Re: [LU] VAR for offside

[Guy Thornton]

Oh mighty King of Tonga, I agree with you and I did say I didn't blame the ref 
who was 'only following 
orders'.
Okay, he was following the latest interpretation of those who must be obeyed on 
on deciding what is 
and what is not offside with VAR. Whether it was Lineker and friends who helped 
get the new 
interpretation I don't know but something needs to be done to sort this out. 
I'm not against VAR, a 
contaire, but there's been some mighty silly decisions made. Forget who it was 
but I remember a 
player with his back to the one kicking the ball, arm by his side but the ball 
hit it and wham, a foul.
On offside what happened to being in an offside potion but not interfering with 
play?
guy



On 10 Nov 2020 at 17:06, Kevin Lewis (UK SBS) wrote:

I'm actually pro VAR, but just can't believe what a pigs ear the officials make 
of applying it.  Firstly they 
don't have to use the lines.  They are not used in Rugby replays to determine 
forward passes.

If they must use the lines then Offside is offside, whether by a foot or a yard 
(Or a few millimetres).  
The forward already gets the advantage that he can be level (if that is even 
possible anymore).

The idea that a player's arm can put them offside is patently ridiculous.  But 
it is not VAR's fault.
Part of the fault is with Lineker and his chums who moaned about handballs 
being given when the ball 
hit the arm.

The unintended consequence of reducing the handball to the T Shirt line as they 
call it was that a goal 
can now be scored with that part of the arm which therefore now qualifies for 
offside. Surely the arm 
should ignored for offside decisions.

It will be interesting to see what happens when a player uses the INSIDE of the 
upper arm to 
deliberately control the ball, or actually knock it into the net.  My bet is 
they will change the 
interpretation again.  Bamford and Leeds were very unlucky to be the first to 
be caught by this, but the 
law was correctly interpreted as it stands.

KOT
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Re: [LU] Alive?

[Guy Thornton]

Well some of us are around James. 
Hadn't said anything as left it those who regularly post however gritted teeth 
and all it's a fine line 
between success and failure. Sure Meslier did not have the best of games but 
that doesn't immediately 
make him bad and keepers have their failures remembered far more than 
outfielders. His performance 
Saturday just made me think of Gary Sprake. There where other failings, 
including defence which 
didn't help Meslier, but they've been there even in the good (ie winning) 
performances this season.
As said it's a fine line and there was that diabolical VAR decision. If that 
goal had been allowed and 
we'd have then taken the lead with Bamford's second it could have been a whole 
different ball game.
Something has to be done about VAR. Not blaming the ref, he was only following 
the rules but you saw 
what most people think on Match of the Day when Lineker said he'd tweeted about 
VAR decisions and 
over 70% where getting rid of it!
guy


On 10 Nov 2020 at 12:07, James A. Lundon @ Yahoo! via Leedslist wrote:

Folks,
Are we all on our knees since Saturday afternoon?
James.
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[LU] Team of the week

[Guy Thornton]

Three Leeds players - Meslier, Koch, Harrison - in Gareth Crook's Team of the 
Week:
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/54328590


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Re: [LU] Liverpool

[Guy Thornton]

Agree with both Dave and Rich. A great game, had us all on the edge of our 
seats, and super to watch. Just a 
pity about the result but neutrals must have really enjoyed it.

Some of the experts and commentators certainly need to do a bit more homework 
and brush up. As Dave said a 
distinct lack of knowledge. Match of the Day was better. Apart from lavish 
praise "we don't normally start with 
talking about the losing team first but Leeds where magnificent". Shearer was 
particularly fulsome though I 
though he was making the same mistake as Souness when he said could we keep 
this tempo up all season but 
them immediately said we did it in the championship so why not.

As Rich says was it's Liverpool's defence that wasn't, and remember how few 
they conceded last season, are 
other PL teams going to play this way? Bring on Fulham and then the Blades and 
we can get a comparison at 
different quality levels. I heard a comment about premier league football for 
quality but with League 2 defence. 
I'll wait and see how things develop but despite the loss I feel a lot happier. 
We where not outclassed and have 
shown we can hold our own.

How times have changed - remembering everything that used to be said about us 
and now the comment was 
made "Leeds are becoming everyone's favourite second team".

guy

On 13 Sep 2020 at 10:11, nattan--- via Leedslist wrote:  

 Totally agree, this was a performance that introduced us to the Premier 
league. To score 3 goals ( almost 4) all 
from open play v the best team in the country who only conceded 16 (?) at home 
last season was remarkable 
Like many pre game I just did want us to get outclassed,  by the end I was 
gutted we did not get at least one 
point All this with our captain and organiser missing
It will be the results against the lower teams, not liverpool,  man city etc 
that will define our season,  and if we 
play like that against them, starting v Fulham we will be fine.
One thing that did piss me off was the lack of knowledge from so called experts 
 - whilst they, quite rightly gave 
us lots of praise,  some comments showed total ignorance of Bielsaball.  
Souness , knob, was the worst 
offender,  asking if we had  a big squad ( we purposely do not! ) then saying 
we can't keep this high pressure 
game all season,  welll we have managed to do it for 48 and 46 games in the 
last 2 seasons so 36 will be easy ( 
whilst the results collapsed 2 seasons ago the level of intensity and 
performance did not)
Feeling much happier and more confident now than before kick off
Just gutted that we cant be there . I saw a quote today that sums it up " 
football used to be 7 hours with lots of 
mates,  now it is 90 minutes with one other person" 
Dave
   
On Sunday, 13 September 2020, 08:57:30 BST, Richard Walker via Leedslist 
 wrote:  
 
 What a day, what a game. Everything I write here should be taken in context of 
around 6 pints of Ilkley Pale Ale. 
I haven't watched the goals back and refuse to watch Lineker and co with their 
dull 'expert' opinions.
The main question for me is, was Liverpool's defence shit or was it that the 
way they play completely suited our 
play ? At times it was like watching the Arsenal defence from the 80s in the 
way they pushed up nearly to the 
half way line to play the off side trap. I haven't seen that for a while and I 
wonder if other PL teams play this way 
? Hope so. 
We started nervously and it looked like we were on for a hiding as we didn't 
appear to know how to mark them. 
Not surprising given we had a young lad making his central defensive debut and 
Koch making his debut. We 
couldn't get our game going at all but then all of a sudden we broke free and 
scored with a great goal from 
Harrison. Philips pass was good but Harrison still had to control it and beat 
his man which he appeared to do 
with one touch. Fantastic.
After that, we seemed to pass through them as if they weren't there. They 
seemed to allow us to play, we had 
loads of space and when we didn't, we made space with simple one-twos. They 
seemed bewildered. They didn't 
appear to know how to handle us which I found incredible. We could have scored 
more in that first half. 
Harrison, after scoring a blinder, then reverted to type when all he had to do 
was square the ball to an unmarked 
Bamford but hit the first man. Frustrating. Costa had a goal disallowed which 
was a very tight decision and then 
Bamford was put through and I shouted "dink it over him with your right foot' 
but in typical Bamford style he 
didn't and lost out after taking the ball wide. 10 mins later he was in exactly 
the same position. I didn't bother 
shouting at the TV cos I knew what was going to happen however, unbelievably he 
dinked the keeper with his 
right foot into the net. Great goal which reminded me that Bamford, despite his 
poor performances last season, 
is a decent player and maybe this division will suit him more than when he was 
up against the 6ft 2" hoof it 

Re: [LU] This is it then!

[Guy Thornton]

Agree with both of you Kev and Dave,

While I hope I'm going into watching today's game realistically and without any 
great expectations though I don't 
expect us to win, or even draw, I'm hoping we might get an indication of what 
to expect. To that end quite glad 
we are playing Liverpool as it's a chance to measure ourselves against (one of) 
the best, there's no great hate or 
grudge with them, and if it had been a lower team there might be to much hope.

What has surprised me is the amount of coverage we've had in all media and 
generally all positive. Considering 
the snide, put down, bitching and hate we used to have generally everyone seems 
happy to have us back. Of 
course one thing it does mean is all the other premier teams are going to be 
for it when they play is. So what's 
new? 

Yes Kev, you are right to be worried about the squad in terms of quality and 
depth but there's time and better to 
take it slowly and build up. Above all avoid doing a Fulham when the came up 
last time. I have faith in Bielsa, 
don't we all, believe he knows what he's doing and we've seen how be can get 
the best out of players.

Bring it on. My mixture of heart and head things we can do it. Top half of the 
table.

guy

On 12 Sep 2020 at 10:19, Kevin Lewis (UK SBS) wrote:

Totally agree Dave, but it would be nice to put up a good performance and not 
get a hammering.



I was at the Swansea game last season, when they stole a win.  The Derby 
play-off game was still very much on 
peoples' minds and there was a feeling even at that point that it could all 
happen again.



We had to tell ourselves it was only August and there were going to be 
setbacks.  The team and supporters will 
have to think like that many more times this season.  It may take until the 
very last game to survive and every 
point and win along the way will be precious.



KOT.









>>>I will not read anything into today's game- we are up against the team that 
>>>absolutely walked the league last 
season and has a phenomenal home record,  it will be the likes of Fulham next 
week that define our season

I hope fans have realistic expectations  - though looking at Twitter etc where 
fans expect us to qualify for 
Europe!- this may be a forlorn hope. We need to stay up, nothing more and build 
on it. We need the fans to stay 
behind the team even after any awful result.  We have waited a long time for 
this so let's enjoy it, come what 
may and "keep the faith"





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Re: [LU] Bielsa: the manager behind the myths

[Guy Thornton]

Also posted on the facebook page yesterday: 
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/54072630
Click the link in the article to listen to the documentary or download the 
podcast from the website. 
The week before is 'Leeds United: Rise, fall and rise again'. 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p08qj208, listen 
online or download the podcast

From yesterday's The Fiver: 
As Leeds prepare for their return to the top flight, Paul Wilson looks back at 
five memorable encounters for the 
club, from Arsenal in 1991 to Southampton in 1972.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/sep/10/humbling-southampton-and-an-arsenal-fa-cup-epic-five-class
ic-leeds-clashes?

guy

On 10 Sep 2020 at 22:07, Tim Whelan via Leedslist wrote:

I've just found this on the BBC website:-
Sportsworld - Bielsa: the manager behind the myths - BBC Sounds


| 
| 
| 
|  |  |

 |

 |
| 
|  | 
Sportsworld - Bielsa: the manager behind the myths - BBC Sounds

What's it really like to play for the obsessive and demanding Leeds coach 
Marcelo Bielsa?
 |

 |

 |



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[LU] The links again

[Guy Thornton]

Hopefully clickable this time
(if not copy and paste)

Here comes El Loco: Is the Premier League ready for Marcelo Biesla?
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/sep/05/here-comes-el-loco-is-the-premier-league-ready-for-marcelo-bielsa-leeds-united

Premier League preview - Leeds
https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2020/sep/04/premier-league-2020-21-preview-no-9-leeds-united

and if you ever wondered where the "Dirty Leeds" moniker came from:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/jul/17/the-fiver-dirty-leeds-premier-league-bielsa?


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Re: [LU] New Season - Very quiet

[Guy Thornton]

Agreed, questions that need to be asked Kev. 
And the comments from Alex give some food for thought.
As for being a weird season that's more like it's going to be a very weird 
world for some time with an 
'interesting' season thrown in

I to expected more postings to the list. Has email become so passée and old 
fashioned?
Have posted some articles from The Guardian and Observer to the facebook page.
In case anyone hasn't seen them:

Here comes El Loco: Is the Premier League ready for Marcelo Biesla?
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/sep/05/here-comes-el-loco-is-the-premier-league-ready-f
or-marcelo-bielsa-leeds-united

Premier League preview - Leeds
https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2020/sep/04/premier-league-2020-21-preview-no-9-leeds-
united

and if you ever wondered where the "Dirty Leeds" moniker came from:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/jul/17/the-fiver-dirty-leeds-premier-league-bielsa?

BTW Congratulations KOT - Tongo is one of the 10 countries still corona free !

guy


On 7 Sep 2020 at 21:59, John Lee via Leedslist wrote:

Good questions Kev. I 'thought' I read Leeds were taking care of Berardi with 
the view to a further 1 
year contract, but I might have imagined that?

Augustin - I hope we get out of that one, but with the lawyers I suspect?

This season - I'm optimistic we'll be competitive this season, but I am very 
worried that we're playing 
the all-conquering Liverpool in 5 days with our players all over Europe. I 
don't know how Bielsa will 
work his magic in this scenario, but really could do without a thrashing first 
game. I'm 'hoping' our 
style will catch Liverpool out, but ITMmnot exactly conident.

I did read we were in for 2 Prem players, one being the Argentinian, Foyth, but 
having heard little for 
a week I don't know if they're happening or not? 

Sent from my iPad

> On 7 Sep 2020, at 20:49, Alec McQueen  wrote:
> 
> Being a Bournemouth (as well as a Leeds) fan, I have some practice in the art 
> of not going down when you should. Here's what you need: 
> 
> 1. 10 wins. A bit obvious, but pretty much you always need 10.
> 2. A decent manager. We have one of those, so there's hope
> 3. A decent core squad. Trouble here. Not good enough yet. 
> 4. A few decent signings each year. Bournemouth struggled with this... 
> eventually the poor signings got the better of them, and down they go.
> 5. A bit of luck to avoid injuries to key players. Again, B'th suffered badly 
> on this one
> 6. A home siege mentality: we've got this in Spades, could be a trump card
> 7. A bit of luck in the early season: this can get you 2 or 3 wins quickly, 
> and this makes the season oh so much easier. Lose the first 4, and you're in 
> trouble.
> 8. A decent defence, especially a class central defender. Oops, we ain't got 
> nuffin. Our one class lad we had has gone. 
> 9. A striker who avoids injury and can bury them reliably. Another miss, 
> unless our new signing can do the biz and be a star: unknown quantity.
> 10. Beat the teams at the bottom win the 6 pointers, and you stay up. 
> B'th didn't... they went down. It's no good beating Chelsea and ManU one 
> week, and then losing to Villa and Fulham the next. We have to beat the 
> smaller teams. 
> 
> On balance, I would say we are a 17th or 18th placed squad right now. We 
> desperately need some Bielsa Magic. Without it, we are gonna struggle. 
> 
> Having said all this, I seriously hope we are top by Xmas and win the league 
> by 30 points. 
> Cheers
> Alec
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 8 Sep 2020, at 05:00, Kevin Lewis (UK SBS)  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> Very little traffic on the list.  I would have expected it to be in 
>> meltdown, or are we all still too 
stunned at the prospect of Leeds being in the Premier League
>> 
>> Anyway, before the season and list gets into full swing I've got a couple of 
>> things that have been 
on my mind for a few weeks.
>> 
>> 
>> 1.  Berardi.  What happened to him?  I realise he is out of contract and 
>> injured (sadly).  But it is 
almost like he has become a non-person.  His name does not appear on any squad 
lists on sites, but 
there has been no official announcement either.  Do Leeds pay for his treatment 
and rehabilitation, or 
do they just say 'ContractTMs Up, ByeTM.   Is he still registered as  Leeds 
player?  ITMm sure heTMs 
not on his uppers, but going 9 months or however long it takes him to get fit " 
without any pay is not a 
great reward for a player who has been a good servant for 6 ? years, and played 
his part in getting 
Leeds back to the PL.  He may not have been treted as badly as it seems to me, 
but nothing has 
come out of official or news channels.  It would not be right to give him a new 
contract because he 
got injured, nor is it right not to give him one for the same reason.
>> 2.  The Augustin situation.  This probably one for the Contract Lawyers on 
>> the list.  One of the 
things I remember from a very rudimentary level of 

[LU] Bhangra song celebrates Premier League promotion

[Guy Thornton]

Leeds' first Punjabi Song

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-53567112





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[LU] Match of Their Day: Jack Charlton + World Cup 1966: Alfie's Boys

[Guy Thornton]

Anyone who didn't catch it BBC2 last Saturday had Match of Their Day, Garth 
Crooks talking to 
Jack Charlton. From 1999 but still worth watching: 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000l9w8

And before that was World Cup 1966: Alfie's Boys with Big Jack and Norman "bite 
yer legs" and a 
lot of archive footage. https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000l9w8

Both available on iPlayer for four weeks but anyone outside the UK will need an 
VPN.

guy


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[LU] Wor Jackie

[Guy Thornton]

Great send off for Big Jack:  
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-tyne-53475667





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[LU] oor jack

[Guy Thornton]

Just been announced Jackie Charlton has died.
Another legend gone



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Re: [LU] David DRB Brennan

[Guy Thornton]

I did see your posting Betty much earlier but apart from one thing and another 
left responding till 
today as it seemed appropriate. It's a long time since I physically saw David 
but the first time we 
meet was back in the Adolphi, those when the days three o'clock Saturday 
afternoon was when all 
games kicked-off with the very rare exception, and that's where I mostly came 
across him.

Of course there was also the MOALM. Thanks for reposting the report on that 
Betty. That was the 
first we meet if I remember rightly. First time for putting a face to quite a 
few other listers as well. 
Top night, top weekend, just a pity spoilt by the footy.

David we will all miss you, we'll miss your most excellent match reports. There 
have been some 
excellent tributes and reminiscences from Gav through other (former) 
illustrious list names. Let me 
add mine and my condolences to his family, to Kate and the kids, and all who 
knew and cared for 
him. Sorry you're gone. I'm presuming it wasn't the virus on top of the other 
problems you had but 
may you rest in peace and wherever you are I hope you can still follow what's 
going on.

Now let's have a great match and good victory for DRB this afternoon.

guy


On 25 Jun 2020 at 15:46, John Boocock wrote:

Dear All,

Earlier this week we heard of the sad death of one of the earliest 
members and most loved characters from the list, David "DRB" Brennan. 
Not only was DRB a list regular in the 90s as a trawl through the 
archives held by James Lundon proved but he also wrote a lot of good stuff.

As a season ticket-holder he used to go to reserve matches at The Shay 
and (as well as Maggie Barber) post regular reports of the reserves' 
progress. He was a regular source of ticket information and became very 
friendly with Mandy in the ticket office especially when trying to find 
out what times cup matches would be played and what the ticket 
allocations would be.

DRB and his wife Kate were part of a gang that regularly met pre-match 
(he was an Adolphi regular), he was at the MOALM and he was the man 
behind the sponsored head shave at the first Euronet in 1996.

Like others on the list he was a Northern Soul boy, coming from 
Horsforth what else would he be?

One of the friendliest, funniest and kindest blokes I have had the 
pleasure to meet he will always be the example I would use of what the 
list is about.

DRB leaves behind, Kate and the two boys Sid and Bradley and we have 
been in touch to send our sympathy. No date has been set for what will 
be a very small family funeral but his brother-in-law suggests there 
might be a memorial service in the future. The family has asked, if 
anyone wishes to, that donations are made to MIND which is a charity DRB 
supported. (https://www.mind.org.uk/donate/)

We checked with the family before we posted anything to the list and 
they were happy for us to do this. As we get more information, we will 
pass this on but in the meantime please enjoy the following post to the 
list from 1996, it's typical of the DRB we knew and loved (that and the 
bloody song he wrote about Tomas Brolin!)

RIP DRB.

Betty

From:    VBORMC:"hss...@lucs-01.novell.leeds.ac.uk" "D.R. BRENNAN" 
20-FEB-1996 11:22:41.54
To:    leeds-uni...@vax.ox.ac.uk
Subj:    LU: Interview

Interviewer: Mr Wilkinson, as your team selection for some games over 
the past few months has  been, shall we say, "innovative" what will be 
your policy for the Port Vale game?

HW: Well, all things considered, and bearing in mind that our players 
have had a hectic autograph signing session recently, and it will be a 
bit chilly, I think 11 players will suffice.

Interviewer: Mr Wilkinson, does this mean that even though your African 
players are back from international duty, you will not use them?

HW: All things being equal, Tony, Phil and Lucas are definitely players, 
and players want to play, want to play, but there can only be so many 
players, who play, so they may play a part in playing but it's not so 
warm for players who normally play, normally play, in a warmer climate.

Interviewer: It was suggested that in the Aston Villa game, you may have 
been better playing an attacking side, as the defence, containing so 
many youngsters, was unlikely to keep Villa out, offence being the best 
sort of defence.

HW: Youngsters, youngsters.  I was young once, and wanted to play, 
wanted to play.  You've got to give them a goal, I mean go, they may be 
short of pace, but Rob Bowman has got the same name as the Producer of 
the X Files, so who knows what might happen, might happen.  I picked the 
best side for the game, for the game.  When I start telling you where to 
use a metaphor instead of a simile, and when to employ onomatopoeic 
licence, then you can tell me how to pick and quarter of pick and mix, I 
mean a football team.

Interviewer:  There has been much discussion about Tomas Brolin's future 
at Elland Road.  Can you enlighten us as to the current situation?

HW: 

Re: [LU] FW: Delusional or Footballs coming back

[Guy Thornton]

Thanks Naffy. 
Actually it did go to the list - after I realized first time I'd only sent it 
to you.
And am aware of the gmail problem but it's only a back up so ignore message 
regarding it and will 
get it sorted

Does anyone know anything about iFollow? I haven't heard of it.
Also does this mean the Leeds fiver option for games is off and are the free 
games for season ticket 
holders only home matches or all?

guy


On 9 Jun 2020 at 14:25, Richard Naef wrote:

Not sure this email from Guy went to the List.

NB Guy, your gmail account is over quota.

From: Guy Thornton 
Sent: 09 June 2020 12:01
To: Richard Naef 
Subject: Re: [LU] Delusional or Footballs coming back

Ah, the proverbial glass half-full or half-empty question mixed with archetypal 
whinging yorkies.
Well I'm siding with Da Rev and Naffy. Always look on the bright side 
Anyway makes no difference what we think, say or whinge. It looks like Football 
really is returning. The EFL are 
meeting today - originally should have been yesterday but it was put back - to 
(hopefully/probably) finalize the 
proposals, which for anyone who hasn't seen them are:

The season is set to restart 20 June with games 20/21 and 27/28 June
No midweek games first week
Final regular games 21/22 July with play-off final Sunday 2 or Monday 3 August
Fixture schedule will be over six time slots Friday to Sunday: 18.00 & 20.00 
Friday, 12.30,15.00, 17.30 Saturday 
and 12.00 Sundays plus three time slots Tuesdays and Wednesdays midweek: 17.00, 
18.00 & 20.00
None of the 108 games will be shown free-to-air but 30 games will be shown on 
Sky Sports
All games will be shown on iFollow with season ticket holders able to watch 
their teams games free while those 
without a season ticket games will cost £10.

The provisional fixture list for us is:

Sun Jun 21 Cardiff City A (12:00pm live on Sky Sports)

Sat Jun 27 Fulham H (3:00pm live on Sky Sports)

Tue Jun 30 Luton Town H (7:45pm)

Sat Jul 4 Blackburn Rovers A (3:00pm)*

Tue Jul 7 Stoke City H (7:45pm)*

Sat Jul 11 Swansea City A (3:00pm)*

Tue Jul 14 Barnsley H (7:45pm)*

Sat Jul 18 Derby County A (3:00pm)*

Wed Jul 22 Charlton Athletic H (TBC)*

* = may change subject to broadcast selections

Now sit back, wait for the EFL decisions and enjoy(?)
guy


On 9 Jun 2020 at 9:54, Richard Naef wrote:

Without getting all Zen, neither pessimism or optimism will affect the outcome, 
so looking forward positively with 
nervous excitement is possibly better for you health than expecting the worse. 
Sure if it does go tits up, you 
might protect yourself from the low, but really, every thing points to us being 
the best team and best prepared. 
Of course in the end, nothing really matters and we are just brief flashes of  
deterministic automata running on 
the rails of a cold uncaring universe.

Sent from my Mobile.


From: Leedslist 
mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org>> on behalf 
of David 
Smail mailto:dsm...@dsmail.plus.com>>
Sent: Monday, June 8, 2020 9:57:47 PM
To: bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk<mailto:bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk> 
mailto:bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk>>
Cc: leedslist@gn.apc.org<mailto:leedslist@gn.apc.org> 
mailto:leedslist@gn.apc.org>>
Subject: Re: [LU] Delusional

With all this unconditional optimism and potentially misplaced good faith,
as in all things, there needs to be a measure of balance without necessarily
being pessimistic
We all want the same conclusion, but some express it differently.
Dave

-Original Message-
From: bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk<mailto:bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk> 
[mailto:bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: 08 June 2020 19:17
To: David Smail
Cc: heathpalai...@gmail.com<mailto:heathpalai...@gmail.com>; 
leedslist@gn.apc.org<mailto:leedslist@gn.apc.org>
Subject: Re: [LU] Delusional

Will the miserable bastards amongst this list please wait until we have
actually lost?

I thank you!

Sent from my iPad

> On 8 Jun 2020, at 04:51, David Smail 
> mailto:dsm...@dsmail.plus.com>> wrote:
>
> Great minds think alike - I have raised this with a small group of
> supporters at work.
>
> I too would have happily taken promotion as a result of season early
> termination based on the fact that we've done enough already.
>
> All this talk of purity and finishing the season could be disaster for us
as
> you say if we fold again under the pressure. It's the equivalent of
starting
> a new season. One thing we have in our favour is that we do tend to make
> good starts in the early weeks of new campaigns, so I hope this continues.

>
> All teams will be pumped up after the enforced break, however,  we don't
> generally get on well in Wales.
>
> Sadly we don't have a points cushion to help us ease back in and there is
no
> guarantee that we will continue our winning streak especially with no ER
> home support  I'm sure MB has all this in ha

Re: [LU] Delusional or Footballs coming back

[Guy Thornton]

Ah, the proverbial glass half-full or half-empty question mixed with archetypal 
whinging yorkies.
Well I'm siding with Da Rev and Naffy. Always look on the bright side 
Anyway makes no difference what we think, say or whinge. It looks like Football 
really is returning. The EFL are 
meeting today - originally should have been yesterday but it was put back - to 
(hopefully/probably) finalize the 
proposals, which for anyone who hasn't seen them are:

The season is set to restart 20 June with games 20/21 and 27/28 June
No midweek games first week
Final regular games 21/22 July with play-off final Sunday 2 or Monday 3 August
Fixture schedule will be over six time slots Friday to Sunday: 18.00 & 20.00 
Friday, 12.30,15.00, 17.30 Saturday 
and 12.00 Sundays plus three time slots Tuesdays and Wednesdays midweek: 17.00, 
18.00 & 20.00
None of the 108 games will be shown free-to-air but 30 games will be shown on 
Sky Sports
All games will be shown on iFollow with season ticket holders able to watch 
their teams games free while those 
without a season ticket games will cost £10.

The provisional fixture list for us is:

Sun Jun 21 Cardiff City A (12:00pm live on Sky Sports)

Sat Jun 27 Fulham H (3:00pm live on Sky Sports)

Tue Jun 30 Luton Town H (7:45pm)

Sat Jul 4 Blackburn Rovers A (3:00pm)*

Tue Jul 7 Stoke City H (7:45pm)*

Sat Jul 11 Swansea City A (3:00pm)*

Tue Jul 14 Barnsley H (7:45pm)*

Sat Jul 18 Derby County A (3:00pm)*

Wed Jul 22 Charlton Athletic H (TBC)*

* = may change subject to broadcast selections

Now sit back, wait for the EFL decisions and enjoy(?)
guy


On 9 Jun 2020 at 9:54, Richard Naef wrote:

Without getting all Zen, neither pessimism or optimism will affect the outcome, 
so looking forward positively with 
nervous excitement is possibly better for you health than expecting the worse. 
Sure if it does go tits up, you 
might protect yourself from the low, but really, every thing points to us being 
the best team and best prepared. 
Of course in the end, nothing really matters and we are just brief flashes of  
deterministic automata running on 
the rails of a cold uncaring universe.

Sent from my Mobile.


From: Leedslist  on behalf of David Smail 

Sent: Monday, June 8, 2020 9:57:47 PM
To: bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk 
Cc: leedslist@gn.apc.org 
Subject: Re: [LU] Delusional

With all this unconditional optimism and potentially misplaced good faith,
as in all things, there needs to be a measure of balance without necessarily
being pessimistic
We all want the same conclusion, but some express it differently.
Dave

-Original Message-
From: bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk [mailto:bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: 08 June 2020 19:17
To: David Smail
Cc: heathpalai...@gmail.com; leedslist@gn.apc.org
Subject: Re: [LU] Delusional

Will the miserable bastards amongst this list please wait until we have
actually lost?

I thank you!

Sent from my iPad

> On 8 Jun 2020, at 04:51, David Smail wrote:
>
> Great minds think alike - I have raised this with a small group of
> supporters at work.
>
> I too would have happily taken promotion as a result of season early
> termination based on the fact that we've done enough already.
>
> All this talk of purity and finishing the season could be disaster for us
as
> you say if we fold again under the pressure. It's the equivalent of
starting
> a new season. One thing we have in our favour is that we do tend to make
> good starts in the early weeks of new campaigns, so I hope this continues.

>
> All teams will be pumped up after the enforced break, however,  we don't
> generally get on well in Wales.
>
> Sadly we don't have a points cushion to help us ease back in and there is
no
> guarantee that we will continue our winning streak especially with no ER
> home support  I'm sure MB has all this in hand, We are well versed with
> disappointments over the years - perhaps we can shake these off and see it
>through.
>
>
>
>Dave
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> As a paid up member of the Grumpy Old Men Society, it is not surprising
>
> that I mutter "the world's gone mad" about three times a day.but
>
> having said that, I really do think that the amount of delusional thinking
>
> in all walks of life nowadays has reached, well dare-I-say-it pandemic
>
>proportions.
>
>
>
> And one example of such is all these Leeds fans and players who are
>
> blathering about wanting the season to be completed and to "earn promotion
>
> on the pitch." They are completely deluded.
>
>
>
> If it does restart, this huge hiatus will have only ramped up the
>
> psychological pressure on the Leeds players. After weeks of reading and
>
> hearing how a) promotion was almost in the bag when it stopped, b) if it
>
> starts again promotion will be a formality, or c) the season should be
>
> stopped and Leeds should be handed promotion already, there will be
massive
>
> pressure on the players if they actually do have 

Re: [LU] To play or not to play, that is the question (Leedslist Digest, Vol 119, Issue 13)

[Guy Thornton]

I'm with you 100% Alan. You mirror my thoughts exactly.

When this came up last week on how to vote a number of people where for calling 
it done and 
dusted and not playing on with one of the reasons being the chance of us 
blowing it.
Apart from Norwich whinging that if the Premiership is finished they shouldn't 
be relegated as it 
wouldn't be fair for Leeds or anyone to be promoted based on positions in an 
unfinished 
championship if anyone has worries about us bottling it then that would not 
augur well for the 
pressure of the Premier League. I don't think we will blow it but let's prove 
it, show we can compete 
at at higher level
guy

On 25 May 2020 at 11:25, alan.edgar--- via Leedslist wrote:

If, from this position, we are going to submit to the pressure of getting 
promotion over 46 (or even 49) games as 
the rules stated at the start of the season I don't fancy our chances in the 
pressure-cooker that is the Premier 
League.
Here's hoping the players are less pessimistic than you, Rob.
Cheers, Al (VP of the Richard Naef Eternal Optimists Club)
 -
On Monday, 25 May 2020, 12:00:07 BST, leedslist-requ...@gn.apc.org 
 
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Today's Topics:

  1. Delusional (Robert Heath)


--

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 25 May 2020 12:50:13 +0200
From: Robert Heath 
To: Leeds List 
Subject: [LU] Delusional
Message-ID:
    
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

As a paid up member of the Grumpy Old Men Society, it is not surprising
that I mutter "the world's gone mad" about three times a day.but
having said that, I really do think that the amount of delusional thinking
in all walks of life nowadays has reached, well dare-I-say-it pandemic
proportions.

And one example of such is all these Leeds fans and players who are
blathering about wanting the season to be completed and to "earn promotion
on the pitch." They are completely deluded.

If it does restart, this huge hiatus will have only ramped up the
psychological pressure on the Leeds players. After weeks of reading and
hearing how a) promotion was almost in the bag when it stopped, b) if it
starts again promotion will be a formality, or c) the season should be
stopped and Leeds should be handed promotion already, there will be massive
pressure on the players if they actually do have to go out and do it on the
pitch.

I could easily see a superhyped-up Cardiff beating us in the first match.
Imagine if we then do one of our classics and batter Fulham but fail to
finish any moves and they get two chances all game and Mitrovic puts them
both away.

PRESSURE!

And we showed in the playoffs last year that we have the capacity to
completely fold when the pressure really mounts. Pablo, for example, was a
complete liability in those last few games. A bowl of jelly would have
contributed more. Dallas, with his experience of big International
occasions, was the only player who reacted well to the pressure.

Anyway, that's why I've got everything firmly crossed hoping the season
will NOT get finished.


--

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RIP Norman MOT


--

End of Leedslist Digest, Vol 119, Issue 13
**
  
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[LU] King Billy - Geat Lives

[Guy Thornton]

Today on BBC Radio 4, 16.30 BST:

Great Lives - Billy Bremner
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000j80t

Available on BBC Sounds (aka Radio iPlayer) after broadcast or download podcast

guy






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[LU] we are the champions ...

[Guy Thornton]

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/52507779




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[LU] Greatest british manager

[Guy Thornton]

BBC have got a poll https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/52371056 for the 
greatest british manager

List of 14 includes Revie. Votes close 10.00 BST Monday 27th




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[LU] We're not nasty any more ...

[Guy Thornton]

It seems our new soubriquet is 'Lovely Leeds':   
 
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/mar/26/leeds-united-not-so-nasty-now?

a small thing maybe but in these times any light relief helps.

hope everyone is bearing up and fit and healthy

guy




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[LU] not quite leeds ...

[Guy Thornton]

 but this in today's The Fiver from the Guardian did amuse me:
QUOTE OF THE DAY
"Following unacceptable behaviour of the Ultras supporters group over a number 
of games this season 
we have taken the decision to ban this group from home games. They will be able 
to gain entry 
individually if accompanied by a parent" - as pay-offs on club statements go, 
this from Fort William is 
quite the zinger.

guy


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[LU] Bring on the pies

[Guy Thornton]

Let's hear it for Wigan
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Re: [LU] LU: Tonight’s game and the Red Button in Amsterdam

[Guy Thornton]

Hi Mick,

Looks like Three Sisters on Rembrantplein will be showing the game, at least 
they have it listed.

Sent out a mail to the usual crowd over here. David Woolmer is going to Ajax 
game, Allard can't make it and 
others we'll see. Hope to make it, or at least part but got some work on and 
just had news of death of friend and 
to let various people know.

BTW see you sent this from your gmail. The first mail from work address I got 
an automatic mail back saying 
your work address changed.

guy

On 10 Dec 2019 at 11:46, Mick Robinson (Gmail) wrote:

> Hi Guy
> 
> Thanks for this, in Rotterdam today but will be in Amsterdam. If you
> fine anything will you be coming out to watch? 
> 
> Regards
> 
> Mick Robinson
> 
> 
> > On 10 Dec 2019, at 11:29, Guy Thornton  wrote:
> > 
> > Not quite sure Mick if the read button is available. I think so but not 
> > certain. Some places though seem to  be 
> > able to show games.
> > 
> > As for tonight (and yes Dr. Michael, it is tonight) no one has said they 
> > are showing it but the two likely options 
> > are Coco's (which you've been to I think) and Three Sisters a few minutes 
> > away on the Rembrantplein. Checks 
> > are being made and more information when we know something.
> > 
> > guy
> > 
> > 
> >> On 10 Dec 2019 at 5:37, Robinson, Mick wrote:
> >> 
> >> I know you can get Sky Go in Europe now but does anyone know if the Red 
> >> Button is available?
> >> 
> >> Any bars good for the Leeds game please, Guy, Allard?
> >> 
> >> Regards
> >> 
> >> Mick
> >> 
> >> ___
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> >> RIP Jimmy WAC-COE
> > 
> > 
> > ___
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> > 
> > RIP Jimmy WAC-COE


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Re: [LU] LU: Tonight’s game and the Red Button in Amsterdam

[Guy Thornton]

Not quite sure Mick if the read button is available. I think so but not 
certain. Some places though seem to  be 
able to show games.

As for tonight (and yes Dr. Michael, it is tonight) no one has said they are 
showing it but the two likely options 
are Coco's (which you've been to I think) and Three Sisters a few minutes away 
on the Rembrantplein. Checks 
are being made and more information when we know something.

guy


On 10 Dec 2019 at 5:37, Robinson, Mick wrote:

> I know you can get Sky Go in Europe now but does anyone know if the Red 
> Button is available?
> 
> Any bars good for the Leeds game please, Guy, Allard?
> 
> Regards
> 
> Mick
> 
> ___
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> RIP Jimmy WAC-COE


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[LU] Marching Out Together

[Guy Thornton]

Sunday I happened to catch 'Gareth Thomas v Homophobia: The Legacy' on BBC2. My 
heart dropped when it 
opened with shots of Elland Road and choruses of homophobic abuse. The good 
news is that was then and the 
now was at the end of the programme with Leeds being one of the leading clubs 
signing up to and actively 
taking action to tackle homophobia and LGBT discrimination. Plus inbetween the 
LGBT Leeds fans sponsoring 
the kits of Sunday League team - Marching Out Together.

If anyone wants to catch the programme it's still available: 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0007s58

guy




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Re: [LU] LU: Take Us Home

[Guy Thornton]

Interesting. 
I've seen various reviews and comments about the documentary. Some good, some 
less so. One of the 
criticisms was a lack of Bielsa, at least talking.

The problem is how to watch it? I know it's on Amazon Prime which I don't have 
and anyway someone here has 
just tried taking out a trial subscription to Amazon Prime Video in order to 
watch it only to get the message 'This 
title isn't available in your location.'

guy

On 21 Aug 2019 at 1:38, seanscribe--- via Leedslist wrote:

> So I finally finished the documentary this evening. It's very moving
> and I would recommend it. A few observations: - It's clearly not a
> completely independent production. While there are controversial
> episodes covered (Bamford's feigning getting whacked against Villa,
> Spygate, etc. etc.) there's very little new information revealed about
> these. (For instance, a more "newsy" documentary might have
> interviewed the intern/employee who actually did the spying against
> Derby.) Some important episodes are completely omitted. (For example,
> there is absolutely no mention of Jack Clarke's bizarre collapse on
> the bench at 'Boro, let alone an explanation of what caused it, beyond
> the vague "virus" that the club belatedly told us about.)  - The series
> does not go into great detail about most of the squad or the backroom
> team. There's no mention of the under-23s winning the national
> championship, no real discussion of Carlos Corberan, Jack Clarke,
> Jamie Shackleton, etc. - It's a brilliant portrayal of the human side
> of the club: players, management and supporters. You'd need the
> proverbial heart of stone not to be affected by the scenes of the
> players and backroom staff in tears after the last Derby game. In
> particular, I came away with new respect for Kalvin Phillips, Liam
> Cooper, Marcelo Bielsa, Victor Orta, Angus Kinnear and Andrea
> Radrizzani. One can criticize various personnel decisions that Orta
> made, particularly in his first season, but watching him crying after
> the Derby game, one can't question his commitment. That guy cares.
> Also, the scenes with Bob Tappin made it worth the price (okay, it was
> free with Amazon Prime) on their own. Anyway, I came away feeling even
> more proud to be a Leeds United supporter, which I didn't think was
> possible after all these years. 


> Cheers!
> Sean
> 
> 
> 
> ___
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Re: [LU] Tonight

[Guy Thornton]

Enough of this ageism please. I've been following Leeds since we where in the 
second division (that's second 
division I said, not league one) and on the list since pretty well it's 
inception when the Rev. Gav started it and 
ran it from Oxford (I even paid homage to the machine it was on in the uni 
computer bank).

I have no problem with change, just not change for changes sake or 
Risdale'esque idiocy type chance. Of 
course it's necessary for progress or we'd still be clogging, sorry running 
round on the pitch in shorts down to 
the knees, huffing and puffing from those fags at half time, probably getting 
concussion heading leather balls 
and the terraces would be full of flat caps whippets with people moaning about 
the common market (oh sorry, 
they still are a la brexit) so youngsters, grumpsters, granddads lay of the 
jibes.

And yes, I noticed what you did but was double parody intended not only 
referring to Leeds fans but replying to 
a mail from Da Rev, aka John Lee?

guy

On 14 Aug 2019 at 8:03, Richard Naef wrote:

> Lemoaners (see what i did there) would be happy if we lose, cos the
> problem with a list with an average age of 130 is old gits don't like
>change.
>
> Sent from my Mobile.
>
>
> From: Leedslist  on behalf of Tim Leslie 
> 
> Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 8:20:57 AM
> To: Leeds List 
> Subject: Re: [LU] Tonight
>
> Oh My Lord! Does anyone on the list require the number for the
> Samaritans? I read the mails posted during the game and just had to
> double check ...Yes, we DID win! Wasn't so sure looking at the doom
>mongers.
>
> We WON a game we would quite probably (Not possibly) have lost in
> seasons past, Histon anyone?
> We WON the game reasonably comfortably against the lower league upstarts
> who have spent MILLIONS to get to League 2 and are a half decent 'up and
> at em'outfit.
> We WON the game playing half a dozen players who were either making
> their first starts or were, as they were last year, teenagers.
> We WON the 3rd game of a very long season with no injuries and many of
> the players (Costa, Eddie, McAlmont, White) Still adapting to Marcelo
> and his methods.
>
> Christ on a bike knows what it'll be like when we lose 
>
> It's 0113 245 6789 for all you Leeds based lads BTW
>
>StigOfThePositiveDump
>
>
>
>
> On 2019-08-13 22:31, John Lee via Leedslist wrote:
> > A bit like a training session in my eyes, always looked like we'd get
> > the job done, but didn't tell us that much we didn't know. Eddie took
> > his goal well, and the ball to open them up from Shackleton was
> > sublime - hopefully he can build on his goal. He looked a bit
> > lightweight at times, but still a positive. Good to see McAlmont make
> > his debut, and a reasonably solid one it was.
>>
> > Same old issue with the crossing - some good ones, but no-one within
> > 20 yards - I really would like to know what the 'tactical'objective
> > is - maybe now we have Eddie we'll have someone who can finish from 2
> > yards out?
>>
> > Casilla made a few good saves, but then nearly gave them a goal :-)
> > Pointless making any comments!
>>
> > I hope Shackleton can get into our first 11 regularly - I don't see
> > the advantage of sticking with Dallas instead - we have to get him,
> > Davis, Mcalmont, Bogusz etc as regulars. Davis did give a few slack
> > balls away, but so did everyone at times. Bielsa pointedly said that
> > we had enough players to swap players around if we went on a cup run,
> > so any pre match notions he didn't want a successful cup run seem wide
> > of the mark.
>>
> > Still, 3-0, no 'history' of losing to Salford, so all good.
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Re: [LU] Quiet List

[Guy Thornton]

Been thinking the same myself Kev. The quiet before the storm?

The heart and head thing. On the one hand I feel quietly confident we're going 
to build on last season and this 
will be it, direct promotion. On the other hand there is a certain nervousness 
about it all that we don't really seen 
to have done much, at least enough.

Looking through your mail I can go along with your comments. Also it's so warm 
and sticky at the moment not 
sure I can think of any original ones of my own.

guy

On 23 Jul 2019 at 12:14, Kevin Lewis (UK SBS) wrote:

> Hi all,
> The list  has been quiet for the last few days considering the season is 
> approaching. Is this in trepidation or quiet confidence?
> 
> I must admit that I'm getting a bit worried at the lack of signings in 
> positions we know need strengthening.  Whilst it is good to see that the U23 
> squad is being bolstered.  I'd like to see some progress in getting proven 
> players in.
> He has als got rid of a lot of players he did not like, which should free up 
> a bit of cash for wages.
> 
> Priorities as I see it are:
> 
> 1.   Jansson replacement like-for-like.
> 
> 2.   Striker.  Roofe has done OK, but seems to be fragile.  Bamford is 
> very streaky.  Has spell where everything goes in, then others where he 
> misses everything.
> 
> 3.   Goalkeeper. It looks like Casilla will get another chance, but 
> Peacock-Farrell could be on the way out.
> 
> 4.   Left-Back. Douglas has to step up a bit in terms of form and 
> fitness.  Are any of Davis, Pearce, Alioski capable of stepping in over a 
> long period?
> 
> Phillips staying is still far from 100%, and given the external interest in 
> Roofe, his injury could be a blessing in disguise.  Whoever comes in now will 
> not have much time to be indoctrinated by Bielsa.
> 
> Overall I think the attack is slightly stronger than last year, due to Costa, 
> and the defence slightly weaker, without Jansson.
> 
> Hopefully not too many of the youngsters will show a 2nd season dip.  
> Harrison and Bogusz seem to be laying down markers in the pre-season games.
> 
> 
> KOT.
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [LU] no LU - ENGLAND CRICKET CHAMPIONS OF THE WORLD !

[Guy Thornton]

Totally surreal !
Never experienced a super over before
Do sort of feel it should have been a tie
guy

On 14 Jul 2019 at 19:55, Simon McNally wrote:

> I'm in bits. Tense at the end!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> > On 14 Jul 2019, at 19:47, "nat...@sky.com"  wrote:
> > 
> > What an amazing game - feel sorry for Kiwis who put on such a great show 
> > and were 'robbed' by the four overthrows that hit Stokes' bat - without 
> > that we would not have won
> > So won football, rugby and now cricket world cups and each time in extra 
> > time or equivalent
> > How tense and tight that match was and so hard fought - brilliant 
> > entertainment
> > Dave
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> 
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Re: [LU] non LU - VAR & offside

[Guy Thornton]

Absolutely agree with you Dave.
Offside needs clarifying/redefining. As you say 'clear daylight' and not a toe 
or part of a foot ahead.
Equally why they need to refer to VAR when a decision is quite clear and 
obvious. I've seen quite clear and 
blatant penalties yet the ref felt she had to refer to VAR to justify her 
decision.

Not being a luddite and against VAR. Just there needs to be more though given 
as to how and when it's used.

guy

On 3 Jul 2019 at 10:26, nat...@sky.com wrote:

> Watching the womens semi final last night it made me even more convinced that 
> if they are going to use VAR for offside decisions they need to tweak the 
> offside rule
> Both v Cameroon when it went for England and last night when it went against 
> them the decision to overrule a goal due to the striker being offside by an 
> inch (in the Cameroon game she was facing the 'wrong way') I thought that 
> this was bad for the game in general
> Quite often when a player is out wide and is offside the 'expert' summariser 
> will say that it is bad football since that player can look right down the 
> line and judge his run.That is fine when he gets ahead of the defence but it 
> is impossible for a player who is 'level' to judge if any relevant part of 
> his body is ahead of the defender
> Most recent rule changes have had the intention (albeit sometimes the 
> opposite result) of speeding the game up and making it more likely for teams 
> to have chances and thus more exciting and entertainingThis offside by an 
> inch via VAR will have the opposite effect , with really good , well worked 
> goals being chalked off. Last night, for example was a lovely flick through, 
> a well timed run and good finish and yet ruled out because her big toe was in 
> front of the defenders big toe
> Surely if they are going to use VAR for this the rule should be (as linesmen 
> were told the other year) to only be offside if there is 'clear daylight' 
> between the attacker and the defender - this will give both players the 
> ability tom judge when to make a run / when to hold a line etc. It will still 
> penalise a player for gaining an advantage by being ahead of the defenders 
> but not penalise someone who is to all intents and purposes 'level'
> Problem solved
> Still do not like VAR in its present format - they should really stick to the 
> 'clear and obvious mistake' - one that a single quick review , done in 
> seconds will sort out
> Dave
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Re: [LU] Phil Hay

[Guy Thornton]

Maybe I've missed it but Phil Hay has left the YEP, not just stopped being the 
Leeds person on the paper?
So what's the lowdown, why has he left and where is he now?

guy


On 30 Jun 2019 at 12:54, nat...@sky.com wrote:

> Not sure if his info is 100% accurate (though no reason to think that it is 
> not) since he left YEP but he has tweeted a lot of interesting info this last 
> few days, all of which is positive for the coming season2 for the future 
> (albeit they reckon McCarron has been 'promised' a chance in first team IF he 
> impresses - a back up centre back , a really positive signing (Costa), the 
> re-singing of one who splits opinion (Harrison) and most oddly of all (not 
> sure how I feel and the point of it in some way) the fact that Clarke could 
> be back on loan.  Hay also thinks there is a chance with Ryan KentProbably 
> losing Wilks and Halme - either on loan or permanent
> Rafa MujicaWill be signing for Leeds United shortly. Twenty-year-old and 
> Spain U19 international who is coming from Barcelona's B squad:
> 
> Leeds United close to signing 18-year-old winger Liam McCarron from Carlisle 
> United. One for the future but will command a six-figure fee
> 
> Brighton centre-back Ben White to undergo a medical with Leeds United today. 
> Season-long loan.
> 
> Jack Harrison due to sign on loan from Manchester City tomorrow. If all goes 
> well in the next 24/48 hours, Helder Costa will follow from Wolves
> 
> Interesting - hearing that Jack Clarke will rejoin Leeds United on loan after 
> he signs for Tottenham tomorrow
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Re: [LU] Clarke

[Guy Thornton]

How does it work with players on loan and payment of their earnings?
I'm presuming we're not paying the full monty of 20,000 a week so we stick at 
the 1,000 he was getting from us 
or what?

guy

On 29 Jun 2019 at 12:41, Jeremy Adams wrote:

> Is that 20K or 200K?? I'm assuming the former which still isnt half bad.
> 
> From: Leedslist  on behalf of Nicholas Armit 
> via Leedslist 
> Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2019 8:14 AM
> To: Leeds List
> Subject: [LU] Clarke
> 
> Supposedly went from 1,000 a week to 20,. Bloody hell.
> Nick
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Re: [LU] VAR

[Guy Thornton]

Basically agree with you Dave.
Not being a luddite and I think VAR has it's place and is(could be?) a useful 
addition but but it's not the gospel 
or new god and there needs to be a balance. Just how long is it going to take 
to get this.

Certainly agree on thee offside. Even on the visuals afterwards it was so 
marginal.
On penalties I have a feeling the ref's are verging to much on the side of VAR. 
It was more or less the same 
with the penalty awarded against the Netherlands in the England game. However 
it is not just VAR but the 
offside rule has changed as of this month. I have read a lot on this but this 
from the Beeb's live text on today's 
games lays it out quite succinctly:

Under football's new laws, which came in on 1 June, the handball rule changed.

The law remains that deliberate handball is an offence. But accidental handball 
will also be a free-kick (or 
penalty) if...
o   the ball goes into the goal off an attacker 
o   a player gets the ball using his arm or hand and then scores, or 
creates a goalscoring  
opportunity 
o   the player's arm or hand is above their shoulder (unless the player 
has controlled the ball 
onto his own arm or hand) 
o   a player's hand or arm has made their body "unnaturally bigger" 

Referee Jana Adamkova has deemed that Nicola Docherty's arms made her body 
unnaturally bigger as she 
went to block the cross.
guy

On 9 Jun 2019 at 16:49, nat...@sky.com wrote:

> Watched the England v Swiss game and now (sort of watching ) lionesses
> v jockettes or whatever they call themselves IF the 2 VAR decisions are
> going to be typical of decisions going forward - we are going to see
> lots and lots of penalties for handball - she was stood a yard away
> when it hit her hand , but this was the 'arm out to affect things'
> rule meant the ref gave England a penalty  In the proper game if the
> foul by Wilson is enough to disallow a goal we are going to see lots
> of goals from corners and free kicks chalked off due to 'pushing and
> pulling ' in the area In fact I can see plenty of times when a goal is
> scored from a corner and the ref via VAR will see that a forward
> pushed someone and cancel the goal but then see that a defender had
> pulled an attackers shirt before that, and so give a penalty ? Then
> when the pen is saved VAR will show the keeper moved and so it will be
> re-taken - it will be mental Going to be hard to celebrate any goal
> properly when worried about it being cancelled via VAR Also looking at
> the VAR on Thursday for the offside - are we sure that the equipment
> is good enough ? It will depend on them being able to line up exactly
> the position of the players when the ball was kicked - a split second
> later (eg when the pass has gone an inch or more) the position of the
> players will be different - 2 players running in opposite directions -
> and so may look offside especially if half a boot is enough to say
> 'offside' - not the clear and obvious I though they needed ? In
> cricket they stay with the umpire on Hawkeye precisely because they
> know the equipment is not 100% accurate Add to that the extra time
> needed (7minutes time added on on Thursday) and it is a real can of
> worms (Not that any of it will affect us this coming season as it will
> only apply in the Prem) 
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[LU] London meet up tonight

[Guy Thornton]

There'll be some of us watching tonight in the Beehive, 51 Durham Street, 
Vauxhall.

It's about 200 yards from Vauxhall Station down Harleyford Road in the 
direction on the Oval.

Anyone who's around and wants to join us is more than welcome.

guy




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[LU] London meet up(s) wednesday ?

[Guy Thornton]

On my way over to London for meetings tomorrow.
Had contemplated trying to get to Leeds for the game but won't be finished in 
time so who's 
watching the game in London and where?
There is a possibility of meeting up with Big Al, saw him Saturday, but that'll 
probably be SW/W 
London and I'm stopping north london (stroud green/finsbury park) so checking 
out other options 
as not yet heard from Al.

guy






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Re: [LU] 5 games to go

[Guy Thornton]

So Kev, Sheff Utd win 4 and draw 1?
That draw would be there game against Millwall, yes?

Just proves how unpredictable it all is, a real roller coaster. Saturday we 
won, true, but it should have been 
far more than 1-0 the way we dominated the game and chances we had but Westwood 
had a brilliant game, 
at least one of those saves was contender for save of the season. Until we 
finally scored I kept remembering 
Montgomery and even then when started playing deep at the end and gave 
Wednesday chances they hadn't 
had at all in the second half.

On the whole I think I'm happier with us playing after SU have finished their 
game. This way we know what 
we have to do and wobbly though it may be we are in the driving seat. Some more 
goals would be nice, not 
just to calm the nerves but catch SU on goal difference. Nothing easy though as 
Norwich found out 
yesterday.

Deep breaths, keep calm and, oh yes, happy birthday Kev.

guy


On 11 Apr 2019 at 13:40, Kevin Lewis (UK SBS) wrote:

Hi all after a while,
I agree with Rob about it being nerve-shredding.

In some ways life was much more bearable when Leeds were crap.  As Mark Smith 
or was it  Adrian said 
years ago - 'It's the hope that brings despair!'
I still can't bring myself to believe that promotion is a possibility because 
the disappointment of missing out 
will be too much to bear.

I can't even watch live on TV any more. I have to record the game then watch it 
once I know the result, either 
in resigned gloom, or deep content.
If we end up in the play-offs, I'll have to go to a pub with no TV and have 
quite a few pints before finding out 
the result.  Then watch it on the telly a couple of days later.

Really cheesed off with the rearrangement of the Villa game. I'd purposely put 
off going away till the Sunday 
to fit a 3pm Saturday match in, then it gets postponed!

In some ways I'd like it to be all over before then, just to rebound on Sky.

If really pushed, I expect Sheff Utd to win 4, draw 1  of their last 5 games, 
with Leeds to win 3, draw 2 - so 
we'd miss out by a point.
Par for the next 3 games is probably 2 wins and a draw each, but Sheff Utd have 
the advantage in the last 2 
fixtures.

Hope I'm wrong, but the last 15 years have taken their toll on my optimism.

KOT.


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Re: [LU] Bielsa and GoT

[Guy Thornton]

I hadn't seen that but read this on the beeb: 
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/47884808

Mind you as I've never seen Game of Thrones it's all double dutch to me 

guy


On 11 Apr 2019 at 11:33, nat...@sky.com wrote:

This is well worth a look / listen - won't spoil it for those who not seen - 
watch from 5.25mins
Brilliant - audience do not have a clue
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVFUJae2W1Y
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Re: [LU] Gordon Banks RIP

[Guy Thornton]

Agreed Dave
Always had good memories of him and. of course '66 and '70.
That save was indeed brilliant, just looking at the replays of it brings it all 
back. The only downside is it's all 
over in a flash. These days there would be several cameras tracking it all from 
different angles and we'd get 
them all in the replays including slo-mo.

Surprised no one else commented and had something to say. Surely not everyone's 
to young to remember.

guy

On 12 Feb 2019 at 9:58, nat...@sky.com wrote:

A great keeper and will always be remembered for THAT saveRIP
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Re: [LU] Marcelo Bielsa’s Leeds United: a myth being assembled in real time

[Guy Thornton]

That's because you've got a space between the 'e' and 'a' in -real-

Try pasting the line rather than clicking on the link or let your reader show 
as whole like rather than breaking 
or go to Guardian and find article in Sports

guy

On 28 Aug 2018 at 15:08, Chris Nickson wrote:

Brings up a 404 error

> On 28 Aug 2018, at 15:02, Guy Thornton 
> wrote:
> 
> From Today's Grauniad:
> 
> https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/aug/28/marcelo-bielsa-leeds-un
> ited-myth-assembled-re al-time
> 
> 
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[LU] Marcelo Bielsa’s Leeds United: a myth being assembled in real time

[Guy Thornton]

>From Today's Grauniad:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/aug/28/marcelo-bielsa-leeds-united-myth-assembled-re
al-time


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[LU] Norwich v Leeds

[Guy Thornton]

I know the game is at 15.00 BST on Saturday, the traditional time for footie, 
and neither Sky or BT 
are showing it but I gather the game has been selected as the Championship 
match for 
international broadcasting.

No idea what stations or channels will be showing it but can anyone confirm 
this is the case?

guy
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[LU] Leeds on BBC World Football

[Guy Thornton]

Leeds are featured on the BBC World Service World Football:

Inter's Arrivals and El Loco at Leeds
World Football 
We're with 18 time Italian champions Inter Milan as they prepare for a return 
to the Champions 
League. John Bennett speaks to Ghana International Kwadwo Asamoah who joined 
from Serie A 
champions Juventus and Dutch former Lazio defender Stefan de Vrij as the club 
plays English 
second-tier side Sheffield United.
Across Yorkshire former Argentina and Chile coach Marcelo Bielsa is preparing 
for his first season 
with three time champions of England, Leeds United. Authors Thomas Goubain and 
Jed Davies 
outline what we can expect from "El Loco" at Elland Road.
And we catch up with footballing globetrotter Tom Saintfiet as he takes over as 
coach of Gambia, 
his tenth national team in ten years.

Listen to it online https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3cswtzm  
or dowload the podcast  
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p002vsyx/episodes/downloads

guy
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Re: [LU] Paul Madeley

[Guy Thornton]

You are indeed right Naefy. He'd probably have tried in goal if needed
Incredibly versatile. Revie called him a Rolls Royce
Played his whole career for Leeds

On 23 Jul 2018 at 20:51, Richard Naef wrote:

Shit news - am I right in recalling he playing in every position except Keeper 
for Leeds/England?

-Original Message-
From: Leedslist  On Behalf Of John Boocock
Sent: 23 July 2018 21:39
To: Leedslist@gn.apc.org
Subject: [LU] Paul Madeley

Sadly no longer with us :-(
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[LU] The Square Ball and U23's

[Guy Thornton]

Haven't seen either of these mentioned

The BBC website had a piece on the survival of the fanzine including the Square 
Ball:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-41149738

and then there's the unfortunate U'23's friendly;  
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/42075303

guy


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FLAME WARS 'R US

Re: [LU] 17years ago

[Guy Thornton]

Only just been catching up with posts due to circumstances recently. Most 
glanced through and 
taken in but this thread really brings home memories. Dave said the whole 
european adventure 
was brilliant. Absolutely. Totally agree with him and shown by the comments of 
listers on the 
various games. Not going to cover them all but some of the outstanding one's 
for me.

Munich - No problems with their fans. Just a great time. Stopped with Stuart 
and Traudi who lived 
in Munich. There where seats but they could be put up and then the catering 
staff coming round 
the stadium dispensing draught beer (they have containers on their backs) and 
worst.

Anderlecht - Probably our best performance of any (as has been said).  Superb 
football, no 
problems and an easy trip down from Amsterdam and back.

Valencia - I'd been at a meeting in Milan, got the night train to Barcelona, 
changed for train to 
Valencia and waited dozing on the station till Jabba and Andy Ewart turned up 
to find me. They'd 
arrived the day before and I crashed out on their floor. A glorious day going 
round the city, a bit of 
hassle getting into the ground but had worse, losing Jabba and Andy in the 
ground but then we 
found each other again at the Argie bar where Argentinian-Yorkshire friendship 
cemented. As I 
remember it we drunk them dry. The only real hassle was on my way back when I 
was mugged in 
Barcelona where I had to stop overnight for an early morning flight. (and 
despite the Sarge's 
memories I didn't get mugged at most games).

The the adventure continued the next season with two outstanding memories.

Troyes - We picked in a mini-bus in Amsterdam and collected people on the way 
down. There 
where about ten to twelve of us (can't remember exactly). Got to Troyes early 
afternoon and meet 
up with more listers. We may have lost the game but still got through. 
Afterwards the dodgy bar 
with halloween decorations where Clare was taken with the graffiti, in 
particular 'L'etudiant, comme 
le fleuve cherche suiver son cours sans quitter son lit'. We drove back through 
the night and after 
dropping everyone off John and I got the the hire about 6.30. They didn't open 
till 07.00 so we 
went and had a coffee and beer at a market cafe then back to the hire firm, 
sort things out and 
then to bed.

Eindhoven - This was truly memorable. We'd made contact with the PSV list 
before the game and 
we organized lots of things over two days, get togethers, five-a-side games on 
blow up pitches, 
dutch tv coming and filming us showing hows fans could have fun together rather 
than fight.

Those where great days indeed. What chance of a repeat sometime?

guy



On 10 Nov 2017 at 14:07, MATTHEW GAYNOR wrote:

I do look back at some of those trips and wonder how we all came back unscathed 
- more luck than 
judgement I think.
Rome games somehow the police missed us when sweeping the bars pre-match to put 
us on coaches - so 
we ended up walking to ground and getting in 5 minutes before KO - no trouble 
at all.
Milan I seem to remember the police making us walk around the whole stadium 
before letting us out in an 
effort to delay our arrival to the city
Moscow - Escaping through a hole in a fence from the Leeds fans compound to get 
back to the bar before the 
Leeds coaches.
Prague - Walking across a very dark park after the game - pitch black
Ukraine - The list crew stumbling around pissed on vodka and entirely lost 
until friendly police gave us a lift to 
the game.
Only hassle I had was some police baton bruises at Valencia - but that was due 
to the crush at the turnstiles - 
nothing to do with the home fans
Matt

  From: {broken-address} Richard Walker 

 To: {broken-address} Nicholas Armit  
Cc: Leeds List ; "James A. Lundon @ Gmail Home" 

 Sent: Friday, 10 November 2017, 7:57
 Subject: Re: [LU] 17years ago
   
I think most were put off with their experience in Rome first time. They kept 
us in the ground after the match 
for ages and then put us on busses and dropped us at different places around 
the city, the idea being we 
wouldn't all congregate and cause trouble - bloody ridiculous policing.



> On 9 Nov 2017, at 13:32, {broken-address} Nicholas Armit 
>  wrote:
> 
> Rome is worth two visits Dave! :-)
> Nick
>    On Thursday, November 9, 2017, 8:25:24 AM EST, nat...@sky.com 
> wrote:  
> 
> yes Anderlecht was great - possibly the best  football-wise, we totally 
> destroyed a team with a long unbeaten home euro record, and we played some 
> scintillating stuff BUT the sing-a-long after the Milan game was just 
> something else - probably unique in the whole of football
> From memory we did try and have a bit of a sing with the players after one of 
> the later games (possibly  Anderlecht ?0  but it was not anywhere near the 
> same 

[LU] Clubs risk bankruptcy with promotion to Premiership

[Guy Thornton]

Interesting piece from the BBC a couple of days ago. However I note that we 
don't appear anywhere in the 
16t clubs listed who've spent the most on staff

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/41564471

English Football League clubs risk bankruptcy by chasing promotion to the 
Premier League, 
financial experts say.
Between the 2008-09 and 2015-16 seasons, 19 clubs entered the top flight, and 
only one - Crystal 
Palace - avoided making a loss.
Average losses in their promotion seasons were more than £300,000 per week, 
financial data firm 
Vysyble said.
But the English Football League (EFL) said such reports "confuse the reality of 
the situation for 
supporters".
Most of the promoted clubs made money in their first Premier League season, but 
after four years 
just one in four was still in the black, according to Vysyble's report.
One in three was immediately relegated and two in three were down again within 
three years.
The report describes the "economic exhaustion" of trying to compete with the 
more established 
Premier League clubs.
Report co-author Roger Bell said many fans and owners of EFL clubs see 
promotion to the top 
flight as a "golden ticket to untold riches" but in reality trying to stay in 
the Premier League is 
"ultimately loss-making".
This "financial over-exertion" can lead to long-term problems, Bell continued, 
which cannot be 
solved by parachute payments to relegated sides, even though they can now total 
more than £90m.
*   'Closed shop' Premier League clubs £100m richer than EFL before bumper TV 
rights
"EFL clubs who spend beyond their means are, in fact, risking their futures by 
chasing a dream that 
is just that, a dream, and one that is actually more likely to end up as a 
financial nightmare," Bell 
added.
An EFL spokesman said it is "one of the most competitive competitions in world 
football" and is in 
a "strong financial position".
{PRIVATE "TYPE=PICT;ALT=TV cameraman"}
Promotion to the Premier League can be "financially exhausting" for some clubs, 
according to the 
report 
"Reports of this nature inflame the position and confuse the reality of the 
situation for supporters," 
he said.
Citing financial fair play rules introduced in 2012, the league's improved 
revenues, and solidarity 
payments from the Premier League, the EFL spokesman said no club had been 
through an 
insolvency process for several years.
He added football is a "competitive industry", where progress up the league 
pyramid is the main 
goal, but said the EFL's rules are under regular review as its clubs "clearly 
face different financial 
challenges to those in the Premier League".
The Premier League declined to comment on the report.
It is understood that some of the 19 promoted clubs would have broken even but 
for player bonuses 
triggered by those successes.
Bell believes his report has highlighted the risks associated with pushing too 
hard for promotion, 
particularly when the Premier League is split on how future broadcasting 
revenue is shared.
"Owners who accept the risk of relegation but also preserve the balance sheet 
face much better 
prospects if the club is indeed relegated, with Burnley, Norwich and Newcastle 
proving to be 
excellent examples," he said.

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FLAME WARS 'R US

[LU] Not exactly NonLU depending how the dice fall ...

[Guy Thornton]

The mail below makes interesting reading. I don't know if there's any chance of 
Leeds doing something 
similar. I would hope not but then it only needs one club to take the lead and 
others follow ...

guy
--- Forwarded message follows ---
From:   Michael Brunskill 
Date sent:  Mon, 25 Sep 2017 08:56:06 -0700
Subject:Your club could scrap concessions for supporters - do something 
about it
To: Michael Brunskill 
Copies to:  graham.can...@hullcityst.com


Hi,

I'm emailing as your club are due to face Hull City in the coming months.

For those of you who haven't followed developments at Hull City the club 
scrapped concessions for the 
disabled, young and old over the past few years. Hull City Supporters' Trust 
(HCST) has been campaigning 
for them to be restored and are seeking to engage fan groups across the country 
in the campaign (which the 
FSF backs). The EFL has confirmed to HCST that its own rules don't oblige clubs 
to provide any concession 
tickets. It means your club could scrap concessions and nothing could be done. 
We want that rule to change.
*   For more info email Graham from Hull City Supporters' Trust: 
graham.can...@hullcityst.com
The Premier League (PL) ruled that Hull City were guilty of breaking their 
rules through this policy last 
season, and the club was forced to agree to offer concession tickets in the 
event that HCAFC return to the 
PL. However, the EFL has no such rule and expect clubs to draw up ticketing 
policy in consultation with 
supporters. But Hull City's owners have no time for the club's supporters and 
actively seek to punish them 
wherever possible for successfully thwarting their attempts to change the 
club's name a few years ago. 

The club's owners simply will not entertain the idea of reintroducing 
concessionary tickets unless they are 
forced to do so by the EFL. Both the FSF and HCST would like to see a clearly 
defined rule obliging clubs to 
offer concessionary tickets and we would like to hear from supporter groups 
across the country who agree - 
this has happened at Hull City but at present there is nothing to stop it 
happening at your club. 

Kind regards,
Michael

Michael Brunskill
Director of communications
The Football Supporters' Federation
phone  0330 44 000 44 :: mob +44 (0)7795245859 :: web  www.fsf.org.uk
Join the FSF for free today here


--- End of forwarded message ---

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[LU] Cardiff

[Guy Thornton]

Anyone getting to together in (north/central) London to watch the game tomorrow?
If so where

guy
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Re: [LU] Burton

[Guy Thornton]

>From the reports feel very envious of everyone who was there, especially as 
>this international 
streaming service wasn't for me (not going to blame club, might well be a 
provider issue). Still early 
days and I remain cautious so no glass half full or empty predictions but there 
is hope and smile.

Dave, on your 'best ever' comment memories might be poor and do funny things 
but for me I shall 
remember the delight and joy of the 7-0 against Southampton as out best ever, 
albeit 45 years 
ago.

guy


On 9 Sep 2017 at 19:35, nat...@sky.com wrote:

Unbelievable - amazing , outstanding  , brilliant - you chose your adjective - 
it was just greatI have got home 
to see my wife watching strictly and i just think if we were being judged today 
it would be 9 maybe even a 10, 
since I cannot think of any aspect that was not perfect
For the full 90 minutes we gave Burton a lesson and put on a masterclass for 
the watching fans.
This was the hammering we were always on the cusp of handing out last season 
but never did - and yet once 
dallas came on 8 of the 10 outfield players were here last season but they have 
moved to a different level. 
Cooper, Phillips, Roofe, O'Kane ,Hernandez all Ok to average last time are now 
world beaters (at this level)
Like most fans I have a pretty poor memory when it comes to 'the best ever ' 
etc but I cannot remember the 
last time we totally and utterly destroyed a team from the sam Division - they 
really could not live with us and 
we looked like a team from a Divisoion 3 or 4 levels above - we really were 
that good. Someone on the bus 
said we had 30 shots to their 1 and that sounds about right. As my lad kept 
saying - our centre half did a 
Cruyff turn in his own box and it will not even make the highlights !
We have now played 6 games in the league with our new keeper and we still do 
not have a clue if he is any 
good, so solid is the defence in front of him - 5 clean sheets on the bounce 
now. 

Normally when you have a team with that sort of defence record you are looking 
at a boring George Graham 
team - this lot are anything but that. We attack with verve and skill and from 
all angles - Redknapp must be 
thinking of retiring before Tuesday when he watches this
In the pub beforehand there was a general feeling of optimism tinged with a bit 
of concern that we would be 
brought crashing down to earth today and fail to win a game, that , on paper we 
should win reasonably easily. 
We then spent the next 90 minutes, laughing smiling and asking each other if 
this was real
If you were not there and did not watch it live it is hard to get across how 
great we were from 1 to 11 (or 
whatever numbers we have) and from minute 1 to 90. They could not live with us 
and were chasing shadows
I had said beforehand that Lasogga needed to get on the score sheet quickly 
since I thought (wrongly) that 
his style would not go down well and would not impress the fans. Well he 
certainly got off to a good start and 
he looked the real deal both in front of goal and in his general play - it 
really will be a case of Chris who very 
soon
I was disappointed to see no Alioski and felt a bit sorry for Roofe not getting 
the number 9 role - but TC got 
both correct and Roofe instead of sulking or going into his shell, gave as good 
a performance as he ever has
As for the goals - not sure I can remember them all but after totally battering 
them for 20 minutes we got the 
break through we both needed and deserved - a lovely through ball fell to 
Lasogga and he took a touch and 
fired home (think of the two misses by Wood v Preston and Fulham) 

>From then on it was a question of how many - a shot was blocked and the ball 
>fell to Phillips on the edge of 
the box and bang - 2-0Just before half time we got the third that put us out of 
sight and gave the team the 
lead they deserved - we got a penalty, not sure why and as we discussed who 
would be taking it , up stepped 
Hernandez and he put it in with aplomb ( to the keepers left)
Second half was more of the same - Roofe got in on the action with a lovely 
curler into the net and then he 
turned provider as he skinned the full back, stood still ,looked up and chipped 
it onto the head of Lasogga 
who headed home - perfection
As well as the five goals, Lasogga hit the woodwork and various players shot 
wide and had shots saved
This was football as it should be played - a real sight of the beautiful game
All the players deserve a 9 with Siaz, O'Kane and Lasogga getting a ten - yes 
it was that good

Looking forward to Tuesday already
dave





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[LU] Sad new (cont)

[Guy Thornton]

Very many thanks to all those who responded, both on and off the list, my mail 
about Andrew 
Keogh. Thanks for all the warm and tender words and condolences.

I got back yesterday after the funeral Tuesday. It was a good day (as far as 
these things ever are) 
and we gave him a good send off. A fair scattering of Leeds scarves to be seen 
at the service and 
we had a wake for him at the Windmill on Clapham Common for those that know it.

guy


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Re: [LU] Sad news

[Guy Thornton]

Going back Wednesday Betty. 
Just a short visit having already had a few over here to visit Andrew. However 
should be back 
before to long (ie next month) as there's going to be a second ceremony for 
Andrew's ashes. 
Hopefully around longer then.

Guy
BTW my first mail was sent today, not yesterday as the date shows. My laptop 
getting out of 
synch (like me re-reading my mail)

On 26 Jun 2017 at 13:29, John Boocock wrote:

Sad news indeed Guy.

How long are you over for?

Betty


On 6/25/2017 1:20 PM, Guy Thornton wrote:
> Maybe not many people on the list know will remember Andrew Keogh. He was 
> only occasionally on the list
> and never posted. However he was a lifelong Leeds supporter. Back in the days 
> of yore (otherwise known as
> the 60's and start of the Glory Years) Andrew, Tim Greenwood (who is on the 
> list) and I as youthful
> teenagers all lived in Harrogate and apart from common political interests we 
> shared a passion for Leeds
> and regularly made that pilgrimage together to Elland Road. Though we have 
> gone our various ways, Tim in
> the states for the last 30 years, Andrew in London and me all over the place 
> the passion for Leeds has never
> died. Andrew has brought up both his boys to support Leeds.
>
> Andrew sadly died a week last Saturday. His GP had referred him to hospital 
> in March when he couldn't work
> out what was causing Andrew's back problems. The hospital diagnosed lung 
> cancer which had spreSad ad to a
> secondary cancer in the bones. After radiotherapy he was sent home but was 
> soon back in hospital, then to
> a care home but had to go to (another) hospital. During this period I had 
> managed to get over a see him a
> few times. Then a week last Thursday he was moved to a hospice so I arranged 
> to come over and see him
> again but he died on the Saturday. I am now over for the funeral tomorrow. 
> Maybe not everyone but several
> of us there will be wearing Leeds United scarves.
>
> Andrew,you will be missed. May you take a bit of Leeds and Gods Own County 
> with you.
>
> Marching on together
> Guy
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>
> FLAME WARS 'R US

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FLAME WARS 'R US

[LU] Sad news

[Guy Thornton]

Maybe not many people on the list know will remember Andrew Keogh. He was only 
occasionally on the list 
and never posted. However he was a lifelong Leeds supporter. Back in the days 
of yore (otherwise known as 
the 60's and start of the Glory Years) Andrew, Tim Greenwood (who is on the 
list) and I as youthful 
teenagers all lived in Harrogate and apart from common political interests we 
shared a passion for Leeds 
and regularly made that pilgrimage together to Elland Road. Though we have gone 
our various ways, Tim in 
the states for the last 30 years, Andrew in London and me all over the place 
the passion for Leeds has never 
died. Andrew has brought up both his boys to support Leeds.

Andrew sadly died a week last Saturday. His GP had referred him to hospital in 
March when he couldn't work 
out what was causing Andrew's back problems. The hospital diagnosed lung cancer 
which had spread to a 
secondary cancer in the bones. After radiotherapy he was sent home but was soon 
back in hospital, then to 
a care home but had to go to (another) hospital. During this period I had 
managed to get over a see him a 
few times. Then a week last Thursday he was moved to a hospice so I arranged to 
come over and see him 
again but he died on the Saturday. I am now over for the funeral tomorrow. 
Maybe not everyone but several 
of us there will be wearing Leeds United scarves.

Andrew,you will be missed. May you take a bit of Leeds and Gods Own County with 
you.

Marching on together
Guy
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FLAME WARS 'R US

Re: [LU] Fwd: None LU: Andy Murray World Number one (;-))

[Guy Thornton]

Well I'm glad Murray's doing well and I enjoy watching him. He's got better and 
improved, and I don't just 
mean winning grand slams and getting to world number one but he's matured and 
controls his emotions 
more than he used to. True he can still lose it and a Federer he's not, someone 
else I enjoy watching and 
still has style, elegance and class even though he's arguably past his best. 
That though isn't everything. 
Tim Henman just didn't have it thought I wished him well. Going back I used to 
like Jimmy Conners and 
Bjorn Borg, two quite different personalities. McEnroe I didn't like at first 
but grew to, the opposite to 
Nastase who I used to like but has now blown it. 

Murray has had a dip after getting to No 1 last year but seems to be finding 
his form again and has 
definitely got better each round in the French Open. He's got a good chance 
this afternoon and I shall 
watch. Things are going his way, Djokovic has just lost in straight sets 
(though is through with his 
opponent retiring). Could be a Nadal v Murray final.

As for this list sure it's changed but then things are always changing. It's 
part of life, if things didn't 
change there'd be no development, if the world didn't change it's be the end of 
everything. Footie has 
changed, maybe not beyond recognition but it's not the same game I grew up 
with, at least at the higher 
levels and the wall to wall footie 24/7 on tv. It's football Jim but not as we 
know it. We change as well. I 
know longer see things in the black and white I used to. I've even given up on 
an irrational hated from 
that team for Salford as well as various others. Still it's good to have 
Thirkers back on the list. There's a 
few other oldies still about, just not quite as vocal as in the past, and maybe 
some others will return as 
well.

For anyone who hasn't been to Whitby the do so. There's much to be recommended. 
Not just Thirkers 
and some of the best fish and chips you can find but a magnificent Abbey (ruins 
of),  shades of Bram 
Stoker and Dracula, whaling, a magnificent town and glorious surroundings with 
the North Yorkshire 
Moors.

guy

On 5 Jun 2017 at 16:37, Graham Thirkill wrote:

Rob heath answered me with:-
> I did indeed love good old "Come on" Tim. Winning is not everything in sport, 
> although it's amazing how many people watch or play sport yet don't know 
> that. P.s. No.
> 
Maybe if your statement is true to yourself, then that´s why you are a Leeds 
United supporter. Did you 
know Billy Bremner wrote a book, 'You get nowt for being second´...or 
seventh...He wouldn´t have 
agreed with you, perhaps. Winning is very important as everyone knows and 
winning surely is why 
professional people do sport. I am not saying winning is everything but the old 
Olympic aying, "The 
most important thing is not winning but taking part, was when the Games were 
played and competed 
bateurs¦¦Before cash rule sports¦.Me personally would prefer winning and saying 
hard luck to the 
losers.
Anyhow Rob, we all have our opinions, but I go along more with Billy Bremner, 
than your good self.
Have a good afternoon and evening.
Cheers and Beers
Thirkers\]098/

Ps Andy looks to have the best chance of reaching the final, he should blast 
either of these two 
lightweights off the court.Maybe you will become a fan of Andy´s eh?
 





> On 5 Jun 2017 21:57, "Graham Thirkill"  > wrote:
> Maybe because he´s a winner and world number one...each to their own 
> RobMaybe, then, you drooled over, never-one-owt, Tim Henman. he had 
> charisma but little else IMHHO
> 
> Cheers and Beers 
> Thirkers
> 
> PSDid you visit me in Whitby at my business, about 15 years ago, with 
> your son If so, 
> I hope he still has the John Charles signed programme I have gave him 
> Sorry if I´m wrong, 
> but it was a long time ago, but a few people used to come to see me in 
> Whitby.
> 
> 
> Rob Heath Posted;_
>> You're going to think I'm being deliberately contrary, but I have to say 
>> that I cannot warm to Murray.
>> 
>> I used to despise him with a passionafter he single handedly won us 
>> the Davis Cup I tried hard to 
like him, but I just can't.
>> 
>> For some reason, style is SO important in tennis. Murray is undoubtedly a 
>> impressively effective 
player who yes does play some great shots, and yes he's a fantastic competitor 
but he's got none of the 
style or charisma of, as a perfect example, these two fabulous players who are 
on court nowMonfils 
and Wawrinka.
>> 
>> On 5 Jun 2017 20:52, "Graham Thirkill" > wrote:
>> Just watched World "Number One" Andy Murray cruise through to the last eight 
>> in the French open, 
three sets to nil. I remember a few years ago I seemed to be the only Andy 
Murray fan on this list. I 
mentioned his 

Re: [LU] Norwich

[Guy Thornton]

Hello Thirkers, welcome back and good to hear from you.
Fear not, I at least am still here as are some of the other names you mention. 
Admittedly I have been 
very quiet posting wise for a while. Last couple of years been something of an 
annus horribilis with too 
much to much time spent in hospital, ongoing from events from earlier accidents 
including an operation 
on my wrist back in August 2015 which should have been done and dusted in six 
weeks and instead it's 
eighteen months and four operations later. Add to that a problem discovered 
with my eyes last year. 
Looked bad and was having vision problems but, touch wood, things have now been 
stabilized.

Hopefully things are improving and on the up and like Leeds be ready next 
season for improved 
performance and a big push.

guy


On 30 Apr 2017 at 13:24, Graham Thirkill wrote:

Dave Nattan, thanks for your report on the Norwich game. I thoroughly enjoyed 
it.
Just before I came back to the list, I asked Betty what the list was like these 
days, 
Auntie Betty told me you did great reports on the games. Thanks very much Dave,
Betty is quite right, you do. Betty didn´t say it was more quiet than it used 
to be 
The list is far different from the one I remember, Stotty, Dellow, Guy 
Thornton, Wiggy,
Niggy, Rogere, Jim Moran, Martin Dexter, Accrington Stanley Lad, Martin Browne,
Caddy, Janes London, Verner, Dave Diowden, where are they now ?. The list 
meets, 
pre-game was usually in The Brittania, (now closed) There used to be a regular 
20 or 
more listers in there, it was a hoot. We also used Peter Lorimer´s boozer, we 
used to 
meet my pal Harold Williams with John Charles. The away list meets were also 
super 
in different pubs all over the country. Maybe over the years, these lads of got 
fed up 
with Bates´y and the club in general. It´s eighteen years ago, since I first 
joined the list
so a few of the older guys may have passed away, I know Grandpa Sykes in Canada 
did. There were quite a few guys who wrote very comical stuff, it was very 
entertaining 
at the time and a bloody good laugh. Betty used to write a very funny story or 
two and 
so did Stotty. I travelled all over Europe with some of these guys, we lived 
the dream 
with O´leary and Ridsdale, it was fantastic, visiting the stadiums and Cities 
I´d never 
been to before, with good close pals. From the flight out, to the flight back, 
these 
trips were superb, these pals will always be remembered as long as I live. The 
last 
one I remember was with Verner and we stayed in Malaga for a few days as I 
remember, I think this was the last game we played in Europe. I will tell you a 
story, 
one day, about me and Martyn Brown with Betty in Barcelona, Betty somehow had 
to walk up a few flights of stairs because someone sabotaged the lift in the 
place we 
were staying. It only held two passengers, Martyn and myself went up in the 
lift first.
For some reason Betty couldn´t get the lift to return back to get him up to 
join us
shame..the lift door had been left open so poor old Betty had to trudge and 
struggle up three or four flights of stairs after a night on the town, on his 
own. 
He was quite animated when he eventually joined Martyn and my self and saw the 
lift door had been left open.on purpose..??..of course 
not?
Hope you all have a great Bank Holiday. 
Cheers and Beers, 
Thirkers\098/
PS There is also a story referring to Jon Abbot and a huge soft toy on the 
the streets of Barceloa in the early hours after a football match, and another 
about 
Stotty conning me to have a removable tattoo on my head and then he would also 
have 
one. I did, he bottled out, it was pouring with raining all so the paint/ink 
was running 
everywhere. Thanks Stotty who I remember was wetting himself about the con..
Another memorable occasion was my 60th birthday, seventeen years ago..(how 
time flies-by)... at my house. There was a load of friends from the list in 
attendance 
and what a night that was. There were bodies in every room of the house that 
slept over.
There was one guy SI.c, remember him.He was so sick my wife said put
him in the utility room. An our two later, sick was appearing from under the 
utility 
room door, His name Si.c was immediately change to Sick.

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MARCHING ON TOGETHER
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[LU] Support Leeds and die young ....

[Guy Thornton]

... not mention be overweight and more than somewhat raddled.

Okay, there are reasons why the stats are not accurate for the fan base as 
whole but a report on the 
health of people living around football stadiums in the Premiership and 
Football League makes 
interesting reading; http://www.bbc.com/news/health-27328674

As it says it's a bit rough and ready and about towns, not really football fans 
but on life expectancy 
Leeds are around the middle of League Two, much the same as Binge Drinking 
while Obesity is even 
worse near the bottom of League Two. 

Still it could be worse - Newcastle supporters have it really bad when it come 
to drinking, Gillingham 
have the most obese fans while if you support Birmingham City you're going to 
die young.

guy
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John 'Grampa' Sykes
Rest In Peace old lad
28th Oct 1938 - 12 Nov 2013
MARCHING ON TOGETHER

[LU] Steve Gillen

[Guy Thornton]

Haven't posted for some time, don't suppose anyone's noticed but then things 
have been 
so depressing I suspect others didn't feel like posting as well. However the 
principle for 
reason for the lack of posting has been (another) period of incarceration in 
hospital and it's 
been enough of a problem trying to keep up with things and access mail and the 
internet, 
never mind actively mailing.

All of which leeds me to the purpose of this mail. Before I went into hospital 
I had seen the 
news about Steve and Paula's mails updating us on his condition. In fact one of 
my last 
mails to the list was a reply to one of Paula's posts. However I haven't seen 
anything for 
some time. As I've missed a lot of list mail as well this is probably not 
surprising but can 
anyone update on Steve and how he and Paula are?

Guy


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Rest In Peace old lad
28th Oct 1938 - 12 Nov 2013
MARCHING ON TOGETHER

Re: [LU] First time up!

[Guy Thornton]

Very good news indeed Paula, good news for both of you.

Been reading your mails and the story of the hospital food really sounded bad.
Then I heard the latest Food Programme on Radio 4 which was on hospital food and
realized, yes, it is bad but it's also pretty normal standard wise. Not good 
news but
hopefully he'll soon be able to eat something decent again.

guy


On 17 Mar 2014 at 21:08, Paula Gillen wrote:

Out of bed for the first time in 34 days! Took a hoist to get him there but
it was well worth the trip.  He was very tired when he go back into bed
after sitting there for 40 minutes! Limbs are still not up to scratch but
they will get there! We figure is has lost a good two stone on top of the
seven he lost before. 

 



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Re: [LU] Update

[Guy Thornton]

Thanks for the update Paula
Good to hear there's some improvement even if it's still going to be a long 
road.
Everyone's with you and if there's anything we can do let us know
guy


On 25 Feb 2014 at 8:36, Paula Gillen wrote:

 Update - thanks, Paula


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MARCHING ON TOGETHER

Re: [LU] Steve Gillen

[Guy Thornton]

So sorry to hear the news Paula.
I've meet Steve a few times, and then of course you where both over in the 
Netherlands last 
year, and he's a great bloke but I know he, well both of you, have health 
problems.
Medical science can do a lot these days as I know well and have reason to be 
thankful for. I 
may still be on crutches from my accident a good five years ago but it could 
have been 
much worse. I am sure they'll get to the bottom of whatever the infection is he 
got like they 
did with me when I picked something nasty when covering things in former 
yugoslavia. Had 
me laid low in hospital  for some time. That was a few years back and things 
have come on 
a long way since them so I'm sure they'll find something for whatever he's got.

Be strong, all our thoughts are with you and you only have to let us know if 
there's anything 
we can do and we hope to hear the news that Steve is recovering and look 
forward to 
seeing him back his feet.

guy

On 18 Feb 2014 at 8:10, Steve Gillen wrote:

 Hello Leeds List,
 
 I am not sure how to contact you all so hopefully
 this will get about.  My name is Paula Gillen, My
 husband Steve is a part of your group. I wanted to
 tell you that Steve is in ICU in very, very
 critical condition.  He has infections that the
 doctors cannot identify that are attacking his
 body and are trying to find an antibiotic(s) that
 will be able to kill it. So far they are only
 managing barely to keep him from dying.  He is on
 dialysis and has been put into an induced coma and
 is on a ventilator. They are doing everything they
 can.  My email address is pgil...@ntlworld.com. I
 have sent this email to my computer in case things
 go horribly wrong and I can let you know. Please
 keep him in your thought and prayers. Thank you,
 
 Paula Gillen
 
 
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 Rest In Peace old lad
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Re: [LU] GFH statment

[Guy Thornton]

Hmm, this is a toughie. So much to choose from.
However to try and tie it down 63-64 when we gained promotion to the First 
Divison, having avoided 
relegation to the third two seasons earlier when we had to wiin our final 
match, was great but even 
better was 64-65, our first season back in the top. Runners up on goal average 
for the first division 
title and runners up in the FA losing to Liverpool  in extra time havng beaten 
ManU in the semi's after 
a replay.

guy

On 5 Feb 2014 at 14:01, David W wrote:

 Agree John, although for a bittersweet reflection of great times and heroic
 failure that in some many ways epitomises the Leeds Utd experience, the
 86-87 season with FA Cup Semi Final and play-off heartbreak takes some
 topping...
 
 
 On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 1:39 PM, John Lee bruvvalee...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
 
  Dave - 2 of my fave years were the Wilko promotion year, and then first
  year up when we finished 4th - that was amazing!
 
  Hold on to the memories :-)
 
 
 
 
 
  On Wednesday, 5 February 2014, 12:01, nat...@sky.com nat...@sky.com
  wrote:
 
 
 
  My apologies then - I just saw the 'we have met our obligations' quote on
  the OS
  I did not realise it has been amended
  Dave
 
  
 
  From: David W davidwool...@gmail.com
  To: nat...@sky.com nat...@sky.com
  Cc: leeds list leedslist@gn.apc.org
  Sent: Wednesday, 5 February 2014, 10:56
  Subject: Re: [LU] GFH statment
 
 
 
  It wasn't removed - it was amended. A more opinion sentence suggesting
  Flowers intentions may have been more to do with trying to influence the
  takeover process and talks was deleted.
 
  All just more fuel to the sense that there is a fundamental division on
  approach and desired outcomes within GFH, resulting in the Club
  continuously backtracking and contradicting itself.
 
 
 
  On Wed, Feb 5, 2014 at 11:35 AM, nat...@sky.com nat...@sky.com wrote:
 
  It has been said including on this list ( I see that the statement that
  GFH has met all te clubs liabilities and will continue to do so has been
  removed from the website - hmmm.) that the above statement has been removed
  from the website - all I can say is that it was there when I clicked on the
  page at 7am and is still there when I clicked on it again a few minutes ago
  Not sure if it was removed and put back or if the 'rumour' (which I first
  saw on waccoe) has been started by someone trying to stir it.
  
  I must admit I am pretty ambivalent to the whole take over saga - GFH
  have done some good things in favour of the fans but clearly do not have
  the funds needed to carry on, Flowers is spitting out his dummy,
  withdrawing sponsorship and then the 'tactical' winding up order.
  Haigh is all show and no substance, Cellino is a nutter and the new Bates
  
  As Rich N said,all I want (apart from my ST being honoured) is to enjoy
  going to the game,having a few beers with my mates, watching a decent game
  of football,with a good atmosphere, hoping for more wins than losses and
  some success, and then going home having had a good time.
  
  I do not care that much which Division we are in - I enjoyed the European
  adventure but my favourite ever season was the Wilko promotion, I even
  enjoyed the years in the 3rd Divison especially the away trips to small
  towns that we 'took over'
  
  The owners should be someone seen but not heard - we should not even know
  who they are (not in the Bates shell corporation way) and they should not
  be the topic of conversation - football is about the players (and the
  manager) that is who counts, that is who fans should be talking about and
  either praising or criticising
  
  Get it sorted 
  
  Dave
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  Rest In Peace old lad
  28th Oct 1938 - 12 Nov 2013
  MARCHING ON TOGETHER
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[LU] New bid ....

[Guy Thornton]

How come no one has posted anything about an apparent new bid, as reported by 
Phil Hay this 
morning in the YEP:  
http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/fresh-takeover-bid-for-le
eds-united-1-6416261

Text of article below but first comment on our beloved club I got from friend, 
ex- Benelux white till he 
moved from Brussels back to Scotland and occasional lister: 
Are we like the well brought up, pretty girls, that somehow are attracted to 
the worst cads in the city? 
(I like that word - cad, just seems to bring great images to mind.)

guy

Opposition to Massimo Cellino´s takeover of Leeds United will increase today 
when a rival group of 
buyers meet with Gulf Finance House for talks about an alternative deal for the 
club.

Officials from GFH, the Bahraini bank which owns Leeds, are to receive a bid 
matching the price 
agreed with Cellino last week after the wild events of Friday and Saturday 
prompted a late attempt to 
stop the Italian acquiring a 75 per cent stake.

The new consortium, which brings together members of two separate groups who 
have bid 
unsuccessfully to buy Leeds in the past, will ask GFH for an immediate 
agreement which negates 
their plan to sell a controlling interest to Cellino.

Cellino has been on the verge of buying Leeds since he and GFH finalised the 
terms of a takeover 
last Friday, two days after an offer put together by the Sport Capital 
consortium fell apart.

One of the figures behind the Sport Capital proposal - Enterprise Insurance 
managing director 
Andrew Flowers - is understood to be pushing the latest offer to GFH.

After talks between the pair, Flowers has aligned himself with Mike Farnan, the 
Irishman whose 
Together Leeds consortium had an offer for United rejected by GFH in November.

The new group have been encouraged to approach GFH by the fact that Cellino´s 
takeover is still 
incomplete.

The Cagliari owner and GFH are yet to exchange contracts and events in the past 
24 hours indicate a 
turning of the tide against Cellino.

Club manager Brian McDermott officially returned to work yesterday morning, 
three days after Cellino 
sacked him and sparked angry protests against the decision.

The dismissal was revoked by GFH which said Cellino lacked the authority to 
change manager until 
his takeover was officially complete.

The 57-year-old´s position seemed to weaken further yesterday when lawyer Chris 
Farnell - the man 
responsible for sacking McDermott via telephone - was escorted out of Elland 
Road by security and 
two members of United´s board.

Farnell is understood to have been at the stadium with a view to completing the 
paperwork for 
Cellino´s takeover. His failure to do so is an indication that GFH might yet 
consider alternative ways of 
selling their majority stake.

Cellino´s deal remains subject to Football League approval, though there were 
credible claims last 
night that he will pass

the governing body´s Owners and Directors Test due to the fact that his two 
convictions for fraud in 
Italy are classed as spent.

Flowers, however, is threatening to take the Football League to court if it 
approves Cellino´s takeover 
and he has appointed Timothy Dutton QC to prepare a legal case in the event 
that the Cellino 
purchase goes ahead.

The Football League issued an unusually prompt statement on Saturday, 
confirming that it was 
already in preliminary discussions with Cellino about its stipulations.

Both the League and the club are the focus of much attention following the 
aborted sacking of 
McDermott which appears to have cost Leeds two major sponsors.

McDermott held a lengthy press briefing yesterday in which he again urged GFH 
to bring its shambolic 
search for buyers to an end and remove the uncertainty hanging over Elland Road.

Asked how safe his position was with Cellino free to sack him if full control 
of Leeds comes his way, 
McDermott said: I can´t answer that question.

It´s just about moving forward the best way we possibly can and putting this 
to bed, put what´s 
happened to bed.

The ownership needs to be resolved very, very quickly.
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Re: [LU] NONLU: bloody hell.....

[Guy Thornton]

To be strictly accurate what he said about the reporter was when I see him (on 
TV) he makes me 
think of the gas chambers. Well that's the translation I heard (but may have 
been 'reminds me of' 
rather than 'thinks of'). 
Maybe Damian or someone who has heard the piece and got better French than me 
can give the 
exact translation.
And on things French and reedom of speech while I agree with the sentiment of 
I may not agree with 
what you say I'll defend your right to say it freedom of speech is fine with a 
society of sensible, 
responsible, sane people but sadly there's a lot more around who aren't and 
when it comes to inciting 
racial hatred, rousing people to violence and more there's limits to freedom of 
speech.

guy

On 23 Jan 2014 at 12:03, Ed Morrish wrote:

I would argue that a three thousand year old spiritual insignia that was 
adopted for a span of 25 years 
by anti-Semites has a different order of legitimacy than a gesture invented by 
a man who told a 
Jewish reporter, You should be sent to a gas chamber being adopted by 
anti-Semites almost 
instantaneously.

But that's just my personal view.

 On 23 Jan 2014, at 00:11, Eric B barl...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 The point is that that Buddhism is represented by a symbol that has since
 been tarnished by the nazis.
 Similar to the quenelle.
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Re: [LU] Eusebio R.I.P.

[Guy Thornton]

On 5 Jan 2014 at 18:20, Rick Duniec wrote:

 sad news 

Sad news indeed.
He was a great player and I had the privilege of seeing him play. 
Remember this was in the days before wall-to-wall football on television. 
Hardly any highlights, never 
mind live games. 
The 1966 World Cup I got to three Portuguese games - a group match against 
Bulgaria, the SF 
against England and the 3rd and 4th place game against Russia (where I also saw 
one of my great 
heroes, Lev Yashin). 
I only saw the highlights, eventually, of probably his greatest game, the QF 
against North Korea as I 
was at England's match against Argentina. North Korea 3-0 up after 20 minutes. 
Eusebio then scored 
four, final score 5-3. (I'd been to Ayrsome Park to see North Korea beat Italy 
1-0 to qualify for the QF's 
at Italy's expense, Pak Du Ik scoring the only goal almost running between the 
Italians legs).

Eusebio was - no, is - one of the footballing greats. A legend.

guy





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Re: [LU] Harrogate Town

[Guy Thornton]

Harrogate are suppoosed to have a pretty good keeper who is creating quite a 
bit of interest 
among various league clubs.

At least the game took place even it was in the rain, presumably no flooding. 
How about 
with you and the polar vortex. You haven't frozen solid yet. or at least you 
can still think of 
things Leeds and not just keeping warm? Okay, the Green Bay Packers may have 
played 
their game though I believe fans had multilple layers of clothing - one said 
three lots of 
thermal underwar, two ski pants. windproof trousers and jacket plus blankets. 
And then 
there's the story of a prisoner who esccaped from jail who turned himself back 
in because it 
was to cold outside.

guy

On 8 Jan 2014 at 16:21, Tim Greenwood wrote:

 Forget that I mentioned it. Lost 3-1 to the mighty Harrogate Town in the
 rain.
 
 
 
 On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 2:51 PM, Tim Greenwood timo...@greenwood.namewrote:
 
  Just by chance I looked at the Harrogate Advertiser website to see that we
  are playing Harrogate Town - right now, with no mention of this clash of
  the titans on this list.
 
  No score after 20 minutes.
 
  Tim
 
 
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Re: [LU] Forrest

[Guy Thornton]

Never happened to me with a football match but I did manage it with cricket. 
Was covering a game in 
Taunton between Somerset and the Netherlands. Got down there to find I'd come a 
day to early. Ended up 
stoppng the night in Taunton having found a pub with accomodation. Real 
hardship !

guy

On 28 Dec 2013 at 18:12, Robert Heath wrote:

I very nearly did the same thingand I've got history
as well...I once turned up at Boothferry Park 24 hrs before
kickoff.

Sent from my iPad

 On Dec 28, 2013, at 4:23 PM, Richard walker richleed...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

 There's a guy on Twitter who travelled to Nottingham today. Obviously nobody 
 there.


 Sent from my iPad

 On 28 Dec 2013, at 15:46, Dr Michael Benjamin m...@myray.com wrote:

 Can't see that either
 On 28 Dec 2013 17:43, Steve Mosley st...@stevemosley.org wrote:

 Apologies for the awful typo'. I hate autocorrect.

 -Original Message-
 From: leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org [mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org]
 On Behalf Of Steve Mosley
 Sent: 28 December 2013 15:40
 To: m...@myray.com; LEEDSLIST
 Subject: Re: [LU] Forrest

 You're signs are 24 hours premature.

 You can probably get treatment for that...

 Steve.

 -Original Message-
 From: leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org [mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org]
 On Behalf Of Dr Michael Benjamin
 Sent: 28 December 2013 15:38
 To: LEEDSLIST
 Subject: [LU] Forrest

 Are we playing today at three?
 I see signs.
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[LU] who's ths scoring a goal then?

[Guy Thornton]

If nothing else Leeds feature as one of 5 live's top ten best goal commentaries 
of 2013.

Can you work out which match and who scored it before you take a look? ...

 ...http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01nwn4g

have a good christmas/festive season
guy


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Re: [LU] Max Gradel

[Guy Thornton]

Remember Troyes?
Indeed, those where the days. We filled a mini-bus down to the game.Started in 
Amsterdam picking others 
up on the way through Netherlands and Belgium. Got down there mid-afternoonish, 
met up with other 
listers and leeds fans. Lots of good craick, good few and not a small amount of 
alcohol.
Good game to, outsung the Troyes supporters. The the journey back after the 
game. Me and John got the 
mini-bus back to the hire firm about 6.00 in the morning. As they opened at 
7.00 rather than just leave it 
there and have to come back later we went and found a market cafe already open 
and drank coffee till time 
to go back and be on the door as they opened. Got everything settled up and 
went home to bed

guy
 
On 17 Dec 2013 at 13:12, m...@leeds-united.net wrote:

Ligue Un isn't a rich league. PSG and Monaco have rich benefactors now and 
marseilles are traditionally a 
top european club but most clubs get championship or lower crowds and I guess 
championship and lower 
wages.

They also have the threat of a new 75% tax band coming in which will either see 
clubs go bust or players 
desert the league

Anyone remember the game v Troyes. Only about 15000 for the visit of world 
footballing power Leeds 
United and I reckon a big minority were Leeds fans


Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device

-Original Message-
From: Phill Shields phillshie...@hotmail.com
Sender: leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2013 13:05:48 
To: p...@cundell.comp...@cundell.com; 
leedslist@gn.apc.orgleedslist@gn.apc.org
Subject: Re: [LU] Max Gradel

You may be right about his agent being behind this Paul. Apparently his 
contract with St Etienne expires in 
2015 so the timing would fit with your assessment. This time it feels to have 
more legs about it for me 
though.

 

As regards swapping French top tier with our 2nd tier I do not think that is an 
issue. Apart from PSG I 
reckon wages in English Championship would be comparable with most French clubs 
and definitely St 
Etienne.

 

I've already said he'd follow the money so I don't think the World Cup is a 
factor.

 

You will have gathered I hope it is his agent behind this and I personally am 
not bothered about having him 
back.

 

MOT 
 

 Subject: Re: [LU] Max Gradel
 To: phillshie...@hotmail.com; leedslist@gn.apc.org
 From: p...@cundell.com
 Date: Tue, 17 Dec 2013 12:53:21 +
 
  Seems that us being linked with bringing back Gradel is more than just 
  media speculation. 
 
 
 If it is more than media speculation is it not just an agent trick for an 
 improved contract? 
 He is highly thought of at St Etienne who are French First Division and its 
 World Cup season, why would he really want to come to the obscurity of the 
 English 2nd tier?
 Cheers
 Paul
 
  
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Re: [LU] Sad news - Padraig O'Conail RIP

[Guy Thornton]

Thanks James for the news sad though it is.

James had let me know the news about Padraig a couple of months ago and I've 
been back in touch with 
him since then not having heard from him for a while - now I knew why.

A good lad was Padraig. I've got a Dublin supporters club polo he gave me when 
a group of them came 
over to Amsterdam for an Irish game and I took them round. Apart from Leeds we 
also shared a passion 
for cycling and Le Tour. He was an active contributed in the tour/cycling list 
a group of us started some 
time ago where he was know as the Peleton Paddy.

Considering this had been going on some time, since at last early 2006, he 
looked remarkably well. It did 
look like treatment had worked but last year was told it had metastasised and 
then, earlier this year, that it 
was active. Even though it was expected the news is still a shock. Now I know 
why I hadn't had a reply to 
my last mail.

Padraig, we'll miss you
guy


On 16 Dec 2013 at 9:35, James A. Lundon @ Yahoo! wrote:

Folks,

Many of the older people on the list will remember Padraig well -
a Dublin White of 40+ years standing.  He appeared on the list
with a bang in late-94/early-95 - would need to check but am 
fairly sure.  

He was a beacon of light hereabouts for many years after that.  

He first got cancer about 7 years ago, got a clean bill of
health, and went on his merry way for another 5.5 years.  It came
back into his life 18 months ago but was well for a year after
that again.  It got aggressive in the last 6 months and the
prognosis was not good; so much so that the end came, as his
sister says below, very quickly! 

May the man rest easy now, though he was very sanguine about it
when I spoke to him about five weeks ago and through a chain of
e-mail I received from him right up to a few days ago. 

Our win at Donny will have sent him on his way a little happier
than a draw or defeat would have :-).

James.


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Re: [LU] John Sykes

[Guy Thornton]

Dear Brenda and Cindy,

Thank you for you mail and letting us all know. I realize it is a sad time for 
you and the rest of 
the family but rest assured that the feelings and sympathy of the list are with 
you all. 
Maybe not as much as you but we will all miss John. Geographically he may have 
been a long 
way from Leeds but the list brings us all together and he was part of it and 
contributed to it.
His love and passion for Leeds was self-evident, as well as many other sports 
which clearly 
included ice hockey.
I'm glad to hear the interest in soccer[sic} is being carried on in the rest 
of the family. As you 
say his legacy lives on.
Though it is sad he is no longer here at least it sounds like his passing was 
quick and. 
hopefully, without to much pain. Our commiserations are with you all.
And wherever he is now I'm sure he will be happy Leeds won tonight!

Deepest feelings and regards,
Guy

On 2 Dec 2013 at 11:57, JOHN SYKES wrote:

 Hello,

 We are sorry to announce the passing of our father, John Sykes, on
 Nov. 12th.  It was unexpected and quick.  He had been diagnosed with
 cancer and within two weeks he was gone. 
 
 His love for Leeds United was deep. He was even talking about it ,
 despite a stroke that affected his speech. 
 
 We will be disabling this email address at the end of the year. we
 will be trying to monitor it until then. 
 
 Thank you.
 
 Brenda Kawasaki and Cindy Olafson
 Daughters of John Sykes
 
 
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Re: [LU] Satdi

[Guy Thornton]

Pussay, indeed. Some very good memories of visits to Damian and family there.
Getting the Rapide from Paris out to ??? (can't remember which station it was 
but
think it was the end of the line). Still a fair way to Pussay, something like a 
20 min
journey or so if I remember correctly. Pussay, a functional but also charming 
village. The house was great, roomy and robust, up a not quite a cul de sac, 
with
a good garden. The food was superb made even better by the magnificent wines
Damian would produce (and he jokes not about the stone vaults) and all topped
off with convivial company.

Sorry to hear about the misfortune with so many bottles Damian. 

guy

On 30 Nov 2013 at 20:16, Damian Walsh wrote:

 I managed to build up a half decent collection of wine 20 odd years ago
 because friends of mine had a 13th Century farmhouse with huge dry-stone
 vaulted cellars. They live 20 odd km from where I lived so there was no by
 gum that wer a grand bottle, lets bring oop another one (my first cellar
 in the UK only lasted until a particulary boozy night with an alcky friend).
 
 I moved and bought a house with 2 stone vaults, got up to 900 bottles (all
 good good stuff BTW) then moved here - to a modern house, with a modern
 cellar - only to end up pouring more than 300 bottles down the drain and
 taking the enamel off my teeth with another 300.
 
 I've not got the money to vin de garde anymore, for the bottles I lost, I
 got a bit back on the insurance - the so called expert agreed that the
 auction value of the last 300 was 14 000EUR... I got 1980EUR back.
 
 All that too long story to say that you can dream about a cellar, but don't
 buy one built after the war, its not worth it :(
 
 Damian
 
 PS I think at least some of the Lards have drunk the odd bottle in my
 Pussay cellar (the 2 vaults...) - this is going to bring on another mail
 
 
 On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 7:01 PM, Richard walker 
 richleed...@yahoo.co.ukwrote:
 
  'From the cellar ' ???
 
  It's my ambition in life to have a wine cellar.
 
 
 
  Sent from my iPad
 
   On 30 Nov 2013, at 17:45, Damian Walsh pussaydam...@gmail.com wrote:
  
   Just opened a '08 Capitan-Gagnerant Cotes de Nuits Villages. Straight up
   from the cellar so a little bit cold but the bottle's in front of the
  fire
   and I have hopes ;)
  
   It's the last bottle I've got from that year. Will I be able to wait a
   couple of years for the '11? In fact will I see out this evening without
  ;)
  
  
   On Sat, Nov 30, 2013 at 6:06 PM, Richard Walker richleed...@yahoo.co.uk
  wrote:
  
   Where's the wine.
  
  
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Re: [LU] Non-LU : The Cold War

[Guy Thornton]

Going to Doncaster, the perfect present?
Okay, it's not actually that bad, got friends there and there are some decent 
pubs.

Did think it a bit of a cheek (as do friends) calling the old RAF airfield 
Robin Hood Airport.
Used it once - an interesting experience

guy


On 18 Nov 2013 at 10:37, John Lee wrote:

Well Guy, I think here's a perfect Xmas present for you 
 
http://www.vulcantothesky.org/appearances/aircraft-tours.html



On Saturday, 16 November 2013, 16:36, sinisterpicturesDB 
sinisterpictu...@dogz-bollox.co.uk wrote:
  
I miss the cold war, things seemed so much simpler then, armageddon, no 
armageddon...

On 16 Nov 2013, at 00:33, Richard Naef rich...@triumph-computers.co.uk wrote:

 I'm not sure about The War Game not being shown because it was too scary, I
 think that was the excuse, but in reality may have been cos it was bad for
 morale and seen as being a recruitment film for CND?  The fear of the bomb
 was a real and present danger, we lived near Chobham Ranges and there were
 often big explosions and I quite often for a split second thought that's
 it, my flesh is about to be melted from my bones
 
 Them youngsters don't know how lucky they are...
 
 Talking of TV, anyone seen Drifters, the female version of the Inbetweeners,
 set in Leeds, uses the Amanda Palmer Leeds United song as the theme tune
 and Elland Road was shown on last nights show.  Like inbetweeners very crude
 and funny at times but might be a bit awkward if you watch it with your
 teenage daughter.
 
 
 
 
 ttfn
 
 Richard
 
 Triumph Computer Services
 01273 505214
 07974870424
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org [mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org] On
 Behalf Of Guy Thornton
 Sent: 15 November 2013 22:38
 To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
 Subject: [LU] Non-LU : The Cold War
 
 Absolutely non LU this.
 
 Who else has been watching the BBC Cold War series? Me for one and it's with
 a mixed feeling and emotions. Younger members of this list may only now
 about it from history, and maybe not even then. For some of us it was
 reality
 
 Just been watching Cold War, Hot Jets. On the one hand I can remember having
 Airfix models of some of those aircraft, followed on from Airfix models of
 second world war military aircraft and ships, and there was a certain
 beauty, and most certainly awe, of the V-bombers and the Lightning. On the
 other hand it was scary. This was the time of MAD (that's Mutually Assured
 Destruction for you youngsters, a term coined in the early 50's). I remember
 '62 and the Cuban Missile Crisis. I may have been a youngster still at
 school but it' remains vivid. Despite turbulence, terrorism and the rest in
 the world today this is probably the nearest we came to world annihilation.
 
 My first reaction to try and do something about it was to join the Civil
 Defence but it didn't take to long to realize how futile that was. Shades of
 Raymond Briggs and there was Peter Jenkin's The War Game. 
 Commissioned by the BBC but they though it too scary to show till many years
 later. Saw it at the filmhouse top of Vicar Lane in Leeds. And then there
 was Dr. Stangelove (or how I learnt to stop worrying and love the war). So
 it became CND and Alderston marches.
 
 That was living in interesting times
 
 Guy
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Re: [LU] Non-LU : The Cold War (but not for this!)

[Guy Thornton]

Thanks Betty,
Pacing myself to make the day last :-)

As for The Cat must work out sometime how many of my lives I've used up :o

cheers,  guy

On 16 Nov 2013 at 12:15, John Boocock wrote:


On 15/11/2013 22:37, Guy Thornton wrote:
 Absolutely non LU this.


Happy Birthday Guy, hope The Cat has a fabulous day

Betty
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[LU] Non-LU : The Cold War

[Guy Thornton]

Absolutely non LU this.

Who else has been watching the BBC Cold War series? Me for one and it's with a 
mixed feeling and 
emotions. Younger members of this list may only now about it from history, and 
maybe not even then. For 
some of us it was reality

Just been watching Cold War, Hot Jets. On the one hand I can remember having 
Airfix models of some of 
those aircraft, followed on from Airfix models of second world war military 
aircraft and ships, and there 
was a certain beauty, and most certainly awe, of the V-bombers and the 
Lightning. On the other hand it 
was scary. This was the time of MAD (that's Mutually Assured Destruction for 
you youngsters, a term 
coined in the early 50's). I remember '62 and the Cuban Missile Crisis. I may 
have been a youngster still at 
school but it' remains vivid. Despite turbulence, terrorism and the rest in the 
world today this is probably 
the nearest we came to world annihilation.

My first reaction to try and do something about it was to join the Civil 
Defence but it didn't take to long to 
realize how futile that was. Shades of Raymond Briggs and there was Peter 
Jenkin's The War Game. 
Commissioned by the BBC but they though it too scary to show till many years 
later. Saw it at the 
filmhouse top of Vicar Lane in Leeds. And then there was Dr. Stangelove (or how 
I learnt to stop worrying 
and love the war). So it became CND and Alderston marches.

That was living in interesting times

Guy
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[LU] Yellow balls

[Guy Thornton]

Asking if it was snowing Mr Walker wondered why the yellow ball. Well ...


YELLOW WINTER FOOTBALLS FROM THIS WEEKEND

From this weekend all 72 Football League clubs will use special yellow
footballs up until the end of February following the introduction of a new 
official match-ball by the Football League from Mitre.

Mitre, the Official Ball Supplier of The Football League, have launched the
new hi-visibility match-ball today (Friday) but Parkinson's side have been
training all week with the new footballs.
 
The Delta V12 Fluo is the hi-visibility version of the most advanced FIFA
approved quality match ball ever made. The fluo yellow colour is
scientifically proven to deliver speedier player reaction times in poor
visibility. The combination of 12 panels and textured grain surface keeps
the ball stable at over 70mph.
 
All matches in the Sky Bet Championship, Sky Bet League 1 and Sky Bet League
2 will use the state of the art new Mitre footballs from this weekend, up
until the end of February.  The ball will also be used in the Johnstone´s
Paint Trophy for the Area Quarter Finals, Area Semi-Finals and Area Finals.
 
***
Weather prediction:
There will be an exceptionally mild christmas and winter with generally clear
skys and little precipitation until the end of February when the country will be
hit by severe snowfall and ice lasting till the end of the season.

guy




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Re: [LU] Ipswich last 30.

[Guy Thornton]

Can't speak for the Germans but most dutch (based) persons don't have their own 
satellite - with 
virtually all the country being on cable a lot of places, including Amsterdam, 
get iffy on folk putting up 
their own satellites. Some areas, where a number of ethinic turks, etc live you 
do see satellites on 
balconys but it's frowned on and there are purges to remove them. The Amsterdam 
skyline does look  
a lot cleaner since the removal of ariels, satellites, etc.

That said we do have access as there's enough cafes and pubs showing games who 
have the 
necessary for it which is how I got watch Saturday. And as said they also had 
all the premier league 
games on other screen plus footie from other countries and various other sports.

Incidentally it's not just Al Jazerra for Championship footbball now. Fox has 
just started here in the 
Netherlands and they have got the rights for showing live Championship games 
here.

guy

On 26 Aug 2013 at 11:07, Matt Anderson wrote:

 If you have access to the hotbird satellite (as I'm sure most
 Dutch/german based people do!?!?!) they show championship games and
 other things like French league on Al Jazeera +3 channel.  

 You need a viaaccess cam (card holder) for your receiver then an Al
 Jazeera card which costs about £100 from eBay. 

 They have just removed the premier league from hotbird at the premier
 leagues request so that's only receivable if you have a 2.5m or larger
 and nilesat. (They show every single premier league game) 

 Matt 


Sent from my iPad

On 25 Aug 2013, at 21:59, Guy Thornton guy.thorn...@inter.nl.net wrote:

 Got to see most of the game courtesy of Al Jazerra. Meant no commentary of 
 course, at least 
 undersandable, but then with with another 15 odd screens in thepub showing 
 other games - 
 everything from rugby league, union, aussie rules and footie (hadn't realized 
 most 15.00 ko 
 premiership games are broadcast) - wouldn't have heard anything anyway.
 
 Yes, first half hour was mainly Ipswich and could have been three goals down 
 but wheren't picked it 
 up and improved. Not going to try and give a detailed report, others already 
 have, but generally I 
 didn't find it that bad, certainlly better than some of the reports from 
 Leicester and other games, and 
 it gives me some hope for this season.
 
 
 
 On 25 Aug 2013 at 0:44, John Lee wrote:
 
 Looked like a game of two halves on telly. Some terrible defending and 
 tactics first half; more 
 balanced and more threat  in the second. I'll take as much luck as we can get 
 until we're safe from 
 the drop. How often have we moaned about unlucky Leeds/last minute goals 
 conceded - nice that 
 the boot is on the other foot.
  
 Not sure about McCormack's shoot from anywhere policy - he's no Gerrard - but 
 as long as they 
 keep deflecting in he'll keep taking pot-shots.
  
 5th place, a manager who doesn't sound like an arse, a manager who knows how 
 (and will) change 
 tactics - it'll do for now!
 
 
 
 From: Damian Walsh pussaydam...@gmail.com
 To: leedslist leedslist@gn.apc.org 
 Sent: Saturday, 24 August 2013, 17:48
 Subject: [LU] Ipswich last 30.
 
 
 No comments yet? Are we all too flabbergasted after the dire early match
 reports?
 
 Away - I got to see the last 30 minswhich is as much of Leeds I've seen in
 a League match for donkey's years.
 
 I didn't see the goals but otherwise I was reasonably impressed. Leeds were
 trying to play possession football (a goal up obviously) and Ipswich
 weren't good enough to expose the weaknesses that are surely there. The
 fact is that not all Leeds players are comfortable on the ball. McCormack
 stands out, Austin looks confident (sometimes misplaced) and Peltier knows
 what he has to do when he gets the ball but the rest didn't look happy
 having to pass the ball about.
 
 I was surprised by Warnock who played like he was frightened to death by
 the ball. I had expected him to be much more comfortable.
 
 Austin played some classy and assured 30 yard passes but screwed up his 5
 yard ones. I wonder if he's got a concentration problem?
 
 Finally Poleon, when he came on, had some good runs but went nowhere.
 Partly I think because it never occurred to him that he's allowed to shoot
 when he gets sight of the goal. He cut inside several times on the edge of
 the box but then didn't know what to do - the Ipswich defenders sussed him
 out straight away and could afford to stand off him a bit when he was
 central, something they didn't do at all when he was wide.
 
 Damian MOT
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Re: [LU] Ipswich last 30.

[Guy Thornton]

Got to see most of the game courtesy of Al Jazerra. Meant no commentary of 
course, at least 
undersandable, but then with with another 15 odd screens in thepub showing 
other games - 
everything from rugby league, union, aussie rules and footie (hadn't realized 
most 15.00 ko 
premiership games are broadcast) - wouldn't have heard anything anyway.

Yes, first half hour was mainly Ipswich and could have been three goals down 
but wheren't picked it 
up and improved. Not going to try and give a detailed report, others already 
have, but generally I 
didn't find it that bad, certainlly better than some of the reports from 
Leicester and other games, and 
it gives me some hope for this season.



On 25 Aug 2013 at 0:44, John Lee wrote:

Looked like a game of two halves on telly. Some terrible defending and tactics 
first half; more 
balanced and more threat  in the second. I'll take as much luck as we can get 
until we're safe from 
the drop. How often have we moaned about unlucky Leeds/last minute goals 
conceded - nice that 
the boot is on the other foot.
 
Not sure about McCormack's shoot from anywhere policy - he's no Gerrard - but 
as long as they 
keep deflecting in he'll keep taking pot-shots.
 
5th place, a manager who doesn't sound like an arse, a manager who knows how 
(and will) change 
tactics - it'll do for now!
 


 From: Damian Walsh pussaydam...@gmail.com
To: leedslist leedslist@gn.apc.org 
Sent: Saturday, 24 August 2013, 17:48
Subject: [LU] Ipswich last 30.
  

No comments yet? Are we all too flabbergasted after the dire early match
reports?

Away - I got to see the last 30 minswhich is as much of Leeds I've seen in
a League match for donkey's years.

I didn't see the goals but otherwise I was reasonably impressed. Leeds were
trying to play possession football (a goal up obviously) and Ipswich
weren't good enough to expose the weaknesses that are surely there. The
fact is that not all Leeds players are comfortable on the ball. McCormack
stands out, Austin looks confident (sometimes misplaced) and Peltier knows
what he has to do when he gets the ball but the rest didn't look happy
having to pass the ball about.

I was surprised by Warnock who played like he was frightened to death by
the ball. I had expected him to be much more comfortable.

Austin played some classy and assured 30 yard passes but screwed up his 5
yard ones. I wonder if he's got a concentration problem?

Finally Poleon, when he came on, had some good runs but went nowhere.
Partly I think because it never occurred to him that he's allowed to shoot
when he gets sight of the goal. He cut inside several times on the edge of
the box but then didn't know what to do - the Ipswich defenders sussed him
out straight away and could afford to stand off him a bit when he was
central, something they didn't do at all when he was wide.

Damian MOT
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Re: [LU] NON-LU: Techy help - UK Proxy

[Guy Thornton]

I'd been meaning to post this the other day when people where asking about 
creating proxies so as 
you're asking ask well here's an option that will work for everyone, and no 
need to be an internet 
techy or any other sort of IT guru.

Just go to http://watch-bbc-iplayer.com. The website is Expat Shield and let's 
you set up a proxy so 
you can iPlayer and the other players for UK channels. The downside is as it's 
free you have to put 
with a bit of advertising at the start when you want to watch something (you 
can pay for a premium ad 
free version) and I know some people whose anti-virus programme went nuts when 
downloading the 
software. It does work though but I only enable it when I need to use it.

There are other options I'm sure others may come up with and I've got a couple 
as well but need to 
check some details first.

guy

On 7 Aug 2013 at 20:23, Peter Castlehouse wrote:

 All knowing list peoples - do we have an internet techy out there who can
 advise how to access a UK-based proxy server for us continental and foreign
 listers, so we can hook into it, then follow the link to Radio Leeds and get
 the comms from the matches that aint deemed worthy of satellite
 broadcasting?
 
  
 
 ozPete
 
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Re: [LU] NON-LU: Techy help - UK Proxy

[Guy Thornton]

Indeed I forgot to mention it doesn't work with Mac (though have heard they're 
working on it)

Don't know the one you mention but will have a look and also checking out some 
others.
Info as soon as they pass muster

guy

On 7 Aug 2013 at 6:48, Nicholas Armit wrote:

 Doesn't or at least didn't work on macs. Try this...costs but a great service:
 
 http://www.vpnauthority.com/
 
 
  From: Guy Thornton guy.thorn...@inter.nl.net
 To: leedslist@gn.apc.org 
 Sent: Wednesday, August 7, 2013 9:08 AM
 Subject: Re: [LU] NON-LU: Techy help - UK Proxy
  
 
 I'd been meaning to post this the other day when people where asking about 
 creating proxies so as 
 you're asking ask well here's an option that will work for everyone, and no 
 need to be an internet 
 techy or any other sort of IT guru.
 
 Just go to http://watch-bbc-iplayer.com. The website is Expat Shield and 
 let's you set up a proxy so 
 you can iPlayer and the other players for UK channels. The downside is as 
 it's free you have to put 
 with a bit of advertising at the start when you want to watch something (you 
 can pay for a premium ad 
 free version) and I know some people whose anti-virus programme went nuts 
 when downloading the 
 software. It does work though but I only enable it when I need to use it.
 
 There are other options I'm sure others may come up with and I've got a 
 couple as well but need to 
 check some details first.
 
 guy
 
 On 7 Aug 2013 at 20:23, Peter Castlehouse wrote:
 
  All knowing list peoples - do we have an internet techy out there who can
  advise how to access a UK-based proxy server for us continental and foreign
  listers, so we can hook into it, then follow the link to Radio Leeds and get
  the comms from the matches that aint deemed worthy of satellite
  broadcasting?
  
   
  
  ozPete
  
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Re: [LU] Non LU: Happy Yorkshire Day

[Guy Thornton]

Glad to see the BBC have finally corrected the live page for this morning's 
Today programme.
The had an interview with Bill Mitchell of The Dalesman on the characteristics 
of a yorkie.
Interesting, as was the previous item on the Zimbabwe elections. Unfortunately 
the live page 
managed to mix them so the Bill Mitchell piece appeared above a map of Zimbabwe.
Thought summat was up with Yorkshire :o
g

Have a Happy Yorkshire day all.


eee lad, I'll be beating my children and eating a plate of gruel in
celebration misen.   meanwhile Sheep all throughout the county will be
combing their hair and fluffing their coats in anticipation of some good
lovin' tonight.


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[LU] Harvey's Career At Bradford And Leeds Helps Him Land FL Role

[Guy Thornton]

As reported in the Yorkshire Post ...

HARVEY'S CAREER AT BRADFORD AND LEEDS CAREER HELPS LAND FL ROLE

SHAUN HARVEY´S extensive experience as a board member of both Leeds United
and Bradford City was a major factor in his appointment as the Football
League´s first chief executive, according to one of the selection panel.

The 43-year-old will start his new role in the Autumn as part of a
restructuring of the governing body´s management team that will involve Greg
Clarke, who has effectively filled the role of chairman and chief executive
in recent years, reverting to a non-executive role.

That will involve Clarke working one day per week, creating the full-time
role that Harvey will step into on October 1. By then, he will have stepped
down from his role as a director at Elland Road.

Once in situ, Harvey, who is expected to be based at the
League´s London offices, will oversee the management and strategic direction
of the League.

League chairman Clarke, one of the five-man selection panel who plumped for
the former Bradford managing director, last night told the Yorkshire Post:
Shaun is someone who has worked in all four divisions of English football
and will bring extensive experience to the role, which is vitally important.

Thanks to his time with Bradford City and Leeds United, he is someone who
understands what the clubs have to deal with and how best to move forward.

The interview process began in May after Clarke had made clear to the clubs
that the demands of steering the League had become such that a change of
approach was needed.

He added: I led the debate about 18 months ago because things were getting
busier and busier. The television deals were getting bigger, as were the
sponsorship deals.

The implementation of the new Financial Fair Play rules has also been
taking over our lives so this appointment is very important. It is part of
the process towards prudent governance, which we all know is vital.

We went through a rigorous selection process after receiving applications
from a lot of good quality candidates. We reduced those to a shortlist of
five and we are delighted that Shaun has agreed to join the League.

Harvey´s appointment to one of the English game´s most senior positions
comes almost exactly 20 years on from his first entry into the
administrative side of football.

His first role was as club secretary of Scarborough during Geoffrey
Richmond´s reign in charge at the McCain Stadium.

After a year, Harvey followed Richmond to Bradford City after the
Leeds-based businessman swapped clubs with then Bantams chairman Dave
Simpson.

Two years as club secretary at Valley Parade was followed by Harvey being
promoted to managing director in the wake of City winning promotion to the
second tier in 1996.

He remained in that role until the summer of 2004 when an offer to become
chief executive at Leeds United was accepted.

James Milner, Alan Smith and Paul Robinson had just been sold as the board,
then headed by Gerald Krasner, fought to cope with the financial fallout of
relegation from the Premier League.

Ken Bates took charge at Elland Road in January, 2005, and kept Harvey in
the post after being particularly impressed by his businesslike approach
during the negotiations.

On his new job with the League, Harvey said: As someone who has served
Football League clubs for most of my working life, it is a great privilege
to be appointed to this role.

I have the very highest regard for the people who run our football clubs
and I look forward to working with them, as well as all those with a stake
in our game, to deliver a vibrant and sustainable Football League.

Earlier this month, Harvey´s nine-year stint as Leeds´s chief executive came
to an end as part of a restructuring plan.

He has since been replaced by Paul Hunt, with David Haigh becoming managing
director and Salah Nooruddin being appointed chairman.

Hunt is expected to deal with the day-to-day running of the club, while
Haigh and Nooruddin focus on bringing in investment to Elland Road.


Now, having read that ...
a)  are you rolling around in fits of laughter
b)  open mouthed, jaw dropped and breath taken
c)  a grunt of so what's new
d)  the future is 

guy

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Re: [LU] is everyone dead ?

[Guy Thornton]

Some of us are from a generation when to support your team you went to games 
with a scarf, wore 
rosettes and a woolly hat. There where no replica shirts in those days never 
mind city centre club shops 
and outlets at grounds where few and far between.

Leeds though where the first club to start selling shirts to fans in 1975 with 
specially designed replica 
shirts.and I do have some classic replica shirts but as I don't like ads on 
shirts all pre-date 1982(?), 
when RFW where the first, and mostly pure white with LUFC script, including the 
centenary cup final, 
and the smiley variations.Plus I've got a John Charles 50's era retro shirt, 
amber/gold with blue sleeves 
and collar

guy

  DRB wrote:
  I'm guessing there are loads and loads of fans who buy every kit,
 religiously, regardless of the style of colouring. 
 
 I certainly used to.  It became more of a collection thing than anything - I
 had every home and away shirt that was on sale between 1989 and sometime in
 the early 2000's.  They're all still on their own shelf in my wardrobe, even
 though most of them haven't seen the light of day for years.  I certainly
 didn't like them all when I bought them - but there were a couple (e.g. the
 'puke-on-the-shoulder', blue Admiral kit) that I wasn't going to bother
 with, but then picked up for a tenner at the end of the season, just to keep
 the collection going...
 
 Nigel
 (the Dublin one)
 
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Re: [LU] is everyone dead ?

[Guy Thornton]

They where indeed used at the '72 cup final but the 71/72 season saw there 
introduction so where first 
used earlier in the season.
The scripted LUFC logo was first used in the 71 Inter-Cities Fairs Cup victory 
against Juventus

guy
(not dead, just melting)

 I think those tags were introduced in FA cup final 1972.
 
 aaPee
 
 2013/7/23 Nicholas Armit arm...@yahoo.com:
  As a kid in 70's London I had the kit with the tags on the socks (wore 
  those too.) When was that? Vividly remember wearing it all for my birthday 
  and playong on Palewell Commonjust can't remember which birthday.
 
 
  
   From: Guy Thornton guy.thorn...@inter.nl.net
  To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
  Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2013 11:29 AM
  Subject: Re: [LU] is everyone dead ?
 
 
  Some of us are from a generation when to support your team you went to 
  games with a scarf, wore
  rosettes and a woolly hat. There where no replica shirts in those days 
  never mind city centre club shops
  and outlets at grounds where few and far between.
 
  Leeds though where the first club to start selling shirts to fans in 1975 
  with specially designed replica
  shirts.and I do have some classic replica shirts but as I don't like ads on 
  shirts all pre-date 1982(?),
  when RFW where the first, and mostly pure white with LUFC script, including 
  the centenary cup final,
  and the smiley variations.Plus I've got a John Charles 50's era retro 
  shirt, amber/gold with blue sleeves
  and collar
 
  guy
 
   DRB wrote:
   I'm guessing there are loads and loads of fans who buy every kit,
  religiously, regardless of the style of colouring.
 
  I certainly used to.  It became more of a collection thing than anything - 
  I
  had every home and away shirt that was on sale between 1989 and sometime in
  the early 2000's.  They're all still on their own shelf in my wardrobe, 
  even
  though most of them haven't seen the light of day for years.  I certainly
  didn't like them all when I bought them - but there were a couple (e.g. the
  'puke-on-the-shoulder', blue Admiral kit) that I wasn't going to bother
  with, but then picked up for a tenner at the end of the season, just to 
  keep
  the collection going...
 
  Nigel
  (the Dublin one)
 
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Re: [LU] NON LU: EC ruling on world cup and euro champs

[Guy Thornton]

Not quite. The UK protected sports list may have initiated all this but the 
ruling is by the European 
Couurt of Justice and appliies to all European member states (and the UK was 
not the only country 
fighting pay-tv). Here's the full story:

Fifa and Uefa have lost an appeal against a European ruling that the World Cup 
and Euro 
Championships should be shown on free-to-air TV in the UK.
In 2011, the European General Court said the UK could keep the events on a list 
of protected 
events of national sporting interest broadcast for free.
It means the two tournaments cannot be sold exclusively to pay-TV firms.
Fifa and Uefa had appealed, after saying they could not sell the events fairly 
for their real 
value.
But the European Court of Justice - Europe's Supreme Court - has now said the 
original 
decision in the General Court (formerly Court of First Instance) in 2011 was 
correct. 
Big money 
The BBC and ITV had already secured the rights to broadcast the football World 
Cup finals in 
2014, and they were guaranteed of being shown free-to-air.
But there had been fears that moves towards a pay-TV model would have been in 
place in time 
for the 2018 World Cup in Russia, should Fifa and Uefa have won their case.
The court said it dismisses the appeals brought by Fifa and Uefa in their 
entirety.
Fifa earned a minimum of $2bn (£1,3bn) in TV and media rights deals for the 
South Africa 
2010 World Cup, and Uefa makes hundreds of millions of dollars from the sale of 
its TV rights 
to the European Championships.
Pay-TV rights for football are currently big business, as seen by the huge sums 
paid by BT 
Sports and Sky in the latest Premier League TV deal, which kicks off in the 
forthcoming 
2013/14 season.
BT has spent £738m over three years for the rights to 38 live matches a season. 
and Sky paid 
£2.3bn for 116 matches a season.
'Major importance' 
Even if Fifa had won its case, World Cup finals games featuring England, 
Scotland, Wales and 
Northern Ireland would have remained free to watch in the UK, as would the 
opening games, 
semi-finals and the final.
But it was the other dozens of games featuring non-UK teams that Fifa was 
disputing - and had 
argued that matches such as these should not be shown for free in the 
UK.{PRIVATE TYPE=PICT;ALT=Spain celebrate a goal against Paraguay in the 2010 
World Cup}
Fifa and Uefa had argued that the current set-up interfered with their ability 
to sell television 
rights at the best commercial price they could get in the marketplace.
However, the UK argued that all the 64 World Cup finals matches and 31 European 
Championship matches were an important part of the list of national sporting 
crown jewels, 
that have to be made available to the whole population to watch on terrestrial 
television.
And the court agreed, saying that European states were able to select broadcast 
events, which 
they deem to be of major importance for society and show them for free.
Otherwise it would deprive a substantial proportion of the public of the 
possibility of 
following those events on free television.
'Rebuffed' 
Belgium was also successful in keeping the rights to World Cup and European 
Championship 
matches on free-to-air services.
Despite the more than two-year wait for the result of the appeal by Fifa and 
Uefa, many experts 
had expected the decision to go against them.
The result means that Uefa and Fifa have now reached the end of their European 
Court 
journey, said Daniel Geey, a TV sports rights expert at Field Fisher 
Waterhouse law firm. {PRIVATE TYPE=PICT;ALT=Watching England during the 2010 
World Cup} 
Their aim was to try and secure concessions to market some of their World Cup 
and Euro 
matches to pay-TV channels in the UK and Belgium with the ultimate aim of 
maximising their 
revenues. 
The European courts have rebuffed such an approach.
The case has been working its way through the European courts for the past five 
years, with 
Fifa and Uefa lodging legal papers just before the Euro 2008 football 
championships.
In its ruling the court said it was for the [European] member states alone to 
determine the 
events which are of major importance to their viewing publics.
It also said that all the matches in the final stages of the World Cup and 
Euros actually 
attracted sufficient attention from the public to form part of an event of 
major importance.
The court also pointed out that the tournaments in their entirety, have always 
been very 
popular among the general public and not only viewers who generally follow 
football matches 
on television. 
'Strength of feeling' 
In 2009 former BBC journalist and FA chief executive David Davies chaired a 
panel which 
looked at the way the listing system of sporting crown jewels was drawn up.
Following the latest European court decision he said he could see both sides of 
the 
broadcasting argument.
I can't say I am surprised by the decision, as I know the strength of feeling 
on this issue, he 
said.
I have 

Re: [LU] Leedslist Digest, Vol 37, Issue 27

[Guy Thornton]

Sorry Eric,
Cricket is the new football and Leeds are the new Yorkshire. Why they already 
where whites.
You better get used to it.
guy
(btw I don't think you can have a nonLU when a digest is created)

 NON LU anyone? wheres the subject line?
 
 nr 1 cricket hater,
 Eric
 
 
 On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 1:59 AM, Robert Heath rhe...@asd.edu.qa wrote:
 
  Alan,
 
  I am in the deepest depths of rural France, so not thart many pubs with
  Sky! (Incredibly, I did see a new enterprise called Le Fair Play in a
  small village on the way to Perpignan the other week though..so
  on day one, I made the 30 min drive over there in the hope that they would
  have Sky Sports. I walked in and asked Ca, c'est un pub anglais, oui? And
  the bloke said Non, c'est neerlandais! Twat!)
 
  No coverage in my daily paper either (L'Equipe).
 
 
  On 15 July 2013 15:54, Alan Edgar alan.ed...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
 
  
I did not think he touched it even with hotspot etc but now I have seen
   snicko I am convinced
  
   I heard the edge when watching it on TV - another howler from Dar.
  
Plus Haddin did look behind straightaway which is a bit of a giveaway
   for a batsman - cheating Aussie should have walked !
  
   They only walk when their ute breaks down.
   No problem with that - indeed it's only the pompous UK media that berated
   Broad for standing his ground.
  
   Play to the whistle - wait for the umpires decision.
  
I'll be @ lord's on thursday for the next installment. Can't wait!
   
   I had 2 great days at Trent Bridge on Friday  Saturday - hoping it goes
   the distance again this weekend as I only have Lords ticket for day 5 so
   far.
  
Who watched it though ? Not many beer gardens with big screens.
  
   Screen is big enough if you're sitting 2 yards away from your TV with a
   chilled bottle of Hoegaarden in your hand.
  
Good point. I found a really good stream and watched it on my computer,
   but sitting on a hard chair in front of a small screen for 5 days was not
   much fun.
  
   No pubs showing it round your way, Rob ?
  
   Lions, Murray, Froome and Ashes - consecutive weekends of sporting
  success
   rarely achieved in the UK.
  
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Re: [LU] Andy Murray

[Guy Thornton]

And, if II remember rightly, wasn't it filmed at Valley Parade?

guy

On 8 Jul 2013 at 11:04, Mick Cooney wrote:

 It was a Monty Python sketch where aliens were turning everyone into
 Scotsmen so the aliens could win Wimbledon.
 -- 
 Mick Cooney
 mickcoo...@gmail.com

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[LU] Ian Harte signs ...

[Guy Thornton]

Ian Harte has signed for Bournemouth on a one-year deal, having been released 
by Reading at the end 
of the season. He's impressed me since he was playing for Leeds, said 
Cherries gaffer Eddie Howe, 
who clearly didn't think much of the Irishman's formative years playing for St. 
Kevins in Dublin.

(from The Fiver)

hope no one had convulsions when they saw the subject line

guy
(not reaching for my coat but another beer[not tetley's])
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Re: [LU] I had a dream....

[Guy Thornton]

Just when did youu last drink a pint of Tetley's Andy? You to Ian come to that?
John's the only one who's got it right and he's in Canada.
Tetley's is now owned by  Carlsberg and is currently produced for them at 
Bank's in Wolverhamton, 
except Bank's is not know as Bank's, aka Wolverhampton and Dudley, any more but 
Marston's after a 
buying spree starting back to the late 1990's saw them take over Marston's, 
Mansfield, Jennings, 
Eldridge Pope, Ringwood, Brakspear and Wychwood. They decided Marston's was 
nicer name for the 
conglomerate.  
Oh, and Carslberg closed the historic Tetley Leeds brewery in 2011. 

There's far better local options to drink these days.

guy

On 27 Jun 2013 at 6:48, Andy Pyzer wrote:

 
 last night ...very vivid . that I took over LUFC, immediately got rid of 
 Bates, took the press down the pub whilst ordering Tetley bitter and debating 
 the best players of LUFC history whilst lamenting on the fact that players 
 today just ain't what they used to be... and they are only in it for the money
  
 what was even more odd is that I alerted all to this list and admitted that I 
 ran the club with the backing of several of the voices on this esteemed 
 international panel and if people didn't like it they could bugger off
  
 then I had another dream about a woman I know who just had a boob job and 
 likes girls you don't want to know about that one...
  
 I need to get out more or drink less
  
 MOT folks
 
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Re: [LU] Fixtures. Start with Home to Brighton

[Guy Thornton]

It's football Jim, er Dave, but not as we knew it.
(bring back the cloth cap and whippets)
[the past is another country]

and now Murdoch is turning his eyes to the Netherlands intending to do with Fox 
what's he's alredy 
done to the UK (he's aldready got a 51% interest in the dutch 
ere{premiership]divisie)

guy

On 19 Jun 2013 at 12:58, nat...@sky.com wrote:

 Never really understood how Sky go into raptures over the fixture list and go 
 interviewing managers and players etc
 We each play every other team twice - once at home and once away , end of 
 story !
 
 Ok there may be individual matches certain fans look forward to more than 
 others but you know you will be playing them. My only concern is to look at 
 dates to see which matches I miss through holidays or other commitments, the 
 rest of it is just non sensical hype
 
 dave
 
 
 
  From: Nigel Sykes ni...@sykesonline.com
 To: Leedslist@gn.apc.org 
 Sent: Wednesday, 19 June 2013, 12:51
 Subject: Re: [LU] Fixtures. Start with Home to Brighton
  
 
  http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/leeds-united/fixtures
 
 Is it just me, or is there absolutely nothing whatsoever to get excited
 about in this fixture list?
 
 A few (quite a few, actually) half-arsed derby games, all of which mean much
 more to the other teams than us... that's about it!
 
 Nigel
 (the Dublin one)
 
 
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Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over here - Test

[Guy Thornton]

Hi Sarge,
Pretty well any of the pubs Morse uses are okay but here's some centrally 
placed:
- Chequers 131 High Street
- Far from the Madding Crowd 10-12 Friars Entry (alley off Magdalen St)
- Bear Inn 6 Alfred Street
- Lamb  Flag 12 St Giles
- White Horse 52 Broad Street (between Blackwells, Oxford's smallest pub)

Enjoy. I'm off to Berlin tomorrow!
guy


On 5 Jun 2013 at 13:30, Leeds List wrote:

 Hi Guy,
 Off to Oxford tomorrow night - any pub recommendations please ?
 Thanks,
 Sarge

 Sent from my iPhone

 On 4 Jun 2013, at 16:05, Guy Thornton guy.thorn...@inter.nl.net wrote:

  Don't forget I too am disabled.
  Maybe not a mobility scooter but being on crutches I think counts.
  Yes, there are options for disabled - you could probably have got a 
  mobility scooter on loan.
  (That said the dutch social services are having similar problems to the UK 
  with cut backs, part
  of the whole austerity budget syndrome from the economic malaise hitting 
  everywhere)
 
  Surinamese food is quite different from Indonesian. The only real 
  connection being both
  countries are former dutch colonies. Think asian for Indonesian food while 
  for Suriname it's
  more caribbean style. And fish is not mandatory. You can have either or 
  both without fish
  but plently of choice. If nothing else you should have a sate.
 
  guy
 
  On 4 Jun 2013 at 14:59, Steve Gillen wrote:
 
  Do you know Guy, I wish I had got in touch, but
  then we had a good deal of challenges going for
  us - we are both disabled - currently I too am
  having to use a disability scooter due to my knees
  - getting my first replacement operation next week
  by the way and I had to fall in with Paula's
  plans too - I do promise you though, next time we
  will have a beer together and there will be a next
  time - we really took to Holland and Amsterdam as
  some on the list will attest to is they saw some
  of my postings and pictures on Facebook.
 
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Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over here - Test

[Guy Thornton]

Hi Sarge,
Pretty well any of the pubs Morse uses are okay but here's some centrally 
placed:
-   Chequers131 High Street
-   Far from the Madding Crowd  10-12 Friars Entry (alley off Magdalen 
St)
-   Bear Inn6 Alfred Street
-   Lamb  Flag 12 St Giles
-   White Horse 52 Broad Street (between Blackwells, 
Oxford's smallest pub)

Enjoy. I'm off to Berlin tomorrow!
guy


On 5 Jun 2013 at 13:30, Leeds List wrote:

 Hi Guy,
 Off to Oxford tomorrow night - any pub recommendations please ?
 Thanks,
 Sarge
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On 4 Jun 2013, at 16:05, Guy Thornton guy.thorn...@inter.nl.net wrote:
 
  Don't forget I too am disabled. 
  Maybe not a mobility scooter but being on crutches I think counts.
  Yes, there are options for disabled - you could probably have got a 
  mobility scooter on loan.
  (That said the dutch social services are having similar problems to the UK 
  with cut backs, part
  of the whole austerity budget syndrome from the economic malaise hitting 
  everywhere)
  
  Surinamese food is quite different from Indonesian. The only real 
  connection being both
  countries are former dutch colonies. Think asian for Indonesian food while 
  for Suriname it's
  more caribbean style. And fish is not mandatory. You can have either or 
  both without fish
  but plently of choice. If nothing else you should have a sate.
  
  guy
  
  On 4 Jun 2013 at 14:59, Steve Gillen wrote:
  
  Do you know Guy, I wish I had got in touch, but
  then we had a good deal of challenges going for
  us - we are both disabled - currently I too am
  having to use a disability scooter due to my knees
  - getting my first replacement operation next week
  by the way  and I had to fall in with Paula's
  plans too - I do promise you though, next time we
  will have a beer together and there will be a next
  time - we really took to Holland and Amsterdam as
  some on the list will attest to is they saw some
  of my postings and pictures on Facebook.
  
  WE saw lots of Indonesian outlets as you say as
  well as Surinamese food (is that the same?) - and
  we did indeed see Herring stalls, but Paula was
  having some problems with her digestion at the
  time and frankly, fish would have been over the
  limit for her.
  
  One place we ate that was truly great was the Half
  Moon restaurant ( De Halve Maen)in Sloten (just
  over the road from the Windmill) and we were made
  very welcome by a waiter there called Rob - he's
  an Ajax fan and we had a good time discussing
  football and dissing Eindhoven!  :-)  The food was
  lovely if you get a chance to go there and  can
  thoroughly recommend the Asparagus soup - that
  white asparagus soup is wonderful stuff isn't it?
  
  We'll try that other place the next time we are
  there - Thanks for that.
  
  An we'll also try the place John Lee has suggested
  to me, a sort of Dutch Beamish in a place called
  Zaanse Schans  But this will be a few months
  or even next year before I can do this as I have 2
  upcoming operations on my knees, as I said the
  first one being next week.
  
  One thing worth mentioning - a very kind Dutch
  person saw my blue disabled badge in the car and
  suggested a place for me to go - can't recall the
  name now, but is  in central Amsterdam, and if
  anyone wants to know I have it written down and
  the documents are in my fire safe - I went and
  showed my disabled credentials and car details and
  they issued a notice that I can park for free in
  Amsterdam centre for the next 12 months - no
  notice on the screen at all (unless in designated
  disabled parking, then the badge is required) -
  quite a decent saving - nice people the Dutch,
  aren't they?
  
  Cheers
  
  Steve
  
  -Original Message-
  From: leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org
  [mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org] On Behalf Of
  Guy Thornton
  Sent: 04 June 2013 10:27
  To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
  Subject: Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over
  here - Test
  
  So you made it to Amsterdam Steve. 
  Great, but you didn't get in touch. Shame.
  Could have pointed you in the direction of 'dutch'
  food, though most traditional dutch food tends to
  be winter fare (mind you, with the weather we've
  been having). As you say the croquettes aren't bad
  but did you get to try Nieuwe Haring (herring)?
  That's real dutch. And what about an Indonesian
  meal? 
  (which is dutch in the same way Indian food is
  British).
  You may have gone to the Sloten windmill but what
  about the one in Oost? That has the 'Ij brewery as
  well with tasting local to try the products.
  
  guy
  
  On 4 Jun 2013 at 9:28, Steve Gillen wrote:
  
  Hahaha Thanks Ian
  
  It was indeed the long awaited European Tour
  
  WE started off with a night in a premier in near
  to the channel tunnel 
  in Folkestone - nice hotel, can recommend it if
  you are travelling 
  that way

Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over here - Test

[Guy Thornton]

So you made it to Amsterdam Steve. 
Great, but you didn't get in touch. Shame.
Could have pointed you in the direction of 'dutch' food, though most 
traditional dutch food tends to be 
winter fare (mind you, with the weather we've been having). As you say the 
croquettes aren't bad but 
did you get to try Nieuwe Haring (herring)? That's real dutch. And what about 
an Indonesian meal? 
(which is dutch in the same way Indian food is British).
You may have gone to the Sloten windmill but what about the one in Oost? That 
has the 'Ij brewery as 
well with tasting local to try the products.

guy

On 4 Jun 2013 at 9:28, Steve Gillen wrote:

 Hahaha Thanks Ian
 
 It was indeed the long awaited European Tour
 
 WE started off with a night in a premier in near
 to the channel tunnel in Folkestone - nice hotel,
 can recommend it if you are travelling that way..
 
 Into France and a night in Rheims - champagne
 region - very nice - on to Dijon for a look at
 some of the incredible old buildings and churches
 there and good food etc...We love France and will
 always visit there whenever we can...
 
 Next day to Switzerland and a few nights in
 Lucerne - cloudy most of the time, but still
 beautiful, albeit expensive. Lots of souvenirs
 bought (currently Cuckooing in the hall as I type)
 - great place.
 
 Into Munich for a couple of nights (via Austria
 and Lichtenstein) and onto our favourite German
 city, Frankfurt. Visit the Zoo, good food and a
 pleasant hotel. One night in Hanover, not so good
 as it pee'd down the whole time and very few
 places on Earth look good when it's pissing
 down... Final day in Germany in Osnabruck - I
 wanted to visit the museum dedicated to the battle
 of Teutoburg Forest - the one where the Roman
 General Quinctilius Varus lost 3 legions to the
 Germans - but it being Sunday the museum was shut
 - Bugger! We liked Germany, but it didn't get to
 us as well as Holland did.
 
 Into Holland and a stay in a lovely little town
 called Veenendaal - very handy for a visit to
 Nijmegen and Arnhem and also a visit to the
 Airborne museum at Oosterbeek .
 
 3 nights in Amsterdam, doing the usual touristy
 bits of a trip on the canals, a visit to the red
 light district (with Paula along with me) a
 visit to a splendid Windmill museum in Sloten -
 and no, we didn't try any of the strange
 substances in the café's   :-) - Amsterdam is a
 lovely place as is Holland as a whole, we very
 much enjoyed that country and will certainly visit
 there again - As was hinted at, the food was OK in
 Holland, just not especially Dutch (other than the
 beef and chicken croquette things we tried - not
 bad either).
 
 Finally an overnight ferry from Rotterdam to Hull
 and then an hour's drive home (much better than 4
 or 5 hours from Dover)
 
 A Great holiday - we had a good time - Southern
 Europe and the Mediterranean for us next time
 though...
 
 Cheers
 
 Steve
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Ian Murray
 [mailto:ianjamesmur...@hotmail.com] 
 Sent: 04 June 2013 08:07
 To: Steve Gillen
 Cc: Leeds List
 Subject: Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over
 here - Test
 
 I think we've all been waiting to hear about your
 hols Steve! Is this the long awaited trip to
 Holland?
 
 How was the skunk? :-)
 
 I
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On 04/06/2013, at 14:46, Steve Gillen
 steve.gil...@ntlworld.com wrote:
 
  Er... has the list died whilst I was away on
 holiday?
  
  I came home to find some emails, which I read
 but then. nothing! 
  For 2 whole days now
  
  Are we still going?
  
  
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 http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/le
 edslist
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 leedslist-unsubscr...@gn.apc.org
  
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Re: [LU] Great list

[Guy Thornton]

Thanks David, and I comletely agree with you, especially about the (not so) 
special one

The problem is even when you try and talk football related folks still seem to 
be asleep.
I replied a few days to a comment on female managers in a post on a Northern 
Premier League 
Manger who had got a hefty band and fine for extreme agression and abuse to his 
female counterpart 
of another team. Thought it might of got one or two replies but no, it was 
zilch.

BTW I know other footie lists who see the close season as Marmite time. ie free 
to talk and post about 
whatever they fancy there being s*d all footie wise, and there's not even any 
major footie tournaments 
on at the moment. So best curries, fish and chips, pubs and beers anyone?

guy

On 4 Jun 2013 at 13:05, David Brennan wrote:

 I know there are several football purists out there, who don't always like 
 the non-Leeds stuff on this list, and of course you're entitled to your 
 opinion, but for me, it's posts like Steve's holiday blog, and Guy's local 
 knowledge response, that makes this such an interesting group to be part of.  
 Cheers fellas.
 
 And even the purists out there would have to say Steve's 'postcard' is more 
 interesting than anything on Jose chuffing Merino (bahhh) which is wall to 
 wall just now.
 
 DRB
 

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Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over here - Test

[Guy Thornton]

Don't forget I too am disabled. 
Maybe not a mobility scooter but being on crutches I think counts.
Yes, there are options for disabled - you could probably have got a mobility 
scooter on loan.
(That said the dutch social services are having similar problems to the UK with 
cut backs, part
of the whole austerity budget syndrome from the economic malaise hitting 
everywhere)

Surinamese food is quite different from Indonesian. The only real connection 
being both
countries are former dutch colonies. Think asian for Indonesian food while for 
Suriname it's
more caribbean style. And fish is not mandatory. You can have either or both 
without fish
but plently of choice. If nothing else you should have a sate.

guy

On 4 Jun 2013 at 14:59, Steve Gillen wrote:

 Do you know Guy, I wish I had got in touch, but
 then we had a good deal of challenges going for
 us - we are both disabled - currently I too am
 having to use a disability scooter due to my knees
 - getting my first replacement operation next week
 by the way  and I had to fall in with Paula's
 plans too - I do promise you though, next time we
 will have a beer together and there will be a next
 time - we really took to Holland and Amsterdam as
 some on the list will attest to is they saw some
 of my postings and pictures on Facebook.
 
 WE saw lots of Indonesian outlets as you say as
 well as Surinamese food (is that the same?) - and
 we did indeed see Herring stalls, but Paula was
 having some problems with her digestion at the
 time and frankly, fish would have been over the
 limit for her.
 
 One place we ate that was truly great was the Half
 Moon restaurant ( De Halve Maen)in Sloten (just
 over the road from the Windmill) and we were made
 very welcome by a waiter there called Rob - he's
 an Ajax fan and we had a good time discussing
 football and dissing Eindhoven!  :-)  The food was
 lovely if you get a chance to go there and  can
 thoroughly recommend the Asparagus soup - that
 white asparagus soup is wonderful stuff isn't it?
 
 We'll try that other place the next time we are
 there - Thanks for that.
 
 An we'll also try the place John Lee has suggested
 to me, a sort of Dutch Beamish in a place called
 Zaanse Schans  But this will be a few months
 or even next year before I can do this as I have 2
 upcoming operations on my knees, as I said the
 first one being next week.
 
 One thing worth mentioning - a very kind Dutch
 person saw my blue disabled badge in the car and
 suggested a place for me to go - can't recall the
 name now, but is  in central Amsterdam, and if
 anyone wants to know I have it written down and
 the documents are in my fire safe - I went and
 showed my disabled credentials and car details and
 they issued a notice that I can park for free in
 Amsterdam centre for the next 12 months - no
 notice on the screen at all (unless in designated
 disabled parking, then the badge is required) -
 quite a decent saving - nice people the Dutch,
 aren't they?
 
 Cheers
 
 Steve
 
 -Original Message-
 From: leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org
 [mailto:leedslist-boun...@gn.apc.org] On Behalf Of
 Guy Thornton
 Sent: 04 June 2013 10:27
 To: leedslist@gn.apc.org
 Subject: Re: [LU] LU: It's all gone quiet over
 here - Test
 
 So you made it to Amsterdam Steve. 
 Great, but you didn't get in touch. Shame.
 Could have pointed you in the direction of 'dutch'
 food, though most traditional dutch food tends to
 be winter fare (mind you, with the weather we've
 been having). As you say the croquettes aren't bad
 but did you get to try Nieuwe Haring (herring)?
 That's real dutch. And what about an Indonesian
 meal? 
 (which is dutch in the same way Indian food is
 British).
 You may have gone to the Sloten windmill but what
 about the one in Oost? That has the 'Ij brewery as
 well with tasting local to try the products.
 
 guy
 
 On 4 Jun 2013 at 9:28, Steve Gillen wrote:
 
  Hahaha Thanks Ian
  
  It was indeed the long awaited European Tour
  
  WE started off with a night in a premier in near
 to the channel tunnel 
  in Folkestone - nice hotel, can recommend it if
 you are travelling 
  that way..
  
  Into France and a night in Rheims - champagne
 region - very nice - on 
  to Dijon for a look at some of the incredible
 old buildings and 
  churches there and good food etc...We love
 France and will always 
  visit there whenever we can...
  
  Next day to Switzerland and a few nights in
 Lucerne - cloudy most of 
  the time, but still beautiful, albeit expensive.
 Lots of souvenirs 
  bought (currently Cuckooing in the hall as I
 type)
  - great place.
  
  Into Munich for a couple of nights (via Austria
 and Lichtenstein) and 
  onto our favourite German city, Frankfurt. Visit
 the Zoo, good food 
  and a pleasant hotel. One night in Hanover, not
 so good as it pee'd 
  down the whole time and very few places on Earth
 look good when it's 
  pissing down... Final day in Germany in
 Osnabruck - I wanted to visit 
  the museum

Re: [LU] Wigan

[Guy Thornton]

The first female manager? 
Wasn't there a TV series the Manageress? Never saw it but heard about it. Not 
highly rated though 
being typical soap rather than drama. Seem to remember there have been one or 
two not to bad 
dramas involving female managers.

However the reality may not be that far away, or even already is depending on 
what level of the 
football pyramid you're talking about. Hannah Dingley, who holds a UEFA A 
Licence, is coach at 
Gresley FC in the Northern Premier League. She was interviewed on Today this 
morning as Northwich 
Victoria's manager, Lee Ashcroft, has been fined £12,00 and banned for 10 
matches for extreme 
verbal abuse to her.  
Initially he denied the charge and asked for a personal hearing but two days 
before the it was due to 
take place cancelled his request. (Ashcroft has something of a record for abuse 
- in 2010 while 
manager at Kendal Town he was banned from all footballing activities for three 
months for foul and 
indecent language to match officials.)

guy

On 1 Jun 2013 at 12:43, Sutton / Smail wrote:

 Managers have this unique attribute by where they perform badly and then are 
 welcomed with open arms by another club.
 In the normal world of work, bad performers receive a bad reputation and 
 can't find employment - not in football management.
 This may be because that there isn't that many of them available or because 
 of a badly performing squad, which is not the managers
 fault of course - is it??  He can't be held responsible for that now can 
 he - ha! Perhaps lack of funds for new players is the normal
 escape route. I'm looking forward to the first female manager - it must 
 happen sooner or later. Perhaps Maggie never found her true calling.
 Dave
 
 
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Re: [LU] NON LU: Wigan Make History?

[Guy Thornton]

Totally agree with you John

Here's to more tin pot impostors holding their own at the top and that includes 
us

Do we really want half-a-dozen or less elitist unbelievably rich businesses 
(once know as football 
clubs) with avarice, profit followed by glory as a motive raking in the gains 
from television, 
merchandizing and exploitation of fans and fan base both at home and world wide?

It's football Jim but not as we knew it

guy

On 15 May 2013 at 13:03, John Barber wrote:

-Original Message-
From: Richard Walker richleed...@yahoo.co.uk

I'm happy for them to be relegated.
Tin pot , imposters.




We hate that sense of entitlement that Manchester's fans like to exhibit.
But we do see comments like the one above on our List pretty frequently.
Isn't that just the same ugly trait?

JB




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Re: [LU] 8 May

[Guy Thornton]

A Happy Europe Day today to her and all the rest of 'em
Sure they'll all want to celebrate everything that's europe - and next week 
they can enjoy the European 
Song Festival

guy
(where we celebrated Liberation day last Sunday being when the Germans 
offically signed their 
surrender in the Netherlands)

On 8 May 2013 at 16:26, John Lee wrote:

 tis rather worrtying the rise of the little Ingerlander again. Did you
 see that one of UKIPs councillors in Lincolshire had a FB page where
 she didn't realise tuna was a fish. I fear we're in for the rise of
 the tub-thumping thicko, until the penny drops they're a complete
 liability? 
 
  
 
 
  From: Richard Naef rich...@triumph-computers.co.uk
 To: 'leedslist' leedslist@gn.apc.org 
 Sent: Wednesday, 8 May 2013, 12:01
 Subject: Re: [LU] 8 May
   
 
 Happy 8 May everyone. 68 years since the defeat of the Nazi tyranny and 50
 years since the Franco-Germanic rapprochment that guaranteed peace (of a
 sort...) for most of us, and for most of our lives.
 
 
 Pas count your Poulet's to vitement mon brave, with the rise of the FN 
 UKIP in our respective countries I fear we'll be reverting back to
 nationalism writ large.
 

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[LU] A load of balls?

[Guy Thornton]

From today's Fiver:

We teach basic expressions but also have demonstrations with er0tic 
paraphernalia so they 
can learn the names, how to use them and propose them - nominative 
determinism's Igor 
Fuchs, a volunteer with Brazil's Association of Pr0stitutes, reveals 300 ladies 
of the night 
have signed up for English classes to welcome football fans ahead of next 
year's World Cup.


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Re: [LU] It was 21 years ago today...

[Guy Thornton]

What happened to the West Riding Cup and do we still enter it?


On 26 Apr 2013 at 17:57, Ian Murray wrote:

 Things can change quickly mate. Keep the faith.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On 26 Apr 2013, at 17:47, Chris Briggs c_bri...@hotmail.co.uk wrote:
 
  At this rate I think I will get my bus pass before Leeds win anything else 
  and I am only 43!!
  
  On 26 Apr 2013, at 09:44, Nigel Sykes ni...@sykesonline.com wrote:
  
  .that Leeds last won anything.
  
  
  
  Feeling old now?
  
  
  
  Nigel
  
  (the Dublin one)
  
  
  
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[LU] Ding Dong ... creepy coincidence?

[Guy Thornton]

No, i'm not going to go on about Tina, the milk monitor, anything to do with 
iron or any other sobriquet 
come to that but no sooner has the demise of Mrs. T been announced than my 
computer exploded, well 
had a burn out. Whatever it was catastrophic and a total loss. A creepy 
coincidence or some correlation 
smacking of conspiracy?  Anyway I have now got a new machine and virtually 
everything transferred as 
the hard disc was okay, just what I was working on and browser history is awol. 
There is the small 
problem of no more XP and having to get to grips with Windows 8. Oh, and seems 
I have to get a new 
printer as well as I was going to a parallel adaptor but seems 8 will not 
support it ...

So back on line I see the list seems to been somewhat taken up by that other 
event with views divided. 
Quelle surprise. It fits in with the way she left society and the nation and 
the deep divisions that are still 
evident. When you can have the BBC being equally accused of toadying, 
glorification and right wing 
adulation on the one hand while on the other what it has said is seen as 
left-wing conspiracy, denigration 
and helping bring about the destruction of all that is noble in society ...

No I did not like her, opposed her policies and never mind Francis of Assi 
quotes, she tore society apart 
but she's gone now. Maybe a small hurray but for me no cause for glorification 
and rushing out in 
celebration. Instead I shall take the John Donne line that Each man's death 
dimishes me.

Nowhere near as much debate or number of postings but I see we have a new 
manager. Not only that 
but we won on Saturday. Even less discussion on that but surely this must 
quieten the boom and gloom 
merchants. We have 55 points now so surely there is no one now talking about 
relegation. Only once has 
a team been relegated with more than 50 points and that was Leicester with 52. 
We are not going to be 
relegated. More likely to make the play-offs if anything.

guy

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Re: [LU] Scummer

[Guy Thornton]

Apparently he's Colin's choice. 
Leastwise yesterday's Fiver carried this:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/apr/03/neil-warnock-leeds-mark-hughes-destroy?CMP=EMC
FTBEML853

On 4 Apr 2013 at 9:37, swin...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:

 Hughes emerges as frontrunner for Leeds United job - Latest Whites News 
 - Yorkshire Evening Post - http://is.gd/dj86qf
 
 With his track record and man management skills Hughescummer looks 
 perfect for the job (one's arse)
 
 Betty

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