RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
Thanks for all the help! I think I'll definitely go for the book about silks, it might also help me with giving a name to another fabric I don't know the name of. I know exactly the possible mm of the fabrics in China, and the shantung or dupioni (Chinese call it shuan-gong, which is probably shantung) has 19 to 22mm. But it's usually 19. I called it shantung till someone told me it's dupioni, and from then on I was unsure about the name. My sister'll arrive for Christmas, so we can talk things over and I'm sure we'll solve that mystery... The two fabrics I've got at home are both like a softer taffeta, one is a bit more uneven than the other and has less slubs, but they both weight the same. The more uneven one looks like this and the other like this. Could these two be douppioni? Then my sister once brought from China something looking similar to the second fabric (less slubs), but finer,thinner, more tightly woven, and not really ressembling taffeta, it was heavier and flowier. This might have been the shantung...? Zuzana Chiara Francesca [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do understand where you all are coming from Suzi but please realize that unlike European countries the US no longer has a silk mass producer that I know of, there may be small runs of it for specialty markets. Kimiko, correct me if I am wrong, you would know that better than I. All of our silk comes from overseas. All the ones I see have India stamped on the bolt ends. For the finer silks however there is a bridal shop here that we all hit and their bolt ends have Japan or China stamped on them. I have never seen silk bolt ends with any other country's stamp on it. In the end, Zuzana, look for the weight. Since you are not there with your sister in China ask her to look at the weights and to look at the surface. If you can get the book of swatches that Kimiko recommends do it and send it to her asap or see if she can get one where she is at. If you have the fabric you want already, send her that swatch so that she can compare it. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 2:36 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung At 17:16 14/12/2007, you wrote: Dupioni is the lighter weight fabric, as it is a thin even weave with the same or similar warp and weft threads. Shantung ends up heavier, as it has weft filler threads that thicken the fabric, giving it a pronounced rib effect. It has fewer slubs because they use a finer silk in the warp, but use thick and thin dual threads similar to the dupioni as the rib weft. Some places consider them the same fabric type, but they really are not. Dupioni is more like a slubby taffeta in weight and weave, and in stiffness. Shantung ... I can't say what it is similar to, but not really similar to dupioni except for the occasional slub roughness. Both fabrics do have issues with raveling a lot while working with them. This may well be so in the U.S. but, like Bjarne, I have always understood shantung to be the finer fabric. In England, most dupion is not stiff like taffeta, but more inclined to be floppy. Shantung is a fabric used for shirts, blouses etc., like a finer dupion. They do both ravel like mad though. Like I say, that is what I understand to be the U.K. comparisons. Suzi Kimiko --- Zuzana Kraemerova wrote: Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? ___ _ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
sorry the html somehow didn't work, so once more: The two fabrics I've got at home are both like a softer taffeta, one is a bit more uneven than the other and has less slubs, but they both weight the same. The more uneven one looks like this: http://www.onlinesilkfabricstore.com/Dupioni_Silk_Fabric_p/dps-orchidlimesapphire.htm and the other like this: http://www.dharmatrading.com/fabric/silk/dupion.html Could these two be douppioni? - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung. .......memories of stinky silk
ahh stinky silksbrings back lovely memories of wearing a beautiful silk fiber sweater to jr high, having it rain, then suffering the rest of the day with gaggles of 14 yr olds commenting on the terrible fishy smell in the room. melody Kimiko Small [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think our dupioni has more sizing or something, cause when I buy it is hangs pretty stiffly similar to taffeta (but definitely not the same), but when washed and pressed it goes limp like nothing. And taffeta has a nasty chemical smell when washed, and the wrinkles in taffeta never goes away (yeah, I washed it once) even with lots of high steam, but becomes fairly crisp upon drying. I prefer shantung over dupioni, but dupioni is so much easier to find in lots of colors, including metallics. Shantung does seem to be a nicer, finer silk to work with. I also like taffeta, but not so happy with how to work with it. I like working with washed silks that don't stink. Kimiko --- Suzi Clarke wrote: This may well be so in the U.S. but, like Bjarne, I have always understood shantung to be the finer fabric. In England, most dupion is not stiff like taffeta, but more inclined to be floppy. Shantung is a fabric used for shirts, blouses etc., like a finer dupion. They do both ravel like mad though. Like I say, that is what I understand to be the U.K. comparisons. Suzi Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
--- Zuzana Kraemerova [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Could these two be douppioni? Yes. Both could be dupioni. What the All About Silks book will tell you is that every manufacturer calls what they make by different names, and that those names may not have anything to do with what the next manufacturer will call it's fabrics. In general, they try to call them by similar names, but fashion being fashion, they will call some things by other names, and confuse us poor consumers in the process. I would worry less about what they might call a given fabric, and chose based on the desired fabric qualities you want, and whatever you and your sister agree on, and what is available that is similar. That's why I like the book, because it not only tells you the common term, it will also give you what a particular fabric type is good for in creating a garment... fitted vs semi-fitted vs loosely constructed, for one example. How well a given fabric drapes, or doesn't, how crisp the hand or how fluid. The swatches really help as well, so you can compare their dupioni with the dupioni or shantung your sister sends you, and have a better idea of what it really is so you can plan your projects accordingly. And the series also has a book on cotton fabrics, and a book on wool fabrics. I wish they had one on linens, but not that I know of. Kimiko Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
Good Morning Zuzana! Here is an excerpt of an article series that I recently started called Straight from the Corset. I think it answers your question about silks. If you want to see the whole article let me know. :) Silk is measured by weight either by grams or by momme (mm). 28 grams = 1 ounce. 8 momme = 1 oz. In determining the right silk for your purposes, silk under 20 momme is considered lightweight, 20 to 28 is considered medium weight and anything above that is considered heavyweight. Shantung Once made from hand-reeled tussah silk, today's shantung is usually made with cultivated silk warp yarns and heavier douppioni filling yarns. Depending on the filling yarn, shantung may be lustrous or dull. It has a firm, semi-crisp hand and tends to ravel, so avoid close-fitting styles. It can be machine washed on gentle and dried on low. 29 mm Douppioni Douppioni is a plain-weave fabric with slubbed ribs. It has a stiff, taffeta-like hand and is usually dyed in bright colors. Douppioni is often made into elegant flowy gowns that are not fitted or for semi-fitted doublets and garments because the fabric doesn't stand up well to stress and ravels easily. Dry cleaning recommended. 19mm. For a detailed chart go to http://www.classactfabrics.com/silk/silk_fabric.htm For further reading go find: Mola, Luca. The Silk Industry in Renaissance Venice. Baltimore: The Johns Hopkins University Press. 2000. My source was the above book. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 9:19 AM To: h-costume Subject: [h-cost] difference between dupioni and shantung Hi everyone, I've spent the past few days searching on the internet and I've been asking as many people as I met and still can't get the difference between silk shantung and silk dupioni. I often ask my sister in China to buy me some shantung, but once she gets a very fine fabric with almost no slubs and another day she gets one with a rougher texture and more visible slubs. I didn't know how to call these two, so I started to search for such sorts of silk fabric that would match the two fabrics, and I got shantung and dupioni. But alas, sources say different definitions, one says the contrary of the other, leaving me really puzzled... Does anyone know something about that? Pictures are really welcome... - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
That is correct. Anything over 28mm is considered heavy weight. Shantung would be the heavy weight. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 10:00 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? Chiara Francesca [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good Morning Zuzana! Here is an excerpt of an article series that I recently started called Straight from the Corset. I think it answers your question about silks. If you want to see the whole article let me know. :) Silk is measured by weight either by grams or by momme (mm). 28 grams = 1 ounce. 8 momme = 1 oz. In determining the right silk for your purposes, silk under 20 momme is considered lightweight, 20 to 28 is considered medium weight and anything above that is considered heavyweight. Shantung Once made from hand-reeled tussah silk, today's shantung is usually made with cultivated silk warp yarns and heavier douppioni filling yarns. Depending on the filling yarn, shantung may be lustrous or dull. It has a firm, semi-crisp hand and tends to ravel, so avoid close-fitting styles. It can be machine washed on gentle and dried on low. 29 mm Douppioni Douppioni is a plain-weave fabric with slubbed ribs. It has a stiff, taffeta-like hand and is usually dyed in bright colors. Douppioni is often made into elegant flowy gowns that are not fitted or for semi-fitted doublets and garments because the fabric doesn't stand up well to stress and ravels easily. Dry cleaning recommended. 19mm. For a detailed chart go to http://www.classactfabrics.com/silk/silk_fabric.htm For further reading go find: Mola, Luca. The Silk Industry in Renaissance Venice. Baltimore: The Johns Hopkins University Press. 2000. My source was the above book. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 9:19 AM To: h-costume Subject: [h-cost] difference between dupioni and shantung Hi everyone, I've spent the past few days searching on the internet and I've been asking as many people as I met and still can't get the difference between silk shantung and silk dupioni. I often ask my sister in China to buy me some shantung, but once she gets a very fine fabric with almost no slubs and another day she gets one with a rougher texture and more visible slubs. I didn't know how to call these two, so I started to search for such sorts of silk fabric that would match the two fabrics, and I got shantung and dupioni. But alas, sources say different definitions, one says the contrary of the other, leaving me really puzzled... Does anyone know something about that? Pictures are really welcome... - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? Chiara Francesca [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good Morning Zuzana! Here is an excerpt of an article series that I recently started called Straight from the Corset. I think it answers your question about silks. If you want to see the whole article let me know. :) Silk is measured by weight either by grams or by momme (mm). 28 grams = 1 ounce. 8 momme = 1 oz. In determining the right silk for your purposes, silk under 20 momme is considered lightweight, 20 to 28 is considered medium weight and anything above that is considered heavyweight. Shantung Once made from hand-reeled tussah silk, today's shantung is usually made with cultivated silk warp yarns and heavier douppioni filling yarns. Depending on the filling yarn, shantung may be lustrous or dull. It has a firm, semi-crisp hand and tends to ravel, so avoid close-fitting styles. It can be machine washed on gentle and dried on low. 29 mm Douppioni Douppioni is a plain-weave fabric with slubbed ribs. It has a stiff, taffeta-like hand and is usually dyed in bright colors. Douppioni is often made into elegant flowy gowns that are not fitted or for semi-fitted doublets and garments because the fabric doesn't stand up well to stress and ravels easily. Dry cleaning recommended. 19mm. For a detailed chart go to http://www.classactfabrics.com/silk/silk_fabric.htm For further reading go find: Mola, Luca. The Silk Industry in Renaissance Venice. Baltimore: The Johns Hopkins University Press. 2000. My source was the above book. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 9:19 AM To: h-costume Subject: [h-cost] difference between dupioni and shantung Hi everyone, I've spent the past few days searching on the internet and I've been asking as many people as I met and still can't get the difference between silk shantung and silk dupioni. I often ask my sister in China to buy me some shantung, but once she gets a very fine fabric with almost no slubs and another day she gets one with a rougher texture and more visible slubs. I didn't know how to call these two, so I started to search for such sorts of silk fabric that would match the two fabrics, and I got shantung and dupioni. But alas, sources say different definitions, one says the contrary of the other, leaving me really puzzled... Does anyone know something about that? Pictures are really welcome... - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
Dupioni is the lighter weight fabric, as it is a thin even weave with the same or similar warp and weft threads. Shantung ends up heavier, as it has weft filler threads that thicken the fabric, giving it a pronounced rib effect. It has fewer slubs because they use a finer silk in the warp, but use thick and thin dual threads similar to the dupioni as the rib weft. Some places consider them the same fabric type, but they really are not. Dupioni is more like a slubby taffeta in weight and weave, and in stiffness. Shantung ... I can't say what it is similar to, but not really similar to dupioni except for the occasional slub roughness. Both fabrics do have issues with raveling a lot while working with them. Kimiko --- Zuzana Kraemerova [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
At 17:16 14/12/2007, you wrote: Dupioni is the lighter weight fabric, as it is a thin even weave with the same or similar warp and weft threads. Shantung ends up heavier, as it has weft filler threads that thicken the fabric, giving it a pronounced rib effect. It has fewer slubs because they use a finer silk in the warp, but use thick and thin dual threads similar to the dupioni as the rib weft. Some places consider them the same fabric type, but they really are not. Dupioni is more like a slubby taffeta in weight and weave, and in stiffness. Shantung ... I can't say what it is similar to, but not really similar to dupioni except for the occasional slub roughness. Both fabrics do have issues with raveling a lot while working with them. This may well be so in the U.S. but, like Bjarne, I have always understood shantung to be the finer fabric. In England, most dupion is not stiff like taffeta, but more inclined to be floppy. Shantung is a fabric used for shirts, blouses etc., like a finer dupion. They do both ravel like mad though. Like I say, that is what I understand to be the U.K. comparisons. Suzi Kimiko --- Zuzana Kraemerova [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
I think shantung is fewer slubs and finer ones than dupioni, but it is more densely wovern(more threads per inch), which would make the fabric heavier in weight Cindy Abel -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 10:00 AM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? Chiara Francesca [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good Morning Zuzana! Here is an excerpt of an article series that I recently started called Straight from the Corset. I think it answers your question about silks. If you want to see the whole article let me know. :) Silk is measured by weight either by grams or by momme (mm). 28 grams = 1 ounce. 8 momme = 1 oz. In determining the right silk for your purposes, silk under 20 momme is considered lightweight, 20 to 28 is considered medium weight and anything above that is considered heavyweight. Shantung Once made from hand-reeled tussah silk, today's shantung is usually made with cultivated silk warp yarns and heavier douppioni filling yarns. Depending on the filling yarn, shantung may be lustrous or dull. It has a firm, semi-crisp hand and tends to ravel, so avoid close-fitting styles. It can be machine washed on gentle and dried on low. 29 mm Douppioni Douppioni is a plain-weave fabric with slubbed ribs. It has a stiff, taffeta-like hand and is usually dyed in bright colors. Douppioni is often made into elegant flowy gowns that are not fitted or for semi-fitted doublets and garments because the fabric doesn't stand up well to stress and ravels easily. Dry cleaning recommended. 19mm. For a detailed chart go to http://www.classactfabrics.com/silk/silk_fabric.htm For further reading go find: Mola, Luca. The Silk Industry in Renaissance Venice. Baltimore: The Johns Hopkins University Press. 2000. My source was the above book. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Zuzana Kraemerova Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 9:19 AM To: h-costume Subject: [h-cost] difference between dupioni and shantung Hi everyone, I've spent the past few days searching on the internet and I've been asking as many people as I met and still can't get the difference between silk shantung and silk dupioni. I often ask my sister in China to buy me some shantung, but once she gets a very fine fabric with almost no slubs and another day she gets one with a rougher texture and more visible slubs. I didn't know how to call these two, so I started to search for such sorts of silk fabric that would match the two fabrics, and I got shantung and dupioni. But alas, sources say different definitions, one says the contrary of the other, leaving me really puzzled... Does anyone know something about that? Pictures are really welcome... - Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
Chiara Francesca wrote: Shantung Once made from hand-reeled tussah silk, today's shantung is usually made with cultivated silk warp yarns and heavier douppioni filling yarns. Depending on the filling yarn, shantung may be lustrous or dull. It has a firm, semi-crisp hand and tends to ravel, so avoid close-fitting styles. It can be machine washed on gentle and dried on low. 29 mm Douppioni Douppioni is a plain-weave fabric with slubbed ribs. It has a stiff, taffeta-like hand and is usually dyed in bright colors. Douppioni is often made into elegant flowy gowns that are not fitted or for semi-fitted doublets and garments because the fabric doesn't stand up well to stress and ravels easily. Dry cleaning recommended. 19mm. It's also worth noting that there's a lot of variability in douppioni (which, as a friend of mine once said, translates to we don't beat our slack-ass weavers) and shantung. Indian douppioni tends to be pretty slubby. I've seen (and have) Chinese douppioni that could almost pass for taffeta. It's purely technique and weight, The quality of the silk (and the weavers) determines whether it's clean and clear or slubby and rustic. andy ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
I think our dupioni has more sizing or something, cause when I buy it is hangs pretty stiffly similar to taffeta (but definitely not the same), but when washed and pressed it goes limp like nothing. And taffeta has a nasty chemical smell when washed, and the wrinkles in taffeta never goes away (yeah, I washed it once) even with lots of high steam, but becomes fairly crisp upon drying. I prefer shantung over dupioni, but dupioni is so much easier to find in lots of colors, including metallics. Shantung does seem to be a nicer, finer silk to work with. I also like taffeta, but not so happy with how to work with it. I like working with washed silks that don't stink. Kimiko --- Suzi Clarke [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This may well be so in the U.S. but, like Bjarne, I have always understood shantung to be the finer fabric. In England, most dupion is not stiff like taffeta, but more inclined to be floppy. Shantung is a fabric used for shirts, blouses etc., like a finer dupion. They do both ravel like mad though. Like I say, that is what I understand to be the U.K. comparisons. Suzi Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
I do understand where you all are coming from Suzi but please realize that unlike European countries the US no longer has a silk mass producer that I know of, there may be small runs of it for specialty markets. Kimiko, correct me if I am wrong, you would know that better than I. All of our silk comes from overseas. All the ones I see have India stamped on the bolt ends. For the finer silks however there is a bridal shop here that we all hit and their bolt ends have Japan or China stamped on them. I have never seen silk bolt ends with any other country's stamp on it. In the end, Zuzana, look for the weight. Since you are not there with your sister in China ask her to look at the weights and to look at the surface. If you can get the book of swatches that Kimiko recommends do it and send it to her asap or see if she can get one where she is at. If you have the fabric you want already, send her that swatch so that she can compare it. :) Chiara Francesca -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Suzi Clarke Sent: Friday, December 14, 2007 2:36 PM To: Historical Costume Subject: RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung At 17:16 14/12/2007, you wrote: Dupioni is the lighter weight fabric, as it is a thin even weave with the same or similar warp and weft threads. Shantung ends up heavier, as it has weft filler threads that thicken the fabric, giving it a pronounced rib effect. It has fewer slubs because they use a finer silk in the warp, but use thick and thin dual threads similar to the dupioni as the rib weft. Some places consider them the same fabric type, but they really are not. Dupioni is more like a slubby taffeta in weight and weave, and in stiffness. Shantung ... I can't say what it is similar to, but not really similar to dupioni except for the occasional slub roughness. Both fabrics do have issues with raveling a lot while working with them. This may well be so in the U.S. but, like Bjarne, I have always understood shantung to be the finer fabric. In England, most dupion is not stiff like taffeta, but more inclined to be floppy. Shantung is a fabric used for shirts, blouses etc., like a finer dupion. They do both ravel like mad though. Like I say, that is what I understand to be the U.K. comparisons. Suzi Kimiko --- Zuzana Kraemerova [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks very much!! If I understood right, shantung is 29mm and douppioni 19mm, which means that shantung is much heavier? This makes me a bit confused as from the definitions I understood that Shantung might be the finer (less slubs) = and lighter one? ___ _ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
RE: [h-cost] difference between douppioni and shantung
I've not been able to enjoy seeing the ends of bolts, except the few at Hancock's. I tend to order my silks from various online sources as I need them. But Chiara, what you have stated seems to be true based on my experience those times I do know where the silk is coming from. While I covet the Italian or other finer European silks, I so can't afford them yet. Kimiko --- Chiara Francesca [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do understand where you all are coming from Suzi but please realize that unlike European countries the US no longer has a silk mass producer that I know of, there may be small runs of it for specialty markets. Kimiko, correct me if I am wrong, you would know that better than I. All of our silk comes from overseas. All the ones I see have India stamped on the bolt ends. For the finer silks however there is a bridal shop here that we all hit and their bolt ends have Japan or China stamped on them. I have never seen silk bolt ends with any other country's stamp on it. Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
