Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Seems like there are some anti tamper labeling and packaging requirements
also, fwiw.

https://www.loftware.com/blog/ece-r90-regulation-calls-for-new-labeling-of-brake-components

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018, 8:39 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Similar issue with checking to see if your money is held in a bank account
> covered by FDIC insurance.  Crucial step in verifying that is going to the
> FDIC website to see if your bank is covered.
>
> In this case, I tried to go to any UN website for ECE to find out if they
> list brake pad makers who meet the cert, but Fire Fox says the page is
> unsafe - doesn't meet security.
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 9:34 AM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > I thought the same thing. Maybe it takes them awhile to catch up.
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 29, 2018, 5:23 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > > The counterfeits don't copy all the certification stamps?
> > > Mitch.
> > >
> > > > On October 28, 2018 at 8:07 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Im sure real akebono are fine. I think the point of the cert is to
> > > > distinguish real ones from counterfeit ones
> > > >
> >
> >
> ___
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>
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>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Similar issue with checking to see if your money is held in a bank account
covered by FDIC insurance.  Crucial step in verifying that is going to the
FDIC website to see if your bank is covered.

In this case, I tried to go to any UN website for ECE to find out if they
list brake pad makers who meet the cert, but Fire Fox says the page is
unsafe - doesn't meet security.
-
Max
Charleston SC


On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 9:34 AM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I thought the same thing. Maybe it takes them awhile to catch up.
>
> On Mon, Oct 29, 2018, 5:23 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > The counterfeits don't copy all the certification stamps?
> > Mitch.
> >
> > > On October 28, 2018 at 8:07 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Im sure real akebono are fine. I think the point of the cert is to
> > > distinguish real ones from counterfeit ones
> > >
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

I thought the same thing. Maybe it takes them awhile to catch up.

On Mon, Oct 29, 2018, 5:23 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> The counterfeits don't copy all the certification stamps?
> Mitch.
>
> > On October 28, 2018 at 8:07 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Im sure real akebono are fine. I think the point of the cert is to
> > distinguish real ones from counterfeit ones
> >
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

The counterfeits don't copy all the certification stamps?
Mitch. 

> On October 28, 2018 at 8:07 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Im sure real akebono are fine. I think the point of the cert is to
> distinguish real ones from counterfeit ones
>

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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Im sure real akebono are fine. I think the point of the cert is to
distinguish real ones from counterfeit ones

On Fri, Oct 26, 2018, 1:16 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes 
wrote:

> Thanks for sharing that article regarding ECE R90.  I wonder if the
> Akebono ceramic pads have that certification?  Have to look that up later.
> --
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '87 300TD
> '95 E300
>
> On October 25, 2018 3:53:02 PM EDT, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >Interesting. Seems unlikely that the pads are in wrong, but never say
> >never. I changed all the calipers, so this isnt just a brake job.
> >
> >I found this european cert thing in an email from autohaus (finally got
> >the
> >500e master cyl today btw). Anyway it may interest the list:
> >
> >
> >See More Articles and Tech Tips at AutohausAZ.com/tech-tips.
> >*Not displaying correctly?*  View in your browser
> >.
> >[image: autohausAZ]
> ><
> https://autohausaz.us10.list-manage.com/track/click?u=6c9c0c80a8f1383098e77d365=35cb7760f4=8a74a2c8f2
> >
> >
> >HOME
> ><
> https://autohausaz.us10.list-manage.com/track/click?u=6c9c0c80a8f1383098e77d365=bae2a05199=8a74a2c8f2
> >
> >LOGIN
> ><
> https://autohausaz.us10.list-manage.com/track/click?u=6c9c0c80a8f1383098e77d365=4997bdb924=8a74a2c8f2
> >
> >UNSUBSCRIBE
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> >
> >[image: Brake Safety- ECE R90]
> >
> >Brake Safety- ECE R90
> >
> >Safety has always been at the forefront of European vehicle design.
> >When
> >you hear the word “safety”, one tends to think of the passive safety
> >features such as seatbelts or airbags, or the newer active safety
> >features
> >such as lane-departure warning and traction or stability control. But
> >hands
> >down the most important safety system on a car is the braking system.
> >The
> >disc brake system on a modern car relies on a complex system of
> >hydraulics,
> >electrics, electronics, and of course human input to safely bring a
> >vehicle
> >to a stop every time. But the most fundamental pieces of the braking
> >system
> >are the mechanical bits that do the actual stopping, the brake pads and
> >rotors. These components convert the kinetic energy of a vehicle in
> >motion
> >into heat energy, using nothing more than simple friction.
> >
> >Brake pads and rotors are of course a wear item on any vehicle.
> >Depending
> >on driving style and other factors, these components may have a longer
> >or
> >shorter lifespan, but on any car they will eventually need to be
> >replaced.
> >When shopping for brake pads and rotors for your vehicle you will find
> >a
> >confusing array of parts to choose from. There are different compounds
> >of
> >pads from semi-metallic to organic to ceramic. Rotors can be
> >high-carbon,
> >coated, drilled or slotted. How is a consumer to know what the best
> >choice
> >for their vehicle is?
> >
> >Regardless of what pad compound or type of rotor you choose, a good
> >place
> >to start when shopping for brakes on a European vehicle is to choose a
> >manufacturer that offers pads and rotors that are certified to meet ECE
> >R90
> >regulations.What is ECE R90? The Economic Commission for Europe, or
> >ECE, is
> >a body that regulates certain aspects of vehicle design throughout
> >Europe
> >and has been adopted in many other regions around the world. Regulation
> >90,
> >or R90 as it is commonly known, specifies that a certified pad or rotor
> >must pass several rigorous tests to verify both the braking performance
> >and
> >physical characters of the part do not widely deviate from the OEM
> >parts
> >that originally came with the vehicle. The standard was developed in
> >response to the rise of low-cost or counterfeit aftermarket brake pads
> >and
> >rotors that did not always perform properly. This of course is a major
> >safety hazard to all drivers on the road and the ECE decided to
> >implement
> >this strict set of rules for replacement brake pads and rotors
> >beginning in
> >November of 2016. While in the US it is not a requirement for vehicles
> >to
> >be fitted with replacement parts that meet the ECE R90 spec, it is
> >highly
> >advised.
> >
> >How do you tell if a part is certified as meeting ECE R90? All parts
> >will
> >be physically marked with a code that looks like this: [image:
> >Winterizing
> >Your Vehicle], followed by a unique set of approval numbers. This mark
> >ensures that you are installing a part that meets or exceeds the
> >requirements the OEM originally specified during development of the
> >vehicle. To reduce the likelihood of counterfeit products entering the
> >market falsely claiming to meet R90, packaging will typically be sealed
> >by
> >the manufacturer and many times also includes holograms or other
> >security
> >features that are difficult to duplicate. This is an additional layer
> >of
> >security that 

Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Thanks for sharing that article regarding ECE R90.  I wonder if the Akebono 
ceramic pads have that certification?  Have to look that up later.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On October 25, 2018 3:53:02 PM EDT, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>Interesting. Seems unlikely that the pads are in wrong, but never say
>never. I changed all the calipers, so this isnt just a brake job.
>
>I found this european cert thing in an email from autohaus (finally got
>the
>500e master cyl today btw). Anyway it may interest the list:
>
>
>See More Articles and Tech Tips at AutohausAZ.com/tech-tips.
>*Not displaying correctly?*  View in your browser
>.
>[image: autohausAZ]
>
>
>HOME
>
>LOGIN
>
>UNSUBSCRIBE
>
>[image: Brake Safety- ECE R90]
>
>Brake Safety- ECE R90
>
>Safety has always been at the forefront of European vehicle design.
>When
>you hear the word “safety”, one tends to think of the passive safety
>features such as seatbelts or airbags, or the newer active safety
>features
>such as lane-departure warning and traction or stability control. But
>hands
>down the most important safety system on a car is the braking system.
>The
>disc brake system on a modern car relies on a complex system of
>hydraulics,
>electrics, electronics, and of course human input to safely bring a
>vehicle
>to a stop every time. But the most fundamental pieces of the braking
>system
>are the mechanical bits that do the actual stopping, the brake pads and
>rotors. These components convert the kinetic energy of a vehicle in
>motion
>into heat energy, using nothing more than simple friction.
>
>Brake pads and rotors are of course a wear item on any vehicle.
>Depending
>on driving style and other factors, these components may have a longer
>or
>shorter lifespan, but on any car they will eventually need to be
>replaced.
>When shopping for brake pads and rotors for your vehicle you will find
>a
>confusing array of parts to choose from. There are different compounds
>of
>pads from semi-metallic to organic to ceramic. Rotors can be
>high-carbon,
>coated, drilled or slotted. How is a consumer to know what the best
>choice
>for their vehicle is?
>
>Regardless of what pad compound or type of rotor you choose, a good
>place
>to start when shopping for brakes on a European vehicle is to choose a
>manufacturer that offers pads and rotors that are certified to meet ECE
>R90
>regulations.What is ECE R90? The Economic Commission for Europe, or
>ECE, is
>a body that regulates certain aspects of vehicle design throughout
>Europe
>and has been adopted in many other regions around the world. Regulation
>90,
>or R90 as it is commonly known, specifies that a certified pad or rotor
>must pass several rigorous tests to verify both the braking performance
>and
>physical characters of the part do not widely deviate from the OEM
>parts
>that originally came with the vehicle. The standard was developed in
>response to the rise of low-cost or counterfeit aftermarket brake pads
>and
>rotors that did not always perform properly. This of course is a major
>safety hazard to all drivers on the road and the ECE decided to
>implement
>this strict set of rules for replacement brake pads and rotors
>beginning in
>November of 2016. While in the US it is not a requirement for vehicles
>to
>be fitted with replacement parts that meet the ECE R90 spec, it is
>highly
>advised.
>
>How do you tell if a part is certified as meeting ECE R90? All parts
>will
>be physically marked with a code that looks like this: [image:
>Winterizing
>Your Vehicle], followed by a unique set of approval numbers. This mark
>ensures that you are installing a part that meets or exceeds the
>requirements the OEM originally specified during development of the
>vehicle. To reduce the likelihood of counterfeit products entering the
>market falsely claiming to meet R90, packaging will typically be sealed
>by
>the manufacturer and many times also includes holograms or other
>security
>features that are difficult to duplicate. This is an additional layer
>of
>security that ensures the consumer is purchasing a safe, quality
>product.
>
>A leading US automotive publication was recently conducting a
>performance
>test of several vehicles. One vehicle, outfitted with brakes for the US
>market, exhibited very poor stopping performance while on track and was
>pulled from the test. The manufacturer subsequently supplied a vehicle
>with
>replacement pads from the European model, which would be certified as
>meeting ECE R90. 

Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Interesting. Seems unlikely that the pads are in wrong, but never say
never. I changed all the calipers, so this isnt just a brake job.

I found this european cert thing in an email from autohaus (finally got the
500e master cyl today btw). Anyway it may interest the list:


See More Articles and Tech Tips at AutohausAZ.com/tech-tips.
*Not displaying correctly?*  View in your browser
.
[image: autohausAZ]


HOME

LOGIN

UNSUBSCRIBE

[image: Brake Safety- ECE R90]

Brake Safety- ECE R90

Safety has always been at the forefront of European vehicle design. When
you hear the word “safety”, one tends to think of the passive safety
features such as seatbelts or airbags, or the newer active safety features
such as lane-departure warning and traction or stability control. But hands
down the most important safety system on a car is the braking system. The
disc brake system on a modern car relies on a complex system of hydraulics,
electrics, electronics, and of course human input to safely bring a vehicle
to a stop every time. But the most fundamental pieces of the braking system
are the mechanical bits that do the actual stopping, the brake pads and
rotors. These components convert the kinetic energy of a vehicle in motion
into heat energy, using nothing more than simple friction.

Brake pads and rotors are of course a wear item on any vehicle. Depending
on driving style and other factors, these components may have a longer or
shorter lifespan, but on any car they will eventually need to be replaced.
When shopping for brake pads and rotors for your vehicle you will find a
confusing array of parts to choose from. There are different compounds of
pads from semi-metallic to organic to ceramic. Rotors can be high-carbon,
coated, drilled or slotted. How is a consumer to know what the best choice
for their vehicle is?

Regardless of what pad compound or type of rotor you choose, a good place
to start when shopping for brakes on a European vehicle is to choose a
manufacturer that offers pads and rotors that are certified to meet ECE R90
regulations.What is ECE R90? The Economic Commission for Europe, or ECE, is
a body that regulates certain aspects of vehicle design throughout Europe
and has been adopted in many other regions around the world. Regulation 90,
or R90 as it is commonly known, specifies that a certified pad or rotor
must pass several rigorous tests to verify both the braking performance and
physical characters of the part do not widely deviate from the OEM parts
that originally came with the vehicle. The standard was developed in
response to the rise of low-cost or counterfeit aftermarket brake pads and
rotors that did not always perform properly. This of course is a major
safety hazard to all drivers on the road and the ECE decided to implement
this strict set of rules for replacement brake pads and rotors beginning in
November of 2016. While in the US it is not a requirement for vehicles to
be fitted with replacement parts that meet the ECE R90 spec, it is highly
advised.

How do you tell if a part is certified as meeting ECE R90? All parts will
be physically marked with a code that looks like this: [image: Winterizing
Your Vehicle], followed by a unique set of approval numbers. This mark
ensures that you are installing a part that meets or exceeds the
requirements the OEM originally specified during development of the
vehicle. To reduce the likelihood of counterfeit products entering the
market falsely claiming to meet R90, packaging will typically be sealed by
the manufacturer and many times also includes holograms or other security
features that are difficult to duplicate. This is an additional layer of
security that ensures the consumer is purchasing a safe, quality product.

A leading US automotive publication was recently conducting a performance
test of several vehicles. One vehicle, outfitted with brakes for the US
market, exhibited very poor stopping performance while on track and was
pulled from the test. The manufacturer subsequently supplied a vehicle with
replacement pads from the European model, which would be certified as
meeting ECE R90. Further testing on the track showed much improved braking
performance, simply by changing to a better-quality pad. Many US consumers
are concerned about reducing brake dust and/or noise, but ask yourself this
question: when the safety of you and your family is on the line does it
matter if your wheels are slightly dirtier or you hear a squeak from time
to time? Wheels can be 

Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Thanks that was the set of issues I suspected I might be avoiding.

I am however torn on whether the ate part is worth 140 when the meyle is
80-odd and a centric or equivalent is 60-odd. I suspect all of them will
last decades in regular use, but went the conservative route and splurged.

I found ate on ebay for 130. Pelican was 190. Autohausaz was 150 and they
had the reservoir grommets and plug. So I used them for convenience.

I am using castrol srf fluid and bought some shiny stainless lines, but of
course the right front hard line fitting is seized so I ordered a new set
of flare wrenches for that project. I will have to bleed it all again now
so might as well figure out how to get the old lines off.

I did source the 500e master as I have put the brembo dual piston fronts on
with sl600 rears. The booster is stock but I rather enjoy a firm brake
pedal so no matter.

If anyone would like a twin piston and rotor upgrade setup for an older
w124 (rears are vented and fronts are 294mm IIRC) I will be happy to box it
all up for beer money plus shipping; Rotors and pads seem to have plenty of
life left. They are from a later model w124 as far as I can tell. Ate
stuff. One of the calipers may rub a bit but I drove it that way for two
years and it still has pad left everywhere.



On Mon, Oct 22, 2018, 9:47 AM Randy Bennell via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I note that a decision has been made to get a replacement but I will
> comment on this anyway.
> I had the master give up on my 115 300D. I was able to get a rebuild kit
> but unable to put it together to my satisfaction and ended up getting a
> replacement anyway.
> Not sure how this will relate to newer Mercedes, but for my vintage,  it
> appears that the original rebuild kits came with a thin sleeve that one
> put the parts into and then slid into the bore and then removed. I did
> not get the sleeve with my kit and was unable to come up with anything
> that would permit me to slide the new parts in without risking damage to
> the new seals. I looked around for thin tubing and made an attempt with
> a wrapped piece of thin plastic but to no avail. I could have pushed
> them in without the sleeve and waited to see if they had managed to slip
> in without damage but was reluctant to re-assemble and find out that I
> still had brake problems, so I did not do that. I gave in and ordered
> the whole thing which is what I should have done at the outset. The car
> was out of service for a month while I horsed around with this issue.
>
> RB
>
> On 21/10/2018 2:15 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes wrote:
> > So I have pressure bled the 124 wagon brakes about three times now and no
> > air comes out any more. I drained at least a pint each caliper this time.
> > No leaks from any of the calipers when pumping pedal with nipples tight.
> >
> > This is a non-asr car.
> >
> > Pedal will pump up but then goes to the floor with sustained pressure. If
> > you pump it up then let up for a few seconds and push again it goes  way
> > down before any resistance. Probably not going to stop the car at the
> foot
> > of my driveway.
> >
> > My thought is to replace or rebuild the master cylinder, because maybe
> the
> > pedal was pushed too far down while bleeding.
> >
> > Is the collective wisdom to use ATE only, or is meyle just as good (or
> > others)? And has anyone just rebuilt the original cylinder with new
> seals?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Trampas Stern via Mercedes]

If you replaced the brakes make sure the pads are in place correctly.  I
worked at a shop once where mechanic put pads on wrong (pads not in the
guides) on a Toyota.  The results were that when you pressed break peddle
it would bend the brake pad which acted like a spring, when you released
the break peddle it would push calipers back in.  The brakes felt like they
needed bleed and would "pump up".  They replaced master cylinder twice
before they got me to look at it.
I asked:
"Did it stop before you did the brake job?"
"Yes"
"Then let's check that you did the brake job correctly..."




On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 12:46 PM Randy Bennell via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I note that a decision has been made to get a replacement but I will
> comment on this anyway.
> I had the master give up on my 115 300D. I was able to get a rebuild kit
> but unable to put it together to my satisfaction and ended up getting a
> replacement anyway.
> Not sure how this will relate to newer Mercedes, but for my vintage,  it
> appears that the original rebuild kits came with a thin sleeve that one
> put the parts into and then slid into the bore and then removed. I did
> not get the sleeve with my kit and was unable to come up with anything
> that would permit me to slide the new parts in without risking damage to
> the new seals. I looked around for thin tubing and made an attempt with
> a wrapped piece of thin plastic but to no avail. I could have pushed
> them in without the sleeve and waited to see if they had managed to slip
> in without damage but was reluctant to re-assemble and find out that I
> still had brake problems, so I did not do that. I gave in and ordered
> the whole thing which is what I should have done at the outset. The car
> was out of service for a month while I horsed around with this issue.
>
> RB
>
> On 21/10/2018 2:15 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes wrote:
> > So I have pressure bled the 124 wagon brakes about three times now and no
> > air comes out any more. I drained at least a pint each caliper this time.
> > No leaks from any of the calipers when pumping pedal with nipples tight.
> >
> > This is a non-asr car.
> >
> > Pedal will pump up but then goes to the floor with sustained pressure. If
> > you pump it up then let up for a few seconds and push again it goes  way
> > down before any resistance. Probably not going to stop the car at the
> foot
> > of my driveway.
> >
> > My thought is to replace or rebuild the master cylinder, because maybe
> the
> > pedal was pushed too far down while bleeding.
> >
> > Is the collective wisdom to use ATE only, or is meyle just as good (or
> > others)? And has anyone just rebuilt the original cylinder with new
> seals?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

I note that a decision has been made to get a replacement but I will 
comment on this anyway.
I had the master give up on my 115 300D. I was able to get a rebuild kit 
but unable to put it together to my satisfaction and ended up getting a 
replacement anyway.
Not sure how this will relate to newer Mercedes, but for my vintage,  it 
appears that the original rebuild kits came with a thin sleeve that one 
put the parts into and then slid into the bore and then removed. I did 
not get the sleeve with my kit and was unable to come up with anything 
that would permit me to slide the new parts in without risking damage to 
the new seals. I looked around for thin tubing and made an attempt with 
a wrapped piece of thin plastic but to no avail. I could have pushed 
them in without the sleeve and waited to see if they had managed to slip 
in without damage but was reluctant to re-assemble and find out that I 
still had brake problems, so I did not do that. I gave in and ordered 
the whole thing which is what I should have done at the outset. The car 
was out of service for a month while I horsed around with this issue.


RB

On 21/10/2018 2:15 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes wrote:

So I have pressure bled the 124 wagon brakes about three times now and no
air comes out any more. I drained at least a pint each caliper this time.
No leaks from any of the calipers when pumping pedal with nipples tight.

This is a non-asr car.

Pedal will pump up but then goes to the floor with sustained pressure. If
you pump it up then let up for a few seconds and push again it goes  way
down before any resistance. Probably not going to stop the car at the foot
of my driveway.

My thought is to replace or rebuild the master cylinder, because maybe the
pedal was pushed too far down while bleeding.

Is the collective wisdom to use ATE only, or is meyle just as good (or
others)? And has anyone just rebuilt the original cylinder with new seals?

Thanks




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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

In my experience, pumping an old master cylinder lower than the normal end of 
stroke will ruin the seal.

> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of Karl
> Wittnebel via Mercedes
> Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2018 3:15 PM
> To: mercedes@okiebenz com 
> Cc: Karl Wittnebel 
> Subject: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder
> 
> So I have pressure bled the 124 wagon brakes about three times now and no
> air comes out any more. I drained at least a pint each caliper this time.
> No leaks from any of the calipers when pumping pedal with nipples tight.
> 
> This is a non-asr car.
> 
> Pedal will pump up but then goes to the floor with sustained pressure. If you
> pump it up then let up for a few seconds and push again it goes  way down
> before any resistance. Probably not going to stop the car at the foot of my
> driveway.
> 
> My thought is to replace or rebuild the master cylinder, because maybe the
> pedal was pushed too far down while bleeding.
> 
> Is the collective wisdom to use ATE only, or is meyle just as good (or 
> others)?
> And has anyone just rebuilt the original cylinder with new seals?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> On Sun, Oct 21, 2018, 11:53 AM Karl Wittnebel 
> wrote:
> 
> > Did you use the Meyle HD mounts or oe stuff?
> >
> > On Sat, Oct 20, 2018, 7:00 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Yes, I'll be sore for a couple days.  About nine hours total, with a
> >> couple breaks.  I've still got to fill with gear lube and test drive.
> >>  Tomorrow.
> >> --
> >> Max Dillon
> >> Charleston SC
> >> '87 300TD
> >> '95 E300
> >>
> >> On October 20, 2018 7:53:25 PM EDT, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
> >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >> >Congrats!  Waytago!   Strong work!
> >> >
> >>
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>
> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>
> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>
> >>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Ok will pick up an ate.

Thanks guys.



>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

Replace it.  Newer master cylinders don't rebuild well as there are no 
oversized kits for having them honed as you should -- part of the wear is on 
the walls of the cylinder, and new cups won't last all that long.
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

I agree, that's the classic description of a bad master cylinder.  When
faced with a similar choice on my '95 sedan, I ended up buying an ATE
brand.

I found that there are very few makers of kits for rebuilding master
cylinders. I think that ATE is one of the few?  I wasn't sure what was in
my car (could find no markings other than the MB star while it was mounted)
so rather than gamble on buying a rebuild kit that might be wrong, I just
bought the ATE MC.
-
Max
Charleston SC


On Sun, Oct 21, 2018 at 3:26 PM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Sounds like classic cups on the piston are worn/leaking.  Time for a
> new/rebuilt master cylinder.
>
> -D
>
>
> > On Oct 21, 2018, at 3:15 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > So I have pressure bled the 124 wagon brakes about three times now and no
> > air comes out any more. I drained at least a pint each caliper this time.
> > No leaks from any of the calipers when pumping pedal with nipples tight.
> >
> > This is a non-asr car.
> >
> > Pedal will pump up but then goes to the floor with sustained pressure. If
> > you pump it up then let up for a few seconds and push again it goes  way
> > down before any resistance. Probably not going to stop the car at the
> foot
> > of my driveway.
> >
> > My thought is to replace or rebuild the master cylinder, because maybe
> the
> > pedal was pushed too far down while bleeding.
> >
> > Is the collective wisdom to use ATE only, or is meyle just as good (or
> > others)? And has anyone just rebuilt the original cylinder with new
> seals?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > On Sun, Oct 21, 2018, 11:53 AM Karl Wittnebel 
> wrote:
> >
> >> Did you use the Meyle HD mounts or oe stuff?
> >>
> >> On Sat, Oct 20, 2018, 7:00 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes <
> >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Yes, I'll be sore for a couple days.  About nine hours total, with a
> >>> couple breaks.  I've still got to fill with gear lube and test drive.
> >>> Tomorrow.
> >>> --
> >>> Max Dillon
> >>> Charleston SC
> >>> '87 300TD
> >>> '95 E300
> >>>
> >>> On October 20, 2018 7:53:25 PM EDT, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
> >>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>  Congrats!  Waytago!   Strong work!
> 
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>>
> >>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>>
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> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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> >
> >
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 124 master cylinder

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Sounds like classic cups on the piston are worn/leaking.  Time for a 
new/rebuilt master cylinder.

-D


> On Oct 21, 2018, at 3:15 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> So I have pressure bled the 124 wagon brakes about three times now and no
> air comes out any more. I drained at least a pint each caliper this time.
> No leaks from any of the calipers when pumping pedal with nipples tight.
> 
> This is a non-asr car.
> 
> Pedal will pump up but then goes to the floor with sustained pressure. If
> you pump it up then let up for a few seconds and push again it goes  way
> down before any resistance. Probably not going to stop the car at the foot
> of my driveway.
> 
> My thought is to replace or rebuild the master cylinder, because maybe the
> pedal was pushed too far down while bleeding.
> 
> Is the collective wisdom to use ATE only, or is meyle just as good (or
> others)? And has anyone just rebuilt the original cylinder with new seals?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> On Sun, Oct 21, 2018, 11:53 AM Karl Wittnebel  wrote:
> 
>> Did you use the Meyle HD mounts or oe stuff?
>> 
>> On Sat, Oct 20, 2018, 7:00 PM Max Dillon via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Yes, I'll be sore for a couple days.  About nine hours total, with a
>>> couple breaks.  I've still got to fill with gear lube and test drive.
>>> Tomorrow.
>>> --
>>> Max Dillon
>>> Charleston SC
>>> '87 300TD
>>> '95 E300
>>> 
>>> On October 20, 2018 7:53:25 PM EDT, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
 Congrats!  Waytago!   Strong work!
 
>>> 
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>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> 
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> 


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