Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

That was my reaction to the Hepatitis B vaccine back in '83.  Strong reaction 
means your body is responding.

I had CoVid in December, got the vaccine in Feb -- first one made me sore and a 
little off feeling, second one was just injection site soreness, so I think I'm 
good.
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

My 85 friend in Naples, FL finally received her first Pfizer shot 2 weeks
ago, after fruitlessly trying for an appt. for months.  WTF.

On Tue, Mar 30, 2021 at 9:58 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> We got the Pfizer, too.
>
> -D
>
> > On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:55 AM, Bob Rentfro via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > I had the Fizzer, and I felt fine after both. jabs.
> >
> > AZBob
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I get mine on Monday. Not making any plans for that day just in case.
> >>
> >> -D
> >>
>  On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:27 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout
> >>>
> >>> --FT
> >>> Sent from iPhone
> >>>
> > On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>  I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad
> like the flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up
> Monday morning.
> 
>  Sent from my iPhone
> 
> >> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1
> March. Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in the
> evening. Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this morning,
> like a flu. Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical plant is
> doing what it is supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the first jab.
> >
> > I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be
> able to stare the Covids in the eye!
> >
> > --FT
> > Sent from iPhone
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> 
> 
>  ___
>  http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
>  To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
>  To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>  http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>>
> >>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>
> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>
> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

We got the Pfizer, too.

-D

> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:55 AM, Bob Rentfro via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I had the Fizzer, and I felt fine after both. jabs. 
> 
> AZBob
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I get mine on Monday. Not making any plans for that day just in case.
>> 
>> -D
>> 
 On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:27 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout
>>> 
>>> --FT
>>> Sent from iPhone
>>> 
> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
 
 I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad like 
 the flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up 
 Monday morning.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
> 
> Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1 
> March. Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in 
> the evening. Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this 
> morning, like a flu. Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical 
> plant is doing what it is supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the 
> first jab. 
> 
> I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be able 
> to stare the Covids in the eye!
> 
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
 
 
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 
 To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
 
 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Reactions vary widely.  Supposedly the stronger the side effects the better
protected you are.  I don't buy it.

On Tue, Mar 30, 2021 at 9:17 AM Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> That is because it’s just water.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Mar 30, 2021, at 7:55 AM, Bob Rentfro via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > I had the Fizzer, and I felt fine after both. jabs.
> >
> > AZBob
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I get mine on Monday. Not making any plans for that day just in case.
> >>
> >> -D
> >>
>  On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:27 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout
> >>>
> >>> --FT
> >>> Sent from iPhone
> >>>
> > On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>  I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad
> like the flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up
> Monday morning.
> 
>  Sent from my iPhone
> 
> >> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1
> March. Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in the
> evening. Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this morning,
> like a flu. Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical plant is
> doing what it is supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the first jab.
> >
> > I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be
> able to stare the Covids in the eye!
> >
> > --FT
> > Sent from iPhone
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> 
> 
>  ___
>  http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
>  To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
>  To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>  http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>>
> >>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>
> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>
> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes]

That is because it’s just water. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 30, 2021, at 7:55 AM, Bob Rentfro via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I had the Fizzer, and I felt fine after both. jabs. 
> 
> AZBob
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> I get mine on Monday. Not making any plans for that day just in case.
>> 
>> -D
>> 
 On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:27 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout
>>> 
>>> --FT
>>> Sent from iPhone
>>> 
> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
 
 I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad like 
 the flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up 
 Monday morning.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
> 
> Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1 
> March. Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in 
> the evening. Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this 
> morning, like a flu. Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical 
> plant is doing what it is supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the 
> first jab. 
> 
> I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be able 
> to stare the Covids in the eye!
> 
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
 
 
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 
 To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
 
 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Bob Rentfro via Mercedes]

I had the Fizzer, and I felt fine after both. jabs. 

AZBob

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:41 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> I get mine on Monday. Not making any plans for that day just in case.
> 
> -D
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:27 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout
>> 
>> --FT
>> Sent from iPhone
>> 
 On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes 
  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad like 
>>> the flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up Monday 
>>> morning.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
 
 Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1 
 March. Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in the 
 evening. Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this morning, 
 like a flu. Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical plant is 
 doing what it is supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the first jab. 
 
 I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be able 
 to stare the Covids in the eye!
 
 --FT
 Sent from iPhone
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 
 To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
 
 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

I get mine on Monday. Not making any plans for that day just in case.

-D

> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:27 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout
> 
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad like 
>> the flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up Monday 
>> morning.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
 On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1 March. 
>>> Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in the 
>>> evening. Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this morning, 
>>> like a flu. Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical plant is 
>>> doing what it is supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the first jab. 
>>> 
>>> I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be able to 
>>> stare the Covids in the eye!
>>> 
>>> --FT
>>> Sent from iPhone
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes]

Yeah I’m taking a lazy day and gonna just be a layabout

--FT
Sent from iPhone

> On Mar 30, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad like the 
> flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up Monday 
> morning.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1 March. 
>> Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in the evening. 
>> Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this morning, like a flu. 
>> Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical plant is doing what it is 
>> supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the first jab. 
>> 
>> I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be able to 
>> stare the Covids in the eye!
>> 
>> --FT
>> Sent from iPhone
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes]

I got my second one Saturday and Saturday night started feeding bad like the 
flu. Sunday was pretty bad all day, was OK by the time I woke up Monday morning.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 30, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Got my second Moderna  jab yesterday afternoon after the first on 1 March. 
> Arm started hurting coupla hours later, whole arm then later in the evening. 
> Feeling a little rough last night, feeling rougher this morning, like a flu. 
> Dr. Boy tells me this is all good, my biochemical plant is doing what it is 
> supposed to do. Had no rxn whatsoever to the first jab. 
> 
> I guess it’s A Good Thing, a little discomfort for now then I’ll be able to 
> stare the Covids in the eye!
> 
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Rick Knoble via Mercedes]

Pretty good article by someone who had it recently.

https://www.theorganicprepper.com/covid-personal-story/


Rick
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

yes exactly.

On Sat, Dec 26, 2020 at 9:09 PM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Dr Boy at Stanford says a lot of the cases earlier were occurring a bit to
> the south Of his location in areas with larger Hispanics populations,
> generally lower socioeconomic groups who live more densely and don’t have
> the luxury of working from home since most of their jobs are services or
> construction etc that involve lots of close contact.
>
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
>
> > On Dec 26, 2020, at 11:29 PM, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > Karl, In your experience, do you think illegal immigration across the
> > southern border could be a factor, especially in CA?
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Peter Frederick via Mercedes
> > Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2020 11:01 PM
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> > Cc: Peter Frederick 
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
> >
> > Actually, all the new cases are from there being far too many cases
> around.
> > Since I'm half way through a case myself with no known exposure, I can
> > verify it's very contagious.
> >
> > The more people have it, the more it spreads, just like any contagious
> > disease.  The death rate is going up because somewhere between one and
> three
> > percent of people who contract it eventually die from it.  Several
> million
> > new cases since every idiot in the US just HAD to travel for Thanksgiving
> > means 3 new deaths in the next month, minumum, and probably far more.
> > We have now arrived at the point where hospital services are unavailable
> due
> > to the number of CoVid cases, so people are going to also start dying
> from
> > other preventable causes as well -- excess deaths in the US are up
> > considerably more than just the number from CoVid already, and it's
> going to
> > be much worse in January and February.
> >
> > My 97 year old mother is currently in hospital, still doing pretty well
> but
> > on oxygen, diagnosed three days after I was.  I suspect she got it from
> her
> > home health aides rather than me bringing it home since she was
> complaining
> > of chills for several days before I started to run a temp.  Gonna be
> another
> > couple weeks before we know for sure she's gonna make it.
> >
> > I got the Lilly mono-clonal antibody treatment.  Mom would have had the
> > Remdesivir except she has some pre-existing kidney issues so they didn't
> > prescribe it, haven't heard back if they decided to use the Lilly one
> (it's
> > not usually used in hospitalized patients).  Seemed to help me, I have
> > regained a little sense of taste and smell, although strong odors make my
> > nose sting like crazy.
> >
> > I was hoping Mom could be vaccinated shortly, she's up as soon as the
> > nursing home residents get one which starts this week in Indiana.
> > Thankfully my sister in law the nurse is already done with round one of
> the
> > Pfizer vaccine.
> >
> > This stuff is not a joke, get the vaccine as soon as you can!
> >
> > Peter
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

We see plenty of people from south of the border here legally, visiting
family. One of my patients right now is here on vacation from Mexico. But
he probably got it here. We have plenty of covid on our side of the border
to account for what we are seeing.

I think the housing situation here is driving it. Prices drive many people
to live in houses that have been added on to and expanded over the years,
either for large families or just to collect rent from people who need a
room. But the rest of the house is often shared. Covid travels easily in
households, and if the people are all working construction etc they can get
it and bring it home. I think this explains a lot of the ethnic disparity
in burden of disease for our state, anyway. We certainly have a lot of
immigrants but many of them are lower in socioeconomic status which drives
household sizes up.

On Sat, Dec 26, 2020 at 8:29 PM Scott Ritchey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Karl, In your experience, do you think illegal immigration across the
> southern border could be a factor, especially in CA?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Peter Frederick via Mercedes
> Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2020 11:01 PM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> Cc: Peter Frederick 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
>
> Actually, all the new cases are from there being far too many cases around.
> Since I'm half way through a case myself with no known exposure, I can
> verify it's very contagious.
>
> The more people have it, the more it spreads, just like any contagious
> disease.  The death rate is going up because somewhere between one and
> three
> percent of people who contract it eventually die from it.  Several million
> new cases since every idiot in the US just HAD to travel for Thanksgiving
> means 3 new deaths in the next month, minumum, and probably far more.
> We have now arrived at the point where hospital services are unavailable
> due
> to the number of CoVid cases, so people are going to also start dying from
> other preventable causes as well -- excess deaths in the US are up
> considerably more than just the number from CoVid already, and it's going
> to
> be much worse in January and February.
>
> My 97 year old mother is currently in hospital, still doing pretty well but
> on oxygen, diagnosed three days after I was.  I suspect she got it from her
> home health aides rather than me bringing it home since she was complaining
> of chills for several days before I started to run a temp.  Gonna be
> another
> couple weeks before we know for sure she's gonna make it.
>
> I got the Lilly mono-clonal antibody treatment.  Mom would have had the
> Remdesivir except she has some pre-existing kidney issues so they didn't
> prescribe it, haven't heard back if they decided to use the Lilly one (it's
> not usually used in hospitalized patients).  Seemed to help me, I have
> regained a little sense of taste and smell, although strong odors make my
> nose sting like crazy.
>
> I was hoping Mom could be vaccinated shortly, she's up as soon as the
> nursing home residents get one which starts this week in Indiana.
> Thankfully my sister in law the nurse is already done with round one of the
> Pfizer vaccine.
>
> This stuff is not a joke, get the vaccine as soon as you can!
>
> Peter
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes]

Dr Boy at Stanford says a lot of the cases earlier were occurring a bit to the 
south Of his location in areas with larger Hispanics populations, generally 
lower socioeconomic groups who live more densely and don’t have the luxury of 
working from home since most of their jobs are services or construction etc 
that involve lots of close contact. 

--FT
Sent from iPhone

> On Dec 26, 2020, at 11:29 PM, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Karl, In your experience, do you think illegal immigration across the
> southern border could be a factor, especially in CA?
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Peter Frederick via Mercedes
> Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2020 11:01 PM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> Cc: Peter Frederick 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
> 
> Actually, all the new cases are from there being far too many cases around.
> Since I'm half way through a case myself with no known exposure, I can
> verify it's very contagious.  
> 
> The more people have it, the more it spreads, just like any contagious
> disease.  The death rate is going up because somewhere between one and three
> percent of people who contract it eventually die from it.  Several million
> new cases since every idiot in the US just HAD to travel for Thanksgiving
> means 3 new deaths in the next month, minumum, and probably far more.
> We have now arrived at the point where hospital services are unavailable due
> to the number of CoVid cases, so people are going to also start dying from
> other preventable causes as well -- excess deaths in the US are up
> considerably more than just the number from CoVid already, and it's going to
> be much worse in January and February.
> 
> My 97 year old mother is currently in hospital, still doing pretty well but
> on oxygen, diagnosed three days after I was.  I suspect she got it from her
> home health aides rather than me bringing it home since she was complaining
> of chills for several days before I started to run a temp.  Gonna be another
> couple weeks before we know for sure she's gonna make it.
> 
> I got the Lilly mono-clonal antibody treatment.  Mom would have had the
> Remdesivir except she has some pre-existing kidney issues so they didn't
> prescribe it, haven't heard back if they decided to use the Lilly one (it's
> not usually used in hospitalized patients).  Seemed to help me, I have
> regained a little sense of taste and smell, although strong odors make my
> nose sting like crazy.
> 
> I was hoping Mom could be vaccinated shortly, she's up as soon as the
> nursing home residents get one which starts this week in Indiana.
> Thankfully my sister in law the nurse is already done with round one of the
> Pfizer vaccine.
> 
> This stuff is not a joke, get the vaccine as soon as you can!
> 
> Peter
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

Karl, In your experience, do you think illegal immigration across the
southern border could be a factor, especially in CA?

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Peter Frederick via Mercedes
Sent: Saturday, December 26, 2020 11:01 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List 
Cc: Peter Frederick 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

Actually, all the new cases are from there being far too many cases around.
Since I'm half way through a case myself with no known exposure, I can
verify it's very contagious.  

The more people have it, the more it spreads, just like any contagious
disease.  The death rate is going up because somewhere between one and three
percent of people who contract it eventually die from it.  Several million
new cases since every idiot in the US just HAD to travel for Thanksgiving
means 3 new deaths in the next month, minumum, and probably far more.
We have now arrived at the point where hospital services are unavailable due
to the number of CoVid cases, so people are going to also start dying from
other preventable causes as well -- excess deaths in the US are up
considerably more than just the number from CoVid already, and it's going to
be much worse in January and February.

My 97 year old mother is currently in hospital, still doing pretty well but
on oxygen, diagnosed three days after I was.  I suspect she got it from her
home health aides rather than me bringing it home since she was complaining
of chills for several days before I started to run a temp.  Gonna be another
couple weeks before we know for sure she's gonna make it.

I got the Lilly mono-clonal antibody treatment.  Mom would have had the
Remdesivir except she has some pre-existing kidney issues so they didn't
prescribe it, haven't heard back if they decided to use the Lilly one (it's
not usually used in hospitalized patients).  Seemed to help me, I have
regained a little sense of taste and smell, although strong odors make my
nose sting like crazy.

I was hoping Mom could be vaccinated shortly, she's up as soon as the
nursing home residents get one which starts this week in Indiana.
Thankfully my sister in law the nurse is already done with round one of the
Pfizer vaccine.

This stuff is not a joke, get the vaccine as soon as you can!

Peter
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com



___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Peter Frederick via Mercedes]

Actually, all the new cases are from there being far too many cases around.  
Since I'm half way through a case myself with no known exposure, I can verify 
it's very contagious.  

The more people have it, the more it spreads, just like any contagious disease. 
 The death rate is going up because somewhere between one and three percent of 
people who contract it eventually die from it.  Several million new cases since 
every idiot in the US just HAD to travel for Thanksgiving means 3 new 
deaths in the next month, minumum, and probably far more.  We have now arrived 
at the point where hospital services are unavailable due to the number of CoVid 
cases, so people are going to also start dying from other preventable causes as 
well -- excess deaths in the US are up considerably more than just the number 
from CoVid already, and it's going to be much worse in January and February.

My 97 year old mother is currently in hospital, still doing pretty well but on 
oxygen, diagnosed three days after I was.  I suspect she got it from her home 
health aides rather than me bringing it home since she was complaining of 
chills for several days before I started to run a temp.  Gonna be another 
couple weeks before we know for sure she's gonna make it.

I got the Lilly mono-clonal antibody treatment.  Mom would have had the 
Remdesivir except she has some pre-existing kidney issues so they didn't 
prescribe it, haven't heard back if they decided to use the Lilly one (it's not 
usually used in hospitalized patients).  Seemed to help me, I have regained a 
little sense of taste and smell, although strong odors make my nose sting like 
crazy.

I was hoping Mom could be vaccinated shortly, she's up as soon as the nursing 
home residents get one which starts this week in Indiana.  Thankfully my sister 
in law the nurse is already done with round one of the Pfizer vaccine.

This stuff is not a joke, get the vaccine as soon as you can!

Peter
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Credit report, Karl. Thank you. Can you explain why the number of deaths is
increasing at such an alarming rate. I thought that the new cases were from
restaurants and other large event Gatherings. Is it possible to generalize?

On Sat, Dec 26, 2020, 5:47 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Yes we can shift a lot of resources around. But you have to realize it
> means nothing else is getting done. All elective surgeries are cancelled
> until further notice. All of our anesthesia residents have been temporarily
> assigned to ICUs, along with every other qualified fellow (cardiology etc)
> in the institution. Currently about 310 of our 900 total beds are occupied
> by covid patients, and we are increasing by 15-20 covid patients per day.
> The peak in April was 160. Not looking good. Some hospitals in the state
> are something like 80-90% covid patients, e.g. El Centro.
>
> The limit on hospital beds is more often a staffing limit than a physical
> limit. It isnt like there is a huge pool of RNs out there available to hire
> to staff an extra 20 beds every day. This is particularly true of ICU
> nurses. Most nurses dont work in ICUs. Respiratory therapists are also in
> high demand. Overtime is very expensive.
>
> If you come into the ER for any non-covid reason, your care will be
> impacted, including the ambulance taking you to a distant facility because
> the ER where you would like to be taken is closed.
>
> At any rate we will do what we have to do. Most of the fear mongering is
> media driven - not hospitals or providers. Our hospital is normally full.
> Giving up over 300 beds is a big deal. But no one is in the parking lot -
> yet.
>
> Hospitals are only "businesses" in the sense that they are not publically
> supported, so they run as nonprofits typically. They have to watch the
> bottom line or they can run out of cash quickly. If they were not run as
> businesses, we would have to pay for them with tax money.
>
> Daily new cases seem to have peaked here now, but hospitalizations tend to
> lag the new cases by a week or two. So we could easily be over 400 patients
> in hospital before this wave subsides. We also have no idea why we are even
> in a wave, as we remain mostly locked down, but there are lots of people in
> high density housing working essential jobs who are likely contributing,
> and apparently that is enough to cause a spike.
>
> In other news, some details of the botched CDC testing fiasco. What a
> cluster this turned out to be when they could have simply bought some tests
> from Thailand or Korea. A real  "perfect is the enemy of good" scenario:
>
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/cdc-covid/2020/12/25/c2b418ae-4206-11eb-8db8-395dedaaa036_story.html?utm_campaign=wp_post_most_medium=email_source=newsletter=nl_most=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F2de0633%2F5fe766a79d2fda0efb94a093%2F5e2922849bbc0f632602b279%2F8%2F68%2F5fe766a79d2fda0efb94a093
>
> On Mon, Dec 21, 2020, 11:41 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > My understanding of the hospital bed "shortage" is that hospitals are
> > businesses, and having an empty bed "just because" is a money losing
> > proposition.  Thus the number of available beds is set based on demand
> and
> > forecasted demand.  Chicken Little crying about the sky is falling
> because
> > hospital beds are nearly full / nearly at capacity is deceptive
> > fear-mongering.  When the demand exists, hospitals will meet it.  Back at
> > the start of this panic, the US. Navy hospital ships were mobilized, one
> to
> > each coast, and they were not used to treat Wuhan Red Death patients.
> That
> > would be a money losing proposition for the hospitals, so no one should
> be
> > surprised.
> > -
> > Max
> > Charleston SC
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 11:12 AM Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > >  You do bring up a good point about hospitals being hit with shortages
> > > again. You'd have thought that having the summer off they'd have
> stocked
> > up
> > > on PPE. I've certainly stocked us up on cleaners, TP and paper towels.
> > I've
> > > got meat and frozen veg laid in assuming we're going to be locked down
> > > starting at the first of the year.
> > > Apparently hospital administrators don't think ahead. Angie has laid
> in a
> > > year's worth (!) of masks, rubber gloves and cleaner for her practice
> > > although I expect her to be closed down after the holidays.
> > > -Curt
> > >
> > > On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 6:11:39 PM EST, Clay Monroe via
> > Mercedes
> > >  wrote:
> > >
> > >  Short term success in this plague is no measure of long term
> > > effectiveness.
> > >
> > > There are small victories that have not withstood the test of time.
> > > Kauai, HI shut itself off for seven months and now is being hard hit by
> > > infections.  AK also thought it had a handle, but that early control
> was
> > > 

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Yes we can shift a lot of resources around. But you have to realize it
means nothing else is getting done. All elective surgeries are cancelled
until further notice. All of our anesthesia residents have been temporarily
assigned to ICUs, along with every other qualified fellow (cardiology etc)
in the institution. Currently about 310 of our 900 total beds are occupied
by covid patients, and we are increasing by 15-20 covid patients per day.
The peak in April was 160. Not looking good. Some hospitals in the state
are something like 80-90% covid patients, e.g. El Centro.

The limit on hospital beds is more often a staffing limit than a physical
limit. It isnt like there is a huge pool of RNs out there available to hire
to staff an extra 20 beds every day. This is particularly true of ICU
nurses. Most nurses dont work in ICUs. Respiratory therapists are also in
high demand. Overtime is very expensive.

If you come into the ER for any non-covid reason, your care will be
impacted, including the ambulance taking you to a distant facility because
the ER where you would like to be taken is closed.

At any rate we will do what we have to do. Most of the fear mongering is
media driven - not hospitals or providers. Our hospital is normally full.
Giving up over 300 beds is a big deal. But no one is in the parking lot -
yet.

Hospitals are only "businesses" in the sense that they are not publically
supported, so they run as nonprofits typically. They have to watch the
bottom line or they can run out of cash quickly. If they were not run as
businesses, we would have to pay for them with tax money.

Daily new cases seem to have peaked here now, but hospitalizations tend to
lag the new cases by a week or two. So we could easily be over 400 patients
in hospital before this wave subsides. We also have no idea why we are even
in a wave, as we remain mostly locked down, but there are lots of people in
high density housing working essential jobs who are likely contributing,
and apparently that is enough to cause a spike.

In other news, some details of the botched CDC testing fiasco. What a
cluster this turned out to be when they could have simply bought some tests
from Thailand or Korea. A real  "perfect is the enemy of good" scenario:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/cdc-covid/2020/12/25/c2b418ae-4206-11eb-8db8-395dedaaa036_story.html?utm_campaign=wp_post_most_medium=email_source=newsletter=nl_most=https%3A%2F%2Fs2.washingtonpost.com%2Fcar-ln-tr%2F2de0633%2F5fe766a79d2fda0efb94a093%2F5e2922849bbc0f632602b279%2F8%2F68%2F5fe766a79d2fda0efb94a093

On Mon, Dec 21, 2020, 11:41 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> My understanding of the hospital bed "shortage" is that hospitals are
> businesses, and having an empty bed "just because" is a money losing
> proposition.  Thus the number of available beds is set based on demand and
> forecasted demand.  Chicken Little crying about the sky is falling because
> hospital beds are nearly full / nearly at capacity is deceptive
> fear-mongering.  When the demand exists, hospitals will meet it.  Back at
> the start of this panic, the US. Navy hospital ships were mobilized, one to
> each coast, and they were not used to treat Wuhan Red Death patients.  That
> would be a money losing proposition for the hospitals, so no one should be
> surprised.
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 11:12 AM Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> >  You do bring up a good point about hospitals being hit with shortages
> > again. You'd have thought that having the summer off they'd have stocked
> up
> > on PPE. I've certainly stocked us up on cleaners, TP and paper towels.
> I've
> > got meat and frozen veg laid in assuming we're going to be locked down
> > starting at the first of the year.
> > Apparently hospital administrators don't think ahead. Angie has laid in a
> > year's worth (!) of masks, rubber gloves and cleaner for her practice
> > although I expect her to be closed down after the holidays.
> > -Curt
> >
> > On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 6:11:39 PM EST, Clay Monroe via
> Mercedes
> >  wrote:
> >
> >  Short term success in this plague is no measure of long term
> > effectiveness.
> >
> > There are small victories that have not withstood the test of time.
> > Kauai, HI shut itself off for seven months and now is being hard hit by
> > infections.  AK also thought it had a handle, but that early control was
> > shown to be immune to the reality of disease spread.  New Zealand also
> > though they had mastered it, but keeps getting hit while being sealed off
> > from the world.  And the list of places that followed the narrative of
> > plague control are now hotbeds.
> >
> > The West Coast is full of sheeple who would willingly follow mandates and
> > narrative.  Yet that willingness to isolate and mask has not translated
> > into a reduction.  Medical centers are filled to the gills.  Maybe the
> > 

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Clay Monroe via Mercedes]

For months on end AK crowed about all the empty beds.  It was some sort of 
virtue signal that capacity was wide open and beds were going begging.  Now, 
there is not a spare bedpan or folding cot without people lined up for it.  It 
is to the point that medivac to SEA is no longer happening, since those 
hospitals are at capacity.  Somebody is getting very wealthy off the sick an 
dying.

Clay


inter urinas et faeces nascimur

> On Dec 21, 2020, at 10:40 AM, Meade Dillon via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> My understanding of the hospital bed "shortage" is that hospitals are
> businesses, and having an empty bed "just because" is a money losing
> proposition.  Thus the number of available beds is set based on demand and
> forecasted demand.  Chicken Little crying about the sky is falling because
> hospital beds are nearly full / nearly at capacity is deceptive
> fear-mongering.  When the demand exists, hospitals will meet it.  Back at
> the start of this panic, the US. Navy hospital ships were mobilized, one to
> each coast, and they were not used to treat Wuhan Red Death patients.  That
> would be a money losing proposition for the hospitals, so no one should be
> surprised.
> -

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

My understanding of the hospital bed "shortage" is that hospitals are
businesses, and having an empty bed "just because" is a money losing
proposition.  Thus the number of available beds is set based on demand and
forecasted demand.  Chicken Little crying about the sky is falling because
hospital beds are nearly full / nearly at capacity is deceptive
fear-mongering.  When the demand exists, hospitals will meet it.  Back at
the start of this panic, the US. Navy hospital ships were mobilized, one to
each coast, and they were not used to treat Wuhan Red Death patients.  That
would be a money losing proposition for the hospitals, so no one should be
surprised.
-
Max
Charleston SC


On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 11:12 AM Curt Raymond via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

>  You do bring up a good point about hospitals being hit with shortages
> again. You'd have thought that having the summer off they'd have stocked up
> on PPE. I've certainly stocked us up on cleaners, TP and paper towels. I've
> got meat and frozen veg laid in assuming we're going to be locked down
> starting at the first of the year.
> Apparently hospital administrators don't think ahead. Angie has laid in a
> year's worth (!) of masks, rubber gloves and cleaner for her practice
> although I expect her to be closed down after the holidays.
> -Curt
>
> On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 6:11:39 PM EST, Clay Monroe via Mercedes
>  wrote:
>
>  Short term success in this plague is no measure of long term
> effectiveness.
>
> There are small victories that have not withstood the test of time.
> Kauai, HI shut itself off for seven months and now is being hard hit by
> infections.  AK also thought it had a handle, but that early control was
> shown to be immune to the reality of disease spread.  New Zealand also
> though they had mastered it, but keeps getting hit while being sealed off
> from the world.  And the list of places that followed the narrative of
> plague control are now hotbeds.
>
> The West Coast is full of sheeple who would willingly follow mandates and
> narrative.  Yet that willingness to isolate and mask has not translated
> into a reduction.  Medical centers are filled to the gills.  Maybe the
> agenda would have been more effective had historical data been used to plan
> for the inevitable secondary and tertiary waves that would truly tax and be
> greater yet than initial contagion.  The public was shown those trends as
> they were trotted out by talking heads and officials as a means to convince
> the populace that such as thing as “flatten the curve”.  Which really just
> meant to prolong the disease until an effective response could be
> mustered.
>
> Today we are witnessing just what a sham the flat curve was.  Nobody seems
> to have bulked up a response to better handle the coming surge.  Where are
> the bigger treatment centers and beds?  Who has all the N95 masking,
> gloves, gowns that the current wave requires?  How many of the laid off
> medical staff are being repurposed to care for both the infected as well as
> those requiring normal care?  The disease has been kept at a simmer… low
> and slow.  That seems to point to an effort to keep it a crisis, not to
> effectuate a reliable treatment or cure.
>
> Now the discussion is how to triage.  Since the pooch was screwed, we will
> now be looking at providing treatment for those who can be saved instead of
> the heroics for all methods used over the last ten months.  Today, doctors
> and administrators really are deciding whose Granny gets to live and who
> they will be sending to the morgue.  An acceptance of the reality of
> lacking required resources, proper treatments, true dimensions of the
> transmission, and hubris those in charge are guilty of.  May have been more
> realistic to have allowed the thing to burn out and achieve herd immunity
> naturally.  That is what happens in Africa with Ebola, no matter how much
> prancing around WHO/UN/MSF and the Gates Foundation did.
>
> It will be decades before there is enough verifiable data to show what
> really was effective and what was tissue paper dreams.  Just like medical
> proclamation of the magic of radiation treatments has turned out to have
> been a lethal dose of false narratives.  From Marie Curie on, and that is
> just one example of modern doctors and medical professionals getting things
> oh, so, very wrong.  Diet pills, pain pills, early government endorsed
> treatments for HIV/AIDS turned out to be damaging, ineffective, or outright
> toxic and became public health embarrassments.  All that Oxy pushed by
> doctors could well be the root cause of the homeless crisis.  FDA and CDC
> endorsed the use.  Look how right they got this crisis.  Or, lets ban and
> not allow research into THC, which is very effective in treatment of many
> health issues.  Helps with side effects of chemo, ophthalmic issues, and
> might even assist in breaking fatal outcomes in opioids laces with
> fentanyl.  

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

Karl, I respect your medical experience and training (of which I have none).
Is your comment based on general experience or do you know specific examples
(e.g. things CDC prevented from doing or forced to do)?

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2020 11:35 PM


That is a reasonable question. I tend to think that had they been allowed to
do what they wanted to do, based upon their expertise in this area, rather
than being micromanaged at every turn by people with no formal training in
medicine, public health, or any other form of scientific endeavor, that
things would have been very different in terms of the course of this
epidemic and its magnitude. We have lots of examples of countries that had a
strong centralized government response, and did far better than we have in
terms of deaths per 100k.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 8:16 PM Scott Ritchey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Maybe the normal operations of the CDC needed interference?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
> Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2020 11:03 PM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> Cc: Karl Wittnebel 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
>
> Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White 
> House interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the 
> epidemic. The answer is unequivocally yes.
>
> If you want to find someone to defend the journalistic integrity of 
> the New York Times, pleas start your own thread.
>
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 3:54 PM Rick Knoble via Mercedes < 
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > >It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty and
bias.
> > While it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT should 
> > not be trusted.
> >
> >
> > https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-york
> > -t 
> > imes-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-hoax
> > -n
> > 1218390
> >
> >
> > Rick
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com



___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

People, in general, are known to rend the bearers of news they don't want to 
hear
limb from limb, so to speak.  We are continuing to get exactly the government we
have paid for, and deserve.  God help us.

Currently I lay the blame on the infotainment industry, and the ill-considered 
positive
feedback policies of media outlets, social and otherwise.  These are currently 
NOT
designed to bring out the best in people, but rather the worst.

-- Jim


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

 Really?She's a massage therapist. She's had her own practice since, well I 
forget now, 2000 maybe?
-Curt

On Monday, December 21, 2020, 11:16:51 AM EST, Mitch Haley via Mercedes 
 wrote:  
 
 I don't believe I ever heard what Angie does for a living.

On 2020-12-21 10:11, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:
>  Angie has laid
> in a year's worth (!) of masks, rubber gloves and cleaner for her
> practice although I expect her to be closed down after the holidays.
> -Curt

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

  
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

I don't believe I ever heard what Angie does for a living.

On 2020-12-21 10:11, Curt Raymond via Mercedes wrote:

 Angie has laid
in a year's worth (!) of masks, rubber gloves and cleaner for her
practice although I expect her to be closed down after the holidays.
-Curt


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

 You do bring up a good point about hospitals being hit with shortages again. 
You'd have thought that having the summer off they'd have stocked up on PPE. 
I've certainly stocked us up on cleaners, TP and paper towels. I've got meat 
and frozen veg laid in assuming we're going to be locked down starting at the 
first of the year.
Apparently hospital administrators don't think ahead. Angie has laid in a 
year's worth (!) of masks, rubber gloves and cleaner for her practice although 
I expect her to be closed down after the holidays.
-Curt

On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 6:11:39 PM EST, Clay Monroe via Mercedes 
 wrote:  
 
 Short term success in this plague is no measure of long term effectiveness.  

There are small victories that have not withstood the test of time.  Kauai, HI 
shut itself off for seven months and now is being hard hit by infections.  AK 
also thought it had a handle, but that early control was shown to be immune to 
the reality of disease spread.  New Zealand also though they had mastered it, 
but keeps getting hit while being sealed off from the world.  And the list of 
places that followed the narrative of plague control are now hotbeds.  

The West Coast is full of sheeple who would willingly follow mandates and 
narrative.  Yet that willingness to isolate and mask has not translated into a 
reduction.  Medical centers are filled to the gills.  Maybe the agenda would 
have been more effective had historical data been used to plan for the 
inevitable secondary and tertiary waves that would truly tax and be greater yet 
than initial contagion.  The public was shown those trends as they were trotted 
out by talking heads and officials as a means to convince the populace that 
such as thing as “flatten the curve”.  Which really just meant to prolong the 
disease until an effective response could be mustered.  

Today we are witnessing just what a sham the flat curve was.  Nobody seems to 
have bulked up a response to better handle the coming surge.  Where are the 
bigger treatment centers and beds?  Who has all the N95 masking, gloves, gowns 
that the current wave requires?  How many of the laid off medical staff are 
being repurposed to care for both the infected as well as those requiring 
normal care?  The disease has been kept at a simmer… low and slow.  That seems 
to point to an effort to keep it a crisis, not to effectuate a reliable 
treatment or cure.

Now the discussion is how to triage.  Since the pooch was screwed, we will now 
be looking at providing treatment for those who can be saved instead of the 
heroics for all methods used over the last ten months.  Today, doctors and 
administrators really are deciding whose Granny gets to live and who they will 
be sending to the morgue.  An acceptance of the reality of lacking required 
resources, proper treatments, true dimensions of the transmission, and hubris 
those in charge are guilty of.  May have been more realistic to have allowed 
the thing to burn out and achieve herd immunity naturally.  That is what 
happens in Africa with Ebola, no matter how much prancing around WHO/UN/MSF and 
the Gates Foundation did.

It will be decades before there is enough verifiable data to show what really 
was effective and what was tissue paper dreams.  Just like medical proclamation 
of the magic of radiation treatments has turned out to have been a lethal dose 
of false narratives.  From Marie Curie on, and that is just one example of 
modern doctors and medical professionals getting things oh, so, very wrong.  
Diet pills, pain pills, early government endorsed treatments for HIV/AIDS 
turned out to be damaging, ineffective, or outright toxic and became public 
health embarrassments.  All that Oxy pushed by doctors could well be the root 
cause of the homeless crisis.  FDA and CDC endorsed the use.  Look how right 
they got this crisis.  Or, lets ban and not allow research into THC, which is 
very effective in treatment of many health issues.  Helps with side effects of 
chemo, ophthalmic issues, and might even assist in breaking fatal outcomes in 
opioids laces with fentanyl.  (Currently being investigated in BC Canada)  

There are no simple or easy solutions.  There are no political personages who 
were not chasing their own tails on this.  Because those supposed to be 
“enlightened” and medically trained or establishment endorsed speaking heads 
could not provide a reliable or consistent message from the start, and kept on 
vacillating if not daily then on a weekly basis.  Hard to hit a target spun out 
of control by the people you are supposed to trust on the issue.

Clay


inter urinas et faeces nascimur

> On Dec 19, 2020, at 7:34 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> That is a reasonable question. I tend to think that had they been allowed
> to do what they wanted to do, based upon their expertise in this area,
> rather than being micromanaged at every turn by people with no formal
> training in medicine, public 

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

 Did any of you listen to: 
https://www.artofmanliness.com/articles/podcast-619-what-driving-tells-us-about-agency-skill-and-freedom/I
 like the Art of Manliness podcast anyway but this was a pretty good one...
-Curt

On Sunday, December 20, 2020, 12:26:17 PM EST, Rick Knoble via Mercedes 
 wrote:  
 
 Jim C. says:

>Thinking is hard.

That's probably why so few people do it anymore.
It's much easier to let others or algorithms do their thinking for them.

Mercedes content: all the computerized nanny's are niceties, but they have 
compromised people's abilities to drive. ABS=no need to learn traction limits 
or pump the brake. Anti skid=no need to learn to countersteer in a skid. Lane 
assist (dui package) = no need to check mirrors anymore. Adaptive cruise=no 
need to pay attention to what's in front of you.

Technology, while a wonderful tool, is just that. A tool. Currently that tool 
is being used to dumb down the masses, it seems.


Rick
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

  
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-12-21 09:46, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes wrote:
I didn't read the deck that way at all. In fact the older adults were 
first

in line after healthcare providers and essential workers.


Yes, the final recommendation was to hit the nursing homes and then the 
old people, which they said was the scientific way of doing it.


But in the ethics section, they said it was unethical, because the white 
population is older than minority populations, (and helping white people 
is unethical)


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

I didn't read the deck that way at all. In fact the older adults were first
in line after healthcare providers and essential workers.



On Mon, Dec 21, 2020, 5:11 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> On 2020-12-20 23:46, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes wrote:
> > As I recall, the CDC hedged their bets by taking both sides of every
> > issue,
> > at some point.  Micromanagement?  I'll never know.  But I have worked
> > in a
> > Federal bureaucracy where they believe they have the only answer.
>
> These are the same asshats who think giving vaccine to old people is
> unethical, because white people are more likely to live longer. (slides
> 31-32)
>
>
> https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/acip/meetings/downloads/slides-2020-11/COVID-04-Dooling.pdf
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-12-20 23:46, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes wrote:
As I recall, the CDC hedged their bets by taking both sides of every 
issue,
at some point.  Micromanagement?  I'll never know.  But I have worked 
in a

Federal bureaucracy where they believe they have the only answer.


These are the same asshats who think giving vaccine to old people is 
unethical, because white people are more likely to live longer. (slides 
31-32)


https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/acip/meetings/downloads/slides-2020-11/COVID-04-Dooling.pdf

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

As I recall, the CDC hedged their bets by taking both sides of every issue,
at some point.  Micromanagement?  I'll never know.  But I have worked in a
Federal bureaucracy where they believe they have the only answer.

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2020 12:02 AM
To: Mercedes Discussion List 
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

CDC was in a no-win situation. If they warned everyone about the pandemic
and urged physical distancing/masking it would be politically unpopular.
If more cautious they would be criticized as the death toll mounted.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 11:35 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> That is a reasonable question. I tend to think that had they been 
> allowed to do what they wanted to do, based upon their expertise in 
> this area, rather than being micromanaged at every turn by people with 
> no formal training in medicine, public health, or any other form of 
> scientific endeavor, that things would have been very different in 
> terms of the course of this epidemic and its magnitude. We have lots 
> of examples of countries that had a strong centralized government 
> response, and did far better than we have in terms of deaths per 100k.
>
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 8:16 PM Scott Ritchey via Mercedes < 
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Maybe the normal operations of the CDC needed interference?
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
> > Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2020 11:03 PM
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> > Cc: Karl Wittnebel 
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
> >
> > Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White 
> > House interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the 
> > epidemic. The answer is unequivocally yes.
> >
> > If you want to find someone to defend the journalistic integrity of 
> > the
> New
> > York Times, pleas start your own thread.
> >
> > On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 3:54 PM Rick Knoble via Mercedes < 
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > > >It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty 
> > > >and
> bias.
> > > While it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT 
> > > should not be trusted.
> > >
> > >
> > > https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-yo
> > > rk-t 
> > > imes-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-ho
> > > ax-n
> > > 1218390
> > >
> > >
> > > Rick
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >
> > >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com



___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Clay Monroe via Mercedes]

Short term success in this plague is no measure of long term effectiveness.  

There are small victories that have not withstood the test of time.  Kauai, HI 
shut itself off for seven months and now is being hard hit by infections.  AK 
also thought it had a handle, but that early control was shown to be immune to 
the reality of disease spread.  New Zealand also though they had mastered it, 
but keeps getting hit while being sealed off from the world.  And the list of 
places that followed the narrative of plague control are now hotbeds.  

The West Coast is full of sheeple who would willingly follow mandates and 
narrative.  Yet that willingness to isolate and mask has not translated into a 
reduction.  Medical centers are filled to the gills.  Maybe the agenda would 
have been more effective had historical data been used to plan for the 
inevitable secondary and tertiary waves that would truly tax and be greater yet 
than initial contagion.  The public was shown those trends as they were trotted 
out by talking heads and officials as a means to convince the populace that 
such as thing as “flatten the curve”.  Which really just meant to prolong the 
disease until an effective response could be mustered.  

Today we are witnessing just what a sham the flat curve was.  Nobody seems to 
have bulked up a response to better handle the coming surge.  Where are the 
bigger treatment centers and beds?  Who has all the N95 masking, gloves, gowns 
that the current wave requires?  How many of the laid off medical staff are 
being repurposed to care for both the infected as well as those requiring 
normal care?   The disease has been kept at a simmer… low and slow.  That seems 
to point to an effort to keep it a crisis, not to effectuate a reliable 
treatment or cure.

Now the discussion is how to triage.  Since the pooch was screwed, we will now 
be looking at providing treatment for those who can be saved instead of the 
heroics for all methods used over the last ten months.  Today, doctors and 
administrators really are deciding whose Granny gets to live and who they will 
be sending to the morgue.  An acceptance of the reality of lacking required 
resources, proper treatments, true dimensions of the transmission, and hubris 
those in charge are guilty of.  May have been more realistic to have allowed 
the thing to burn out and achieve herd immunity naturally.  That is what 
happens in Africa with Ebola, no matter how much prancing around WHO/UN/MSF and 
the Gates Foundation did.

It will be decades before there is enough verifiable data to show what really 
was effective and what was tissue paper dreams.  Just like medical proclamation 
of the magic of radiation treatments has turned out to have been a lethal dose 
of false narratives.  From Marie Curie on, and that is just one example of 
modern doctors and medical professionals getting things oh, so, very wrong.  
Diet pills, pain pills, early government endorsed treatments for HIV/AIDS 
turned out to be damaging, ineffective, or outright toxic and became public 
health embarrassments.   All that Oxy pushed by doctors could well be the root 
cause of the homeless crisis.   FDA and CDC endorsed the use.  Look how right 
they got this crisis.  Or, lets ban and not allow research into THC, which is 
very effective in treatment of many health issues.  Helps with side effects of 
chemo, ophthalmic issues, and might even assist in breaking fatal outcomes in 
opioids laces with fentanyl.  (Currently being investigated in BC Canada)  

There are no simple or easy solutions.  There are no political personages who 
were not chasing their own tails on this.  Because those supposed to be 
“enlightened” and medically trained or establishment endorsed speaking heads 
could not provide a reliable or consistent message from the start, and kept on 
vacillating if not daily then on a weekly basis.  Hard to hit a target spun out 
of control by the people you are supposed to trust on the issue.

Clay


inter urinas et faeces nascimur

> On Dec 19, 2020, at 7:34 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> That is a reasonable question. I tend to think that had they been allowed
> to do what they wanted to do, based upon their expertise in this area,
> rather than being micromanaged at every turn by people with no formal
> training in medicine, public health, or any other form of scientific
> endeavor, that things would have been very different in terms of the course
> of this epidemic and its magnitude. We have lots of examples of countries
> that had a strong centralized government response, and did far better than
> we have in terms of deaths per 100k.


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Rick Knoble via Mercedes]

Jim C. says:

>Thinking is hard.

That's probably why so few people do it anymore.
It's much easier to let others or algorithms do their thinking for them.

Mercedes content: all the computerized nanny's are niceties, but they have 
compromised people's abilities to drive. ABS=no need to learn traction limits 
or pump the brake. Anti skid=no need to learn to countersteer in a skid. Lane 
assist (dui package) = no need to check mirrors anymore. Adaptive cruise=no 
need to pay attention to what's in front of you.

Technology, while a wonderful tool, is just that. A tool. Currently that tool 
is being used to dumb down the masses, it seems.


Rick
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Jim Cathey via Mercedes]

> The problem is that once credibility is lost it's hard to re-establish. If 
> I've been lied to I'm unlikely to believe that source in the future.

Of course, but that doesn't affect the validity _of_the_argument_.
Otherwise, if I am opposed to a true thing, all I have to do is endorse
a prominent liar to stand behind it, then I've taken it out 'automatically'.

Thinking is hard.

-- Jim

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

The problem is that once credibility is lost it's hard to re-establish. If I've 
been lied to I'm unlikely to believe that source in the future.
Curt

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 11:26 AM, Karl Wittnebel via 
Mercedes wrote:   I take my news where I find it. Are 
you disputing the facts in the article?
Seems like direct quotes from the people involved should be pretty reliable.

They are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT are not
true, that all things in the NYT are not true. This one is known as the ad
hominem attack, where instead of refuting any facts, someone tries to
discredit an article because a certain person wrote it, or it was published
in a certain periodical.

https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 7:04 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Really, you trust the New York Times?  Same paper that swore up and down
> the Hunter Biden laptop was fake, not a thing, ignore this and move on, and
> now after the election "oh yeah, the FBI and DOJ are investigating that
> laptop.  Sorry, our bad."  This is just one of many examples of their
> bias.  "Russian Collusion" anyone?
>
> No, sorry, NY Times has proven itself to have no credibility at all.  They
> will print anything and everything to rake in the eyeballs and money.
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
> >
> > Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> > during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> > qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> > this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is
> > > appreciated!
> > >
> > > Dan
> > >
> > > > On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by
> personal
> > > and
> > > > occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> > > > procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
> > > factors
> > > > will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients,
> > etc.
> > > > Maybe by Friday.
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> > > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last
> > night
> > > >> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago,
> negative
> > > >> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to
> > > see if
> > > >> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this
> > > trial.
> > > >> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from
> > them.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
> > experiences
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > >
> >
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> --FT
> > > >> Sent from iPhone
> > > >> ___
> > > >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> > > >>
> > > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > > >>
> > > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > > ___
> > > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > > >
> > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > > >
> > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >
> > >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go 

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-12-20 00:01, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
CDC was in a no-win situation. If they warned everyone about the 
pandemic
and urged physical distancing/masking it would be politically 
unpopular.

If more cautious they would be criticized as the death toll mounted.


There were all sorts of countervailing practical concerns involved, 
which is why I hesitated to blame government officials unless they acted 
out of apparent malice.


Mitch.

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-12-19 23:03, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes wrote:
Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White 
House

interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the epidemic. The
answer is unequivocally yes.


So, to paraphrase,

The science is settled. Orange Man is Bad. No further discussion 
required, because Orange Man Bad.


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Clay Monroe via Mercedes]

Though there may be one or two credible article they publish, that is far 
outweighed by the preponderance of highly biased and corrupt reporting 
throughout their rag.  As a person who subscribes and reads any of the legacy 
media broadsheets or magazines regularly will come to realize, there is a 
taint, a slant and management of messaging within the pages.  The same yellow 
journalism is found broadcast daily.

Some choose to drink that Kool-Aid.  I fully understand how messaging results 
in horrors.  Dad got called out to assist with the debacle of November 1978 in 
Guyana while stationed in Caracas.  He came back from that a very different 
person and spoke rarely of it.  What he did say was not to believe what those 
in charge are telling you.  Narratives and the truth are not the same.  Living 
in Venezuela served well to re-enforce his warnings.  All is not as it seems, 
and the press is a tool for populace control.

YMMV.  

Clay


inter urinas et faeces nascimur

> On Dec 19, 2020, at 7:25 AM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the article?
> Seems like direct quotes from the people involved should be pretty reliable.
> 
> They are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
> other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT are not
> true, that all things in the NYT are not true. This one is known as the ad
> hominem attack, where instead of refuting any facts, someone tries to
> discredit an article because a certain person wrote it, or it was published
> in a certain periodical.
> 
> https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/
> 
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 7:04 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

CDC was in a no-win situation. If they warned everyone about the pandemic
and urged physical distancing/masking it would be politically unpopular.
If more cautious they would be criticized as the death toll mounted.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 11:35 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> That is a reasonable question. I tend to think that had they been allowed
> to do what they wanted to do, based upon their expertise in this area,
> rather than being micromanaged at every turn by people with no formal
> training in medicine, public health, or any other form of scientific
> endeavor, that things would have been very different in terms of the course
> of this epidemic and its magnitude. We have lots of examples of countries
> that had a strong centralized government response, and did far better than
> we have in terms of deaths per 100k.
>
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 8:16 PM Scott Ritchey via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Maybe the normal operations of the CDC needed interference?
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
> > Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2020 11:03 PM
> > To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> > Cc: Karl Wittnebel 
> > Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
> >
> > Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White House
> > interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the epidemic. The
> > answer is unequivocally yes.
> >
> > If you want to find someone to defend the journalistic integrity of the
> New
> > York Times, pleas start your own thread.
> >
> > On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 3:54 PM Rick Knoble via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > > >It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty and
> bias.
> > > While it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT should
> > > not be trusted.
> > >
> > >
> > > https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-york-t
> > > imes-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-hoax-n
> > > 1218390
> > >
> > >
> > > Rick
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >
> > >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

That is a reasonable question. I tend to think that had they been allowed
to do what they wanted to do, based upon their expertise in this area,
rather than being micromanaged at every turn by people with no formal
training in medicine, public health, or any other form of scientific
endeavor, that things would have been very different in terms of the course
of this epidemic and its magnitude. We have lots of examples of countries
that had a strong centralized government response, and did far better than
we have in terms of deaths per 100k.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 8:16 PM Scott Ritchey via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Maybe the normal operations of the CDC needed interference?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
> Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2020 11:03 PM
> To: Mercedes Discussion List 
> Cc: Karl Wittnebel 
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax
>
> Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White House
> interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the epidemic. The
> answer is unequivocally yes.
>
> If you want to find someone to defend the journalistic integrity of the New
> York Times, pleas start your own thread.
>
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 3:54 PM Rick Knoble via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > >It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty and bias.
> > While it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT should
> > not be trusted.
> >
> >
> > https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-york-t
> > imes-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-hoax-n
> > 1218390
> >
> >
> > Rick
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

Maybe the normal operations of the CDC needed interference?

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes
Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2020 11:03 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List 
Cc: Karl Wittnebel 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White House
interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the epidemic. The
answer is unequivocally yes.

If you want to find someone to defend the journalistic integrity of the New
York Times, pleas start your own thread.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 3:54 PM Rick Knoble via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> >It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty and bias.
> While it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT should 
> not be trusted.
>
>
> https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-york-t
> imes-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-hoax-n
> 1218390
>
>
> Rick
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com



___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Sorry guys, but the topic of discussion is whether the Trump White House
interfered in the normal operations of the CDC during the epidemic. The
answer is unequivocally yes.

If you want to find someone to defend the journalistic integrity of the New
York Times, pleas start your own thread.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 3:54 PM Rick Knoble via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> >It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty and bias.
> While it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT should not be
> trusted.
>
>
> https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-york-times-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-hoax-n1218390
>
>
> Rick
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Of course it is ad hominem to divert attention away from the facts of an
article in order to cast aspersions upon its publisher and thereby attempt
to discredit the article. A "guilt by association" argument. It is
extremely common. It is just not logical in any way

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 1:29 PM greg via Mercedes 
wrote:

>
>
>
> It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of dishonesty
> and bias. While it is not proof of a lie, it is evidence that the NYT
> should not be trusted.
> Greg
> > I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the
> > article?
> > Seems like direct quotes from the people
> involved should be pretty
> > reliable.
> >
> > They
> are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
> > other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT
> are
> > not
> > true, that all things in the NYT are not true.
> This one is known as the ad
> > hominem attack, where instead of
> refuting any facts, someone tries to
> > discredit an article
> because a certain person wrote it, or it was
> > published
> >
> in a certain periodical.
> >
> >
> https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/
> >
>
> > On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 7:04 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Really,
> you trust the New York Times?  Same paper that swore up and down
> >> the Hunter Biden laptop was fake, not a thing, ignore this and
> move on,
> >> and
> >> now after the election "oh
> yeah, the FBI and DOJ are investigating that
> >> laptop.  Sorry,
> our bad."  This is just one of many examples of their
> >>
> bias.  "Russian Collusion" anyone?
> >>
> >>
> No, sorry, NY Times has proven itself to have no credibility at all.
> >> They
> >> will print anything and everything to rake
> in the eyeballs and money.
> >> -
> >>
> Max
> >> Charleston SC
> >>
> >>
> >>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> > Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
> >> >
> >> > Here's an article about a couple of
> Trump appointees who were at the
> >> CDC
> >> >
> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> >> > qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed
> to set it.
> >> But
> >> > this article gives some
> detail on how that actually transpired:
> >> >
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> >>
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >>
> > > Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It
> is
> >> > > appreciated!
> >> > >
> >> > > Dan
> >> > >
> >> > >
> > On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> >> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >> >
> > >
> >> > > > We got a shipment yesterday and we
> are all prioritized now by
> >> personal
> >> > >
> and
> >> > > > occupational risk factors. So the ICU
> people doing
> >> aerosol-generating
> >> > > >
> procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
> >> > > factors
> >> > > > will get the
> vaccine first, then anyone working with covid
> >> patients,
> >> > etc.
> >> > > > Maybe by Friday.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > On Wed, Dec 16,
> 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> >> > >
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >> > > >
> >> > > >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial,
> feeling a bit off last
> >> > night
> >> > >
> >> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago,
> >> negative
> >> > > >> although I had a rxn
> then too. Will go get another test next week
> >> to
> >> > > see if
> >> > > >> I got the
> real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in
> >>
> this
> >> > > trial.
> >> > > >> If I
> got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax
> >>
> from
> >> > them.
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> COVID-19
> vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
> >> >
> experiences
> >> > > >>
> >> > >
> >>
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
>
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> --FT
> >> > > >> Sent
> from iPhone
> >> > > >>
> ___
> >> > > >>
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >> > > >>
> >>
> > > >> To search list archives
> http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go
> to:
> >> > > >>
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >> > > >>
> >> > > >>
> >> > > > ___
> >> > > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >> > >
> >
> >> > > > To search list archives
> http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >> > > >
> >> > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go
> to:
> >> > > >
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >> > > >

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Rick Knoble via Mercedes]

>It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of >dishonesty and bias. While 
>it is not proof of a lie, it >is evidence that the NYT should not be trusted.

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/12/18/new-york-times-forced-to-retract-hit-isis-podcast-series-because-it-was-a-hoax-n1218390


Rick
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[greg via Mercedes]

It is not ad hominem to point to a track record of dishonesty
and bias. While it is not proof of a lie, it is evidence that the NYT
should not be trusted.
Greg
> I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the
> article?
> Seems like direct quotes from the people
involved should be pretty
> reliable.
> 
> They
are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
> other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT
are
> not
> true, that all things in the NYT are not true.
This one is known as the ad
> hominem attack, where instead of
refuting any facts, someone tries to
> discredit an article
because a certain person wrote it, or it was
> published
>
in a certain periodical.
> 
>
https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/
>

> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 7:04 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Really,
you trust the New York Times?  Same paper that swore up and down
>> the Hunter Biden laptop was fake, not a thing, ignore this and
move on,
>> and
>> now after the election "oh
yeah, the FBI and DOJ are investigating that
>> laptop.  Sorry,
our bad."  This is just one of many examples of their
>>
bias.  "Russian Collusion" anyone?
>>
>>
No, sorry, NY Times has proven itself to have no credibility at all. 
>> They
>> will print anything and everything to rake
in the eyeballs and money.
>> -
>>
Max
>> Charleston SC
>>
>>
>>
On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>
>>
> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>> >
>> > Here's an article about a couple of
Trump appointees who were at the
>> CDC
>> >
during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
>> > qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed
to set it.
>> But
>> > this article gives some
detail on how that actually transpired:
>> >
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
>>
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> >
>>
> > Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It
is
>> > > appreciated!
>> > >
>> > > Dan
>> > >
>> > >
> On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
>> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> >
> >
>> > > > We got a shipment yesterday and we
are all prioritized now by
>> personal
>> > >
and
>> > > > occupational risk factors. So the ICU
people doing
>> aerosol-generating
>> > > >
procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
>> > > factors
>> > > > will get the
vaccine first, then anyone working with covid
>> patients,
>> > etc.
>> > > > Maybe by Friday.
>> > > >
>> > > > On Wed, Dec 16,
2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
>> > >
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial,
feeling a bit off last
>> > night
>> > >
>> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago,
>> negative
>> > > >> although I had a rxn
then too. Will go get another test next week
>> to
>> > > see if
>> > > >> I got the
real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in
>>
this
>> > > trial.
>> > > >> If I
got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax
>>
from
>> > them.
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> COVID-19
vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
>> >
experiences
>> > > >>
>> > >
>>
>> > >
>> >
>>
https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> --FT
>> > > >> Sent
from iPhone
>> > > >>
___
>> > > >>
http://www.okiebenz.com
>> > > >>
>>
> > >> To search list archives
http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> > > >>
>> > > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go
to:
>> > > >>
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > > ___
>> > > > http://www.okiebenz.com
>> > >
>
>> > > > To search list archives
http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> > > >
>> > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go
to:
>> > > >
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>
>> > > ___
>> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
>> > >
>> > > To search list archives
http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> > >
>>
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>
> >
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
___
>> >
http://www.okiebenz.com
>> >
>> > To search
list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> >
>> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> >
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> >
>> >
>>
___
>>
http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
>> To search list

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

yes I should stop taking the bait.

I just cannot commit to another mailing list. I don't mean to inflame any
sensibilities. Someone asked about whether the CDC was incompetent or not,
so the article was a belated response to that.

Right now I am figuring out whether the wings are going to fall off an
airplane I am considering building. I should be out working on the
turbocharger setup for the 606. And helping the guys put the sod down on
the yard. Anyway it is hard to see committing to another mailing list, as
much as I might enjoy it. I did look for the link one time and didn't
figure out how to subscribe.

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 9:37 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Karl, Come on over to Okietalk, where this sort of discussion belongs.
> I've composed a simply brilliant response and I'm sure you'd enjoy the
> opportunity to follow-up.
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
>
> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 11:26 AM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the
> article?
> > Seems like direct quotes from the people involved should be pretty
> > reliable.
> >
> > They are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
> > other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT are
> not
> > true, that all things in the NYT are not true. This one is known as the
> ad
> > hominem attack, where instead of refuting any facts, someone tries to
> > discredit an article because a certain person wrote it, or it was
> published
> > in a certain periodical.
> >
> > https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/
> >
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Karl, Come on over to Okietalk, where this sort of discussion belongs.
I've composed a simply brilliant response and I'm sure you'd enjoy the
opportunity to follow-up.
-
Max
Charleston SC


On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 11:26 AM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the article?
> Seems like direct quotes from the people involved should be pretty
> reliable.
>
> They are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
> other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT are not
> true, that all things in the NYT are not true. This one is known as the ad
> hominem attack, where instead of refuting any facts, someone tries to
> discredit an article because a certain person wrote it, or it was published
> in a certain periodical.
>
> https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/
>
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

I often refer to my logical fallacies poster when things like this come up:

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/

Excellent means of shutting these sorts of arguments down in short order.

-D

> On Dec 19, 2020, at 11:26 AM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the article?
> Seems like direct quotes from the people involved should be pretty reliable.
> 
> They are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
> other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT are not
> true, that all things in the NYT are not true. This one is known as the ad
> hominem attack, where instead of refuting any facts, someone tries to
> discredit an article because a certain person wrote it, or it was published
> in a certain periodical.
> 
> https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/
> 
>> On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 7:04 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Really, you trust the New York Times?  Same paper that swore up and down
>> the Hunter Biden laptop was fake, not a thing, ignore this and move on, and
>> now after the election "oh yeah, the FBI and DOJ are investigating that
>> laptop.  Sorry, our bad."  This is just one of many examples of their
>> bias.  "Russian Collusion" anyone?
>> 
>> No, sorry, NY Times has proven itself to have no credibility at all.  They
>> will print anything and everything to rake in the eyeballs and money.
>> -
>> Max
>> Charleston SC
>> 
>> 
>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>>> 
>>> Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
>>> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
>>> qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
>>> this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
>>> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>> 
 Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is
 appreciated!
 
 Dan
 
> On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
 mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
> We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by
>> personal
 and
> occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
 factors
> will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients,
>>> etc.
> Maybe by Friday.
> 
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last
>>> night
>> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago,
>> negative
>> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to
 see if
>> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this
 trial.
>> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from
>>> them.
>> 
>> 
>> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
>>> experiences
>> 
>> 
 
>>> 
>> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
>> 
>> 
>> --FT
>> Sent from iPhone
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 
 
 
 ___
 http://www.okiebenz.com
 
 To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
 
 To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
 http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
 
 
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>> 
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>> 
>>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go 

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

I take my news where I find it. Are you disputing the facts in the article?
Seems like direct quotes from the people involved should be pretty reliable.

They are called logicall fallacies for a reason - they are fallacies. In
other words, it does not follow that because some things in the NYT are not
true, that all things in the NYT are not true. This one is known as the ad
hominem attack, where instead of refuting any facts, someone tries to
discredit an article because a certain person wrote it, or it was published
in a certain periodical.

https://kreativcopywriting.com/10-logical-fallacies-know-spot/

On Sat, Dec 19, 2020, 7:04 AM Meade Dillon via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Really, you trust the New York Times?  Same paper that swore up and down
> the Hunter Biden laptop was fake, not a thing, ignore this and move on, and
> now after the election "oh yeah, the FBI and DOJ are investigating that
> laptop.  Sorry, our bad."  This is just one of many examples of their
> bias.  "Russian Collusion" anyone?
>
> No, sorry, NY Times has proven itself to have no credibility at all.  They
> will print anything and everything to rake in the eyeballs and money.
> -
> Max
> Charleston SC
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
> >
> > Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> > during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> > qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> > this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is
> > > appreciated!
> > >
> > > Dan
> > >
> > > > On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by
> personal
> > > and
> > > > occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> > > > procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
> > > factors
> > > > will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients,
> > etc.
> > > > Maybe by Friday.
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> > > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last
> > night
> > > >> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago,
> negative
> > > >> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to
> > > see if
> > > >> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this
> > > trial.
> > > >> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from
> > them.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
> > experiences
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > >
> >
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> --FT
> > > >> Sent from iPhone
> > > >> ___
> > > >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> > > >>
> > > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > > >>
> > > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > > ___
> > > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > > >
> > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > > >
> > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >
> > >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-12-19 10:03, Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote:

Really, you trust the New York Times?


Even Jon Stewart, a left leaning Canadian, doesn't trust the NYT.

http://www.cc.com/video-clips/ctffc2/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-petty-in-print

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Really, you trust the New York Times?  Same paper that swore up and down
the Hunter Biden laptop was fake, not a thing, ignore this and move on, and
now after the election "oh yeah, the FBI and DOJ are investigating that
laptop.  Sorry, our bad."  This is just one of many examples of their
bias.  "Russian Collusion" anyone?

No, sorry, NY Times has proven itself to have no credibility at all.  They
will print anything and everything to rake in the eyeballs and money.
-
Max
Charleston SC


On Wed, Dec 16, 2020 at 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>
> Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is
> > appreciated!
> >
> > Dan
> >
> > > On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by personal
> > and
> > > occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> > > procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
> > factors
> > > will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients,
> etc.
> > > Maybe by Friday.
> > >
> > > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last
> night
> > >> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago, negative
> > >> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to
> > see if
> > >> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this
> > trial.
> > >> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from
> them.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
> experiences
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --FT
> > >> Sent from iPhone
> > >> ___
> > >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >>
> > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >>
> > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >>
> > >>
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Rick Knoble via Mercedes]

>Sure we all have a delete key, but I also thought >that was part of what the 
>Banned list was for?

There is also an Okie talk list that is political and whatever, without the 
verbal abuse and vulgarity of "Banned".

Rick
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

Agreed. If I were you I'd list those wheels on thesamba.com if you want
to include that market.

Allan


Karl Wittnebel  writes:

> I think those 8 hole wheels look great on vanagons. 
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 7:30 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes 
> 
> wrote:
>
> No I don't think so. When I owned a VW Vanagon, I had read that Mercedes
> wheels are a common upgrade. They apparently have the same bolt pattern
> and either same offset or close enough. So I was thinking they might
> look good on my Karmann Ghia. However the Ghia uses a different bolt
> pattern so they would not work there.
>
> I don't really think they'd look right on a W116 or W123 either but open
> to thoughts?
>
> Allan
>
> Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > Quite right. Do you want my wheels?
> >
> > Karl
> >
> >
>

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

We (as in the list, not specifically you and I) have had this debate
before. Ultimately I'm fine with whatever, as long as it's clear, but
politics tends to go off the rails much more than other off-topic stuff
and ultimately it's just a lot of arguing and very rarely is anyone's
mind changed.

Sure we all have a delete key, but I also thought that was part of what
the Banned list was for?

Allan

Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes  writes:

> As much as politics isn’t allowed on this list, I also get sick of the 
> whining and crying if something such as the post below is occasionally 
> posted. 
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Dec 16, 2020, at 8:31 PM, Allan Streib via Mercedes 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I thought politics was strictly off-topic on this list?
>> 
>> 
>> Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:
>> 
>>> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>>> 
>>> Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
>>> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
>>> qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
>>> this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
>>> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>

-- 
Allan Streib
Indiana University
Luddy School of Informatics, Computing, and Engineering
Digital Science Center | Intelligent Systems Engineering | FutureSystems

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

I think those 8 hole wheels look great on vanagons.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 7:30 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> No I don't think so. When I owned a VW Vanagon, I had read that Mercedes
> wheels are a common upgrade. They apparently have the same bolt pattern
> and either same offset or close enough. So I was thinking they might
> look good on my Karmann Ghia. However the Ghia uses a different bolt
> pattern so they would not work there.
>
> I don't really think they'd look right on a W116 or W123 either but open
> to thoughts?
>
> Allan
>
> Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > Quite right. Do you want my wheels?
> >
> > Karl
> >
> >
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Kaleb Striplin via Mercedes]

As much as politics isn’t allowed on this list, I also get sick of the whining 
and crying if something such as the post below is occasionally posted. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 16, 2020, at 8:31 PM, Allan Streib via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I thought politics was strictly off-topic on this list?
> 
> 
> Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:
> 
>> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>> 
>> Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
>> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
>> qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
>> this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
>> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

No I don't think so. When I owned a VW Vanagon, I had read that Mercedes
wheels are a common upgrade. They apparently have the same bolt pattern
and either same offset or close enough. So I was thinking they might
look good on my Karmann Ghia. However the Ghia uses a different bolt
pattern so they would not work there.

I don't really think they'd look right on a W116 or W123 either but open
to thoughts?

Allan

Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:

> Quite right. Do you want my wheels?
>
> Karl
>
>

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Quite right. Do you want my wheels?

Karl


On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 6:31 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I thought politics was strictly off-topic on this list?
>
>
> Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
> >
> > Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> > during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> > qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> > this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
> >
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

Used to be.

Dwight Giles Jr.
Wickford RI

On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 9:31 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I thought politics was strictly off-topic on this list?
>
>
> Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
> >
> > Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> > during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> > qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> > this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> > https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
> >
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

I thought politics was strictly off-topic on this list?


Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes  writes:

> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>
> Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Dwight Giles via Mercedes]

Yes great árticle. Have a good shot.

Dwight Giles Jr.
Wickford RI

On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 8:49 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.
>
> Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
> during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
> qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
> this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is
> > appreciated!
> >
> > Dan
> >
> > > On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by personal
> > and
> > > occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> > > procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
> > factors
> > > will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients,
> etc.
> > > Maybe by Friday.
> > >
> > > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last
> night
> > >> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago, negative
> > >> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to
> > see if
> > >> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this
> > trial.
> > >> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from
> them.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their
> experiences
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --FT
> > >> Sent from iPhone
> > >> ___
> > >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >>
> > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >>
> > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >>
> > >>
> > > ___
> > > http://www.okiebenz.com
> > >
> > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> > >
> > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> > >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> >
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Finally got scheduled for the first dose. Tomorrow at 0930.

Here's an article about a couple of Trump appointees who were at the CDC
during the whole outbreak. It was obvious to me that the people most
qualified to set the policy were in fact not being allowed to set it. But
this article gives some detail on how that actually transpired:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/16/us/politics/cdc-trump.html



On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 11:20 AM Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is
> appreciated!
>
> Dan
>
> > On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by personal
> and
> > occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> > procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk
> factors
> > will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients, etc.
> > Maybe by Friday.
> >
> > On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last night
> >> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago, negative
> >> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to
> see if
> >> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this
> trial.
> >> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from them.
> >>
> >>
> >> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their experiences
> >>
> >>
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
> >>
> >>
> >> --FT
> >> Sent from iPhone
> >> ___
> >> http://www.okiebenz.com
> >>
> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >>
> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >>
> >>
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
>
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Dan Penoff via Mercedes]

Thanks for what you’ve been doing, along with your peers. It is appreciated!

Dan

> On Dec 16, 2020, at 2:17 PM, Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by personal and
> occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
> procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk factors
> will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients, etc.
> Maybe by Friday.
> 
> On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> 
>> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last night
>> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago, negative
>> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to see if
>> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this trial.
>> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from them.
>> 
>> 
>> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their experiences
>> 
>> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
>> 
>> 
>> --FT
>> Sent from iPhone
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>> 
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>> 
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>> 
>> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids vax

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

We got a shipment yesterday and we are all prioritized now by personal and
occupational risk factors. So the ICU people doing aerosol-generating
procedures and those employees with underlying health and age risk factors
will get the vaccine first, then anyone working with covid patients, etc.
Maybe by Friday.

On Wed, Dec 16, 2020, 4:46 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Got my second shot Monday in the AZ trial, feeling a bit off last night
> and now. Cheated and got an antibody test a coupla weeks ago, negative
> although I had a rxn then too. Will go get another test next week to see if
> I got the real deal or placebo. 2/3 chance for the real deal in this trial.
> If I got the placebo at some point soon I’ll get the real vax from them.
>
>
> COVID-19 vaccine trial participants across SC describe their experiences
>
> https://www.postandcourier.com/features/covid-19-vaccine-trial-participants-across-sc-describe-their-experiences/article_08542a32-399e-11eb-bb58-e757d49d81f1.html
>
>
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Clay Monroe via Mercedes]

Quantas requires certified proof of vaccine before you can fly.  CCP wants you 
to get a verification QR code stamp so they are able to track your WRD travel.  
They are trying to peddle that to the rest of the world.  As a means to 
streamline travel.

Clay


inter urinas et faeces nascimur

> On Nov 23, 2020, at 6:38 AM, Floyd Thursby via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Correct.  I guess at some point it will be noted in a database somewhere but 
> will not be "personalized" unless a doc needs to know for some medical reason 
> then they can find out.
> 
> --FT/mercedes_okiebenz.com


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

You can take your certificate of participation to any bar for a free Bud
Light.

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:41 AM Mitch Haley via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> On 2020-11-23 10:37, Floyd Thursby via Mercedes wrote:
> > I would be more inclined to go out and do things, restaurants and
> > such.  Still masking though, that seems to be the norm, but I would
> > not worry about getting exposed.
>
> That would be why your one Dr friend said it would be cheating.
>
> Mitch.
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-11-23 10:37, Floyd Thursby via Mercedes wrote:

I would be more inclined to go out and do things, restaurants and
such.  Still masking though, that seems to be the norm, but I would
not worry about getting exposed.


That would be why your one Dr friend said it would be cheating.

Mitch.

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

Correct.  I guess at some point it will be noted in a database somewhere 
but will not be "personalized" unless a doc needs to know for some 
medical reason then they can find out.


--FT

On 11/23/20 10:33 AM, Allan Streib via Mercedes wrote:

In theory they are unable to tell you, right? Double blind? Neither the
researchers nor the subjects know who is getting the placebo.


Floyd Thursby via Mercedes  writes:


There is an app for communication, I have to put stuff in a diary and
answer questions.  They will only advise if the nasal swab I took is
positive for covids.  They did take blood for a baseline on the
antibodies and will do that again when I get the second dose in 3 weeks
from now, but they will not tell me if I did get the actual vax or if I
have the anitbodies; hence, I will go get the thrid-party test

--FT

On 11/23/20 10:09 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:

But surely they will check back with you periodically.  How frequently?

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:07 AM Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>> wrote:

 Trial won't tell me so I am going to get an anitbody test at a local
 outfit to see if I have the proteins in my blood that bind the SARS
 spike protein.  So I will cheat...

 --FT

 On 11/23/20 10:03 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
 > When will you learn whether you received the real thing or a
 placebo?
 >
 > On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:45 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes
 > mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 >> wrote:
 >
 >     I think I got the first dose last Monday. Yay me.
 >
 >
 
https://www.wsj.com/articles/astrazeneca-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-up-to-90-effective-in-late-stage-trials-11606116047
 >
 >     --FT

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com


--
--FT


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-11-23 10:33, Allan Streib via Mercedes wrote:

In theory they are unable to tell you, right? Double blind? Neither the
researchers nor the subjects know who is getting the placebo.


I don't know if this one needs to be double blind, but it definitely 
should be at least single blind, because they don't want the test 
subjects to say 'I got vaccine, so now it's party time'.


If it's known to the subjects that they probably got the vaccine (2/3 
test, 1/3 control), I can imagine the control subjects taking risks they 
might not have otherwise.


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

I would be more inclined to go out and do things, restaurants and such.  
Still masking though, that seems to be the norm, but I would not worry 
about getting exposed.


--FT

On 11/23/20 10:25 AM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes wrote:

What will you different if you find out you have the Vax?
Mitch.

On 2020-11-23 10:23, Floyd Thursby via Mercedes wrote:

There is an app for communication, I have to put stuff in a diary and
answer questions.  They will only advise if the nasal swab I took is
positive for covids.  They did take blood for a baseline on the
antibodies and will do that again when I get the second dose in 3
weeks from now, but they will not tell me if I did get the actual vax
or if I have the anitbodies; hence, I will go get the thrid-party test



___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com


--
--FT


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

In theory they are unable to tell you, right? Double blind? Neither the
researchers nor the subjects know who is getting the placebo.


Floyd Thursby via Mercedes  writes:

> There is an app for communication, I have to put stuff in a diary and 
> answer questions.  They will only advise if the nasal swab I took is 
> positive for covids.  They did take blood for a baseline on the 
> antibodies and will do that again when I get the second dose in 3 weeks 
> from now, but they will not tell me if I did get the actual vax or if I 
> have the anitbodies; hence, I will go get the thrid-party test
>
> --FT
>
> On 11/23/20 10:09 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
>> But surely they will check back with you periodically.  How frequently?
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:07 AM Floyd Thursby via Mercedes 
>> mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Trial won't tell me so I am going to get an anitbody test at a local
>> outfit to see if I have the proteins in my blood that bind the SARS
>> spike protein.  So I will cheat...
>>
>> --FT
>>
>> On 11/23/20 10:03 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
>> > When will you learn whether you received the real thing or a
>> placebo?
>> >
>> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:45 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes
>> > mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >
>> >     I think I got the first dose last Monday. Yay me.
>> >
>> >
>> 
>> https://www.wsj.com/articles/astrazeneca-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-up-to-90-effective-in-late-stage-trials-11606116047
>> >
>> >     --FT

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

What will you different if you find out you have the Vax?
Mitch.

On 2020-11-23 10:23, Floyd Thursby via Mercedes wrote:

There is an app for communication, I have to put stuff in a diary and
answer questions.  They will only advise if the nasal swab I took is
positive for covids.  They did take blood for a baseline on the
antibodies and will do that again when I get the second dose in 3
weeks from now, but they will not tell me if I did get the actual vax
or if I have the anitbodies; hence, I will go get the thrid-party test



___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

There is an app for communication, I have to put stuff in a diary and 
answer questions.  They will only advise if the nasal swab I took is 
positive for covids.  They did take blood for a baseline on the 
antibodies and will do that again when I get the second dose in 3 weeks 
from now, but they will not tell me if I did get the actual vax or if I 
have the anitbodies; hence, I will go get the thrid-party test


--FT

On 11/23/20 10:09 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:

But surely they will check back with you periodically.  How frequently?

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:07 AM Floyd Thursby via Mercedes 
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>> wrote:


Trial won't tell me so I am going to get an anitbody test at a local
outfit to see if I have the proteins in my blood that bind the SARS
spike protein.  So I will cheat...

--FT

On 11/23/20 10:03 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
> When will you learn whether you received the real thing or a
placebo?
>
> On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:45 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes
> mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>
>> wrote:
>
>     I think I got the first dose last Monday. Yay me.
>
>

https://www.wsj.com/articles/astrazeneca-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-up-to-90-effective-in-late-stage-trials-11606116047
>
>     --FT
>     Sent from iPhone
>     ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
>     To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
>     To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
-- 
--FT


___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com


--
--FT

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

But surely they will check back with you periodically.  How frequently?

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 10:07 AM Floyd Thursby via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Trial won't tell me so I am going to get an anitbody test at a local
> outfit to see if I have the proteins in my blood that bind the SARS
> spike protein.  So I will cheat...
>
> --FT
>
> On 11/23/20 10:03 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:
> > When will you learn whether you received the real thing or a placebo?
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:45 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes
> > mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>> wrote:
> >
> > I think I got the first dose last Monday. Yay me.
> >
> >
> https://www.wsj.com/articles/astrazeneca-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-up-to-90-effective-in-late-stage-trials-11606116047
> >
> > --FT
> > Sent from iPhone
> > ___
> > http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> >
> --
> --FT
>
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

Trial won't tell me so I am going to get an anitbody test at a local 
outfit to see if I have the proteins in my blood that bind the SARS 
spike protein.  So I will cheat...


--FT

On 11/23/20 10:03 AM, Andrew Strasfogel wrote:

When will you learn whether you received the real thing or a placebo?

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:45 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes 
mailto:mercedes@okiebenz.com>> wrote:


I think I got the first dose last Monday. Yay me.


https://www.wsj.com/articles/astrazeneca-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-up-to-90-effective-in-late-stage-trials-11606116047

--FT
Sent from iPhone
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com


--
--FT

___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com

Re: [MBZ] OT Covids Vax

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

When will you learn whether you received the real thing or a placebo?

On Mon, Nov 23, 2020 at 7:45 AM Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I think I got the first dose last Monday. Yay me.
>
>
> https://www.wsj.com/articles/astrazeneca-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-up-to-90-effective-in-late-stage-trials-11606116047
>
> --FT
> Sent from iPhone
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
>
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
___
http://www.okiebenz.com

To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/

To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com