[lace] lawyers
Devon Your suggestion of a gaggle (delegation) of Indian lawyers descending on Ruth Bean absolutely tickles my funny bone. Maybe Ruth Bean will crumple with enough pestering (especially creative pestering). Lorelei - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] fan book
I got my Edward Hamilton catalog in the mail today and noticed they have Ann Collier's Lace Fans book for $17.95 instead of $26.95. I paid full price for this book and it is worth having if only for the eye candy. Check the web page. Janice http://www.hamiltonbook.com/Discount_Books/Catalog/Lacemaking_LAC.html -- Janice Blair Crystal Lake, 50 miles northwest of Chicago, Illinois, USA A mistake is simply another way of doing things. Katherine Graham - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
As, I understand it, the principle behind copyright law is to encourage creativity by ensuring that those who invest effort in a pattern or other intellectual property may profit from it. Publishers who take the risk in publishing the work are also deserving of the right to profit. I believe whole heartedly in this principle. I pay top dollar for lace books with the hope that the publisher will continue to print them and the creator will continue to create them. It breaks my heart when I hear a gifted lace person regret ever having spent the time writing a book, and this happens quite often. I get a little confused though when the fact pattern gets as convoluted and distorted as the Channer Mat problem. Ruth Bean constantly asserts that there is no profit to be made from this pattern. I have no doubt they are correct. It is rare that you hear that anyone has made any money publishing a lace book. The market is extremely small. They already published it once, thus saturating the market. It is entirely doubtful that they would ever publish it again. I am not sure what the minimum print run is that can be profitable. I am sure it is not 100. It is probably not 1000. If Ruth Bean keeps a list of everyone who wants the pattern with the idea of publishing when it gets to 1000, I think that it will take 20 years and the people who put their names on the list first will be dead, so there will still not be a thousand people who want the pattern even then. There are roughly 7,000 lacemakers in the English speaking world. Probably 500 have the pattern. Probably 6,400 don't want it. I don't blame Ruth Bean for not wanting to take a financial bath by republishing Channer's Mat. So, if there is no profit in the pattern, hypothetically, copying it doesn't sound like it is hurting them. If you were, hypothetically, to say the profit on each pattern was $10 and they suffer a $10 loss if you photocopy the pattern, they could sue you for $10 according to Tom. I even asked them if they would allow people to photocopy the pattern and send them the amount that they would consider the profit, ie. $10 and they said no. It is too much trouble for them to accept the individual $10 sums. This is entirely understandable. Maybe someone should offer to handle the paper work of clearing the checks from "honor payments" so they could receive it in a yearly lump sum which would be cheaper for them to process. Meanwhile, of course, the pattern is selling on e-bay and the second hand market. When these sell the dealers profit, extraordinarily. No money is kicked back to Ruth Bean or Channer, or Bury. Theoretically people could sell one copy to each other, copy for their own use, sell to another. Personally, I would rather see the creators or the publishers profit in order to encourage creativity and the publication of more lace patterns. I appreciate the role that used book sellers play and that they work quite hard. However, it would make more sense in terms of accomplishing the goals of the copyright law to photocopy the pattern and use the $70 you would pay on e-bay for the pattern to take the president of Ruth Bean, Bury and the Channer heirs out to dinner as a special thank you for creating and publishing it originally. Morally, I find the whole thing quite confusing. Mind you, I don't even want a copy. My skills aren't up to it and I don't think it is all that pretty. Devon - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re: lace-digest V1 #3750
On Wednesday, August 27, 2003, at 08:39 PM, Jane wrote: I was very sorry to hear about Doreen Wright - and a little surprised that there has been no more comment about her. I never knew her, except as the founding chairman of the Lace Guild (and I was only a teenager at the time so not very interested in such things). But does no one else on the list remember her? and is prepared to share an anecdote? I was always told that she was "quite a character"! She was a lovely old lady - blunt and down to earth, but very capable and was enormously valuable to the lace world. She will be missed. I did respond to David Leader's request for a photo for the Lace Guild website, but the one I have isn't good enough to scan at low-res. The first time I met her she threw a table at me!!! Well not quite - it was 1982, I was one of the helpers at the lace day she was speaking at, the hall was packed an there weren't any chairs left so I sat on a cushion on the floor at the front. Doreen was speaking quite passionately and banged her hand down on the little table she had for her notes or whatever and it went flying - in my direction! ( I ducked quick enough though). A couple of years later I was organizing a small exhibition/demo at a craft fair and had the privilege of going to her home to collect some Lace Guild display boards (pre Hollies era). It was Good Friday and we had a long lacy chat over hot cross buns. I remember she showed me a lampshade with BL on which she had designed and made, and at the time I thought that was very modern and "with-it". She also had me rummaging through boxes upstairs looking for the Guild's table covers. I learned later that I'd only narrowly missed being put into a swimsuit and thrown into her pool which was cleaned and filled ready for the summer the following week. Fond memories Brenda http://users.argonet.co.uk/users/paternoster/ Supporting the [EMAIL PROTECTED] campaign - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Re: Lace Frog
Maybe Torchon was the only lace the "teacher" knew how to make? Ann in Manchester, UK - Original Message - From: "Elizabeth Ligeti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:41 AM Subject: [lace] Re: Lace Frog "They had only been making lace for 4 years, and were still on narrow, simple torchon patterns, and their teacher would not let them try anything else yet!!!" - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] York and bobbins
I have just managed to catch up with the lists again - it seems stop go, stop go all the time this summer. I have been very busy researching the history of Smocks and Smocking as I am to give the lecture for the Textile Society on the Saturday evening after our Convention dinner. The venue this year is YORK, so I will go and see if I can find the bobbin-shop at the address in the Shambles, that is if it is still there and I will look at and appraise any bobbins, if there are any! We are staying at the University and have a visit planned to the reserve collection at the Museum. I am told there will be smocks, but also hope I may see some lace. During the earlier part of the summer I sorted my Leavers Machine lace drawer, thoroughly, and have labelled all the different types and put some pieces in nice new museum-type see-through bags. Heaven knows when all the other lace-drawers will get re-sorted. They are all getting rather full. Angela Thompson, Worcestershire UK [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Braid lace pictures
Some people have had difficulties to find the link to the page, so here it is: http://www.geocities.com/carolgallego/encajebrujo.html Regards. -- Carolina. Barcelona. Spain. http://www.geocities.com/carolgallego - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
Hi everyone - visions of a Commonwealth (post-colonial) team of lawyers vs. publishers knee-deep in historical records, and lacemakers in the peanut gallery - you guy/s and gals are cracking me up :))) While photocopying for resale is a no-no we do photocopy for personal use - and I will photocopy a pattern I have purchased likewise, in case I want to make it again. This is the 'fair use' clause in most jurisdictions. I have a photocopy of a photocopy of the pricking of Miss Channer's mat. If a copy of the original had been available to me at the time, I would have bought it. It wasn't, and I was interested in the pricking more for reference, than to make it. If I ever thought I'd make the mat, I would try to find the original pricking - if that couldn't be found, I would redraft the pricking from my reference material. Then I would make the mat. Only one, Tom. I would probably throw out the pricking, because I would now have the mat for reference. Trying to control the sale/dispersal of lace patterns is sticky. I prefer to make my original designs available through lace magazines, for the price of buying the magazine. If I get a bobbin or a copy of the magazine for my pains, that is payment enough. The potential that my pattern will be used and shared by many lacemakers is incentive to keep designing. bye for now Bev in Sooke, BC (west coast of Canada) with no intention in the near future of attempting anything as ambitious as Miss Channer's mat ;) - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/jurisdictional issues
For those of you who are interested, a summary of UK copyright law can be found at: http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/copyright/law(01).htm There are also conventions that give UK copyright protection in most countries. Karen, In Coventry - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer's mat
I'm not suggesting producing a line of clothing for sale or otherwise. Just that, for example, if you buy a pattern for a wedding dress for your daughter, and make it, you are free to take as many pictures of it as you like, and then do whatever you wish with the dress after the wedding. The same applies to anything else you make from a commercial pattern. The company that sells the pattern doesn't own the item you make. If someone makes an identical dress from another bought copy of the pattern, they can do what they like with that one. The company that produces the pattern owns the design, not the item made from it. You buy a license to make the item when you buy the pattern. If you were producing commercially, you'd have your own pattern designers and cutters. I just saw an example of this on TV this evening when copies of dresses for our BAFTA awards (a bit like the Oscars) were being made for commercial sale. There were changes made to the original designs partly to make them saleable to the public, and partly for reasons of infringement of copyright. Jean in Poole - Original Message - From: "Clay Blackwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Jean Nathan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Lace" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 10:38 PM Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer's mat > U. I think I disagree with you on this, Jean. I > believe that if we buy a pattern, we are allowed to make it > for our own use, but not for any commercial endeavor. We > could make a dress for ourselves from a pattern, for > example, but we could not produce a line of clothing for > sale based on that pattern (as if...! ) > > Clay > > - Original Message - > From: "Jean Nathan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Lace" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 5:21 PM > Subject: [lace] Miss Channer's mat > > > > I think that what Ruth Bean owns is the 'right' to > reproduce 'copies' of the > > original pricking ie 'copyright', and any part of the > book, including the > > photograph which accompanied it. But only until 2019 which > will be 70 years > > after Catherine Channer's death. Then it will be out of > copyright and anyone > > should be able to make copies of the original pricking. > > > > They certainly don't own any mat that's made from the > pricking, and anyone > > who makes or owns a mat can do anything with it that they > want including > > reproducing pictures of the one they have made/own. Just > the same as if you > > buy a dress or knitting pattern and make the garment, the > company producing > > the pattern, doesn't own the garment you made and you can > do with it what > > you will. > > > > Jean in Poole > > > > - > > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > containing the line: > > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer's mat
U. I think I disagree with you on this, Jean. I believe that if we buy a pattern, we are allowed to make it for our own use, but not for any commercial endeavor. We could make a dress for ourselves from a pattern, for example, but we could not produce a line of clothing for sale based on that pattern (as if...! ) Clay - Original Message - From: "Jean Nathan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Lace" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 5:21 PM Subject: [lace] Miss Channer's mat > I think that what Ruth Bean owns is the 'right' to reproduce 'copies' of the > original pricking ie 'copyright', and any part of the book, including the > photograph which accompanied it. But only until 2019 which will be 70 years > after Catherine Channer's death. Then it will be out of copyright and anyone > should be able to make copies of the original pricking. > > They certainly don't own any mat that's made from the pricking, and anyone > who makes or owns a mat can do anything with it that they want including > reproducing pictures of the one they have made/own. Just the same as if you > buy a dress or knitting pattern and make the garment, the company producing > the pattern, doesn't own the garment you made and you can do with it what > you will. > > Jean in Poole > > - > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
Tom ! You're so funny ! Leave out the hard parts! Sigh... Guess I can't do it then. Seriously, how on earth does one measure a percentage of an artistic design? That just mystifies me. Clay - Original Message - From: "palmhaven" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Clay Blackwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 5:11 PM Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > Although not hard and fast. The cases I have read would indicate that a > Fifteen percent (15%) change would be a "new" design. I'd go Twenty percent > (20%) to be sure. How you measure that is a jury question. I might > suggest you leave out the hard parts. > > Tom > > > > - Original Message - > From: "Clay Blackwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 3:59 PM > Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > > > > Hi Tom, and Devon, and other lacemakers! > > > > To take this question in a slightly different direction, how > > much would the original design have to be changed in order > > to call it an original design? If a creative lacemaker used > > the mat as "inspiration" and made a design that looked a > > great deal like the mat - but was not an exact duplication - > > would that be a violation of copyright? > > > > Clay > > > > - Original Message - > > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:34 PM > > Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > > > > > > > So, Tom, if someone were, hypothetically speaking, not > > that I am advocating > > > it, to very quietly and in a non-public place, photocopy > > the pattern and give > > > it to her friend, how would the damages be reckoned? Ruth > > Bean repeatedly goes > > > on record as saying that it is not worth reprinting. > > However, they did respond > > > with a reminder that they own the copyright at one point > > when someone offered > > > on-line to photocopy it for another person. > > > I don't think anyone is actually proposing to run off as > > many as a hundred > > > copies, and if they did, they would lose their shirts on > > the enterprise, much as > > > Ruth Bean, apparently would if they did it. It is the > > person who reproduces > > > the pattern that suffers economic loss in this scenario, > > so how do you > > > calculate damages? It would be an interesting question for > > a law school exam. > > > It seems to me that every year Ruth Bean is deluged with > > e-mails from people > > > pleading to have them reprint this pattern. This kind of > > annoyance is probably > > > unknown for "The Idiot's Guide to Safe Cracking", for > > instance, but the > > > lacemakers are a fanatically law abiding group. > > > Devon > > > who never advocates law-breaking. > > > > > > - > > > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > containing the line: > > > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > - > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Miss Channer's mat
I think that what Ruth Bean owns is the 'right' to reproduce 'copies' of the original pricking ie 'copyright', and any part of the book, including the photograph which accompanied it. But only until 2019 which will be 70 years after Catherine Channer's death. Then it will be out of copyright and anyone should be able to make copies of the original pricking. They certainly don't own any mat that's made from the pricking, and anyone who makes or owns a mat can do anything with it that they want including reproducing pictures of the one they have made/own. Just the same as if you buy a dress or knitting pattern and make the garment, the company producing the pattern, doesn't own the garment you made and you can do with it what you will. Jean in Poole - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
Although not hard and fast. The cases I have read would indicate that a Fifteen percent (15%) change would be a "new" design. I'd go Twenty percent (20%) to be sure. How you measure that is a jury question. I might suggest you leave out the hard parts. Tom - Original Message - From: "Clay Blackwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 3:59 PM Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > Hi Tom, and Devon, and other lacemakers! > > To take this question in a slightly different direction, how > much would the original design have to be changed in order > to call it an original design? If a creative lacemaker used > the mat as "inspiration" and made a design that looked a > great deal like the mat - but was not an exact duplication - > would that be a violation of copyright? > > Clay > > - Original Message - > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:34 PM > Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > > > > So, Tom, if someone were, hypothetically speaking, not > that I am advocating > > it, to very quietly and in a non-public place, photocopy > the pattern and give > > it to her friend, how would the damages be reckoned? Ruth > Bean repeatedly goes > > on record as saying that it is not worth reprinting. > However, they did respond > > with a reminder that they own the copyright at one point > when someone offered > > on-line to photocopy it for another person. > > I don't think anyone is actually proposing to run off as > many as a hundred > > copies, and if they did, they would lose their shirts on > the enterprise, much as > > Ruth Bean, apparently would if they did it. It is the > person who reproduces > > the pattern that suffers economic loss in this scenario, > so how do you > > calculate damages? It would be an interesting question for > a law school exam. > > It seems to me that every year Ruth Bean is deluged with > e-mails from people > > pleading to have them reprint this pattern. This kind of > annoyance is probably > > unknown for "The Idiot's Guide to Safe Cracking", for > instance, but the > > lacemakers are a fanatically law abiding group. > > Devon > > who never advocates law-breaking. > > > > - > > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > containing the line: > > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
If perchance, a hypothetical lacer made a copy of Miss Channer's Mat and "gave" it to a friend, and if Ruth Bean had someway of knowing about such a private transaction, and if she could find a lawyer to take the case; she would be entitled to the "profit" she would have made had she sold the recipient lacer the pricking. Hardly worth going after, is it? Now, maybe some of our British friends could enlighten me on British copyright law, but in the States a copyright is only good for fifty years after the death of person who copyrighted it. Now as memory serves me, copyrights were recently brought up in Congress and extended in order to put money in the coffers of Walt Disney, Inc. whose copyrights on his troop of characters were about to expire. I wonder if under British copyright law the copyright on a hundred plus year old mat has not expired. Besides, I wouldn't want one. I would need at least eight for a complete place setting. Anyone game? Tom Andrews - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 3:34 PM Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > So, Tom, if someone were, hypothetically speaking, not that I am advocating > it, to very quietly and in a non-public place, photocopy the pattern and give > it to her friend, how would the damages be reckoned? Ruth Bean repeatedly goes > on record as saying that it is not worth reprinting. However, they did respond > with a reminder that they own the copyright at one point when someone offered > on-line to photocopy it for another person. > I don't think anyone is actually proposing to run off as many as a hundred > copies, and if they did, they would lose their shirts on the enterprise, much as > Ruth Bean, apparently would if they did it. It is the person who reproduces > the pattern that suffers economic loss in this scenario, so how do you > calculate damages? It would be an interesting question for a law school exam. > It seems to me that every year Ruth Bean is deluged with e-mails from people > pleading to have them reprint this pattern. This kind of annoyance is probably > unknown for "The Idiot's Guide to Safe Cracking", for instance, but the > lacemakers are a fanatically law abiding group. > Devon > who never advocates law-breaking. > > - > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
If perchance, a hypothetical lacer made a copy of Miss Channer's Mat and "gave" it to a friend, and if Ruth Bean had someway of knowing about such a private transaction, and if she could find a lawyer to take the case; she would be entitled to the "profit" she would have made had she sold the recipient lacer the pricking. Hardly worth going after, is it? Now, maybe some of our British friends could enlighten me on British copyright law, but in the States a copyright is only good for fifty years after the death of person who copyrighted it. Now as memory serves me, copyrights were recently brought up in Congress and extended in order to put money in the coffers of Walt Disney, Inc. whose copyrights on his troop of characters were about to expire. I wonder if under British copyright law the copyright on a hundred plus year old mat has not expired. Besides, I wouldn't want one. I would need at least eight for a complete place setting. Anyone game? Tom Andrews - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 3:34 PM Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues So, Tom, if someone were, hypothetically speaking, not that I am advocating it, to very quietly and in a non-public place, photocopy the pattern and give it to her friend, how would the damages be reckoned? Ruth Bean repeatedly goes on record as saying that it is not worth reprinting. However, they did respond with a reminder that they own the copyright at one point when someone offered on-line to photocopy it for another person. I don't think anyone is actually proposing to run off as many as a hundred copies, and if they did, they would lose their shirts on the enterprise, much as Ruth Bean, apparently would if they did it. It is the person who reproduces the pattern that suffers economic loss in this scenario, so how do you calculate damages? It would be an interesting question for a law school exam. It seems to me that every year Ruth Bean is deluged with e-mails from people pleading to have them reprint this pattern. This kind of annoyance is probably unknown for "The Idiot's Guide to Safe Cracking", for instance, but the lacemakers are a fanatically law abiding group. Devon who never advocates law-breaking. - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/jurisdictional issues
So are you advocating stealing the design on the idea that it would cost too much to stop you? If so shame on you. Where are the morals of all this? Most of the lace ladies I meet are moral people, it is just the shameful handful. KEEP LACING, VIVIENNE, BIGGINS - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
The mat would have to be changed considerably so if you can manage that and keep the "essence" why not design one any way? KEEP LACING, VIVIENNE, BIGGINS - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
Any thoughts of "stealing" copies of the mat are dreadful. However annoying it may be not being able to get a copy even copying and giving it to your friend is illegal. Okay perhaps I feel really strongly about it because Biggins design and produce patterns which are blatantly copied but it is not morally right. KEEP LACING, VIVIENNE, BIGGINS - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
Hi Tom, and Devon, and other lacemakers! To take this question in a slightly different direction, how much would the original design have to be changed in order to call it an original design? If a creative lacemaker used the mat as "inspiration" and made a design that looked a great deal like the mat - but was not an exact duplication - would that be a violation of copyright? Clay - Original Message - From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 4:34 PM Subject: Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues > So, Tom, if someone were, hypothetically speaking, not that I am advocating > it, to very quietly and in a non-public place, photocopy the pattern and give > it to her friend, how would the damages be reckoned? Ruth Bean repeatedly goes > on record as saying that it is not worth reprinting. However, they did respond > with a reminder that they own the copyright at one point when someone offered > on-line to photocopy it for another person. > I don't think anyone is actually proposing to run off as many as a hundred > copies, and if they did, they would lose their shirts on the enterprise, much as > Ruth Bean, apparently would if they did it. It is the person who reproduces > the pattern that suffers economic loss in this scenario, so how do you > calculate damages? It would be an interesting question for a law school exam. > It seems to me that every year Ruth Bean is deluged with e-mails from people > pleading to have them reprint this pattern. This kind of annoyance is probably > unknown for "The Idiot's Guide to Safe Cracking", for instance, but the > lacemakers are a fanatically law abiding group. > Devon > who never advocates law-breaking. > > - > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Crochet curtain
Dear Miriam - How very sad that the curtain has been so badly treated. You did not say how you have tried to pull the stitches in the right direction... First, I think I'd soak the curtain in water. Then, I'd block it on a frame. You may have to do this in stages, making it a little bigger each time. The best way to do this is with a frame made specifically for blocking lace curtains and tablecloths. I don't think they make them any more, and you may have a challenge just finding one to borrow. If you can't find one, make one. Cut two 2.5 X 5cm boards a little longer than your curtain need to be when it is the right size again. Cut two more a little longer than the width of your curtain. Use a drill to drill holes through which you can insert a bolt and wingnut in each corner. The first stage corners will be just an inch or so bigger than the curtain is presently. After your frame is tightened so that it has 90 degree corners, you will start attaching the curtain. The old-fashioned frames used nails or heavy pins which were inserted into pre-drilled holes. (Some of the frames simply had combs of teeth over which the lace was placed...) With your frame, you'll probably want to use push-pins which come from stationery supply stores and have a bit of a top to grip. Start in the middle of one side of the curtain. Pin it in place and then go to the opposite side of the curtain and pin again. Then go to the top and then the bottom. After that, work away from the middle pins, always putting an opposing pin on the other side. This is just the same concept as stretching canvas over a stretcher before painting a picture - except that you don't yank quite so hard!! If the curtain begins to feel like it's drying out before you're finished, spray it with water to keep it damp. Once the curtain is completely stretched, let it dry completely. If you're not happy with the results, repeat the process, stretching a little further or spacing your pins a little differently. It's possible that you have some particular motifs in the main body of the curtain that don't respond to the edge treatment. In that case, you may want to start with these motifs and get them in the proper shape before working on the entire curtain from the edges. I think your curtain can be salvaged... but it may take a lot of work! Sounds like it's worth it! Clay - Original Message - From: "Miriam Gidron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 2:05 PM Subject: [lace] Crochet curtain > Dear Spider, > > I'm in need of ideas. > > I have a crochet curtain, which I have made in my living room. It is about > 70 cm wide and 150 cms long. After the fire, the people who cleaned the > house just took the curtain off the rod and sent it to the cleaners. (I was > in the States at the time, remember?) Well it came back all distorted. It > shrunk in odd ways. The long sides of the curtain got wavy and it looks > horrible. I tried to add several rows to the length and to pull it in the > correct direction but to no avail. The odd shape stays there. > > Any idea how I can save my curtain? It took me years to make it and I > definitely won't make another one. It has a lovely design of a weeping > willow and at night against the dark background it is beautiful. Only my > heart aches when I look at it. > > Miriam > in Israel > > - > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/enforcement issues
So, Tom, if someone were, hypothetically speaking, not that I am advocating it, to very quietly and in a non-public place, photocopy the pattern and give it to her friend, how would the damages be reckoned? Ruth Bean repeatedly goes on record as saying that it is not worth reprinting. However, they did respond with a reminder that they own the copyright at one point when someone offered on-line to photocopy it for another person. I don't think anyone is actually proposing to run off as many as a hundred copies, and if they did, they would lose their shirts on the enterprise, much as Ruth Bean, apparently would if they did it. It is the person who reproduces the pattern that suffers economic loss in this scenario, so how do you calculate damages? It would be an interesting question for a law school exam. It seems to me that every year Ruth Bean is deluged with e-mails from people pleading to have them reprint this pattern. This kind of annoyance is probably unknown for "The Idiot's Guide to Safe Cracking", for instance, but the lacemakers are a fanatically law abiding group. Devon who never advocates law-breaking. - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [lace] Doreen Wright
I started making lace in the late 1978 in New Jersey USA. At that time we had no teacher. Nancy Carnegie had Pamela Nottingham's book and somehow I managed to get a copy of Doreen Wright's book. We did the best we could for a few years until we found a teacher, but that is another story. Doreen Wright came to New York for the IOLI convention in 1979. It was only 3-4 days and I left my DH and babies at home, stayed with friends in the city and went. Boy! Did I learn a lot! I remember going to the Cooper-Hewitt and "following" Kathe Kliot around and getting really good info about what we were seeing. We also had a trip to the Metropolitan Museum and saw some lovely laces that were put on display for us.(Those of you who went to the IOLI convention this year -Sound familiar?) Anyway, I had a Mini-workshop (a few hours only) with Doreen Wright. I have no idea what it was but she did a harangue about how I was doing it wrong, not enough time to help me, why was I there It didn't faze me at all. I was just happy to attend and obviously, it has not affected my lacemaking since I am still making lace almost 25 years later!... and loving it! This might not have been the eulogy expected but I still have fond memories of that convention including Doreen Wright. Lee Daly Jane wrote: I never knew her, except as the founding chairman of the Lace Guild (and I was only a teenager at the time so not very interested in such things). But does no one else on the list remember her? and is prepared to share an anecdote? I was always told that she was "quite a character"! Jane Southampton, UK - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer/jurisdictional issues
Sorry to intrude, Ladies, but as an attorney, I would like to remind you that law is nothing unless it can be enforced. Enforcement through the courts is a very expensive proposition. Copyright litigation can easily go into the tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars. So if the infraction is not costing enough to warrant the enforcement the matter is non Justiciable on an economic basis. As to collecting attorney's fees and costs from the one committing the infraction? You cannot get blood from a turnip, and I don't know too many well heeled lace makers. I hope that puts a different face on the question. Tom Andrews - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Miss Channer/jurisdictional issues
I am no copyright expert. But I think there are a number of issues here, first and foremost, what does Ruth Bean actually own? Do they own Patricia Bury's work or do they own Miss Channer's work or both? At one point we heard that the jurisdictional issue lies, at least by American law, in the place where the item is now. So, if there is a version of this in America, can we apply American law, and does that help matters or hurt them? What about the person who bought the mat on e-bay. Can she reproduce a picture of her mat? Can she reproduce it actual size? Are we absolutely sure that British law applies? Could Miss Channer have designed the mat in India? She spent many years in Kalimpoong, I believe, for all we know, her most productive ones. I propose we send a delegation of Indian lawyers to call on Ruth Bean and discuss jurisdictional issues and the fascinating subject of Indian copyright law and how it has developed in the post-colonial sub-continent. I think this will finally bring them to their knees :) Devon - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Crochet curtain
Dear Spider, I'm in need of ideas. I have a crochet curtain, which I have made in my living room. It is about 70 cm wide and 150 cms long. After the fire, the people who cleaned the house just took the curtain off the rod and sent it to the cleaners. (I was in the States at the time, remember?) Well it came back all distorted. It shrunk in odd ways. The long sides of the curtain got wavy and it looks horrible. I tried to add several rows to the length and to pull it in the correct direction but to no avail. The odd shape stays there. Any idea how I can save my curtain? It took me years to make it and I definitely won't make another one. It has a lovely design of a weeping willow and at night against the dark background it is beautiful. Only my heart aches when I look at it. Miriam in Israel - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re Miss Channer
Miss Channer died in March 1949. A picture of the lace does not appear in her little book 'Lace-making in the Midlands' published in 1900 but does appear in 'Practical Lacemaking' published in 1928, there is not a pricking in either. Interestingly in my first edition 'Practical Lacemaking' the name of Dryad appears in the corner of the picture of the mat. The note in the book by Anne Buck regarding the mat, designed by Miss Channer and made by Mrs Dixon of Clapham, Beds, gives acknowledgement to the Cecil Higgins Art Gallery, Bedford. Patricia Bury adapted the original pricking and made the lace sample. Diana in Northamptonshire - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer's mat
On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 12:08:46 -0400, Marcie wrote: >I remember the discussion too, but I can't remember what was said. What >we need to know is when the pricking was first made and if it is early >enough, that is sufficient. Otherwise we need to know when Miss Channer >died. Before a certain date (around about 1900, I think), the point at >which the original was created is used, after that date the death of the >author is used as the starting point for counting the years till it is >in the public domain. Miss Channer's relatives probably hold the >copyright to her pricking and any attending materials she herself made >and Ruth Bean may only have a copyright on their printed form of the >material (it would be interesting to find out if they were even the >original printers of the book.) Miss Channer was British, she did the design in Britain and Ruth Bean is also in Britain, so the relevant copyright law is British law. To be out of copyright in Britain the author has to have been dead for over 70 years i.e. to have died by 1933. I have a vague recollection that Miss Channer has been discussed here before, and that she was alive a lot later than that. So the copyright would still be current. From whom and how the copyright ended up with Ruth Bean makes no difference to whether the copyright still exists. In Britain, so far as I know the rules about date of creation of the original are only relevant for something published by a company, or something published without an author's name attached to it. Neither of those would apply in this case. -- Love is the most subtle form of self-interest. - Holbrook Jackson Steph Peters, Manchester, England [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
re: [lace] Lace magazine international
Hi everyone LMI does not publish currently, but the back issues are available as you can see at their website. I am most impressed with the photo reproduction of the laces in this magazine. Otherwise, the articles are uneven. The back issues are not expensive though, and probably worth the gamble even if you can't see a copy beforehand. Consider them another resource, along with other books or articles - for instance on Jesurum lace. bye for now Bev in Sooke BC (west coast of Canada) - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] 5 metres of lace
Hi everyone I have contacted Sofie - she had written to us at the Gazette in French, which sent us scrambling for our 'dictionnaire' -- bye for now Bev in Sooke, BC (west coast of Canada) Canadian Lacemaker Gazette http://www.lacegazette.com - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [lace] Miss Channer's mat
I remember the discussion too, but I can't remember what was said. What we need to know is when the pricking was first made and if it is early enough, that is sufficient. Otherwise we need to know when Miss Channer died. Before a certain date (around about 1900, I think), the point at which the original was created is used, after that date the death of the author is used as the starting point for counting the years till it is in the public domain. Miss Channer's relatives probably hold the copyright to her pricking and any attending materials she herself made and Ruth Bean may only have a copyright on their printed form of the material (it would be interesting to find out if they were even the original printers of the book.) Does someone on the list have the information from the front of the book? If you wouldn't mind re-posting, some of us can keep an archived copy of the info this time around. This question comes up about once a year. Also, aren't there are two methods for working the mat... one Beds and one Bucks? I have a vague memory of this being discussed as well. Marcie Original message: Hi, Vivienne and others, - I have a very vague recollection (and I may be wrong) that the copyright on the original Miss Channer's mat ran out, but that Ruth Bean got a copyright because there was no pattern and she got someone to draw the pattern out and make a pricking and pattern, which makes that particular pattern her copyright material. But someone else could do the same thing - get the original and make it into a pricking and a pattern, I mean. All you would have to do is draw it out and make the pricking and keep records of the process so that you could prove you didn't just copy Ruth Bean's version. - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer's mat
Hi, I have a "industrial" printer but I understand even this would not be up to it. It needs to be done professionally. I also don't agree they should sell the rights. It is their property and up to them what they do. Hi, Vivienne and others, - I have a very vague recollection (and I may be wrong) that the copyright on the original Miss Channer's mat ran out, but that Ruth Bean got a copyright because there was no pattern and she got someone to draw the pattern out and make a pricking and pattern, which makes that particular pattern her copyright material. But someone else could do the same thing - get the original and make it into a pricking and a pattern, I mean. All you would have to do is draw it out and make the pricking and keep records of the process so that you could prove you didn't just copy Ruth Bean's version. I'm throwing out this suggestion just in case somebody hasn't thought of it and wants to try ... Adele North Vancouver, BC (west coast of Canada) - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Doreen Wright
>It is with great sadness, we tell you of the death of Mrs Doreen Wright >this afternoon. I was very sorry to hear about Doreen Wright - and a little surprised that there has been no more comment about her. I never knew her, except as the founding chairman of the Lace Guild (and I was only a teenager at the time so not very interested in such things). But does no one else on the list remember her? and is prepared to share an anecdote? I was always told that she was "quite a character"! Jane Southampton, UK - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Lace Frog
In my first lace class there had been a lady who'd been making lace for several years and who ,according to the rest of the class, was very competent in several types of lace. She'd had to leave the class when she moved out of the area, and the teacher in the class she then joined made her go back to producing a bandage and said she had to work through samples of basic elements to prove she could produce work of "a satisfactory standard" before she would be allowed to work on a piece of her own choice. Naturally she only stayed a couple of weeks. On the other hand two ladies joined the class I'm currently in last September. By February neither was aware of their limitations, so they had no limitations and were thoroughly enjoying what they were doing. Jean in Poole - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Re: Lace Frog
I had a somewhat similar situation. I had been on holiday in England and had brought back some bobbins and had started teaching myself. I didn't have any fine pins or "proper" lace thread, but I was beginning to get the hang of the lace. I heard about a lace course being offered in Ottawa by a teacher from Toronto, and while I wasn't able to go for the whole weekend, I did go for a while to meet people and the teacher on the Sunday morning. The teacher (whose name I forget - blacked out for ever from my memory in disgust at her attitude) took one look at my feeble attempts and said in a very snooty voice - "Not very good, is it?" (I knew that - I didn't need it to be said, I was looking for help). "Of course", she continued, "the problem is that you are using the wrong thread. You will only produce good lace if you use linen thread." OK lady - where the heck can you go into a shop a buy linen thread. I was so disappointed in her attitude it made me determined to prove her wrong. I had made several years worth of lace before I bought my first reel of linen thread. As a side note to that situation. Most of the people on that course, and me, formed a group and got together once a month. I was still exploring different patterns, found a nice gentleman in B.C. who made bobbins, got finer thread from England and pressed on trying different patterns. Others who had been on the course were still struggling with the bookmark she had been teaching months and months later because her teaching had been to take each pupil pin to pin telling them how to do each bit and most of them didn't understand what, how or why they were doing what they were doing. Malvary - in Ottawa where we had a very heavy rainstorm last evening, but it is bright and clear for now - off to work. - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] IOLI membership
I've just received my IOLI membership card - very quickly - after sending a sterling cheque to America on the 13th of August. So it works and very easily too. I doubt I'll ever get to a convention or borrow a book or a video but I am so looking forward to the bulletins! jenny barron Scotland - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Miss Channer's mat
Hi, I have a "industrial" printer but I understand even this would not be up to it. It needs to be done professionally. I also don't agree they should sell the rights. It is their property and up to them what they do. At least it is making a lot of you excited! :-) KEEP LACING, VIVIENNE, BIGGINS - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] 5 metres of lace
Thank you every body for you answer. I had send a mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and now I send a email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] I have 5 metres of lace waiting. Sof from France with sun - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] Re: Lace Frog
I had a similar experience with a lady who moved to Sydney - she wanted to learn Bucks, and asked if I'd teach her. Of course, I agreed. Then she told me that her teacher in another part of Australia had told her that she wasn't ready yet to learn Bucks. She too had been "learning" Torchon for 8 years! I must admit though, that when I'm teaching Torchon to a real beginner, I like to just concentrate on the technical things for the first couple of months, making sure the student really knows how to work a spider, a fan, a trail etc., in a sampler before moving onto simple pieces of lace. I do it because I've found that, for most people, this enables them to become independant, thinking lacemakers very quickly. Once they're secure in the basics, I do my best to encourage them to develop as far and as quickly as they can. I have no desire to spend the rest of my life "supervising" a student's work, helping them start a piece etc. I explain my system to any prospective student and if they're not happy with that, I'll always do what I can to help them find another way of learning lacemaking. Ruth Budge (Sydney, Australia) --- Elizabeth Ligeti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I agree with you, Eva, though there may be some times when a student needs > to have done some techniques so that they can learn the new ones in class. > > I remember, back in the earlier days of the Guild, that at a Lace Day a > couple of ladies asked me how many years should they be making lace for, > before they could move on to Beds lace. "They had only been making lace for > 4 years, and were still on narrow, simple torchon patterns, and their > teacher would not let them try anything else yet!!!" > I was appalled!!! I would have given the whole thing away, if I had had to > stay on tiny torchon edges for that length of time! I think the teacher was > just feathering her own nest - not trying to advance her students - and I > told them so!!! > > Once you can make the basic lace, then try other types - you may find them > more satisfying! > > from Liz in Melbourne, Oz, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://search.yahoo.com.au - Yahoo! Search - Looking for more? Try the new Yahoo! Search - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re: Lace Frog
I agree with you, Eva, though there may be some times when a student needs to have done some techniques so that they can learn the new ones in class. I remember, back in the earlier days of the Guild, that at a Lace Day a couple of ladies asked me how many years should they be making lace for, before they could move on to Beds lace. "They had only been making lace for 4 years, and were still on narrow, simple torchon patterns, and their teacher would not let them try anything else yet!!!" I was appalled!!! I would have given the whole thing away, if I had had to stay on tiny torchon edges for that length of time! I think the teacher was just feathering her own nest - not trying to advance her students - and I told them so!!! Once you can make the basic lace, then try other types - you may find them more satisfying! from Liz in Melbourne, Oz, [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] 5 metres of lace
The 5-metre club is run by the Canadian Lace Guild. You have to be a member of that guild to be able to take part. I think I saw details on their web page, but I don't seem to have the URL. Maybe someone else will have it and let us know. All the details you want (and more ;-)) http://www.lacegazette.com/page4.html Greetings from Beautiful British Columbia Esther Perry - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [lace] 5 metres of lace
Dear Sof, The 5-metre club is run by the Canadian Lace Guild. You have to be a member of that guild to be able to take part. I think I saw details on their web page, but I don't seem to have the URL. Maybe someone else will have it and let us know. Warm regards, Ruth Budge (Sydney, Australia) --- Sof <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > How can I meet the club? > > I sended a e.mail last week and I have no answer. > > Dentellez bien > > Sof from France with sun > > > > On 4 Jul 2003, at 15:18, Bev Walker wrote: > > > Hi everyone and Kenn, who wrote: > > > > > The other news is that I have started the next 5-metre club attempt. > > > Not really certain if one can enter more then once... > > > > Of course you can! > > > > bye for now > > Bev Walker, editor Canadian Lacemaker Gazette > > http://www.lacegazette.com > > - > > - > To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: > unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://search.yahoo.com.au - Yahoo! Search - Looking for more? Try the new Yahoo! Search - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] Re: Newby needs advice
On Sunday, Aug 24, 2003, at 15:49 US/Eastern, Jurado (Angi in Ohio) wrote: I would like to learn to make bobbin lace. Can you please suggest a kit or book or supplier to start me out? I don't remember seing any answers to this one... Here are a few links to lace suppliers in the US; each will either carry a beginner kit -- usually consisting of a pillow, a set of bobbins and a book to get you started -- or else will work with you on assembling one which will best meet your needs. All of their kits are guaranteed to be of decent quality, though none is dirt-cheap. Do not, under any circumstances, be tempted to cut price corners and get yourself The Kit From Hell (sold through various *craft* venues -- clubs etc)... :) If you're not certain you'll like BL, you might want to try hooking up with someone in your area and see if there's a group which would *lend* you the necessary stuff for the first couple of months (to find people in your area, you ought to join IOLI and get their directory) In no particular order of preference: http://www.vansciverbobbinlace.com/index.html http://www.snowgoose.cc/ http://www.lacysusan.com/ http://www.lacemakerusa.com/ (that one is in Ohio; you might be able to visit in person and see things for yourself, perhaps?) Last, but not least: http://lace.lacefairy.com/ Lori (the Lacefairy) is a supplier herself but more than anything else, she keeps the most comprehesive website on all things relating to lace and lacemaking; there's hardly any info on the subject that's not stashed somewhere there :) Good hunting, and welcome to Arachne - Tamara P Duvall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Lexington, Virginia, USA Formerly of Warsaw, Poland - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[lace] DH
Dear Hubby, Darling Hubby Cheers, Helen, Aussie in Denver - To unsubscribe send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] containing the line: unsubscribe lace [EMAIL PROTECTED] For help, write to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
