Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread Randy Barnett 
Here! Here! We seem to be in a down turn right now. My question is why 
should we have to put up with it? Why do we have to accept inferior 
access other than "Oh thats just the way it is"?

If we are totally accepting we wont ever get better access to technology.
On 10/26/2017 7:34 AM, JM Casey wrote:

Yeah, really. Doesn't it kind of feel like the early 90s all over again,
where you would try to run a program and find it needed Windows, which you
couldn't use because screen-readers only really worked with MSDos?

As an aside, and not to be a grumpy old codger, but I really dislike this
new modern apps (the ones introduced with Windows 10) and their
layout/interface. I understand it brings things more in line with
smartphones and cross-platform is good. But I'm on a desktop; I want it to
behave like a desktop, damit.



-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Randy Barnett
Sent: October 25, 2017 6:19 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

Yeah, I have been using jaws since the mid 90's and see the same issues you
do with the modern approach to Windows and other software. This is a hard
time to be a blind PC user. Hearing about how cool this or that is on the
web and how everyone can find out anything and everything while I struggle
with a captcha or have jaws drowned out by a video ad or try to find some
news on a site that is constantly updating and has inaccessible links buried
in a ton of java or flash  sucks.
On 10/25/2017 2:57 PM, JM Casey wrote:

So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On
another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot
seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could
cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means
it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play
nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the
same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that
it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and from what
I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the virtual
buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as I use
Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til now. I
also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web browsing and
would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative was developed.

   


Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in
quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none")
who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep
up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using
Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10
and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that
wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround
to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't
be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.

   


Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the
ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security
updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be

doing that, then!
   

   


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


--
Sincerely: Randy Barnett (Owner)
Soundtique
Grants Pass, Oregon.


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/



--
Sincerely: Randy Barnett
Owner of Soundtique.
Grants Pass, Or.


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread wayne smith 
It can't hurt to contact Mazilla and let them know, politely, the problems they 
are creating for the blind and ask them to aid in better solutions.

Wayne

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf 
Of Jim Pursley
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 8:54 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
screen-readers

Helpful.  FSBlog a good resource.

On 10/26/2017 4:56 AM, Dennis Long wrote:
> This should help.
> http://blog.freedomscientific.com/2017/10/25/important-information-for
> -users
> -of-mozilla-firefox/
>
> -Original Message-
> From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] 
> On Behalf Of Justin Williams
> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
> To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
> like screen-readers
>
> Where do I get the ESR extended support?
> Justin
>
> -Original Message-
> From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] 
> On Behalf Of cheez
> Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
> To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
> like screen-readers
>
> it figures.  Every time you take 3 steps forward, they push you back 2.
>
> Vince
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22...@gmail.com>
> To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:46 PM
> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
> like screen-readers
>
>
>> Hi,
>> And Narrator won't work with it either.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com]
>> On Behalf Of cheez
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
>> To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
>> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
>> like screen-readers
>>
>> You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?
>>
>> Vince
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
>> To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
>> Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
>> screen-readers
>>
>>
>>> So..
>>>
>>> Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
>>> another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot 
>>> seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I 
>>> could cross-post it. In
>>> brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that 
>>> means it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not 
>>> play nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at 
>>> the same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, 
>>> in that it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and 
>>> from what I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing 
>>> the virtual buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the 
>>> least, as I use Firefox all the time and have been really happy with 
>>> it up til now. I also think the virutal buffer a great innovation 
>>> for web browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better 
>>> alternative was
> developed.
>>>
>>>
>>> Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in 
>>> quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") 
>>> who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't 
>>> keep up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be 
>>> using Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting 
>>> Windows 10 and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have 
>>> to fix that wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring 
>>> a workaround to one thing or another, or a doomful press release 
>>> about how I won't be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the 
>>> ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security 
>>> updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess 
>>> I'll be doing that, then!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>&

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread Jim Pursley 

The  fs blog is available for
rss subscription.

On 10/26/2017 1:20 PM, Cher Bosch wrote:

I think this is the article you referenced:


This blog post was just sent out by Freedom Scientific. If you use JAWS and
Firefox, you need to read this.

Important information for users of Mozilla Firefox

Jonathan Mosen October 25, 2017 0

Overview

On November 14, Mozilla is expected to release a new version of its Firefox
web browser. Firefox 57 represents such a significant technical and
performance change that it's going to be known as Firefox Quantum. Mozilla
and mainstream reviewers of the beta code agree, the browser is much faster
and more memory efficient.

The reason why mainstream users will see such a significant speed increase
with Firefox Quantum is that it is switching to a multiprocess methodology.
Unfortunately, Mozilla in their switch to multiprocess for Firefox has
chosen an accessibility approach in which each call for JAWS to obtain
information takes orders of magnitude more time.  We are disappointed that
Mozilla has not at this time adopted the highly performant approach that
Google took with Chrome to increase security while at the same time allowing
screen readers to access information at unparalleled speed without needing
to make any changes.

For now, we recommend switching to the Extended Support Release (ESR) of
Firefox as work on the accessibility issues continues, because even when you
are running assistive technology that supports Firefox Quantum, performance
with Firefox will be much worse than you are used to. We're working with
Mozilla to improve the situation and are hopeful of further improvement.

We appreciate that if you're a Firefox user, it's software you are likely to
use many times every day. We want by way of this post to explain the
situation as it currently stands and how we got here, plus what we're doing
about it and steps you can take so that in the short to medium term, you can
use Firefox with the same degree of responsiveness you're used to.

Short-term Work-around

For now, there is a way to avoid upgrading to Firefox Quantum while keeping
your browser updated with important security fixes. You can install Firefox
ESR (Extended Support Release). The Quantum changes are not scheduled to be
rolled out to this release until the second quarter of 2018, by which time
we hope the accessibility situation with Firefox Quantum will have improved.

Compatibility

While we cannot recommend Firefox Quantum at this time, we appreciate that
some people may be curious and want to experiment with it. Firefox Quantum
will not work in any fashion unless you are running the latest versions of
JAWS 2018, JAWS 18, ZoomText 11 and MAGic 14. Previous versions of our
assistive technology are not compatible with Firefox Quantum.

To ensure Quantum will run at all, please ensure you are running the most
current version of the above technologies. Please visit our downloads page
for the latest software.

If going current with your assistive technology isn't possible, the Firefox
ESR release discussed above will continue to work at this time with the
technology you have. This will not always be the case, so if using Firefox
is important to you, you should make plans to bring your technology
up-to-date over the next few months.

When it is installed, Firefox Quantum will be able to detect if older
assistive technology is running that is not compatible. When this is the
case, Firefox Quantum will alert you to this.

Performance

Unfortunately, even if you have an assistive technology product that has
been updated to accommodate Mozilla's new approach, you will notice a
serious deterioration in performance. We would go as far as saying that at
this point, you would not want to use Firefox Quantum for your daily
browsing. Pages will take a long time to load, and navigating pages will be
problematic.

The reason for this is that Firefox's implementation of multiprocess has
caused a marked deterioration in the speed of communication between the
browser and assistive technology.

As our users who browse with Google Chrome, which has been using
multiprocess for some time, can confirm, multiprocess browsers can provide a
highly responsive experience comparable with what Firefox users are
accustomed to, and it is still our hope that Mozilla might adopt a similar
approach.

The problem created by Firefox Quantum is a complex technical one, but we
believe all our users are entitled to an explanation, so here's our best
shot. To give you a browsing experience that is the most flexible available,
as well as being intuitive and accurate, JAWS behaves a bit like an
impatient child on a long car journey. It asks Firefox many questions on a
regular basis, including "are we there yet". In the past, Firefox had no
difficulty answering all our questions quickly and patiently, meaning we
could always give you up-to-the-second information about what was happening
on the web page. For our readers with some

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread Cher Bosch 
I think this is the article you referenced:


This blog post was just sent out by Freedom Scientific. If you use JAWS and
Firefox, you need to read this.

Important information for users of Mozilla Firefox

Jonathan Mosen October 25, 2017 0

Overview

On November 14, Mozilla is expected to release a new version of its Firefox
web browser. Firefox 57 represents such a significant technical and
performance change that it's going to be known as Firefox Quantum. Mozilla
and mainstream reviewers of the beta code agree, the browser is much faster
and more memory efficient.

The reason why mainstream users will see such a significant speed increase
with Firefox Quantum is that it is switching to a multiprocess methodology.
Unfortunately, Mozilla in their switch to multiprocess for Firefox has
chosen an accessibility approach in which each call for JAWS to obtain
information takes orders of magnitude more time.  We are disappointed that
Mozilla has not at this time adopted the highly performant approach that
Google took with Chrome to increase security while at the same time allowing
screen readers to access information at unparalleled speed without needing
to make any changes.

For now, we recommend switching to the Extended Support Release (ESR) of
Firefox as work on the accessibility issues continues, because even when you
are running assistive technology that supports Firefox Quantum, performance
with Firefox will be much worse than you are used to. We're working with
Mozilla to improve the situation and are hopeful of further improvement.

We appreciate that if you're a Firefox user, it's software you are likely to
use many times every day. We want by way of this post to explain the
situation as it currently stands and how we got here, plus what we're doing
about it and steps you can take so that in the short to medium term, you can
use Firefox with the same degree of responsiveness you're used to.

Short-term Work-around

For now, there is a way to avoid upgrading to Firefox Quantum while keeping
your browser updated with important security fixes. You can install Firefox
ESR (Extended Support Release). The Quantum changes are not scheduled to be
rolled out to this release until the second quarter of 2018, by which time
we hope the accessibility situation with Firefox Quantum will have improved.

Compatibility

While we cannot recommend Firefox Quantum at this time, we appreciate that
some people may be curious and want to experiment with it. Firefox Quantum
will not work in any fashion unless you are running the latest versions of
JAWS 2018, JAWS 18, ZoomText 11 and MAGic 14. Previous versions of our
assistive technology are not compatible with Firefox Quantum.

To ensure Quantum will run at all, please ensure you are running the most
current version of the above technologies. Please visit our downloads page
for the latest software.

If going current with your assistive technology isn't possible, the Firefox
ESR release discussed above will continue to work at this time with the
technology you have. This will not always be the case, so if using Firefox
is important to you, you should make plans to bring your technology
up-to-date over the next few months.

When it is installed, Firefox Quantum will be able to detect if older
assistive technology is running that is not compatible. When this is the
case, Firefox Quantum will alert you to this.

Performance

Unfortunately, even if you have an assistive technology product that has
been updated to accommodate Mozilla's new approach, you will notice a
serious deterioration in performance. We would go as far as saying that at
this point, you would not want to use Firefox Quantum for your daily
browsing. Pages will take a long time to load, and navigating pages will be
problematic.

The reason for this is that Firefox's implementation of multiprocess has
caused a marked deterioration in the speed of communication between the
browser and assistive technology.

As our users who browse with Google Chrome, which has been using
multiprocess for some time, can confirm, multiprocess browsers can provide a
highly responsive experience comparable with what Firefox users are
accustomed to, and it is still our hope that Mozilla might adopt a similar
approach.

The problem created by Firefox Quantum is a complex technical one, but we
believe all our users are entitled to an explanation, so here's our best
shot. To give you a browsing experience that is the most flexible available,
as well as being intuitive and accurate, JAWS behaves a bit like an
impatient child on a long car journey. It asks Firefox many questions on a
regular basis, including "are we there yet". In the past, Firefox had no
difficulty answering all our questions quickly and patiently, meaning we
could always give you up-to-the-second information about what was happening
on the web page. For our readers with some technical knowledge, we did this
through calls to MSAA and it wasn't necessary to ration those

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread JM Casey 
Yeah, really. Doesn't it kind of feel like the early 90s all over again,
where you would try to run a program and find it needed Windows, which you
couldn't use because screen-readers only really worked with MSDos? 

As an aside, and not to be a grumpy old codger, but I really dislike this
new modern apps (the ones introduced with Windows 10) and their
layout/interface. I understand it brings things more in line with
smartphones and cross-platform is good. But I'm on a desktop; I want it to
behave like a desktop, damit.



-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Randy Barnett
Sent: October 25, 2017 6:19 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

Yeah, I have been using jaws since the mid 90's and see the same issues you
do with the modern approach to Windows and other software. This is a hard
time to be a blind PC user. Hearing about how cool this or that is on the
web and how everyone can find out anything and everything while I struggle
with a captcha or have jaws drowned out by a video ad or try to find some
news on a site that is constantly updating and has inaccessible links buried
in a ton of java or flash  sucks.
On 10/25/2017 2:57 PM, JM Casey wrote:
> So..
>
> Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
> another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot 
> seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could 
> cross-post it. In
> brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means 
> it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play 
> nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the 
> same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that 
> it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and from what 
> I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the virtual 
> buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as I use 
> Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til now. I 
> also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web browsing and 
> would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative was developed.
>
>   
>
> Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in 
> quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") 
> who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep 
> up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using 
> Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 
> and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that 
> wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround 
> to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't 
> be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.
>
>   
>
> Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the 
> ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security 
> updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be
doing that, then!
>
>   
>
>   
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


--
Sincerely: Randy Barnett (Owner)
Soundtique
Grants Pass, Oregon.


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread JM Casey 
Hello, humberto.

That was a very nice post; cheers. I do understand the cyclical, or, as you
say, balance, you are speaking of. I wasn't using JAWS in 1989 because at
that time I was a youngster, and had an Apple 2 E computer. I do remember
getting my first MSDOS computer, a Toshiba laptop with a Navigator serial
braille display. I loved that thing, but by then Windows 3.1 was already the
up and coming thing and more and more I got the "this program requires
Microsoft Windows" message, and yes, that was an equally frustrating
experience. My first uses of the Internet were via telnet and a Linux shell.
I have not heard of Webie until now, but I sure remember Links, the
text-based web browser that I used through the shell. If that thing works in
windows 7, it should probably function on my Win 10 machine; maybe I will
give it a try. I wonder how good the security is though. And of course,
there's still Chrome, which I have and may as well get used to using. It's
probably going to become the nicest mainstream browser for JAWS users in a
short time. So yes, it's not all doom and gloom. Thanks for the positive
outlook.



-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Humberto Rodriguez
Sent: October 25, 2017 9:12 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

Hello young Casey:

I am more than twice your age, began using computers with IBM DOS and MS
DOS, also Pick OS, the precursor of SQL, began using JAWS in 1989 with its
DOS 1.0 version, when through the horrible beginning of Windows when it was
totally inaccessible to us (until version 3.1), remember when we thought a
300 BAUD modem and the IBM AT (286) were super fast, the opening of the
Internet with Windows 95 but not for us until Arkenstone shared with
Henter-Joyce the way to access the OSM and HJ came out with JFW, many
subsequent terrifying changes; it is normal to resist them and now that they
seem to proliferate as a geometric progression,  it is becoming much more
difficult to catch up.

It is an act of balance, sometimes things become more difficult for a while,
but eventually somebody figures out a solution, there are many smart people
out there.  Just think where would we be if Ted Henter had not lost his
eyesight.

Have patience, things will work out, granted, not as fast as we would like,
but they will nevertheless.

Have you heard of a text-based browser called WebIE?  It was written by Dr.
Alasdair King from England , years ago and was totally accessible, very
fast.  I have not tried it with Windows 10, but used to work with Windows 7,
so it probably works with Windows 10 as well.  You might give it a tryand
see.

He has other excellent programs, notable Accessible Potcatcher, all free.

Regards,

Humberto



-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of JM Casey
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 5:57 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On another
list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot seem to find the
URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means it
will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play nicely with
JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the same stage now (or
will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that it's going to be a work
in progress for quite some time, and from what I've read, it may be
difficult to continue implementing the virtual buffer concept. This is, to
me, annoying to say the least, as I use Firefox all the time and have been
really happy with it up til now. I also think the virutal buffer a great
innovation for web browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better
alternative was developed.

 

Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in quotes
there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") who moaned
about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep up. Now, at 37,
I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using Windows XP, yet it
seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 and JAWS 18 in particular),
there's some new thing I have to fix that wasn't broken before; some time I
have to spend figuring a workaround to one thing or another, or a doomful
press release about how I won't be able to use this-or-that once a certain
update happens.

 

Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the ESR
(Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security updates, without
a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be doing that, then!

 

 

For answers to freq

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread JM Casey 
Ah yes, thanks, that was the article th at was posted. I did a search for
various keywords in the article in google but for some reason did not come
across it (probably too new); I should have gone directly to the FS page.
The person who posted the article did not list the source.



-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Dennis Long
Sent: October 26, 2017 2:57 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

This should help.
http://blog.freedomscientific.com/2017/10/25/important-information-for-users
-of-mozilla-firefox/

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Justin Williams
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

Where do I get the ESR extended support?
Justin

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

it figures.  Every time you take 3 steps forward, they push you back 2.

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22...@gmail.com>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers


> Hi,
> And Narrator won't work with it either.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com]
> On Behalf Of cheez
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
> To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
> like screen-readers
>
> You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?
>
> Vince
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
> To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
> Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
> screen-readers
>
>
>> So..
>>
>> Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
>> another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot 
>> seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I 
>> could cross-post it. In
>> brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that 
>> means it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not 
>> play nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at 
>> the same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in 
>> that it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and 
>> from what I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the 
>> virtual buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as 
>> I use Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til 
>> now. I also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web 
>> browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative 
>> was
developed.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in 
>> quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") 
>> who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep 
>> up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using 
>> Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 
>> and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that 
>> wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround 
>> to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't 
>> be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.
>>
>>
>>
>> Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the 
>> ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security 
>> updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess 
>> I'll be doing that, then!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
>> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread Jim Pursley 

Helpful.  FSBlog a good resource.

On 10/26/2017 4:56 AM, Dennis Long wrote:

This should help.
http://blog.freedomscientific.com/2017/10/25/important-information-for-users
-of-mozilla-firefox/

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Justin Williams
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

Where do I get the ESR extended support?
Justin

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

it figures.  Every time you take 3 steps forward, they push you back 2.

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22...@gmail.com>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers



Hi,
And Narrator won't work with it either.

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com]
On Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't
like screen-readers

You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers



So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On
another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot
seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I
could cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that
means it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not
play nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at
the same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in
that it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and
from what I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the
virtual buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as
I use Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til
now. I also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web
browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative
was

developed.



Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in
quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none")
who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep
up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using
Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10
and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that
wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround
to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't
be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.



Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the
ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security
updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess
I'll be doing that, then!





For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/




--

James C. Pursley
Chief Investment Officer
Gaia Capital Management
Underpinned by sustainably growing cash dividends from quality
 companies, we seek long term client account growth

For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-26 Thread Dennis Long 
This should help.
http://blog.freedomscientific.com/2017/10/25/important-information-for-users
-of-mozilla-firefox/

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of Justin Williams
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

Where do I get the ESR extended support?
Justin

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

it figures.  Every time you take 3 steps forward, they push you back 2.

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22...@gmail.com>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers


> Hi,
> And Narrator won't work with it either.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com]
> On Behalf Of cheez
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
> To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
> like screen-readers
>
> You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?
>
> Vince
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
> To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
> Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
> screen-readers
>
>
>> So..
>>
>> Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
>> another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot 
>> seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I 
>> could cross-post it. In
>> brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that 
>> means it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not 
>> play nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at 
>> the same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in 
>> that it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and 
>> from what I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the 
>> virtual buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as 
>> I use Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til 
>> now. I also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web 
>> browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative 
>> was
developed.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in 
>> quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") 
>> who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep 
>> up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using 
>> Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 
>> and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that 
>> wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround 
>> to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't 
>> be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.
>>
>>
>>
>> Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the 
>> ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security 
>> updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess 
>> I'll be doing that, then!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
>> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread Justin Williams 
Where do I get the ESR extended support?
Justin

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 12:00 AM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

it figures.  Every time you take 3 steps forward, they push you back 2.

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22...@gmail.com>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers


> Hi,
> And Narrator won't work with it either.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] 
> On Behalf Of cheez
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
> To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
> Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't 
> like screen-readers
>
> You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?
>
> Vince
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
> To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
> Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
> screen-readers
>
>
>> So..
>>
>> Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
>> another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot 
>> seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I 
>> could cross-post it. In
>> brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that 
>> means it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not 
>> play nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at 
>> the same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in 
>> that it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and 
>> from what I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the 
>> virtual buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as 
>> I use Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til 
>> now. I also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web 
>> browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative was
developed.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in 
>> quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") 
>> who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep 
>> up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using 
>> Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 
>> and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that 
>> wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround 
>> to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't 
>> be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.
>>
>>
>>
>> Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the 
>> ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security 
>> updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess 
>> I'll be doing that, then!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
>> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread cheez 

it figures.  Every time you take 3 steps forward, they push you back 2.

Vince

- Original Message - 
From: "Joseph Lee" <joseph.lee22...@gmail.com>

To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
screen-readers




Hi,
And Narrator won't work with it either.

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers



So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On
another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot
seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could
cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means
it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play
nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the
same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that
it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and from what
I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the virtual
buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as I use
Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til now. I
also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web browsing and
would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative was developed.



Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in
quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none")
who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep
up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using
Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10
and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that
wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround
to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't
be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.



Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the
ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security
updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll
be doing that, then!





For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/



For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ 



For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread Joseph Lee 
Hi,
And Narrator won't work with it either.

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of cheez
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 8:45 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?

Vince

- Original Message -
From: "JM Casey" <crystallo...@ca.inter.net>
To: <jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers


> So..
>
> Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
> another list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot 
> seem to find the URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could 
> cross-post it. In
> brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means 
> it will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play 
> nicely with JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the 
> same stage now (or will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that 
> it's going to be a work in progress for quite some time, and from what 
> I've read, it may be difficult to continue implementing the virtual 
> buffer concept. This is, to me, annoying to say the least, as I use 
> Firefox all the time and have been really happy with it up til now. I 
> also think the virutal buffer a great innovation for web browsing and 
> would hate to give it up, unless a better alternative was developed.
>
>
>
> Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in 
> quotes there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") 
> who moaned about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep 
> up. Now, at 37, I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using 
> Windows XP, yet it seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 
> and JAWS 18 in particular), there's some new thing I have to fix that 
> wasn't broken before; some time I have to spend figuring a workaround 
> to one thing or another, or a doomful press release about how I won't 
> be able to use this-or-that once a certain update happens.
>
>
>
> Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the 
> ESR (Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security 
> updates, without a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll 
> be doing that, then!
>
>
>
>
>
> For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
> http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread cheez 

You think Windows Narrator will work, since Narrator works with Edge?

Vince

- Original Message - 
From: "JM Casey" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 2:57 PM
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like 
screen-readers




So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On 
another
list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot seem to find 
the

URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means it
will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play nicely with
JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the same stage now (or
will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that it's going to be a 
work

in progress for quite some time, and from what I've read, it may be
difficult to continue implementing the virtual buffer concept. This is, to
me, annoying to say the least, as I use Firefox all the time and have been
really happy with it up til now. I also think the virutal buffer a great
innovation for web browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better
alternative was developed.



Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in quotes
there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") who moaned
about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep up. Now, at 37,
I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using Windows XP, yet it
seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 and JAWS 18 in 
particular),
there's some new thing I have to fix that wasn't broken before; some time 
I

have to spend figuring a workaround to one thing or another, or a doomful
press release about how I won't be able to use this-or-that once a certain
update happens.



Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the ESR
(Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security updates, 
without

a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be doing that, then!





For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ 



For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit:
http://www.jaws-users.com/help/

Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread Humberto Rodriguez 
Hello young Casey:

I am more than twice your age, began using computers with IBM DOS and MS
DOS, also Pick OS, the precursor of SQL, began using JAWS in 1989 with its
DOS 1.0 version, when through the horrible beginning of Windows when it was
totally inaccessible to us (until version 3.1), remember when we thought a
300 BAUD modem and the IBM AT (286) were super fast, the opening of the
Internet with Windows 95 but not for us until Arkenstone shared with
Henter-Joyce the way to access the OSM and HJ came out with JFW, many
subsequent terrifying changes; it is normal to resist them and now that they
seem to proliferate as a geometric progression,  it is becoming much more
difficult to catch up.

It is an act of balance, sometimes things become more difficult for a while,
but eventually somebody figures out a solution, there are many smart people
out there.  Just think where would we be if Ted Henter had not lost his
eyesight.

Have patience, things will work out, granted, not as fast as we would like,
but they will nevertheless.

Have you heard of a text-based browser called WebIE?  It was written by Dr.
Alasdair King from England , years ago and was totally accessible, very
fast.  I have not tried it with Windows 10, but used to work with Windows 7,
so it probably works with Windows 10 as well.  You might give it a tryand
see.

He has other excellent programs, notable Accessible Potcatcher, all free.

Regards,

Humberto



-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of JM Casey
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 5:57 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On another
list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot seem to find the
URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means it
will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play nicely with
JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the same stage now (or
will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that it's going to be a work
in progress for quite some time, and from what I've read, it may be
difficult to continue implementing the virtual buffer concept. This is, to
me, annoying to say the least, as I use Firefox all the time and have been
really happy with it up til now. I also think the virutal buffer a great
innovation for web browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better
alternative was developed.

 

Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in quotes
there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") who moaned
about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep up. Now, at 37,
I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using Windows XP, yet it
seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 and JAWS 18 in particular),
there's some new thing I have to fix that wasn't broken before; some time I
have to spend figuring a workaround to one thing or another, or a doomful
press release about how I won't be able to use this-or-that once a certain
update happens.

 

Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the ESR
(Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security updates, without
a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be doing that, then!

 

 

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Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread ely.r 
Hi all,
Below is a link to an article appearing on Marco's Accessibility Blog in
September of this year that discusses the changes in architecture that will
impact on screen readers. A bit heavy reading but it makes it pretty clear
that we AT users are likely to find some big bumps coming our way for a
while. Love to hear interpretations and assessments from more tech minded
folks on the list. 
Rick 
https://www.marcozehe.de/

-Original Message-
From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On
Behalf Of JM Casey
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2017 5:57 PM
To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Subject: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like
screen-readers

So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On another
list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot seem to find the
URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means it
will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play nicely with
JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the same stage now (or
will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that it's going to be a work
in progress for quite some time, and from what I've read, it may be
difficult to continue implementing the virtual buffer concept. This is, to
me, annoying to say the least, as I use Firefox all the time and have been
really happy with it up til now. I also think the virutal buffer a great
innovation for web browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better
alternative was developed.

 

Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in quotes
there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") who moaned
about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep up. Now, at 37,
I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using Windows XP, yet it
seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 and JAWS 18 in particular),
there's some new thing I have to fix that wasn't broken before; some time I
have to spend figuring a workaround to one thing or another, or a doomful
press release about how I won't be able to use this-or-that once a certain
update happens.

 

Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the ESR
(Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security updates, without
a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be doing that, then!

 

 

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http://www.jaws-users.com/help/


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Re: [JAWS-Users] Firefox Quantum is coming, and it doesn't like screen-readers

2017-10-25 Thread Randy Barnett 
Yeah, I have been using jaws since the mid 90's and see the same issues 
you do with the modern approach to Windows and other software. This is a 
hard time to be a blind PC user. Hearing about how cool this or that is 
on the web and how everyone can find out anything and everything while I 
struggle with a captcha or have jaws drowned out by a video ad or try to 
find some news on a site that is constantly updating and has 
inaccessible links buried in a ton of java or flash  sucks.

On 10/25/2017 2:57 PM, JM Casey wrote:

So..

Has anyone Hey folks. Haven't seen any discussion about this yet. On another
list, someone posted an article about this, which I cannot seem to find the
URL for, but if people are interested I guess I could cross-post it. In
brief: Firefox Quantum has a new "multiprocessing" approach that means it
will be twice as fast for everyone else, but it will not play nicely with
JAWS or other screen-readers. We're essentially at the same stage now (or
will be come November) as we are with Edge, in that it's going to be a work
in progress for quite some time, and from what I've read, it may be
difficult to continue implementing the virtual buffer concept. This is, to
me, annoying to say the least, as I use Firefox all the time and have been
really happy with it up til now. I also think the virutal buffer a great
innovation for web browsing and would hate to give it up, unless a better
alternative was developed.

  


Has anyone thoughts on this? I used to laugh at "old people" (in quotes
there, in case you have punctuation set to "some" or "none") who moaned
about things changing too fast and that they couldn't keep up. Now, at 37,
I'm feeling the bite. I'm happy to no longer be using Windows XP, yet it
seems like every month (since getting Windows 10 and JAWS 18 in particular),
there's some new thing I have to fix that wasn't broken before; some time I
have to spend figuring a workaround to one thing or another, or a doomful
press release about how I won't be able to use this-or-that once a certain
update happens.

  


Fortunately, for us Firefox users, I guess we can still install the ESR
(Extended Support Release) of the browser, and get security updates, without
a Quantum upgrade, until sometime in 2018. Guess I'll be doing that, then!

  

  


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http://www.jaws-users.com/help/



--
Sincerely: Randy Barnett (Owner)
Soundtique
Grants Pass, Oregon.


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