Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Neil Bothwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Thu, 20 Dec 2007 08:46:12 -0600, Marzan, Richard non Unisys wrote: Portage can continue to build packages if one fails. # emerge -options package/list_of_packages || until emerge -same_options_as_before package/list_of_packages ; do : ;done Yes it can, but not with this, which will repeatedly try to build the same package until entropy stops it. You need emerge -opts pkglist || untill emerge --resume --skipfirst; do : ; done but this is a kludge as you will be eying to build packages when their dependencies failed. I would hope the paludis option is more intelligent. Indeed it is. :) From the man page: --continue-on-failure Whether to continue after a fetch or install error if-fetch-only If fetching only (default) never Never if-satisfied If remaining packages' dependencies are satisfied if-independent If independent of failed and skipped packages always Always (UNSAFE) János Zsitvai -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
-Original Message- From: Zsitvai János [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, December 21, 2007 3:47 AM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview Neil Bothwick [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Thu, 20 Dec 2007 08:46:12 -0600, Marzan, Richard non Unisys wrote: Portage can continue to build packages if one fails. # emerge -options package/list_of_packages || until emerge -same_options_as_before package/list_of_packages ; do : ;done Yes it can, but not with this, which will repeatedly try to build the same package until entropy stops it. You need emerge -opts pkglist || untill emerge --resume --skipfirst; do : ; done but this is a kludge as you will be eying to build packages when their dependencies failed. I would hope the paludis option is more intelligent. Indeed it is. :) From the man page: --continue-on-failure Whether to continue after a fetch or install error if-fetch-only If fetching only (default) never Never if-satisfied If remaining packages' dependencies are satisfied if-independent If independent of failed and skipped packages always Always (UNSAFE) János Zsitvai -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list I'm definitely willing to switch and will most likely do so during the holiday week. Paludis seems to be a favorite amongst experienced users. Which begs the question; Why not redirect all efforts to building a stable, full-featured Paludis as soon as possible and purge portage? One option that I would like is for the build to be done completely in ram until it's compiled and ready to be placed on disk. HDD I/O is the slowest part of the system avoiding it as much as possible on systems with plenty of ram is a good idea. Regards, Richard -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Fri, 21 Dec 2007 10:54:44 -0600, Marzan, Richard non Unisys wrote: One option that I would like is for the build to be done completely in ram until it's compiled and ready to be placed on disk. HDD I/O is the slowest part of the system avoiding it as much as possible on systems with plenty of ram is a good idea. Mount $PORTAGE_TMPDIR on tmpfs. It will use physical and swap memory, so even OOo emerges will work providing you have a large enough swap partition. -- Neil Bothwick Daddy, what does formatting drive 'C' mean? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Thu, 20 Dec 2007 11:08:13 +0200, Rumen Yotov wrote: Regarding claws-mail there's a script to rebuild it's plugins - see elogs. Since i first tried paludis-0.2.1, may still have some old use info (laziness) about paludis USE-flag (IIRC revdep-rebuild portage-utils, etc.had it). flagedit will warn you if you have any unsupported USE flags set. That and eix-test-obsolete are useful for keeping make.conf and /etc/portage clear of cruft. -- Neil Bothwick Captain, I sense millions of minds focused on my cleavage. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Here is an excellent interview with Ciaran McCreesh about Paludis: http://lab.obsethryl.eu/content/paludis-gentoo-and-ciaran-mccreesh-uncensored Has anyone here switched from Portage to Paludis? Yes, and very satisfied. Even with the earlier versions. ralf -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Thursday 20 December 2007 10:08:13 Rumen Yotov wrote: Watch out for some scripts (perl-cleaner, claw-mail, etc.) in which the use of portage/emerge is embedded. Put 'paludis' as USE-flag. Unless you use a crappy, unsupported overlay no such use flag exists. [...] Regarding claws-mail there's a script to rebuild it's plugins - see elogs. Ok. Since i first tried paludis-0.2.1, may still have some old use info (laziness) about paludis USE-flag (IIRC revdep-rebuild portage-utils, etc.had it). [...] There's also a paludis-extras overlay, which is rather separated from official paludis but have some nice things (and problems sometimes ;-). That was actually the 'crappy, unsupported overlay' I was referring to. That also is where the packages with a paludis use flag came from. -- Bo Andresen signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Thursday 20 December 2007 09:43:20 Neil Bothwick wrote: flagedit will warn you if you have any unsupported USE flags set. That and eix-test-obsolete are useful for keeping make.conf and /etc/portage clear of cruft. And the config-decruft ruby script that can be used with Paludis can do the same (and more) in a much more verbose manner. :) -- Bo Andresen signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
RE: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Portage can continue to build packages if one fails. # emerge -options package/list_of_packages || until emerge -same_options_as_before package/list_of_packages ; do : ;done All with a little help from bash, of course. I think Andressen taught me this trick. It makes no sense to leave your box on overnight only to find that it quit emerge 10 minutes into your sleep because of one package failure to install/build. Unisys | 370 Jay St. Storage Room 66 | Brooklyn, NY 11201 |NYCT: (718) 243-5086 Personal Cell Phone #: (646) 724-5776 -Original Message- From: Iain Buchanan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, December 19, 2007 8:46 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview On Wed, 2007-12-19 at 22:42 +0100, Zsitvai János wrote: And the recent addition of the option '--continue-on-failure' won me over all over again. :) I've been wondering for a long time why portage doesn't continue with building other packages when one fails - so long as deps are met why stop? Acutally, while I'm on the subject of features - here's another one I'd like to see: parallel merges instead of parallel makes. Since many packages have problems with MAKEOPTS, it doesn't help with configure scripts anyway and other parts of the process, why not spawn 2 or 3 emerges automatically? Each one could do it's own tree of packages and dependencies that don't affect the other... would be nice IMHO. cya, -- Iain Buchanan iaindb at netspace dot net dot au People think love is an emotion. Love is good sense. -- Ken Kesey -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Thu, 20 Dec 2007 08:46:12 -0600, Marzan, Richard non Unisys wrote: Portage can continue to build packages if one fails. # emerge -options package/list_of_packages || until emerge -same_options_as_before package/list_of_packages ; do : ;done Yes it can, but not with this, which will repeatedly try to build the same package until entropy stops it. You need emerge -opts pkglist || untill emerge --resume --skipfirst; do : ; done but this is a kludge as you will be eying to build packages when their dependencies failed. I would hope the paludis option is more intelligent. -- Neil Bothwick When you are out of whack, the best thing to do is to order more whack. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
RE: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Thu, 2007-12-20 at 08:46 -0600, Marzan, Richard non Unisys wrote: Portage can continue to build packages if one fails. # emerge -options package/list_of_packages || until emerge -same_options_as_before package/list_of_packages ; do : ;done yes but wouldn't this continue regardless of what deps are met? Ideally if a lib fails, you only want to continue with packages that don't require that lib. Otherwise you have to fix it, and rebuild other packages anyway... -- Iain Buchanan iaindb at netspace dot net dot au Comedy, like Medicine, was never meant to be practiced by the general public. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Hi, On (19/12/07 08:43) Grant wrote: Here is an excellent interview with Ciaran McCreesh about Paludis: http://lab.obsethryl.eu/content/paludis-gentoo-and-ciaran-mccreesh-uncensored Thanks for the link. Has anyone here switched from Portage to Paludis? Yes, for some 4-5 months and plan to stay with it. - Grant -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list Rumen pgpzVIORGHxCw.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Wednesday 19 December 2007 17:43:41 Grant wrote: Has anyone here switched from Portage to Paludis? Yes, I did it long time ago :-) Bye... Dirk -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Dirk Heinrichs ha scritto: On Wednesday 19 December 2007 17:43:41 Grant wrote: Has anyone here switched from Portage to Paludis? Yes, I did it long time ago :-) I'd like to try Paludis, looks very promising. I think I've read that Portage and Paludis can coexist happily. Can someone confirm it? It would be useful for a transition. m. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Here is an excellent interview with Ciaran McCreesh about Paludis: http://lab.obsethryl.eu/content/paludis-gentoo-and-ciaran-mccreesh-uncensored Thanks for the link. It really got the meta-wheels turning for me. I found especially interesting the fact that Paludis's use on Gentoo is crippled due to incompatibilities between it and Portage. This is, of course, brought about by the Portage tree. Also: What are your plans regarding the future of Paludis as a Gentoo related technology should Paludis for various reason reach the event horizon of being able to provide a completely new GNU/Linux Distribution both in the technical and social framework meaning of the term? I don't have a problem with supporting multiple distributions with Paludis. I know that a couple of people are using Paludis for small, internal-use-only distributions where they need things that Gentoo can't deliver. Supporting other distributions or formats doesn't mean dropping Gentoo or ebuilds. And: Or is there interest in creating from scratch a distribution based entirely on Paludis? I've heard a rumour that some people are experimenting with a replacement tree that uses functionality offered by Paludis but not Portage (not so much to create a Paludis-based distribution as to create a better tree that Portage could theoretically support at some point). But there's nothing open to the public just now. - Grant -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Wednesday 19 December 2007 17.43.41 Grant wrote: Here is an excellent interview with Ciaran McCreesh about Paludis: http://lab.obsethryl.eu/content/paludis-gentoo-and-ciaran-mccreesh-uncensor ed excellent is a bit much... Seems like a propaganda pice to me. That said I did find paludis a bit hard to use but that might have been because it was quite some timeago I tried it. -- Naga -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Dec 19, 2007 2:46 PM, Naga Toro [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wednesday 19 December 2007 17.43.41 Grant wrote: Here is an excellent interview with Ciaran McCreesh about Paludis: http://lab.obsethryl.eu/content/paludis-gentoo-and-ciaran-mccreesh-uncensor ed excellent is a bit much... Seems like a propaganda pice to me. That said I did find paludis a bit hard to use but that might have been because it was quite some timeago I tried it. -- Naga -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list Portage has proved more than adequate for my needs. Paladis doesn't seem like anything I need or want. -- - Mark Shields
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On (19/12/07 20:05) b.n. wrote: Dirk Heinrichs ha scritto: On Wednesday 19 December 2007 17:43:41 Grant wrote: Has anyone here switched from Portage to Paludis? Yes, I did it long time ago :-) I'd like to try Paludis, looks very promising. I think I've read that Portage and Paludis can coexist happily. Can someone confirm it? It would be useful for a transition. m. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list Hi, Yes, they *can* coexist well, but i've some remarks. The config is rather different but concepts remain the same. The paludis vdb-entries have more info but are(were) compatible. Watch out for some scripts (perl-cleaner, claw-mail, etc.) in which the use of portage/emerge is embedded. Put 'paludis' as USE-flag. Have gone to paludis then went back to portage w/o major problems. No support for binary packages yet, some warning/downgrades from the tree. Now using mainly paludis. Please don't consider this 'anti-portage', but just as my choice. For me both are good, only paludis has more features (even now). HTH. Rumen pgplMQNa8uCqx.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
b.n. [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'd like to try Paludis, looks very promising. I think I've read that Portage and Paludis can coexist happily. Can someone confirm it? It would be useful for a transition. It works just fine. :) Later versions have the ability to use portage configuration files directly, but that makes you lose some advantages, like per-repository masking or unmasking of packages. I use a small script to keep portage and paludis config files in sync, so I can use whichever I want. The thing I like about it most is how it keeps overlays separate, so they don't override eclasses globally, or that you can even specify 'underlays' that are only used if neither the official portage nor any other overlays carry a specific package. And the recent addition of the option '--continue-on-failure' won me over all over again. :) János Zsitvai -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Mark Shields ha scritto: Portage has proved more than adequate for my needs. Paladis doesn't seem like anything I need or want. Well, Portage is adequate for my needs too, and I've never tried Paludis but the very continue-on-failure and underlays things look like, for example, two small but dramatically useful features. It seems interesting. Why don't you find it interesting? I'm just curious. m. -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Wednesday 19 December 2007 21:37:38 Rumen Yotov wrote: Watch out for some scripts (perl-cleaner, claw-mail, etc.) in which the use of portage/emerge is embedded. Put 'paludis' as USE-flag. Unless you use a crappy, unsupported overlay no such use flag exists. Kind of curious how that relates to claw-mail anyway. Python-updater on the other hand supports all three package managers in the tree and just defaults to using portage. :P And yes, I'm a Paludis user (for over a year now). -- Bo Andresen signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Wed, 2007-12-19 at 22:42 +0100, Zsitvai János wrote: And the recent addition of the option '--continue-on-failure' won me over all over again. :) I've been wondering for a long time why portage doesn't continue with building other packages when one fails - so long as deps are met why stop? Acutally, while I'm on the subject of features - here's another one I'd like to see: parallel merges instead of parallel makes. Since many packages have problems with MAKEOPTS, it doesn't help with configure scripts anyway and other parts of the process, why not spawn 2 or 3 emerges automatically? Each one could do it's own tree of packages and dependencies that don't affect the other... would be nice IMHO. cya, -- Iain Buchanan iaindb at netspace dot net dot au People think love is an emotion. Love is good sense. -- Ken Kesey -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Thursday 20 December 2007 02:46:20 Iain Buchanan wrote: And the recent addition of the option '--continue-on-failure' won me over all over again. :) I've been wondering for a long time why portage doesn't continue with building other packages when one fails - so long as deps are met why stop? Because the current resolver in Portage isn't powerfull enough to know if the deps are met. Acutally, while I'm on the subject of features - here's another one I'd like to see: parallel merges instead of parallel makes. It's planned (both for Portage and Paludis). For Portage there's even a bug with a patch which isn't considered suitable for inclusion in Portage. -- Bo Andresen signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
On Wed, 2007-12-19 at 22:42 +0100, Zsitvai János wrote: b.n. [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'd like to try Paludis, looks very promising. I think I've read that Portage and Paludis can coexist happily. Can someone confirm it? It would be useful for a transition. It works just fine. :) Later versions have the ability to use portage configuration files directly, but that makes you lose some advantages, like per-repository masking or unmasking of packages. I use a small script to keep portage and paludis config files in sync, so I can use whichever I want. The thing I like about it most is how it keeps overlays separate, so they don't override eclasses globally, or that you can even specify 'underlays' that are only used if neither the official portage nor any other overlays carry a specific package. And the recent addition of the option '--continue-on-failure' won me over all over again. :) János Zsitvai May i have that script? I assume it's GPLed :-) -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Richard Marzan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
May i have that script? I assume it's GPLed :-)
Honestly, calling it a script is an embellishment.
Perhaps phrasing it as 'something that keeps the faster moving parts of
configuration in sync' would have been better.
echo '*/* x86' /etc/paludis/keywords.conf
grep -h -v \# /etc/portage/package.keywords/* | grep \/ | awk -F '{print $1
x86 ~x86}' | sort -u /etc/paludis/keywords.conf
cat /etc/paludis/package_mask.conf | grep -v '::' | grep -v '#' | sort -u
/etc/portage/package.mask/paludis
cat /etc/paludis/package_unmask.conf | grep -v '::' | grep -v '#' | sort -u
/etc/portage/package.unmask/paludis
cat /etc/paludis/use.conf | grep -v '::' | grep -v '\*\/\*' | grep -v '#' |
sort -u /etc/portage/package.use/paludis
That's all there is to it, and it makes a lot of assumptions: that
you've already configured both paludis and portage, that you consider
/etc/paludis authoritative on everything but package.keywords, that
you're running a mixed x86 and ~x86 system, and probably others I can't
spot. You also have to sync the global use flags by hand in make.conf
ans use.conf, as well as manage adding/removing overlays by hand, and it
won't touch CFLAGS settings either, etc.
Another thing to keep in mind is that if you package unmask/mask a
package from a certain repository only with cat/pkg::repo, portage won't
know about it and probably not do what you want.
János Zsitvai
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Grant wrote: Here is an excellent interview with Ciaran McCreesh about Paludis: http://lab.obsethryl.eu/content/paludis-gentoo-and-ciaran-mccreesh-uncensored Has anyone here switched from Portage to Paludis? - Grant i'm completely delete portage and use paludis. work's fine ;) -- С уважением, Vasiliy G Tolstov http://www.selfip.ru begin:vcard fn:Vasiliy G Tolstov n:Tolstov;Vasiliy org:PeterHost.Ru;Virtual Hosting adr:;;;Saint-Petersbutg;;;Russia email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] title:System Administrator tel;work:+78123477743 tel;cell:+79119940054 x-mozilla-html:TRUE url:http://www.selfip.ru version:2.1 end:vcard
Re: [gentoo-user] Excellent Paludis interview
Bo Ørsted Andresen написа: On Wednesday 19 December 2007 21:37:38 Rumen Yotov wrote: Watch out for some scripts (perl-cleaner, claw-mail, etc.) in which the use of portage/emerge is embedded. Put 'paludis' as USE-flag. Unless you use a crappy, unsupported overlay no such use flag exists. Kind of curious how that relates to claw-mail anyway. Python-updater on the other hand supports all three package managers in the tree and just defaults to using portage. :P And yes, I'm a Paludis user (for over a year now). Hi, Regarding claws-mail there's a script to rebuild it's plugins - see elogs. Since i first tried paludis-0.2.1, may still have some old use info (laziness) about paludis USE-flag (IIRC revdep-rebuild portage-utils, etc.had it). Haven't tried/needed python-updater so omitted it. There's also a paludis-extras overlay, which is rather separated from official paludis but have some nice things (and problems sometimes ;-). Regards, Rumen smime.p7s Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature
