Re: [PAYCO] RE: Memo on memorial lecture of Uncle Zeph Mothopeng
Comrade Xola There are many wrongs and negatives in the PAC and very few positives. And the payco google was formed as far back as 2004 or 2005, why did not discourage Sbusiso, Mashao and other PAYCO members to close this google group. Part of the reasons we have so many wrongs and negatives in the PAC it is because comrades are hypocrites. It well and good to use PAYCO Google Group to rubbish Pheko's NEC and post 2007 PAYCO Google Groups has been used to rubbish Letlapa's Leadership, so precedence has been set and you were part of all these wrong doing. Worse of all you, Justice and Nofuma and others hidden faces you form part of the appointment of Muendane and Fihla to the NEC by Nariu-Mpethi faction. If you are serious about building PAC then firstly Joni, you must become honest and sincere, this includes you to stop smearing campaign against comrades who disagrees with you. Izwe lethu Ndima On Tue, Oct 22, 2013 at 7:24 PM, Xola tyamza...@yahoo.com wrote: ** Will the Facebook/PAYCOgoogle Branch members ever stop? There was PAC long before Cde Mphahlele and Cde Mololo and surely as the sun rises in the East there'll be PAC long before they are gone. The day some of you stop focusing on the negatives and concentrate on the positives is the day you'll start moving in the right direction. In as much some of us were not happy with the processes leading to Butterworth, we however went knowing very well that the playing fields were not leveled and accepted the results. As for the prophets of doom and professional fault-finders that the party breeds nowadays many did not even attend the Butterworths Congress for all kinds of reasons and interestingly have all the solutions to PAC problems, with some even wanting to suggest that PAC problems started on the 11th May. With all due respects, let's discuss and solve PAC problems in relevant platforms. Unite maAfrika. Forward to the establishment of an Africanist Socialist Democracy. Nchi yetu! Tyamzashe Sent via my BlackBerry from Vodacom - let your email find you! -- *From: * Tongogara Ndima ndimatongog...@gmail.com *Date: *Wed, 23 Oct 2013 14:05:54 +0200 *To: *payco@googlegroups.compayco@googlegroups.com *Cc: *Mohlomphegi Mphahlelemphah...@eskom.co.za; Apa Pooe apap...@webmail.co.za; anwar.ad...@capetown.gov.za anwar.ad...@capetown.gov.za; justice mvakalimvakalijust...@gmail.com; frazer.sm...@webmail.co.za; Alton Mphethii...@bataufc.com; d...@pac.org.za; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; isa...@diplomatsa.co.za; paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; eddie mfulwanerammymfulw...@gmail.com; rateb...@webmail.co.za; smiz...@hotmail.com; smollozo...@gmail.com; bassiekam...@facebook.com; nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com; rako...@tut.ac.za; Andiswa Mjalimja...@pac.org.za; wgaj...@gmail.com; bulang...@gmail.com; david mabitselamabitselada...@gmail.com; emadzu...@yahoo.com; Malinge Plaatjiemalingeplaat...@yahoo.com; makgaledisamphahl...@yahoo.com; patrick.khum...@ekurhuleni.gov.za; milesndl...@yahoo.com; takalaniligeg...@gmail.com; Adelaide Mulaudzi tamulau...@hotmail.com; angwa...@webmail.co.zaangwa...@webmail.co.za; Lehlohonolo Shalelehlohonolosh...@yahoo.com; lennox.maqw...@gmail.com; leon...@mpi.metropolitan.co.za; Sibusiso Xabasibusiso.x...@gmail.com; tob...@yahoo.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; APLAMVA LIMPOMPOaplamval...@gmail.com; aplamvanatio...@gmail.comaplamvanatio...@gmail.com; kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za; Luyanda Gwinaluyand...@gmail.com; jtrimblefam...@hotmail.com; Kutie Thondlanakutie.thondl...@doves.co.za; kub...@telkomsa.net; vumilemof...@yahoo.com; samuel.zw...@ekurhuleni.gov.za; baldwin.nd...@inl.co.za; hoteli...@iburst.co.zahoteli...@iburst.co.za; headoff...@sacwu.org.za; mnyhon...@yahoo.com; maiv...@pac.org.za; Lehlogonolo Digashu digashuma...@gmail.com; samrad...@upd.co.za; Danny Monareng dannymonar...@gmail.com; khoi.so...@gmail.com; a...@a-aprp-gc.org; a...@joburg.org.zaa...@joburg.org.za; drmotsokoph...@drmotsokopheko.com; victor.serakal...@dcs.gov.za; ntsiemohl...@gmail.com ntsiemohl...@gmail.com; mphash...@webmail.co.za; ckoms...@yahoo.com ckoms...@yahoo.com; Lerato Lephatsaleratolepha...@ymail.com; ju-...@webmail.co.zaju-...@webmail.co.za; solomoncontrac...@gmail.com; nancykob...@webmail.co.za; znd...@hotmail.com; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; Ikey Isaacs ikeyisa...@gmail.com; oscarfelit...@gmail.com; Gordon MPinie gordon.mpi...@gmail.com; sibekowill...@yahoo.com; Vusi8 . vemahla...@gmail.com; rakwe...@yahoo.comrakwe...@yahoo.com; Xola Tyamzashetyamza...@yahoo.com; Jabu Makhanyajabumakha...@yahoo.com; yolisamazo...@gmail.com; rmse...@gmail.com; ad...@pac.org.za; vakele mkandawiremvak...@gmail.com; Mzwandile Montjanemontja...@yahoo.com; Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudinrkgag...@gmail.com *Subject: *Re: [PAYCO] RE: Memo on memorial lecture of Uncle Zeph Mothopeng Comrade Nkrumah The angle you brought is interesting,
Re: [PAYCO] RE: Memo on memorial lecture of Uncle Zeph Mothopeng
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 6:48 AM, frazer smith frazer.sm...@webmail.co.zawrote: Izwe Lethu Ma Afrika We all need to back and re-study Pan Africanism and the ideology of the PAC and for what we stand for and we fought for the liberation. Ma Afrika let us not loose focus in the coming elections. Once all us failed to give leadership this Organisation. I am seek and tired when I open my mails that we accuse and threaten our own PAC members and we all forget who is the enemy. Let us not always speak of Letlapa as President when we all no there is a court case on the matter. PAC is not owned by anyone let us not loose focus. Let us approach discussion on philosophical understanding. My apology is that people who did not study political science always falls in criticising others. Tomorrow if Letlapa wakes up and say I resign you will be still saying Letlapa for President. The history of this Organization is rich and I being noting that there are who joined the PAC for wrong reasons. If people don't response we you ar e expecting to do so that not possible Mo Africa the reason people respond depends on the interest of the topic. I hope people who participate in the PAC discussion need to be clear and relevant don't speak for any one including the President as if the president is immortal. No Press can destroy us And Press can Build Izwe Lethu On Wed, 23 Oct 2013 14:05:54 +0200 Tongogara Ndima ndimatongog...@gmail.com wrote Comrade Nkrumah The angle you brought is interesting, it is true that some or most PAC NEC members are hiding themselves by posing as supporting or being against Cde President Letlapa Mphahlele and Cde GS Moloto. I thought we will hear NEC members speaking with one voice as a united PAC but we are not seeing this, maybe these comrades think they are fooling all of us, where is Cde Justice Mvakali, Cde Mohlomphegi and Cde Nofuma, these comrades used to travel all over the country mobilising members and branches against Cde Letlapa Mphahlele as President. Muendana and others are appointed into the NEC without following the constitution, now they are nowhere to give us feedback since PAC is falling apart. Let us not forget that some once declaredAPLAMVA as a non-profit organisation not belonging to PAC, after their plans falling apart because Plaatjie's PAMfailed to secure a seat in parliament they came back to PAC through the back door attackingCde Letlapa or destroying PAC! Kunzima mpela Ndima On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 5:55 PM, Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi nrkgag...@gmail.com wrote: Comrades Some of us wonder as to for how long will this infighting continue? Social networks you speak peace and unity for PAC, but your actions towards each other is as such that you treat each other with vile as enemies. The earlier you wake and realise that sice May until to date more damage has been caused across the entire PAC. This blame game must come to an end, we are surely less impressed by your conduct, actually the amount of damaged caused, divisions sown and pain inflicted among PAC members and structures to date under your collective leadership has never been seen in our lifetime. The earlier you realise that PAC is operating without a constitutional and functional National Executive Council the better, it seems you are now smelling coffee. None of you can claim to legitimately represent NEC because both 11th and 18th May 2013 mee tings divided PAC NEC. Some of you have sufficiently blamed Cde Letlapa Mphahlele while others have blame Cde Narius Moloto for all the current conditions of PAC, actually you are hiding yourselves behind these two comrades, the sooner PAC branches and members see through all you and start to denounce for your deceit maybe this will assist. Two people cannot be wholly liable for the destruction of PAC, you are collaborators and shareholders in this destruction of PAC. A polictail case been made against Cde Letlapa Mphahlele and Cde Narius Moloto, now the remainder NEC members should take full responsibility and accountability for the political destruction taking place in PAC. The image of PAC publicly is damaged and as PAC we have become a laughing stock or should I say a mocker. 2014 national elections poor performance of PAC will you take full responsibility. Its illogical to claim that you are rescuing PAC from harm whilst you suffocate and infli ct the very same PAC. M'Afrika, you have done enough damage, its enough you have proven your point. PAC branches and members deserves a state of sanity, PAC members are sick and tired about all this amorphous mess, Kwanele majoni-it's enough, what else are you proving? Because through your collective acts PAC is organisationally and politically is lifeless as matters stand, it must be revived, you are just finishing the remaining parts and semblance of PAC. Kwanele M'Afrika. Shango lashu Nkrumah
RE: [PAYCO] RE: Memo on memorial lecture of Uncle Zeph Mothopeng
Izwe Lethu Cde Frazer The sooner we realise and accept the PAC is divided and has serious problems which effectively undermines smooth function and operations of the PAC the better. And resolution of PAC Problems can and will only be resolved by PAC branches and members, objective and matured and selfless leadership approach is essential. It self-contradictory, to demand that PAC structures to focus and plan for 2014 national neo-colonial bourgeoisie election when divisions occurring in the NEC are furthermore cascaded to lower party structures consequently there are parallel structures almost the entire country such as two APLAMVA’s and two PAYCOs etc, while there is a high court case seemingly you subject PAC Branches and Members to await the outcomes. Collective-Self-Deception and harbouring of illusions id dangerous, and tends to lead to self-destruction. No court will resolve PAC political problems, any High Court Judge does not rule on inner political issues. Shango lashu Nkrumah From: frazer smith [mailto:frazer.sm...@webmail.co.za] Sent: 24 October 2013 06:49 AM To: payco@googlegroups.com; Tongogara Ndima Cc: Mohlomphegi Mphahlele; Apa Pooe; anwar.ad...@capetown.gov.za; justice mvakali; Alton Mphethi; d...@pac.org.za; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; isa...@diplomatsa.co.za; paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; eddie mfulwane; rateb...@webmail.co.za; smiz...@hotmail.com; smollozo...@gmail.com; bassiekam...@facebook.com; nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com; rako...@tut.ac.za; Andiswa Mjali; wgaj...@gmail.com; bulang...@gmail.com; david mabitsela; emadzu...@yahoo.com; Malinge Plaatjie; makgaledisamphahl...@yahoo.com; patrick.khum...@ekurhuleni.gov.za; milesndl...@yahoo.com; takalaniligeg...@gmail.com; Adelaide Mulaudzi; angwa...@webmail.co.za; Lehlohonolo Shale; lennox.maqw...@gmail.com; leon...@mpi.metropolitan.co.za; Sibusiso Xaba; tob...@yahoo.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; APLAMVA LIMPOMPO; aplamvanatio...@gmail.com; kwamendeb...@webmail.co.za; Luyanda Gwina; jtrimblefam...@hotmail.com; Kutie Thondlana; kub...@telkomsa.net; vumilemof...@yahoo.com; samuel.zw...@ekurhuleni.gov.za; baldwin.nd...@inl.co.za; hoteli...@iburst.co.za; headoff...@sacwu.org.za; mnyhon...@yahoo.com; maiv...@pac.org.za; Lehlogonolo Digashu; samrad...@upd.co.za; Danny Monareng; khoi.so...@gmail.com; a...@a-aprp-gc.org; a...@joburg.org.za; drmotsokoph...@drmotsokopheko.com; victor.serakal...@dcs.gov.za; ntsiemohl...@gmail.com; mphash...@webmail.co.za; ckoms...@yahoo.com; Lerato Lephatsa; ju-...@webmail.co.za; solomoncontrac...@gmail.com; nancykob...@webmail.co.za; znd...@hotmail.com; crosby.njwab...@webmail.co.za; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; Ikey Isaacs; oscarfelit...@gmail.com; Gordon MPinie; sibekowill...@yahoo.com; Vusi8 .; rakwe...@yahoo.com; Xola Tyamzashe; Jabu Makhanya; yolisamazo...@gmail.com; rmse...@gmail.com; ad...@pac.org.za; vakele mkandawire; Mzwandile Montjane; Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi Subject: Re: [PAYCO] RE: Memo on memorial lecture of Uncle Zeph Mothopeng Izwe Lethu Ma Afrika We all need to back and re-study Pan Africanism and the ideology of the PAC and for what we stand for and we fought for the liberation. Ma Afrika let us not loose focus in the coming elections. Once all us failed to give leadership this Organisation. I am seek and tired when I open my mails that we accuse and threaten our own PAC members and we all forget who is the enemy. Let us not always speak of Letlapa as President when we all no there is a court case on the matter. PAC is not owned by anyone let us not loose focus. Let us approach discussion on philosophical understanding. My apology is that people who did not study political science always falls in criticising others. Tomorrow if Letlapa wakes up and say I resign you will be still saying Letlapa for President. The history of this Organization is rich and I being noting that there are who joined the PAC for wrong reasons. If people don't response we you ar e expecting to do so that not possible Mo Africa the reason people respond depends on the interest of the topic. I hope people who participate in the PAC discussion need to be clear and relevant don't speak for any one including the President as if the president is immortal. No Press can destroy us And Press can Build Izwe Lethu On Wed, 23 Oct 2013 14:05:54 +0200 Tongogara Ndima ndimatongog...@gmail.com wrote Comrade Nkrumah The angle you brought is interesting, it is true that some or most PAC NEC members are hiding themselves by posing as supporting or being against Cde President Letlapa Mphahlele and Cde GS Moloto. I thought we will hear NEC members speaking with one voice as a united PAC but we are not seeing this, maybe these comrades think they are fooling all of us, where is Cde Justice Mvakali, Cde Mohlomphegi and Cde Nofuma, these comrades used to travel all over the country mobilising members and
Re: [PAYCO] RE: Memo on memorial lecture of Uncle Zeph Mothopeng
Why We always talk about Names of Individuals It is almost 9 years this disease is happening in this google page. The energy that we spend and writing skills , we can channel them in right platforms such as. Mail Guardian Sowetan Daily Dispatch Izwi Latantu Cape Times PAC Internal communication Machinery SABC News/ Pages International newspapers/ African correspondence. On 24 October 2013 08:36, Tongogara Ndima ndimatongog...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 6:48 AM, frazer smith frazer.sm...@webmail.co.zawrote: Izwe Lethu Ma Afrika We all need to back and re-study Pan Africanism and the ideology of the PAC and for what we stand for and we fought for the liberation. Ma Afrika let us not loose focus in the coming elections. Once all us failed to give leadership this Organisation. I am seek and tired when I open my mails that we accuse and threaten our own PAC members and we all forget who is the enemy. Let us not always speak of Letlapa as President when we all no there is a court case on the matter. PAC is not owned by anyone let us not loose focus. Let us approach discussion on philosophical understanding. My apology is that people who did not study political science always falls in criticising others. Tomorrow if Letlapa wakes up and say I resign you will be still saying Letlapa for President. The history of this Organization is rich and I being noting that there are who joined the PAC for wrong reasons. If people don't response we you ar e expecting to do so that not possible Mo Africa the reason people respond depends on the interest of the topic. I hope people who participate in the PAC discussion need to be clear and relevant don't speak for any one including the President as if the president is immortal. No Press can destroy us And Press can Build Izwe Lethu On Wed, 23 Oct 2013 14:05:54 +0200 Tongogara Ndima ndimatongog...@gmail.com wrote Comrade Nkrumah The angle you brought is interesting, it is true that some or most PAC NEC members are hiding themselves by posing as supporting or being against Cde President Letlapa Mphahlele and Cde GS Moloto. I thought we will hear NEC members speaking with one voice as a united PAC but we are not seeing this, maybe these comrades think they are fooling all of us, where is Cde Justice Mvakali, Cde Mohlomphegi and Cde Nofuma, these comrades used to travel all over the country mobilising members and branches against Cde Letlapa Mphahlele as President. Muendana and others are appointed into the NEC without following the constitution, now they are nowhere to give us feedback since PAC is falling apart. Let us not forget that some once declaredAPLAMVA as a non-profit organisation not belonging to PAC, after their plans falling apart because Plaatjie's PAMfailed to secure a seat in parliament they came back to PAC through the back door attackingCde Letlapa or destroying PAC! Kunzima mpela Ndima On Thu, Oct 17, 2013 at 5:55 PM, Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi nrkgag...@gmail.com wrote: Comrades Some of us wonder as to for how long will this infighting continue? Social networks you speak peace and unity for PAC, but your actions towards each other is as such that you treat each other with vile as enemies. The earlier you wake and realise that sice May until to date more damage has been caused across the entire PAC. This blame game must come to an end, we are surely less impressed by your conduct, actually the amount of damaged caused, divisions sown and pain inflicted among PAC members and structures to date under your collective leadership has never been seen in our lifetime. The earlier you realise that PAC is operating without a constitutional and functional National Executive Council the better, it seems you are now smelling coffee. None of you can claim to legitimately represent NEC because both 11th and 18th May 2013 mee tings divided PAC NEC. Some of you have sufficiently blamed Cde Letlapa Mphahlele while others have blame Cde Narius Moloto for all the current conditions of PAC, actually you are hiding yourselves behind these two comrades, the sooner PAC branches and members see through all you and start to denounce for your deceit maybe this will assist. Two people cannot be wholly liable for the destruction of PAC, you are collaborators and shareholders in this destruction of PAC. A polictail case been made against Cde Letlapa Mphahlele and Cde Narius Moloto, now the remainder NEC members should take full responsibility and accountability for the political destruction taking place in PAC. The image of PAC publicly is damaged and as PAC we have become a laughing stock or should I say a mocker. 2014 national elections poor performance of PAC will you take full responsibility. Its illogical to claim that you are rescuing PAC from harm whilst you suffocate and infli ct the very same PAC. M'Afrika, you have done enough
[PAYCO] INTERESTING READ Re: MARIKANA
http://www.dailymaverick.co.za/article/2013-10-25-marikana-massacre-ramaphosas-statement-revisited/ Sent via my BlackBerry from Vodacom - let your email find you! -- -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Pan Africanist Youth Congress group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to payco+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
