendation is to only run ntpd in Dom0 using independent_wallclock set to 0, *unless* your DomU's then fail to keep sane time. For example: http://www.nabble.com/Unable-to-set-system-clock-on-domU-td22042252.html The other domains can and should simply use the HW clock, because latencies and such for the guest domains are highly unpredictable. which is why the recommendation is to sync EVERY Dom0/DomU against an accurate clock via ntpd ... Why, when ntpd in a DomU *can't* actually change the HW clock? See: http://xen.epiuse.com/xen-faq.txt Q: Where does a domain get its time from? A: Briefly, Xen reads the RTC at start of day and by default will track that with the precision of the periodic timer crystal. Xen's estimate of the wall-clock time can only be updated by domain 0. If domain 0 runs ntpdate, ntpd, etc. then the synchronised time will automatically be pushed down to Xen every minute (and written to the RTC every 11 minutes, just as normal x86 Linux does). All other domains always track Xen's wall-clock time: setting the date, or running ntpd, on these domains will not affect their wall-clock time. Note that the wall-clock time exported by Xen is UTC --- all domains must have appropriate timezone handling (i.e. a correct /etc/localtime file). Seriously, each physical machine only has one RTC and crystal oscillator. It's useful to run one instance of ntpd in the Dom0 context where it can actually work and keep this real hardware clock in sync. Running ntpd's in the other DomUs is almost entirely pointless; it might be useful only if Dom0-DomU time is busted, and even in that case, ntpd is unlikely to ever obtain good time synchronization running in a DomU. You are better off running ntpdate (or sntp) periodically via cron in the DomUs. Regards, -- -Chuck ___ timekeepers mailing list timekeep...@fortytwo.ch https://fortytwo.ch/mailman/cgi-bin/listinfo/timekeepers ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/17/09 16:23, Chuck Swiger wrote: The kern.hz=100 recommendation I can certainly agree with, but there is mostly no point in running ntpd or variants anywhere except on the host machine (host ESX for VMware, or Dom0 for Xen). For VMware, the vmtools stuff should provide a mechanism to sync time in VMs to the host clock. I haven't used Xen, but for ESX: I may be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that the vmtools available for FreeBSD do not support synchronizing the host time to the guest OS. I know it is supported (and works) for Linux, but by what mechanism I do not know. On OpenBSD the kernel can be built to present a device which will use the synchronize time with guest feature of VMware to provide a clock source which can be specified in ntpd.conf. Perhaps you're right and all it takes is the switch in ESX. I've disabled ntpd on one of my VMs and I'll see if it drifts any by tomorrow. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/15/2009 9:38 AM, Jacques Manukyan wrote: On Sat, 12 Dec 2009 12:06:18 -0500, Robert Fitzpatrick rob...@webtent.com wrote: I found posts about this and a possible solution is to disable APIC by adding hint.apic.0.disabled=1 to /boot/loader.conf. But after doing so, it booted to the mountroot prompt and would not recognize my ufs:/dev/da0s1a partition when tried. I went to FixIt and removed the line from the loader.conf file and it boots fine. I do have some other things to help the pgsql db on this server in the loader.conf file, are they interfering? pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 Try putting: kern.hz=50 in your /boot/loader.conf Thanks, that worked. I removed the hint.apic.0.disabled line and put the kern.hz line back in except this time with 50 instead of 100 and it boots and seems to be keeping time now fine. Since I am a programmer and not a system admin, not sure what this does and would like to know, what is the kern.hz telling FreeBSD? I run multiple FreeBSD servers inside VMWare and I don't have this problem. Are you running VMWare workstation? Or ESX/ESXi? I am running VMware Server 2.0...thanks again. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
I found posts about this and a possible solution is to disable APIC by adding hint.apic.0.disabled=1 to /boot/loader.conf. But after doing so, it booted to the mountroot prompt and would not recognize my ufs:/dev/da0s1a partition when tried. I went to FixIt and removed the line from the loader.conf file and it boots fine. I do have some other things to help the pgsql db on this server in the loader.conf file, are they interfering? pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 The only way I'm able to keep the clock up to date is to sync with an Internet time server regularly. Anyone have an idea how fix this issue? ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On Sat 2009-12-12 12:06:18 UTC-0500, Robert Fitzpatrick (rob...@webtent.com) wrote: pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 According to the loader.conf man page these should all be in the format: kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 I don't know if this matters. I'm not sure hint.apic.0.disabled is valid for 7.2. sysctl -a doesn't list this variable on my machine. Maybe it's only available on some machines. The only way I'm able to keep the clock up to date is to sync with an Internet time server regularly. Anyone have an idea how fix this issue? Can you use ntpd? Regards Andrew ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/12/2009 12:30 PM, Maxim Khitrov wrote: On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Robert Fitzpatrickrob...@webtent.com wrote: I found posts about this and a possible solution is to disable APIC by adding hint.apic.0.disabled=1 to /boot/loader.conf. But after doing so, it booted to the mountroot prompt and would not recognize my ufs:/dev/da0s1a partition when tried. I went to FixIt and removed the line from the loader.conf file and it boots fine. I do have some other things to help the pgsql db on this server in the loader.conf file, are they interfering? pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 Add kern.hz=100 to loader.conf. - Max Thanks for the suggestion, but i added to the loader.conf file, but the kernel would not even load then, let alone getting to any prompt including mountroot :( ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On 12/12/2009 12:59 PM, andrew clarke wrote: On Sat 2009-12-12 12:06:18 UTC-0500, Robert Fitzpatrick (rob...@webtent.com) wrote: pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 According to the loader.conf man page these should all be in the format: kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 I don't know if this matters. I'm not sure hint.apic.0.disabled is valid for 7.2. sysctl -a doesn't list this variable on my machine. Maybe it's only available on some machines. The only way I'm able to keep the clock up to date is to sync with an Internet time server regularly. Anyone have an idea how fix this issue? Can you use ntpd? Regards Andrew I'm pulling from a time server now every hour, keeps it from getting behind too much. Perhaps that is what I'll end up doing, loading the ntp server, I guess that would keep it up to date better? Thanks. ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 1:18 PM, Robert Fitzpatrick li...@webtent.net wrote: On 12/12/2009 12:30 PM, Maxim Khitrov wrote: On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Robert Fitzpatrickrob...@webtent.com wrote: I found posts about this and a possible solution is to disable APIC by adding hint.apic.0.disabled=1 to /boot/loader.conf. But after doing so, it booted to the mountroot prompt and would not recognize my ufs:/dev/da0s1a partition when tried. I went to FixIt and removed the line from the loader.conf file and it boots fine. I do have some other things to help the pgsql db on this server in the loader.conf file, are they interfering? pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 Add kern.hz=100 to loader.conf. - Max Thanks for the suggestion, but i added to the loader.conf file, but the kernel would not even load then, let alone getting to any prompt including mountroot :( I've never encountered that problem. I have two VMWare servers running 7.2, and this is the only way to get semi-accurate time keeping. You still have to run ntpd to keep the clock from drifting. Maybe remove the other settings from loader.conf and try again with just this one line? If the kernel still doesn't load, what messages do you see on the screen? - Max ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
Re: slow clock on FreeBSD 7.2 on vmware
Robert Fitzpatrick li...@webtent.net writes: On 12/12/2009 12:59 PM, andrew clarke wrote: On Sat 2009-12-12 12:06:18 UTC-0500, Robert Fitzpatrick (rob...@webtent.com) wrote: pgsql# cat /boot/loader.conf kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 According to the loader.conf man page these should all be in the format: kern.ipc.semmni=32 kern.ipc.semmns=512 hint.apic.0.disabled=1 I don't know if this matters. I'm not sure hint.apic.0.disabled is valid for 7.2. sysctl -a doesn't list this variable on my machine. Maybe it's only available on some machines. The only way I'm able to keep the clock up to date is to sync with an Internet time server regularly. Anyone have an idea how fix this issue? Can you use ntpd? Regards Andrew I'm pulling from a time server now every hour, keeps it from getting behind too much. Perhaps that is what I'll end up doing, loading the ntp server, I guess that would keep it up to date better? Thanks. If it is consistently off by a certain amount, then you might want to look into /usr/sbin/ntptime to set a frequency offset. If it works, then you can put it into somewhere like /etc/rc.local. -- Carl Johnsonca...@peak.org ___ freebsd-questions@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-questions To unsubscribe, send any mail to freebsd-questions-unsubscr...@freebsd.org
